Sufism thread

[Looney]

Who is interested in it ? How did you gain interest in it ? Share your favorite sufi poetry , kalam , dance , documentary and history related to sufism .

Note to Maulvi brigade : keep out if you have problems , no biddah this biddah that in my thread . I am talking about real sufi stuff here .


enjoy this
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[Cricketismylife]

Although I must admit I still havn't fully understood the concepts I am quite fascinated by this branch of Islam.

In fact this side really appeals to me. I think if understood.... some of the concepts of this side are highly impressive to a person with any background...

Don't understand why sufis are being targeted - Heard Iran was thinking of banning them?

 

[Cricketismylife]

A lot of religious talk is in terms is in terms of believers vs Nonbelievers. Lot of US vs THEM.

Sufism has that higher ground of loving the whole of mankind.

and How cool is Bulleh Shah- the man was a genius!!

 

[Looney]

Although I must admit I still havn't fully understood the concepts I am quite fascinated by this branch of Islam.

In fact this side really appeals to me. I think if understood.... some of the concepts of this side are highly impressive to a person with any background...

Don't understand why sufis are being targeted - Heard Iran was thinking of banning them?

what ? i am not aware of them being targetted . my knowledge too is very limited when it comes to sufism but it has to be great given that it is because of sufism , islam was able to spread in the subcontinent . the poetry particularly is so thought provoking .

 

[upper_Cut]

Nusrat Fateh Ali khan

 

[IAJ]

MashAllah, to become a real sufi is my dream. The world of tasawwuf is the most peaceful world you can speak of.

Looney, I have alot of respect for all the Sufis but will mention some here;

Junaid Baghdadi, Abdul Qadir Jillani, Imam Ghazali, Data Sahib, Ghareeb Nawaz chishti, Maulana Rumi, Peer Mehr Ali Shah, Sultan Bahoo, Mian Muhammad Bakhs, Peer Karam Shah, Peer Naseer udeen Naseer and many more. (May Allah bless them All). The list is long.

I will InshAllah try to post more in this thread.

 

[immubhai]

Sufism totally represents my views on Islam and I love the poetry of all the sufi Buzurg Hazrat. For instance, there is one poem of Baba Bhullay Shah which i love most, namely:

Bulleh! to me, I am not known
Not a believer inside the mosque, am I
Nor a pagan disciple of false rites
Not the pure amongst the impure
Neither Moses, nor the Pharaoh

Bulleh! to me, I am not known

Not in the holy Vedas, am I
Nor in opium, neither in wine
Not in the drunkard`s intoxicated craze
Niether awake, nor in a sleeping daze

Bulleh! to me, I am not known

In happiness nor in sorrow, am I
Neither clean, nor a filthy mire
Not from water, nor from earth
Neither fire, nor from air, is my birth

Bulleh! to me, I am not known

Not an Arab, nor Lahori
Neither Hindi, nor Nagauri
Hindu, Turk, nor Peshawari
Nor do I live in Nadaun

Bulleh! to me, I am not known

Secrets of religion, I have not known
From Adam and Eve, I am not born
I am not the name I assume
Not in stillness, nor on the move

Bulleh! to me, I am not known

I am the first, I am the last
None other, have I ever known
I am the wisest of them all
Bulleh! do I stand alone?

Bulleh! to me, I am not known

I love specially the part:

Secrets of religion, I have not known
From Adam and Eve, I am not born
I am not the name I assume
Not in stillness, nor on the move

This is sufism for me. My kind of Islam!!!

 

[cricketfanfirst]

Sufism totally represents my views on Islam and I love the poetry of all the sufi Buzurg Hazrat. For instance, there is one poem of Baba Bhullay Shah which i love most, namely:

Bulleh! to me, I am not known
Not a believer inside the mosque, am I
Nor a pagan disciple of false rites
Not the pure amongst the impure
Neither Moses, nor the Pharaoh

Bulleh! to me, I am not known

Not in the holy Vedas, am I
Nor in opium, neither in wine
Not in the drunkard`s intoxicated craze
Niether awake, nor in a sleeping daze

Bulleh! to me, I am not known

In happiness nor in sorrow, am I
Neither clean, nor a filthy mire
Not from water, nor from earth
Neither fire, nor from air, is my birth

Bulleh! to me, I am not known

Not an Arab, nor Lahori
Neither Hindi, nor Nagauri
Hindu, Turk, nor Peshawari
Nor do I live in Nadaun

Bulleh! to me, I am not known

Secrets of religion, I have not known
From Adam and Eve, I am not born
I am not the name I assume
Not in stillness, nor on the move

Bulleh! to me, I am not known

I am the first, I am the last
None other, have I ever known
I am the wisest of them all
Bulleh! do I stand alone?

Bulleh! to me, I am not known

I love specially the part:

Secrets of religion, I have not known
From Adam and Eve, I am not born
I am not the name I assume
Not in stillness, nor on the move

This is sufism for me. My kind of Islam!!!

Great philosophy from Baba Bhullay Shah!

I heard first time about Baba Bhullay Shah through one of the videos made in India some years back. Liked that tune and the way the singer sang it but I did know the meaning of the song.

Recently, I studied some information on Baba Bhullay Shah and was greatly impressed by his philosophical and humane approach towards life and that too during a time when religious strife was ripe. For me, he was a great person.

 

[Sufi Malang]

Sufis are the Wali ALLAH (friends of ALLAH) ...

Some versus fro Bulley Shah's poetry collection with English translation...

Makkay gayaan, gal mukdee naheen
Pawain sow sow jummay parrh aaeey

Going to Makkah is not the ultimate
Even if hundreds of prayers are offered
-

Ganga gayaan, gal mukdee naheen
Pawain sow sow gotay khaeeay

Going to River Ganges is not the ultimate
Even if hundreds of cleansing (Baptisms) are done
-

Gaya gayaan gal mukdee naheen
Pawain sow sow pand parrhaeeay

Going to Gaya is not the ultimate
Even if hundreds of worships are done
-

Bulleh Shah gal taeeyon mukdee
Jadon May nu dillon gawaeeay

Bulleh Shah the ultimate is
When the “I” is removed from the heart

 

[Dr. Schaden Freud]

Sufism totally represents my views on Islam and I love the poetry of all the sufi Buzurg Hazrat. For instance, there is one poem of Baba Bhullay Shah which i love most, namely:

Bulleh! to me, I am not known
Not a believer inside the mosque, am I
Nor a pagan disciple of false rites
Not the pure amongst the impure
Neither Moses, nor the Pharaoh

Bulleh! to me, I am not known

Not in the holy Vedas, am I
Nor in opium, neither in wine
Not in the drunkard`s intoxicated craze
Niether awake, nor in a sleeping daze

Bulleh! to me, I am not known

In happiness nor in sorrow, am I
Neither clean, nor a filthy mire
Not from water, nor from earth
Neither fire, nor from air, is my birth

Bulleh! to me, I am not known

Not an Arab, nor Lahori
Neither Hindi, nor Nagauri
Hindu, Turk, nor Peshawari
Nor do I live in Nadaun

Bulleh! to me, I am not known

Secrets of religion, I have not known
From Adam and Eve, I am not born
I am not the name I assume
Not in stillness, nor on the move

Bulleh! to me, I am not known

I am the first, I am the last
None other, have I ever known
I am the wisest of them all
Bulleh! do I stand alone?

Bulleh! to me, I am not known

I love specially the part:

Secrets of religion, I have not known
From Adam and Eve, I am not born
I am not the name I assume
Not in stillness, nor on the move

This is sufism for me. My kind of Islam!!!

I hope, you've heard the song from Rabbi Shergill on this very poem.

 

[Robert]

Bulleh Shah the ultimate is
When the “I” is removed from the heart

I like that - it is akin to Buddhism.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

I got into it a bit after reading some books by Idrees Shah and other stories and parables.

Alot of the stuff is misread by people who read it literally rather than the deeper meaning.

The masnavi of Rumi should be compulsory for everybody. A fantastic piece of work.

However a lot of it is quite different to orthadox Islam. Thats what worried me but yeah some aspects are mindblowing.

 

[ace4rmspace]

The lives and works of The Great Awliya-e-Allah is something I have great respect for. I am deeply inspired by Sufi Poetry and anyone who reads it in the same spirit in which it was written and intended to be interpreted would only appreciate it. One has to, however, be very very careful because some concepts can very easily be misunderstood which can be very dangerous. The Sufi's, as they are now classified as, preached one thing and one thing alone and that was Love for Allah and His Prophet. That was the essence of everything they said and did.

The core beliefs of Islam are unquestionable, what Sufism teaches only strengthens that faith. It teaches to love Allah and His Prophet and to follow the path of righteousness not out of fear for reprimand, as many Maulvi's tend to do, but out of sheer love! Thats the philosophy I subscribe to.

 

[Eagle_Eye]

The lives and works of The Great Awliya-e-Allah is something I have great respect for. I am deeply inspired by Sufi Poetry and anyone who reads it in the same spirit in which it was written and intended to be interpreted would only appreciate it. One has to, however, be very very careful because some concepts can very easily be misunderstood which can be very dangerous. The Sufi's, as they are now classified as, preached one thing and one thing alone and that was Love for Allah and His Prophet. That was the essence of everything they said and did.

The core beliefs of Islam are unquestionable, what Sufism teaches only strengthens that faith. It teaches to love Allah and His Prophet and to follow the path of righteousness not out of fear for reprimand, as many Maulvi's tend to do, but out of sheer love! Thats the philosophy I subscribe to.

Spot on... The very reason they had so much success in propagating the religion in the subcontinent.

However, there are aspects of sufism that are not in congruous with what Quran and Hadith says. I have a feeling that the great Sufis of the past did not subscribe to these beliefs.

 

[ace4rmspace]

[/B]

Spot on... The very reason they had so much success in propagating the religion in the subcontinent.

However, there are aspects of sufism that are not in congruous with what Quran and Hadith says. I have a feeling that the great Sufis of the past did not subscribe to these beliefs.

Exactly! You are absolutely right. The great Awliya-e-Allah did not preach anything that was inconsistent with The Quran or Hadith. It's pretty obvious, if one bothers to read their works. What we see these days is just a distorted disgusting and ignorant misinterpretation of something so simple and beautiful. But thats the story of Islam as a whole really.

