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The battle of the keepers, Rishabh Pant versus Mohammad Rizwan

If this Pant had played 2019 world cup India would have been in the finals. They didn't give him chance until that point.
 
jnaveen1980 said:
If this Pant had played 2019 world cup India would have been in the finals. They didn't give him chance until that point.
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Problem was Dhoni and Kohli's muddled approach. He was ready to.give chances after chances to the likes of Karthik, Rayudu, Shankar, Jadhav etc but not Pant.

Not difficult to see why Pant wasn't given preference in WC '19.
 
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Also, for all the talks of us wining WC under Dhoni in 2011, he was also directly responsible for us not winning the next 2 WCs which we could have won with all the talent at our disposal.
 
Tests
Rishabh (747): 7
Rizwan (667): 17

Odis
Rishabh (432): 91
Rizwan (367): 112

T20is
Rizwan (485): 47
Rishabh (407): 68

Only in Tests both are in the top rankings. However, in the longer run, I think Rishabh will be top even in LOIs
 
shamaan said:
Defonitely but i rate pant slightly higher in odis and t20s in tests id go with rizwan
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In test matches Pant has played three memorable match winning innings.
Something that many greats cannot claim to do in their entire career.
 
MP2011 said:
Also, for all the talks of us wining WC under Dhoni in 2011, he was also directly responsible for us not winning the next 2 WCs which we could have won with all the talent at our disposal.
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We should have made both the finals. I think Australia in Australia would have been a different beast to beating England in England. But looking at the final where everything went England's way, Eng probably would have won that too. But two finals is the least we should have done.

Not sure if that would have been more painful to deal when you add the CT final loss to Pak too :jimmy
 
Rizwan was poor in last game dropping catches and scoring duck. But this is advantage he has, pant always in limelight and every move is scrutinised
 
shamaan said:
But hes keeping is average at best
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He has been quite brilliant since Aus series as a keeper. Pulled off some brilliant stumpings and catches in the Eng series. Not to mention countless difficult takes.
 
Some Pakistan fans were talking about how great Rizwan was as a keeper and much better than Pant, well Pant has improved as a keeper and Rizwan dropped 2 catches in this series. You people are such a jinx. :))

Fully expect Pants keeping to improve.
 
The fact that some people were adamant that Rizwan is a better WK batsman or a better batsman in LOIs shows how clueless and cricket-ignorant our fans are.

Rizwan is a very good WK batsman but Pant is several notches above him in all formats. He is GOAT material.
 
Mamoon said:
The fact that some people were adamant that Rizwan is a better WK batsman or a better batsman in LOIs shows how clueless and cricket-ignorant our fans are.

Rizwan is a very good WK batsman but Pant is several notches above him in all formats. He is GOAT material.
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Agree with you in this.Players of Pant style are rare.
 
Sir Alex said:
He has been quite brilliant since Aus series as a keeper. Pulled off some brilliant stumpings and catches in the Eng series. Not to mention countless difficult takes.
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Of course hes going to take stumping i didnt say he wouldn't.your other keeper is a proper keeper and twice the keeper pant is
 
shamaan said:
Of course hes going to take stumping i didnt say he wouldn't.your other keeper is a proper keeper and twice the keeper pant is
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Nah, Saha WAS twice the keeper, but the improvement Pant has shown, the stunning stumpings and catches he has taken, now the gap is not that wide any more
 
Battle of the keepers in Tests might be relevant but LOL at Rizwan being named anywhere else!
 
Indiafan said:
Nah, Saha WAS twice the keeper, but the improvement Pant has shown, the stunning stumpings and catches he has taken, now the gap is not that wide any more
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Saha should be compared to rizwan in keeping and not pant even if pant has improved.
 
Rizwan is Watling level bat. Clutch bat and very good behind gloves.

He will average close to 40 over the next 5 years and that should be good enough for a wicket keeper batsman.

