[PICTURES] Will BazBall thrive in India?

[Vikram1989]

Their previous solution didnt work in India anyway.

It seems like India got unnecessarily triggered by Bazball and took it personally. Most of the criticism and 'jokes' seem to indicate this.

On the field it provided a good series and for the English some good data for the main series which is the Ashes next year.

Off the field I do agree with some of the criticism of the silly statements from the England camp.

Eng have branded bazball as the greatest cricket philosophy and its sin not to play like them.Eng will forever play the opponents to collect data points for the ashes and gets slaughtered .Eng commentators (Athers,Nasir,Cook etc )were praising as they there is no room for improvement. With out acceptance of fact,no one will ever improve.

 

[Ab Fan]

We can debate until the cows come home, but two things are very clear:

Stokes is not the tactical genius people thought he was.

Bazba is not the revolutionary brand of Test cricket and the way forward that people thought it was.

Now it is up to England to decide what direction they want to move forward in but this treatment by India was necessary for them to get back on earth and get out of their self-created bubble.

Neither is Stokes some kind of Eoin Morgan type captain who has taught England the right way of playing cricket in any format in process to achieving glory.

Bazball might just help England win more games vs weaker nations than they used to win before. We may see this brand of cricket allows their players to be more ruthless vs likes of Windies, Sri Lanka, Pakistan or Bangladesh but as long as they don't win in India or Australia or dominate top nations at home consistently, it is nothing special worth hyping it as some kind of revolutionary brand of cricket.

 

[Vikram1989]

The title Bazball will not change. But in between they keep changing the definitions. I am yet to get hold of the latest version

Haddin mocked eng team in his podcast saying "last time bazball inspired jaiswall and this time bazball introduced adaptability by scoring 36 runs in 25 overs"

 

[Nikhil_cric]

It worked against South Africa. They had an attack including Rabada, Norje, Maharaj, Ngidi, Jansen.

Not too shabby.

England lost when they played all of Jansen, Ngidi, Rabada and Nortje.

In the 2nd Test , SA played Harmer and Maharaj while dropping Jansen. That compromised both the bowling and the batting.

Anyway, in English conditions - an attack of Anderson, Robinson , Broad, Stokes is comparable to the Saffer attack.

 

[shaz619]

It has thrived, village bowlers making a mockery of Indian batsman and single handedly ruining their spinners fake legacies

 

[shaz619]

Look at all the ants come out now, it was squeaky bum time during the Test LOL biggest group of fair weather fans I’ve ever scene, don’t deserve to support their team even though they are really crap

 

[jnaveen1980]

Their previous solution didnt work in India anyway.

It seems like India got unnecessarily triggered by Bazball and took it personally. Most of the criticism and 'jokes' seem to indicate this.

On the field it provided a good series and for the English some good data for the main series which is the Ashes next year.

Off the field I do agree with some of the criticism of the silly statements from the England camp.

I think it is more whole world primarily Aussies than India. Aussies took a lot of dig at this. Check news around different countries. They all take a dig at bazball.

 

[ahmadharis1]

I'm a fan of the idea of bazball, not a big fan of the way the England side/media is presenting it.... but I still cannot comprehend how personally offended some people are taking it and taking it like a personal attack

 

[Buffet]

I see it this way.

If we ignore some ridiculous statements from Eng players then the end result was a good series despite India being 3-1 here.

The scoreline sometimes does not tell the full story. Eng mostly played well and mainly failed to deliver the knockout punch. Yes, Root also was captain with a similar scoreline, but the series was a boring one. Lots of posters also miss the point that India had Ashwin,Jadeja, Bumrah, and Kuldeep as bowlers. Simply a top-class bowling unit. Playing bazzball or dravidball, it is not easy to score big against them unless the pitch is totally dead.

It was a very good test series with many ebbs and flows. It does not happen often. Often series in India are totally one-sided. I will ignore some ridiculous statements and simply enjoy Eng being competitive. Eng just needs a slight modification, but their approach is not bad. It does not mean that they will become a world-beater, it simply means that getting the most out of the players they have.

 

[shaz619]

Bazball has the whole country talking and inspiring the next gen in England like no other team befofe

 

[WengerOut]

Aussies last year were more competitive than this Eng. And Aussies in 2017 was the most hardest challenge for India in the last 10 years. The series was decided on the last day. And both those series, they traded blows against a full strength Ind side ( last series without Pant ).

 

[Buffet]

Aussies last year were more competitive than this Eng. And Aussies in 2017 was the most hardest challenge for India in the last 10 years. The series was decided on the last day. And both those series, they traded blows against a full strength Ind side ( last series without Pant ).