I still cringe when someone classifies Sufism as some seperate form of Islam, I mean, when did that happen???

 

[IAJ]

Here is an answer to what sufism is:

In the name of Allah, the inspirer of truth. All praise is to Allah, Most Merciful and Compassionate, and all blessings and peace to our Master Muhammad, his family, companions, and those who follow them.

One of the clearest and most complete definitions of Sufism was given by the great North African sufi, Shaykh Ahmad Zarruq, who defined it as, �Sincerity in turning to Allah,� and explained that;

�The necessary condition of sincerity of approach is that it be what the Truth Most High accepts, and by the means He accepts. Now, something lacking its necessary condition cannot exist, �And He does not accept unbelief for His servants.� (Qur�an, 39: 7), so one must realize true faith (iman), �and if you show gratitude, He will accept it of you.� (Qur�an, 39: 7), which entails applying Islam. So there is no Sufism except through comprehension of Sacred Law, for the outward rules of Allah Most High are not known save through it, and there is no comprehension of Sacred Law without Sufism, for works are nothing without sincerity of approach, as expressed by the words of Imam Malik (may Allah have mercy on him):

�He who practices Sufism without learning Sacred Law corrupts his faith, while he who leans Sacred Law without practicing Sufism corrupts himself. Only he who combines the two proves true.� (Iqaz al-Himam fi Sharh al-Hikam, 5-6 from The Reliance of the Traveller, w9.3, 862)

Similarly, Shaykh Muftafa Naja explained that basis of the spiritual way is,

�Absolute uprightness (al-istiqma al-tamma), being with Allah, having presence of heart in one�s slavehood, and conforming to the Qur�an and Sunna in every breath, step, spiritual experience, and state. Its pillar is keeping the company of the people divine knowledge and Sacred Law, and making much remembrance, with presence of heart.� (Kitab Kashf al-Asrarli Tanwir al-Afkar, 41)

And Allah alone gives success.

Source: http://qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.asp?HD=1&ID=904&CATE=1

 

[orthodox_spin]

Sufism is infected with a lot of shirk. Where Is dancing mentioned in Quran? Going to peers? Kissing Graves at darbars? Wearing taweez?or the killer question, when did Allah prescribe Sufism and which prophet endorsed it's faction or practices. Get me me direct quotes from the Quran which unequivocally endorse all that I have mentioned and I will embrace this branch of islam

 

[Vegitto1]

Sufism is infected with a lot of shirk. Where Is dancing mentioned in Quran? Going to peers? Kissing Graves at darbars? Wearing taweez?or the killer question, when did Allah prescribe Sufism and which prophet endorsed it's faction or practices. Get me me direct quotes from the Quran which unequivocally endorse all that I have mentioned and I will embrace this branch of islam

1. Like some posters said above, it has been corrupted with elements which do not relate to sufism at all. When these men died, they did not ask for darbars to be made for them, it is what the stupid people did.

2. Where did Allah prescribe Sunnism or Shiaism or any other Islamic sect?

 

[ace4rmspace]

I am struggling to understand why Sufism is being considered a seperate sect of Islam. To respect and rever Sufi Saints and what they said and did is somehow seperate to Sunnism in what way exactly?

Suicide bombing isn't part of Islam and is not in the Quran or Ahadith. Warped interpretations and ignorant misunderstandings.

 

[orthodox_spin]

1. Like some posters said above, it has been corrupted with elements which do not relate to sufism at all. When these men died, they did not ask for darbars to be made for them, it is what the stupid people did.

2. Where did Allah prescribe Sunnism or Shiaism or any other Islamic sect?

Allah didnt prescribe any sect, only Islam as one unified religion.

 

[IAJ]

Sufism is infected with a lot of shirk. Where Is dancing mentioned in Quran? Going to peers? Kissing Graves at darbars? Wearing taweez?or the killer question, when did Allah prescribe Sufism and which prophet endorsed it's faction or practices. Get me me direct quotes from the Quran which unequivocally endorse all that I have mentioned and I will embrace this branch of islam

I have a qustion for you as well; Where does Quran say that Sufism is prohibited?

 

[orthodox_spin]

I have a qustion for you as well; Where does Quran say that Sufism is prohibited?

This quote prohibits any divisions and sects

Yusuf Ali:
And hold fast, all together, by the rope which Allah (stretches out for you), and be not divided among yourselves; and remember with gratitude Allah's favour on you; for ye were enemies and He joined your hearts in love, so that by His Grace, ye became brethren; and ye were on the brink of the pit of Fire, and He saved you from it. Thus doth Allah make His Signs clear to you: That ye may be guided

 

[ace4rmspace]

I don't think Sufi's preached division of any kind. Quite the opposite. They tried to bring everyone together with love for Allah SWT and His Prophet.

A classic shair by Mian Mohammed Baksh, one of my favorite Sufi Poets, my apologies if you aren't familiar with Potohari:

Danishmando, suno tamaami, arz Faqeer karainda
Aapoon changa je koi hovey, sab no bhala takainda


So it's all about purifying ones own heart first of all. Once you have achieved that, you'll find good in everyone and everything. How is that contradictory to what Islam teaches us?

 

[cricket47]

I don't think Sufi's preached division of any kind. Quite the opposite. They tried to bring everyone together with love for Allah SWT and His Prophet.

A classic shair by Mian Mohammed Baksh, one of my favorite Sufi Poets, my apologies if you aren't familiar with Potohari:

Danishmando, suno tamaami, arz Faqeer karainda
Aapoon changa je koi hovey, sab no bhala takainda


So it's all about purifying ones own heart first of all. Once you have achieved that, you'll find good in everyone and everything. How is that contradictory to what Islam teaches us?

A Muslim believes in the Uniqueness of God. He has no partner; no one is like unto Him. God, Almighty, says:

“There is nothing like unto Him[2] and He is the all-Hearing and the all-Seeing.” (Quran 42:11)

God is separate from His creation and not a part of it. He is the Creator, and all else is His creation.

Sufis hold a number of beliefs in relation to God, Almighty; of these beliefs are the following:

a) Al-Hulool: This belief denotes that God, Almighty, dwells in His creation.

b) Al-It’tihaad: This belief denotes that God, Almighty, and the creation are one, united presence.

c) Wahdatul-Wujood: This belief denotes that one should not differentiate between the Creator and the creation, for both the creation and the Creator are one entity.

Mansoor al-Hallaaj, a figure much revered by Sufis, said: “I am He Whom I love,” he exclaimed, “He Whom I love is I; we are two souls co-inhabiting one body. If you see me you see Him and if you see Him you see me.”( At-Tawaaseen by Al-Hallaj)

Muhiyddin Ibn Arabi, another revered figure in Sufism, was infamous for his statements: “What is under my dress is none but God,” “The slave is the Lord and the Lord is a slave.” (Al-Fatoohaatul-Makkiyyah & Al-Fatoohaat )

These above beliefs strongly contradict the Muslim belief in the Oneness of God, for Islam is a strict monotheism. These cardinal Sufi doctrines are not far from some of the Christian beliefs or the Hindu belief of reincarnation. S. R. Sharda in his book, ‘Sufi Thought’ said: “Sufi literature of the post-Timur period shows a significant change in thought content. It is pantheistic. After the fall of Muslim orthodoxy from power at the centre of India for about a century, due to the invasion of Timur, Sufism became free from the control of the Muslim orthodoxy and consorted with Hindu saints, who influenced them to an amazing extent. The Sufi adopted Monism and wifely devotion from the Vaishnava Vedantic school and Bhakti and Yogic practices from the Vaishnava Vedantic school. By that time, the popularity of the Vedantic pantheism among the Sufis had reached its zenith.”

 

[Eagle_Eye]

cricket47 - your missing the essence of what ace4rmspace is pointing out...... Most of the classic Sufis were also great scholars of their time and if need be took stand against the rulers of the time... unlike the great "Sheikhs/Pirs" of our time.

 

[mnoman15]

I like that - it is akin to Buddhism.

Actually all religions and prophets from Adam PBUH toJesus PBUH Muhammad PBUH preached that. It is just we are always trying to find short cut to paradise

 

[ZAK]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SssKoTfSHfY

 

[ace4rmspace]

True, the Sufi's of the past were great scholars and had an immense understanding of the Deen so to say that their beliefs would contradict such a fundamental concept in Islam is just a case of misunderstanding. We can talk about various philosophies all day long cricket47 my friend and we'll just end up saying something to upset each other.

Lets just take what we can and try to use it to strengthen our faith and become closer to Allah SWT and His Beloved Prophet SAW. Let us spread the good word and promote love, peace and harmony however which way we can.

Dha de masjid dha de mandir dha de jo kujj dheinda
Ik bandey da dil na dhaavein, Rabb dillaan vich rehnda

 

[ace4rmspace]

Just to clarify. In that shair, I am by no means trying to confine The Zaat of The Wahdahoo Lashareek to a lowly human organ Nauzobillah.

 

[6xafridi]

I think Sufiism was the main reason Islam spread throughout the Indian subcontinent. Abdul Qadir Jilani was a Sufi but there is a bit of a difference between the Sufis now and back then. A lot of Pakistanis today indulge in bid'ah and think it is okay because some Sufi sheikh or peer saab mandate/condone it.

The way the Sufis do dhikr is beyond me.. read this 100 times, and that 7 times etc etc. I would like to ask 'do you think that you have discovered something good that was not known to the Prophet or his companions? '

Or do you think that you or your shaykh have the right to introduce new laws and to define news dhikrs and when they should be said and how often they should be repeated, just as the Messenger of Allah PBUH had that right?

Not everyone who seeks or intends good attains it and is guided to it. Not every act of worship is accepted, unless it is in accordance with the Sunnah of Muhammad PBUH

Worship must be something that is prescribed in sharee’ah in essence and in its form and the manner in which it is done. If a specific number is prescribed in sharee’ah then no one has the right to go beyond that, and if no number or way is specified then no one has the right to invent a limit for it, because that implies that one is assuming the role of a lawgiver.

This is further supported by the report narrated from the tabi'i Sa’eed ibn al-Musayyib RadiAllahanhu. He saw a man praying more than two rak’ahs after dawn had come, and he told him not to do that. The man said, “O Abu Muhammad, will Allaah punish me for praying?!” He said, “No, but He will punish you for going against the Sunnah.”