Pant's ceiling is very high( Gilchrist level) but let's see how far he can go. His batting has higher potential than even Gilly.
 
shamaan said:
Saha should be compared to rizwan in keeping and not pant even if pant has improved.
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Foakes is the best wicket keeper in the world. He wont get a game in LOIs for England. As long as your keeping is good enough, it's OK. Pant's batting is more valuable than Saha's keeping.
 
rhony said:
Foakes is the best wicket keeper in the world. He wont get a game in LOIs for England. As long as your keeping is good enough, it's OK. Pant's batting is more valuable than Saha's keeping.
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Why would you mention foakes in Lols but not tests ?.
And i agree than pants batting is more valuable than saha keeping but is it more valuable than rizwans runs and keeping in tests.
 
shamaan said:
Why would you mention foakes in Lols but not tests ?.
And i agree than pants batting is more valuable than saha keeping but is it more valuable than rizwans runs and keeping in tests.
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Rizwan can provide support in Pak middle order. Pant can win games for India. Atleast that's the way it went so far. As far as Foakes goes, he played because Butler was rested in tests. As long as one is a decent keeper, it's enough. Batting prowess is critical too.
 
shamaan said:
Why would you mention foakes in Lols but not tests ?.
And i agree than pants batting is more valuable than saha keeping but is it more valuable than rizwans runs and keeping in tests.
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I dont know why people keep ignoring that Pant has improved his keeping so much, he has been flawless in all recent match. They keep pretending he is still a below average keeper. In all recent series he out kept the regular keepers from the other side
 
Indiafan said:
I dont know why people keep ignoring that Pant has improved his keeping so much, he has been flawless in all recent match. They keep pretending he is still a below average keeper. In all recent series he out kept the regular keepers from the other side
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He may have improved am not saying he hasnt but he stil is no were in terms of keeping compared to saha and rizwan
 
shamaan said:
He may have improved am not saying he hasnt but he stil is no were in terms of keeping compared to saha and rizwan
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I'm guessing you haven't watched any recent Indian games. I know Sarf is a bad fielder and that's probably the reason but Rizwan's keeping wasn't considered mandatory when both he and Sarf played. At this level the difference is incremental. Pakistan team thought Sarf's batting was more critical than Rizwan's keeping. So the argument regarding Pant can die a miserable death now. Pant has been outstanding in the recent games and he will only improve.
 
rhony said:
I'm guessing you haven't watched any recent Indian games. I know Sarf is a bad fielder and that's probably the reason but Rizwan's keeping wasn't considered mandatory when both he and Sarf played. At this level the difference is incremental. Pakistan team thought Sarf's batting was more critical than Rizwan's keeping. So the argument regarding Pant can die a miserable death now. Pant has been outstanding in the recent games and he will only improve.
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I have watched majority of the games Indians have played recently including the Australian games and the england games.rizwan can play as a batter who can field in the outfield sarfraz cant field in the outfield hence the reason why they gave the gloves to sarfraz who is also a good keeper.
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Another day, another brilliant catch by Mohammad Rizwan<a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/SAvPAK?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#SAvPAK</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Cricket?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Cricket</a></p>— Saj Sadiq (@Saj_PakPassion) <a href="https://twitter.com/Saj_PakPassion/status/1383057253360664576?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">April 16, 2021</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Mohammad Rizwan copying the celebration of Hassan Ali <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/SAvsPAK?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#SAvsPAK</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Cricket?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Cricket</a> <a href="https://t.co/zazhOPLOsa">pic.twitter.com/zazhOPLOsa</a></p>— Saj Sadiq (@Saj_PakPassion) <a href="https://twitter.com/Saj_PakPassion/status/1383059069863403529?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">April 16, 2021</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
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Didnt pant mess up a straighforward run out the other day costing his team the win?
 
Interesting stat on Rishabh Pant is that he already has 75 catches in just 20 tests.

He has a good 12+ years of cricket ahead of him. If he keeps this up, will end up with a few bags full of catches.
 
Bhaag Viru Bhaag said:
When and where? :inti
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Yesterday vs RR


Tom Curran to Morris, 1 run

Unadkat slips and it seems like it's an unfortunate end, but the script has completely flipped! Pant doesn't gather the ball. Short of a length ball heaved off the inside edge to deep midwicket. Unadkat was sent back trying to go for the second, slipped, fell and made a despairing dive. It was a straightforward throw to Pant who was over-eager and has broken the stumps without gathering the ball
 
Devadwal said:
Against 3rd string south Africa bowling attack lol
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While I agree this bowling attack is a joke, I find it funny how Indians celebrated their 2018 LO series wins over South Africa. Both sets of fans are the most immature in the world without a doubt.
 
