[VIDEOS] Shan Masood Career Poultry Farm

[mominsaigol]

He’s the worst captain in the history of Pakistan at world cups. He took exactly the squad he wanted to take. He had an embarrassing run in the Asia cup before the World Cup too.

For @Mamoon ‘s sake. I will pray especially in this Ramadhan that may God enable Babar to return as the captain of Pakistan for the ICC mens t20 World Cup and ICC champions Trophy

The intention behind my prayer is that I want this absolutely cleared to those who still believe he is hard done by to once again witness the embarrassment that comes with this man leading Pakistan cricket

InshaAllah, this is a humiliation that we now truly deserve.

I agree that he's a horrible captain, the results were their to see. Their wasn't any excuse for that. Babar verbatim said sheddy and nawaz were his best bowlers while throwing players like zaman khan under the bus when sheddy and nawaz performed 100x worse.

However I will say this, the reason he became captain in the first place is because he merits a spot in the team and has been a consistent rn scorer, even against top string sides and in the world cup where he was poor, he still scored a couple of 50's so he still maintains that soft score avg.

It's just that when you're surrounded by Discount wallmart versions of yourself like imam, rizwan etc, it's hard to succeed, because in 2019 Joe root was also in a similar boat, consistent player but soft scorer however he was surrounded by bazzballers in their prime so it wasn't an issue.

However tbf he's the one who appointed rizwan at no 4, and sent Abdullah and imam to open lol.

 

[Rana]

I agree that he's a horrible captain, the results were their to see. Their wasn't any excuse for that. Babar verbatim said sheddy and nawaz were his best bowlers while throwing players like zaman khan under the bus when sheddy and nawaz performed 100x worse.

However I will say this, the reason he became captain in the first place is because he merits a spot in the team and has been a consistent rn scorer, even against top string sides and in the world cup where he was poor, he still scored a couple of 50's so he still maintains that soft score avg.

It's just that when you're surrounded by Discount wallmart versions of yourself like imam, rizwan etc, it's hard to succeed, because in 2019 Joe root was also in a similar boat, consistent player but soft scorer however he was surrounded by bazzballers in their prime so it wasn't an issue.

However tbf he's the one who appointed rizwan at no 4, and sent Abdullah and imam to open lol.

Whatever the situation is, I now hope this happens:

1. Peshawar Zalmi win the PSL under Babar Azam

2. Babar’s cult fans start a Tsunami of pressure on social media, especially on Chairman Mohsin Naqvi to appoint Babar as the white ball captain

3. Shaheen resigns from his position as if he is Hritik Roshan doing a sacrifice for his brother Babar Azam in Kabhi Khush Kabhi Gham

4. Bobzy the king returns to his national team position as the leader. Saim is sent to bat at number 4, as Babar cosys up again with his other half Rizwan for the opening spot

5. Pakistan win 3-2 against New Zealand c under Babar in Pakistan

Then…Aage Aage dekho hota hai kya

 

[mominsaigol]

Whatever the situation is, I know hope this happens:

1. Peshawar Zalmi win the PSL under Babar Azam

2. Babar’s cult fans start a Tsunami of pressure on social media, especially on Chairman Mohsin Naqvi to appoint Babar as the white ball captain

3. Shaheen resigns from his position as if he is Hritik Roshan doing a sacrifice for his brother Babar Azam in Kabhi Khush Kabhi Gham

4. Bobzy the king returns to his national team position as the leader. Saim is sent to bat at number 4, as Babar cosys up again with his other half Rizwan for the opening spot

5. Pakistan win 3-2 against New Zealand c under Babar in Pakistan

Then…Aage Aage dekho hota hai kya

For some reason this gave me a vibe of major deja vu, almost as if this already happened in 2023 lol .

 

[Rana]

I won't be entertaining a poster who thinks Imad is better than Babar.

Imad’s cricketing understanding is a Mount Everest in comparison to Babar’s. Education matters. Imad does his job. Babar demands to do a job he can’t do….and in fact he doesn’t do that job properly even though he gets whatever he wants

 

[Rana]

Agreed a nothing player like Imad thinks he's a superstar. A pathetic player in every aspect. Why would Babar even care about a guy who is not good enough to tie his shoelaces?

That last paragraph is just embarrassing for any sportsman let alone being made fun of by your own fans. The silence from his fans regarding the last paragraph is quite funny. Not a single word about the utter humiliation he has received from his home fans. This is what I call justice. Next time Imad won't be talking rubbish well at least if he has any shame he won't. Then again we are talking about Imad.

@Mamoon

You are better than this, your views deserve appreciation from proper intellectuals. Don’t intentionally go on the wrong path.

 

[Rana]

For some reason this gave me a vibe of major deja vu, almost as if this already happened in 2023 lol .

It has to be repeated. People have very short term memories.

 

[Rana]

The first BIG SHOCK Pakistan will get is against England in the T20 series,

When Phil Salt and Joss Buttler absolutely pulverise all of your PSL bowlers into oblivion. If you get through those two, then you have Brooks, Livingstone, Bairstow all waiting to have a piece of your bowlers.

Your World Cup campaign will get derailed right here.

Yeh tou Hoga Ab!

 

[PakEngFan]

Imad’s cricketing understanding is a Mount Everest in comparison to Babar’s. Education matters. Imad does his job. Babar demands to do a job he can’t do….and in fact he doesn’t do that job properly even though he gets whatever he wants

Thanks for your post Asif Ali is better than Babar Azam.

 

[mominsaigol]

I agree Babar is already a great of Pakistan while Imad is mocked by his home crowd.

It's not a comparison in any sense. Imad is rightly compared to all rounder and we see a nothing cricketer like shadab is miles ahead of him.

Shadab isn't better then imad at all, sheddy was a mockery in asia cup and world cup stages while the last t20 imad played he dismantled the NZ c string side whereas shadab in the same tour did virtually nothing.

Hating imad is one thing, I don't like imad that much, personally imo he's medicore but claiming sheddy is far superior is verbatim false.

Imad's stain on his career is that KK had a horrific season last year and that before nawaz replaced him courtesy of misbah, imad's own form with the ball heavily declined and he reported to pretty much being a pinch hitter.

But nawaz and shadab's tu hai mera match winner turned into an entire meme.

I'm starting to understand people hate imad or Babar for political reasons, which doesn't make any sense to me. I hate players like shan or ima. because they suck, that's all their is to it, I wouldn't care if shan was a product of nepotism if he was even half the player that anyone in his team is, but he isn't even fit to be in the same category of nothing players like iftikhar ahmed let alone actual match winners like fakhar.

 

[PakEngFan]

Shadab isn't better then imad at all, sheddy was a mockery in asia cup and world cup stages while the last t20 imad played he dismantled the NZ c string side whereas shadab in the same tour did virtually nothing.

Hating imad is one thing, I don't like imad that much, personally imo he's medicore but claiming sheddy is far superior is verbatim false.

Imad's stain on his career is that KK had a horrific season last year and that before nawaz replaced him courtesy of misbah, imad's own form with the ball heavily declined and he reported to pretty much being a pinch hitter.

But nawaz and shadab's tu hai mera match winner turned into an entire meme.

I'm starting to understand people hate imad or Babar for political reasons, which doesn't make any sense to me. I hate players like shan or ima. because they suck, that's all their is to it, I wouldn't care if shan was a product of nepotism if he was even half the player that anyone in his team is, but he isn't even fit to be in the same category of nothing players like iftikhar ahmed let alone actual match winners like fakhar.

In this PSL alone shadab has been far better than Imad with bat ball and field. Agreed shadab is rubbish and has had pathetic world cup but shadab has always outperformed Imad at all the global events.

Both shadab and Imad played WC 19 and shadab performed better. The the t20 world cup where shadab was comfortably better and the last t20 world cup shadab is quite good.

Yes he not good but still outperformed Imad at major events. Let's not forget Imad was pathetic against Australia in the semi final and was one of the reasons why we lost t20 semi final where shadab took 4 wickets.

Imad bowling stats in odis are as bad as a part timer and against proper oppositions he averages over 60.

 

[mominsaigol]

In this PSL alone shadab has been far better than Imad with bat ball and field. Agreed shadab is rubbish and has had pathetic world cup but shadab has always outperformed Imad at all the global events.

Both shadab and Imad played WC 19 and shadab performed better. The the t20 world cup where shadab was comfortably better and the last t20 world cup shadab is quite good.

Yes he not good but still outperformed Imad at major events. Let's not forget Imad was pathetic against Australia in the semi final and was one of the reasons why we lost t20 semi final where shadab took 4 wickets.

Imad bowling stats in odis are as bad as a part timer and against proper oppositions he averages over 60.

My issue is sheddy and nawaz were the 2 worst bowlers in asia cup and world cup, literally the only bowler who was worse then these 2 wickets and economy wise was Joe root who isn't even a bowler and was being used caused 2023 England bowling was toothless and moeen Ali was a dissapointment throughout.

This whole comparison thing can go for ages, their dozens of series you can highlight where shadab did better and dozens where imad did better, similarly you can highlight ct 2017 where sheddy was good and got the important wicket of yuvaraj.

Point is neither are good player, nor am I advocating for either of em to return, but imad has won games for Pakistan countless tines here and their and so has babar multiple times which biased fans seems to ignore on both sides.