This is the understanding of the Sahaabah, Taabi’een and Imams. As for the people of bid’ah, they say, “What fitnah? It is only dhikr and prayer and a few miles by which we seek to draw closer to Allah.”

Some of the extreme Sufis believe that Muhammad PBUH was light, and that he was the first thing created by Allaah, and that the rest of creation was created from his light. This is a lie and is misguidance for which they have no evidence apart from a false, fabricated hadeeth.

[Excerpt from IslamQA]

As for the "keep out if you have problems", are you asking for misguidance? Isn't it my duty as a brother to inform you of your wrong doing.. whether you think it is right or not you should listen to the other side of the story.

 

[cricket47]

As for the "keep out if you have problems", are you asking for misguidance? Isn't it my duty as a brother to inform you of your wrong doing.. whether you think it is right or not you should listen to the other side of the story.

I agree with you Brother.. No offense to OP Brother. but to say "keep out if you have problems" is reminiscent of what previous nations (in times of Jahaliyah) used to say, we follow this or that, if you have problem, stay out of it, we wont change etc.

Brother Islam is a thing a beauty. Why deviate from the Quran/Sunnah and invent stuff to try to (nauzibillah) "out do' the Prophet PBUH. It was stated in Quran

"Today I have perfected your religion for you, and completed My grace upon you, and approved Islam as your religion."
<Quran, The Table Spread 5:3>

Then just stick to what is stated in Quran/Sunnah and dont deviate from that.

As for other brothers on here who have stated that previous "Sheikh/pir" were so humble and honest. My reply is this : Allah hu Alim (Allah has full knowledge). I dont know them personally or anything, so I cant comment on what have gone in the past.

It is stated in Quran that everyone is accountable for their own actions, you wont be held accountable for what previous nations did.

if there is some "corruption/invention" from the ways old nations carried out their lives, and we cant for sure say what they did with 100% certainty. What we need to do is the following:-

1) forget wht they all did.. they will be held accountable for their actions and we would be held accountable for ours.

2) FOCUS ON QURAN/SUNNAH ONLY! and follow what is beyond any doubt 100% correct . That way there wont be any disagreement because we can say it is stated in the Quran.

 

[ace4rmspace]

I don't think anyone wants to create disagreement and fitna amongst brothers. But those who want to create fitna can do so using the Quran and Sunnah itself. Different interpretations, different points of view, what does one do? Some say stick to the Quran, they are branded as Hadith rejectors. Some follow the Ahadith and are questioned about the authenticity of them. There is fitna in everything brother, if you so choose.

You are right, everyone is accountable for their own actions at the end of the day. Quran and Sunnah is the benchmark, anything which contradicts with it is best avoided. I think I have said that before. The problem is when people get things the wrong way round. Building a house on a crooked foundation and expecting the building to be straight and true is ignorance and stupidity. As far as I am concerned, what I hear and read and understand, brings me closer to Allah SWT and His Beloved Prophet, it invokes a feeling of love for The Creator and all it's creation, it makes me want to do what I am duty bound to do and follow the path which The Prophet so lovingly showed us ... all with a smile on my face and a spring in my step and an overwhelming feeling of love and submission in my heart and soul to the extent that one just can't get enough of it. Whatever works for you I guess, it works for me.

 

[Looney]

very interesting posts , i will reply to them later

 

[cricket47]

I don't think anyone wants to create disagreement and fitna amongst brothers. But those who want to create fitna can do so using the Quran and Sunnah itself. Different interpretations, different points of view, what does one do? Some say stick to the Quran, they are branded as Hadith rejectors. Some follow the Ahadith and are questioned about the authenticity of them. There is fitna in everything brother, if you so choose.

You are right, everyone is accountable for their own actions at the end of the day. Quran and Sunnah is the benchmark, anything which contradicts with it is best avoided. I think I have said that before. The problem is when people get things the wrong way round. Building a house on a crooked foundation and expecting the building to be straight and true is ignorance and stupidity. As far as I am concerned, what I hear and read and understand, brings me closer to Allah SWT and His Beloved Prophet, it invokes a feeling of love for The Creator and all it's creation, it makes me want to do what I am duty bound to do and follow the path which The Prophet so lovingly showed us ... all with a smile on my face and a spring in my step and an overwhelming feeling of love and submission in my heart and soul to the extent that one just can't get enough of it. Whatever works for you I guess, it works for me.

You can read what ever you want Brother, BUT becarefull what you implement into your life, in terms of dealing with people, ideology, worship etc. That is what im trying to say.

Read what ever you want, everyone has right to read and attain knowledge but becarefull what knowledge to implent into ones life and what not. Because some of the ideology is against the Quran/Sunnah.

The thing one has to be careful is that, you might read a lot of things that are right but there might be few that are wrong too, and if you are blindly following it, then chances are you would adapt the wrong and assume it is right too. Therein lies the problem of "invention". So be careful that if one reads a lot of information that correlates with the Quran/Sunnah and then reads stuff that one isnt sure if it correlates with both Quran/Sunnah or not, to get that information checked up and verified, instead of assuming it will be right too. Because if one does that and assumes its right, then there are chances he would be led astray.

Brother you have the right to read, but be careful with the infromation.

006.159 As for those who divide their religion and break up into sects, thou hast no part in them in the least: their affair is with God: He will in the end tell them the truth of all that they did.

This Ayat is why i emphasize just focus on Quran/Sunnah and perfect your religion and be successful in this life and the HereAfter. Because as soon as people start adding stuff that is not correlating with Quran/Sunnah it opens path it all sort of corruption and problems in persons religion.

May Allah SWT guide us All. AMEEN

 

[ace4rmspace]

^ You know what brother, i completely agree with everything you have just said and if you scroll up a bit you'll find i didn't say anything different.

 

[sunnykhan]

Sufism is not a sect!

 

[cricket47]

Sufism is not a sect!

Care to elaborate ? .....

 

[Mohsin]

Wah:

[UTUBE]pTxZy32Fv_0[/UTUBE]

 

[sunnykhan]

Care to elaborate ? .....

I don't consider them a separate section of Islam.

 

[Striver]

I don't consider them a separate section of Islam.

Whenever you here the letters "ism" its almost always a distinct and unique element/concept etc.

Whenever you use the words for a group of Muslims other than Islam or Muslims then IMO its a devision or sect.

again that is only my opinion not a Fatwaand ofcourse Allah swt knows best.

 

[6xafridi]

I don't consider them a separate section of Islam.

It isn't part of the sunnah wal jama'ah. Many of the people that call themselves Barelvi are actually more Sufi than Sunni.

 

[ace4rmspace]

Why are people adamant on declaribg Sufi as a seperate sect? I personally know people, from ahle sunnat wal jamaah who subscribe to philosophies attributed to so called Sufism. It's like calling me a Shia because I have the utmost respect and love for The Ahle Bait. I just don't get it.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Good thread. Can anyone post some information about the earliest forms of Sufism?

 

[Looney]

MashAllah, to become a real sufi is my dream. The world of tasawwuf is the most peaceful world you can speak of.

Looney, I have alot of respect for all the Sufis but will mention some here;

Junaid Baghdadi, Abdul Qadir Jillani, Imam Ghazali, Data Sahib, Ghareeb Nawaz chishti, Maulana Rumi, Peer Mehr Ali Shah, Sultan Bahoo, Mian Muhammad Bakhs, Peer Karam Shah, Peer Naseer udeen Naseer and many more. (May Allah bless them All). The list is long.

I will InshAllah try to post more in this thread.

i have heard of the bolded ones . Bulleh Shah , Omar Khayyam , Shah Bhittai , Amir Khusrau , Jami , Sachal Sarmast are also very well known sufi poets in the subcontinent . extremely popular .

Sufism totally represents my views on Islam and I love the poetry of all the sufi Buzurg Hazrat. For instance, there is one poem of Baba Bhullay Shah which i love most, namely:

really thought provoking , brings you closer to the God . Sufism has taught me not to fear God but to love God and follow Islam , not out of fear of Him but out of love for Him .

Great philosophy from Baba Bhullay Shah!

I heard first time about Baba Bhullay Shah through one of the videos made in India some years back. Liked that tune and the way the singer sang it but I did know the meaning of the song.

Recently, I studied some information on Baba Bhullay Shah and was greatly impressed by his philosophical and humane approach towards life and that too during a time when religious strife was ripe. For me, he was a great person.

I think you are talking about Rabbi Shergill

Sufis are the Wali ALLAH (friends of ALLAH) ...

Some versus fro Bulley Shah's poetry collection with English translation...

thanks for sharing that .

I got into it a bit after reading some books by Idrees Shah and other stories and parables.

Alot of the stuff is misread by people who read it literally rather than the deeper meaning.

The masnavi of Rumi should be compulsory for everybody. A fantastic piece of work.

However a lot of it is quite different to orthadox Islam. Thats what worried me but yeah some aspects are mindblowing.

lol like Ghalib once said :
Peene de sharab mujhe masjid maiN baith kar
Ya koi aisa jagah bata jahaN Khuda na ho


You are not supposed to take everything literally , and it requires and stimulates the thinking which is really needed now , Muslims tend to follow everything they are told by random pirs and maulvis . We never challenge or question anything , just follow what is being asked of us .

 

[Looney]

The lives and works of The Great Awliya-e-Allah is something I have great respect for. I am deeply inspired by Sufi Poetry and anyone who reads it in the same spirit in which it was written and intended to be interpreted would only appreciate it. One has to, however, be very very careful because some concepts can very easily be misunderstood which can be very dangerous. The Sufi's, as they are now classified as, preached one thing and one thing alone and that was Love for Allah and His Prophet. That was the essence of everything they said and did.

The core beliefs of Islam are unquestionable, what Sufism teaches only strengthens that faith. It teaches to love Allah and His Prophet and to follow the path of righteousness not out of fear for reprimand, as many Maulvi's tend to do, but out of sheer love! Thats the philosophy I subscribe to.

100 % agree with you .

[/B]

Spot on... The very reason they had so much success in propagating the religion in the subcontinent.

