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[VIDEOS] Naseem Shah - A failed experiment?

More he plays better for future of Pakistan cricket, he is a quick learner, much improved bowler since he last played for Pakistan.
 
You answered your own question. Archer won his country a World Cup. What has Naseem done?

What has Archer to be disrespected like this?

Why would you compare a World Cup winner to an abject failure?

So performing in ODIs makes him the best Test bowler in the world despite his rubbish performance?

So if Naseem performs in the T20 World Cup this year it automatically changes how his Test numbers are perceived?
 
So performing in ODIs makes him the best Test bowler in the world despite his rubbish performance?

So if Naseem performs in the T20 World Cup this year it automatically changes how his Test numbers are perceived?

Not sure, what you are going on about. Archer not only won his country a world cup, he performed admirably in his debut test series in a high pressure Ashes series against some of the best test batsmen in the world.

Naseem on the other hand averages 45 with the ball at an economy rate of 3.8. he averages like 70 against most of the top teams. No comparison between him and Archer.
 
Even Shahid Nazir was far better bowler than Naseem. Such a rubbish bowler.
 
Not sure, what you are going on about. Archer not only won his country a world cup, he performed admirably in his debut test series in a high pressure Ashes series against some of the best test batsmen in the world.

Naseem on the other hand averages 45 with the ball at an economy rate of 3.8. he averages like 70 against most of the top teams. No comparison between him and Archer.

Archer 'winning his country a World Cup' is a myth, he performed brilliantly but he wasn't the top 3 reasons they won. And as for his debut series. He was great in one Test match where his bowling had any consequence. He bowled some amazing bouncers, that's definitely his specialty. And what about since then? How long is Archer going to be given a long rope over what happened 3 years ago. Since then he has been awful or injured.

While Naseem is a young bowler who has had some good performances (against weak opposition) and is learning.
 
So performing in ODIs makes him the best Test bowler in the world despite his rubbish performance?

So if Naseem performs in the T20 World Cup this year it automatically changes how his Test numbers are perceived?

Archer isn’t the best Test bowler in the world. In my opinion, Cummins is the best Test bowler in the world.

However, if you take all three formats into consideration, I would argue that a fit Archer is the best fast bowler around.

If someone disputes that opinion based on the fact that Archer hasn’t had a great series after the Ashes, it would be perfectly reasonable.

However, what I don’t understand is using Naseem to put down Archer. This comparison always makes me laugh because of how random it is.

Naseem is a complete nobody. He is a rubbish bowler with zero achievements to his name against the big sides. He cannot even get into the white ball team.

Even if Archer retires today and Naseem plays for another 10 years, I doubt if he would ever merit a comparison because Archer’s 2019 alone will probably remain bigger than anything that Naseem will ever do in his career looking at how rubbish his bowling is.

A World Cup winning bowler like Archer does not deserve this disrespect. Compare Naseem to bowlers who are in his category. For example, bowlers from Bangladesh, Zimbabwe, Nepal, UAE etc.
 
Naseem's inexperience proving to be his downfall in this match. He already had his work cut out for him against a high-quality batting line-up on an absolutely docile and lifeless pitch, but his wayward line and length has not helped him out at all.

I think he is best served being the third seamer, rather than one of the new ball bowlers. He is not developed enough yet to carry the bowling.

That said, he has bowled beautifully this morning and seems to be learning from his mistakes from yesterday...which is certainly a positive.
 
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His tendency to bowl one bad ball every over is letting him down. It’s a flat wicket, just look to bowl consistently at the right lengths. There is no ‘stock’ length for Naseem, it’s either too full or too short.
 
He has been unlucky i mean people do have high expectations

The expectations are high because of the amount of hype he has in addition to the over the top statements that he made.

It is good to be confident but when you are overconfident without achieving anything, it will haunt you know when you backfire.

There is nothing going for him at this level. He has very little talent and skill if anyone, he concedes a boundary every over which explains his embarrassing economy rate against the big teams, and when he bowls a good delivery every now and then and draws an edge, it doesn’t carry because he is short.

So not only is he restricted by his lack of ability and bowling intelligence, he also restricted by his height. Pakistan needs to look elsewhere because it is never going to work out for him.
 
There reality is that there is a lot of emotional investment in Naseem. PCB created hype for him by faking his age and the fans bought into the hype and saw a future star in him, so now all we get are excuses because they cannot come to terms with the bitter reality that he is not and will not be the bowler they hoped for.

Even the commentators hyped him in Australia in 2019 because PCB lied about his age and not because the quality of his bowling.