As for babar himself, he isn't a Saint, the guy was stubborn beyond belief, mickey Arthur straight up told babar to bat at no 3 in all formats but he batted himself at t20nopeneing cause its the easiest place to get milestones.

He was advised to take abrar as a front line spinner since shadab and nawaz were terrible in asia cup and even part timers did better then these 2 jobbers, but babar outright refused and went to the media advocating for these 2.

Babar and imad have both done service for their country however both have also caused problems, neither of em are saints. Only valid argument that exists is that babar is still a decent bat and merits a place in the squad while imad is retired and hasn't been a frontline for years.

But those advocating for either imad or babar to be made captain again are bonkers and out of their minds. Their acting as if inad didn't just completly run KK into the ground and babar didn't just come back from the most humiliating world cup experience surpassing even 2007.

 

[daytrader]

Imad, Shadab and Nawaz are all of the same mould. They're part time spinners but we expect them to be primary ones. If any of these guys had a proper spinner bowling from the other end, their performances would improve considerably

 

[mominsaigol]

Imad, Shadab and Nawaz are all of the same mould. They're part time spinners but we expect them to be primary ones. If any of these guys had a proper spinner bowling from the other end, their performances would improve considerably

This, rather have a proper spin allrounder instead.

Malik and hafeez despite all their faults and being Peak medicore are 100x the bowlers and batsmen that these 3 are, hafeez especially in spin bowling.

 

[daytrader]

This, rather have a proper spin allrounder instead.

Malik and hafeez despite all their faults and being Peak medicore are 100x the bowlers and batsmen that these 3 are, hafeez especially in spin bowling.

For a majority of their careers they had premier spinners at the other end like Yasir Shah and Saeed Ajmal. Malik picked up his art from Saqlain. Who does a part time spinner turn to in our current team? Especially when we're asking them to perform a task that goes above and beyond their capabilities. Our biggest problem is we don't play to our strengths

 

[ExpressPacer]

Shan rightly deserves to be Testv captain and is reasonably good as a batter for our standards. As a captain, he makes up for any incompetencies in batting.

As for captaining PSL, he’s had one bad season. I remember everyone was crying for him to be in the national side after last years PSL. Fans need to stop being so fickle and look at their old posts.

Maybe his T20 time is up but he’s not here on the basis of nepotism.

 

[BouncerGuy]

The whole thread has been derailed and turned into babar thread. Either you guys should come back on topic or leave this thread as we have other threads available for this kind of conversation. No more irrelevant discussion here now. Thanks

 

[mominsaigol]

Shan rightly deserves to be Testv captain and is reasonably good as a batter for our standards. As a captain, he makes up for any incompetencies in batting.

As for captaining PSL, he’s had one bad season. I remember everyone was crying for him to be in the national side after last years PSL. Fans need to stop being so fickle and look at their old posts.

Maybe his T20 time is up but he’s not here on the basis of nepotism.

No he doesn't. Based of what? Dude has the worst average for any opener/top order bat in Pakistani history? So he obviously doesn't make the team for his batting capabilities.

As for tactics, bhai we lost 3 matches on the dot? What tactics?

Babar was a bad captain but his selection makes sense Conaidering he himself merits a place in the squad and is probably our best no 3 since the past 10 years.

Either you get results as a captain or you yourself are a good player, sarfraz got sacked as soon as he led the team to ruin in 2019, yes he was a great captain in 2017 but the team later regressed and his own form didn't merit a place.

Babar didn't get results but his selection as a batsmen isn't up for debate.

Either you merit a place based of performance or based of team results, Shan has dome neither, so far in international cricket his win% is 0 % lol.

 

[mominsaigol]

I don't understand how anyone can seriously talk about shan masood as a captain with a straight face? No disrespect to any poster but bro, he lost 3 on the dot. No one is gonna care about what tactics he employed.

Don't get me wrong babar would have lost to, but with babar you have arguments to defend him based of his batting skills alone as even when babar plays against top string sides he still shows that he's still capable of getting 50's for his team and contributing consistently even if he can't replicate his superstar performance against 2nd string sides.

Playing with shan basically means that we're playing with 10 players instead of 11.

 

[BouncerGuy]

Shan Masood was the worst pick to be made the captain for the test side. His place was not justified but he was made captain LOL. Now Karachi Kings did the same. They deserved it because they chose mediocrity over anything else. They needed an English speaker I guess otherwise shan masood? makes no sense.

 

[mominsaigol]

Shan Masood was the worst pick to be made the captain for the test side. His place was not justified but he was made captain LOL. Now Karachi Kings did the same. They deserved it because they chose mediocrity over anything else. They needed an English speaker I guess otherwise shan masood? makes no sense.

If they wanted an English speaker then just do what quetta did and get an international player to represent your squad.

Tactics don't matter when shan loses 3 games on the dot in his first captaincy stint and his inclusion means that Pakistan has to play with 10 players instead of 11.

 

[BouncerGuy]

If they wanted an English speaker then just do what quetta did and get an international player to represent your squad.

Tactics don't matter when shan loses 3 games on the dot in his first captaincy stint and his inclusion means that Pakistan has to play with 10 players instead of 11.

I guess Karachi is not as clever as Quetta is. Shan's party time should be over now. He is just not good enough to be in the team and teams are making him their captain?

 

[The_KING]

How can a guy who averages less than 30 after playing test cricket for a decade be the test captain? If that doesn’t show that our standards are on the floor, I don’t know what will.

 

[mominsaigol]

I guess Karachi is not as clever as Quetta is. Shan's party time should be over now. He is just not good enough to be in the team and teams are making him their captain?

Their making him captain because his dad is influential, why is his dad so incompetent? What's the reason to have his son play cricket? Just tell Mr English to inherit his position in the company and work alongside his dad for management roles?

Why is he playing cricket?

 

[BouncerGuy]

Their making him captain because his dad is influential, why is his dad so incompetent? What's the reason to have his son play cricket? Just tell Mr English to inherit his position in the company and work alongside his dad for management roles?

Why is he playing cricket?

Shan's departure from multan is not doing any good for him. He looked good in multan because he had other players to cover his short-comings but here in Karachi, he has nobody to save him. Poor shan attracting a lot of hate.

 

[mominsaigol]

Shan's departure from multan is not doing any good for him. He looked good in multan because he had other players to cover his short-comings but here in Karachi, he has nobody to save him. Poor shan attracting a lot of hate.

Theirs nothing poor about it, I don't feel any sympathy for shan, I have felt sympathy for players like sarfraz, Babar etc because even though they did lead the team to decline, the insane hate is undeserved considering us fans should be grateful for the ct 2017 achievement and babar's innings over the years. The negatives may overshadow the positives ut that doesn't mean the positives aren't their.

Shan has every right to be persecuted by fans that call him parchi, and he has no right to complain to social media about bullying, when he knows full well he's in this position thanks to nepotism and a corrupt country in general and pure luck that he was born into these favourable standards.

Every single interview I've seen him in, he always has a convenient excuse as to why he failed and uses complicated fancy English words like attributed to fool pakistani fans as most people from pakistan aren't privileged enough to be as educated in the English language as many of us are so he deliberately gives them false pretense.

It's not like shan doesn't know this, he knows this full well which is why he wants the heat off him, someone like rohit sharma when he was being persecuted by fans due to his poor form in 2022 didn't reply or cause a drama cause rohit knows that fans have no clue what their talking about and that he's an ultimate hitman which is why kohli defended rohit on media. No player in their right mind is gonna defend shan unless shan manipulates them or threatens their positions like salman butt did back in 2010.

It also doesn't help that he comes across as egotistical, telling fans that call him a parchi to shut up as if he's some goat player or having constant fights upon fights in the psl with literally every player, and its ironic that people criticised sarfraz for having fights when sarfi himself has zero form or any right but they defend shan saying that he's educated and knows what he's talking about.

Shan is quite literally the definition of someone who reads a book about surgery and thinks he's now educated to be a doctor but when it comes to doing the surgery itself, he fumbles and puts the patient he's operating on at risk. This is why education is more then just what you read off a book or what you can speak.

Theirs no poor shan, he has every right to called out, the fans didn't insult him or his family or anything, they just called him a parchi which he actually is. If he stepped down and just quit cricket and pursued a career in pcb management like his father, it would be fine, but no he wants the limelight to captain a squad which instantly puts disrespect who all the great captains who led the team to victory in the past.

 

[ExpressPacer]

No he doesn't. Based of what? Dude has the worst average for any opener/top order bat in Pakistani history? So he obviously doesn't make the team for his batting capabilities.

As for tactics, bhai we lost 3 matches on the dot? What tactics?

Babar was a bad captain but his selection makes sense Conaidering he himself merits a place in the squad and is probably our best no 3 since the past 10 years.

Either you get results as a captain or you yourself are a good player, sarfraz got sacked as soon as he led the team to ruin in 2019, yes he was a great captain in 2017 but the team later regressed and his own form didn't merit a place.

Babar didn't get results but his selection as a batsmen isn't up for debate.

Either you merit a place based of performance or based of team results, Shan has dome neither, so far in international cricket his win% is 0 % lol.

Even if Imran Khan was captaining this side against the mighty Australians in their home grounds, we would’ve lost 3-0.