But that has no relevance to the current Eng team. No one is claiming that Eng is the world-beater or the best test team. No one is saying that it was the most competitive series in India in recent years.

The current Eng team's concern should be to get the most out of available resources. I believe they are able to do it to a large extent. With their old approach, they would not have competed in India at all, but here they did compete. Also, with their old approach , no way they would have won 3-0 on super dead pitches in Pakistan. So over all, results have been better considering the resource they have.

Some modifications, like Root playing his natural game, are needed. But I think their approach is not wrong when so many batsmen have zero defensive game.

 

[Cover Drive Six]

Stokes single-handedly messed up the fourth test. England is clearly in a leading position to win the match. In the second innings, he allowed Indian openers to build their partnership and wasted time bowling with Root and others.

 

[WengerOut]

But that has no relevance to the current Eng team. No one is claiming that Eng is the world-beater or the best test team. No one is saying that it was the most competitive series in India in recent years.

The current Eng team's concern should be to get the most out of available resources. I believe they are able to do it to a large extent. With their old approach, they would not have competed in India at all, but here they did compete. Also, with their old approach , no way they would have won 3-0 on super dead pitches in Pakistan. So over all, results have been better considering the resource they have.

Some modifications, like Root playing his natural game, are needed. But I think their approach is not wrong when so many batsmen have zero defensive game.

My post was to those who are parading around with the moral victory trophy

 

[Mesozoic]

Bazball has the whole country talking and inspiring the next gen in England like no other team befofe

By losing 4-1?


Also weren't you the one who was doing jumping jacks prematurely at the end of day 2 saying that Stokes was too good a captain to let India off ? Guess what happened?

 

[JaDed]

It’s going to be a hit or miss but i find it funny that they have propagated something that is making them lose often against better teams.

 

[Mesozoic]

Bottom line is ..


England is just not good enough a Test side to beat India and Australia away or even at home these days. They can do this Bazball drama away from home only against malnourished teams like Pakistan or Sri Lanka. Heck..I even doubt if they can beat Bangladesh in BD on those rank turners against some very good Bangla spinners.

 

[JaDed]

Irrespective these gimmicks make sports interesting, like Calypso , total football, hand of God etc.

I commend Stokes for atleast trying to make English cricket interesting.

 

[Mesozoic]

It’s going to be a hit or miss but i find it funny that they have propagated something that is making them lose often against better teams.

They could have just been humble and let their on field game the talking. And to be fair their results have actually improved quite a bit after they adopted this style...But the issue is with those over the top statements by their players bordering insanity and sheer delusion.

 

[JaDed]

They could have just been humble and let their on field game the talking. And to be fair their results have actually improved quite a bit after they adopted this style...But the issue is with those over the top statements by their players bordering insanity and sheer delusion.

It’s fun though.. I like the entertainment, many Indian players and media gives such statements too, only Aussies can walk the talk no one else can.

 

[jnaveen1980]

I'm a fan of the idea of bazball, not a big fan of the way the England side/media is presenting it.... but I still cannot comprehend how personally offended some people are taking it and taking it like a personal attack

Aussies at every chance will mock them due to age old rivalry as they felt insulted when they were told how to entertain. Clarke last week in an interview told "Haven't they seen Hayden, Langer, Gilchrist. They are not the first ones tonplay aggressively"

 

[sindhiboy]

Aussies last year were more competitive than this Eng. And Aussies in 2017 was the most hardest challenge for India in the last 10 years. The series was decided on the last day. And both those series, they traded blows against a full strength Ind side ( last series without Pant ).

Its not as if India cruised through victory, it took an incredible comeback from Jurel and Kuldeep for India to win this test. Jaiswal made a double hundred first innings in vizag when no other batter made above 34.

Aussies faced a team without Jaiswal,Bumrah,Jurel,Kuldeep., this series would atleast be 2-2 had the 2023 team still been persisted with

England have been competitive in 3 out of the 4 tests so far and shown alot more fight than the Aussies did and against a stronger Indian team.

 

[WengerOut]

Its not as if India cruised through victory, it took an incredible comeback from Jurel and Kuldeep for India to win this test. Jaiswal made a double hundred first innings in vizag when no other batter made above 34.

Aussies faced a team without Jaiswal,Bumrah,Jurel,Kuldeep., this series would atleast be 2-2 had the 2023 team still been persisted with

England have been competitive in 3 out of the 4 tests so far and shown alot more fight than the Aussies did and against a stronger Indian team.