The idea that a 16 year old was bowling at a very decent pace and playing Test cricket excited many, but the reality is that he was 16 in 2016 which means that he is pretty much the same age as Shaheen, who is several notches above him in terms of talent, skill, mentality and is also blessed with physical characteristics.
 
You're not a fast bowler if you cannot swing the ball which in naseem's case is unfortunately true
 
There reality is that there is a lot of emotional investment in Naseem. PCB created hype for him by faking his age and the fans bought into the hype and saw a future star in him, so now all we get are excuses because they cannot come to terms with the bitter reality that he is not and will not be the bowler they hoped for.

Even the commentators hyped him in Australia in 2019 because PCB lied about his age and not because the quality of his bowling.

The idea that a 16 year old was bowling at a very decent pace and playing Test cricket excited many, but the reality is that he was 16 in 2016 which means that he is pretty much the same age as Shaheen, who is several notches above him in terms of talent, skill, mentality and is also blessed with physical characteristics.

There was hype initially - 16 years of course was a stretch, I don’t think anyone for one minute believed he was actually 16. But it was clear he was still in his late teens. 16 or 19 or even 21, to bowl 147k at either age is pretty special. Hence the hype.

A lot of the hype was also because (contrary to the opinions of non pakistani commentators) of the dearth of fast bowlers coming out of pakistan.

There’s no harm fans getting excited for a young bowler who bowls 90mph.

It is abundantly clear he has a lot to learn, I think most people accept that. Beyond that a lot of people are wishing a young bowler well. Why not?

I don’t understand the vitriol
 
There was hype initially - 16 years of course was a stretch, I don’t think anyone for one minute believed he was actually 16. But it was clear he was still in his late teens. 16 or 19 or even 21, to bowl 147k at either age is pretty special. Hence the hype.

A lot of the hype was also because (contrary to the opinions of non pakistani commentators) of the dearth of fast bowlers coming out of pakistan.

There’s no harm fans getting excited for a young bowler who bowls 90mph.

It is abundantly clear he has a lot to learn, I think most people accept that. Beyond that a lot of people are wishing a young bowler well. Why not?

I don’t understand the vitriol

Maybe he has more haters then expected at this stage because his hardcore fans have put him on such a high pedestal, apparently he is already better then Archer and more proven at the highest level across all forms.

I don’t think Pakistan have done Naseem any favours by blindly throwing him at the deep end, it will work for a few but wouldn’t he be better served getting more FC experience. Hopefully he comes back stronger in this Test but either way Pakistan should take their time with him, am not sure why Hasan Ali wasn’t picked, he has been more suited to this format as of late
 
He has improved. Need to keep him with the team in developing and working more on his variations and lines. The pitch in this test match is not going any good to him either.
 
Archer isn’t the best Test bowler in the world. In my opinion, Cummins is the best Test bowler in the world.

However, if you take all three formats into consideration, I would argue that a fit Archer is the best fast bowler around.

If someone disputes that opinion based on the fact that Archer hasn’t had a great series after the Ashes, it would be perfectly reasonable.

However, what I don’t understand is using Naseem to put down Archer. This comparison always makes me laugh because of how random it is.

Naseem is a complete nobody. He is a rubbish bowler with zero achievements to his name against the big sides. He cannot even get into the white ball team.

Even if Archer retires today and Naseem plays for another 10 years, I doubt if he would ever merit a comparison because Archer’s 2019 alone will probably remain bigger than anything that Naseem will ever do in his career looking at how rubbish his bowling is.

A World Cup winning bowler like Archer does not deserve this disrespect. Compare Naseem to bowlers who are in his category. For example, bowlers from Bangladesh, Zimbabwe, Nepal, UAE etc.

Well, the stares he is giving to the batsman after almost every ball and running towards them doesn't give the impression he being nobody. Unless of course someone opens the scoresheet and see his test match stats.
 
Well, the stares he is giving to the batsman after almost every ball and running towards them doesn't give the impression he being nobody. Unless of course someone opens the scoresheet and see his test match stats.

Lol, he was doing the same in PSL as well, there he had a fight with Khushdil Shah. Somebody needs to tell him that you don't have to stare the batsman after almost every good ball.
 
Lovely ball to remove Carey

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There’s no consistency to his bowling, it’s one good ball followed by 2-3 rubbish ones. The pace is there, the ability to seam the ball is definitely there, just needs to find that ‘stock’ length he can revert to when things are not going his way rather than going too short or too full all the time.
 
That was a beauty to remove Carey

He’s not been the worst but has leaked runs
 
Every pacer has struggled to take wickets in this match. It is a dead wicket after all.

However, he is the only pacer to go over 4 an over. All other pacers have kept their economy rates below 3.

In his last series in New Zealand, he bowled the most expensive spell in history (min. 25 overs).