However, in every single match, Pakistan played exciting and attacking cricket and in every single match, they gave themselves a chance. It isn’t Shan’s fault that Shaheen was bowling pies, Babar was batting like a schoolboy and our spin was non-existent.

Sarfraz was sacked not only because his performances dropped but Shah because his captaincy became poorer. Do you remember his onfield tantrums?

 

[mominsaigol]

Even if Imran Khan was captaining this side against the mighty Australians in their home grounds, we would’ve lost 3-0.

However, in every single match, Pakistan played exciting and attacking cricket and in every single match, they gave themselves a chance. It isn’t Shan’s fault that Shaheen was bowling pies, Babar was batting like a schoolboy and our spin was non-existent.

Sarfraz was sacked not only because his performances dropped but Shah because his captaincy became poorer. Do you remember his onfield tantrums?

That's completely besides the point, you didn't read what I said, imran Khan can lose 3-0 but it doesn't matter because imran Khan is one of the finest bowling allrounders to ever grace the game.

Sarfraz got sacked rightfully so, he led the team to ruin and was terrible as a player, I didn't say otherwise.

So far in shan's captaincy stint he's lost 3-0 and karachi Kings is on its way out of the PSL, our 2 captains shaheen and Shan are the first 2 captains to be eliminated.

As for sarfraz ik his tantrums, Shan also made numerous tantrums in this cup.

No disrespect to you brother, I value your opinion but I disagree with everything you have said.

Shan so far has lost all his games in aus, and as captain is eliminated from PSL altogether. The imran Khan point makes no sense because imran Khan was one of the finest pakistani players to ever grace the game, he's a great of the game and by pakistani standards he's a pakistani atg, and in all time 11's it's always between selecting him or kapil dev in your playing 11?

Shan wouldn't even make it to current world 11 or current Pakistan 11 lol.

You can be a bad captain but a good player which can merit your selection which was the case with babar as he was unreplacable at no 3, or you can be a bang average player but as long as your getting results for the team, then you stand which Sarfraz was in 2017 and even prior where he whitewashed west Indies and had a decent srint as a captain as well as winning under 19 Cup.

But you can't be a bad player and also show zero results for your squad irrespective of any infield tactics. Sarfraz got the boot because ever since 2017, the team rapidly declined in 2018 and 2019 and he himself didn't do himself any favours with bad form.

Babar on the other hand despite bad performance captaincy wise, willingly stepped down amd didn't get booted, and even now many are advocating him to come back to captaincy? Why? Because even though he's a failure of a captain he himself justifies a spot, so you don't have plausible cause to boot him.

If Shan was winning psl's like sarfraz was or winning trophies like sarfi was before sarfi's decline then you could justify his place despite being a nothing player himself, but just like sarfi got the boot as soon as the team started to decline, Shan deserves the same fate.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

That's completely besides the point, you didn't read what I said, imran Khan can lose 3-0 but it doesn't matter because imran Khan is one of the finest bowling allrounders to ever grace the game.

Sarfraz got sacked rightfully so, he led the team to ruin and was terrible as a player, I didn't say otherwise.

So far in shan's captaincy stint he's lost 3-0 and karachi Kings is on its way out of the PSL, our 2 captains shaheen and Shan are the first 2 captains to be eliminated.

As for sarfraz ik his tantrums, Shan also made numerous tantrums in this cup.

No disrespect to you brother, I value your opinion but I disagree with everything you have said.

Shan so far has lost all his games in aus, and as captain is eliminated from PSL altogether. The imran Khan point makes no sense because imran Khan was one of the finest pakistani players to ever grace the game, he's a great of the game and by pakistani standards he's a pakistani atg, and in all time 11's it's always between selecting him or kapil dev in your playing 11?

Shan wouldn't even make it to current world 11 or current Pakistan 11 lol.

You can be a bad captain but a good player which can merit your selection which was the case with babar as he was unreplacable at no 3, or you can be a bang average player but as long as your getting results for the team, then you stand which Sarfraz was in 2017 and even prior where he whitewashed west Indies and had a decent srint as a captain as well as winning under 19 Cup.

But you can't be a bad player and also show zero results for your squad irrespective of any infield tactics. Sarfraz got the boot because ever since 2017, the team rapidly declined in 2018 and 2019 and he himself didn't do himself any favours with bad form.

Babar on the other hand despite bad performance captaincy wise, willingly stepped down amd didn't get booted, and even now many are advocating him to come back to captaincy? Why? Because even though he's a failure of a captain he himself justifies a spot, so you don't have plausible cause to boot him.

If Shan was winning psl's like sarfraz was or winning trophies like sarfi was before sarfi's decline then you could justify his place despite being a nothing player himself, but just like sarfi got the boot as soon as the team started to decline, Shan deserves the same fate.

I have no bone in this argument, but however a few points of note.

To judge Shan on his performances in Australia seems harsh when historically no Pakistani team has won in Australia since I stopped wearing diapers. Shan is no Mike Brearly that Pakistan would suddenly start winning by him being instilled into the team. But he was a significant upgrade vs Babar over captaincy skills and everyone who saw the Australian series would testify to that. Unless you were biased and only saw results and decided that Babar would have fared the same as well despite evidence to contrary for last 2 years.

His PSL captaincy is also not a good gauge because Karachi is probably the weakest franchise with players like Malik still around.
PSL in fact is the worst gauge for anything because Babar seems like a superstar right now in PSL; one of the untouchables, but we all know thats zilch because come the World Cup and real match pressure, Babar would be back into pavilion even faster than Rizwan.

So the real question is do we not judge Shan at all? No, we do. But we dont take Australian performance as a benchmark and a weak Karachi team as a litmus test for Shans captaincy. We should really give him a few more test series before discarding him as an average captain and looking for someone else.

Shan probably doesnt make the team on merit. But there are 5 other cricketers in the Pakistan team who dont make it on merit but they are ignored because Shan was fast tracked for his captaincy skills. He is never going to be a Babar type batsmen just like Babar is never going to think like Shan.

I would like Shan to be given another tour against a mid rung team to see if he can change Pakistans fortunes with his good captaincy. If not, we can always let him go.

But it is intellectual dishonesty to somehow evaluate Shan in Australia and a lowly PSL league and say he is not good enough.

Its like cards. I am a good player but if I dont get any face cards I am NOT going to be defending the Bridge game. But if I get a couple of face cards I can defend the game. But someone like Babar can have 2 aces and still end up losing.

Just my two cents.

 

[BouncerGuy]

To judge Shan on his performances in Australia seems harsh when historically no Pakistani team has won in Australia since I stopped wearing diapers. Shan is no Mike Brearly that Pakistan would suddenly start winning by him being instilled into the team.

He has been part of the test team for a long time now. The point is not that Pakistan lost in Australia, the point is his own form atm, which is pretty bad tbh.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

He has been part of the test team for a long time now. The point is not that Pakistan lost in Australia, the point is his own form atm, which is pretty bad tbh.

I am well aware of his abilities as a batsmen.

If he can improve Pakistan from 5th 6th to 3rd, thats what I would accept otherwise we can let him go.

 

[BouncerGuy]

I am well aware of his abilities as a batsmen.

If he can improve Pakistan from 5th 6th to 3rd, thats what I would accept otherwise we can let him go.

So, we want him to be the next sarfaraz ahmed? No personal performance, but made captain because either he won us 2009 u19 world cup or he can speak good English.

 

[iPakistani]

It wasn’t Salman Iqbal. He doesn’t direct cricket decisions. The person who needs to be questioned is Haider Azhar. KK brought this guy in hoping he would turn them into a new Multan Sultans by creating a similar atmosphere revolving around a player similar to Rizwan.

The funny thing is, Multan wanted to retain Shan. He is good friends with Ali Tareen (owner of Multan) and he was the original captain of MS before they brought in Rizwan. Haider convinced Salman to get Shan in, remove Sharjeel/Amir/Imad and make Shan their captain. Sharjeel was kicked out so Shan can open the innings with an overseas. Imad was removed from captaincy and he is 10 times the player, fighter and leader than Shan is.

The guy that messed this franchise up is Haider Azhar

Shan has had a terrible PSL but that doesn't mean any of the other failures you mentioned would've done wonders with this team.

PSL 2024:

Imad Wasim : 48 bowling average, 4 wickets in 9 games. 8.8 batting average at 115 SR.
Mohammad Amir: 38 bowling average, 6 wickets in 7 games. Not even in the top 20 wicket takers, same amount as Saim.
Sharjeel: UNSOLD.

Babar Azam: 62 avg, 149 SR. 159 SR in the powerplay (one of the highest). Top run scorer.

Karachi did the correct thing with booting out these failures, the only mistake they made was replacing them with failures in Shan and Malik and ALSO letting Babar go.

 

[mominsaigol]

I have no bone in this argument, but however a few points of note.

To judge Shan on his performances in Australia seems harsh when historically no Pakistani team has won in Australia since I stopped wearing diapers. Shan is no Mike Brearly that Pakistan would suddenly start winning by him being instilled into the team. But he was a significant upgrade vs Babar over captaincy skills and everyone who saw the Australian series would testify to that. Unless you were biased and only saw results and decided that Babar would have fared the same as well despite evidence to contrary for last 2 years.