Aussie series were on turners. India had 3 spinners plus Shami and Siraj. Presence of Shami mitigates Bumrah as he is the better bowler in SC. Jaiswal and Jurel are hindsights so i am leaving that. Anyway Ind had Kohli. On turners, Axar is as potent if not better than Kuldeep. Kuldeep was in the squad if i am not wrong.

Even in 2021 Eng was leading Ind by 60 odd runs with India having lost 6 wickets. Just that Pant and Sundar had other ideas. And they won the first test comprehensively. So they were more competitive last time. It is the current PR machine working overtime.

 

[RexRex]

Irrespective these gimmicks make sports interesting, like Calypso , total football, hand of God etc.

I commend Stokes for atleast trying to make English cricket interesting.

Agreed. English cricket has gone from their miserable scone-eating winter moaning selves to something more tangible and with real personality, even tho some of it's fake bravado. To use WWE lexicon, they've entered their Attitude era.

 

[Croma]

I am still flabbergasted with Bumrah's bowling average this series 17wickets@13.64.
Not to forget the amazing Jaiswal 655runs@93.57.
2 main reasons for Bazball failing.

But Bazball is fun to watch.. I will give em that

 

[aboveandbeyond]

The India v Australia series was better. Both teams at full strength, and the Aussy attack matched the indians , including the spinners.

 

[sindhiboy]

Aussie series were on turners. India had 3 spinners plus Shami and Siraj. Presence of Shami mitigates Bumrah as he is the better bowler in SC. Jaiswal and Jurel are hindsights so i am leaving that. Anyway Ind had Kohli. On turners, Axar is as potent if not better than Kuldeep. Kuldeep was in the squad if i am not wrong.

Even in 2021 Eng was leading Ind by 60 odd runs with India having lost 6 wickets. Just that Pant and Sundar had other ideas. And they won the first test comprehensively. So they were more competitive last time. It is the current PR machine working overtime.

That test wasn't anywhere near as close as this one . England were very close to winning this one but totally choked it.
Jaiswal's impact has been immense, hypothetically speaking, Kohli wouldn't have replicated Jaiswal's performance this series if he played in his place.

Axar was not potent with the ball vs Australia on turners, averaged 62 with the ball and only took 3 wickets. India chose to replace him with kuldeep after the second test for this series.

 

[WengerOut]

That test wasn't anywhere near as close as this one . England were very close to winning this one but totally choked it.
Jaiswal's impact has been immense, hypothetically speaking, Kohli wouldn't have replicated Jaiswal's performance this series if he played in his place.

Axar was not potent with the ball vs Australia on turners, averaged 62 with the ball and only took 3 wickets. India chose to replace him with kuldeep after the second test for this series.

Axar was indias third best spinner coming into that series. Aus played him well. Jaiswal runs is balanced by Patidar no show. Check Kohli's 2023 test record as well.

Regarding the 2021 Eng test, Eng were undone by Pant and Sundar partnership. Or else the series would have been 2-2 after 4 test matches.

 

[Mamoon]

I'm a fan of the idea of bazball, not a big fan of the way the England side/media is presenting it.... but I still cannot comprehend how personally offended some people are taking it and taking it like a personal attack

As I have said before, people don’t have a problem with Bazball. They have a problem with England blowing its trumpet and trying to force Bazball down others throats.

As a result, now that the wheels are coming off, they are going to trolled big time and they had it coming.

If England were honest with themselves and with others since day one, they wouldn’t be criticized. Everyone can see why they decided to go down this route.

It is very simple - with the exception of Root and Pope, England don’t have proper Test batsmen who can bat for long periods and grind runs. As a result, they decided to allow their white ball batsmen to bat more freely in Test cricket which maximized the chances of success.

You pick a T20 player in Tests and ask him to bat for 200 balls and score 70 runs and he will fail every time, but if you ask him to get you 70 in 70 in balls, he will do a good job.

That is all there is to Bazball. It is a tactic to help England’s white ball player become more successful in Test cricket.

However, England decided to get all preachy with Bazball and peddled this narrative that it was the way forward for Test cricket, they were reinventing the format, they were saving the format from extinction and reviving interest of those who had given up on the format.

when you adopt such a self-serving attitude, you will be get criticized when it all goes south.

 

[James]

as long as they don't win in India or Australia or dominate top nations at home consistently

In fairness, when have England done that

 

[James]

Aussies last year were more competitive than this Eng. And Aussies in 2017 was the most hardest challenge for India in the last 10 years. The series was decided on the last day. And both those series, they traded blows against a full strength Ind side ( last series without Pant ).

England have still won a lot more recently in India than Australia have. Australia haven’t won in England for 23 years either. Australia are a very strong team at home, but their away record is rather patchy.