He has played in Australia, England, New Zealand and Pakistan - he has struggled to take wickets against all big teams home and away.

Regardless of the conditions, his mediocrity remains constant and he is always expensive. Pretty much guaranteed to conceded a boundary ever over.

Horrendous bowler. The hype makes me laugh.
 
Not sure about whether he will be able to survive in test cricket. He bowls a good delivery every now and then but leaks faar too many runs.
 
4 more wickets to take tomorrow at the tail

Let’s see if he can redeem himself
 
Good bowling from him today. The usual jokers will go on and on about him being rubbish, but they did the same for Shaheen when he debuted for Lahore, then did the same again when he started playing for Pakistan. After a few years to find his feet, now Shaheen is the number 1 bowler in the world.

These young players need time to grow, in pakistan cricket we don't give them any time, and throw them in the deep end. On this dead pitch he has been way more threatening than any of the Australian pace bowlers.
 
Watched him bowl late in the day today
Not bad
But if hassan ali gets fit
He will probably sit out at this stage
 
He is not test cricket ready at this stage but this match is not the reason ,he has looked the most threatening among all 5 quicks that have played this game.
His main problem is giving one soft boundary ball every over it waxs the same case with Sami hence he never turned potential in to success it can happen to Naseem as well if he does not sort it out.
 
Why would you judge him based on this highway . No bowler has looked good here , he just needs consistency , has enough wicket taking potential.
 
Why would you judge him based on this highway . No bowler has looked good here , he just needs consistency , has enough wicket taking potential.

Mamoon has given multiple examples of where Naseem has failed, and at least half of those were in pace friendly conditions.
 
All the pacers struggled on this pitch. Even Aussie pacers struggled.

Therefore, this Rawalpindi pitch should not be used to judge a pacer.
 
Every one will be silenced when he pick ups 3 or 4 wickets by day end. Just wait and watch.

Narrator: At the end of the day's play, Naseem Shah ended with a solitary wicket after conceding 89 runs, at a near-ODI ER of 4.23.
 
His tendency to bowl one bad ball every over is letting him down. It’s a flat wicket, just look to bowl consistently at the right lengths.
There is no ‘stock’ length for Naseem, it’s either too full or too short.

Short summary there.. he is overhyped and overrated.. Not ready yet for international test cricket..

They will go with Haris rauf in the next test and it will be the repeat of same mistake in this test going with Naseem.. Both Naseem and Haris need to play more FC to earn a test call up.. Unfortunately PPT selector is clueless..:jk

Bowling in test cricket is an art , need to master those skills before stepping into the job..
 
Why would you judge him based on this highway . No bowler has looked good here , he just needs consistency , has enough wicket taking potential.

Look at their RPO and look at Naseems ... He consistently leaked atleast 1 boundary in his over
 
Good bowling from him today. The usual jokers will go on and on about him being rubbish, but they did the same for Shaheen when he debuted for Lahore, then did the same again when he started playing for Pakistan. After a few years to find his feet, now Shaheen is the number 1 bowler in the world.

These young players need time to grow, in pakistan cricket we don't give them any time, and throw them in the deep end. On this dead pitch he has been way more threatening than any of the Australian pace bowlers.

Shaheen number 1 bowler in the world?
 
Can’t blame Shah for the hopeless pace bowling stocks and the clueless selectors and management.

But Shah’s very raw, should be nowhere near the team at this stage. Let him develop in domestics. Can’t afford to leak so many runs.
 
Maybe he has more haters then expected at this stage because his hardcore fans have put him on such a high pedestal, apparently he is already better then Archer and more proven at the highest level across all forms.

I don’t think Pakistan have done Naseem any favours by blindly throwing him at the deep end, it will work for a few but wouldn’t he be better served getting more FC experience. Hopefully he comes back stronger in this Test but either way Pakistan should take their time with him, am not sure why Hasan Ali wasn’t picked, he has been more suited to this format as of late

I don’t know why anyone would compare him to Archer or use Archer as a measuring stick. Archer himself has much to prove anyway - most of all whether he even has a test future.

Naseem has shown glimpses of potential in this match, I think he’s bowled ok in these conditions.

Tough to compare him to 3 seasoned veterans like Cummins, Starc and Hazlewood.

Should Naseem be down in the pecking order? Yes, and he is. Hassan Ali and Rauf were unavailable for some reason so it’s fair he got the nod for this test
 
I don’t know why anyone would compare him to Archer or use Archer as a measuring stick. Archer himself has much to prove anyway - most of all whether he even has a test future.

Naseem has shown glimpses of potential in this match, I think he’s bowled ok in these conditions.

Tough to compare him to 3 seasoned veterans like Cummins, Starc and Hazlewood.

