Ross Taylor dropped, Lockie Ferguson ruled out of Black Caps Twenty20 squad for Pakistan

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Veteran batsman Ross Taylor’s Twenty20 international cricket career is in limbo after he was dropped from the Black Caps squad to face Pakistan.

Taylor’s absence was a major talking point of the 18-man squad named for three matches starting next Friday in Auckland, along with star fast bowler Lockie Ferguson who is awaiting further medical advice after suffering a bone stress injury in his back in a potential major blow for the side.

Fellow pace bowler Hamish Bennett was also ruled out of the series after suffering an abdominal muscle tear.

The test players against West Indies won’t feature in game one at Eden Park, meaning Otago seamer Jacob Duffy is in line for a T20 international debut while legspinner Todd Astle and seamer Blair Tickner return to the squad. Tickner, batsman Mark Chapman and allrounder Doug Bracewell are in for game one only, where Mitchell Santner will lead the side.

Regular captain Kane Williamson is set to return for games two and three in Hamilton and Napier, pending the arrival of his first child which saw him miss the current test in Wellington.

That means Taylor misses out after playing his 102nd T20 international against West Indies in Tauranga, where Glenn Phillips and Devon Conway were outstanding in the New Zealand top order.

“We were thrilled Glenn and Devon were able to take their opportunities so well in the previous series and we’re keen to give them the chance to back that up against a strong Pakistan T20 outfit,” selector Gavin Larsen said in a statement.

“Their inclusion and the return of Kane means we’ve left out Ross Taylor. This was, as you’d imagine, a very tough decision as Ross has been a consistent performer for us, but unfortunately we just couldn’t find room in the squad for him due to the quality and form of the other batsmen.”

At 36 it could be a struggle for Taylor to return to the T20 side, having become the first cricketer to play 100 matches in all three formats. He recently stated a desire to play the 2023 World Cup in India which means T20 might be the format to scale back on to ensure his longevity.

Senior swing bowler Trent Boult also returns for the final two matches.

Ferguson’s injury is a worry, after he was devastating against West Indies.

Scans revealed a bone stress injury of Ferguson’s lumbar spine. More details of his expected time on the sidelines will be known once the results of further imaging are available. It could range from several weeks to several months.

“The injury to Lockie is obviously a concern considering what he brings to our bowling attack and we’re awaiting more information around his rehabilitation,” Larsen said.

That opens the door for Duffy, who captained New Zealand A in their innings victory over West Indies A last week.

Now 26, the Southlander made his first-class debut back in 2012 and consistently impressed at domestic level but is yet to make his first Black Caps appearance.

Said Larsen: “It’s a special time for Jacob who’s taken his game to another level this summer and I know he’s excited to join the Black Caps camp for the first time.”

Black Caps Twenty20 squad to face Pakistan:

Game one: Mitchell Santner (captain), Martin Guptill, Tim Seifert, Devon Conway, Glenn Phillips, Mark Chapman, Jimmy Neesham, Doug Bracewell, Todd Astle, Ish Sodhi, Scott Kuggeleijn, Jacob Duffy, Blair Tickner.

Games two and three: Kane Williamson (captain), Guptill, Seifert, Conway, Phillips, Neesham, Daryl Mitchell, Kyle Jamieson, Astle, Sodhi, Kuggeleijn, Tim Southee, Trent Boult.

Schedule:

Friday: 1st T20 at Eden Park, Auckland, 7pm

December 20: 2nd T20 at Seddon Park, Hamilton, 7pm

December 22: 3rd T20 at McLean Park, Napier, 7pm

https://i.stuff.co.nz/sport/cricket...out-of-black-caps-twenty20-squad-for-pakistan

===

Boult & Williamson return to T20 squad, Conway & Phillips retain batting spots | Ferguson & Bennett ruled out

The blazing bats of Glenn Phillips and Devon Conway are once again set to light up the BLACKCAPS T20 top-order in the upcoming three-game series against Pakistan, which starts on Friday night at Eden Park.

The duo were involved in a T20I world-record, third-wicket stand of 181 against the West Indies less than a fortnight ago and have been rewarded with selection in a T20 extended squad - which also features the return of Kane Williamson and Trent Boult.

With the T20 series scheduled to start just three days after the current Test in Wellington, Williamson and Boult along with Tim Southee, Kyle Jamieson and Daryl Mitchell will only be available for the second and third games of the series: in Hamilton on Sunday December 20 and in Napier, Tuesday December 22, respectively.

Auckland Aces speedster Lockie Ferguson was withdrawn from the squad after scans revealed a bone stress injury of his lumbar spine. More details of his expected rehabilitation time will be known once the results of further imaging are available.