Will this thread blow up after every rizwan failure and good innings because this is what it's turning out to be. This is ridiculous. A constant and useless back and forth
 
Zaz said:
Yesterday vs RR


Tom Curran to Morris, 1 run

Unadkat slips and it seems like it's an unfortunate end, but the script has completely flipped! Pant doesn't gather the ball. Short of a length ball heaved off the inside edge to deep midwicket. Unadkat was sent back trying to go for the second, slipped, fell and made a despairing dive. It was a straightforward throw to Pant who was over-eager and has broken the stumps without gathering the ball
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Thanks. Just checked his thread. Some fans are talking about a great catch he took but no one mentioned this. It is good for them that I don't watch IPL. :rabada2 :inti
 
Rizwan is a good player but the problem with this comparison is that he has been compared with the great Rishabh Pant which is unfair on the crisis man. There are enough quality test wicket keepers like Dhoni, Watling, Prior, Haddin etc but you can't compare him with the great Rishabh Pant especially after his lifetime performance in Australia which was followed by another brilliant series Vs England.

The performance in Australia was already too good to moan for the ages but he followed up with splendid performance in England in Tests and ODI series and has put himself in the category where we can call him "the great Rishabh Pant" now :inti.
 
Ab Fan said:
Rizwan is a good player but the problem with this comparison is that he has been compared with the great Rishabh Pant which is unfair on the crisis man. There are enough quality test wicket keepers like Dhoni, Watling, Prior, Haddin etc but you can't compare him with the great Rishabh Pant especially after his lifetime performance in Australia which was followed by another brilliant series Vs England.

The performance in Australia was already too good to moan for the ages but he followed up with splendid performance in England in Tests and ODI series and has put himself in the category where we can call him "the great Rishabh Pant" now :inti.
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The word "great" has been used too loosely by some fans these days that it is losing its meaning as fast as some fans change their favorite teams or players. :)))

As far as your post is concerned [MENTION=143570]NoBallZombie[/MENTION]'s post in this thread is a perfect answer to that. :inti

NoBallZombie said:
No one is fit to tie Pant's showlaces at this point. The way things are going, he has already surpassed most, if not all the past greats, already. He has two great innings and if he were to retire today, he would be remembered as the greatest keeper bat everrrrr.

Whereas, Rizwan, well he being 28 years old, his stats are irrelevant. Doesnt matter his average or clutch innings or anything else, he is going to be Watling level ... and even that is pushing it. I would think he is probably Mongia level. Yes that makes sense now. Its all coming to me. I am enlightened.
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The great Pant may have smashed apart Time Paine's arrogance of no team being capable of breaching the fortress, GABBA, early this year in Australia but in the process, it seems he has also ripped apart plenty of delusions and bitterness that the usual suspect had ascribed to here in India only.

The challenge now is how to deal with these continuous humiliations twice every day.
 
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Ab Fan said:
The great Pant may have smashed apart Time Paine's arrogance of no team being capable of breaching the fortress, GABBA, early this year in Australia but in the process, it seems he has also ripped apart plenty of delusions and bitterness that the usual suspect had ascribed to here in India only.

The challenge now is how to deal with these continuous humiliations twice every day.
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Is he the same Tim Paine who missed Pant's stumping in Brisbane test when he was batting at 52? Tim Paine deserved that humiliation. Australia dropped the series because of his poor keeping. :inti
 
A lot of the people had the egg on their face for not recognising the obvious greatness of Rishabh pants talent.

Some are still trying to doubt him after his test heroics, I have a feeling they are enjoying the humiliation now. If you can’t avoid it, enjoy it ;)
 
Smbhayi said:
Why do you guys downgrading a knock if it's against weakened bowling? Still he has to score runs nah?
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That's the weird part. One should complain when a player doesn't score against weakened bowlers. For some reason, they are criticized for scoring
 
Ab Fan said:
The great Pant may have smashed apart Time Paine's arrogance of no team being capable of breaching the fortress, GABBA, early this year in Australia but in the process, it seems he has also ripped apart plenty of delusions and bitterness that the usual suspect had ascribed to here in India only.

The challenge now is how to deal with these continuous humiliations twice every day.
Click to expand...

