PTI's Tsunami March on 14th August [Mega Thread]

[Noora420]

What is also acknowledge is that rigging was not enough to change the course of the election and the current party would still have won. That is the point

Since time immemorial every time an election was held, rigging was always alleged. In every country. This is nothing new

So we should continue with the same process and ignore rigging ?

And how are you so sure that results would have been the same if rigging was avoided ? If that is the case then why not re elections ? Re elections in that case will be an embarrassment and Political death of PTI and no one in future will dare to do such things. This is the point, there mere reason that Nawaz and co are scared of re elections is giving more and more confidence to Imran and PTI and they genuinely believe that rigging was done on a very large scale.

 

[CricketCartoons]

How much does an election cost in Pakistan. With population same as that of Uttar Pradesh it should be same as UP state elections.

 

[Fastandfurious]

There is no point in arguing anymore. I don't think either side is gonna budge from their stance. Let's just see what happens.

 

[Fallen King]

[MENTION=10992]MalikMohsin[/MENTION] [MENTION=2071]saadibaba[/MENTION] [MENTION=3327]Indiafan[/MENTION] - It's useless discussing anything. They're all wallowing in this false sense of victory, ridiculing what are genuine concerns. Its PTI over Pakistan for now, leave them be.

[MENTION=14431]blinding light[/MENTION]

To be fair; the words of economic policy, progressive, stability, patient, compromise, continuity of gov't, unity, taxes, image of nation are like rants to them. Indeed, sincere advices fall on deaf ears despite of strong examples we have witnessed recently prior to middle-east political affairs.

Even if PMLN allows election, that will set dangerous precedent in the future as well. If opposition lost the election will claim for re-trial of election at any time without respecting the slow process of democracy; however, if that move is used repeatedly will derail the democracy process in the future which PTI and its supporters lack foresight [that's no surprise].

Even if Pakistan has 100 elections in everyday, yet out of many parties only one party will winner. The rest will still not accept it. Judging by today's situation, Imran Khan has already made up his minds.

 

[Fallen King]

How much does an election cost in Pakistan. With population same as that of Uttar Pradesh it should be same as UP state elections.

That's not problem. Any party that lose will still be not convinced. After what PTI has pulled, its had lost a lot of supporters recently; however, that started with attack on Karachi Airport conducted by TTP aka khawarji- a dear friend of PTI sought peace negotiation that backfired badly at the expense of Pakistan's economy including its image in global.

If there is re-election, PTI might not get the same numbers as its had gotten in the past. Nevertheless, that party will never in the result that doesn't PTI.

PTI way or highway [who care about Pakistan]

 

[s28]

The problem is accepting the principle that someone can take a country hostage by gathering 30,000 people in the capital. This is not a difficult thing to do at all especially for national level parties like PML-N and PPP.

LOL once we have Clean Democracy i am sure peaceful protest will be welcomed.

I doubt the Corrupt opposition will be able to muster 30,000 people seeing as the Corrupt leaders will be escaping justice in their London/Dubai boltholes.

 

[s28]

That's not problem. Any party that lose will still be not convinced. After what PTI has pulled, its had lost a lot of supporters recently; however, that started with attack on Karachi Airport conducted by TTP aka khawarji- a dear friend of PTI sought peace negotiation that backfired badly at the expense of Pakistan's economy including its image in global.

No AllahuAlim now ? Or are you suggesting in this case your view is sacrosanct ?

 

[Indiafan]

LOL once we have Clean Democracy i am sure peaceful protest will be welcomed.

I doubt the Corrupt opposition will be able to muster 30,000 people seeing as the Corrupt leaders will be escaping justice in their London/Dubai boltholes.

Peaceful protests do not enter parliament houses or secretariats or tries to forcefully bring down the government

 

[Indiafan]

Looks like PTI has agreed to talk with the government

 

[s28]

Peaceful protests do not enter parliament houses or secretariats or tries to forcefully bring down the government

Jesus (PBUH) the 'lamb of God' went to the temple and threw out the money-lenders

Sometimes those who want to establish peace have to be peacefully active to relieve oppression

 

[Mamoon]

So now the analogies with Jesus . . . .

Jesus wouldn't have taken crooks like Sheikh Rasheed under his wing like Imran has, not to mention the fact that he once said 'Sheikh Rasheed jaisay banday ko to mai apnay chaprasi bhi nahi banaonga', something along those lines.

