Follow along with the video below to see how to install our site as a web app on your home screen.
Note: This feature may not be available in some browsers.
Not BCCI, it was the Indian cricket team that made the request and asked the groundsman to cut off the grass.The pitch might have turned out just fine. But still BCCI should've avoided the last minute switch.
Its another blot on BCCI's already not so good reputation.
ICC should add in the rules disallowing it in the future.Meh all it means is if India play Aus/Eng in a big WC match they might prepare pitches which benefit them.
India have opened a can of worms where the host nation can pick and choose what surfaces they play on.
Hopefully, otherwise the host nation has an unfair advantage and will abuse it throughout the tournament.ICC should add in the rules disallowing it in the future.
I think that is what the ultimate outcome will be, but I don’t think it’s a good direction for the sport. Homes side already have such an extreme advantage at home in ODI WC’s as evidenced by the last 4 out of 5 ODI WC’s being won by the home team.Meh all it means is if India play Aus/Eng in a big WC match they might prepare pitches which benefit them.
India have opened a can of worms where the host nation can pick and choose what surfaces they play on.
Hopefully, otherwise the host nation has an unfair advantage and will abuse it throughout the tournament.
Like England where spin was neutered?I think that is what the ultimate outcome will be, but I don’t think it’s a good direction for the sport. Homes side already have such an extreme advantage at home in ODI WC’s as evidenced by the last 4 out of 5 ODI WC’s being won by the home team.
Exactly, it's messed up and it's up to the ICC to grow a spine or we're going to continue with the trend of host nations winning home WCs.I think that is what the ultimate outcome will be, but I don’t think it’s a good direction for the sport. Homes side already have such an extreme advantage at home in ODI WC’s as evidenced by the last 4 out of 5 ODI WC’s being won by the home team.
You got to be kidding if you think England in 2019 didn’t do it.. but they did it as part of entire wc and not jus their gameszMeh all it means is if India play Aus/Eng in a big WC match they might prepare pitches which benefit them.
India have opened a can of worms where the host nation can pick and choose what surfaces they play on.
There advantage is being familiar with grounds and home support, if you're giving them the pitch as well why even hold a tournament. Hand them the trophy when they're announced as hosts.Host nations should have an advantage. Like ENG did in last WC where they curated pitches to ensure subcontinental sides were totally handicapped by making spin irrelevant.
Either way, if you get Aus/SA in a WC match abroad I'd expect fast tracks with a lot of bounce.Like England where spin was neutered?
There advantage is being familiar with grounds and home support, if you're giving them the pitch as well why even hold a tournament. Hand them the trophy when they're announced as hosts.
Which is what ICT would be expecting..Either way, if you get Aus/SA in a WC match abroad I'd expect fast tracks with a lot of bounce.
And yet leave it to the chance of toss? Unless you mean that the toss can be decided by the host nation too.Meh all it means is if India play Aus/Eng in a big WC match they might prepare pitches which benefit them.
India have opened a can of worms where the host nation can pick and choose what surfaces they play on.
I think there’s a difference between conditions in a country generally favoring a certain type of bowling - such as the ball always swinging more in England compared to other countries or the subcontinent having more spin - and individually selecting pitches the day before the match in opposition to the procedure laid out by the ICC and the direction of the independent consultant hired for this very purpose.Like England where spin was neutered?
Meh all it means is if India play Aus/Eng in a big WC match they might prepare pitches which benefit them.
India have opened a can of worms where the host nation can pick and choose what surfaces they play on.
There advantage is being familiar with grounds and home support, if you're giving them the pitch as well why even hold a tournament. Hand them the trophy when they're announced as hosts.
Can't comment on England vs India, I didn't follow that match. I do remember there being controversy over India not trying to chase and Pakistan being knocked out as a result.Correct. But shouldn't this question be put to ECB who made sure not even one spinner would feature in top 15 wicket takers list in CWC19?
To me, the pitches have been balanced this WC. Far more than the last edition.