Should Naseem be down in the pecking order? Yes, and he is. Hassan Ali and Rauf were unavailable for some reason so it’s fair he got the nod for this test

Sense, at last.
 
I don’t know why anyone would compare him to Archer or use Archer as a measuring stick. Archer himself has much to prove anyway - most of all whether he even has a test future.

Naseem has shown glimpses of potential in this match, I think he’s bowled ok in these conditions.

Tough to compare him to 3 seasoned veterans like Cummins, Starc and Hazlewood.

Should Naseem be down in the pecking order? Yes, and he is. Hassan Ali and Rauf were unavailable for some reason so it’s fair he got the nod for this test

Its an abject failure of the thick tank. How is it fair that Shah who is only a kid is getting the nod ahead of others who may have been working hard in domestics and FC cricket?

Its not as if his stats have been absolutely amazing, that there’s a desperation to play him.

I understand this was an experiment but its an experiment that should have been canned a long time ago.
 
I don’t know why anyone would compare him to Archer or use Archer as a measuring stick. Archer himself has much to prove anyway - most of all whether he even has a test future.

Naseem has shown glimpses of potential in this match, I think he’s bowled ok in these conditions.

Tough to compare him to 3 seasoned veterans like Cummins, Starc and Hazlewood.

Should Naseem be down in the pecking order? Yes, and he is. Hassan Ali and Rauf were unavailable for some reason so it’s fair he got the nod for this test

The comparison with Archer is to show the different yardsticks with which certain posters of here rate young pakistani talent vs players from the Big 3.

Take Hassan Ali for example. He won Pakistan a Champions trophy, he was the number ODI bowler and after the injury has come back as an incredible Test match bowler who has taken a lot of wickets in different conditions. Yet no one would rightly call him among the best in the world yet, but on the other hand he gets a lot of hate for his poor performances.

Jofra had performed in the World Cup and a couple of tests at home and suddenly he’s been put on a pedestal.

Naseem has shown potential, has incredible pace (he was faster than Archer when they played the same match) and has better fitness. He has struggled in tough conditions and is clearly not ready for Test cricket. But the hate he’s getting in this thread simply because he’s pakistani is unbelievable.

Ofcourse Archer > Naseem right now, but the way they’re being discussed is like you’re comparing Brian Lara with Faisal Iqbal.
 
I don’t know why anyone would compare him to Archer or use Archer as a measuring stick. Archer himself has much to prove anyway - most of all whether he even has a test future.

Naseem has shown glimpses of potential in this match, I think he’s bowled ok in these conditions.

Tough to compare him to 3 seasoned veterans like Cummins, Starc and Hazlewood.

Should Naseem be down in the pecking order? Yes, and he is. Hassan Ali and Rauf were unavailable for some reason so it’s fair he got the nod for this test

Archer has fitness issues it’s true but he has been more successful then Naseem across all forms, I don’t know why Naseem is rated more then him? if it’s based on hypothetical scenarios and potential that’s something else or those who believe he genuinely has done significantly better are delusional.

When he is being picked to play Tests at the highest level the scrutiny is understandable but also management should be questioned because they feel the guy can deliver right now, maybe they know something we don’t and he will show his capabilities in this series
 
11 first class games.. Better to select experience bowlers here.

He was selected again based on PSL performance.
 
Archer has fitness issues it’s true but he has been more successful then Naseem across all forms, I don’t know why Naseem is rated more then him? if it’s based on hypothetical scenarios and potential that’s something else or those who believe he genuinely has done significantly better are delusional.

When he is being picked to play Tests at the highest level the scrutiny is understandable but also management should be questioned because they feel the guy can deliver right now, maybe they know something we don’t and he will show his capabilities in this series

Who rates Naseem higher than Archer?

The only issue is why Naseem is treated so harshly while someone like Archer is still considered the best (even mentioned by commentators) despite bowling just as badly as Naseem for almost 3 years (when he hasn’t been injured ofcourse).
 
Archer has fitness issues it’s true but he has been more successful then Naseem across all forms, I don’t know why Naseem is rated more then him? if it’s based on hypothetical scenarios and potential that’s something else or those who believe he genuinely has done significantly better are delusional.

When he is being picked to play Tests at the highest level the scrutiny is understandable but also management should be questioned because they feel the guy can deliver right now, maybe they know something we don’t and he will show his capabilities in this series

Who rates him higher than Archer? It hasn’t even crossed my mind! It’s a completely irrelevant comparison. Archer is mainly known for his exploits with the white ball. Naseem hasn’t played a white ball international game!