A convenient fact insaafiyans have swept under the rug.

 

[Mamoon]

So we've entered a new phase in Pakistani politics - gather thousands of people and march to the capital demanding what you think is right.

What happens if tomorrow, the Mullah parties get a million of their supporters and protest in the capital for the implementation of shariah?

Or a large majority of the population of FATA marches to the capital to install the Taliban as the governing party?

 

[Mamoon]

Is it true that IK has gone back to Banni Gala to sleep and recuperate. Nice revolution...eat, drink and rest in the comfort of your home than come back every evening rejuvenated, ready to take down the govt.

Had Nawaz/Zardari/Bilawal done this, you'd have seen the overreaction.

The double standards of the heroic insaafiyans have never been more obvious.

 

[Mamoon]

A Taliban apologist he definitely is, but the wind changes frequently for the Honorable Khan. He is clearly setting an extremely dangerous precedence and his blind worshipers would bless every single move of his at this point.

Completely brainwashed.

 

[Mamoon]

You won't pay taxes and the whole financial model of the economy would erupt. Unemployment would rise, production will stop and the nation would be on its knees (without going into intricate details which are unnecessary tbh). Is that what you call a 'peaceful' ehtejaj?

 

[Bewal Express]

Mian Sahib and rest of the crooked elite don't pay taxes and your ok with that but when the PTI call for taxes not to be paid the economy will collapse. I hope this lootocracy is brought down and I will be even prouder that it will be the PTI that does it.

 

[waqar goraya]

If you're questioning political partisanship of SC judges, then let me assure you my friend, that this problem is shared by most if not all of modern countries of this day and age. Even the most developed ones including UK, US, Canada and Australia.

As for the corruption charges, then I'd like to see a source other than the IK/PTI camp suggesting this and I might give it some thought.

So no "lies" there, buddy.

Not only political partisanship but the associated corruption with it. Any one may choose a certain political entity but not for money.

PPP and some other people like AItzaz Ahsan, Asma Jehangir also speak the same.

 

[saadibaba]

PTI’s media advisor Faisal Vawda told Dawn.com that the PTI’s 6 demands to the government include:

The resignations of Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif and Chief Minister Shahbaz Sharif

Electoral reforms

That the Election Commission of Pakistan be disbanded and reconstituted

That recounts take place on certain constituencies

That action be taken against those involved in rigging

Re-elections



I expect all demands being accepted except number one.

 

[Azlan Khan]

Looks like PTI has agreed to talk with the government

Only if Nawaz Sharif resigns, then only they will start the negotiations.

 

[saadibaba]

Another about turn.

5:02pm | PTI backtracks on dialogue
We have decided not to immediately enter negotiations with the government, says PTI leader Shah Mehmood Qureshi.

The party decided that the foremost fundamental condition is that the PM step down, and that no dialogue can be initiated unless the resignation takes place.

Earlier, Qureshi had said that the party is willing to sit at the negotiating table with the government.

 

[waqar goraya]

PTI needs to be patient. Should get maximum of their demands and also give a time frame to government , they could always threaten another long march after 6 months or so in the spring (March/April) if the demands are not met.

 

[waqar goraya]

Another about turn.

5:02pm | PTI backtracks on dialogue
We have decided not to immediately enter negotiations with the government, says PTI leader Shah Mehmood Qureshi.

The party decided that the foremost fundamental condition is that the PM step down, and that no dialogue can be initiated unless the resignation takes place.

Earlier, Qureshi had said that the party is willing to sit at the negotiating table with the government.

I believe they are only doing this for their crowd to reassemble, once workers hear about negotiations then they won't come out in this heat.
If they have a large crowd backing them then they could talk from a position of strength.

This is what i can analyze.

 

[Mamoon]

Mian Sahib and rest of the crooked elite don't pay taxes and your ok with that but when the PTI call for taxes not to be paid the economy will collapse. I hope this lootocracy is brought down and I will be even prouder that it will be the PTI that does it.

The irony of not being able to differentiate b/w the two.

 

[saadibaba]

Looks like Haider Abbas Rizvi and Ejaz-ul-Haq had constructive talks with TUQ, they seemed confident some type of deal can be worked out.

 

[Mamoon]

Do Pervez Khattak, Asad Umar and Shah Mehmood rejuvenate and revitalize in the comforts of Bani Gala as well?

