Trevor Bayliss: Series win over India on par with Ashes triumph

[Canford Cliffs]

The victory against world no 1 India in the ongoing five-Test series is on par with beating Australia in the Ashes, said England coach Trevor Bayliss, who suggested they might experiment in the final match starting at London on Friday.

“It is right up there with beating Australia in the Ashes. Obviously India are a very good team, the number one team, and to knock them off is a very good feeling,” said Bayliss after England sealed the series with a 60-run win in the fourth Test.

“There were some difficult conditions especially on day one. We have said before, under a bit of pressure these guys have got a bit of character which is a good sign going forward.”

With opener Alastair Cook announcing his retirement after this series, and skipper Joe Root eager to bat at number four, England will have to figure out their top-order in the final Test as well as in the upcoming series against Sri Lanka and West Indies.

Moeen Ali was promoted to the number 3 spot in the second innings of the fourth Test, paving the way for Root to bat at four and Bayliss said the off-spinner might be an option in that position in the right condition.

“I’m sure there will be discussions on a few things in the next couple of days. Batsmen would like to have a settled position in the order. You always find in any era or team there are one or two guys who have to be a bit flexible,” he said.

“Moeen has been that guy for us over the last few years. When Root asked him if he was keen to do it he jumped at it. In the right conditions I would not put it past him.

“He works hard at his game. In spinning conditions he can cover that pretty well at the moment but his challenge will be on the faster wickets but we haven’t got any of those for a while.”

Bayliss, however, wasn’t sure if Ali would be a permanent move and hinted it was possible for Root to revert to the role.

“Joe has always said he wants to bat at four. He understood where I was coming from that if we had a number three averaging 50 to allow him to bat at four, that would be handy. But I thought it was for the best of the team he batted at three,” he said.

“Hopefully we can find someone who can do a decent job at number three and he can bat where he feels most comfortable. All credit to him. He has taken that role on with no problems. He has taken one for the team in that respect.”

The coach also said they will take a call on whether to field both James Anderson and Stuart Broad in the upcoming series.

“We will get together after this Test and see who is fit and available. We will definitely want to win the last Test, and I see a future with them (Anderson-Broad) at the moment,” Bayliss said.

“They are the most successful pace bowlers in this series and it will go down to how their bodies are feeling. We spoke before the series if their bodies would double up in close Test matches. So we will have to wait and see how they are in 48 hours’ time.

“The numbers of Tests we have played this year have been spread out. There is another reasonable gap until we play the Tests in Sri Lanka. There is a bigger gap again and then another couple of months leading in to the West Indies. Them only playing Test cricket does give them a bit of a break.”

The fifth and final Test begins on Friday at London.


https://www.hindustantimes.com/cric...hes-triumph/story-09yKcgQGuyf7WUPp4VUU0K.html

 

[Titan24]

Good way to make people forget how poor they were in last ashes.
Beating India which is a top test team is a good achievement but how can it be compared to Ashes which has history behind it unless he still has a bitter taste from that defeat and is yet to overcome it.

 

[Mamoon]

His comments will sting our fans, but they are true enough. India have been the benchmark in Test cricket for 2-3 years, and beating the most high profile team in the world is a big deal.

However, beating India in India remains the biggest challenge in the game today, but England should look to build on this success and gain some momentum. They have been very poor for a while now.

 

[Canford Cliffs]

The fact that Cook decided this series to retire and not Ashes says it all perhaps.

 

[InziRules]

The fact that Cook decided this series to retire and not Ashes says it all perhaps.

Says he failed and didn't want to hamper the team in a big series like the Ashes when he couldn't smash Indian trundlers who are the worst bowlers in the World?

We all remember what Cook did in the massacre of Mumbai a few years back, India were shaken that day by that knock

 

[the_outsider]

Says he failed and didn't want to hamper the team in a big series like the Ashes when he couldn't smash Indian trundlers who are the worst bowlers in the World?

We all remember what Cook did in the massacre of Mumbai a few years back, India were shaken that day by that knock

2 months ago, the same Cook that has managed only 109 runs in 7 innings against Indian "trundlers" scored 117 runs in 3 innings against Pakistan.... Yikes!

 

[InziRules]

2 months ago, the same Cook that has managed only 109 runs in 7 innings against Indian "trundlers" scored 117 runs in 3 innings against Pakistan.... Yikes!

That's an average under 40, which is terrible... so what's your point?

 

[the_outsider]

That's an average under 40, which is terrible... so what's your point?