However, there are aspects of sufism that are not in congruous with what Quran and Hadith says. I have a feeling that the great Sufis of the past did not subscribe to these beliefs.

i think so too , if you study Rumi's work , he was all about loving God . While nowadays , sufism has become doing sajda to your pirs and asking them to make dua for you . it has lost its meaning .

I am struggling to understand why Sufism is being considered a seperate sect of Islam. To respect and rever Sufi Saints and what they said and did is somehow seperate to Sunnism in what way exactly?

Suicide bombing isn't part of Islam and is not in the Quran or Ahadith. Warped interpretations and ignorant misunderstandings.

i do not beleive in different sects of Islam at all .

I think Sufiism was the main reason Islam spread throughout the Indian subcontinent. Abdul Qadir Jilani was a Sufi but there is a bit of a difference between the Sufis now and back then. A lot of Pakistanis today indulge in bid'ah and think it is okay because some Sufi sheikh or peer saab mandate/condone it.

The way the Sufis do dhikr is beyond me.. read this 100 times, and that 7 times etc etc. I would like to ask 'do you think that you have discovered something good that was not known to the Prophet or his companions? '

Or do you think that you or your shaykh have the right to introduce new laws and to define news dhikrs and when they should be said and how often they should be repeated, just as the Messenger of Allah PBUH had that right?

Not everyone who seeks or intends good attains it and is guided to it. Not every act of worship is accepted, unless it is in accordance with the Sunnah of Muhammad PBUH

Worship must be something that is prescribed in sharee’ah in essence and in its form and the manner in which it is done. If a specific number is prescribed in sharee’ah then no one has the right to go beyond that, and if no number or way is specified then no one has the right to invent a limit for it, because that implies that one is assuming the role of a lawgiver.

This is further supported by the report narrated from the tabi'i Sa’eed ibn al-Musayyib RadiAllahanhu. He saw a man praying more than two rak’ahs after dawn had come, and he told him not to do that. The man said, “O Abu Muhammad, will Allaah punish me for praying?!” He said, “No, but He will punish you for going against the Sunnah.”

This is the understanding of the Sahaabah, Taabi’een and Imams. As for the people of bid’ah, they say, “What fitnah? It is only dhikr and prayer and a few miles by which we seek to draw closer to Allah.”

Some of the extreme Sufis believe that Muhammad PBUH was light, and that he was the first thing created by Allaah, and that the rest of creation was created from his light. This is a lie and is misguidance for which they have no evidence apart from a false, fabricated hadeeth.

[Excerpt from IslamQA]

As for the "keep out if you have problems", are you asking for misguidance? Isn't it my duty as a brother to inform you of your wrong doing.. whether you think it is right or not you should listen to the other side of the story.

Bro , that is not what i meant , people think of sufism as going to mazaars and pirs , doing sajda to them , instead of asking from God they ask from dead people . sufism has lost its meaning now . Sufis of past only preached love for God and his Prophet ( SAW ) , spread peace and tolerance through their work and actions . how is that against the beliefs of Islam ?

 

[Striver]

You are not supposed to take everything literally , and it requires and stimulates the thinking which is really needed now , Muslims tend to follow everything they are told by random pirs and maulvis . We never challenge or question anything , just follow what is being asked of us .

Perhaps we can agree that, both ends have extremes, some who challenge everything a "Maulvi" say and make their own choices/preferences in regards to Halal Haram etc. In my opinion, now a days majority would fall under this category from the newer generations at least.

And then there are those who like to think that they must follow everything "literally" as you put it and ask the "Maulvis" for interpretations/teachings/meanings of Quran and Sunnah.

I have very limited knowledge of Sufism, however know of the above mentioned personalities. We can only judge what is presented to us and perhaps the modern day Sufism is not in its total originality?

 

[Striver]

To the posters: who think that Sufism is not a sect or division:

then what is it?

after all, we have Sunnis, Ahl el Hadith, Barelvis, Deobandis, Salfis and Sufis?

would you call the whole of Sufism today religion of Islam or simply another branch? with my limited knowledge about the topic on hand I would probably consider it to be the latter.

 

[Looney]

I agree with you Brother.. No offense to OP Brother. but to say "keep out if you have problems" is reminiscent of what previous nations (in times of Jahaliyah) used to say, we follow this or that, if you have problem, stay out of it, we wont change etc.

Brother Islam is a thing a beauty. Why deviate from the Quran/Sunnah and invent stuff to try to (nauzibillah) "out do' the Prophet PBUH. It was stated in Quran

"Today I have perfected your religion for you, and completed My grace upon you, and approved Islam as your religion."
<Quran, The Table Spread 5:3>

Then just stick to what is stated in Quran/Sunnah and dont deviate from that.

As for other brothers on here who have stated that previous "Sheikh/pir" were so humble and honest. My reply is this : Allah hu Alim (Allah has full knowledge). I dont know them personally or anything, so I cant comment on what have gone in the past.

It is stated in Quran that everyone is accountable for their own actions, you wont be held accountable for what previous nations did.

if there is some "corruption/invention" from the ways old nations carried out their lives, and we cant for sure say what they did with 100% certainty. What we need to do is the following:-

1) forget wht they all did.. they will be held accountable for their actions and we would be held accountable for ours.

2) FOCUS ON QURAN/SUNNAH ONLY! and follow what is beyond any doubt 100% correct . That way there wont be any disagreement because we can say it is stated in the Quran.

again , i think we all disagree with the modern take on sufism . It is the work of people like Rumi and Khusrau who bring us closer to the God . I see it more as a philosophy . Growing up , i was always told not to do this , not to do that or Allah will be angry with me and send me to hell . Whatever i did was out of fear of going to hell . But sufi poetry guided me to not fear God , but love God and follow Islam for the love of it .

It is all about how you percieve things , if you ask me . As for the fitna part , i think ace4rmspace explains it the best . You want to create fitna you will do it no matter what , all depends on one's intentions .

Of course , Qur'an is of the utmost important because it is literally THE word of God . But obviously , people look for guidance in ahadees , likewise , people further look for guidance in sufism .

I don't think anyone wants to create disagreement and fitna amongst brothers. But those who want to create fitna can do so using the Quran and Sunnah itself. Different interpretations, different points of view, what does one do? Some say stick to the Quran, they are branded as Hadith rejectors. Some follow the Ahadith and are questioned about the authenticity of them. There is fitna in everything brother, if you so choose.

You are right, everyone is accountable for their own actions at the end of the day. Quran and Sunnah is the benchmark, anything which contradicts with it is best avoided. I think I have said that before. The problem is when people get things the wrong way round. Building a house on a crooked foundation and expecting the building to be straight and true is ignorance and stupidity. As far as I am concerned, what I hear and read and understand, brings me closer to Allah SWT and His Beloved Prophet, it invokes a feeling of love for The Creator and all it's creation, it makes me want to do what I am duty bound to do and follow the path which The Prophet so lovingly showed us ... all with a smile on my face and a spring in my step and an overwhelming feeling of love and submission in my heart and soul to the extent that one just can't get enough of it. Whatever works for you I guess, it works for me.

top post

 

[Looney]

To the posters: who think that Sufism is not a sect or division:

then what is it?

after all, we have Sunnis, Ahl el Hadith, Barelvis, Deobandis, Salfis and Sufis?

would you call the whole of Sufism today religion of Islam or simply another branch? with my limited knowledge about the topic on hand I would probably consider it to be the latter.

i dont like the idea of sects , just the difference in the way people percieve things . i see it as philosophy and guidance .

 

[Free Hit]

Excellent thread Looney.

Its just mind blowing what these great men of Allah have said in the past and ofcourse helped to spread islam in subcontinent.

[utube]t_ahy97wMys[/utube]

 

[moiz]

Very nice thread and some really great posts by all.

Very refreshing!

 

[moiz]

My first encounter with Sufism happened when I started reading Kashful Mahajub of Data Sahab! Since then my life changed...

 

[Free Hit]

I would mention these names, and this thread will be done.

Syed Abdul Qadir Jilani (king od all the wali allah)- Baghdad
Data Ali Hajveri- Lahore
Khawaja Ghareeb Nawaz (ajmer shareef)

amazing personalities.

 

[moiz]

http://www.jerrahi.org/68-blemishes-nafs

^Kindly check the above link if you guys can. I read it every month only to know that I have only got rid of 5 or 6 of those 68 blemishes yet.

 

[IAJ]

Some of the posters here, probably influenced by Ibn Taimiyya and Abdul Wahab Najd have no clue of what they are writing. If you belong to Ahle Sunna Wal Jamaa' you should know that Imam Ghazali was one of the greates shcolars of Islam after the beloved Prophet's (SAW) life and he himself was a Sufi and went in to the world of tasawwuf.

Do you guys really know what tasawwuf is? The goal of a sufi is to turn away from the the temptations of this world and just concentrate of Allah SWT. How can that be wrong? Prove it!!! This is not a sect, only a way of coming close to Allah SWT and should be everyone's aim.

One of the asools of fiqh is that you can not deem something haram if you don't have prove of it. The burden of proving this is on your burden.

And some were quoting Ibn Arabi here. Hey listen, how much knowledge do you have of Islam to come and start critisizing him? Be careful of judging him because with your amount of knowledge you can't understand him. People have spent years to study his books and you come here and quote a sentence of him and take it litterally. Be careful!

And I also read someone distincting between Sunni and Brelvi . Do you know who started calling people Brelvi? If I am beeing called Brelvi I will first ask you why you are calling me that? If you can answer me then i'll go on with further information.

Patta hai i nahi kissi cheez ka our awain hi uth key lougon kou samjhane shuru hou jate hain?

The famous quote is to hold on to the biggest Jamaa' and Ahle Sunnah Wal Jamaa' is the biggest Jamaa' and you can bring out the earliest scholars/Alims from Ahle Sunnah and tell me if they were against Tasawwuf!

(And brother Cricket47 I haven't forget your message, I will answer you soon InshAllah.)

 

[ace4rmspace]

Do you guys really know what tasawwuf is? The goal of a sufi is to turn away from the the temptations of this world and just concentrate of Allah SWT. How can that be wrong? Prove it!!! This is not a sect, only a way of coming close to Allah SWT and should be everyone's aim.

This sort of summarises the whole concept in my opinion. Ahle Tasawwuf strive to invite and include all they can to come and share their love for The Creator and His Creation, not divide and exclude based on petty differences of opinion.