After the massacre it's time to show compassion. Alternately, one can sit back and enjoy the desperation.
 
pant is the best rn no doubt but rizwan isnt far behind. The amount of mental fortitude rizwan has is unperralled, stop comparing and enjoy both as both are going to be legends when all is said and done
 
The real test starts when there is a dip in each player's form. Every player looks great when he is in form of his life. I think those who have watched enough cricket know that nothing is constant apart from change.

I remember many fans were claiming that Alistair Cook will easily break Sachin's test records easily when he was in his form of his life. Even then I asked fans to hold their horses and said he won't come anywhere near that. :inti
 
Devadwal said:
Against 3rd string south Africa bowling attack lol
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LOL?
So wait, what do you want?

If a guy doesn't perform, you will whine, if a guy performs you will still whine.

Than what should they do? Pack their bags?

You cry about second string team, do you know the only good teams in cricket are England, NZ, India and Australia. We dont even play India. So we are left with 3. Even Australia doesn't really play its full squad agianst us.

Chalo, now we have two teams in international criket that are actually good and play against us with a good squad.

Now how is this Pakistan's fault? If out of 10 teams, Pakistan faces 8 bad teams, than what is Pakistan suppose to do? What are the players suppose to do

You are just critisizng for the sake of critisizing. You will find any reason to absh a player you dislike
 
Bhaag Viru Bhaag said:
The word "great" has been used too loosely by some fans these days that it is losing its meaning as fast as some fans change their favorite teams or players. :)))

As far as your post is concerned [MENTION=143570]NoBallZombie[/MENTION]'s post in this thread is a perfect answer to that. :inti
Click to expand...

If soms people were really that cricket fans like they pretended to be, they woild know knocks like the Gabba are life time knocks and test fans, particularly Indian fans, have been waiting since history of cricket

But of course these people pretend to be test fans only to put down IPL and underplay all time great knocks in test cricket which has never happened in Indian history

Never can never ever be anything greater for an Indian test fan than a series win in overseas tests in Australia. Now imagine an unbeaten 4th innings in a record chase. Which Indian test cricket fan will keep downplaying such an innings? Particialrly someone who hates t20s and always praises test?
 
Major said:
LOL?
So wait, what do you want?

If a guy doesn't perform, you will whine, if a guy performs you will still whine.

Than what should they do? Pack their bags?

You cry about second string team, do you know the only good teams in cricket are England, NZ, India and Australia. We dont even play India. So we are left with 3. Even Australia doesn't really play its full squad agianst us.

Chalo, now we have two teams in international criket that are actually good and play against us with a good squad.

Now how is this Pakistan's fault? If out of 10 teams, Pakistan faces 8 bad teams, than what is Pakistan suppose to do? What are the players suppose to do

You are just critisizng for the sake of critisizing. You will find any reason to absh a player you dislike
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No one said south African attack of Rabada and nortje is bad. But when the bowling attack is Magala?

Also the hypocrisy and irony is amusing, considering your attempts to constantly put down kohl's achievements by all sorts of filters and mental gymnastics
 
Best Batsmen: Pant
Best Gloveman: Rizwan
Greatest wicket keeper of all time: Rohail Nazir.
 
U$ofA said:
Interesting stat on Rishabh Pant is that he already has 75 catches in just 20 tests.

He has a good 12+ years of cricket ahead of him. If he keeps this up, will end up with a few bags full of catches.
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That speaks about Indian bowling more than keeping. It also means India has a better test bowling than Pakistan.
 
Major said:
LOL?
So wait, what do you want?

If a guy doesn't perform, you will whine, if a guy performs you will still whine.

Than what should they do? Pack their bags?

You cry about second string team, do you know the only good teams in cricket are England, NZ, India and Australia. We dont even play India. So we are left with 3. Even Australia doesn't really play its full squad agianst us.

Chalo, now we have two teams in international criket that are actually good and play against us with a good squad.

Now how is this Pakistan's fault? If out of 10 teams, Pakistan faces 8 bad teams, than what is Pakistan suppose to do? What are the players suppose to do

You are just critisizng for the sake of critisizing. You will find any reason to absh a player you dislike
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Lol so all the filters only applies to indian team & Indian player's. If you don't know about those filters then i can share here with you
 
Romali_rotti said:
Best Batsmen: Pant
Best Gloveman: Rizwan
Greatest wicket keeper of all time: Rohail Nazir.
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:))) Still can't get my head around on how some Pak fan yesterday compare Haider with Rohit. It is incredible how people hype some players to tge extreme.
 