Last I checked an avg of 39 is a little better than an avg of 15.

 

[InziRules]

Last I checked an avg of 39 is a little better than an avg of 15.

How much did Curran average against Pakistan? I think its zero

 

[the_outsider]

How much did Curran average against Pakistan? I think its zero

You should stop, man. This is already embarrassing. Next time try checking the stats before "educating" the world about trundlers.

 

[Pakhs]

Last I checked an avg of 39 is a little better than an avg of 15.

Well Cook is a proven great and had a reasonable series against Pak which doesn't mean Pak dont have good bowlers. Where someone like Sam Curran is not great and at best a number 7 bat. The bigger point is that this Indian bowling line up struggled to get wickets once the bowl got a bit older through out the series but bowled very well when the bowl was new. I am surprised people havent picked up on that, I think that was the biggest difference between the two attacks. England was able to pick up wickets even when the bowl got old and India could not they waited for the second new ball instead which again they were successful at but it meant additional runs were scored.

 

[batnbowl]

Agree with Trev - India have been fantastic in the field and with the ball - they have fallen short in the batting dept however both the master Kohli and Pujara kept it competitive.

All this without having a solid top order line up is very impressive.....

 

[Robert]

Beating India will never be as important as beating Australia.

Unless we beat India in India while currently holding the Ashes.

 

[Pakhs]

Beating India will never be as important as beating Australia.

Unless we beat India in India while currently holding the Ashes.

I agree, he may have only meant it in difficulty terms. But I live in England and only series English fans even talk about is Ashes they are mostly not bothered otherwise.

 

[Rahul1]

Says he failed and didn't want to hamper the team in a big series like the Ashes when he couldn't smash Indian trundlers who are the worst bowlers in the World?

We all remember what Cook did in the massacre of Mumbai a few years back, India were shaken that day by that knock

I would gladly take the worst bowlers in the world if it means we get to be number 1 instead of the phast and phurious bowlers who are stuck at number 7 since eternity.

 

[j_kazmi]

All the batsmen have been atrocious bar Kohli so it isn’t much of an achievement beating this Indian team at home.

The main reason why this series has been so completitive is becuase of how bad England’s batting has been.

Any other England team of the last 20 years would’ve destroyed the current Indian team.

 

[the_outsider]

All the batsmen have been atrocious bar Kohli so it isn’t much of an achievement beating this Indian team at home.

And yet, 3 out of the top 5 run scorers in the series are Indian.

The main reason why this series has been so competitive is because of how bad England's batting has been.

Against Pak - the best pace attack in the world - English batsmen averages:

Cook - 39
Root - 39
Buttler - 80

Against Indian trundlers:

Cook - 15
Root - 27
Butler - 37

Cook scored more runs (117) in just 3 innings against Pak than he has in 7 innings against Ind (109).

Maybe English batsmen haven't batted that poorly. Maybe, India just bowled well. Could be, right?

 

[Pakhs]

I would gladly take the worst bowlers in the world if it means we get to be number 1 instead of the phast and phurious bowlers who are stuck at number 7 since eternity.

India's number 1 status has been built around home condition and wicket of Ashwin and Jadeja. Jadeja actually has better figures than Ashwin at home but have not played one test away. How embarrassing is that?

Its widely acknowledged even before India became number ranked side that they were hard to beat at home so nothing new there. But they didnt win any series outside Asia before they became No 1 or even after. So which attack are you talking about? If you remember when Pak reached No.1 it was due to the series drawn against ENG in England and not home Wins.

 

[gazza619]

Well if you put into perspective the fact that the England top order 1, 2 & 3 hardly scores any runs, to still win is quite an achievement. Mind you this was India’s best set of fast bowlers ever.

So credit to England.
India must be kicking themselves. They should have been 2-1 up.

 

[Pakhs]

And yet, 3 out of the top 5 run scorers in the series are Indian.



Against Pak - the best pace attack in the world - English batsmen averages:

Cook - 39
Root - 39
Buttler - 80

Against Indian trundlers:

Cook - 15
Root - 27
Butler - 37

Cook scored more runs (117) in just 3 innings against Pak than he has in 7 innings against Ind (109).

Maybe English batsmen haven't batted that poorly. Maybe, India just bowled well. Could be, right?