 

[James]

Bazball has the whole country talking and inspiring the next gen in England like no other team befofe

There is definitely a buzz around cricket in England at the moment that there hasn’t been for quite a few years, not on the level of the 05 Ashes when it totally took over the country for a full summer, but people are talking about the game more for sure, and a fair few of the international fixtures since McCullum and Stokes took the reigns have sold out months in advance — even in white ball cricket where they are not involved — whereas ticket sales outside of the marquee series had been struggling for years before this new regime really took off in 2022. Men’s and Women’s cricket attendances are way up, the Blast and particularly the Hundred getting very good crowds, more families attending together too. This traction is not all solely because of “Bazball” of course, but there has been a tangible shift at home and England’s current brand of playing red ball cricket has contributed to this.

 

[Vikram1989]

England have still won a lot more recently in India than Australia have. Australia haven’t won in England for 23 years either. Australia are a very strong team at home, but their away record is rather patchy.

In last 2 tours of india by England and Australia ,eng won 1 ,drawn 1 and aus won 2 ,drawn 2 .in present series eng won 1 which must been completely avoided by India.

 

[gibsyhesperis]

Look, the reality is that so-called Bazball is the way that England realised was the best way to get the maximum out of the resources they had available — a logical and sensible course of action. They were going nowhere as a Test side (one victory in 17 games ).
They adopted a more aggressive style more suited to the players they had.

However, as Mamoon has rightly stated, they then decided to get preachy, saying they were saving Test cricket and redefining the way the game should be played — both presumptive and delusional.
Not surprisingly, this caused some irritation particularly in Australia (of course !) and India.

Some of the more ridiculous comments from the players (”we‘re happy chasing 600, we deserve credit for the way Jaiswal batted“ etc) caused more irritation

If you keep winning you can get away with it — but they’re not.
Just playing exciting cricket is also not enough — great sides are defined by winning series against the best opposition (in essence, India and Australia) — otherwise it just becomes an exhibition game (“ we don’t care if we lose “ was another particularly stupid comment from th dressing room).

As the American football coach Vince Lombardi once said — “ winning isn’t the most important thing ….its the only thing”.

Elite sport is about winning

 

[WengerOut]

England have still won a lot more recently in India than Australia have. Australia haven’t won in England for 23 years either. Australia are a very strong team at home, but their away record is rather patchy.

Last ten years Eng have lost 10 tests and won 2. Played 13

Aussies have lost 4 tests and won 2. Played 8

Not sure about your comment.

 

[James]

Last ten years Eng have lost 10 tests and won 2. Played 13

Aussies have lost 4 tests and won 2. Played 8

Not sure about your comment.

England last won a series in India in 2012, Australia last won a series in India in 2005.

(I could also add that England last beat Australia in Australia in 2011, whereas last time Australia beat England in England was a full decade before that in 2001.)

I keep hearing online that Test wins are less important than final series results in terms of wantonly piling more criticism onto England, which I know is fashionable and easy at the moment, but then I hear contradictory views when it involves talking England down. Some definite inconsistencies coming out recently.

 

[WengerOut]

England last won a series in India in 2012, Australia last won a series in India in 2005.

(I could also add that England last beat Australia in Australia in 2011, whereas last time Australia beat England in England was a full decade before that in 2001.)

I keep hearing online that Test wins are less important than final series results in terms of wantonly piling more criticism onto England, which I know is fashionable and easy at the moment, but then I hear contradictory views when it involves talking England down. Some definite inconsistencies coming out recently.

We are talking about the current Indian juggernaut at home, right? And that started in 2015.. Why are we going further back? And Ind played against Aus 8 times of which there is only 1 test which Ind overwhelmed them easily.

And Aus won 8 tests in Eng from 2005 onwards to England's 11 which says they performed admirably. Not gonna mention Eng in Aus from 2005 onwards ( even with the 2010 win ).

 

[James]

We are talking about the current Indian juggernaut at home, right? And that started in 2015.. Why are we going further back? And Ind played against Aus 8 times of which there is only 1 test which Ind overwhelmed them easily.

And Aus won 8 tests in Eng from 2005 onwards to England's 11 which says they performed admirably. Not gonna mention Eng in Aus from 2005 onwards ( even with the 2010 win ).

So do series results matter or just Test wins? Series results only when it’s England, but Test wins as well as series results when it’s everyone else, is the narrative I’m getting at the moment.

 

[James]

Other teams are allowed to lose well and go down honourably in defeat, but if England do it at any point, the moral victory card comes out and they are mocked. Inconsistent.

 

[WengerOut]

So do series results matter or just Test wins? Series results only when it’s England, but Test wins as well as series results when it’s everyone else, is the narrative I’m getting at the moment.