His PSL captaincy is also not a good gauge because Karachi is probably the weakest franchise with players like Malik still around.
PSL in fact is the worst gauge for anything because Babar seems like a superstar right now in PSL; one of the untouchables, but we all know thats zilch because come the World Cup and real match pressure, Babar would be back into pavilion even faster than Rizwan.

So the real question is do we not judge Shan at all? No, we do. But we dont take Australian performance as a benchmark and a weak Karachi team as a litmus test for Shans captaincy. We should really give him a few more test series before discarding him as an average captain and looking for someone else.

Shan probably doesnt make the team on merit. But there are 5 other cricketers in the Pakistan team who dont make it on merit but they are ignored because Shan was fast tracked for his captaincy skills. He is never going to be a Babar type batsmen just like Babar is never going to think like Shan.

I would like Shan to be given another tour against a mid rung team to see if he can change Pakistans fortunes with his good captaincy. If not, we can always let him go.

But it is intellectual dishonesty to somehow evaluate Shan in Australia and a lowly PSL league and say he is not good enough.

Its like cards. I am a good player but if I dont get any face cards I am NOT going to be defending the Bridge game. But if I get a couple of face cards I can defend the game. But someone like Babar can have 2 aces and still end up losing.

Just my two cents.

I agree with your post, well said Dr sahib( Ps: I'm calling you Dr sahib cause my own mother is a doctor so I respect doctors, regardless)

- I am not basing Shan's performance on His aussie series or his psl performance as a captain

My whole point is, Shan doesn't merit a place at all, Sarfraz before his regression wasn't the same as Shan, he starred against South Africa making 49 of 49 and taking 6 catches and then scoring a 100 the next game, he was breathe of fresh air over nasir jamshed who couldn't even get a double digit score across multiple games and dropped multiple catches. Sarfraz also scored a test century against Australia and more or less at the time he seemed like the perfect wicket keeper batsmen and captain, since he was far superior to pretty much anyone from the dark misbah days, Nasir jamshed, Ahmed shehzad, umar akmal, sohaib maqsood, asad shafiq etc were all performing 100x worse then he was during 2015, and after azhar's failed performance as a captain, sarfraz seemed like a natural leader since during psl he reached the finals whereas azhar Ali's lahore qalandars was the first team to be eliminated during PSL first season.

At the time sarfraz seemed like the best player on form, our best wicket keeper batsmen and he had a track record of winning games be it a past record on under 19 or outperforming azhar Ali as a captain in psl ans scoring 3 wins over West Indies casually while azhar Ali was struggling against pretty every team leading to team to no 9 rank position.

Sarfraz at the time 100% deserved captaincy based of form and track records, people comvientally leave out how good he use to be to the point that when he replaced umar akmal who had regressed into nothing by 2015, critics and influential cricketers were making claims on how Pakistan have finally found an answer to their wicket keeping woes as kamran akmal was beyond pathetic in the India series in 2012 and umar akmal was hilariously bad and getting worse day by day minus that one 102 saving grace game, umar rightfully got sacked in 2013 ct and still managed to be given another chance before getting the final boot in 2015 and further statements on how sarfraz was like oxygen to the Pakistan team.

Babar is a similar case but I don't need to list his achievements, most fans like babar's batting except a few blind haters.

Regardless when sarfraz regressed he deserved a sack, but people are acting like sarfi was as random as shan being selected when in reality misbah didn't even play sarfraz and was trying to keep him out in 2015, he was a forced change to replace nasir jamshed and umar akmal.

Given sarfraz's past captaincy track record and his performance during pur 2015 dark days as well as his early psl performances, he deserved captaincy 100% at the time.

Shan is a different case, his tactics being better then babar is irrelevant when he doesnt warrant a place in the team and the 5 or so people who also don't warrant a place in the team is not a valid argument, it just shows and exposes our selectors incompetency.

Shan unlike sarfraz was never a breakout star in everything, 11 years since his debut he's been consistently the worst opener in the history of the game for Pakistan even worse then failures such as Ahmed shehzad at opening, in odi's and PSL his own form is so bad, that Fodder Level bowlers are causally getting rid of him. He himself never warranted a place on the team and even our players like sheddy, nawaz who clearly don't warrant a place, even they have a superior track record to shan ironically.

Sarfraz regressed so badly that he doesnt deserve to ever represent pakistan again but he did prove himself to lead in 2015, shan hasn't proved a damn thing other then having superior tactics to babar in test which is irrelevant considering shan playing is an auto handicap to the team.

 

[mominsaigol]

So, we want him to be the next sarfaraz ahmed? No personal performance, but made captain because either he won us 2009 u19 world cup or he can speak good English.

Sarfraz deserved to be captain in 2015, read my above comment. People either weren't their to witness it, or have short term memory,

Sarfraz regressing to the point of irrelevancy from 2018 to 2024 has no correlation with him meriting a place to lead during 2015-2017.

Shan never merited anything, he can't even score an odi century if his life depended on it let alone a t20 or test century, since test rules make it harder to play the one ball and t20 has shorter overs .

I really really hope shan plays in t20 world cup and faces off against bumrah, kuldeep, siraj etc. It'll be worse then watching nafay bat. Pure comedy, I can't wait.

 

[PakEngFan]

My issue is sheddy and nawaz were the 2 worst bowlers in asia cup and world cup, literally the only bowler who was worse then these 2 wickets and economy wise was Joe root who isn't even a bowler and was being used caused 2023 England bowling was toothless and moeen Ali was a dissapointment throughout.

This whole comparison thing can go for ages, their dozens of series you can highlight where shadab did better and dozens where imad did better, similarly you can highlight ct 2017 where sheddy was good and got the important wicket of yuvaraj.

Point is neither are good player, nor am I advocating for either of em to return, but imad has won games for Pakistan countless tines here and their and so has babar multiple times which biased fans seems to ignore on both sides.

As for babar himself, he isn't a Saint, the guy was stubborn beyond belief, mickey Arthur straight up told babar to bat at no 3 in all formats but he batted himself at t20nopeneing cause its the easiest place to get milestones.

He was advised to take abrar as a front line spinner since shadab and nawaz were terrible in asia cup and even part timers did better then these 2 jobbers, but babar outright refused and went to the media advocating for these 2.

Babar and imad have both done service for their country however both have also caused problems, neither of em are saints. Only valid argument that exists is that babar is still a decent bat and merits a place in the squad while imad is retired and hasn't been a frontline for years.

But those advocating for either imad or babar to be made captain again are bonkers and out of their minds. Their acting as if inad didn't just completly run KK into the ground and babar didn't just come back from the most humiliating world cup experience surpassing even 2007.

Imad would have fared even worse than both of them. Just look at Imad stats in odis they are a joke. The reason why abrar was selected is because he's a genius no 11 and hasn't even played much limited overs cricket.

Babar should have always opened in t20s because the alternative were useless. It was best to let him play as many balls.

Shadab as bad as he is has always performed better than Imad at ICC events.

Can you give us just 3 games which Imad has won for Pakistan let alone countless games. I wouldn't ignore imad's achievement if he actually had any or was a decent cricketer. The fact is he below someone like shadab but acts like a superstar.

Babe was rubbish as captain and is removed. When Babar is rubbish with the bat I will be the first asking for his head while factoring that he's one of our greats unlike Imad who's a poor man's shadab.

 

[mominsaigol]

Imad would have fared even worse than both of them. Just look at Imad stats in odis they are a joke. The reason why abrar was selected is because he's a genius no 11 and hasn't even played much limited overs cricket.

Babar should have always opened in t20s because the alternative were useless. It was best to let him play as many balls.

Shadab as bad as he is has always performed better than Imad at ICC events.

Can you give us just 3 games which Imad has won for Pakistan let alone countless games. I wouldn't ignore imad's achievement if he actually had any or was a decent cricketer. The fact is he below someone like shadab but acts like a superstar.

Babe was rubbish as captain and is removed. When Babar is rubbish with the bat I will be the first asking for his head while factoring that he's one of our greats unlike Imad who's a poor man's shadab.

No need to ask for anyone's head , that was a bit too literal . Jokes aside, you can't definitely claim he would have fared worse then those 2.

Again I'm not saying you should select imad over them, I'm just saying sheddy and nawaz were so bad that the only person who bowled worse then those 2 were Joe root lol.

Also that's not true, imad is primarily the reason we won the Afghanistan game in 2019, otherwise it was a lost position based of how badly Pakistan collapsed after babar and imam departed. He also contributed to a decent score in 2017. During the 2016 England series in pdi, imad remained not out throughout the entire series and scored multiple half centuries, that series was arguably his best ever series performance and is 100x the innings nawaz or shadab have ever played.

Look I don't hate anyone, I'm just stating the truth, Shadab in 2017 was a decent bowler who picked up wickets and seemed like a breathe if fresh air to replace yasir Shah who simply wasn't going anywhere, similarly imad from 2016 and 2017 was the ideal allrounder at the time. Both of them since then just became chillaxed and went down the sarfraz route.

People seem to have short term memories, even in Sarfraz's case, sarfraz was called to replace umar akmal in keeping and replace nasir jamshed as an opener. In 2015 sarfri made 49 of 49 and took 6 catches and instantly scored a century at opening in the next game whereas nasir jamshed couldn't even get to double digit scores and umar akmal was so garbo, he deserved the sack he got in ct 2013 but somehow climbed back out with one 102 against Afghanistan In 2014 before regressing completly. Sarfraz was good enough that critics claimed he was oxygen for the team and was clearly > umar at the time.

