Should boxing classes be based on height instead of weight?

[Blistering Barnacle]

Just throwing this out there, but should boxing categories be based on height rather than weight?

Thinking about this era of super heavy weights who are like 6'6" to 6'9" verses the old days of say 5'10" to 6'2".

I'm kind of thinking perhaps it should be based on height rather than weight.

Eg., two guys around 5'6" face off against each other instead of one guy who is perhaps 6' at the same weight as a stock guy who's 5'6".

The weight classes are becoming sort of stupid at this point. You might have a heavyweight at 210 facing off against a guy like Tyson Fury who is like 270 and like 6 or 7 inches taller. That's ridiculous.

 

[Blistering Barnacle]

How about 2 guys around the same height? Two guys around 5'6". One stocky and broad and slow vs one slim guy with greater speed but less power.

 

[LordJames]

Just throwing this out there, but should boxing categories be based on height rather than weight?

Thinking about this era of super heavy weights who are like 6'6" to 6'9" verses the old days of say 5'10" to 6'2".

I'm kind of thinking perhaps it should be based on height rather than weight.

Eg., two guys around 5'6" face off against each other instead of one guy who is perhaps 6' at the same weight as a stock guy who's 5'6".

The weight classes are becoming sort of stupid at this point. You might have a heavyweight at 210 facing off against a guy like Tyson Fury who is like 270 and like 6 or 7 inches taller. That's ridiculous.

Mike Tyson 5'10" Brutal Knockout of Frank Bruno 6'3", February 1989



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Mike Tyson 5'10" Brutal Knockout of Buster Mathis Jr 6'1", December 1995

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Mike Tyson 5'10" Brutal Knockout of Francois Botha 6'1", January 1999

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[Blistering Barnacle]

Eh, all those guys weren't like fighting Lewis at 6'5" or Klitskcho brothers at 6'6" to 6'7" or any of the massive heavyweights today. But also what about the lighter weights? If you are a stocky build at 5'5", should you have to fight a lighter build guy at 6 or so? With his massive reach advantage? I think personally it would be interesting to have it based on height. Two shorties fighting each other or two tall guys. Mike Tyson today wouldn't stand a chance against Fury or the other giants.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Eh, all those guys weren't like fighting Lewis at 6'5" or Klitskcho brothers at 6'6" to 6'7" or any of the massive heavyweights today. But also what about the lighter weights? If you are a stocky build at 5'5", should you have to fight a lighter build guy at 6 or so? With his massive reach advantage? I think personally it would be interesting to have it based on height. Two shorties fighting each other or two tall guys. Mike Tyson today wouldn't stand a chance against Fury or the other giants.

Mike Tyson would destroy Tyson Fury, AJ and Uysk at his peak.

He is the perfect example against your argument...reason being height doesnt alter power but weight does.

Someone at 100kg will be too strong for someone at 70kg if both are 6ft.

 

[Blistering Barnacle]

As a shorter guy myself who is heavy, I think I could knock out a taller opponent, but I can also see myself being outjabbed and outpointed by a taller opponent in a boring match. He would just dodge my shots and stick his jab out once in a while and then win a decision. That's boring for me. Would rather the contest be fairer. As I said , I don't think Tyson would have a chance today against the giants of the division. I know, I know, he has his fans who think he was the greatest, but imo he would be destroyed by a Fury.

 

[Blistering Barnacle]

Mike Tyson would destroy Tyson Fury, AJ and Uysk at his peak.

He is the perfect example against your argument...reason being height doesnt alter power but weight does.

Someone at 100kg will be too strong for someone at 70kg if both are 6ft.

Beg to differ. Tyson would be destroyed by Fury.

 

[Blistering Barnacle]

Tyson would be a little light shrimp against a giant in Fury. Not only a giant, but a highly skilled giant. Sorry, but Tyson would lose badly and be humiliated. that's part of my point. If Fury was Tyson's size, Fury would be destroyed in minutes.