Ben Stokes somewhat hints at this in his book actually, that it was the only time he’s seen Dohni purposefully not go after the target or go for singles when he clearly needed boundaries.Can't comment on England vs India, I didn't follow that match. I do remember there being controversy over India not trying to chase and Pakistan being knocked out as a result.
2011 2015 2019 , which is the 4th wc you are referring to?I think there’s a difference between conditions in a country generally favoring a certain type of bowling - such as the ball always swinging more in England compared to other countries or the subcontinent having more spin - and individually selecting pitches the day before the match in opposition to the procedure laid out by the ICC and the direction of the independent consultant hired for this very purpose.
At what point does it shift from being an ICC tournament to just an away series for all the visiting sides? But yes, in general, I also think that conditions and the toss are too influential upon the results of cricket games. The last 4 out of 5 ODI WC’s have been won by the home side. After this World Cup it will most likely be 5 out of 6. If it’s a given that the home team’s advantage is too great to overcome then the value of winning a WC will go down.
Ball change technology
Pitch change technology
Toss winning technology
So much secret technology we Indians have developed.
Seriously, these journalists from certain countries cannot digest the success of Asians.
There was no issue with the 2011 WC hosted in India - spinners dominated during that WC as well. The issue is choosing individual pitches to give you an advantage against different teams. There’s more spin in India, more bounce in Australia, and more swing in England - all of these are fine. What’s not fine is if the home team selected every individual pitch to suit their match up. Each ground also has its unique qualities - there’s a variety of bowling conditions in India. But, when a certain ground is always known for spin, for example, and then it spins all throughout the tournament, but in the home team’s matchup they go out of their way to select a flat pitch because it advantages them against the team they’re about to play - then that is an extremely unfair advantage.Which is what ICT would be expecting..
The pitches have been excellent this WC. That's not the problem.Correct. But shouldn't this question be put to ECB who made sure not even one spinner would feature in top 15 wicket takers list in CWC19?
To me, the pitches have been balanced this WC. Far more than the last edition.
I think I may have actually confused/mixed up numbers but I think the actual numbers prove my point even more. It’s not the last 4 out of 5 ODI WC’s, it’s the last 3 out of 3 and, most likely, soon to be 4 out of 4. This was not the case in cricket historically - it’s clear that the advantage in ODI WC’s has shifted decisively towards home teams in recent times.2011 2015 2019 , which is the 4th wc you are referring to?
It already is treated as such,Maybe the answer is to just put significantly less stock in tournaments won at home versus tournaments won away from home - the same way we do Test series. Then teams can do whatever they want but it’ll be recognized for what it is.
The pitches have been excellent this WC. That's not the problem.
But if you've already selected a particular pitch, stick with it unless there is a valid reason.
So now we have HTB WC winnersMaybe the answer is to just put significantly less stock in tournaments won at home versus tournaments won away from home - the same way we do Test series. Then teams can do whatever they want but it’ll be recognized for what it is.
Maybe the answer is to just put significantly less stock in tournaments won at home versus tournaments won away from home - the same way we do Test series. Then teams can do whatever they want but it’ll be recognized for what it is.
I mean we all know what happens to your top order when there’s a hint of swing.So now we have HTB WC winners
Not sure if this is valid from a Pakistani pov anymore.I mean we all know what happens to your top order when there’s a hint of swing.
The more pertinent question should be why the ICC "consultant" allowed such rubbish pitches in the knockouts in 2019 World Cup and in 2021 World T20 . But somehow had an issue with such a good pitch in this World Cup's knockout and raised a hue and a cry about the best, fairest knockout pitch we have seen in a long timeThere's a reason why ICC keeps the local association involved in pitch making and pitch selection.
1.They know local conditions much better.
2. One man's bias will not be able to affect a game.
I mean we all know what happens to your top order when there’s a hint of swing.
Be careful checking Kohli’s Test record in EnglandThere was more than a "hint of swing" in Colombo during the Asia Cup and our top order mauled your attack for 112/0 in 15 overs and then 356/2 in total.