Afterwards sarfraz throughout 2016 consistently outperformed azhar Ali whenever they were captains, during the first ever interatiom of psl, sarfri took the team to the final whereas azhar's LQ was the first team to get eliminated and not even reach group stages. On top of that sarfi's test form remained good and he scored a 100 from a collapsed position against England. Azhar deserved a sack and sarfi deserved his position.

Players like imad, Sarfraz, Shadab regressing so badly that they don't warrant a place anymore doesn't invalidate their 2015-2017 achievements just like umar akmal becoming a waste doesn't invalidate that in 2009 he clearly showed talent but ended up being a wasted career.

Nawaz on the other hand has never come close to anything, he's another shan masood who since day 1 has zero highlights minus one t20 innings against India where he saved grace with a 40 of 20 but then a year later was the cause of India winning with that stupid no ball he bowled and then a wide lol.

All the things you've said can easily be answered, but the issue is that if I give you answers, you'll just end up either increasing the number from 3 to 10 or 20 lol or you'll find some excuse to justify.

That's why I don't like engaging in favouritism based conversations because neutrality doesn't exist, most arguments end up being " No this player bad grrrrrrr".

Edit: I'm not singling you out BTW, I'm talking about general Pakistani fans across the nation who analyse based of favouritism

 

[shamaan]

Karachi did exactly that this season. World doesn’t revolve around Babar. Peshawar Zalmi have won 2 games because of Powell, not Babar’s little 50s

As an overseas winning 2 games is the bare minimum.

 

[PakEngFan]

No need to ask for anyone's head , that was a bit too literal . Jokes aside, you can't definitely claim he would have fared worse then those 2.

Again I'm not saying you should select imad over them, I'm just saying sheddy and nawaz were so bad that the only person who bowled worse then those 2 were Joe root lol.

Also that's not true, imad is primarily the reason we won the Afghanistan game in 2019, otherwise it was a lost position based of how badly Pakistan collapsed after babar and imam departed. He also contributed to a decent score in 2017. During the 2016 England series in pdi, imad remained not out throughout the entire series and scored multiple half centuries, that series was arguably his best ever series performance and is 100x the innings nawaz or shadab have ever played.

Look I don't hate anyone, I'm just stating the truth, Shadab in 2017 was a decent bowler who picked up wickets and seemed like a breathe if fresh air to replace yasir Shah who simply wasn't going anywhere, similarly imad from 2016 and 2017 was the ideal allrounder at the time. Both of them since then just became chillaxed and went down the sarfraz route.

People seem to have short term memories, even in Sarfraz's case, sarfraz was called to replace umar akmal in keeping and replace nasir jamshed as an opener. In 2015 sarfri made 49 of 49 and took 6 catches and instantly scored a century at opening in the next game whereas nasir jamshed couldn't even get to double digit scores and umar akmal was so garbo, he deserved the sack he got in ct 2013 but somehow climbed back out with one 102 against Afghanistan In 2014 before regressing completly. Sarfraz was good enough that critics claimed he was oxygen for the team and was clearly > umar at the time.

Afterwards sarfraz throughout 2016 consistently outperformed azhar Ali whenever they were captains, during the first ever interatiom of psl, sarfri took the team to the final whereas azhar's LQ was the first team to get eliminated and not even reach group stages. On top of that sarfi's test form remained good and he scored a 100 from a collapsed position against England. Azhar deserved a sack and sarfi deserved his position.

Players like imad, Sarfraz, Shadab regressing so badly that they don't warrant a place anymore doesn't invalidate their 2015-2017 achievements just like umar akmal becoming a waste doesn't invalidate that in 2009 he clearly showed talent but ended up being a wasted career.

Nawaz on the other hand has never come close to anything, he's another shan masood who since day 1 has zero highlights minus one t20 innings against India where he saved grace with a 40 of 20 but then a year later was the cause of India winning with that stupid no ball he bowled and then a wide lol.

All the things you've said can easily be answered, but the issue is that if I give you answers, you'll just end up either increasing the number from 3 to 10 or 20 lol or you'll find some excuse to justify.

That's why I don't like engaging in favouritism based conversations because neutrality doesn't exist, most arguments end up being " No this player bad grrrrrrr".

Edit: I'm not singling you out BTW, I'm talking about general Pakistani fans across the nation who analyse based of favouritism

I asked a simple question. Could you give us 5 match winning performances from Imad. I will give you a head start. His innings against Afghanistan.

As I have said as bad as shadab is he has always performed better than Imad at ICC events. Shadab 4fer in the semi against Australia is better than Imad whole career combined.

 

[mominsaigol]

I asked a simple question. Could you give us 5 match winning performances from Imad. I will give you a head start. His innings against Afghanistan.

As I have said as bad as shadab is he has always performed better than Imad at ICC events. Shadab 4fer in the semi against Australia is better than Imad whole career combined.

Brother, you just confirmed what I said?

That you'd strawman the argument and started increasing number counts from 3 to 5? Lol.

 

[PakEngFan]

Brother, you just confirmed what I said?

That you'd strawman the argument and started increasing number counts from 3 to 5? Lol.

Give me 3 then? You said Imad won Pakistan countless matches and now struggling to give any. I hope you know the definition of countless.

 

[mominsaigol]

Give me 3 then? You said Imad won Pakistan countless matches and now struggling to give any. I hope you know the definition of countless.

Single handidely no one has won any match by themselves besides fakhar zaman in Pakistan.

All games were contributions, if I list all games where imad contributed such as taking 5 wickets against Ireland for only 15 runs given or scoring 25 vital runs to finish Pakistan for 338 in champions trophy final,

But no, that was a team effort, or he wasn't given man of the match etc etc but will say things on how babar single handidely dominated top string sides when he never did anything beyond score pointless 50 runs.

By this logic, Babar single handidely hasn't won any games against actual top string sides, just constant b and c string bullying while getting exposed in 2022 wc + 2023 asia cup and world cup.

truth is imad waseem is 100x the player shadab or nawaz will ever be, irrespective of any noise complaints from noisy neighbours or any psl sheinngangs.

Amd this is coming from someone who doesn't like imad and doesn't think he should return.

Edit: give me 3 examples of nawaz or shadab single handidely winning games for Pakistan, this is how silly your whole logic is.

 

[PakEngFan]

Single handidely no one has won any match by themselves besides fakhar zaman in Pakistan.

All games were contributions, if I list all games where imad contributed such as taking 5 wickets against Ireland for only 15 runs given or scoring 25 vital runs to finish Pakistan for 338 in champions trophy final,

But no, that was a team effort, or he wasn't given man of the match etc etc but will say things on how babar single handidely dominated top string sides when he never did anything beyond score pointless 50 runs.

By this logic, Babar single handidely hasn't won any games against actual top string sides, just constant b and c string bullying while getting exposed in 2022 wc + 2023 asia cup and world cup.

truth is imad waseem is 100x the player shadab or nawaz will ever be, irrespective of any noise complaints from noisy neighbours or any psl sheinngangs.

Amd this is coming from someone who doesn't like imad and doesn't think he should return.

Edit: give me 3 examples of nawaz or shadab single handidely winning games for Pakistan, this is how silly your whole logic is.

Lol at Ireland and 25 runs against India. I was expecting something better. I will just give you one each which is better than Imad against Ireland and 25 runs against India.

Shadab 50 at the world t20 against SA. Something Imad can only dream of. Nawaz 40 odd against India in Asia cup both better than Ireland lol.

I am not even going to talk about Babar knocks. You are talking about him scoring against b of c teams while bringing Ireland in defense of Imad. They height of hypocrisy. We know how much you don't like Imad by comparing him and Babar in the same sentence.

 

[Rana]

Single handidely no one has won any match by themselves besides fakhar zaman in Pakistan.

All games were contributions, if I list all games where imad contributed such as taking 5 wickets against Ireland for only 15 runs given or scoring 25 vital runs to finish Pakistan for 338 in champions trophy final,

But no, that was a team effort, or he wasn't given man of the match etc etc but will say things on how babar single handidely dominated top string sides when he never did anything beyond score pointless 50 runs.

By this logic, Babar single handidely hasn't won any games against actual top string sides, just constant b and c string bullying while getting exposed in 2022 wc + 2023 asia cup and world cup.

truth is imad waseem is 100x the player shadab or nawaz will ever be, irrespective of any noise complaints from noisy neighbours or any psl sheinngangs.

Amd this is coming from someone who doesn't like imad and doesn't think he should return.

Edit: give me 3 examples of nawaz or shadab single handidely winning games for Pakistan, this is how silly your whole logic is.

Imad’s importance is as a new ball bowler bowling dots in the powerplay. He is used by captains to get 2-3 overs out of the six in the powerplay for less than 8 an over. He won’t exactly run through teams and pick up a 5fer in his 4 overs.

Pakistan tried to make Nawaz and Shadab work (even outside of the powerplay) but those guys will gleefully give you 10+ an over. He can’t seem to understand what Imad offers and is hired for around the world

 

[topspin]

Single handidely no one has won any match by themselves besides fakhar zaman in Pakistan.