In tests, Archer’s only claim to fame is flooring Steve Smith and bowling well in a couple of other matches and some other pedestrian performances where his own countrymen were criticising (unfairly probably) about his attitude
 
Who rates Naseem higher than Archer?

The only issue is why Naseem is treated so harshly while someone like Archer is still considered the best (even mentioned by commentators) despite bowling just as badly as Naseem for almost 3 years (when he hasn’t been injured ofcourse).

Who rates him higher than Archer? It hasn’t even crossed my mind! It’s a completely irrelevant comparison. Archer is mainly known for his exploits with the white ball. Naseem hasn’t played a white ball international game!

In tests, Archer’s only claim to fame is flooring Steve Smith and bowling well in a couple of other matches and some other pedestrian performances where his own countrymen were criticising (unfairly probably) about his attitude

Do you guys believe Naseem is at the same level as Archer in terms of success across all forms domestic and international ?
 
Its an abject failure of the thick tank. How is it fair that Shah who is only a kid is getting the nod ahead of others who may have been working hard in domestics and FC cricket?

Its not as if his stats have been absolutely amazing, that there’s a desperation to play him.

I understand this was an experiment but its an experiment that should have been canned a long time ago.

The thick tank (I like it!) are pretty clueless at the best of times but in this instance I’m not quite sure who you want to play instead? Especially as Hassan and Rauf were unavailable.

Tabish Khan? That ship has sailed - unfairly and harshly treated in the past but there’s no need to go back there now

Abbas? You might as well pick another spinner. Maybe 3-4 years ago, but he is absolutely useless now.

Hasnain - banned

In this instance probably better getting Naseem some more exposure than taking on some older bowlers. I would have probably preferred Dahani, but the arguments against Naseem also apply to him too.

If Hassan is fit next game and Naseem is selected instead then that’s ridiculous but for this match don’t see much wrong with the selection. Limited options
 
The thick tank (I like it!) are pretty clueless at the best of times but in this instance I’m not quite sure who you want to play instead? Especially as Hassan and Rauf were unavailable.

Tabish Khan? That ship has sailed - unfairly and harshly treated in the past but there’s no need to go back there now

Abbas? You might as well pick another spinner. Maybe 3-4 years ago, but he is absolutely useless now.

Hasnain - banned

In this instance probably better getting Naseem some more exposure than taking on some older bowlers. I would have probably preferred Dahani, but the arguments against Naseem also apply to him too.

If Hassan is fit next game and Naseem is selected instead then that’s ridiculous but for this match don’t see much wrong with the selection. Limited options

Was there really no one else, I wouldn’t have thought Abbas is a bad short term option in this scenario.

Am not sure what figures Naseem had for today as some said he bowled well?

But if he is getting absolutely shafted by a world class line up on a motorway, it can be damaging for a young players confidence. If he were getting some exposure playing SL, BD or WI there would be a better case for picking him perhaps
 
The only person holding Archer to any sort of a standard is [MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION]

The rest of the world sees him for exactly who he is. An overrated and injury-prone bowler who has done nothing to establish himself in test cricket. And someone who will likely have a short and unfulfilled career in which he fails to meet the lofty expectations people had from him.

Comparing him to Naseem is laughable because Naseem actually has a future.
 
Was there really no one else, I wouldn’t have thought Abbas is a bad short term option in this scenario.

Am not sure what figures Naseem had for today as some said he bowled well?

But if he is getting absolutely shafted by a world class line up on a motorway, it can be damaging for a young players confidence. If he were getting some exposure playing SL, BD or WI there would be a better case for picking him perhaps

He was quite wayward yesterday but bowled very well today. His line and length was tight but attacking. And ofcourse his pace always adds an extra element.

Unfortunately because the pitch is so lifeless even edges that would have gone to first slip on any normal pitch, were dropping short of the slip fielders and going to the boundary.

Another reason his figures are not that good is because yesterday he and Shaheen came out bowling very attacking line and lengths with the new ball. Lots of bouncers and quick deliveries near the off-stump. But again, the problem with that strategy is that it always results in boundaries.

n any other pitch, both he and Shaheen would have had multiple wickets by now.
 
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Was there really no one else, I wouldn’t have thought Abbas is a bad short term option in this scenario.

Am not sure what figures Naseem had for today as some said he bowled well?

But if he is getting absolutely shafted by a world class line up on a motorway, it can be damaging for a young players confidence. If he were getting some exposure playing SL, BD or WI there would be a better case for picking him perhaps

Abbas is extremely poor now. He’s bowling the pace Graham gooch and Sourav Ganguly used to bowl.

Cue the “pace is not everything” brigade. Everyone knows this, but there’s got to be a minimum. Bowling 70mph is an embarrassment
 
Do you guys believe Naseem is at the same level as Archer in terms of success across all forms domestic and international ?

