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Saim Ayub as an all-rounder: Performance watch

And people used to swear against hafeez against a pumped up Steyn

And chota akmals and afridis brain farts

When saim is worse since he can't even score against club level teams
 
Needs to be handled carefully. Good bowler and has test potential with the ball. Batting should be treated like a bonus. Has batting talent too. Should be batting 6-7 in red ball and become a utility white ball cricketer. Not a pure batsman. However Pak needs to manage him better or else wasted potential.
 
Only three Pakistan players have recorded three or more consecutive ducks in men’s T20Is: Abdullah Shafique (4), Mohammad Hafeez (3), and now Saim Ayub (3*) 😳
 
Kind of reminds me of Hafeez now at periods of his career when we looked classy got few runs, batted as opener and was doing well with the ball. He’s currently the same as that version of Hafeez 😄.

Saim is still one of the last people I would drop. He shouldn’t have played World Cup t20 but now he has a few good knocks here and there in all three formats, despite the overall poor record in t20s (and a great one in Odis). I think it’s different once you actually have some performances under your belt, dropping someone who’s probably our best young talent in domestic and few other options doesn’t feel wise.
 
He has been bowling beautifully lately. I don't think he is a part-timer anymore. He is a full-blown all-rounder now.
 
All rounder? Lol, doesn't seem to know how to hold a cricket bat right now
 
Best not to open with Saim and push him down , and see if he performs. If not, probably best treat him as a tail ender. Seems he has lost his mojo
 
Bowling wise he is as good as frontline attacking spinner at the moment and I rate him better than Abrar , Muqeem and Nawaz for sure
 
dude managed to score against aus and sa, has a higher ceiling than most in this pak set up, which isnt saying a lot, but is still true. all it takes is one patta and his form might click agian. problem now is theres too much non cricketing drama around this team, which is not good for mentally weak people, which is most of these players.
 
ElRaja said:
dude managed to score against aus and sa, has a higher ceiling than most in this pak set up, which isnt saying a lot, but is still true. all it takes is one patta and his form might click agian. problem now is theres too much non cricketing drama around this team, which is not good for mentally weak people, which is most of these players.
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He hasn't found his game yet on slow and sluggish pitches. Scored against great attacks in SENA but struggling on subcontinent type pitches which are not flat.

He needs to look at his shot selection on this pitches, at least for the first 10-20 balls.
 
RidiculousMan said:
He hasn't found his game yet on slow and sluggish pitches. Scored against great attacks in SENA but struggling on subcontinent type pitches which are not flat.

He needs to look at his shot selection on this pitches, at least for the first 10-20 balls.
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This year 13 out of 17 t20i innings he got out before facing 20 balls.

No one’s asking him to anchor but he doesn’t know his role because in our top 6 we have 5 openers. Each of whom thinks they are best suited opening the innings or utilising the powerplay. What ends up happening is that no one is comfortable in their role. No one is sure about their own game and no one is taking responsibility. The only non-opener is the captain who got called out for hiding in the order and has now been exposed in t20s.
 
Obaidd said:
This year 13 out of 17 t20i innings he got out before facing 20 balls.

No one’s asking him to anchor but he doesn’t know his role because in our top 6 we have 5 openers. Each of whom thinks they are best suited opening the innings or utilising the powerplay. What ends up happening is that no one is comfortable in their role. No one is sure about their own game and no one is taking responsibility. The only non-opener is the captain who got called out for hiding in the order and has now been exposed in t20s.
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At least Saim should perform. He is the only one who is consistently playing as an opener in the format without getting dropped.
 
Local.Dada said:
Needs to be handled carefully. Good bowler and has test potential with the ball. Batting should be treated like a bonus. Has batting talent too. Should be batting 6-7 in red ball and become a utility white ball cricketer. Not a pure batsman. However Pak needs to manage him better or else wasted potential.
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What do you mean he has batting talent too? he's literally in the team for his batting.
 
He just need to slightly alter his action so that he can properly hide his variation at the time of release , the guy has 3/4 deliveries in his armory but any half decent batter will pick him up from his hand and release, need to work on that aspect if he wants to become a world class bowler which he surely can based on his potential.
 
Do we need saim as batter?? YES
Do we need saim as a bowler??? NOT MORE THAN HIS BATTING..