All games were contributions, if I list all games where imad contributed such as taking 5 wickets against Ireland for only 15 runs given or scoring 25 vital runs to finish Pakistan for 338 in champions trophy final,

But no, that was a team effort, or he wasn't given man of the match etc etc but will say things on how babar single handidely dominated top string sides when he never did anything beyond score pointless 50 runs.

By this logic, Babar single handidely hasn't won any games against actual top string sides, just constant b and c string bullying while getting exposed in 2022 wc + 2023 asia cup and world cup.

truth is imad waseem is 100x the player shadab or nawaz will ever be, irrespective of any noise complaints from noisy neighbours or any psl sheinngangs.

Amd this is coming from someone who doesn't like imad and doesn't think he should return.

Edit: give me 3 examples of nawaz or shadab single handidely winning games for Pakistan, this is how silly your whole logic is.

I agree with Rana, no point arguing with him. He’s got some next level agenda against Imad.

During the PSL season, there is a recurring pattern of him bashing Imad on daily basis. This also happened during last year’s PSL despite his stellar batting performances for the Karachi Kings.

 

[mominsaigol]

I agree with Rana, no point arguing with him. He’s got some next level agenda against Imad.

During the PSL season, there is a recurring pattern of him bashing Imad on daily basis. This also happened during last year’s PSL despite his stellar batting performances for the Karachi Kings.

Ic, AlrightE then

 

[mominsaigol]

Imad’s importance is as a new ball bowler bowling dots in the powerplay. He is used by captains to get 2-3 overs out of the six in the powerplay for less than 8 an over. He won’t exactly run through teams and pick up a 5fer in his 4 overs.

Pakistan tried to make Nawaz and Shadab work (even outside of the powerplay) but those guys will gleefully give you 10+ an over. He can’t seem to understand what Imad offers and is hired for around the world

The thing is, this back and forth argument goes nowhere as no one in our unit has ever won a game for Pakistan single handidely except for fakhar so I don't get the whole imad sucks cause he can't single handidely win game but nawaz scored this 40 of 20 2 years back and that ignores him being in the same league as Joe root as a bowler and amongst the worst batsmen I've ever seen.

 

[daytrader]

I agree with Rana, no point arguing with him. He’s got some next level agenda against Imad.

During the PSL season, there is a recurring pattern of him bashing Imad on daily basis. This also happened during last year’s PSL despite his stellar batting performances for the Karachi Kings.

How's that any different from your agenda of bashing Misbah and Rizwan in every other post?

We've moved on from Imad. If he performs in the knockouts then he has a chance but looking real slim right now

 

[daytrader]

The thing is, this back and forth argument goes nowhere as no one in our unit has ever won a game for Pakistan single handidely except for fakhar so I don't get the whole imad sucks cause he can't single handidely win game but nawaz scored this 40 of 20 2 years back and that ignores him being in the same league as Joe root as a bowler and amongst the worst batsmen I've ever seen.

You'll have posters tell you that it wasn't Fakhar that won us the CT17 final, it was Amir

 

[mominsaigol]

You'll have posters tell you that it wasn't Fakhar that won us the CT17 final, it was Amir

It was both and an entire team effort. And I wasn't talking about ct 2017 when I said fakhar single handidely won games for Pakistan.

Fakhar single handidely won the game for us when NZ posted 400, since without his 60 ball 100, we'd have never crossed the established rr before rain intervened, it doesn't help that babar at the other end wasn't exactly bashing but credit to babar for atleast rotation strike back.

Fakhar also single handidely murked the NZ c string team during the 2nd odi, since his 180 meant that any other batsmen could score soft 30 or 40's and we'd still win and chase the 300+ score down.

Ct 2017 was a team effort, fakhar's 100, azhar's partnership, hafeez's and imad's finish, the timely wicket for yuvi from shadab, the brilliant run out of pandya, amir's Superman opening spell, etc etc

 

[topspin]

How's that any different from your agenda of bashing Misbah and Rizwan in every other post?

We've moved on from Imad. If he performs in the knockouts then he has a chance but looking real slim right now

My criticism of Misbah (and anyone else) is STRICTLY for cricketing reasons. If you don’t agree it, you’re more than welcome to try and change my mind. If you’re sincere and this is of interest, please refer to post 32 which can be found in the following thread:

"If I was asked individually, I wouldn’t have been satisfied to play one down, but I did it for Pakistan": Babar Azam

Following Peshawar Zalmi's two-run victory against Karachi Kings, Babar was questioned about the significance of his runs as an opener after being demoted to one down spot in the Pakistan team, He said: "When you talked about me being under a lot of pressure, or if playing as an opener puts a...

ppforum.pakpassion.net

But there’s no point going down this road if you’re not going to be a sincere as I’ve already established that you’re incapable of acknowledging, let alone, addressing any of Misbah’s flaws.

As for Imad, he’s retired from international cricket and even he was still up for selection, as things stand, he shouldn’t be selected for the T20 WC later this year because he hasn’t played well enough in this tournament.

What you have to remember is I don’t stick up for Imad because I believe he’s some elite cricketer. He’s far from it. I defend him from toxic Babar/Rizwan/Misbah fans, who can’t move on from his interviews.

But it’s not just Imad who’s been critical of Babar. Simon Doull has recieved death threats and Wasim Akram has been turned on for sharing the same sentiment as Imad by these toxic cult followers of Babar/Rizwan/Misbah.

Supporters like yourself and PakEngFan are also part of the problem. Another example is Major, who last year wanted Doull to be cancelled.

Anyone with blind hate for Imad should be called out and exposed.

 

[mominsaigol]

My criticism of Misbah (and anyone else) is STRICTLY for cricketing reasons. If you don’t agree it, you’re more than welcome to try and change my mind. If you’re sincere and this is of interest, please refer to post 32 which can be found in the following thread:

"If I was asked individually, I wouldn’t have been satisfied to play one down, but I did it for Pakistan": Babar Azam

Following Peshawar Zalmi's two-run victory against Karachi Kings, Babar was questioned about the significance of his runs as an opener after being demoted to one down spot in the Pakistan team, He said: "When you talked about me being under a lot of pressure, or if playing as an opener puts a...

ppforum.pakpassion.net

But there’s no point going down this road if you’re not going to be a sincere as I’ve already established that you’re incapable of acknowledging, let alone, addressing any of Misbah’s flaws.

As for Imad, he’s retired from international cricket and even he was still up for selection, as things stand, he shouldn’t be selected for the T20 WC later this year because he hasn’t played well enough in this tournament.

What you have to remember is I don’t stick up for Imad because I believe he’s some elite cricketer. He’s far from it. I defend him from toxic Babar/Rizwan/Misbah fans, who can’t move on from his interviews.

But it’s not just Imad who’s been critical of Babar. Simon Doull has recieved death threats and Wasim Akram has been turned on for sharing the same sentiment as Imad by these toxic cult followers of Babar/Rizwan/Misbah.

Supporters like yourself and PakEngFan are also part of the problem. Another example is Major, who last year wanted Doull to be cancelled.

Anyone with blind hate for Imad should be called out and exposed.

Babar/Rizwan/Misbah fans: You are toxic and a hater.

10 mins later: Hey guys let's send death threats and try to dox this celebrity talking trash to babar on twitter

 

[BouncerGuy]

Guys, enough of this derailing discussion now. If you cannot talk about Shan in this thread, you should leave this thread, please. The whole discussion of this thread has now been shifted towards Babar, imad stuff. Please refrain from this now otherwise all irrelevant posts will be removed now.

 

[mominsaigol]

Guys, enough of this derailing discussion now. If you cannot talk about Shan in this thread, you should leave this thread, please. The whole discussion of this thread has now been shifted towards Babar, imad stuff. Please refrain from this now otherwise all irrelevant posts will be removed now.

Oh sorry, my bad, I actually didn't realise the thread, I was moving from notification to notification answering questions and analysing.

I'll be more mindful and double check the threads next time. My bad.

 

[BouncerGuy]

Oh sorry, my bad, I actually didn't realise the thread, I was moving from notification to notification answering questions and analysing.

I'll be more mindful and double check the threads next time. My bad.

Thanks for understanding. We do not want anyone to stop posting but he should be keeping in mind the integrity of the forum and the threads as well.

BTW, Shan has been the worst pick for Karachi. Karachi made a mess of their team combination. Letting go Babar and Imad, Amir was a huge mistake. Shan is just not good enough.

 

[mominsaigol]

Thanks for understanding. We do not want anyone to stop posting but he should be keeping in mind the integrity of the forum and the threads as well.

BTW, Shan has been the worst pick for Karachi. Karachi made a mess of their team combination. Letting go Babar and Imad, Amir was a huge mistake. Shan is just not good enough.

Shan has and never will be good enough.

Look for shan supporters I get it, public/cyber/physical bullying is not okay and calling him a parchi and uploading on social media isn't great, not claiming pakistani fans are saints or anything,

But I can't deny that pakistani fans are right, he is a parchi, what else do we call him? And uploading to social media is the only way fans voices can be heard? It's not like pcb ever listens unless their hand is forced.

If I was shan, I'd never take captaincy, I'd have tried cricket 10 years ago and after a few failures and realising I am not good enough, I'd quot and take a management position in pcb and replace .y father after he retires.