Wellington Firebirds paceman Hamish Bennett was also ruled out of the series with an abdominal tear sustained in round three of the Ford Trophy. He’ll target a return to play in the Dream11 Super Smash which gets underway on December 24.

Otago Volts pace bowler Jacob Duffy has earned his first call-up to the BLACKCAPS after impressive performances in domestic cricket and for New Zealand A. The 26-year-old’s been selected for the first game and will assemble with the squad in Auckland on Tuesday December 15.

After having his first game as captain washed out after 2.2 overs, Mitchell Santner will take the skipper’s arm band for the series opener at Eden Park, before taking his first break since leaving for the Caribbean Premier League back in August.

His spinning spot will be backed up by leg-spinning incumbent Ish Sodhi and the recalled Todd Astle, whose last T20I came against Sri Lanka in September last year, when he claimed 3-28 in a losing cause in Pallekele.

Blair Tickner, Mark Chapman and Doug Bracewell are included for game one of the series, before making way for the Test players to return.

Selector Gavin Larsen said this was one of the more challenging squads he’s had to select.

“A combination of form, injuries and the overlapping of series has certainly added some complexity to this announcement,” he conceded.

“I’d like to acknowledge the commitment of the all the players who are having to show a large degree of flexibility and understanding this summer.

“It’s great to have the class of Kane and Trent returning to our T20 side having missed the West Indies series after their starring roles in the IPL in November.

“Kane will return and lead the side for games two and three, but we’ll obviously need to take a wait and see approach in relation to the arrival of his and Sarah’s first child. Mark Chapman’s in the squad for the opening match at Eden Park and is on stand-by for Kane for the remaining games of the series.

“We were thrilled Glenn and Devon were able to take their opportunities so well in the previous series and we’re keen to give them the chance to back that up against a strong Pakistan T20 outfit.

“Their inclusion and the return of Kane means we’ve left out Ross Taylor. This was, as you’d imagine, a very tough decision as Ross has been a consistent performer for us, but unfortunately we just couldn’t find room in the squad for him due to the quality and form of the other batsmen.

“It’s a special time for Jacob who’s taken his game to another level this summer and I know he’s excited to join the BLACKCAPS camp for the first time.

“The injury to Lockie is obviously a concern considering what he brings to our bowling attack and we’re awaiting more information around his rehabilitation.

“We’ve got just these three T20 Internationals remaining this year, before what will be a star studded Dream11 Super Smash - where we hope to see all players present their cases for inclusion in the remaining T20I series against Australia and Bangladesh in February and March.”

BLACKCAPS T20 SQUAD GAME 1
Mitchell Santner (c)
Todd Astle
Doug Bracewell
Mark Chapman
Devon Conway
Jacob Duffy
Martin Guptill
Scott Kuggeleijn
Jimmy Neesham
Glenn Phillips
Tim Seifert (wk)
Ish Sodhi
Blair Tickner

BLACKCAPS T20 SQUAD GAMES 2 & 3
Kane Williamson (c)
Todd Astle
Trent Boult
Devon Conway
Martin Guptill
Kyle Jamieson
Scott Kuggeleijn
Daryl Mitchell
Jimmy Neesham
Glenn Phillips
Tim Seifert (wk)
Ish Sodhi
Tim Southee
 
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As expected, NZ going full strength against Pak. With Guptill back in and Williamson along with Boult also playing 2nd, 3rd T20s.
 
I’m not very hopeful of getting any results in this series if we have all three Abdullah Shafique, Iftikhar Ahmed and Mohammad Rizwan in the starting XI.
 
As expected, NZ going full strength against Pak. With Guptill back in and Williamson along with Boult also playing 2nd, 3rd T20s.

Williamson will torment us in this series. The man is probably the best Fab 4 batsman in the world right now.
 
Williamson will torment us in this series. The man is probably the best Fab 4 batsman in the world right now.

True, he is in really good touch. Even without Williamson NZ was easily able to beat WI in one sided matches. Pak team will really need to be on top of its game to compete.
 
As expected, NZ going full strength against Pak. With Guptill back in and Williamson along with Boult also playing 2nd, 3rd T20s.

Guptill is finished, Williamson isn’t a threat in T20’s, Boult is useless once the ball stops swinging. Having said that, we’ll still lose.
 
We must win the first game. No Willamson or Boult.

Definitely it would be really important to capitalize on that. However, even without them NZ completely demolished WI. Senior players of Pak will need to stand up.
 
My line up given the situation and knowing what Misbah will go for.