 

[SalimBhai]

I loved Tyson. However Tyson always had issues with taller fighters: Razor ruddock, Leiws and he even paid money not to fight Ruddock Bowe. Tyson vs fury would be interesting. Fury will not get destroyed. Could go either way

 

[shaz619]

Being tall alone is not an advantage the moment you step in the ring unlike weight. Having reach doesn’t mean you will automatically establish your jab before your opponent either. Taller fighters seem to get stereotyped for being rangy boxers who keep it long and use their ring generalship to win fights, that’s not the case in every scenario. Being shorter can have its advantages to when you loop shots over the eye line from below and use evasive movement. How you maximise your physical tools is dependent on the style you implement and skill. We don’t even need to go way back to prove this and have seen the likes of Floyd, Loma, Crawford, Manny and even Canelo who have all had success despite climbing multiple weight classes having adapted their methodologies and succeeding, we even saw it from Usyk a recent example in his fight against AJ

 

[Blistering Barnacle]

I loved Tyson. However Tyson always had issues with taller fighters: Razor ruddock, Leiws and he even paid money not to fight Ruddock Bowe. Tyson vs fury would be interesting. Fury will not get destroyed. Could go either way

Tyson paid step aside money to Lewis, not Bowe. Going back to Tyson-Fury, yes I think Fury would be destroyed if they were the same height. No doubt about that imo. Otherwise, yes, 6'9" Fury would destroy 5'10" (as best) Mike Tyson.

 

[Blistering Barnacle]

Being tall alone is not an advantage the moment you step in the ring unlike weight. Having reach doesn’t mean you will automatically establish your jab before your opponent either. Taller fighters seem to get stereotyped for being rangy boxers who keep it long and use their ring generalship to win fights, that’s not the case in every scenario. Being shorter can have its advantages to when you loop shots over the eye line from below and use evasive movement. How you maximise your physical tools is dependent on the style you implement and skill. We don’t even need to go way back to prove this and have seen the likes of Floyd, Loma, Crawford, Manny and even Canelo who have all had success despite climbing multiple weight classes having adapted their methodologies and succeeding, we even saw it from Usyk a recent example in his fight against AJ

Ok, have you seen a super lightweight fighter (who tend to be really short) climb up in weight the way say a welterweight has climbed to middle weight? I'd say no.

Why? Because a super lightweight or featherweight or whatever is likely to be about 5' tall. He can't gain the weight to fight a 5'6"or 5'8" or whatever guy.

Just like nowadays a 6' heavyweight is a shrimp. He's no match for the standard 6'6" to 6'9" monsters today that reign the heavyweight division. Well, Usyck is an exception at about 6'2" or 6'3" . I mean, even that is funny that Usyck is considered a small heavyweight at that height. Mohammaed Ali was 6'3".

 

[shaz619]

Ok, have you seen a super lightweight fighter (who tend to be really short) climb up in weight the way say a welterweight has climbed to middle weight? I'd say no.

Why? Because a super lightweight or featherweight or whatever is likely to be about 5' tall. He can't gain the weight to fight a 5'6"or 5'8" or whatever guy.

Just like nowadays a 6' heavyweight is a shrimp. He's no match for the standard 6'6" to 6'9" monsters today that reign the heavyweight division. Well, Usyck is an exception at about 6'2" or 6'3" . I mean, even that is funny that Usyck is considered a small heavyweight at that height. Mohammaed Ali was 6'3".

Yes, Roberto Duran, who started out as a super featherweight and successfully climbed to middleweight. Physical tools play a part but unless there is a huge weight disparity the playing field is levelled, Boxing is a scientific sport and the mental side of it is pivotal to. Fighters who are shorter or smaller need to be more technical if they have ambitions north of their stock weight class. I think you are alluding to how much weight fighters are capable of putting on post weigh in, sure a guy who started out at 126 pound in his career is not going to put on the same level of weight as a guy who started his career at 140-147lb for a fight scheduled at 154 lb, and he’s not going to grow any taller either, but does that handicap his chances? to an extent perhaps, because as old saying goes, a good big guy will defeat a good small guy, but as we’ve seen in history this isn’t always the case and if you’ve noticed, often it’s the more technical fighters who are ambitious enough to climb up given their skill sets and mental strength, they may suss out an opponent who may be bigger but they may have superior boxing ability to neutralise their physical attributes.