What is the obsession with Archer anyway? Pointless and useless comparison. Why stop at Archer? Why not compare him to Shaun Tait too?

Archer is not a “current” bowler until he comes back.
 
He is a better bowler than what his statistics suggest so far. Definitely needs to improve, as you can’t keep going at 4+ RPO in Test cricket. Puts immense pressure on the other bowlers in your team, and forces them into a defensive role more so when you are leaking runs at such an alarming rate.

Naseem is down the pecking order and rightly so, the hate is also unjustified. Let’s just agree he is too raw and accept without Hasan Ali our pace bowling is pants in Tests.
 
Top performers from recent QEA should have been preferred. Experience was needed. You can’t have naseem AND Shaheen.
In a run fest season QEA trophy, Sohail Khan, Sameen Gul and Mir Hamza had good seasons with good 30 or below average. Imran khan was also a good option.

Was surprised to see Naseem ahead of these guys





The thick tank (I like it!) are pretty clueless at the best of times but in this instance I’m not quite sure who you want to play instead? Especially as Hassan and Rauf were unavailable.

Tabish Khan? That ship has sailed - unfairly and harshly treated in the past but there’s no need to go back there now

Abbas? You might as well pick another spinner. Maybe 3-4 years ago, but he is absolutely useless now.

Hasnain - banned

In this instance probably better getting Naseem some more exposure than taking on some older bowlers. I would have probably preferred Dahani, but the arguments against Naseem also apply to him too.

If Hassan is fit next game and Naseem is selected instead then that’s ridiculous but for this match don’t see much wrong with the selection. Limited options
 
What is the obsession with Archer anyway? Pointless and useless comparison. Why stop at Archer? Why not compare him to Shaun Tait too?

Archer is not a “current” bowler until he comes back.

That question must have been too offensive to answer, apologies. As for your question, that should be asked of Naseem fans who feel he has achieved more then Archer
 
Abbas is extremely poor now. He’s bowling the pace Graham gooch and Sourav Ganguly used to bowl.

Cue the “pace is not everything” brigade. Everyone knows this, but there’s got to be a minimum. Bowling 70mph is an embarrassment

If options are that thin as a 1 test option what are the % chances that Abbas would go for around 4 an over compared to a rookie?
 
If options are that thin as a 1 test option what are the % chances that Abbas would go for around 4 an over compared to a rookie?

On these pitches you need control which helps the spinners a fast bowler bowling 30 overs for 60 runs is ideal unfortunately Abbas wasn’t selected neither was any attacking batsman whereas Pakistan could’ve scored 100 more runs and now had Australia 370-7 with a day to go.

Regardless of less time available the best resources available must be used to get the best performance the low ranked team mentality won’t leave us until then.

Unless something changes Pakistan becoming a top team is simply not going to happen for a long time just winning some tests at home is all we will get and inevitable heavy losses outside Asia.
 
Do you guys believe Naseem is at the same level as Archer in terms of success across all forms domestic and international ?

No Ofcourse not. Archer has achieved more because he’s performed in the World Cup and two test matches.

But there isn’t a huge gulf between them as some people here are suggesting.
 
Every pacer has struggled to take wickets in this match. It is a dead wicket after all.

However, he is the only pacer to go over 4 an over. All other pacers have kept their economy rates below 3.

In his last series in New Zealand, he bowled the most expensive spell in history (min. 25 overs).

He has played in Australia, England, New Zealand and Pakistan - he has struggled to take wickets against all big teams home and away.

Regardless of the conditions, his mediocrity remains constant and he is always expensive. Pretty much guaranteed to conceded a boundary ever over.

Horrendous bowler. The hype makes me laugh.

Pakistan always hypes their bowlers. They hype Musa, Hasnain, and Naseem and all of them are very poor bowlers.

I think in Pakistan we have only 1 world class bowler and that is shaheen.
 
Top performers from recent QEA should have been preferred. Experience was needed. You can’t have naseem AND Shaheen.
In a run fest season QEA trophy, Sohail Khan, Sameen Gul and Mir Hamza had good seasons with good 30 or below average. Imran khan was also a good option.

Was surprised to see Naseem ahead of these guys

This highlights my point.

Sohail Khan - he’s had his chance, yesterday’s news. Going back to him is going backwards

Imran Khan - Tried and tested failure

Sameen Gul and Mir Hamza - average under 29 is nothing special to force your way in to contention. I agree they have probably not been given the chances they deserve, but once they haven’t, an average of 29 isn’t going to turn heads.

Naseem being picked ahead of the ones you mentioned is not a shock. Giving either Sameen, Mir a debut against Australia on a dead pitch is just as risky as putting Naseem in.