He should be dropped for the next few games.. LEt fakhar or haris open... Simple/
 
What shocks me a bit is Saim has actually played a lot more games than I thought. 44 t20 games. Feels like yesterday he debuted but I guess we’ve played a lot of t20s lately. By the end of this Asia cup he will have around 50 games. Which to put in perspective is around half the games Rizwan or Fakhar have played.
 
People are desperately trying to turn him into a bowler so he cannot be dropped but his primary job was batting, where he failed and now he has a poultry farm of his own there.
 
BouncerGuy said:
People are desperately trying to turn him into a bowler so he cannot be dropped but his primary job was batting, where he failed and now he has a poultry farm of his own there.
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100% spot on, the all rounders tag is a load of rubbish. It's just a way of fans making excuses to cover up his failure as a batsmen
 
Amjid Javed said:
100% spot on, the all rounders tag is a load of rubbish. It's just a way of fans making excuses to cover up his failure as a batsmen
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Exactly... I want him to get rested for the next game.. He needs mental rest. you don't want such a ayoungster to go into his shell after multiple failures....
 
If the batting issues continue, my fear is that this thread title may be changed to "Saim Ayub the spinner performance watch"
 
MenInG said:
If the batting issues continue, my fear is that this thread title may be changed to "Saim Ayub the spinner performance watch"
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He is more of a bowling all-rounder currently.

Reminds me of how Steven Smith went from being a spinner to a batter. Saim's case is opposite.
 
sweep_shot said:
He is more of a bowling all-rounder currently.

Reminds me of how Steven Smith went from being a spinner to a batter. Saim's case is opposite.
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Smith was being “selected” as a bowling allrounder but he was always a batsman, he had 50 as his batting average in first class before being selected for Internationals, it was just that there wasn’t an opening in the Aus team as a pure batsman during that early era.
 
JaDed said:
Smith was being “selected” as a bowling allrounder but he was always a batsman, he had 50 as his batting average in first class before being selected for Internationals, it was just that there wasn’t an opening in the Aus team as a pure batsman during that early era.
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When Smith first started, he was not a batter. He was a spinner and a tail-ender. Someone like Keshav Maharaj. :inti

I remember his early days quite clearly.


 
sweep_shot said:
When Smith first started, he was not a batter. He was a spinner and a tail-ender. Someone like Keshav Maharaj. :inti

I remember his early days quite clearly.


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steve smith averaged 50+ in aussie first class when he debuted with the bat, he was always a competent batsmen, he just used his leg spin to make his way in the team. by about ten or twelve tests hed established himself as a test batter.
 
ElRaja said:
steve smith averaged 50+ in aussie first class when he debuted with the bat, he was always a competent batsmen, he just used his leg spin to make his way in the team. by about ten or twelve tests hed established himself as a test batter.
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Yeah, he was well regarded as a veye good batsman. I remember around 2007/08 when india toured Australia, there was a TV segment about all the exciting players around the first class setup in Australia. Multiple coaches and players were interviewed and many spoke very highly about him on camera. They mentioned about how Smith could be the next big batsman and how Smith can revolutionize batting on spinning tracks. He also spoke about his whacky technique and how he is in excellent position when he is about to meet the ball. There was also mention about Smith's eccentric preparation techniques. There wasn't much talk about his bowling at all apart from passing remarks about it
 
Saim trying to change his identity from batter to bowler or management is trying this stuff at least.. it is not a bad thing if you are a handy bowler, but if you are failing at your primary jo,b then you might not survive much/
 
sweep_shot said:
When Smith first started, he was not a batter. He was a spinner and a tail-ender. Someone like Keshav Maharaj. :inti

I remember his early days quite clearly.


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As i said he was “selected” as a bowling allrounder but in first class he was already having 50 average in batting..
 
sweep_shot said:
When Smith first started, he was not a batter. He was a spinner and a tail-ender. Someone like Keshav Maharaj. :inti

I remember his early days quite clearly.


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JaDed said:
As i said he was “selected” as a bowling allrounder but in first class he was already having 50 average in batting..
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A better example would be Azhar Ali who trult was a bowler before becoming a test batter.

Difference is Azhar is not an ATG hence doesnt get mentioned much but he's ironically one of the best no 3 test batters of all time if you exclude any ATG's on that list like Ponting, Dravid etc etc.