 

[ShaazE]

I don't know if one has to master a minimum number of spins before this is answered; but I've always wanted to know where all the Sufis get their drugs from? Did they have acid in the times of al-Hajjaj?

Every time I see them they're always on some killer sh17. So, please let a brother know because I know a bunch of white kids that would love that stuff.

OK Thanks

 

[khan-92]

What Is Tasawwuf

Tasawwuf is a branch of Islamic knowledge which focuses on the spiritual development of the Muslim.

Allah sent His final messenger, Prophet Muhammad , as a source of knowledge for the entire ummah. He was the fountain of Quran, Hadith, tafsir, rhetoric, fiqh, and so on. After the Prophet, the scholars of this ummah carried and propagated each of these branches of knowledge. Because no one person can attain the perfection of the Prophet , who single handedly assumed all of these roles, various branches of the Islamic sciences developed. For example, Imam Abu Hanifah preserved the science of fiqh and after him thousands of scholars continued in his footsteps. Hence these scholars preserved the fiqh of the Prophet . Similarly Imam Bukhari and the other famous scholars of Hadith, preserved the words of the Prophet. The scholars of tajweed preserved the recitation of the Prophet . And, the scholars of Arabic grammar preserved the language of the Prophet .

Along these lines, the Prophet was the model of spirituality for the world. His God-consciousness, deep spirituality, acts of worship, and love for Allah were preserved and propagated by an Islamic science called Tasawwuf. The aim of the scholars of this science was purification of the heart, and development of consciousness of Allah through submission to the shariah and sunnah.
How is Tasawwuf Related to Sufism?

Studying the life of the Prophet , the scholars who propagated the science of tasawwuf understood that a requisite for approaching Allah was abandonment of the common pursuits of the world. They often wore wool because of its simplicity and low cost. In Arabic the word for wool is suf and thus, those who wore it became known as the Sufis. Another possible derivation of the word comes from the root word safa, which means "to clean." Because the scholars of tasawwuf focused on cleansing the heart, they later became known as the Sufis.
What Do Our Scholars Say About Tasawwuf?

Traditional Islamic scholars have accepted Tasawwuf as an important branch of Islamic learning, so long as it remains within the guidelines of the Shariah and emphasizes following the Sunnah of the Prophet .

On Moderation - Imam Rabbani (may Allah be pleased with him)
The Inner Dimensions of Fasting - Imam Abu Hamid al-Ghazali (may Allah be pleased with him)
Maulana Jami - Excerpts from the poems of Maulana Jami (may Allah be pleased with him)
Maulana Saadi - Excerpts from the poems of Maulana Saadi (may Allah be pleased with him)
What is Tasawwuf? - Condensed from the writings of Maulana Ashraf Ali Thanwi (may Allah be pleased with him)
Fighting the Ego - Imam Nawawi (may Allah be pleased with him)

I Have Heard That Sufis Teach Praying At Graves, Dancing, Music, And Other Innovations?

It is true that there have been, and currently are, people who have deviated from the teachings of tasawwuf, thus misrepresenting this science. This is not unique to tasawwuf. Our history is full of examples of people who called themselves scholars of tafsir, or hadith while misrepresenting the essence of these sciences. Each of the Islamic sciences is interlinked and bounded by its sister sciences. For example, a scholar of tafsir cannot interpret the Quran by contradicting the hadith. Similarly a true shaykh of tasawwuf (sufism) never breaks even the smallest tenets of the shariah or the sunnah. Rather, he sees them as the means of his progress towards his Lord. In fact, he prefers death over falling into even a minute sin.

I saw a holy man on the seashore wounded by a tiger.
No medicine could relieve his pain; He suffered much,
but he nevertheless constantly thanked God, the most high, saying,
"Praise be to Allah that I have fallen into a calamity and not into sin."
If Not All Sufis Are Authentic How Can I Judge Which To Learn From?

Many of our scholars have addressed this question by listing the "signs" of a true shaykh. Needless to say the common principle has always been submission to the shariah, by following the teachings of one of the four schools of fiqh, and a complete submission to the inner and the outer of the sunnah. This is based on the idea that the Prophet is the nearest and most God conscious of Allah's creation. His daily acts are an exemplification of how the most God-conscious of all of creation lived his life. For example, the Prophet's treating others with kindness, soft speech, humility, preference for white clothing, growing of a lengthy beard, use of the tooth stick, etc are all intentional acts of service to Allah . If someone lacks these sunnan, while claiming they can help bring you closer to Allah, know that they will eventually lead you to a dead end.
What Is The Goal Of The Student Of Tasawwuf?

The goal is complete submission to the shariah and sunnah in order to attain purification of the heart and soul and to develop a true, deep, and lasting connection with Allah .
How Can A Shaykh Assist In These Goals?

A shaykh of tasawwuf spends years in training in order to develop his character, mannerisms, daily schedule, outer being, acts of worship, and knowledge under the guidance of a spiritual master. They learn the essence of worship and practical implications of abandonment of the mundane life of this world from those who are models of god-consciousness. Further, they often spend years mastering the Islamic sciences of Hadith, Quran, tafsir, fiqh, etc. Each aspect of their training further connects them through chains of scholars to the Prophet who, of course, was sent to connect creation to their Lord.

When you enter the company of such a shaykh, their knowledge and extensive experience allows them to assess your spiritual state and hence, advise you on the best "medicine" to cure the diseases of your heart. Just as a doctor is trained to cure physical ailments, so the scholars of tasawwuf treat the maladies of the diseased heart.
I Thought That All One Needs Is The Quran And The Sunnah?

It is true that the Quran and the Sunnah are sufficient. However, at the same time it is also true that a teacher is required to master any subject. If the Quran was sufficient, then Allah could have easily sent the book without a messenger. However, he sent the Prophet as a model of the Quran so that people could directly learn from his example. This then became the method of learning for each of the Islamic sciences. For example, each hadith that Imam Bukhari compiled in his collection of hadith is directly linked to the Prophet through a continuous chain of narrators. Thus, each person in the chain must have learned from someone and must be able to state who that person was. Similar requirements are present in other branches of Islamic science as well. The science of tasawwuf is no exception.
Is It Mandatory That I Learn And Develop My Spirituality Under A Shaykh?

The juristic scholars of the ummah have ruled that taking a spiritual guide is a sunnah. That is, it is not mandatory, however, it is the way of the Prophet . However, according to the scholars of this ummah achieving the aims of tasawwuf are mandatory. For example, purifying the heart from pride, rectifying one's character, etc are essential to ones religion. Thus, if one can achieve these goals on their own, they may. However, if one tries and continually fails, it is highly recommended that he seek the assistance of a spiritual doctor.
What Are The Responsibilities Of The Murid (Student) Of The Shaykh?

The murid takes an allegiance with his shaykh seeking Allah's forgiveness for past sins, shortcomings, and mistakes, and pledging to establish the shariah and sunnah in his life. The shaykh then assigns certain daily exercises of dhikr (remembrance of Allah) to the student in order that they attract the blessings of Allah . Each student has a set daily regimen of Quranic recitation and dhikr, which, if done diligently leads to rapid progress. For more information refer to Shaykh Zulfiqar's Letter Number 2 from his book Wisdom for the Seeker.

 

[Free Hit]

I don't know if one has to master a minimum number of spins before this is answered; but I've always wanted to know where all the Sufis get their drugs from? Did they have acid in the times of al-Hajjaj?

Every time I see them they're always on some killer sh17. So, please let a brother know because I know a bunch of white kids that would love that stuff.

OK Thanks

you are taking the mik.

slap yourself.

 

[Poison]

Spirituality has always interested me, specifically Sufism and the "purification of the heart". I was researching it a fair bit a while ago ... but I realised that I was kinda 'out of my depth' so to speak, and really needed to focus on the essentials of Islam for myself before venturing into Sufism.

 

[cricket47]

again , i think we all disagree with the modern take on sufism . It is the work of people like Rumi and Khusrau who bring us closer to the God . I see it more as a philosophy . Growing up , i was always told not to do this , not to do that or Allah will be angry with me and send me to hell . Whatever i did was out of fear of going to hell . But sufi poetry guided me to not fear God , but love God and follow Islam for the love of it .

See this is where a lot of people go wrong. When you say Sufi poetry (or sufisim) in general teaches you "not to fear God, but luv God and follow Islam for the love of it".

Brother I respect you and the rest of people who say that we should Love our Lord and love Islam and follow it. BUT how can a person ever say "not to fear God".. brother it is stated in Quran over and over and over again, that fear Allah, fear his azhab and his punishment. I just quote one from the Quran:-

33.1. O Prophet! Fear Allah, and hearken not to the Unbelievers and the Hypocrites: verily Allah is full of Knowledge and Wisdom.

If our beloved Prophet Muhammed PBUH was orderd to fear Allah SWT, keep in mind that Prophet Muhammed PBUH was granted Jannah in this life and his sins were forgiven (mentioned in Surah Fath). IF our beloved Prophet PBUH is repeated told to "Fear Allah" then how can we who cant even compare to the Prophets or their sahabs deen and life say we shouldn't fear Allah?

Just to add another Quote that basically nulifies that thought that one shouldn't fear Allah SWT :-

002.002 This is the Book (Quran) ; in it is guidance sure, without doubt, to those who fear God;

Brother you should LOVE Allah SWT and Islam but NEVER .. and i repeat NEVER stop fearing Allah SWT..

It is Allah's right over His servants that they fear Him as He ought to be feared. Allah says (interpretation of the meaning): "O you who believe! Fear Allah as He ought to be feared and do not die except as believers." [Surah al-'Imran: 102]

 

[Free Hit]

yes, we should always fear God. maybe looney was trying to say something else.

 

[Poison]

Yaar it's a simple concept, if you're fearful of God within your very soul you miss the point that he is the most beneficient, most merciful. The love of God is what leads to true belief.

 

[6xafridi]

Some of the posters here, probably influenced by Ibn Taimiyya and Abdul Wahab Najd have no clue of what they are writing. If you belong to Ahle Sunna Wal Jamaa' you should know that Imam Ghazali was one of the greates shcolars of Islam after the beloved Prophet's (SAW) life and he himself was a Sufi and went in to the world of tasawwuf.