1. Abdullah Shafiq
2. Babar Azam
3. Haider Ali
4. Mohammad Hafeez
5. Shadab Khan
6. Khushdil Shah
7. Mohammad Rizwan
8. Imad Wasim
9. Wahab Riaz
10. Shaheen Afridi
11. Harris Rauf
 
Ferguson is a huge loss. No Williamson in the first T20I either. Let’s see if Pakistan can go 1-0 up against New Zealand B.

When was the last time Pakistan played a full-strength opposition in T20I cricket? Hard to recall.
 
Sucks for Lockie, felt like he had gone up a level this year.

It was a real pleasure watching him bowl live against the WI.

Wish I could have seen him against Pakistan next week..
 
Ferguson is a huge loss. No Williamson in the first T20I either. Let’s see if Pakistan can go 1-0 up against New Zealand B.

When was the last time Pakistan played a full-strength opposition in T20I cricket? Hard to recall.

Yes Ferguson is a huge blow and gives us a chance. He would have traumatized everyone bar Babar and maybe Abdulah (good on the short ball from what I have seen). Just watch what he did to WI in the first T20 to get an idea. He was bowling thunderbolts; serious pace, bounce and accuracy to boot.
 
Hopefully he will not lose some pace because of this injury. It would be a travesty.

He throws fireballs. Probably the most underrated fast bowler around at the moment.
 
Yes Ferguson is a huge blow and gives us a chance. He would have traumatized everyone bar Babar and maybe Abdulah (good on the short ball from what I have seen). Just watch what he did to WI in the first T20 to get an idea. He was bowling thunderbolts; serious pace, bounce and accuracy to boot.

Even Abdullah would have struggled. He hasn’t faced anyone of his pace and accuracy in Pakistan.
 
Even Abdullah would have struggled. He hasn’t faced anyone of his pace and accuracy in Pakistan.
Will never forget how he completely cleaned up Dhawan.


If he masters that yorker, he will be a monster.
 
Ferguson is a huge loss. No Williamson in the first T20I either. Let’s see if Pakistan can go 1-0 up against New Zealand B.

When was the last time Pakistan played a full-strength opposition in T20I cricket? Hard to recall.

So 3 main players missing mean B team? Not even A ?

Still I don't think it will have that much impact. NZ has plenty of fast bowlers and new bowler can be more challenging/better than Ferguson.
We need to give 200% to win a match.
 
So 3 main players missing mean B team? Not even A ?

Still I don't think it will have that much impact. NZ has plenty of fast bowlers and new bowler can be more challenging/better than Ferguson.
We need to give 200% to win a match.
Lockie is the main man and enforcer in limited overs. He brings something the others cannot.
 
Even Abdullah would have struggled. He hasn’t faced anyone of his pace and accuracy in Pakistan.

What do you mean by Abdullah would have struggled? He is a brand new player with very less experience. Hafeez, Babar, Haider are far better than him.
 
NZ are a mediocre T20 team. Pakistan should win atleast 2-1 if not 3-0.

They're virtually 1-0 up already with NZ playing a weakened team in the first T20I.
 
Lockie is the main man and enforcer in limited overs. He brings something the others cannot.

Agree!! But we have history to choke against unknown bowlers like Markus North, Ajzaz Patel, Grandhomme... Who knows may someone new end up getting Man of the series.
 
NZ are a mediocre T20 team. Pakistan should win atleast 2-1 if not 3-0.

They're virtually 1-0 up already with NZ playing a weakened team in the first T20I.
Our new full strength team is pretty good tbh.
 
What do you mean by Abdullah would have struggled? He is a brand new player with very less experience. Hafeez, Babar, Haider are far better than him.

I replied to the post above mine.
 
So 3 main players missing mean B team? Not even A ?

Still I don't think it will have that much impact. NZ has plenty of fast bowlers and new bowler can be more challenging/better than Ferguson.
We need to give 200% to win a match.

I won’t mention Taylor because he has been dropped, but Williamson and Ferguson are major blows for New Zealand. They are not just any two players. Their influence on their results is worth 4-5 players.

Pakistan will definitely not be facing a full-strength team.
 
Our new full strength team is pretty good tbh.

It's good but nowhere near top3 level. Their batting is pretty much Guptill and Williamson at the moment and the former clearly is on an age related decline.

Bowling is top notch though.
 
It's good but nowhere near top3 level. Their batting is pretty much Guptill and Williamson at the moment and the former clearly is on an age related decline.

Bowling is top notch though.
Seifert, Phillips and Conway are good.
 
I won’t mention Taylor because he has been dropped, but Williamson and Ferguson are major blows for New Zealand. They are not just any two players. Their influence on their results is worth 4-5 players.

Pakistan will definitely not be facing a full-strength team.

Williamson is not much of a miss in T20s.
I don't recall Williamson winning many T20s for NZ with his bat.

Ferguson is a big miss, he's really good.