This is what I mean, there has been that crowd in the present who demonise the golden era of heavyweight boxing but Usyk and even someone like Wilder are evidence that their size is not a handicap against some of the bigger Heavyweights in the division. It’s a big myth that guys like Mike, Ali, Holyfield and Joe Frazier would be no match for boxers in the 21st century, am sure you wouldn’t believe that. As I said before, a good big guy will beat a good small guy more often then not, but Tyson Fury is an anomaly, he is the most complete Heavyweight since Ali, in that he has the physical attributes to go along with his incredible ring generalship and Boxing ability, and I feel he matches Ali when it comes to mental strength and determination which are equally important as technical ability.

 

[SpiritOf1903]

Josh Warrington, 5' 6 schooled a 6' Japanese guy. There is an unfairness in heavyweight division though which Joshua alluded to

 

[sweep_shot]

I think keep it as it is (based on weight).

Current system is good.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

This is going back a bit but I remember when the first UFC was conceived, there was no weight divisions and ostensibly no rules. It was absolutely crazy, you had featherweights trying to take on heavyweights, it was absolute bedlam.

Personally I think there's not much you can do other than weight class. Fury is dominating because he's a good boxer who is freakishly big. He's not fantastic though, I still think Kiltscsko in his prime would have beaten him. The only other guy who can match Fury for size is Wilder, and he's just technically a poor boxer with a huge punch.

 

[shaz619]

This is going back a bit but I remember when the first UFC was conceived, there was no weight divisions and ostensibly no rules. It was absolutely crazy, you had featherweights trying to take on heavyweights, it was absolute bedlam.

Personally I think there's not much you can do other than weight class. Fury is dominating because he's a good boxer who is freakishly big. He's not fantastic though, I still think Kiltscsko in his prime would have beaten him. The only other guy who can match Fury for size is Wilder, and he's just technically a poor boxer with a huge punch.

Wlad was in his championship peak, in prime condition and his style had been perfected under Steward. Whenever someone is defeated, there are always excuses, but he won 1 round out of 12 so hard to see him win in any capacity. Fury is just all wrong for big Wlad and the current Tyson would knock him out. Wlad was a late bloomer, he did have some lacklustre performances here and there but for his signature fights he showed up. He almost knocked out Joshua but was given poor corner advice to, Wlad was very effective utilising his attributes against smaller fighters and he boxed well at range and had a great jab, but I can’t see him outsmarting a ring technician. Fury is right, the best way to beat him is knocking him spark out, Wilder is more of a threat to Fury then Wlad, AJ or anyone else could have been and Wilder isn’t even considered a big Heavyweight among the current lot in terms of his size

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Wlad was in his championship peak, in prime condition and his style had been perfected under Steward. Whenever someone is defeated, there are always excuses, but he won 1 round out of 12 so hard to see him win in any capacity. Fury is just all wrong for big Wlad and the current Tyson would knock him out. Wlad was a late bloomer, he did have some lacklustre performances here and there but for his signature fights he showed up. He almost knocked out Joshua but was given poor corner advice to, Wlad was very effective utilising his attributes against smaller fighters and he boxed well at range and had a great jab, but I can’t see him outsmarting a ring technician. Fury is right, the best way to beat him is knocking him spark out, Wilder is more of a threat to Fury then Wlad, AJ or anyone else could have been and Wilder isn’t even considered a big Heavyweight among the current lot in terms of his size

So basically Klitschko was also a limited boxer who dominated by pure size. To be fair, we've had freakishly big boxers in the past as well, but they weren't really boxers at all, just big guys who some thought might win by being much bigger. Fury is actually a very good boxer, not perfect, but he has fast hands and a good chin. It would take an outstanding boxer who wasn't dwarfed by him to win, maybe an outsized Larry Holmes type. It will be interesting to see who surfaces as the next heavyweight champion once Fury retires. Whoever it is probably won't last long as the rest are all eminently beatable.

 

[shaz619]

So basically Klitschko was also a limited boxer who dominated by pure size. To be fair, we've had freakishly big boxers in the past as well, but they weren't really boxers at all, just big guys who some thought might win by being much bigger. Fury is actually a very good boxer, not perfect, but he has fast hands and a good chin. It would take an outstanding boxer who wasn't dwarfed by him to win, maybe an outsized Larry Holmes type. It will be interesting to see who surfaces as the next heavyweight champion once Fury retires. Whoever it is probably won't last long as the rest are all eminently beatable.