 

[saadibaba]

It must be a madhouse there when even Hamid Gul is sounding sane.




But Hamid Gul, the former head of the powerful Inter-Services Intelligence agency, said that despite the military's differences with Sharif, he thought they were unwilling to get involved.

“They (Khan and Qadri) are trying to drag the army into it, to pull the army, but the army is very reluctant,” Gul told AFP, adding that the crisis would inevitably weaken Sharif.

“If Nawaz wants to stay in power he has ho choice” but to listen to the army, Gul said.

 

[Mamoon]

Looks like Haider Abbas Rizvi and Ejaz-ul-Haq had constructive talks with TUQ, they seemed confident some type of deal can be worked out.

Didn't TuQ say a few days ago that if he (or Imran) settle for talks, the supporters should desert them?

 

[UsmanhailsAfridi]

PMLN trolls out in full force today...ironic when the looters are looting the country they are no where to be found

 

[Mamoon]

Why do people who don't agree with Imran's methods of 'opposition' = Sher trolls?

 

[Major]

Exactly, some fools need to realize this before making a big deal out of things.

watch your language. thank you

 

[Saeed]

So has boots taken over yet?

 

[Bewal Express]

The irony of not being able to differentiate b/w the two.

The greater irony is that you don't understand that if the latter isnt effective the former will never pay taxes as they get family and lackeys into positions where they live above the law forever.

 

[Mamoon]

So Imran wants to bring the whole country to its knees and then rise from the ashes like a Phoenix? Don't see how it is plausible.

Civil disobedience is a recipe for disaster and I can't believe I have to explain this to people on Pakpassion, social media and in real life.

 

[Mystrey]

Mamoon has joined blinding light now.

Iis ki kasar reh gai thee

 

[Mamoon]

I must commend the Federal Government for the patience they have shown so far.

 

[Bewal Express]

BTW On the last count how many of Mian Sahibs extended family have got jobs under this wonderful system that people want to save.

 

[Mamoon]

Umm, I have been against this pseudo rebellion for months and jumped off Imran's bandwagon.

 

[Mamoon]

One question, what precedence is Imran setting here? What if there is another cult (PTI is as much of a cult as TuQ brigade) tomorrow that wants to usurp the 'Naya Pakistan' and marches in thousands to the capital. What then?

 

[Mamoon]

Let me make one thing clear, I fully back PTI for their insistence on electoral reforms. No two ways about it but, I completely and vehemently disagree with his demand for Nawaz's resignation.

 

[Bewal Express]

So Imran wants to bring the whole country to its knees and then rise from the ashes like a Phoenix? Don't see how it is plausible.

Civil disobedience is a recipe for disaster and I can't believe I have to explain this to people on Pakpassion, social media and in real life.

People have nothing to lose but their chains and I hope the PTI carry out the threat. The Pakistani population has been too timid,living in fear of predatory elite who sole aim is to accumulate wealth at the expense of masses.

 

[Mamoon]

And the solution to all that is usurping the government by marching across the capital?

 

[Bewal Express]

I must commend the Federal Government for the patience they have shown so far.

They didn't have any choice- they have no support among the masses or they would have had them in the streets in counter demonstrations.

 

[Bewal Express]

Let me make one thing clear, I fully back PTI for their insistence on electoral reforms. No two ways about it but, I completely and vehemently disagree with his demand for Nawaz's resignation.

When you make up things as you go along you also forget the rubbish that you write previously- for example it wasn't too long ago you writing that you were sick of the PTI going on about the fixing that had gone on and now you are with PTI on electoral reforms.

 

[Saeed]

I must commend the Federal Government for the patience they have shown so far.

What patience? It is the pressure of other parties.

 

[Mamoon]

They can't go out and arrest Imran Khan and TuQ, but they are definitely playing it extremely start up to this point. What's the deal with this new 48 hour ultimatum?

 

[Bewal Express]

And the solution to all that is usurping the government by marching across the capital?

Even If the old crook doesn't resign,things will never be the same again. Pakistan has gained because of the sacrifices of the PTI members and the brave public that joined them.

 

[Mamoon]

When you make up things as you go along you also forget the rubbish that you write previously- for example it wasn't too long ago you writing that you were sick of the PTI going on about the fixing that had gone on and now you are with PTI on electoral reforms.

Again, you have a problem with comprehending.