From my comments or in general? Test wins are important. What i mentioned was the general competition provided by opponents in India.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Trashing an Indian team led by Jasprit Bumrah is not exactly the greatest advertisement of Bazball’s success.

Bazball proved to be a failure in the Ashes and in India and it was a much needed reality check for England because they were getting carried away.

Australia were saved by rain in the Ashes.

Although the suicidal declaration in the first test by Stokes was a major error.

Look, the reality is that so-called Bazball is the way that England realised was the best way to get the maximum out of the resources they had available — a logical and sensible course of action. They were going nowhere as a Test side (one victory in 17 games ).
They adopted a more aggressive style more suited to the players they had.

However, as Mamoon has rightly stated, they then decided to get preachy, saying they were saving Test cricket and redefining the way the game should be played — both presumptive and delusional.
Not surprisingly, this caused some irritation particularly in Australia (of course !) and India.

Some of the more ridiculous comments from the players (”we‘re happy chasing 600, we deserve credit for the way Jaiswal batted“ etc) caused more irritation

If you keep winning you can get away with it — but they’re not.
Just playing exciting cricket is also not enough — great sides are defined by winning series against the best opposition (in essence, India and Australia) — otherwise it just becomes an exhibition game (“ we don’t care if we lose “ was another particularly stupid comment from th dressing room).

As the American football coach Vince Lombardi once said — “ winning isn’t the most important thing ….its the only thing”.

Elite sport is about winning

Agree with some of the comments here.

The statements were a bit silly and in hindsight it probably wasnt a good idea to pack their bags and play golf in Dubai mid series.

I've actually never seen a side leave a tour to go on holiday in another country. I'm surprised the Indian media never made a bigger deal out of it.

 

[WengerOut]

Other teams are allowed to lose well and go down honourably in defeat, but if England do it at any point, the moral victory card comes out and they are mocked. Inconsistent.

Test matches are played over 5 days and England had 1 good day each in the 3 matches they lost. That is not an issue. But then to proclaim that they were unlucky not to be 4-0 up is too much. Mocking is to be expected back. Journeymen test spinners like O'Keefe, Kuhneman, Hauritz, Krejza etc had success on turners in India. But Aussies never made them next big thing.

 

[James]

But then to proclaim that they were unlucky not to be 4-0 up is too much.

Did they?

 

[James]

McCullum sounded a bit worn out and jaded in his latest interview with TMS, unusual for him. I think there is a little bit of pressure on him, Stokes and Rob Key from the ECB for the first time. Not in the sense of about to get sacked sort of pressure, but a definite need to turn results around, preferably in the 5th Test here but if not then definitely in the first game of the home summer, otherwise the noise will increase for sure.

 

[WengerOut]

Did they?

Who are "they "?

 

[James]

Who are "they "?

England. Did they say they were unlucky to not be winning this 4-0?

 

[WengerOut]

England. Did they say they were unlucky to not be winning this 4-0?

This particular issue is against the supporters and Eng media. England team was rightfully mocked for their "the more the better ", "we will try to chase it in 50 overs ", "Jaiswall inspired by Bazball ", "We want to save cricket " etc nonsense

 

[James]

This particular issue is against the supporters and Eng media. England team was rightfully mocked for their "the more the better ", "we will try to chase it in 50 overs ", "Jaiswall inspired by Bazball ", "We want to save cricket " etc nonsense

Which England supporters? The supporters are a cynical and self deprecating bunch if anything.

Media yes they deserve it.

 

[Mamoon]

Australia were saved by rain in the Ashes.

England were saved by Lyon’s injury. He was Australia’s leading wicket-taker in the first two Tests.

Australia were 2-0 up when Lyon played. Had he played all 5 Tests, there is no doubt that Australia would have won the series.

Todd Murphy bowled well but Lyon’s absence will always be felt and it impacts the other bowlers as well.

 

[RexRex]

As I have said before, people don’t have a problem with Bazball. They have a problem with England blowing its trumpet and trying to force Bazball down others throats.

As a result, now that the wheels are coming off, they are going to trolled big time and they had it coming.

If England were honest with themselves and with others since day one, they wouldn’t be criticized. Everyone can see why they decided to go down this route.

It is very simple - with the exception of Root and Pope, England don’t have proper Test batsmen who can bat for long periods and grind runs. As a result, they decided to allow their white ball batsmen to bat more freely in Test cricket which maximized the chances of success.

You pick a T20 player in Tests and ask him to bat for 200 balls and score 70 runs and he will fail every time, but if you ask him to get you 70 in 70 in balls, he will do a good job.