Think about how much good shan xould achieve since he is educated and smart enough to implement changes.

But nahi, zidi bachei.

 

[BouncerGuy]

Shan has and never will be good enough.

Look for shan supporters I get it, public/cyber/physical bullying is not okay and calling him a parchi and uploading on social media isn't great, not claiming pakistani fans are saints or anything,

But I can't deny that pakistani fans are right, he is a parchi, what else do we call him? And uploading to social media is the only way fans voices can be heard? It's not like pcb ever listens unless their hand is forced.

If I was shan, I'd never take captaincy, I'd have tried cricket 10 years ago and after a few failures and realising I am not good enough, I'd quot and take a management position in pcb and replace .y father after he retires.

Think about how much good shan xould achieve since he is educated and smart enough to implement changes.

But nahi, zidi bachei.

Shan attracts so much criticism because he scores heavily in domestic games but he fails when he faces quality bowling. His technique has not changed since 1000 BC. Looks like he is taking things for granted.

 

[mominsaigol]

Shan attracts so much criticism because he scores heavily in domestic games but he fails when he faces quality bowling. His technique has not changed since 1000 BC. Looks like he is taking things for granted.

He attracts criticisms because he's Peak nepotism and he knows this.

A man who could have made internal changes in management thanks to his good educational background is playing cricket like a commoner.

So stupid, that's like if I get a PhD and decide to become a cricketer? It takes years and years and decades of training to become a cricketer. Kohli's been playing since he was 10?

Cricket is a serious career, and one should commit to it, someone who has a degree in management shpuld use using his skills to be a better manager.

Looney toon logic employed by shan.

 

[BouncerGuy]

He attracts criticisms because he's Peak nepotism and he knows this.

A man who could have made internal changes in management thanks to his good educational background is playing cricket like a commoner.

So stupid, that's like if I get a PhD and decide to become a cricketer? It takes years and years and decades of training to become a cricketer. Kohli's been playing since he was 10?

Cricket is a serious career, and one should commit to it, someone who has a degree in management shpuld use using his skills to be a better manager.

Looney toon logic employed by shan.

Nepotism is a thing found in every field around the world but yes, Pakistan has seen more of it. Not sure if he will still be the captain of Karachi kings after his miserable campaign in PSL 9.

 

[mominsaigol]

Nepotism is a thing found in every field around the world but yes, Pakistan has seen more of it. Not sure if he will still be the captain of Karachi kings after his miserable campaign in PSL 9.

Nepotism is different from networking man, taylor swift is only in this position cause her parents literally named her after a singer and at 14 just sent her to a record label company, and even after multiple early failures, kept giving her a financial push, that doesn't mean we should start making hate pages, because taylor swift is clearly the greatest female songwriter of this generation and arguably top 5 best female singers. Same can be said for football legend neymar etc etc. Heck I'm making 150K aud a year despite still being a part time master student, only because my uncle owns the ad agency otherwise i wouldnt get the job, but he took me rather then his own kid, cause literally no one can make fx, vfx, or motion graphical ads or graphic design that I can, I've been operating and using said Softwares for over 6 years now, even if they are people superior to me, it's only slightly, and their not family members so they won't be as loyal to the company.

No one would care if shan was a good cricket player, even if he wasn't the best, if he was capable of doing anything that rizwan, Babar, fakhar or any of our openers can do, then the heat wouldn't be that high.

Anil ambani is another example, nepotism is literally networking but without the skills, so you end up hiring a brain dead moron who ruins everything.

Their people out their way more privileged then I am, far more, heck shan is ironically more privileged then any of us here, I'm 100% sure he's making 30x the amount I'm making, no question, he's defo a multi millionaire, but does he deserve it? Ask yourself that.

 

[BouncerGuy]

Nepotism is different from networking man, taylor swift is only in this position cause her parents literally named her after a singer and at 14 just sent her to a record label company, and even after multiple early failures, kept giving her a financial push, that doesn't mean we should start making hate pages, because taylor swift is clearly the greatest female songwriter of this generation and arguably top 5 best female singers. Same can be said for football legend neymar etc etc. Heck I'm making 150K aud a year despite still being a part time master student, only because my uncle owns the ad agency otherwise i wouldnt get the job, but he took me rather then his own kid, cause literally no one can make fx, vfx, or motion graphical ads or graphic design that I can, I've been operating and using said Softwares for over 6 years now, even if they are people superior to me, it's only slightly, and their not family members so they won't be as loyal to the company.

No one would care if shan was a good cricket player, even if he wasn't the best, if he was capable of doing anything that rizwan, Babar, fakhar or any of our openers can do, then the heat wouldn't be that high.

Anil ambani is another example, nepotism is literally networking but without the skills, so you end up hiring a brain dead moron who ruins everything.

Their people out their way more privileged then I am, far more, heck shan is ironically more privileged then any of us here, I'm 100% sure he's making 30x the amount I'm making, no question, he's defo a multi millionaire, but does he deserve it? Ask yourself that.

I will not go into Shan's money etc. But yes, he was fast-tracked into the team and people chatter about how it happened as well. Hope either he improves his batting, else he leave the field.

 

[mominsaigol]

I will not go into Shan's money etc. But yes, he was fast-tracked into the team and people chatter about how it happened as well. Hope either he improves his batting, else he leave the field.

I'm saying the guy makes money that he simply does not deserve. What is he being payed for if his profession involves batting and management and fielding and he's failing at all 3? He deserves a boot.

He wasn't fast tracked into the team, he was quote literally shoved into a box, and mailed off to the finish line while everyone else was busy running to the finish line like hard workers.

To bad he got mailed off at the wrong address.

 

[BouncerGuy]

I'm saying the guy makes money that he simply does not deserve. What is he being payed for if his profession involves batting and management and fielding and he's failing at all 3? He deserves a boot.

He wasn't fast tracked into the team, he was quote literally shoved into a box, and mailed off to the finish line while everyone else was busy running to the finish line like hard workers.

To bad he got mailed off at the wrong address.

I hope he can somehow improves his cricket because he is now Pakista test captain sp he is not going anywhere. Hoping to see his big knocks and praying for his success along with Pakistan's.

 

[PakEngFan]

I agree with Rana, no point arguing with him. He’s got some next level agenda against Imad.

During the PSL season, there is a recurring pattern of him bashing Imad on daily basis. This also happened during last year’s PSL despite his stellar batting performances for the Karachi Kings.

All I asked was for 3 match winning performances for a mentally strong beast Imad. When initially I was told he won countless of games for Pakistan. In return I get Ireland and 25 runs against India. Can you do any better for "winning mentality"?

I have given 1 performance each from the 2 "softies' which are as good as if not better than mental beast Imad.

 

[mominsaigol]

All I asked was for 3 match winning performances for a mentally strong beast Imad. When initially I was told he won countless of games for Pakistan. In return I get Ireland and 25 runs against India. Can you do any better for "winning mentality"?

I have given 1 performance each from the 2 "softies' which are as good as if not better than mental beast Imad.

Your answer is bogus, neither of the those games you highlighted involved sheddy or nawaz doing anything on their own.

As I said ors excuses upon excuses but khair, go on ig.

 

[PakEngFan]

Your answer is bogus, neither of the those games you highlighted involved sheddy or nawaz doing anything on their own.

As I said ors excuses upon excuses but khair, go on ig.

You were going to give us countless match winning performances from Imad, where are they? If according to you 25 runs from Imad is match winning then the innings which I mentioned are far better. Any way my last post on this topic.

 

[mominsaigol]

You were going to give us countless match winning performances from Imad, where are they? If according to you 25 runs from Imad is match winning then the innings which I mentioned are far better. Any way my last post on this topic.

The countless wasn't actually meant to be literal, and you even know that, it's a figure of expression.

I can give matches, tons of em where imad has performed, but you took extremities and phrased it as imad single handidely winning games when no one in Pakistan has ever dome that, cases like these are far and few in between like maxwell.

You didn't give any about nawaz either, and remember NAWAZ was the one called up to replace imad, don't know why you keep using sheddy as an example when both played 2017 cup in different roles.

 

[Rana]

You'll have posters tell you that it wasn't Fakhar that won us the CT17 final, it was Amir

Fakhar’s contribution that day was brilliant especially for someone playing his 3rd or 4th ODI but in essence, it was a par contribution on a flat/road wicket. He batted through and got a hundred in less than a run a ball and a little bit more. There was also some decent contributions from Babar and Malik, but Hafeez really added the killer touch with his exquisite 25 ball 50, Imad also added some lusty blows at the end to take Pakistan to a competitive total of 335.

Was this enough runs against India though? In a final of an ICC tournament, maybe…

in general evidence of how ODI cricket was being played by the best teams on flat decks, it was going to require a solid bowling effort. For this, Yes indeed it was Muhammad Amir’s opening spell to fist remove Rohit Sharma who probably would settle in and cause significant damage as the innings progresses, and also to remove the bonafide king of chase and Pakistan’s most difficult Indian opponent Virat Kohli. That wicket of Kohli had EVERYTHING riding upon it.

Decades will pass, Pakistan may never win another ICC trophy, but that wicket of Kohli, those celebrations of the players, fans and the management will forever be remembered again and again. It was truly one of the most significant cricketing moments in the history of Pakistan cricket.