I have said it many, many times:

I don't have a problem with Imran's vision; I have a problem with how he implements his vision.

Electoral reforms are necessary but there is a way of putting across your point. Whining and crying about it, and calling the the Fed government illegal on record is now how you push your agenda.

He wants a naya Pakistan, but has sided with people like Sheikh Rasheed whom he referred to as a chaprasi not long ago and now is polishing shoes of Chaudhry brothers, not to mention the closet collaboration with TuQ.

Everyone knows that the 2013 General Elections were dodgy, but so far, Imran's claims are only allegations and he does not have any solid facts and evidences to back his claim.

He should have taken the hammering on the chin (not like a loser) and worked his rear off in the KPK, push for electoral reforms in a dignified and proper manner and hope for the best in the General Elections 2018.

He's committing a political suicide these days with the delusional Messiah and savior complex and all his hopes of becoming the PM in the future are dead and buried

 

[Mamoon]

The old crook is a seasoned politician and an old veteran in the field. I won't be surprised if he owns the Great Khan again.

 

[dhump]

Yet again Army clarifies themselves as the main power holder and all others clowns and puppets.

Everything is decided by GHQ and this march can end the moment GHQ decides.

 

[Mamoon]

PPP MPs urging him to cancel his march and bide his time in KPK for the next 4 years.

 

[Mamoon]

Difficult to understand GHQ position at the moment. They have been surprisingly dormant on this matter.

 

[s28]

http://www.thenews.com.pk/article-1...sses-on-Shahbaz-to-hold-meaningful-dialogue-?

'meaningful'

meaningful
[mee-ning-fuh l] Spell Syllables
Synonyms Examples Word Origin
adjective
1.
full of meaning, significance, purpose, or value; purposeful; significant:

only significant or valuable contribution they can make is by quitting now before they are chased from office

 

[Bewal Express]

Again, you have a problem with comprehending.

I have said it many, many times:

I don't have a problem with Imran's vision; I have a problem with how he implements his vision.

Electoral reforms are necessary but there is a way of putting across your point. Whining and crying about it, and calling the the Fed government illegal on record is now how you push your agenda.

He wants a naya Pakistan, but has sided with people like Sheikh Rasheed whom he referred to as a chaprasi not long ago and now is polishing shoes of Chaudhry brothers, not to mention the closet collaboration with TuQ.

Everyone knows that the 2013 General Elections were dodgy, but so far, Imran's claims are only allegations and he does not have any solid facts and evidences to back his claim.

He should have taken the hammering on the chin (not like a loser) and worked his rear off in the KPK, push for electoral reforms in a dignified and proper manner and hope for the best in the General Elections 2018.

He's committing a political suicide these days with the delusional Messiah and savior complex and all his hopes of becoming the PM in the future are dead and buried

So he should push for reforms in a dignified manner and Mian Sahib and his extended family will then give him a fair hearing after which they will decide that the electoral system needs serious reform,which as good democrats, they will of course carry out in the best interests of the country. Sorry I am with you now.

 

[Azzurri]

Important Announcement

Imran wants resignation from Nawaz Sharif and he is ready to negotiate other points

It seems like he don't have any problem with assemblies , He want nawaz and shehbaz to resign and change in electoral system

So all this fuzz from [MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] and [MENTION=14431]blinding light[/MENTION] is baseless

He is not interested to become a PM , He wants real change in Pakistan

 

[Azzurri]

[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION]

I Know you enjoy being a troll but some thimes you need to be realistic instead of bashing every one without any reason

 

[Mamoon]

So he should push for reforms in a dignified manner and Mian Sahib and his extended family will then give him a fair hearing after which they will decide that the electoral system needs serious reform,which as good democrats they will of course,carry out in the best interests of the country. Sorry I am with you now.

There is another route - the Supreme Court Islamabad.

I didn't say he should beg Nawaz.

 

[Mamoon]

'Realistic'?

Very rich coming from an insaafiyan and the biggest troll right now is the man you worship himself.

 

[Mamoon]

Yet Javed Hashmi says Imran Khan will be the next PM.

 

[Azzurri]

'Realistic'?

Very rich coming from an insaafiyan and the biggest troll right now is the man you worship himself.

Lol You said you support his vision but you are against his demands ?' Why

Nawaz ain't a corrupt leader ?
Nawaz wan't responsible for rigging ?
Nawaz shouldn't be blamed for killing in Model town ?