Limited perhaps harsh, Wlad did a good bit of everything but didn’t have an elite boxing IQ to adapt and adjust during a fight. He did dominate due to his size and fought smaller guys, but under Steward he got the best out of his physical attributes, in a way he is a good example of a fighter who’s size before his technical changes didn’t do much for him. He use to try and maul guys and go head hunting with his chin hanging out, his conditioning was poor to so he’d gass and didn’t have an awareness for work rate, his defence was all over the place, you look at his performance against Brewster and David Haye and there are two different fighters.

I agree it would have to be someone with decent size and they’d have to be explosive. In terms of physical attributes and technical pedigree I’d say Lennox Lewis would be a candidate and maybe they fall a little out the category but would add Mike and Ali to the list as well.

If Fury retires sooner rather then later and the others continue for a few years, it wouldn’t surprise me if Wilder unified and AJ became champion again. Wilder/Usyk is a great fight. Out the younger contenders, hoping Dubois develops nicely and Joe Joyce is in the mix but a little old

 

[SalimBhai]

Tyson paid step aside money to Lewis, not Bowe. Going back to Tyson-Fury, yes I think Fury would be destroyed if they were the same height. No doubt about that imo. Otherwise, yes, 6'9" Fury would destroy 5'10" (as best) Mike Tyson.

Sorry, correct

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Limited perhaps harsh, Wlad did a good bit of everything but didn’t have an elite boxing IQ to adapt and adjust during a fight. He did dominate due to his size and fought smaller guys, but under Steward he got the best out of his physical attributes, in a way he is a good example of a fighter who’s size before his technical changes didn’t do much for him. He use to try and maul guys and go head hunting with his chin hanging out, his conditioning was poor to so he’d gass and didn’t have an awareness for work rate, his defence was all over the place, you look at his performance against Brewster and David Haye and there are two different fighters.

I agree it would have to be someone with decent size and they’d have to be explosive. In terms of physical attributes and technical pedigree I’d say Lennox Lewis would be a candidate and maybe they fall a little out the category but would add Mike and Ali to the list as well.

If Fury retires sooner rather then later and the others continue for a few years, it wouldn’t surprise me if Wilder unified and AJ became champion again. Wilder/Usyk is a great fight. Out the younger contenders, hoping Dubois develops nicely and Joe Joyce is in the mix but a little old

I don't agree that Wilder/Usyk is a great fight to be honest, I think Fury is right that Usyk is just a blown up middleweight. I just think he wouldn't be able to get inside Fury's long range defenses to do any significant damage. Lennox would have been a great shout for a genuine challenge, I actually think he would have won against Fury, he was a very slick boxer who had a bit of everything, including the power which Fury lacks somewhat.

 

[shaz619]

I don't agree that Wilder/Usyk is a great fight to be honest, I think Fury is right that Usyk is just a blown up middleweight. I just think he wouldn't be able to get inside Fury's long range defenses to do any significant damage. Lennox would have been a great shout for a genuine challenge, I actually think he would have won against Fury, he was a very slick boxer who had a bit of everything, including the power which Fury lacks somewhat.

I agree that Fury will obliterate Usyk. But felt Wilder/Usyk would be an interesting battle until the latter gets caught clean. Lennox is the ideal candidate on paper, Fury has adopted various styles in his career but as of late is sitting down on his punches again and the Kronx gym have him using his knuckles more to, maybe it’s not a natural gift as it is for some of the biggest hitters but at his size if he plants his feet you’re going to get hurt. That upper cut he threw from range to KO Whyte is a Kronx trademark and one of Lennox’s signature shots, Kronx certainly maximise your ability to hit harder

 

[KingKhanWC]

Beg to differ. Tyson would be destroyed by Fury.

Based on what?

Tyson in the late 80's was super fast, he would defo catch Fury many times to the body, to the head. Fury doesnt have the best chin, would end up flat on the floor.

Your point doesnt work.

Andy Ruiz is 1.88m - Callum Smith is 1.91m. Smith is taller but wouldn't stand a chance against Ruiz, too much power.