Azhar is defo superior to any Asian batter playing in test cricket not named India. Since he's > Every current pk batter, Current Bangladesh batter, Current Sri Lankan test batter.

Steve Smith was avg 50+ in first class and was bowling as well. He was a proper allrounder but gave up bowling completly to focus full time on batting and as a result his batting improved by heaps and bounds after his 12th to 15th test game.
 
@mominsaigol I see Saim as super talented.

You can even see in his bowling.

The problem I see with a super talented guy is that he doesn't know how to utilize his talents properly. It might take him time to understand his own game.

He will need special care. Not pampering. But proper pathway.
 
RidiculousMan said:
@mominsaigol I see Saim as super talented.

You can even see in his bowling.

The problem I see with a super talented guy is that he doesn't know how to utilize his talents properly. It might take him time to understand his own game.

He will need special care. Not pampering. But proper pathway.
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He was relatively new to cricket. Instead of focusing purely on his batting, he tried to diversify his portfolio. Eventually, he seems to be slightly losing grip on his batting.
 
Nikhil_cric said:
Trying to smash back off a length deliveries from the get go is not his strength

He is not Bairstow or any of those Aussie batters. Doesn't have the power for that.
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He always looked like he was getting caught on the boundary leg side. I was hoping he would have developed a bit more after all these matches.
 
Abid Z said:
He always looked like he was getting caught on the boundary leg side. I was hoping he would have developed a bit more after all these matches.
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Think it's just a mental adjustment he needs. Somebody has to get into his ear and ask him to play out the first two overs with minimum risk.
 
Nikhil_cric said:
Think it's just a mental adjustment he needs. Somebody has to get into his ear and ask him to play out the first two overs with minimum risk.
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That’s certainly true. In South Africa odi he was beginning to show glimpses of good judgement, temperament and a range of stroke play all around the wicket not just leg side. Now he looks a little off colour and just wafts aimlessly. But he’s has the talent maybe he’s just found out now and everybody knows back of a length is his weaknesss.
 
Saim needs to rotate strike on first 6 balls and then can go towards his natural game if he survives

Also like last game he shouldn’t be facing ball 1
 
Abid Z said:
He did ok in South Africa. You are allowed a few dips in form but he’s performing with the ball if not the bat.
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His primary job is to score runs. Just because he's now taken a few wickets. Fans are hiding behind the "He's an all rounder" excuse.

Pakistans batting is woeful as it is, having passengers in team espcially at top of order is no benefit to the team
 
Amjid Javed said:
His primary job is to score runs. Just because he's now taken a few wickets. Fans are hiding behind the "He's an all rounder" excuse.

Pakistans batting is woeful as it is, having passengers in team espcially at top of order is no benefit to the team
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This is true if he was a pure batsman. His batting form is woeful currently. He needs to contribute with the bat no doubt But can’t drop him mid tournament either. Too late in the day to make changes.

I do feel that others (sahibzada, Hasan Nawaz, agha, Haris) need to contribute more also. The whole team looks abject.
 
Abid Z said:
This is true if he was a pure batsman. His batting form is woeful currently. He needs to contribute with the bat no doubt But can’t drop him mid tournament either. Too late in the day to make changes.

I do feel that others (sahibzada, Hasan Nawaz, agha, Haris) need to contribute more also. The whole team looks abject.
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The whole batting indeed looks abject. The entire line up is essentially dependant on Saim, fakhar and Agha scoring bulk of the runs.

Problem is Pakistan are on the back foot every game with Saim getting out early. Which means Pakistan are always in damage limitation mode in PP as we can't be losing 2 wickets at start of games so easily.

Yeah you essentially can't do much more with this squad, but at sane time Saim has to get his backside into gear
 
Amjid Javed said:
The whole batting indeed looks abject. The entire line up is essentially dependant on Saim, fakhar and Agha scoring bulk of the runs.

Problem is Pakistan are on the back foot every game with Saim getting out early. Which means Pakistan are always in damage limitation mode in PP as we can't be losing 2 wickets at start of games so easily.

Yeah you essentially can't do much more with this squad, but at sane time Saim has to get his backside into gear
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You are right the whole team looks incredibly abject but the top order is really weak. It’s impossible to drop Saim now, I haven’t rated him as a batter ever and I know we’ve agreed in the past. But he should be useful for at least 20 quick runs. It’s the rest that look equally as bad which is a worry. You’d think time spent in the middle should help but even then everybody is in a go-slow.