If he's responsible for all this then Imran's demand of NS's resignation is valid and it isn't going to derail so called democracy if nawaz steps down and appoint some one else as a Prime minister ..

 

[Azzurri]

[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] i am really disappointed from you point of view here

Apart from having disagreement with you at times i still very much appreciate you point of view but you are totally pointless and baseless here. You should reconsider your point of view

 

[Indiafan]

So Imran wants to bring the whole country to its knees and then rise from the ashes like a Phoenix? Don't see how it is plausible.

Civil disobedience is a recipe for disaster and I can't believe I have to explain this to people on Pakpassion, social media and in real life.

They very well understand this. It is only because there beloved Imran is leading this that their eyes are closed. When Qadri tried this last time, many of the same guy were opposed. They know this is not the right way but because it is their dear leader doing this, they have to support

 

[Azzurri]

They very well understand this. It is only because there beloved Imran is leading this that their eyes are closed. When Qadri tried this last time, many of the same guy were opposed. They know this is not the right way but because it is their dear leader doing this, they have to support

Bro you don't have any idea how our political system works so you won't understand it

 

[Bewal Express]

There is another route - the Supreme Court Islamabad.

I didn't say he should beg Nawaz.

You didn't say it but that was what was implied.

Yes that is now an option after Nooras offered a commission, but had the PTI not embarked on this demo, there would have been no offer.

 

[Mamoon]

Nawaz is corrupt, but is every PTI member clean?

Provide factual proof of rigging, not allegations. What about the NA-242 rigging in Karachi in favor of PTI?

Yes, he will step down. what then?

 

[srh]

Breaking News: PML-N workers have attacked the house of PTI leader Shah Mahmood Quereshi. More Police personnel have been called as the PML-N workers outnumbers the current police personnel at his house.

 

[Mamoon]

Yes good job and that is where his protest should have ended. What's the deal with asking for Nawaz's resignation?

I will ask again - what will happen if some other cult tries to usurp Imran one day by marching across the capital?

 

[Mamoon]

As soon as PML-N gets the blessings of PPP, they seems to have put their best foot forward. What next?

 

[Badsha]

Nawaz is corrupt, but is every PTI member clean?

Provide factual proof of rigging, not allegations. What about the NA-242 rigging in Karachi in favor of PTI?

Yes, he will step down. what then?

Such naive posts make you lose your credibility. One reason most of you are over analyzing this is because you guys didn't SEE the rigging. My friend went all the way to Okara to vote for the first time and came back disappointed. We actually saw/felt the rigging which enraged us.

 

[Vegitto1]

Imran Khan and his Long March

We have now entered day 6 of Azadi March and Inqalabi March and if I am to be honest, watching it has been like sitting on a new roller coaster ride, not knowing which way it will tilt and turn and how long will it last.

I have been watching these marches on Ary News, Express News and Geo News. Express News has been the most balanced out of the three channels. A number of issues have cropped up again and again, questions that anchors have asked either [a] they lack knowledge on the doctrine of democracy or to mislead the audience. I will address some of these questions in this blog one by one. (Please note I am only dealing with Azadi March)


A Dangerous Precedence

One of the arguments being put forward against Imran Khan’s march is that if successful, it will set a dangerous precedence and next time, another party can come to the capital with 20,000 people and demand resignation from the sitting Prime Minister.

On the face of it, the argument has merit however Imran Khan is doing no such thing. This march did not happen all of a sudden. Imran Khan did not wake up in the morning and decided he wanted to do a long march to Islamabad to topple the Prime Minister. Let us look at recent events:

A] PMLN wins elections. All parties make allegations of massive rigging.

B] During his first speech in Parliament, Imran Khan congratulates PMLN and requests four constituencies to be opened. Chaudhry Nisar assures him that 40 constituencies will be opened.

C] Despite having a near 2/3 majority, no reforms are proposed by government.

D] Constituencies are not opened. Where tribunals ordered a recount, PMLN candidates obtained stay orders from High courts. This includes Speaker National Assembly, who won against Imran Khan.

E] PTI holds 3 rallies as show of strength and request that their demands of four constituencies should be met

F] Imran Khan announces Azadi March and a 2 days before the March, PM decides to form a commission of 3 Supreme Court Judges to review 2013 elections.