Do you guys really know what tasawwuf is? The goal of a sufi is to turn away from the the temptations of this world and just concentrate of Allah SWT. How can that be wrong? Prove it!!! This is not a sect, only a way of coming close to Allah SWT and should be everyone's aim.

One of the asools of fiqh is that you can not deem something haram if you don't have prove of it. The burden of proving this is on your burden.

And some were quoting Ibn Arabi here. Hey listen, how much knowledge do you have of Islam to come and start critisizing him? Be careful of judging him because with your amount of knowledge you can't understand him. People have spent years to study his books and you come here and quote a sentence of him and take it litterally. Be careful!

And I also read someone distincting between Sunni and Brelvi . Do you know who started calling people Brelvi? If I am beeing called Brelvi I will first ask you why you are calling me that? If you can answer me then i'll go on with further information.

Patta hai i nahi kissi cheez ka our awain hi uth key lougon kou samjhane shuru hou jate hain?

The famous quote is to hold on to the biggest Jamaa' and Ahle Sunnah Wal Jamaa' is the biggest Jamaa' and you can bring out the earliest scholars/Alims from Ahle Sunnah and tell me if they were against Tasawwuf!

(And brother Cricket47 I haven't forget your message, I will answer you soon InshAllah.)

There is a point which we must make here, which is that praising Shaykh ‘Abd al-Qaadir does not mean praising everyone who claims to follow him. Not everyone who claims to follow a shaykh or a tareeqah or anything else is to be believed. How often has it happened that a person who is thought to be a true follower turned out to be the farthest removed from what was thought to be the case? How many misleading people don the cloak of asceticism and piety when they have nothing to do with either of them? Hence the Sufi tareeqah which is known nowadays as the Qaadiriyyah is not following the straight path which the Shaykh (may Allaah have mercy on him) followed, rather it is a deviant Sufi tareeqah which has deviated from the guidance of the Qur’aan and Sunnah; it exaggerates a great deal about Shaykh ‘Abd al-Qaadir and even attributes to him things that can only rightfully be attributed to Allaah. Some of them exaggerate concerning his grave, seeking help from it, and some of them exaggerate about his attributes and miracles (karaamah).

Sufism has numerous branches or tareeqahs, such as the Teejaniyyah, Qaadiriyyah, Naqshbandiyyah, Shaadhiliyyah, Rifaa’iyyah, etc., the followers of which all claim that their particular tareeqah is on the path of truth whilst the others are following falsehood. Islam forbids such sectarianism. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“… and be not of al-mushrikoon (the disbelievers in the Oneness of Allaah, polytheists, idolaters, etc),

Of those who split up their religion (i.e., who left the true Islamic monotheism), and became sects, [i.e., they invented new things in the religion (bid’ah) and followed their vain desires], each sect rejoicing in that which is with it.” [al-Room 30:31-32]

The Sufis worship others than Allaah, such as Prophets and “awliya’” [“saints”], living or dead. They say, “Yaa Jeelaani”, “Yaa Rifaa’i” [calling on their awliya’], or “O Messenger of Allaah, help and save” or “O Messenger of Allaah, our dependence is on you”, etc.

But Allaah forbids us to call on anyone except Him in matters that are beyond the person's capabilities. If a person does this, Allaah will count him as a mushrik, as He says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And invoke not, besides Allaah, any that will neither profit you, nor hurt you, but if (in case) you did so, you shall certainly be one of the zaalimoon (polytheists and wrongdoers).” [Yoonus 10:106]

The Sufis believe that there are abdaal, aqtaab and awliya’ (kinds of “saints”) to whom Allaah has given the power to run the affairs of the universe. Allaah tells us about the mushrikeen (interpretation of the meaning):

“Say [O Muhammad]: ‘…And who disposes the affairs?’ They will say. ‘Allaah.’…” [Yoonus 10:31]

The mushrik Arabs knew more about Allaah than these Sufis!

The Sufis turn to other than Allaah when calamity strikes, but Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And if Allaah touches you with harm, none can remove it but He, and if He touches you with good, then He is Able to do all things.” [al-An’aam 6:17]

Some Sufis believe in wahdat al-wujood (unity of existence). They do not have the idea of a Creator and His creation, instead they say that everything is creation and everything is god.

The Sufis advocate extreme asceticism in this life and do not believe in taking the necessary means or in jihaad, but Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“But seek with that (wealth) which Allaah has bestowed on you, the home of the Hereafter, and forget not your portion of legal enjoyment in this world…” [al-Qasas 28:77]

“And make ready against them all that you can of power…” [al-Anfaal 8:60]

The Sufis refer the idea of ihsaan to their shaykhs and tell their followers to have a picture of their shaykh in mind when they remember Allaah and even when they are praying. Some of them even put a picture of their shaykh in front of them when they are praying. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Ihsaan is when you worship Allaah as if you can see Him, and although you cannot see Him, He can see you.” (Reported by Muslim).

The Sufis allow dancing, drums and musical instruments, and raising the voice when making dhikr, but Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“The believers are only those who, when Allaah is mentioned, feel a fear in their hearts…” [al-Anfaal 8:2]

Moreover, you see some of them making dhikr by only pronouncing the Name of Allaah, saying, “Allaah, Allaah, Allaah.” This is bid’ah and has no meaning in Islam. They even go to the extreme of saying, “Ah, ah” or “Hu, Hu.” The Sunnah is for the Muslim to remember his Lord in words that have a true meaning for which he will be rewarded, such as saying Subhaan Allaah wa Alhamdulillah wa Laa ilaaha illa Allaah wa Allaahu akbar, and so on.

The Sufis recite love poems mentioning the names of women and boys in their dhikr gatherings, and they repeat words such as “love”, “passion”, “desire” and so on, as if they are in a gathering where people dance and drink wine and clap and shout. All of this has to do with the customs and acts of worship of the mushrikeen. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“Their salaah (prayer) at the House (of Allaah, i.e., the Ka’bah at Makkah) was nothing but whistling and clapping of hands…”

[al-Anfaal 8:35]

Some Sufis pierce themselves with rods of iron, saying, “O my grandfather!” So the shayaateen come to them and help them, because they are seeking the help of someone other than Allaah . Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And whosoever turns away (blinds himself) from the remembrance of the Most Beneficent (Allaah), We appoint for him a shaytaan (devil) to be a qareen (intimate companion) for him.”

[al-Zukhruf 43:36]

The Sufis claim to have gnosis and knowledge of the unseen, but the Qur’aan shows them to be liars. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“Say: ‘None in the heavens and the earth knows the ghayb (unseen) except Allaah…’” [al-Naml 27:65]

The Sufis claim that Allaah created the world for the sake of Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), but the Qur’aan shows them to be liars. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And I (Allaah) created not the jinns and humans except they should worship Me (Alone).” [al-Dhaariyaat 51:56]

Allaah, may He be glorified and exalted, addressed His Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) with the words (interpretation of the meaning):

“And worship your Lord until there comes unto the certainty (i.e., death).” [al-Hijr 15:99]

The Sufis claim that they can see Allaah in this life, but the Qur’aan shows them to be liars. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“[Moosa said:] ‘O my Lord! Show me (Yourself), that I may look upon You.’ Allaah said, ‘You cannot see Me…’” [al-A’raaf 7:143]

The Sufis claim that they take knowledge directly from Allaah, without the mediation of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) and in a conscious state (as opposed to dreams). So are they better than the Sahaabah??

The Sufis claim that they take knowledge directly from Allaah, without the mediation of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). They say, “Haddathani qalbi ‘an Rabbi (My heart told me from my Lord).”

The Sufis celebrate Mawlid and hold gatherings for sending blessings on the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), but they go against his teachings by raising their voices in dhikr and anaasheed (religious songs) and qaseedahs (poems) that contain blatant shirk. Did the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) celebrate his birthday? Did Abu Bakr, ‘Umar, ‘Uthman, ‘Ali, the four imaams or anyone else celebrate his birthday? Who knows more and is more correct in worship, the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) and the Salaf, or the Sufis?

The Sufis travel to visit graves and seek blessings from their occupants or to make tawaaf (ritual circumambulation) around them or to make sacrifices at these sites, all of which goes against the teachings of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him): “Do not travel to visit any place but three mosques: al-Masjid al-Haraam [in Makkah], this mosque of mine [in Madeenah] and al-Masjid al-Aqsa [in Jerusalem].” (Agreed upon).

The Sufis are blindly loyal to their shaykhs, even when what they go against the words of Allaah and His Messenger. But Allaah, may He be exalted, says (interpretation of the meaning):

“O you who believe! Do not put (yourselves) forward before Allaah and His Messenger…” [al-Hujuraat 49:1]

The Sufis use talismans, letters and numbers for making decisions and for making amulets and charms and so on.

The Sufis do not restrict themselves to the specific blessings on the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) that were narrated from him. They invented new formulas that involve seeking his blessings and other kinds of blatant shirk which are unacceptable to the one on whom they are sending blessings.

This will take some time to read but I urge you to look through this.

 

[6xafridi]

I don't know if one has to master a minimum number of spins before this is answered; but I've always wanted to know where all the Sufis get their drugs from? Did they have acid in the times of al-Hajjaj?

Every time I see them they're always on some killer sh17. So, please let a brother know because I know a bunch of white kids that would love that stuff.

OK Thanks

lol are you talking about..

[utube]PtJWaPJf4cM[/utube]

 

[Free Hit]

but am a proud Sunni. Ahmed Raza Khan RA has filled my heart with the Love of Prophet Muhammad PBUH.

 

[cricket47]

i dont like the idea of sects , just the difference in the way people percieve things . i see it as philosophy and guidance .

Brother you can label them with different "terminology" yet at the core, its the same problem though. In the Quran Allah SWT states not to create sects and not to deviate from Quran and Prophet PBUH teachings, than how can you say these "different philosophies are ok"?