India have not bowled better in England than Pak have in recent past. Pakistan were able to bowl out England and not just take wickets with the new ball when the bowl is moving around. Pak batsmen never scored a lot of runs in England but bowlers bowled England team out for even less. Where Indian bowlers even with the efforts of Kholi and Pujara haven't not been able to bowl out England batting line for lesser runs. Yes they have taken wickets at the top with the new ball when its been moving around for both teams but as soon as the bowl got older they couldn't take any wickets and were helplessly waiting for the second new ball to come around.

 

[TalhaSyed]

Think he's gone a bit far here.

India have won 7 test matches in England. They have played 61 matches and won 7. That means they have been unable to win almost 90% of their Test matches in England. They have lost 33 of those 61 matches.

Even in the last 5 years India have won 2 out of 9 Test matches - having lost 6 and drawn 1.

Beating a Test team like India in English conditions is no where near winning the Ashes. Stop trying to create ** hype for your team Bayliss.

If England had beaten India in India then it would have been somewhat note-worthy, however, England beating India in a Test series in England is meaningless.

If Kohli...sorry I mean India - had toppled England in this series it would have been considered an upset.

 

[Xoib]

And yet, 3 out of the top 5 run scorers in the series are Indian.



Against Pak - the best pace attack in the world - English batsmen averages:

Cook - 39
Root - 39
Buttler - 80

Against Indian trundlers:

Cook - 15
Root - 27
Butler - 37

Cook scored more runs (117) in just 3 innings against Pak than he has in 7 innings against Ind (109).

Maybe English batsmen haven't batted that poorly. Maybe, India just bowled well. Could be, right?

Yes but Pak got a 1-1 While India got smashed 3-1 that’s what counts

 

[j_kazmi]

And yet, 3 out of the top 5 run scorers in the series are Indian.



Against Pak - the best pace attack in the world - English batsmen averages:

Cook - 39
Root - 39
Buttler - 80

Against Indian trundlers:

Cook - 15
Root - 27
Butler - 37

Cook scored more runs (117) in just 3 innings against Pak than he has in 7 innings against Ind (109).

Maybe English batsmen haven't batted that poorly. Maybe, India just bowled well. Could be, right?

I’m not saying anything bad about Indian bowlers. They’ve been fantastic.

But England batsmen have been poor for a while. Not just Root and Cook but every one else collectively. Before Cook and Root pulled everyone else up (sort of like what Kohli is doing now) but now even they are failing.

All I was saying that beating this team isn’t a very big thing becuase the Indian batsmen have been poor maybe not as bad as the English batsmen but still bad.

If only the Indian batsmen played just a little bit better then the series could’ve still been alive.

 

[mak36]

Think he's gone a bit far here.

India have won 7 test matches in England. They have played 61 matches and won 7. That means they have been unable to win almost 90% of their Test matches in England. They have lost 33 of those 61 matches.

Even in the last 5 years India have won 2 out of 9 Test matches - having lost 6 and drawn 1.

Beating a Test team like India in English conditions is no where near winning the Ashes. Stop trying to create ** hype for your team Bayliss.

If England had beaten India in India then it would have been somewhat note-worthy, however, England beating India in a Test series in England is meaningless.

If Kohli...sorry I mean India - had toppled England in this series it would have been considered an upset.

Pretty much.

Also, Bayliss can't say this about Pakistan as he hasn't beaten them .

 

[Amir]

His comments will sting our fans, but they are true enough. India have been the benchmark in Test cricket for 2-3 years, and beating the most high profile team in the world is a big deal.

However, beating India in India remains the biggest challenge in the game today, but England should look to build on this success and gain some momentum. They have been very poor for a while now.

Its also because he can't say he beat Pakistan.

 

[Hasan123]

Winning the ashes is the biggest thing and most important thing in English test cricket. Bayliss should be proud of his team for winning this series despite having so many issues.

 

[TalhaSyed]

Pretty much.

Also, Bayliss can't say this about Pakistan as he hasn't beaten them .

Beating Pakistan would be like winning the Ashes in Australia and winning the World Cup

 

[Savak]

Indian posters mocking Pakistani bowling should not forget that the 2016 series was played on flat wickets and yet Pakistan achieved 2-2

 

[CadPakFan]

And yet, 3 out of the top 5 run scorers in the series are Indian.



Against Pak - the best pace attack in the world - English batsmen averages:

Cook - 39
Root - 39
Buttler - 80

Against Indian trundlers:

Cook - 15
Root - 27
Butler - 37

Cook scored more runs (117) in just 3 innings against Pak than he has in 7 innings against Ind (109).