The above is a very brief summary. Most people who follow Pakistan politics are aware that in between PMLN made appointments etc. that go against them. Imran Khan gave them enough time to act on this matter yet the government ignored him. Therefore, Imran Khan is setting a good precedence where if a government chooses to ignore genuine and reasonable demands of the opposition, demands that will ultimately strengthen democracy, such a government should be protested.


PMLN represents “18 crore awam”

This is quite laughable. 4,62,17,482 votes were polled during general election 2013. PMLN received 1,48,74,104 votes (32%) and PTI received 76,79,954 votes (17%) – both parties put together don’t even represent 50% of the population let alone “18 crore awam”

Now ask yourself, is this not a broken system where 32% votes result in 170 seats in parliament, and 17% votes (roughly half of 32%) result in only 35 seats?

Now ask yourself, where did PMLN win most of their seats from? Should one province be allowed to dictate the fate of Pakistan?

The system is flawed and PMLN is not going to allow any changes to it. With 170 seats, they control Parliament.

Imran Khan always takes U-turn

It’s politics, it demands one to be strong where they need to be strong and show flexibility where flexibility is required. And there will be occasions where policies will need to be reconsidered, plans put on hold, game-plan being changed. Etc. You expect Imran Khan to be rigid so that you may break him? Rigid people can be broken, not flexible people

And no, Imran Khan's politics will not end if he does not manage to obtain resignation from Nawaz Sharif. If PPP, PMLN, MQM can survive after having corruption and target killings accusations against them then surely PTI can survive for making a sincere effort for the people of Pakistan and falling short.


These were some of the main issues which came to my mind, however if you require clarification on issues which I have not covered, please mention them in the comments section below and I will answer them for you.

 

[Mamoon]

They very well understand this. It is only because there beloved Imran is leading this that their eyes are closed. When Qadri tried this last time, many of the same guy were opposed. They know this is not the right way but because it is their dear leader doing this, they have to support

I agree. What we are witnessing is the epitome of brainwashing. At this point, Imran can pull of any stunt and he will have the blessings of insaafiyans.

This is not about Pakistan anymore nor is it about PTI; its about one man and this is why its a cult as much as the insaafiyans hate this word.

I wonder what will happen to PTI and insaafiyans after Imran's death.

 

[amax]

Again blunders and intransigent behavior of politician to take things to point of no return resulted in involvement of Pak Fouj, I think model town FIR is the issue where Sharif's will show no flexibility and are most concerned about as after all its was just an "innocuous" case against Bhutto.

 

[Mamoon]

Such naive posts make you lose your credibility. One reason most of you are over analyzing this is because you guys didn't SEE the rigging. My friend went all the way to Okara to vote for the first time and came back disappointed. We actually saw/felt the rigging which enraged us.

Let's talk about naivety:

1) You don't feel rigging; if you don't have facts, your allegations are just . . . allegations.

2) Your friend has as much credibility (without proof) as Nawaz.

Like I said before, I do believe that rigging took place - the support PTI had before the elections were not remotely reflected in the results of the election however, there is no factual and solid evidence against it so far.

The only naivety here is that of the insaafiyans who believe that the government should be overthrown because they have felt rigging. Sorry but this is not how it works.

You cannot see and feel a crime.

 

[Vegitto1]

Let's talk about naivety:

1) You don't feel rigging; if you don't have facts, your allegations are just . . . allegations.

2) Your friend has as much credibility (without proof) as Nawaz.

Like I said before, I do believe that rigging took place - the support PTI had before the elections were not remotely reflected in the results of the election however, there is no factual and solid evidence against it so far.

The only naivety here is that of the insaafiyans who believe that the government should be overthrown because they have felt rigging. Sorry but this is not how it works.

You cannot see and feel a crime.

The following crimes that were committed and no action taken:

Case A

Act: people engaging in ballot stuffing.
Evidence: Video footage shown on all tv channels
Govt Action: No FIRs, No arrests, No inquiry

Case B

Act: Individual casting multiple votes
Evidence: NADRA verified thumb impressions
Govt Action: No FIRs, No arrests, No inquiry

Case C

Act: Magnetic ink not used despite funds released and paid for magnetic ink
Evidence: NADRA report - "76,000 votes unverifiable in all constituencies" - Statement of PMLN minister on floor of National Parliament
Govt Action: No FIRs, No arrests, No inquiry

Case D

Act: 14 people killed by police in Model town by CM's order
Evidence: Judicial commission setup by CM holds CM responsible - Session court orders FIR to be filed according to petitioners petition
Govt Action: No FIRs, No arrests, No inquiry


Now can you see and feel a crime? or does it need to happen to you and your family for you to realise what a crime is?