Playing dirty which has equal probability of the opponent getting the best use which you want for yourself? Is a fair opportunity called playing dirty?I am pleased India won but we played dirty. And luckily got away with it.
Yes, my first post on this thread asked exactly this question. Who has the authority to decide pitches? ICC says Mumbai Cricket Association does and that similar change in pitches have happened before.
Need more clarity.
Let me shift your goalpost by 1 year. 1984-2033. Home world cups should be treated as zero world cups. So India and Pakistan have 1 WC each. In an ideal world.It already is treated as such,
india for e.g. is known as a team unable to win the ODI world cup outside its own country for half a century (1983 to 2033) . This is something Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Australia and West Indies have all managed
Playing dirty which has equal probability of the opponent getting the best use which you want for yourself? Is a fair opportunity called playing dirty?
Ben Stokes must have landed on his head rather than his knee before that World Cup, then. Dhoni played plenty of matches like that going into that World Cup.Ben Stokes somewhat hints at this in his book actually, that it was the only time he’s seen Dohni purposefully not go after the target or go for singles when he clearly needed boundaries.
Used pitch where all bowlers looked very ordinary except the GOAT World Cup bowler that is Shami. Quite an achievement to make such a nuanced pitch.What you mean ? This is simple. Fresh pitches favour NZ a bit more and used ones favour India. BCCI intervened at last minute to change the 'fresh pitch' which had all the cameras set up for it.
What you mean ? This is simple. Fresh pitches favour NZ a bit more and used ones favour India. BCCI intervened at last minute to change the 'fresh pitch' which had all the cameras set up for it.
Both teams had equal chance of first use of that pitch. Equal chance means fair.What you mean ? This is simple. Fresh pitches favour NZ a bit more and used ones favour India. BCCI intervened at last minute to change the 'fresh pitch' which had all the cameras set up for it.
With Fresh pitch, batting under lights was impossible. New Zealand would have been all out for 150-200 at best.What you mean ? This is simple. Fresh pitches favour NZ a bit more and used ones favour India. BCCI intervened at last minute to change the 'fresh pitch' which had all the cameras set up for it.
Prove it with empirical evidence.
Both teams had equal chance of first use of that pitch. Equal chance means fair.
How come NZ scored over 300 on a pitch which doesn't favour them despite not getting the first use of the wicket?
Fresh pitch would aid any team that bowls under lights significantly more in the first 15 overs.There's no need.
Fresh pitch would aid Kiwi fast bowlers, who in 2019 semi reduced India to 5/3. The trauma of that defeat was lingering in their minds.
Jokes aside, in football at least, Italys win in 1934 and Argentinas win in 1978 and England in 1966 and Koreas 2002 semi final run are all considered examples of host nation using unfair means to progress or win. Englands was less so because it was the referees error in just 1 case.Let me shift your goalpost by 1 year. 1984-2033. Home world cups should be treated as zero world cups. So India and Pakistan have 1 WC each. In an ideal world.
With Fresh pitch, batting under lights was impossible. New Zealand would have been all out for 150-200 at best.
How did India gain an advantage without rigging the toss? I will wait.My point flew over your head. Why are you bringing 'first use' of the pitch into the discussion ? Nobody even mentioned that as an advantage.
How did India gain an advantage without rigging the toss? I will wait.
All matches played at Wankede prior to the last 2 prove it. Teams have been getting bowed out for 50-150 in the 2nd innings due to seam movement under lights on fresher wicket. Even Australia were 91/7 in 2nd inningsThat is debatable.
Superior Indian fast bowlers were nullified even more. Can't you see. NZ didn't have Henry. They only had Boult. India had Bumrah, Shami and Siraj.By nullifying the kiwi bowlers, the same ones that ambushed the Ind top order in 2019 semi.