Indiafan said:
If soms people were really that cricket fans like they pretended to be, they woild know knocks like the Gabba are life time knocks and test fans, particularly Indian fans, have been waiting since history of cricket

But of course these people pretend to be test fans only to put down IPL and underplay all time great knocks in test cricket which has never happened in Indian history

Never can never ever be anything greater for an Indian test fan than a series win in overseas tests in Australia. Now imagine an unbeaten 4th innings in a record chase. Which Indian test cricket fan will keep downplaying such an innings? Particialrly someone who hates t20s and always praises test?
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That was a great knock by Pant but that doesn't mean we can't criticize him in the future. Just because you have started worshipping him after that and light up an "agarbatti" in front of his poster everyday doesn't mean all of us should do that and can't criticize him on a match by match basis.

And I think I have told you multiple times already I don't hate IT20's. I don't like your Pyjama Leagues which are trying pretty hard to finish International Cricket in my opinion. Let that sink in. :inti
 
Indiafan said:
If soms people were really that cricket fans like they pretended to be, they woild know knocks like the Gabba are life time knocks and test fans, particularly Indian fans, have been waiting since history of cricket

But of course these people pretend to be test fans only to put down IPL and underplay all time great knocks in test cricket which has never happened in Indian history

Never can never ever be anything greater for an Indian test fan than a series win in overseas tests in Australia. Now imagine an unbeaten 4th innings in a record chase. Which Indian test cricket fan will keep downplaying such an innings? Particialrly someone who hates t20s and always praises test?
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IPL is the proverbial sour grapes for a lot of people. Can see it, but never have it. The desperate attempts to disregard it is pure comic gold. As for pant, he is killing it in both tests and ipl and that's what matters.

Some of the innings he has played can never be imagined from certified legends of most countries.
We have seen teams being whitewashed by innings repetitively down under and that's probably because they don't have a player of pant's caliber in their ranks.
 
Indiafan said:
No one said south African attack of Rabada and nortje is bad. But when the bowling attack is Magala?

Also the hypocrisy and irony is amusing, considering your attempts to constantly put down kohl's achievements by all sorts of filters and mental gymnastics
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when did i insult kohli?
 
MP2011 said:
Also, for all the talks of us wining WC under Dhoni in 2011, he was also directly responsible for us not winning the next 2 WCs which we could have won with all the talent at our disposal.
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Oh come on, you should respect Dhoni for what he did for Indian cricket.

Moreover, in 2015 world cup in Australian conditions, Australia was comfortable better team. In my opinion, India wasn't favorite in that world cup.

You lost to a better team just accept it and move on.

Though, India should have been one of the finalist of 2019 world cup.
 
Pant reached career best 6th place in test ranking ahead of Babar who is at 9th while Rizwan is at 18th place
 
Rishabh did really well in Australia. Really excited to see him in England.

I personally think he'll average somewhere between 37 - 42, which is really good.

For India to win the series, Kohli and Rishabh has to do well in the batting department.
 
Rishabh's test stats are misleading. He hasn't played enough home games where he would have easily averaged 55-60 with bat. Watch him out for next 10 years. He will produce below stats:-

Home average - 56
Away average - 43

Overall:- 46( because of more away games)
 
I'm interested to see how Pant copes with the swinging ball behind the stumps during this tour, he had a nightmare 3 years ago. People say his keeping has improved during that period so it'll be intriguing to see how he keeps to the wobbling dukes ball.

No real qualms about his ability in front of the stumps, he'll be fine with the bat.
 
Ab Fan said:
Rishabh's test stats are misleading. He hasn't played enough home games where he would have easily averaged 55-60 with bat. Watch him out for next 10 years. He will produce below stats:-

Home average - 56
Away average - 43

Overall:- 46( because of more away games)
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What do you think Rizwan will produce ?
 
Watling has good stats in England only. While Rizwan has good stats pretty much everywhere (limited sample though I think he can maintain it). His ceiling is a lot higher than BJ Watling.
 
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