 

[Mamoon]

Imran Khan always takes U-turn

It’s politics, it demands one to be strong where they need to be strong and show flexibility where flexibility is required. And there will be occasions where policies will need to be reconsidered, plans put on hold, game-plan being changed. Etc. You expect Imran Khan to be rigid so that you may break him? Rigid people can be broken, not flexible people

And no, Imran Khan's politics will not end if he does not manage to obtain resignation from Nawaz Sharif. If PPP, PMLN, MQM can survive after having corruption and target killings accusations against them then surely PTI can survive for making a sincere effort for the people of Pakistan and falling short.


These were some of the main issues which came to my mind, however if you require clarification on issues which I have not covered, please mention them in the comments section below and I will answer them for you.

How is siding with former chaprasi Sheikh Rasheed a positively flexible political move? What does Sheikh Rasheed bring to the table?

He is the ultimate bazaari politician with zero credibility and influence (not anymore, has lost Pindi as well).

 

[Mystrey]

Imran Khan and his Long March

We have now entered day 6 of Azadi March and Inqalabi March and if I am to be honest, watching it has been like sitting on a new roller coaster ride, not knowing which way it will tilt and turn and how long will it last.

I have been watching these marches on Ary News, Express News and Geo News. Express News has been the most balanced out of the three channels. A number of issues have cropped up again and again, questions that anchors have asked either [a] they lack knowledge on the doctrine of democracy or to mislead the audience. I will address some of these questions in this blog one by one. (Please note I am only dealing with Azadi March)


A Dangerous Precedence

One of the arguments being put forward against Imran Khan’s march is that if successful, it will set a dangerous precedence and next time, another party can come to the capital with 20,000 people and demand resignation from the sitting Prime Minister.

On the face of it, the argument has merit however Imran Khan is doing no such thing. This march did not happen all of a sudden. Imran Khan did not wake up in the morning and decided he wanted to do a long march to Islamabad to topple the Prime Minister. Let us look at recent events:

A] PMLN wins elections. All parties make allegations of massive rigging.

B] During his first speech in Parliament, Imran Khan congratulates PMLN and requests four constituencies to be opened. Chaudhry Nisar assures him that 40 constituencies will be opened.

C] Despite having a near 2/3 majority, no reforms are proposed by government.

D] Constituencies are not opened. Where tribunals ordered a recount, PMLN candidates obtained stay orders from High courts. This includes Speaker National Assembly, who won against Imran Khan.

E] PTI holds 3 rallies as show of strength and request that their demands of four constituencies should be met

F] Imran Khan announces Azadi March and a 2 days before the March, PM decides to form a commission of 3 Supreme Court Judges to review 2013 elections.


The above is a very brief summary. Most people who follow Pakistan politics are aware that in between PMLN made appointments etc. that go against them. Imran Khan gave them enough time to act on this matter yet the government ignored him. Therefore, Imran Khan is setting a good precedence where if a government chooses to ignore genuine and reasonable demands of the opposition, demands that will ultimately strengthen democracy, such a government should be protested.


PMLN represents “18 crore awam”

This is quite laughable. 4,62,17,482 votes were polled during general election 2013. PMLN received 1,48,74,104 votes (32%) and PTI received 76,79,954 votes (17%) – both parties put together don’t even represent 50% of the population let alone “18 crore awam”

Now ask yourself, is this not a broken system where 32% votes result in 170 seats in parliament, and 17% votes (roughly half of 32%) result in only 35 seats?

Now ask yourself, where did PMLN win most of their seats from? Should one province be allowed to dictate the fate of Pakistan?

The system is flawed and PMLN is not going to allow any changes to it. With 170 seats, they control Parliament.

Imran Khan always takes U-turn

It’s politics, it demands one to be strong where they need to be strong and show flexibility where flexibility is required. And there will be occasions where policies will need to be reconsidered, plans put on hold, game-plan being changed. Etc. You expect Imran Khan to be rigid so that you may break him? Rigid people can be broken, not flexible people

And no, Imran Khan's politics will not end if he does not manage to obtain resignation from Nawaz Sharif. If PPP, PMLN, MQM can survive after having corruption and target killings accusations against them then surely PTI can survive for making a sincere effort for the people of Pakistan and falling short.