That is all there is to Bazball. It is a tactic to help England’s white ball player become more successful in Test cricket.

However, England decided to get all preachy with Bazball and peddled this narrative that it was the way forward for Test cricket, they were reinventing the format, they were saving the format from extinction and reviving interest of those who had given up on the format.

when you adopt such a self-serving attitude, you will be get criticized when it all goes south.

lol at this over-analysis.

It's a bit of a publicity ruse, as others have mentioned. Perhaps it has never crossed your mind that the Eng media/players are trying to drum up some interest in their own country where all the airtime is dedicated to football.

 

[Mamoon]

lol at this over-analysis.

It's a bit of a publicity ruse, as others have mentioned. Perhaps it has never crossed your mind that the Eng media/players are trying to drum up some interest in their own country where all the airtime is dedicated to football.

English cricket never has and never will attempt to compete with football in popularity because it is a battle that they cannot win.

People who are interested in cricket in England will always remain interested no matter what “ball” they implement.

Test matches in England, especially the high profile series, have always had packed crowds. It is a pretty ridiculous narrative that the intention behind Bazball was to drive up interest in cricket.

Bazball was borne out of England’s failure to play proper Test cricket not out of their perceived failure to draw crowds and eyeballs.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

This series and the Ashes simply proves that if the opposing bowling attack is more threatening than your own, it is probably not going to work .

Pakistan, Sri Lanka and New Zealand don't have the bowling attacks to challenge England in any conditions. Bazball will destroy such teams ruthlessly .

But in India, Indian spinners got more spin and drift than English spinners . Siraj and Bumrah got more seam movement and reverse swing than Jimmy, Wood and Ollie(from ball tracking data)

Every time , England threatened to score fast and race away , the Indian bowlers hit back with a flurry of wickets.

It took an extremely fortuitous innings by Pope (75 false shots !) for England to get even 1 narrow win

 

[Ab Fan]

In fairness, when have England done that

They did it between 2009-12. That's the best England side of this millenium.

 

[James]

They did it between 2009-12. That's the best England side of this millenium.

Yes with a side full of English greats, batters who averaged 45+ and bowlers who made their own plans and set their own fields.

Now the England batters apart from Root average in the 30s and they have mostly rookie bowlers.

It is a completely different challenge for Stokes.

 

[jnaveen1980]

England after Swann never found a high quality spinner. They just make up.with guys like Leach who is nothing special. Hartle can overtake Leach if he improves his accuracy. Either way class difference between Leach and Hartley is marginal. Where the real.issue is pace department. English conditions don't allow them tp.produce a tonnof spinners. But it allows them tp.produce pacers. Instead of trying them they have come here with 42 year old Anderson and injury prone trundler Robinson, skiddy hit or miss merchant Wood. They should have tried some new guys. Unlike a lot of other subcontinental.pitches Indian pitches and their ball provide assistance to seamers.

 

[Ab Fan]

Yes with a side full of English greats, batters who averaged 45+ and bowlers who made their own plans and set their own fields.

Now the England batters apart from Root average in the 30s and they have mostly rookie bowlers.

It is a completely different challenge for Stokes.

Then what is so revolutionary about Bazball? What is all the hype for? Is it for bashing mediocre teams at home? Because India and Australia ended up drawing test series in England and they pretty much dominate England at home.

 

[Mamoon]

This series and the Ashes simply proves that if the opposing bowling attack is more threatening than your own, it is probably not going to work .

Pakistan, Sri Lanka and New Zealand don't have the bowling attacks to challenge England in any conditions. Bazball will destroy such teams ruthlessly .

But in India, Indian spinners got more spin and drift than English spinners . Siraj and Bumrah got more seam movement and reverse swing than Jimmy, Wood and Ollie(from ball tracking data)

Every time , England threatened to score fast and race away , the Indian bowlers hit back with a flurry of wickets.

It took an extremely fortuitous innings by Pope (75 false shots !) for England to get even 1 narrow win

I wouldn’t sleep on New Zealand. They lost heavily in England, but in a proper, full series at home (not two match nonsense), I would back them to show Stokes and Bazball their station.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

I wouldn’t sleep on New Zealand. They lost heavily in England, but in a proper, full series at home (not two match nonsense), I would back them to show Stokes and Bazball their station.

You should. They don't have a bowling attack anymore. Boult doesn't play Tests, Wagner has retired and Jamieson is perpetually injured.

With what bowlers will they stop Bazball? SA in SA or even West Indies in Windies might be a better gauge of Bazball's effectiveness because in their home conditions they have very competent bowling attacks.