So actually NZ have lost just 1 player and that doesn't make them a B team.
 
My line up given the situation and knowing what Misbah will go for.

1. Abdullah Shafiq
2. Babar Azam
3. Haider Ali
4. Mohammad Hafeez
5. Shadab Khan
6. Khushdil Shah
7. Mohammad Rizwan
8. Imad Wasim
9. Wahab Riaz
10. Shaheen Afridi
11. Harris Rauf

Best squad righ now hope they get rid of ifti
 
Williamson is not much of a miss in T20s.
I don't recall Williamson winning many T20s for NZ with his bat.

Ferguson is a big miss, he's really good.

So actually NZ have lost just 1 player and that doesn't make them a B team.

Williamson was really good in the T20Is vs India. He is very good in this format on home grounds.

Pakistan’s bowling is garbage as well, and someone of Williamson’s experience and more importantly current form would have certainly done very well.

So New Zealand are certainly underpowered, but that of course doesn’t mean that their bench players cannot turn up. It is quite possible that even their B team is much better than our first-choice team in NZ conditions.
 
My line up given the situation and knowing what Misbah will go for.

1. Abdullah Shafiq
2. Babar Azam
3. Haider Ali
4. Mohammad Hafeez
5. Shadab Khan
6. Khushdil Shah
7. Mohammad Rizwan
8. Imad Wasim
9. Wahab Riaz
10. Shaheen Afridi
11. Harris Rauf

This isn’t PSL. International grade bowling attacks will love to see someone like Shadab at number 5. It almost feels like comedy.

Shadab is a number 9 in LOIs and a number 8 in Tests.
 
Williamson is not much of a miss in T20s.
I don't recall Williamson winning many T20s for NZ with his bat.

Ferguson is a big miss, he's really good.

So actually NZ have lost just 1 player and that doesn't make them a B team.


Check his scores in the last series against India. He's a champion player anf is comfortably NZ's best batsman in every format.

Lol at not much of a miss. :))
 
Williamson is missing a just the first T20 and it's not like he has been rested or what.
New Zealand have announced a full strength squad from the players available. If one fast bowler is missing due to injury you can't call a B team. Ferguson is a miss, but one bowler missing don't make it a B team especially in LOI'S.
 
Seifert, Phillips and Conway are good.

Seifert was impressive against us but couldn't do much against Windies recently. Philips looks unreliable ATM and Conway has played a total of one series.

Against a decent bowling attack like Pakistan, I don't think they'll do much.
 
Seifert was impressive against us but couldn't do much against Windies recently. Philips looks unreliable ATM and Conway has played a total of one series.

Against a decent bowling attack like Pakistan, I don't think they'll do much.
Lol they will slaughter us. This Conway looks really good, and Philips is in monstrous form. Not having KW might actually be a good thing for NZ in this series.
 
Ferguson is a huge loss. No Williamson in the first T20I either. Let’s see if Pakistan can go 1-0 up against New Zealand B.

When was the last time Pakistan played a full-strength opposition in T20I cricket? Hard to recall.

Lol but India beat Australia A? Double standards on full display.
 
New Zealand has been able to win only 2 out of the last 10 T20Is they've played. That's a 20% win rate - at home.

That includes a 5-0 against India where KL Rahul bossed with the bat and was the Man of the Series.

Pakistan should be able to win this series 3-0. Good chance that Babar will reclaim his number 1 spot.
 
Lol they will slaughter us. This Conway looks really good, and Philips is in monstrous form. Not having KW might actually be a good thing for NZ in this series.

Philips only bullied Thomas, Keemo Paul, Allen etc. He has almost always failed against decent attacks as far I remember.
Interesting to see how he goes in this series.
 
Lol but India beat Australia A? Double standards on full display.

India wasn’t full-strength either. They were without Rohit Sharma, a legendary white ball opener. Rohit alone is worth 3-4 players in any team.
 
WELLINGTON (Reuters) - Fast bowler Lockie Ferguson, all-rounder Colin de Grandhomme and left-arm spinner Ajaz Patel are still causing some injury worries for New Zealand’s cricket team, selector Gavin Larsen has said.

De Grandhomme and Ferguson have been ruled out of the Twenty20 series against Pakistan that starts next week in Auckland, while the all-rounder is doubtful for the test series that follows.

Ferguson’s injury appears to be the most troubling, with Larsen confirming that scans on Friday had revealed a stress fracture in his back.

“I’m gutted for Lockie,” Larsen told reporters at the Basin Reserve on Saturday. “He has an X-factor with the pace at which he bowls. He has grown his role ... and is a pivotal member of our bowling lineup in Twenty20 cricket.