Personally if they had been selected instead I wouldn’t have a problem either.

My point is there is no one obvious
 
The only person holding Archer to any sort of a standard is [MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION]

The rest of the world sees him for exactly who he is. An overrated and injury-prone bowler who has done nothing to establish himself in test cricket. And someone who will likely have a short and unfulfilled career in which he fails to meet the lofty expectations people had from him.

Comparing him to Naseem is laughable because Naseem actually has a future.

:)))

This post exemplifies why Pakistani fans are the most delusional in the world.

Imagine if the shoe was on the other foot - a Pakistani bowler played a starring role in helping his country win a World Cup in his debut year in international cricket compared to a bowler who has been treated like a joke every time he has played against a big team in Test cricket and can’t even break into the LOI squad.

Pakistani fans would roll on the floor over such a comparison.

Naseem is a rubbish bowler who has never performed against a good team and can’t even get into the LOI squad. He neither has a past or a future. Archer might not have a future but he has a past that Naseem will probably never eclipse even if he plays for a decade which I don’t think he will considering how awful his bowling is.

Archer’s 2019 alone is bigger than anything Naseem “I like to see fear in batsmen’s eyes but please hit me for a four every over” Shah will achieve in his career.

Only Pakistani fans have the audacity to compare a World Cup winner to a nobody.
 
:)))

This post exemplifies why Pakistani fans are the most delusional in the world.

Imagine if the shoe was on the other foot - a Pakistani bowler played a starring role in helping his country win a World Cup in his debut year in international cricket compared to a bowler who has been treated like a joke every time he has played against a big team in Test cricket and can’t even break into the LOI squad.

Pakistani fans would roll on the floor over such a comparison.

Naseem is a rubbish bowler who has never performed against a good team and can’t even get into the LOI squad. He neither has a past or a future. Archer might not have a future but he has a past that Naseem will probably never eclipse even if he plays for a decade which I don’t think he will considering how awful his bowling is.

Archer’s 2019 alone is bigger than anything Naseem “I like to see fear in batsmen’s eyes but please hit me for a four every over” Shah will achieve in his career.

Only Pakistani fans have the audacity to compare a World Cup winner to a nobody.

A Pakistani bowler did do that. Hasan Ali won Pakistan a Champions Trophy and became the number ODI bowler in the world. He also has been phenomenal in Test for the last year against strong opposition in different conditions. Yet people look at his poor form in the middle and poor performances in other series and rightly say he has a long way to go before he is considered amongst the best, if ever because of his inconsistency. You especially hated on Hassan Ali for his arrogant statement before performing badly against India. How about the same consistency for Archer for his repeated arrogance/ entitled comments before his terrible performances?

Archer performed for a handful of ODIs and two Tests (only one could he be considered to have actually made an impact). An established bowler like Starc has done multiple times what Archer barely did once, yet you consider Archer ahead of him in all formats.

So yes Naseem may be a nobody but so is Archer who gets too much hype.
 
The thick tank (I like it!) are pretty clueless at the best of times but in this instance I’m not quite sure who you want to play instead? Especially as Hassan and Rauf were unavailable.

Tabish Khan? That ship has sailed - unfairly and harshly treated in the past but there’s no need to go back there now

Abbas? You might as well pick another spinner. Maybe 3-4 years ago, but he is absolutely useless now.

Hasnain - banned

In this instance probably better getting Naseem some more exposure than taking on some older bowlers. I would have probably preferred Dahani, but the arguments against Naseem also apply to him too.

If Hassan is fit next game and Naseem is selected instead then that’s ridiculous but for this match don’t see much wrong with the selection. Limited options

Irfanullah,Dahani,Sameen Gull
 
Irfanullah,Dahani,Sameen Gull

Thanks bro, due to time constraints, I don't much time to look into domestics but is abysmal that thick tank hasn't got any proper development plans in place.

You'd expect 3 or 4 players to be knocking on the door from domestics or players being phased in gradually but we're obsessed with plucking some random kids from the school playground and asking them to go and play Test cricket.

What an embarrassment.
 
He clearly isnt ready at the moment

Theres no way a good test bowler should be going at over 4 an over

He needs time Let him play fc for a couple fo years before we bring him back

The last thing we want is chucking him at the deep end all the time and him struggling and this hampering his long term development
 
His overs consist of four nothing balls, one good ball followed by a stare, one ball smacked to the boundary.

I'd compare him to someone of a similar age and experience level in Jayden Seales. Yet with Seales you already see someone bowling with control and a good seam.

Naseem may be quick but his pace is useless when constantly bowling both sides of the wicket.
 