I’ve always rated Saims bowling more than his batting. Canny little cutters with impeccable line and length. Some say carrom ball. It’s a more dependable suit. Maybe he should not open for now.
 
Don't make the mistake of thinking his batting has declined because he's suddenly taking wickets with the ball. Saim's issues have been present since his T20I debut.

He has the talent but hasn't developed any game awareness or batting IQ. Even the most powerful T20 batters in the world don't swing from the hip from ball one. You certainly can't do that on slow, stopping pitches in Dubai. He needs give himself an over to assess conditions instead of getting dismissed in the first over and instantly putting the lineup under pressure.
 
I remember seeing some clips of him here and there was something impressive about his wrists I think. Don't remember exactly. The shot he played vs India to get out - I initially was about to let out a wow before I realized he was caught :ROFLMAO:.

Anyway, when I read he had another duck the other day, I just got the feeling it was all going to come together vs India. Dunno, let's see.
 
One of the most overhyped players in a very long time alongside Mohammad Haris. People talk about him like he is an Imran Nazir Regen when he doesn’t even have 1 percent of his talent or skill
 
Saim at 3 is not a great option. If he’s not good enough to open then he should go further down. At this point, I am thinking Haris might be more suited to 3 then Saim.
 
Savak said:
He is very lucky to have gotten so many chances, other players in his place would have been dropped after two failures. He is taking his place in the team for granted because the team is relying on him for his bowling.
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Agha being a clueless captain doesn’t help Saim.
 
Saim really needs to be dropped now... ENough of him TBH.. He is nowhere near the form we saw him in South Africa... His confidence is under the rubble. Give him rest.. BUt who is gonna replace him??? Talat?? LOL
Khushdil?? LOL

Sorry. forget about dropping him.. He should play
 
BouncerGuy said:
Shoaib Malik was good bro... Compare him with Khushdil or ifti chacha at best ATM
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Reason I said Malik is cause he is good. That's the point.

Saeed Anwar is Pakistan's greatest odi batsmen period. Maybe Inzi or Zhaeer can be considered better but I believe Anwar was better then both of em, his child's death made him lose interest in cricket thats all. And understandably so.

Saim Ayub vs Saeed was a terrible comparison and I called it in the aus and SA series that saim replicating Shots of Saeed =/= to him ever reaching Anwar's heights.

Only Fakhar Zaman has somewhat reached those heights but Fakhar is like 100x more inconsistent then Saaed. Anwar bashed 2nd strings like no tmr, you needed top tier bowling lineups to deal with him,

While fakhar can go from smashing 180 vs NZ and then proceed to get humiliated by Nepal, Zimbabwe and other sides on a consistent basis.

Malik is another good and underrated allrounder who is hated for no reason. But he's a good cricketer to have in your lineup(prime malik, not current)

While saim is a tragedy.

Hence this saim vs Malik will end in tears.
 
From the 2 matches that I have watched, here are my observations

1. Saim can be a utility bowler but not in the power-play. He is not a mystery spinner who can deceive batsmen. Nor he can flight the ball to extract good amount of spin. He has good length and decent control but that only works on mediocre teams. He can cramp the batsmen for room but against any top class batsmen, he will get punished. He lacks confidence on his bowling and once he goes for runs, he will lose rhythm.
2. He might have got wickets in the initial overs in Asia cup but its best to use him during 8-12 over mark in T20. He doesn't have control or speed variation like Axar but decent enough to slow down run rate with protection on one-side of the ground.

There is a reason Varun is the guy mostly used in Powerplay’s. Not even kuldeep as he loops the ball more often which can be easily hit in front foot if he over-pitches in powerplays.

Abrar is a good choice I feel during initial overs. While his insta posts are cringe, he is far decent than the likes of Shadab and others.
 
He's going down the Shadab route i.e. sometimes bowler, sometimes batsman, something nothing.

At this rate, Saim is next in line to become Pakistan captain in T20I.
 
People throw words like all-rounder too casually these days 🙄

All rounder is someone who can get into the team either as a batsman or as a bowler.

At the moment, Saim is not good enough for either
 
He’s obviously bowled more deliveries than he has scored runs lately. I don’t want that from my opener or one down batter.
 
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