“This is a major setback, but we will keep our fingers crossed that when the prognosis comes through that we’re talking weeks not months.”

De Grandhomme was ruled out of the ongoing series against West Indies with a foot injury and was unlikely to be risked for the Pakistan series, while Patel was still battling with a calf strain.

Larsen said de Grandhomme will likely be out beyond the Pakistan test matches. “The last thing we want is to put him back on the park and he’s not quite ready and we lose him for the season.”

Patel, however, may come into consideration if he can get through a New Zealand A match next week in Whangarei, Larsen said.

“Ajaz is tracking well. Bowling is not an issue, but with a calf it’s the explosive work needed while fielding, sharp turning that is more of a concern at this stage.

“We’d like to think he gets through some good work up there then we can chuck him back into consideration for the Boxing Day test.”

https://www.reuters.com/article/cri...me-still-injury-concerns-larsen-idINL4N2IS039
 
India wasn’t full-strength either. They were without Rohit Sharma, a legendary white ball opener. Rohit alone is worth 3-4 players in any team.

And the Pakistan team that has 6 players who were capped in the last year but are fully expected to be in the playing XI, that’s a full strength lineup?
 
And the Pakistan team that has 6 players who were capped in the last year but are fully expected to be in the playing XI, that’s a full strength lineup?

Pakistan is a mediocre team. A “full-strength” Pakistan team these days means nothing, because even our so-called full-strength is nothing great.

And we are always throwing in uncapped players, and are unsettled and have no idea what our team combo is because we are a mediocre team, and do not have a settled core of players that perform consistently.
 
Mamoon taking everyone to the cleaners in this thread :)) NZ B team really hit hard.

Brilliant winding up!
 
What is Pakistan’s full-strength these days?

Babar and to an extent Shaheen and Imad. That is it. Everyone else is average and cannot be banked on against the top sides.

As long as they are available, Pakistan is at “full-strength” in T20Is.
 
What is Pakistan’s full-strength these days?

Babar and to an extent Shaheen and Imad. That is it. Everyone else is average and cannot be banked on against the top sides.

As long as they are available, Pakistan is at “full-strength” in T20Is.

Such disrespect to the modern day T20 Bradman :moha
 
Such disrespect to the modern day T20 Bradman :moha

Until a few T20Is ago, Pakistani fans were abusing him and begging him to retire, and they were also begging selectors to kick him out for good because he was hogging the place of some talented world beating batsman that only exists in the imagination of our fans.

However, now, he has suddenly became a key cog of our team. That’s Pakistani fans for you.

The reality is that Hafeez post 2010 was always good enough for the Pakistani side in any format as a specialist batsman. He should still be opening the batting in Test cricket especially in Asia but unfortunately he retired.

On Asian wickets he still better than Fakhar, Abid, Masood and Imam.

He is not world class and never will be, not even in his current purple patch, but it is a myth that he was not good enough or is not good enough for our joke batting in any format.

He has been disrespected greatly because of the overestimation of our batting resources by fans who are always living in denial.
 
Williamson was really good in the T20Is vs India. He is very good in this format on home grounds.

Pakistan’s bowling is garbage as well, and someone of Williamson’s experience and more importantly current form would have certainly done very well.

So New Zealand are certainly underpowered, but that of course doesn’t mean that their bench players cannot turn up. It is quite possible that even their B team is much better than our first-choice team in NZ conditions.

1 good series against India doesn't mean much. Going by his overall T20I career it was an exception rather than the norm.

Williamson has faced 'garbage' Pakistani bowlers in T20s before aswell and didn't do much special.

Anyways Williamson is missing just 1 game he will be back and can still contribute
 
Check his scores in the last series against India. He's a champion player anf is comfortably NZ's best batsman in every format.

Lol at not much of a miss. :))

1 good series against India doesn't make him great T20 player.

By that logic Mathew Wade must be another champion player as he thrashed India in recent series.

Check Williamson's whole T20I career it's nothing special and he's not NZ's best batsman in T20s.
Infact, I have seen him promoting other players over himself in T20s.
 
Anyways NZ are too strong at home and they should easily beat this inexperienced Pakistani team even without Ferguson
 
Ferguson is a huge loss. No Williamson in the first T20I either. Let’s see if Pakistan can go 1-0 up against New Zealand B.

When was the last time Pakistan played a full-strength opposition in T20I cricket? Hard to recall.

Btw, Ferguson and Boult also missed the T20 series against India earlier this year.

So India only defeated NewZealand B or this rule only applies to Pakistan
 
Stick to Pakistan and New Zealand for this thread.
 
My line up given the situation and knowing what Misbah will go for.