These were some of the main issues which came to my mind, however if you require clarification on issues which I have not covered, please mention them in the comments section below and I will answer them for you.

Superb post

 

[Badsha]

Let's talk about naivety:

1) You don't feel rigging; if you don't have facts, your allegations are just . . . allegations.

2) Your friend has as much credibility (without proof) as Nawaz.

Like I said before, I do believe that rigging took place - the support PTI had before the elections were not remotely reflected in the results of the election however, there is no factual and solid evidence against it so far.

The only naivety here is that of the insaafiyans who believe that the government should be overthrown because they have felt rigging. Sorry but this is not how it works.

You cannot see and feel a crime.

Even if I give you evidence it's useless. We need evidence in court and there should be an ivestigation. When us "cult followers" used to talk about an investigation you would say "Imran khan is crying now. Move on bla bla bla"....

So yeah, how can you get proof without an investigation?!

 

[Vegitto1]

Imran Khan did not join Sheikh Rasheed, Sheikh Rasheed joined Imran Khan.

Imran Khan did not change his point-of-view for Sheikh Rasheed, Sheikh Rasheed changed for Imran Khan. Imran Khan is clear on this, people join his party when they conform to his policies, not the other way around.

Whether a politician is bazaari or credible is a matter of opinion

"you cant see or feel bazaari/credibility"

 

[AZ]

Even if I give you evidence it's useless. We need evidence in court and there should be an ivestigation. When us "cult followers" used to talk about an investigation you would say "Imran khan is crying now. Move on bla bla bla"....

So yeah, how can you get proof without an investigation?!

if nobody had any proof then PMLN and even PTI parliamentarians would not have been de-seated.

this is a bogus excuse.

 

[Mamoon]

The following crimes that were committed and no action taken:

Case A

Act: people engaging in ballot stuffing.
Evidence: Video footage shown on all tv channels
Govt Action: No FIRs, No arrests, No inquiry

Case B

Act: Individual casting multiple votes
Evidence: NADRA verified thumb impressions
Govt Action: No FIRs, No arrests, No inquiry

Case C

Act: Magnetic ink not used despite funds released and paid for magnetic ink
Evidence: NADRA report - "76,000 votes unverifiable in all constituencies" - Statement of PMLN minister on floor of National Parliament
Govt Action: No FIRs, No arrests, No inquiry

Case D

Act: 14 people killed by police in Model town by CM's order
Evidence: Judicial commission setup by CM holds CM responsible - Session court orders FIR to be filed according to petitioners petition
Govt Action: No FIRs, No arrests, No inquiry


Now can you see and feel a crime? or does it need to happen to you and your family for you to realise what a crime is?

Oh wow, where have I seen this before? how many times have copy pasted this?

You seem to be one step ahead of Imran Khan himself, I wonder why are you not part of his caravan at this point. These are solid facts and not allegations that Imran has put up. If we forward these to CJ. Nasir-ul-Mulk, Nawaz will be forced to resign today.

Look, think logically:

Is these 4 Cases (I'm sure you have others up your sleeve) enough to convince the world that elections were rigged IN favor of PML-N AGAINST PTI? (You don't have to convince me, I know it was rigged but it doesn't matter what I or you know).

 

[Vegitto1]

if nobody had any proof then PMLN and even PTI parliamentarians would not have been de-seated.

this is a bogus excuse.

The following crimes that were committed and no action taken:

Case A

Act: people engaging in ballot stuffing.
Evidence: Video footage shown on all tv channels
Govt Action: No FIRs, No arrests, No inquiry

Case B

Act: Individual casting multiple votes
Evidence: NADRA verified thumb impressions
Govt Action: No FIRs, No arrests, No inquiry

Case C

Act: Magnetic ink not used despite funds released and paid for magnetic ink
Evidence: NADRA report - "76,000 votes unverifiable in all constituencies" - Statement of PMLN minister on floor of National Parliament
Govt Action: No FIRs, No arrests, No inquiry

Case D

Act: 14 people killed by police in Model town by CM's order
Evidence: Judicial commission setup by CM holds CM responsible - Session court orders FIR to be filed according to petitioners petition
Govt Action: No FIRs, No arrests, No inquiry


Now can you see and feel a crime? or does it need to happen to you and your family for you to realise what a crime is?