Maybe English batsmen haven't batted that poorly. Maybe, India just bowled well. Could be, right?

I feel the Indian bowlers have bowled well to Butler and Root but I feel Cook is just not batting well.

 

[the_outsider]

Indian posters mocking Pakistani bowling should not forget that the 2016 series was played on flat wickets and yet Pakistan achieved 2-2

Wouldn't playing on flat wickets be easier for Asian teams? Asian batsmen play better on flat wickets and Asian bowlers are used to bowling on flat decks.

 

[Usman Chadda]

England have won their last three test series against India at home quite comprehensively. Not sure where this comes from. If they beat India in India, this statement would have been far more credible.

England can actually go one up from 2014, and beat India 4-1 while they managed 3-1 previously.

 

[the_outsider]

England have won their last three test series against India at home quite comprehensively. Not sure where this comes from. If they beat India in India, this statement would have been far more credible.

England can actually go one up from 2014, and beat India 4-1 while they managed 3-1 previously.

As biased fans, we will hardly have any true perspective of things.

But if the opposition camp themselves are saying this then they obviously aren't lying. It means Eng saw this Indian team as a major threat. Whatever the performance you think has been, whatever the scoreline reads, it's obvious that England saw this touring India team as a major challenge.

 

[Usman Chadda]

As biased fans, we will hardly have any true perspective of things.

But if the opposition camp themselves are saying this then they obviously aren't lying. It means Eng saw this Indian team as a major threat. Whatever the performance you think has been, whatever the scoreline reads, it's obvious that England saw this touring India team as a major challenge.

There’s no bias in my earlier post. England has a very good record against India at home since 2011. So equating beating India to the Ashes is surprising, but he is entitled to his opinion obviously.

Now if he comes up with “Hardik Pandya is one of the best all-rounders in the world”, I’ll know he’s off his rocker.

 

[the_outsider]

There’s no bias in my earlier post. England has a very good record against India at home since 2011. So equating beating India to the Ashes is surprising, but he is entitled to his opinion obviously.

Past records can mean very little sometimes, especially with major personnel changes.

For example, when Aus toured India in 2017, they had lost their last 2 series in India, losing 6 out of 8 games and winning 0.

India won that 2017 series as well but in my opinion, it was the toughest home series India has had in many years.

I would imagine it's a similar situation this time in England.

 

[cricketjoshila]

I agree, he may have only meant it in difficulty terms. But I live in England and only series English fans even talk about is Ashes they are mostly not bothered otherwise.

I will take the word of the English coach over yours.

 

[cricketjoshila]

India's number 1 status has been built around home condition and wicket of Ashwin and Jadeja. Jadeja actually has better figures than Ashwin at home but have not played one test away. How embarrassing is that?

Its widely acknowledged even before India became number ranked side that they were hard to beat at home so nothing new there. But they didnt win any series outside Asia before they became No 1 or even after. So which attack are you talking about? If you remember when Pak reached No.1 it was due to the series drawn against ENG in England and not home Wins.

So which test team has beaten India at home in last 5 years? All have come and have been smashed.

Regarding pakistan, well Pakistan has failed to even draw a test in Aus for over 20 years. Got whitewsshed at home by SL and lost tests to WI. They are currently ranked 7th. So they dont even come into this discussion.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Australian coach of English cricket team compares the test series win over India as equal to the Ashes.

But somehow pakistanis have a problem with it. God knows why.

 

[Cricfan4eva]

What this Indian team has shown is that if you give them an inch, they will pounce on you no matter the conditions.

And winning a hard fought test series against the number one side albeit at home is still an achievement.

 

[Mamoon]

Its also because he can't say he beat Pakistan.

He doesn’t have to. He said beating India is right up there with the Ashes because India is the number one team these days.

He has never played us when we were ranked one. In fact, we were ranked 7th when we played them earlier this summer.

His failure to beat Pakistan has no relevance to this discussion. Beating a 7th ranked team is not comparable to the Ashes.

 

[Mamoon]

Bayliss: beating India is a special feeling and it is right up there with the Ashes, because they are the number one ranked team.

Pakistani fans, wounded by his statement:

“That is because he cannot mention Pakistan since he has not beaten us hehehe”

Now that is some coping mechanism.

 

[Mamoon]

England have won their last three test series against India at home quite comprehensively. Not sure where this comes from. If they beat India in India, this statement would have been far more credible.

England can actually go one up from 2014, and beat India 4-1 while they managed 3-1 previously.