1. Abdullah Shafiq
2. Babar Azam
3. Haider Ali
4. Mohammad Hafeez
5. Shadab Khan
6. Khushdil Shah
7. Mohammad Rizwan
8. Imad Wasim
9. Wahab Riaz
10. Shaheen Afridi
11. Harris Rauf

Most of the selections are pretty normal, except that Rizwan does not deserve to play T20I anymore. In 23 games, he has scored 185 runs at an average of 16.8 and a strike rate of 96. He does not deserve to be anywhere near the T20 team. Sarfaraz was a much better batsman in T20I cricket, and Rohail Nazir's stats in T20I are also pretty bad. Only Sarfaraz merits the spot for a wicket-keeper given the players we took on the tour.

So that's the only change I'd make:

Abdullah Shafiq
Babar Azam (c)
Haider Ali
Mohammad Hafeez
Sarfaraz Ahmed
Khushdil Shah
Shadab Khan (vc)
Imad Wasim
Wahab Riaz
Shaheen Afridi
Haris Rauf

I think that this is a pretty formidable XI that can compete against New Zealand, and that this should be our team moving forward. We have batting until 9 and enough bowling options for a variety of situations. Moreover, this is the best utilization of the resources we have, because we all know that Sarfaraz is a much better player of spin as opposed to pace bowling. The middle order of Hafeez, Sarfaraz, Khushdil, Shadab, and Imad looks very promising, and given the situation, we could send someone like Shadab/Imad earlier if we need someone as a pinch hitter. I think that if the management is competent, then this is the team lineup that we should go into the game with. However, I know that Misbah will give the likes of Iftikhar another chance to prove that they are NOT T20I material.
 
The thing Mamoon fails to understand is that our team is full of young and inexperienced players. He’s always looking at the opposition players, but not looking at the fact that we’re the underdogs going into this series.

New Zealand are expected to win with and without Williamson and Ferguson.
 
The thing Mamoon fails to understand is that our team is full of young and inexperienced players. He’s always looking at the opposition players, but not looking at the fact that we’re the underdogs going into this series.

New Zealand are expected to win with and without Williamson and Ferguson.

When is our team never full of young and inexperienced players? As I said earlier, Pakistan is a poor team and that is why it is always chopping and changing and always unsettled.

That is because we have failed to develop a core of 6-7 players who have the ability to perform consistently against the top sides over a long period of time.

We are always the underdogs because we are not good enough.
 
The thing Mamoon fails to understand is that our team is full of young and inexperienced players. He’s always looking at the opposition players, but not looking at the fact that we’re the underdogs going into this series.

New Zealand are expected to win with and without Williamson and Ferguson.

Mamoon likes to get excuses in early incase Pakistan do well as they did in England. If it was not for rain Pakistan would have won the series
 
Surely we can't lose the first T20. No Williamson, Boult, Southee, Bennett, Jamieson, Taylor, Ferguson.
 
This isn't going 2 be a good series...Nz is a tougher place than eng for visotors
 
When is our team never full of young and inexperienced players? As I said earlier, Pakistan is a poor team and that is why it is always chopping and changing and always unsettled.

That is because we have failed to develop a core of 6-7 players who have the ability to perform consistently against the top sides over a long period of time.

We are always the underdogs because we are not good enough.

Pakistan have always selected undeserving players far too long likes of Faheem, Iftikhar, Nawaz etc and got rid of more deserving players like Talat Hussain too quickly. Thanks god the selections are improving now with likes of Abdullah, Haider, Zafar, Usman, Talat atleast in the squad, but we still carry one or two dead woods like Faheem and Iftikhar.
 
1 good series against India doesn't mean much. Going by his overall T20I career it was an exception rather than the norm.

Williamson has faced 'garbage' Pakistani bowlers in T20s before aswell and didn't do much special.

Anyways Williamson is missing just 1 game he will be back and can still contribute

Overall career holds little value. The only thing that matters is your current experience and current ability.

Williamson is in great form and has done well in T20 cricket in recent times. Also, as a batsman, he is now at the peak of his powers.

Hence, it is very naive to assume that NZ would not miss him in the opening match. Moreover, he is also captain, which makes him even a bigger miss.

This doesn’t mean that if Williamson doesn’t score a double-century in the 2nd and 3rd T20Is you should start celebrating. Anyone can fail in a few matches in a series, it is not a big deal.

The question - does Williamson makes the NZ T20I team when everyone is fit? The answer is yes.

If Pakistan were playing ODIs on this tour and Babar was unavailable, would you not say that Babar is a big miss?

Of course you would, but if we use your logic, then Babar won’t be missed because he averaged 5 against New Zealand in the 2018 series.
 
When is our team never full of young and inexperienced players? As I said earlier, Pakistan is a poor team and that is why it is always chopping and changing and always unsettled.