 

[Rana]

The countless wasn't actually meant to be literal, and you even know that, it's a figure of expression.

I can give matches, tons of em where imad has performed, but you took extremities and phrased it as imad single handidely winning games when no one in Pakistan has ever dome that, cases like these are far and few in between like maxwell.

You didn't give any about nawaz either, and remember NAWAZ was the one called up to replace imad, don't know why you keep using sheddy as an example when both played 2017 cup in different roles.

The definition of ‘singlehandedly’ winning a game is when a player plays a blinder as a batter or bowler whilst all else have failed. I can recall Kapil Dev scoring 175 when everyone else had completely failed. Who in the history of Pakistan has played such a hand either with the bat or the ball? There must be examples but they are so scarce.

However, the expectation from Imad is that he should be able to do this every other game otherwise he is the worst thing to represent Pakistan lol

 

[mominsaigol]

The definition of ‘singlehandedly’ winning a game is when a player plays a blinder as a batter or bowler whilst all else have failed. I can recall Kapil Dev scoring 175 when everyone else had completely failed. Who in the history of Pakistan has played such a hand either with the bat or the ball? There must be examples but they are so scarce.

However, the expectation from Imad is that he should be able to do this every other game otherwise he is the worst thing to represent Pakistan lol

Yeah because Rizwan, Babar, Nawaz and Shadab play blinders 24/7 lol.

 

[PakEngFan]

The countless wasn't actually meant to be literal, and you even know that, it's a figure of expression.

I can give matches, tons of em where imad has performed, but you took extremities and phrased it as imad single handidely winning games when no one in Pakistan has ever dome that, cases like these are far and few in between like maxwell.

You didn't give any about nawaz either, and remember NAWAZ was the one called up to replace imad, don't know why you keep using sheddy as an example when both played 2017 cup in different roles.

So now you are back tracking as expected. I would too if I could only come up with 25 runs as match winning. I haven't asked you to list game where he won us single handedly. Just match winning ones where you said countless times.

Instead of concentrating in writing essays which don't make sense it will be best if you read other people posts. I gave you 1 from nawaz. Let me give it to you again 40 odd in the Asia cup t20 which proved the main reason for our win.

Now please give us a few of the countless match winning contributions from Imad. If you can't then stop posting irrelevant stuff.

 

[PakEngFan]

Yeah because Rizwan, Babar, Nawaz and Shadab play blinders 24/7 lol.

They don't and they can't but they score more than 25 runs or against Ireland lol. As someone rightly pointed out recently you need to watch more cricket.

 

[Cricket Warrior]

Shan Masood in PSL 9

Match's : 10
Run's : 158
Strike Rate : 105.33
Average: 15.80

30,12,10,27,2,36,7,10,24,0

Worst player ever picked by Karachi Kings in this season of PSL 9.

 

[mominsaigol]

Shan Masood in PSL 9

Match's : 10
Run's : 158
Strike Rate : 105.33
Average: 15.80

30,12,10,27,2,36,7,10,24,0

Worst player ever picked by Karachi Kings in this season of PSL 9.

If you open the Oxford dictionary, and search the word failure, you'll be greeted with a screenshot of Shan masood.

 

[YousafTheBeast]

99.99% of the people could see before hand what was going to be the end result, even Shan knew it.

The moment they replaced a PSL GOAT opener with the biggest parchi known to mankind was the very moment Haidar Azhar dug his own grave.

Out of those 10 innings, Sharjeel would’ve won you 2-3 games minimum on his own. That alone would’ve been enough for KK to secure a top 4 spot.

 

[bones]

99.99% of the people could see before hand what was going to be the end result, even Shan knew it.

The moment they replaced a PSL GOAT opener with the biggest parchi known to mankind was the very moment Haidar Azhar dug his own grave.

Out of those 10 innings, Sharjeel would’ve won you 2-3 games minimum on his own. That alone would’ve been enough for KK to secure a top 4 spot.

I agree Shan is utter garbage and should never play at even domestic level. But would Sharjeel have been able to get past 20 before huffing and puffing himself out? These players should be nowhere near competition.

 

[Mamoon]

99.99% of the people could see before hand what was going to be the end result, even Shan knew it.

The moment they replaced a PSL GOAT opener with the biggest parchi known to mankind was the very moment Haidar Azhar dug his own grave.

Out of those 10 innings, Sharjeel would’ve won you 2-3 games minimum on his own. That alone would’ve been enough for KK to secure a top 4 spot.

Masood is a clown. Always was and always will be and if you compare him Sharjeel in isolation, of course Sharjeel is better.

However, Sharjeel is terrible in his own right and his deluded fans should accept the fact that he is not the player they think he is.

He got a long rope by Karachi for two seasons and did nothing. This narrative that he will win X number of games on his own needs to die now. Same was said before he returned to PSL after his ban and he flopped even though Babar did his best to carry him.

Karachi did the right thing by booting him, Imad and Amir out but then they took three steps back by roping in the worst batsman to ever play for Pakistan.

 

[Mamoon]

@topspin What do you admire about Masood’s captaincy? English doesn’t count.

Please don’t bottle this question again. It appears that you have backtracked on the garbage “he has greatly improved as a batsman” narrative and now I am lookin forward to you backtracking on the myth about his captaincy.

Both his batting and captaincy are equally rubbish.

 

[Mamoon]

Shan rightly deserves to be Testv captain and is reasonably good as a batter for our standards. As a captain, he makes up for any incompetencies in batting.

As for captaining PSL, he’s had one bad season. I remember everyone was crying for him to be in the national side after last years PSL. Fans need to stop being so fickle and look at their old posts.

Maybe his T20 time is up but he’s not here on the basis of nepotism.

This is a prime example of why some people will never accept the fact that he is an awful batsman. Always was and always will be.

No matter how you spin it, you cannot defend a 34 year old Test batsman who averages 28 after 33 Tests.

There is no excuse and no justification for this embarrassing record. The only explanation is that he is dreadful.

Pakistan has poor batting standards but he is awful even for Pakistan standards. The worst batsman ever to play a substantial number of Tests for the country.

The narrative that he has improved is also a myth because his numbers pre and post 2019 are almost equally shocking.

As far as his captaincy is concerned, you first need to make the best XI before you can become captain and Masood doesn’t make the best XI.

Secondly, you and others keep making excuses for his captaincy and throwing XYZ players under the bus, like Shaheen etc.

The excuse is that there is nothing Masood can do if other players are not delivering. However, that is exactly the point.

Masood is handicapped by the same issues that other captains are and he will win Tests if others are playing well and he will lose Tests if others are not playing well, so then what is the point of having such a garbage player as your captain when he is not capable of pulling his own weight?

He is so bad that his fans start doing bhangra when he scores more than 35 runs.

If Masood was some miracle worker as captain and would find a way to win games and the constraints that apply to other captains wouldn’t apply to him, I would accept him as captain in spite of his awful batting, but the fact that he got whitewashed in Australia like everyone else and led his team of humiliation in PSL tells me that there is no logic and sense in persisting with him as captain.

He needs to be kicked out of Pakistan in all formats and also the PSL because he brings zero value. He should stick of County Div 2 which is his standard. He also gets exposed in County Div 1.

I sometimes wonder what it will take for some people to accept that he is a nothing player and a nothing captain.

 

[mazkhan]

It's a travesty that shahzads career has been killed off for nepotism that is shan masood.

Poor ahmad shahzad

 

[mominsaigol]

This is a prime example of why some people will never accept the fact that he is an awful batsman. Always was and always will be.

No matter how you spin it, you cannot defend a 34 year old Test batsman who averages 28 after 33 Tests.

There is no excuse and no justification for this embarrassing record. The only explanation is that he is dreadful.

Pakistan has poor batting standards but he is awful even for Pakistan standards. The worst batsman ever to play a substantial number of Tests for the country.

The narrative that he has improved is also a myth because his numbers pre and post 2019 are almost equally shocking.

As far as his captaincy is concerned, you first need to make the best XI before you can become captain and Masood doesn’t make the best XI.

Secondly, you and others keep making excuses for his captaincy and throwing XYZ players under the bus, like Shaheen etc.

The excuse is that there is nothing Masood can do if other players are not delivering. However, that is exactly the point.

Masood is handicapped by the same issues that other captains are and he will win Tests if others are playing well and he will lose Tests if others are not playing well, so then what is the point of having such a garbage player as your captain when he is not capable of pulling his own weight?

He is so bad that his fans start doing bhangra when he scores more than 35 runs.

If Masood was some miracle worker as captain and would find a way to win games and the constraints that apply to other captains wouldn’t apply to him, I would accept him as captain in spite of his awful batting, but the fact that he got whitewashed in Australia like everyone else and led his team of humiliation in PSL tells me that there is no logic and sense in persisting with him as captain.

He needs to be kicked out of Pakistan in all formats and also the PSL because he brings zero value. He should stick of County Div 2 which is his standard. He also gets exposed in County Div 1.

I sometimes wonder what it will take for some people to accept that he is a nothing player and a nothing captain.

Honestly I'd accept masood even if he wasn't a miracle worker and just a good batsmen.

Its not that he's average, he's literally the worst batsmen on the entire international dugout, literally can't think of anyone worse and that's saying something considering this is Pakistan lol.