Thanks bro, due to time constraints, I don't much time to look into domestics but is abysmal that thick tank hasn't got any proper development plans in place.

You'd expect 3 or 4 players to be knocking on the door from domestics or players being phased in gradually but we're obsessed with plucking some random kids from the school playground and asking them to go and play Test cricket.

What an embarrassment.

Exactly we need to get away from picking people based upon 1 or 2 games unless they are ready made products.I would prefer we picked people from domestic scene and Pakistan Shaheens.

Apart from the names I mentioned thiers also khurram Shezard who played for Pakistan Shaheens with Irfanullah.
 
One of the rare sensible thing selectors are doing , investing on Naseem. These is no better young fast bowler in Pakistan ( other than Shaheen ). With test match experience against Australia, summer playing country cricket , he will keep improving . Will will make a long term new ball pair with Shaheen for Pakistan.
 
That was a beauty to remove Carey

He’s not been the worst but has leaked runs


:stokes that was a pretty ordinary delivery undone by pace under lights.. I think that was the penultimate over of the day which after that Babar Azam bowled

Red ball is seriously difficult to see under lights, thats why they have pink ball tests.. Quite surprised that they allowed Naseem to bowl but didnt allow SSA to bowl when Pakistan declared on Day 2 where the light seem to be little better comparatively..
 
One of the rare sensible thing selectors are doing , investing on Naseem. These is no better young fast bowler in Pakistan ( other than Shaheen ). With test match experience against Australia, summer playing country cricket , he will keep improving . Will will make a long term new ball pair with Shaheen for Pakistan.

Sameen Gul is there

Look at his stats https://www.espncricinfo.com/player/sameen-gul-922947

Only thing that looks good on Naseem Shah's part is that he is more handsome... :ssa2
 
This highlights my point.

Sohail Khan - he’s had his chance, yesterday’s news. Going back to him is going backwards

Imran Khan - Tried and tested failure

Sameen Gul and Mir Hamza - average under 29 is nothing special to force your way in to contention. I agree they have probably not been given the chances they deserve, but once they haven’t, an average of 29 isn’t going to turn heads.

Naseem being picked ahead of the ones you mentioned is not a shock. Giving either Sameen, Mir a debut against Australia on a dead pitch is just as risky as putting Naseem in.

Personally if they had been selected instead I wouldn’t have a problem either.

My point is there is no one obvious

Sameen and Mir are two different bowlers.. Sameen is a tall right arm swing bowler, everytime I saw he looked to me as a genuine fast bowler who got pace and swing....Mir Hamza on the other hand need helping conditions like overcast to get wickets which every bowler can do + not as tall as Sameen who can extract more bounce.


In this PSL Wahab purposely sidelines Iqbal and Sameen to keep himself in contention of the team 11 as a captain and was hammered all round the park

Sameen wasnt given chance at all, Pakistan think tank has been forcing their pace theory with Hasnain , Naseem and Musa for a while now, And all of them since 2019 has not come any close to good or decent yet..

Pakistan always has this special skill to back players who are not good , and dont give a chance to players who are good..

Giving either Sameen, Mir a debut against Australia on a dead pitch is just as risky as putting Naseem in.

Going by FC record both Sameen and Mir should be given the chance not Haris and Naseem.
No better place than giving a debut in the home series.. Rmb those dumb MisQar gave debuts to Naseem and Musa in Aus thinking it is a smart move that they are the young pace sensation who would run through Aus batting line up :shappy
 
His overs consist of four nothing balls, one good ball followed by a stare, one ball smacked to the boundary.

I'd compare him to someone of a similar age and experience level in Jayden Seales. Yet with Seales you already see someone bowling with control and a good seam.

Naseem may be quick but his pace is useless when constantly bowling both sides of the wicket.

Nice one liner to explain his 20+ overs in this test match..
 
Exactly , as of now he thinks fast bowling is only about pace..

I actually wish this was the case. He seems to be in a bit of no man’s land. I would prefer he go all out pace, he seems to hold himself back a bit. He needs to realise who he is and who he wants to be.

Atm, he’s not enforcer, not container. Swing will come over time. He’ll never become a container so better off focusing on pure pace until the swing develops.

Pace and swing would be a deadly combination
 
All this complaining about him. He is 19 , has played the least experienced first class cricketer in both teams and he was sent to bowl fast on the most dead track in the last few years. I mean this is a track where Imam ul Haq who hadnt played test cricket for ages and people were mocking why he was selected over Shan Masood scored 2 centuries. A track where an out of form Smith almost got a 100. Give the kid some slack. Just like on a dead pitch a 100 shouldnt count as a game changer, neither should a bowler going for 4 rpo for attacking the wickets
 
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