That is because we have failed to develop a core of 6-7 players who have the ability to perform consistently against the top sides over a long period of time.

We are always the underdogs because we are not good enough.

Lol, so why does it matter if 2 key players are missing from the opposition team. If we somehow do manage to win the T20 series you really can’t downplay it.

And, we’re also missing our opener in Fakhar, and our two main bowlers in Hassan Ali and Amir. So, whatever the xi they put out against NZ, it won’t be our best xi.
 
Pakistan have always selected undeserving players far too long likes of Faheem, Iftikhar, Nawaz etc and got rid of more deserving players like Talat Hussain too quickly. Thanks god the selections are improving now with likes of Abdullah, Haider, Zafar, Usman, Talat atleast in the squad, but we still carry one or two dead woods like Faheem and Iftikhar.

Nothing is different now. These deserving players, except 1-2, will also end up in the “undeserving” category in a few years.

At one point, the likes of Faheem were hyped to the moon and now that reality has dawned on our fans, he has become an undeserving player.

We need to accept that 99% of the players that come through our setup are poor, and that will not change in the future no matter how much we praise and advertise the changes in domestic cricket.
 
Lol, so why does it matter if 2 key players are missing from the opposition team. If we somehow do manage to win the T20 series you really can’t downplay it.

And, we’re also missing our opener in Fakhar, and our two main bowlers in Hassan Ali and Amir. So, whatever the xi they put out against NZ, it won’t be our best xi.

Dropped players do not count. That is the board’s decision. Similarly, Taylor doesn’t count either.

Is Pakistan missing any regular player due to injury?

You can technically say that Fakhar was dropped due to health reasons and not due to bad performances, but people have been demanding for his exclusion for a while now. He has been very poor against good attacks.
 
Dropped players do not count. That is the board’s decision. Similarly, Taylor doesn’t count either.

Is Pakistan missing any regular player due to injury?

You can technically say that Fakhar was dropped due to health reasons and not due to bad performances, but people have been demanding for his exclusion for a while now. He has been very poor against good attacks.


“Overall career holds little value. The only thing that matters is your current experience and current ability” - like you said overall career holds little value, the players that I’ve mentioned (Fakhar, Hassan and Amir) have the ability to rip through any opposition single handedly. So why does it matter if a players is dropped or injured, facts are that we’re not playing our strongest team.
 
With the super small grounds in NZ, even the edges will go for sixes. So the T20 series will be a high scoring one. My bet is that Imad Wasim will do well in the series. He needs to bat higher too.
 
“Overall career holds little value. The only thing that matters is your current experience and current ability” - like you said overall career holds little value, the players that I’ve mentioned (Fakhar, Hassan and Amir) have the ability to rip through any opposition single handedly. So why does it matter if a players is dropped or injured, facts are that we’re not playing our strongest team.

Umm what?

Fakhar is in terrible form and even if we consider the strong start to his career, he doesn’t offer any threat to any strong team these days.

Hasan is also an average bowler today. It is not 2017 anymore. At the moment he is not good enough to compete against the good sides in international cricket.

Amir is also nothing great these days. I would pick him ahead of street bowlers like Rauf and the useless Musa, but currently Amir is not one of the best bowlers in the world.

As far as the notion that we aren’t playing our strongest team, well as I explained previously, the strongest Pakistani team these days means nothing. It like saying the strongest Sri Lankan or Bangladesh team.

Pakistan is a poor team today and even our strongest side cannot be considered strong by any means.
 
Nothing is different now. These deserving players, except 1-2, will also end up in the “undeserving” category in a few years.

At one point, the likes of Faheem were hyped to the moon and now that reality has dawned on our fans, he has become an undeserving player.

We need to accept that 99% of the players that come through our setup are poor, and that will not change in the future no matter how much we praise and advertise the changes in domestic cricket.

Only few naive people rated Faheem, Asif Ali, Nawaz and Iftikhar. They have always performed poorly and continued to do with one or two exceptions. The current lot Haider, Usman, Zafar, Hasnain Haris, Talat have much higher ceiling and if selectors keep selecting them will return good performances
 
Lol, so why does it matter if 2 key players are missing from the opposition team. If we somehow do manage to win the T20 series you really can’t downplay it.

And, we’re also missing our opener in Fakhar, and our two main bowlers in Hassan Ali and Amir. So, whatever the xi they put out against NZ, it won’t be our best xi.
I think you are new here. People here backtracked on their claims right before the CT final, after berating the Pakistan team throughout the tournament. Suddenly when they reached the final, they were 'the team with momentum' and 'will probably win'.