Don’t think you can equate this series to the previous ones. In 2011, England were the best Test team in the world along with South Africa, and were up against an over-the-hill Indian team.

In 2014, England were in poor form, but India were not very good either. They had a young team and the likes of Kohli, Pujara, Rahane were pretty raw, and Dhoni was pretty much done as a Test player.

This time around, England are in worse form than 2014 and India have been the number one team for a while, and pushed South Africa in South Africa to the brink.

This series was tougher for them than 2011 and 2014, and one of their best Test series wins in a while. The have shown a lot of resilience.

 

[Slim]

Of course, he is going to say that. After being unable to beat Pakistan at home twice, and after being unable to win the Ashes he would make big claims to compensate for the failures.

 

[Slim]

Bayliss: beating India is a special feeling and it is right up there with the Ashes, because they are the number one ranked team.

Pakistani fans, wounded by his statement:

“That is because he cannot mention Pakistan since he has not beaten us hehehe”

Now that is some coping mechanism.

Dont see any coping mechanism other than fact.

Bayliss is of course going to big up his series win because he is over compensating for his inability to win against Pakistan and England.

I would rather say its pure propoganda from Bayliss side for domestic consumption.

 

[Slim]

To put this into perspective:

Its similar to the Aussie coach claiming that beating Pakistan is equal to the Ashes when they have been beating us constantly.

Pakistani and Indian fans need to stop arguing. Its pure propoganda from Bayliss's camp to hide his obvious failures.

 

[Varun]

Does Bayliss always wear that floppy hat and sunglasses?

Never seen him without it.

 

[Mamoon]

Dont see any coping mechanism other than fact.

Bayliss is of course going to big up his series win because he is over compensating for his inability to win against Pakistan and England.

I would rather say its pure propoganda from Bayliss side for domestic consumption.

The only “fact” is that Pakistani fans are burning like coal because of what Bayliss has said.

What over-compensation? Winning against Pakistan means little anymore. We are not one of the top teams or one of the big boys anymore.

Beating India in this era means a hell of a lot more than beating Pakistan. England have been very inconsistent in Test cricket under Bayliss, but they have still managed to beat the likes of Australia, South Africa and India in England.

Teams that are bigger and better than Pakistan. Beating Pakistan is like beating New Zealand or Sri Lanka - it is great if you beat these teams, but you are not going to fret over not beating them if you have won against top-tier teams like Australia, India and South Africa.

The only over-compensation is in yours and other Pakistani fans’ heads who cannot come to terms with the reality that Pakistan is not that relevant anymore, and teams like England have bigger fish to fry than to worry about not being able to beat Pakistan.

If you can beat Australia, India and South Africa, no one really cares if you cannot beat a mid-level team like Pakistan.

 

[Mamoon]

To put this into perspective:

Its similar to the Aussie coach claiming that beating Pakistan is equal to the Ashes when they have been beating us constantly.

Pakistani and Indian fans need to stop arguing. Its pure propoganda from Bayliss's camp to hide his obvious failures.

It is the wrong perspective. If Pakistan become the number one ranked team for 2-3 years, beating them would be a big deal for any team.

Pakistan almost always go to Australia with a mediocre ranking and a mediocre reputation, which is why you don’t see such statements from the Australian camp.

 

[Usman Chadda]

Don’t think you can equate this series to the previous ones. In 2011, England were the best Test team in the world along with South Africa, and were up against an over-the-hill Indian team.

In 2014, England were in poor form, but India were not very good either. They had a young team and the likes of Kohli, Pujara, Rahane were pretty raw, and Dhoni was pretty much done as a Test player.

This time around, England are in worse form than 2014 and India have been the number one team for a while, and pushed South Africa in South Africa to the brink.

This series was tougher for them than 2011 and 2014, and one of their best Test series wins in a while. The have shown a lot of resilience.

So basically you are saying Bayliss considers this win as big as the Ashes since he knows England are rubbish and they somehow managed to win against a side that they have dominated at home in the recent past? Yep, still don’t get where Bayliss is coming from. At the end of the day, through all the moral victories for India, the scoreline might read 4-1, which will be a worse thrashing than in 2014.

 

[Slim]

It is the wrong perspective. If Pakistan become the number one ranked team for 2-3 years, beating them would be a big deal for any team.

Pakistan almost always go to Australia with a mediocre ranking and a mediocre reputation, which is why you don’t see such statements from the Australian camp.