For anyone who says Following hadith is optional, that is a flawed logic. Because in Quran its stated numerous times Obey Allah and Obey his Messenger :-

"And obey Allah and the Messenger, that ye may obtain mercy." [Qur'ân 3:132]

"O ye who believe! give your response to Allah and His Messenger, when He calleth you to that which will give you life." [Qur'ân 8:24]


If anything that is practiced or how my brother likes to state, any act or ideology that is preached by a philosophy goes against hadith/Quran, should be rejected. (such as Music etc)

Therefore it is a MUST to follow the hadith. because Allah SWT states :-

"He who obeys the Messenger, obeys Allah." [Qur'ân 4:80]

May Allah SWT guide us All on the straight path . AMEEN

 

[cricket47]

Yaar it's a simple concept, if you're fearful of God within your very soul you miss the point that he is the most beneficient, most merciful. The love of God is what leads to true belief.

Brother to attain true belief there has to be balance of both, fear and love of Allah SWT..

Fear alone would lead person to go beyond boundaries of Islam in attempt to please Allah SWT, such as people who worship all day but dotn give time to their families and other aspects of life. As it is stated in Quran that your families have rights over you. So some people go overboard and think just praying is all that is needed, and forget to carry out other farz that is due, such as giving time to family and children and resting, sleeping etc.

Similarly, Love alone takes person beyond boundaries of Islam, where person starts inventing new methods to worship/thank Allah SWT not knowing that invention in Islam is termed Bidah and was strongly opposed by Messenger of Allah PBUH. Some people start inventing stuff that leads to path of shirk but they dont realize it, because some people in our community Love Prophet Muhammed PBUH to the point they Nauzibillah put him before Allah SWT. Which is again Haram.

So to answer, brother there has to be balance of both love and fear, you can NOT achieve true belief without balance of both.

May Allah SWT guide us all to the straight path AMEEN.

 

[cricket47]

but am a proud Sunni. Ahmed Raza Khan RA has filled my heart with the Love of Prophet Muhammad PBUH.

Brother everyone is supposed to Love Prophet Muhammed PBUH more then themselves, but you have to be careful when listening and following any particular person (im not saying Ahmed Raza Khan was bad or anything. Allah Hu Alim, i dont even know much about him) .. all im saying is some people put Prophet PBUH to such high level that they place him higher then Allah SWT. May Allah SWT prevent us from falling in those group. And before you say tht doesnt happn, trust me, I've seen such people in Pakistan with my own very eyes.

May Allah SWT guide us All to the straight path. Ameen.

 

[cricket47]

yes, we should always fear God. maybe looney was trying to say something else.

Maybe he was trying to say something else, but what im saying is that I've seen too many people other then Looney, who have echoed the same statements as Looney, Allah Hu Alim, maybe Looney did it by mistake.. but wht im saying is, ive heard those words before too..

May Allah SWT guide us all to the straight path. AMEEN

 

[khan-92]

A very good advice by Ibrahim ibn Adham a great sufi.
A man came to Ibrahim ibn Adham, may Allah be pleased with him, and said, “Abu Ishaq, I am unable to control myself. Please give me something to help me with it”

“If you accept five conditions,” said Ibrahim, “and are able to put them into practice, your disobedience will not cause you any problem.”

“Just tell me what they are, Abu Ishaq!” the man said. “The first is that when you want to disobey Allah you do not eat anything He provides.” “Then how will I get anything to eat? Everything on the earth is from Him!” “So is it right to eat His provision and disobey Him at the same time?” replied Ibrahim.

“No, it is not. What is the second condition?” “When you want to disobey him, move off His land.”

“That is even more difficult! Exclaimed the man. “In that case where will I live?”

“Is it right to eat his provision and live on His land and then to disobey Him?” asked Ibrahim. “No, it is not.”

“What is the third condition?” “When you want to disobey Him in spite of eating His provision and living on His land, find a place where He will not see you and disobey Him there.”

“What do you mean, Ibrahim? He knows everything that happens even in the most hidden places!” “So is it right to disobey Him when you eat His provision and live on His land and when you know that He can see everything you do?” “It certainly is not!” the man replied.

“Tell me the fourth condition.” “That when the Angel of Death arrives to take your soul, you say to him, ‘Give me a reprieve so that I can repent and act righteously for Allah.’”

“But he won’t listen to me!” “Then if you cannot ward off death long enough to give yourself time to repent, and you know that when it comes there will be no reprieve, how can you hope to be saved?”

“What is the fifth?” “That when the angels of the Fire come to you to take you to the Fire, you do not go with them.” “They will take me whether I like it or not!” exclaimed the man.

“So how can you hope to be saved?”

“Enough, enough, Ibrahim! I ask Allah’s forgiveness and I turn to Him!”

The man’s repentance was sincere and from that time on he was assiduous in his worship and avoided acts of disobedience until the day he died

 

[IAJ]

There is a point which we must make here, which is that praising Shaykh ‘Abd al-Qaadir does not mean praising everyone who claims to follow him. Not everyone who claims to follow a shaykh or a tareeqah or anything else is to be believed. How often has it happened that a person who is thought to be a true follower turned out to be the farthest removed from what was thought to be the case? How many misleading people don the cloak of asceticism and piety when they have nothing to do with either of them? Hence the Sufi tareeqah which is known nowadays as the Qaadiriyyah is not following the straight path which the Shaykh (may Allaah have mercy on him) followed, rather it is a deviant Sufi tareeqah which has deviated from the guidance of the Qur’aan and Sunnah; it exaggerates a great deal about Shaykh ‘Abd al-Qaadir and even attributes to him things that can only rightfully be attributed to Allaah. Some of them exaggerate concerning his grave, seeking help from it, and some of them exaggerate about his attributes and miracles (karaamah).

Sufism has numerous branches or tareeqahs, such as the Teejaniyyah, Qaadiriyyah, Naqshbandiyyah, Shaadhiliyyah, Rifaa’iyyah, etc., the followers of which all claim that their particular tareeqah is on the path of truth whilst the others are following falsehood. Islam forbids such sectarianism. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“… and be not of al-mushrikoon (the disbelievers in the Oneness of Allaah, polytheists, idolaters, etc),

Of those who split up their religion (i.e., who left the true Islamic monotheism), and became sects, [i.e., they invented new things in the religion (bid’ah) and followed their vain desires], each sect rejoicing in that which is with it.” [al-Room 30:31-32]

The Sufis worship others than Allaah, such as Prophets and “awliya’” [“saints”], living or dead. They say, “Yaa Jeelaani”, “Yaa Rifaa’i” [calling on their awliya’], or “O Messenger of Allaah, help and save” or “O Messenger of Allaah, our dependence is on you”, etc.

But Allaah forbids us to call on anyone except Him in matters that are beyond the person's capabilities. If a person does this, Allaah will count him as a mushrik, as He says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And invoke not, besides Allaah, any that will neither profit you, nor hurt you, but if (in case) you did so, you shall certainly be one of the zaalimoon (polytheists and wrongdoers).” [Yoonus 10:106]

The Sufis believe that there are abdaal, aqtaab and awliya’ (kinds of “saints”) to whom Allaah has given the power to run the affairs of the universe. Allaah tells us about the mushrikeen (interpretation of the meaning):

“Say [O Muhammad]: ‘…And who disposes the affairs?’ They will say. ‘Allaah.’…” [Yoonus 10:31]

The mushrik Arabs knew more about Allaah than these Sufis!

The Sufis turn to other than Allaah when calamity strikes, but Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And if Allaah touches you with harm, none can remove it but He, and if He touches you with good, then He is Able to do all things.” [al-An’aam 6:17]

Some Sufis believe in wahdat al-wujood (unity of existence). They do not have the idea of a Creator and His creation, instead they say that everything is creation and everything is god.

The Sufis advocate extreme asceticism in this life and do not believe in taking the necessary means or in jihaad, but Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“But seek with that (wealth) which Allaah has bestowed on you, the home of the Hereafter, and forget not your portion of legal enjoyment in this world…” [al-Qasas 28:77]

“And make ready against them all that you can of power…” [al-Anfaal 8:60]

The Sufis refer the idea of ihsaan to their shaykhs and tell their followers to have a picture of their shaykh in mind when they remember Allaah and even when they are praying. Some of them even put a picture of their shaykh in front of them when they are praying. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Ihsaan is when you worship Allaah as if you can see Him, and although you cannot see Him, He can see you.” (Reported by Muslim).

The Sufis allow dancing, drums and musical instruments, and raising the voice when making dhikr, but Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“The believers are only those who, when Allaah is mentioned, feel a fear in their hearts…” [al-Anfaal 8:2]

Moreover, you see some of them making dhikr by only pronouncing the Name of Allaah, saying, “Allaah, Allaah, Allaah.” This is bid’ah and has no meaning in Islam. They even go to the extreme of saying, “Ah, ah” or “Hu, Hu.” The Sunnah is for the Muslim to remember his Lord in words that have a true meaning for which he will be rewarded, such as saying Subhaan Allaah wa Alhamdulillah wa Laa ilaaha illa Allaah wa Allaahu akbar, and so on.

The Sufis recite love poems mentioning the names of women and boys in their dhikr gatherings, and they repeat words such as “love”, “passion”, “desire” and so on, as if they are in a gathering where people dance and drink wine and clap and shout. All of this has to do with the customs and acts of worship of the mushrikeen. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“Their salaah (prayer) at the House (of Allaah, i.e., the Ka’bah at Makkah) was nothing but whistling and clapping of hands…”

[al-Anfaal 8:35]

Some Sufis pierce themselves with rods of iron, saying, “O my grandfather!” So the shayaateen come to them and help them, because they are seeking the help of someone other than Allaah . Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And whosoever turns away (blinds himself) from the remembrance of the Most Beneficent (Allaah), We appoint for him a shaytaan (devil) to be a qareen (intimate companion) for him.”

[al-Zukhruf 43:36]

The Sufis claim to have gnosis and knowledge of the unseen, but the Qur’aan shows them to be liars. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“Say: ‘None in the heavens and the earth knows the ghayb (unseen) except Allaah…’” [al-Naml 27:65]

The Sufis claim that Allaah created the world for the sake of Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), but the Qur’aan shows them to be liars. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And I (Allaah) created not the jinns and humans except they should worship Me (Alone).” [al-Dhaariyaat 51:56]

Allaah, may He be glorified and exalted, addressed His Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) with the words (interpretation of the meaning):

“And worship your Lord until there comes unto the certainty (i.e., death).” [al-Hijr 15:99]

The Sufis claim that they can see Allaah in this life, but the Qur’aan shows them to be liars. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“[Moosa said:] ‘O my Lord! Show me (Yourself), that I may look upon You.’ Allaah said, ‘You cannot see Me…’” [al-A’raaf 7:143]

The Sufis claim that they take knowledge directly from Allaah, without the mediation of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) and in a conscious state (as opposed to dreams). So are they better than the Sahaabah??