The same logic was used to downplay Pakistan's wins over NZ in NZ, and the two whitewashes of Australia and NZ in the UAE. Excuses were made for the two wins against England and New Zealand in the WC too, so not sure why anyone is surprised and feeding the trolls in this thread.

Although, this Pakistan team will get hammered by NZ this time.
 
NZ are a good team with all their players having clear roles and intelligent, talented players to carry them out. They smashed Ind last year so we have to be at our best to beat them.
 
Overall career holds little value. The only thing that matters is your current experience and current ability.

Williamson is in great form and has done well in T20 cricket in recent times. Also, as a batsman, he is now at the peak of his powers.

Hence, it is very naive to assume that NZ would not miss him in the opening match. Moreover, he is also captain, which makes him even a bigger miss.

This doesn’t mean that if Williamson doesn’t score a double-century in the 2nd and 3rd T20Is you should start celebrating. Anyone can fail in a few matches in a series, it is not a big deal.

The question - does Williamson makes the NZ T20I team when everyone is fit? The answer is yes.

If Pakistan were playing ODIs on this tour and Babar was unavailable, would you not say that Babar is a big miss?

Of course you would, but if we use your logic, then Babar won’t be missed because he averaged 5 against New Zealand in the 2018 series.


The thing is that Babar is Pakistan's best ODI batsman and he has done well in NZ previously apart from 1 series. So ofcourse he would be a big miss.

But Williamson has not done much in T20Is apart from a few knocks and I don't think he's the best batsman in NZ team in T20s.

But even if I take your word that Williamson is a big miss, he's only missing 1T20.

Does that make it NewZealand B?

As I said in earlier post, Ind beat NZ earlier this year and both Boult and Ferguson didn't play that whole series.

So would you agree that it was NZ B vs India or is it only applicable for Pakistan.
 
NZ at home is a much better team regardless of who is playing or not. They have a good bunch of players who’ll do well therefore it’s not going to be easy for PAK. However, the first T20 will set the tone of the series - if PAK don’t win that one, it’s going to be a long, long tour.
 
This isn’t PSL. International grade bowling attacks will love to see someone like Shadab at number 5. It almost feels like comedy.

Shadab is a number 9 in LOIs and a number 8 in Tests.

Instead of merely dismissing the Idea of Shadab at 5 (where he seems to do well for his T20 franchise), can you please explain who should be at no.5 considering we have the issues with team balance?

Rizwan at 5 means a Test batsman trying to pose as a T20 player batting in the top 5 (recipe for disaster)

Shoaib Malik is history

Selecting Iftikhar Ahmed is an option, but who will you drop to play him? Will you drop Abdullah Shafiq or Khusdhil Shah?

Should Khushdil Shah bat at 5? Would you promote Imad Wasim to bat at 5?

I understand that you dont like the name Shadab, but can you at least provide a realistic outlook about what should be the side? Also consider the traditional selection approach demonstrated by Misbah and Babar
 
Instead of merely dismissing the Idea of Shadab at 5 (where he seems to do well for his T20 franchise), can you please explain who should be at no.5 considering we have the issues with team balance?

Rizwan at 5 means a Test batsman trying to pose as a T20 player batting in the top 5 (recipe for disaster)

Shoaib Malik is history

Selecting Iftikhar Ahmed is an option, but who will you drop to play him? Will you drop Abdullah Shafiq or Khusdhil Shah?

Should Khushdil Shah bat at 5? Would you promote Imad Wasim to bat at 5?

I understand that you dont like the name Shadab, but can you at least provide a realistic outlook about what should be the side? Also consider the traditional selection approach demonstrated by Misbah and Babar

From your given lineup, push Khushdil to 5 and play Imad at 6, Rizwan at 7 and Shadab at 8.

It is still a shocking lineup though. Khushdil doesn’t look international material, Rizwan doesn’t fit into the T20 lineup unless he opens and Shadab at 8 is still one position too high.

But Shadab at 5 is a recipe for disaster. Take a look at other number 5 batsmen in the world and then look at Shadab.
 
Agree with Mamoon that Khushdil should bat at 5. Shadab is no 6 batsmen at international level. Sure he can and will develop his game further the more he plays and make it as no 4 or 5 at some stage but not yet, he is a key all rounder who often delivers in bowling or batting.
 
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My line up given the situation and knowing what Misbah will go for.

1. Abdullah Shafiq
2. Babar Azam
3. Haider Ali
4. Mohammad Hafeez
5. Shadab Khan
6. Khushdil Shah
7. Mohammad Rizwan
8. Imad Wasim
9. Wahab Riaz
10. Shaheen Afridi
11. Harris Rauf

Lol Shadab at 5? Imad and Rizwan should both be batting above him. Also, much more likely that Haider will open with Abdullah at No. 3
 
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