Look at you all pumped up and energized, you really feed off this stuff.

I prefer to believe my reasons, thanks.

 

[Kohli The King of Chase]

You losers lost Ashes now, don't try to make up for it.

Ind-Eng series is nowhere near Ashes. Bayliss is already looking for reasons, as Eng may well end up losing next Ashes at home. Obviously Aus won't bat like our tailenders(apart from Kohli) and, bowl much better than us.

These coaches are looking to save their jobs and add as an achievement to their CVs.

Shastri: Best touring team in 15 years and, now Bayliss.

 

[Canford Cliffs]

What I find hilarious is when online posters who perhaps never touched a cricket bat try to downplay statements from players/coaches.

Butler said IPL helped me regain my test place. Posters here...he didnt mean it, he was just saying for the sake of it...bla bla. Now same for Bayliss. Hoe can he equate holy Ashes with Ind series, why is he not talking about Pak series etc.

Why it is so difficult to accept what the professionals are saying and move on??

 

[the_outsider]

I prefer to believe my reasons, thanks.

That is why you fail.


It's always amusing to me when our neighbours feel insecure about India gaining importance in the world.

Australia hasn't won a test series in Eng since 2002 but I can guarantee you that they take that series far more seriously than Pak tours.

Don't buy your own hype, guys. Stay grounded.

 

[Usman Chadda]

What I find hilarious is when online posters who perhaps never touched a cricket bat try to downplay statements from players/coaches.

Butler said IPL helped me regain my test place. Posters here...he didnt mean it, he was just saying for the sake of it...bla bla. Now same for Bayliss. Hoe can he equate holy Ashes with Ind series, why is he not talking about Pak series etc.

Why it is so difficult to accept what the professionals are saying and move on??

I guess Michael Holding hasn't touched a cricket bat in his life too.

 

[the_outsider]

I guess Michael Holding hasn't touched a cricket bat in his life too.

You mean the same Holding who has compared Kohli with Viv?

Yeah what about him?

 

[Slim]

That is why you fail.


It's always amusing to me when our neighbours feel insecure about India gaining importance in the world.

Australia hasn't won a test series in Eng since 2002 but I can guarantee you that they take that series far more seriously than Pak tours.

Don't buy your own hype, guys. Stay grounded.

Look buddy, its you lot who need validation from others to feel your growing importance. We smash England at home and dont get beaten by them when we visit them. You do you, if you prefer getting smashed in England and being compared to Ashes as some victory after all you are the champions of moral victories.

 

[Mamoon]

So basically you are saying Bayliss considers this win as big as the Ashes since he knows England are rubbish and they somehow managed to win against a side that they have dominated at home in the recent past? Yep, still don’t get where Bayliss is coming from. At the end of the day, through all the moral victories for India, the scoreline might read 4-1, which will be a worse thrashing than in 2014.

Past performances have little significance on current standing. If Pakistan become a top class Test side and occupy the number one ranking for a few years, would Australia say that beating them is not a big deal because they have trashed them for two decades?

India are better than England now and have been the standout Test team for a couple of years. Even in England, quite a few people thought that India would win this series, so no wonder Bayliss considers it a big achievement for this team.

 

[the_outsider]

Look buddy, its you lot who need validation from others to feel your growing importance. We smash England at home and dont get beaten by them when we visit them. You do you, if you prefer getting smashed in England and being compared to Ashes as some victory after all you are the champions of moral victories.

The number 1 ranked team doesn't need validation, pal. They already have the Mace. Take that away from us if you can.

But you be happy with your draws in Eng. After all, it's the only place in the world where Pakistan can win tests.

 

[Usman Chadda]

You mean the same Holding who has compared Kohli with Viv?

Yeah what about him?

An Indian telling us to take the word of professionals while thrashing Holding’s views on anything cricket. Ironic, that’s all.

 

[Canford Cliffs]

I guess Michael Holding hasn't touched a cricket bat in his life too.

Holding was giving his opinion on other players from different teams. Opinions can be challenged and debated. Butler and Bayliss was talking about himself and his team respectively. It was not an opinion.

 

[Usman Chadda]

Past performances have little significance on current standing. If Pakistan become a top class Test side and occupy the number one ranking for a few years, would Australia say that beating them is not a big deal because they have trashed them for two decades?

India are better than England now and have been the standout Test team for a couple of years. Even in England, quite a few people thought that India would win this series, so no wonder Bayliss considers it a big achievement for this team.