 

[Mamoon]

You should. They don't have a bowling attack anymore. Boult doesn't play Tests, Wagner has retired and Jamieson is perpetually injured.

With what bowlers will they stop Bazball? SA in SA or even West Indies in Windies might be a better gauge of Bazball's effectiveness because in their home conditions they have very competent bowling attacks.

New Zealand have a lot of talent. Boult and Wagner won’t be the last quality Test bowlers they will produce. Their next generation will come through, for example, William O'Rourke etc.

They will always be a very strong side at home. People said the same about New Zealand post Taylor and Guptill and they produced Mitchell and Rachin in no time.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

New Zealand have a lot of talent. Boult and Wagner won’t be the last quality Test bowlers they will produce. Their next generation will come through, for example, William O'Rourke etc.

They will always be a very strong side at home. People said the same about New Zealand post Taylor and Guptill and they produced Mitchell and Rachin in no time.

Let's see. You have to remember that around 2021 they had Wagner, Boult, Southee, Jamieson - a quartet of the likes NZ have never had in their history
.

There is actually no evidence that they can produce a quartet of that quality because it had never happened in their history previously

Rourke is one guy. But can they produce 3-4 high quality bowlers at the same time? Left to be seen.

 

[kumjsr]

26 overs 35 runs 5 wickets.

That phase of cricket highlighted crack in bazball theory.

 

[FearlessRoar]

Rohit Sharma while addressing the media in the pre-match press conference before the commencement of the fifth and final Test match:

"There was this guy called Rishabh Pant, probably Duckett hasn’t seen him bat."

"Honestly don’t know what BazBall means. Whether it is strike, I don’t know what this terms means. They played better cricket when they were here in the last series. Credit to two (Three) of the batters who scored a ton here."

 

[Mamoon]

Rohit Sharma while addressing the media in the pre-match press conference before the commencement of the fifth and final Test match:

"There was this guy called Rishabh Pant, probably Duckett hasn’t seen him bat."

"Honestly don’t know what BazBall means. Whether it is strike, I don’t know what this terms means. They played better cricket when they were here in the last series. Credit to two (Three) of the batters who scored a ton here."

Rohit Sharma owning Stokes on and off the pitch. Brutal and brilliant.

About time Bazball is called out for the scam that it is. He is also 100% correct that England played better cricket in India in 2021 under the “defensive and negative” leadership of Joe Root.

England’s win in India in 2021 was far more impressive and dominant than their fluke win this time around.

Looking forward to Bazball getting humiliated in the fifth Test as well but hopefully rain will not ruin the party.

This series has ended Bazball. A lot of embarrassing statements from the likes of Duckett and of course Stokes himself, but the cricket and the captaincy have been deeply mediocre.

Stokes and McCullum should be sacked after this series. Pope should be appointed as captain and England should go back to basics as a Test team.

Less talking, less self-serving attitude, less evangelism and more focus on playing proper Test cricket.

 

[FearlessRoar]

Rohit Sharma owning Stokes on and off the pitch. Brutal and brilliant.

About time Bazball is called out for the scam that it is. He is also 100% correct that England played better cricket in India in 2021 under the “defensive and negative” leadership of Joe Root.

England’s win in India in 2021 was far more impressive and dominant than their fluke win this time around.

Looking forward to Bazball getting humiliated in the fifth Test as well but hopefully rain will not ruin the party.

This series has ended Bazball. A lot of embarrassing statements from the likes of Duckett and of course Stokes himself, but the cricket and the captaincy have been deeply mediocre.

Stokes and McCullum should be sacked after this series. Pope should be appointed as captain and England should go back to basics as a Test team.

Less talking, less self-serving attitude, less evangelism and more focus on playing proper Test cricket.

It's too early to change the captain because, as of now, Stokes has only lost one series as a captain

 

[Mamoon]

It's too early to change the captain because, as of now, Stokes has only lost one series as a captain

It is not about number of series lost but the fact that this approach is not sustainable and there are also question marks over Stokes automatic selection as a player.

He has look completely washed up and off the pace in this series.

 

[Devadwal]

Most of people don't have any problem with bazball cricket becouse it's suit England batters as they don't have Proper technique so bazball is essential for them .
But the way England player's were/ are talking like they only know how to play cricket . Its very embarassing

 

[Vikram1989]

It is not about number of series lost but the fact that this approach is not sustainable and there are also question marks over Stokes automatic selection as a player.

He has look completely washed up and off the pace in this series.

Stokes is hiding behind the bazball intelligently.Stoke have lost the patience to stuck for his team. As he is not as fit as earlier to occupy the crease and bide the time, he is trying to get out of the way with few hits.He is a failure almost for 90 percent of the time after becoming the captain and especially in bazball era.