All matches played at Wankede prior to the last 2 prove it. Teams have been getting bowed out for 50-150 in the 2nd innings due to seam movement under lights on fresher wicket. Even Australia were 91/7 in 2nd innings
(1st innings big scores followed by 2nd innings low scores)
This one was a bit used, so better for batting throughout. Fair pitch for both teams, unlike previous pitches at wankede heavily favouring team batting 1st.
Superior Indian fast bowlers were nullified even more. Can't you see. NZ didn't have Henry. They only had Boult. India had Bumrah, Shami and Siraj.
It was changed at least 2 days before the match. Both team inspected the match pitch on Tuesday, the day before the game.If this was their motive (which I doubt it was), then this should have been days ago and with the permission of ICC, not at the last minute.
Not only that. What they seemed to have done is shaved off the grass to ensure there's not the same zip under lights.All matches played at Wankede prior to the last 2 prove it. Teams have been getting bowed out for 50-150 in the 2nd innings due to seam movement under lights on fresher wicket. Even Australia were 91/7 in 2nd innings
(1st innings big scores followed by 2nd innings low scores)
This one was a bit used, so better for batting throughout. Fair pitch for both teams, unlike previous pitches at wankede heavily favouring team batting 1st.
Why would India the most dominant team of the cup so far would want to rely on a toss? So it makes sense that they would want a pitch that is fair for batting 1st or 2nd so that since they are superior, they can push for a win in either innings, regardless of toss.If this was their motive (which I doubt it was), then this should have been days ago and with the permission of ICC, not at the last minute.
So a fair pitch would have been on which Kiwis ambushed India again?By nullifying the kiwi bowlers, the same ones that ambushed the Ind top order in 2019 semi.
Why will ICC talk about any communication that exists or doesn't exist between them and their employee?
The BCCI hasn't even given a statement, tells you how much importance they give to these journalists.
It was changed at least 2 days before the match. Both team inspected the match pitch on Tuesday, the day before the game.
Media is making it sound like it was changed 3 hours before the match. Curators need time to get any pitch ready.
So a fair pitch would have been on which Kiwis ambushed India again?
But was that semi 2019 pitch fair for India if they got ambushed? It was unfair for them, no?
The pitch was last used 10 days back in the AUS vs AFG match which meant there was ample time for teh curator to prepare a good pitch fpr both innings which was evident with both teams scoring over 300.It was changed at least 2 days before the match. Both team inspected the match pitch on Tuesday, the day before the game.
Media is making it sound like it was changed 3 hours before the match. Curators need time to get any pitch ready.
Wonder why BCCI didn't rig the toss in 2019 WC SF? Surely they had the same financiual clout even then if not more. If India loses toss and match then its fair but if India wins toss and match then pitch doctored, toss is rigged and verything under the sun favours India.Daily mail going full on attack against Indians today claiming bcci rigs tosses
So now you dont care about the fairness of the pitch, as long as it is decided by the ICC?Whatever the pitch fairness is, you have to decide all this beforehand and by the ICC .. not at the behest of one team's management.
Indian cricket team asked for the grass to be removed.Not only that. What they seemed to have done is shaved off the grass to ensure there's not the same zip under lights.
There was still some swing but those dismissals under lights was also because of the way the ball was skidding on rapidly + the movement.
Shaving it off made that movement more manageable and reduced the gap between batting first and chasing .
I just checked a few things:Might is Right
Good. They did you a massive favour. Otherwise you lot would have been bowled out for 150 under lights.Indian cricket team asked for the grass to be removed.
So now you dont care about the fairness of the pitch, as long as it is decided by the ICC?
A while ago you were saying the pitch was unfair because it nullified NZ bowlers. So was the 2019 semi pitch unfair as it nullified Ind batters, or is the Semi 2 pitch today unfair as it has nullified SA batters?
Loving this meltdown by English media and it being swallowed like holy grail by others.
So you concede you have no counter to the fairness of the situation? And if it was not unfair, then how was it abuse of any power?I haven't mentioned the word 'fair' even once. You seem obsessed with that word though lol.
My concern is with the abuse of power by BCCI.