I’m certain Justin Langer won’t say beating Pakistan is as good as winning the Ashes. India is the number one test team in the world, but nothing in their recent overseas performances suggest they have improved away. India was better on their last tour to England, when they were leading the series 1-0 going into the 3rd test.

 

[Pakhs]

I will take the word of the English coach over yours.

England Aus coach dont speak for the whole English Nation! He meant it in terms of difficulty which i agree as Aus teams in recent times have been smashed in England easily about the same difficulty level as this Indian side.

I am a premier level cricketer in England and we dont even talk about it.

 

[Usman Chadda]

Holding was giving his opinion on other players from different teams. Opinions can be challenged and debated. Butler and Bayliss was talking about himself and his team respectively. It was not an opinion.

Bayliss’ statement is also an opinion. The point was about taking the word of professionals over the arm-chair critics over here.

 

[the_outsider]

An Indian telling us to take the word of professionals while thrashing Holding’s views on anything cricket. Ironic, that’s all.

But since you were defending Holding with your life in the other thread, you have no choice but to defend Bayliss too.

Otherwise people will call you a hypocrite.

 

[the_outsider]

Bayliss’ statement is also an opinion. The point was about taking the word of professionals over the arm-chair critics over here.

opinions are formed by third parties, who are watching from afar. Not by people who are actually playing the game.

 

[Pakhs]

opinions are formed by third parties, who are watching from afar. Not by people who are actually playing the game.

Didnt realise bayliss plays the game.

 

[the_outsider]

Didnt realise bayliss plays the game.

If you're questioning the coach's involvement then I am highly suspicious of this statement from you.

I am a premier level cricketer in England.

 

[Pakhs]

If you're questioning the coach's involvement then I am highly suspicious of this statement from you.

You should correct the statement he doesnt play the game. He actually was never a great cricketer. He is a coach who said the win against India is on par with Ashes (so on par with beating Aus) which is fair enough because it probably is. But to say he meant its equally as important for English cricket fans then you have no knowledge of cricket fans in this cricket. Cricket is not a number 1 sport in England not even top 3. And most people only care about the Ashes simply because its against Australia who i a traditional rival in other things as well. Otherwise when it comes to strictly cricket its not a huge issue.

 

[the_outsider]

You should correct the statement he doesnt play the game. He actually was never a great cricketer. He is a coach who said the win against India is on par with Ashes (so on par with beating Aus) which is fair enough because it probably is. But to say he meant its equally as important for English cricket fans then you have no knowledge of cricket fans in this cricket. Cricket is not a number 1 sport in England not even top 3. And most people only care about the Ashes simply because its against Australia who i a traditional rival in other things as well. Otherwise when it comes to strictly cricket its not a huge issue.

I am sure Bayliss wasn't speaking on behalf of the English population. He was speaking on behalf of the England cricket team. It's as simple as that.

I don't understand why you keep bringing up public perception. In any case, the majority of cricket audience don't even watch test matches so obviously they don't care.

 

[Pakhs]

I am sure Bayliss wasn't speaking on behalf of the English population. He was speaking on behalf of the England cricket team. It's as simple as that.

I don't understand why you keep bringing up public perception. In any case, the majority of cricket audience don't even watch test matches so obviously they don't care.

Asian and Australian public do care, And judging by the posts in this thread it seems Pak fans cared about this series more than even England fans did. Anyway what people often miss about English cricket is if not for Ashes cricket would have died in this country long way back.

 

[Usman Chadda]

But since you were defending Holding with your life in the other thread, you have no choice but to defend Bayliss too.

Otherwise people will call you a hypocrite.

Irony. An Indian calling me a hypocrite.

I think you’ve confused me with someone else, nowhere have I defended Holding “with all my life”. But I do respect the views of professionals. Already stated I respect Bayliss’ opinion, but doesn’t mean I cannot give my own thoughts on it. Much better than blasting the person and terming him as a ‘hater’ like you lot have recently

 

[the_outsider]

Irony. An Indian calling me a hypocrite.

I think you’ve confused me with someone else, nowhere have I defended Holding “with all my life”. But I do respect the views of professionals. Already stated I respect Bayliss’ opinion, but doesn’t mean I cannot give my own thoughts on it. Much better than blasting the person and terming him as a ‘hater’ like you lot have recently

Then let me quote you from the thread of Holding on Pandya

"Absolutely nothing wrong with what Holding has said."