 

[Cricket Warrior]

In an interview Rohit Sharma sspoke about 'Bazball', he said:

"I honestly don't know what [Bazball] means, whether it is to go and strike, whether it is to go and defend and wait for the loose ball,"
`

 

[Mamoon]

Bazball destroyed again. Beautiful.

Stokes is finished as a cricketer. He needs to cut short the embarrassment and call it a day.

Where are all the people who were laughing at me after England went 1-0 up?

@Forum363

 

[Mamoon]

Bazball is only as good as the leader and I guarantee without stokes England would collapse every other innings like they’re famous for.

Bazball is a result, not the cause of this stunning turnaround by England since the loser Root was stripped of captaincy.

Without Stokes England would be collapsing every other innings?

Well well well, England have collapsed in every single innings in the last 4 Tests and Stokes has been at the centre of all this collapses thanks to his number 11 like technique.

He is absolutely clueless on this pitches and a complete liability.

Stunning turnaround? Was stunning turnaround? Failed to beat Australia at home. Failed to beat New Zealand away. Brutalized in India. What is the type for?

 

[Swashbuckler]

Normal England of a few years ago would have scored 400+ here. Indian pacers caused all sorts of trouble in the morning, in English like conditions and openers had control % in the 50s and 60s. I thought long day ahead, but somehow England have once again imploded on a day 1 batting beauty after winning the toss. Kuldeep was magical but still, this is unacceptable batting, minnow like.

 

[Mamoon]

Now that the bubble has burst, it is time for ECB to wake up and do the right thing.

Stokes should stripped as captain and also dropped from the team. He is washed up. He can barely string together a half decent innings in 10 attempts and he doesn’t bowl at all.

The drama surrounded his so-called great captaincy and tactics has also been exposed.

It is time to get rid of him and McCullum, get a new captain and stop talking about how you are changing the game and making it and should get credit for opposition playing aggressively and all that nonsense.

 

[Mamoon]

No Anderson
No Robinson
No Brook
Stokes can't bowl
Shoaib Bashir's Visa cancelled
Debutant Hartley
2nd Match for Rehan
Playing at Home

Still lost the game

And the series is about to end 4-1 with England getting destroyed.

 

[Mamoon]

No way.

Kohli is all stats, quantity over quality.
Where as Stokes is clutch player. He has won so many matches, and big matches.
Even in his lesser formats, he has won the ODI world cup and the T20 world cup.

Yes we saw Stokes’ clutchness in this series. Zero quantity and zero quality.

Kohli didn’t play this series but he had the same impact on the outcome as Stokes did.

 

[Mamoon]

India will win 4-1. The exact same scoreline as 2021 when England were playing an outdated, defensive brand of cricket.

England drew the home Ashes 2-2. The exact same scoreline as 2019 when England were playing an outdated, defensive brand of cricket.

The only reason why England managed to win two Test matches in 2023 was because Lyon got injured before the third Test. When he played, Bazball went for a hike.

Bazball this and that. It is a load of garbage.

Beautiful.

@Swashbuckler

 

[DeadlyVenom]

The series has been good preparation for the next Ashes. England should be appreciative of the Indians for helping them find out the chinks in the bazball armour.

 

[Mamoon]

We keep hearing how Bazball helps England players play without fear and pressure and all that, but I would argue that it is actually putting more pressure on them because they have to prove that their way is the right way every time they step on the field.

The over the top statements like the ones made by Duckett clearly reflect the pressure and burden that they are carrying on their shoulders.

Deep down, they all know that they have gone overboard but they have invested so much that it is now difficult to back out and accept that they haven’t revolutionized and shown other teams the way forward they way they thought.

England have dug themselves a hole by creating this bubble for themselves and blowing its trumpet and the only way of getting out of this whole is to sack Stokes and McCullum and put a muzzle on the other loudmouth players.

 

[jnaveen1980]

26 sixes by Jaiswal.
27 sixes by England

This is more Jaisball.

 

[aboveandbeyond]

England batting has badly let the team down. From very solid platforms, they've collapsrd like a pack of cards.

With such a inexperienced spin attack, scores of 450 in the first innings are paramount.

 

[jnaveen1980]

England batting has badly let the team down. From very solid platforms, they've collapsrd like a pack of cards.

With such a inexperienced spin attack, scores of 450 in the first innings are paramount.

Instead of building a "deep attacking batting line up" if they pick 5 world class bowlers without worrying about their batting capacity they would have had a sustainable model. THat is what India did. They had one of the weakest tail for long. But they have been at the top for so many years.