The Sufis claim that they take knowledge directly from Allaah, without the mediation of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). They say, “Haddathani qalbi ‘an Rabbi (My heart told me from my Lord).”

The Sufis celebrate Mawlid and hold gatherings for sending blessings on the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), but they go against his teachings by raising their voices in dhikr and anaasheed (religious songs) and qaseedahs (poems) that contain blatant shirk. Did the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) celebrate his birthday? Did Abu Bakr, ‘Umar, ‘Uthman, ‘Ali, the four imaams or anyone else celebrate his birthday? Who knows more and is more correct in worship, the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) and the Salaf, or the Sufis?

The Sufis travel to visit graves and seek blessings from their occupants or to make tawaaf (ritual circumambulation) around them or to make sacrifices at these sites, all of which goes against the teachings of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him): “Do not travel to visit any place but three mosques: al-Masjid al-Haraam [in Makkah], this mosque of mine [in Madeenah] and al-Masjid al-Aqsa [in Jerusalem].” (Agreed upon).

The Sufis are blindly loyal to their shaykhs, even when what they go against the words of Allaah and His Messenger. But Allaah, may He be exalted, says (interpretation of the meaning):

“O you who believe! Do not put (yourselves) forward before Allaah and His Messenger…” [al-Hujuraat 49:1]

The Sufis use talismans, letters and numbers for making decisions and for making amulets and charms and so on.

The Sufis do not restrict themselves to the specific blessings on the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) that were narrated from him. They invented new formulas that involve seeking his blessings and other kinds of blatant shirk which are unacceptable to the one on whom they are sending blessings.

This will take some time to read but I urge you to look through this.

I don't know if you have written this yourself or only copy pasted it but I have bolded some of your comments and you are a liar. You are spreading lies and coming wiht false allegation. You have no idea of tasawwuf man! It's useless to discuss this with you!

 

[ShaazE]

you are taking the mik.

slap yourself.

Sorry bro not a Sufi.

 

[Free Hit]

Ironically and interestingly today there was a gathering organised by dawate Islami organisation in our masjid and the speaker amazingly explained the three types of worships, one from the fear of Allah SWT, one for better hear after hence jannah, and one just to thank Allah SWT for whatever he has got in this world. so its a balance of all these.

 

[sunnykhan]

but am a proud Sunni. Ahmed Raza Khan RA has filled my heart with the Love of Prophet Muhammad PBUH.

O jiyo Free Hit bhai! He was a great scholar. Truly inspirational! May ALLAH showers him with his blessings.

 

[sunnykhan]

The followers of ibn taymiyyah There are certain question marks over his credibility also. By his very own student.

Sufism is considered a different sect by who basically opposes them. It's an integral part. Their services to Islam are just incredible. Islam was spread by these noble personalities. They devoted their life for the sake of Islam and yet People question them.

 

[6xafridi]

The followers of ibn taymiyyah There are certain question marks over his credibility also. By his very own student.

Sufism is considered a different sect by who basically opposes them. It's an integral part. Their services to Islam are just incredible. Islam was spread by these noble personalities. They devoted their life for the sake of Islam and yet People question them.

I am not questioning Abdul Qadir Jilani, I am questioning his "supposed" followers of today. He would never accept the type of innovations that are involved with Sufiism. I'm not talking or questioning the people that helped bring Islam to the Indian subcontinent. I am talking about the followers of Sufiism and their wrongdoings.

@IAJ

The Sufis worship others than Allaah.

The way they praise shaykhs or call upon them is beyond the boundaries of Islam

The Sufis believe that there are abdaal, aqtaab and awliya’ (kinds of “saints”) to whom Allaah has given the power to run the affairs of the universe.

“Do not revile the people of Syria, for among them there are abdaal; every time one of them dies, Allah replaces him with another man.” This is a fabricated hadith some Sufi scholars use. Obviously not all Sufis believe in this, an example is yourself.

They do not have the idea of a Creator and His creation, instead they say that everything is creation and everything is god.

Again I said SOME.

This is bid’ah and has no meaning in Islam.

If it is not bid'ah then what is it? Does it have any basis in Islam and if you still think it does then please prove from the Sunnah or Qur'aan.

The Sufis allow dancing, drums and musical instruments, and raising the voice when making dhikr

Our own OP asks us to posts "dances". Astaghfirallah, “The believers are only those who, when Allaah is mentioned, feel a fear in their hearts…” [al-Anfaal 8:2]

The Sufis celebrate Mawlid and hold gatherings for sending blessings on the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), but they go against his teachings by raising their voices in dhikr and anaasheed (religious songs) and qaseedahs (poems) that contain blatant shirk

Do they not? Check out the poem "Qasidah Burdah"

The Sufis are blindly loyal to their shaykhs, even when what they go against the words of Allaah and His Messenger.

OF COURSE they are.. and that is not a Sufi problem, that is a problem in the Indian subcontinent, and it is not limited to Sheikhs, it can be said about their forefathers too.

 

[6xafridi]

BTW lads, this is my favourite Sufi dance.. really brings me closer to Allah

[utube]PAOfZTDKdKU[/utube]

 

[cricket47]

The followers of ibn taymiyyah There are certain question marks over his credibility also. By his very own student.

Sufism is considered a different sect by who basically opposes them. It's an integral part. Their services to Islam are just incredible. Islam was spread by these noble personalities. They devoted their life for the sake of Islam and yet People question them.

Brother, please refrain from making such claims. Only thing that is integral in Islam is Quran (Word of Allah) and Sunnah (the sayings/actions of Prophet Muhammed PBUH).

Brother Allah Hu Alim, about Sufism contribution to Islam, but one thing you have to admit, "mystical music" or "losing your self" in saying Allah-hu to the point that the person doesnt even have any idea wht is going around him is not Islam.

Islam teaches balance of life, one cant "loose" it self in saying "Allah hu" to the point they don't even know what is going around them/or they dont care about it. Dhikr is important, let me correct my self, Dhirk is MUST! but there is a method to dhirk and worship.

Brother, In Quran Allah SWT states :


You have indeed in the Messenger of Allah an excellent example for him who hopes in Allah and the Last Day, and who remembers Allah much. (33:21).

In this verse Allah instructs Muslims to follow Prophet Muhammad (P.B.U.H) who was an embodiment of the great values and manners of the Holy Quran. He gave the best example for mankind in the human history. Many Muslim and non-Muslim writers bear witness that Prophet Muhammad (P.B.U.H) is the greatest man in the human history.

Then why do we have to construct new methods to preach Islam, such as "mystical music" or constantly saying "Allah-hu" and neglecting our other obligations set forth in Quran, such as giving time to family, your self, neighbors etc.

Brother Dhirk is MUST but there is a method to it. Allah Hu Alim, im not sure how in the past sufism used to operate or how they used to worship Allah SWT, but where there is some doubt, why dont we just turn to Quran and Sunnah? Quran is Word of Allah SWT, and Sunnah is saying/teachings of Prophet Muhammed PBUH. When Allah SWT said His Messenger is the best example for us, then why do we need to follow ways where there are doubts casted on their actions?

Music is stated to be Haram, then why use the wrong methods to invite people to path of Allah SWT? verily, there are other methods that are better suited than that. And if Music was the way to call people to Islam, verily Allah SWT would have told his Prophet to use it?? why do we think we know more then the prophet so we try to invent new things?

As far as poetry goes,to All the Brothers out there, you have to be REALLY careful, when reading poetry, be it sufism or other poetry, You might find it interesting that, in Quran Allah SWT states :-

026.221 Shall I inform you, (O people!), on whom it is that the evil ones (Shaytan) descend?

026.222 They descend on every lying, wicked person,

026.223 (Into whose ears) they pour hearsay vanities, and most of them are liars.

026.224 And the Poets,- It is those straying in Evil, who follow them:

026.225 Seest thou not that they wander distracted in every valley?-

026.226 And that they say what they practise not?-

026.227 Except those who believe, work righteousness, engage much in the remembrance of Allah, and defend themselves only after they are unjustly attacked. And soon will the unjust assailants know what vicissitudes their affairs will take!

So you have to be careful with poetry. Islamic peotry is allowed, where they talk about the "true' Islam. But there are certain limits in that too, where one CAN NOT go beyond boundaries when talking about Allah SWT or Prophet Muhammed PBUH. Some of the peotry now days praise Prophet Muhammed PBUH to a point that Nauzibillah they place Prophet PBUH higher then Alllah SWT., and in other instances commit shirk.

Example. Ali Moula Ali Moula, Ali da pehla number etc. (that falls in category of Shirk) and I've seen people listening to them and chanting it and not know what they are even doing.

Another example: Bahr da johli meriy ya Mohammed (that too is shirk, you are allowed to ask ONLY ALLAH SWT for du'a not the Prophet PBUH after he is deceased)

Brother Allah Hu Alim, I'm not aware of exactly how previous people carried out their worship, the so called "starters of Sufism". Only Allah has knowledge about that, but the methods implemented now days, through music, peotry are not allowed.

ONCE AGAIN. let me reiterate my point, Allah Hu Alim about the previous Sufism teachers/students, but now days the methods that are implemented are not right. Therefore I would strongly recommend everyone, including my self to turn to Quran and if any other detail is required go to the Sunnah.

May Allah SWT guide us all to the straight path. Ameen.

 

[cricket47]

BTW lads, this is my favourite Sufi dance.. really brings me closer to Allah

[utube]PAOfZTDKdKU[/utube]

My respected Brother, please dont use stuff like that (where you talk "sarcastically") . In Islam, we are told to talk/discuss with logic, manner, and keep others feelings in mind and not offend it. Instead of saying "really brings me closer to Allah"? you could pose a question or ask for information but try not to hurt anyones feeling by being sarcastic, for verily Allah SWT tells to take care of peoples feelings.


Brother we should definitely talk/discuss this topic and try to educate each other on the forums provided by PakPassion, but please keep the conversation in a Islamic manner.

May Allah SWT guide us All on the straight path. Ameen