Here is the link for your reference.

http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/s...n-boy-in-this-team-quot-Michael-Holding/page3

Now, I agree with both you and Holding on Pandya.

But you seem to have gone from "absolutely nothing with Holding..." to "Bayliss’ statement is also an opinion. The point was about taking the word of professionals over the arm-chair critics over here." in this thread.

I guess Holding only says "facts" and Bayliss only has "opinions".

Talk about bias...

 

[Usman Chadda]

Then let me quote you from the thread of Holding on Pandya

"Absolutely nothing wrong with what Holding has said."

Here is the link for your reference.

http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/s...n-boy-in-this-team-quot-Michael-Holding/page3

Now, I agree with both you and Holding on Pandya.

But you seem to have gone from "absolutely nothing with Holding..." to "Bayliss’ statement is also an opinion. The point was about taking the word of professionals over the arm-chair critics over here." in this thread.

I guess Holding only says "facts" and Bayliss only has "opinions".

Talk about bias...

As I said I have a right to put my thoughts into words on what either Holding or Bayliss have said. I found nothing wrong with what Holding said, while I don’t understand where Bayliss is coming from when he made this comment hence me posts in this thread. That does not mean, I think, what Holding said is factual while what Bayliss said is rubbish.

It’s not so hard to understand that I’ve had to break it down for you. Now if I start dissecting the Indian fans’ reaction in that thread, a lot of people here will be thoroughly educated in the meaning of the word ‘hypocrisy’.

 

[cricketjoshila]

England Aus coach dont speak for the whole English Nation! He meant it in terms of difficulty which i agree as Aus teams in recent times have been smashed in England easily about the same difficulty level as this Indian side.

I am a premier level cricketer in England and we dont even talk about it.

Lot of people are lot of things on online forums.

You can claim anything you want.but The voice of the Aussie english coach carries more weight than any anonymous online user.

 

[RainMan_]

Don't really know why he's giving so much importance to this victory.

England have been routinely hammering India and this series wasn't any different either.

Looks like he's trying to cheer up the visitors. If that's the case, then I appreciate his kind words.

 

[TalhaSyed]

Don't really know why he's giving so much importance to this victory.

England have been routinely hammering India and this series wasn't any different either.

Looks like he's trying to cheer up the visitors. If that's the case, then I appreciate his kind words.

Exactly my thoughts.

I think it is Bayliss just wanting to make it sound like his team has achieved something amazing, when actually his team has just done what past English teams has been doing for decades.

Also by comparing it to the Ashes he is wanting English fans to think "Oh we may have got trashed 4-0 in the Ashes - but we beat the Indians so that makes up for it!!" but as a matter of fact - beating India in a Test series in England pales in comparison to winning the Ashes & is completely meaningless.

If India managed to some how beat England THAT would have been a big deal and would have been considered an upset.

 

[RainMan_]

Exactly my thoughts.

I think it is Bayliss just wanting to make it sound like his team has achieved something amazing, when actually his team has just done what past English teams has been doing for decades.

Also by comparing it to the Ashes he is wanting English fans to think "Oh we may have got trashed 4-0 in the Ashes - but we beat the Indians so that makes up for it!!" but as a matter of fact - beating India in a Test series in England pales in comparison to winning the Ashes & is completely meaningless.

If India managed to some how beat England THAT would have been a big deal and would have been considered an upset.

Spot on. Beating India outside Asia isn't a difficult task. Every team hammers India for fun outside Asia since its too damn easy to do. In my personal opinion, from now on teams like England Australia and SA should start resting their key players whenever India visits them to make the series more competitive. I think even [MENTION=147270]the_outsider[/MENTION] will agree with it.

 

[Robert]

I thought India were going to win this series fairly easily.

 

[the_outsider]

]

Spot on. Beating India outside Asia isn't a difficult task. Every team hammers India for fun outside Asia since its too damn easy to do. In my personal opinion, from now on teams like England Australia and SA should start resting their key players whenever India visits them to make the series more competitive. I think even [MENTION=147270]the_outsider[/MENTION] will agree with it.

Funny how you have time to tag me here but continue to run away from every post I tag you in. Bit cowardly, don't you think?

 

[Pakhs]

Lot of people are lot of things on online forums.

You can claim anything you want.but The voice of the Aussie english coach carries more weight than any anonymous online user.

Where is the disagreement here? I said he was comparing Aussies team with India's as both the teams folded about the same in England.

 

[Muddaser]

Words of comfort from Trevor Bayliss.

Indians are probably feeling better lol.