Which team has the weakest lower order in the ICC World Cup 2023?

[happydavy]

7. Shardul Thakur
8. Jadeja/ Ashwin
9. Mohammed Siraj
10. Kuldeep Yadav
11. Bumrah / Mohammed Shami

This is going to be the lower order of Indian lineup throughout the cup. Is this the absolute worst in this WC? In 2011, people don't appreciate much the brilliant role played by Suresh Raina at no: 7 and won us a couple of knock out matches.

 

[Rana]

I would argue:

4. Rizwan
5. Salman
6. Nawaz
7. Shadab
8. Iftikhar

 

[Asad T]

7. Shardul Thakur
8. Jadeja/ Ashwin
9. Mohammed Siraj
10. Kuldeep Yadav
11. Bumrah / Mohammed Shami

This is going to be the lower order of Indian lineup throughout the cup. Is this the absolute worst in this WC? In 2011, people don't appreciate much the brilliant role played by Suresh Raina at no: 7 and won us a couple of knock out matches.

Perhaps, but luckily for them, the quality from 1-6 is exceptional

 

[AAli98]

I would argue:

4. Rizwan
5. Salman
6. Nawaz
7. Shadab
8. Iftikhar

Pray the top 4 bat till at least 42nd over even if it means scraping to 240ish If salmans batting anywhere near 30th over Pak are in deep trouble.

 

[Rana]

Pray the top 4 bat till at least 42nd over even if it means scraping to 240ish If salmans batting anywhere near 30th over Pak are in deep trouble.

Top 3 brother

Top 3

 

[AAli98]

Top 3 brother

Top 3

That’s his last odi innings let’s cut him some slack.. Lankan bowlers didn’t knw where to hide.

M. Rizwan (Wk)

86

73

6

2

117.81

 

[Rana]

That’s his last odi innings let’s cut him some slack.. Lankan bowlers didn’t knw where to hide.

M. Rizwan (Wk)

86

73

6

2

117.81

He should have been out on 11

I saw what I must

 

[hassan918]

I would argue:

4. Rizwan
5. Salman
6. Nawaz
7. Shadab
8. Iftikhar

I think Saud will play at 5 instead of Salman and why did you put Iftikhar at 8?

 

[Rana]

I think Saud will play at 5 instead of Salman and why did you put Iftikhar at 8?

What number do I put him?

 

[Cricket Warrior]

I would argue:

4. Rizwan
5. Salman
6. Nawaz
7. Shadab
8. Iftikhar

i think best suitable position for Iftikhar to bat is 6 because he is not that kind of player who will come and start hitting the ball, he always need a bit of time to get settled so i think sending him much late down the order is not quite unjustified.

 

[Rana]

i think best suitable position for Iftikhar to bat is 6 because he is not that kind of player who will come and start hitting the ball, he always need a bit of time to get settled so i think sending him much late down the order is not quite unjustified.

Right, fair enough. I would argue 5 after Saud at four. More importantly, he is one of the few players that genuinely BAT in this side. He’s not a batting all rounder. He’s a batsman, a proper batsman! He is a part time offie and should only bowl to get through overs against left handers at the crease.

 

[Cricket Warrior]

Right, fair enough. I would argue 5 after Saud at four. More importantly, he is one of the few players that genuinely BAT in this side. He’s not a batting all rounder. He’s a batsman, a proper batsman! He is a part time offie and should only bowl to get through overs against left handers at the crease.

i dont think they gonna giva a chance to saud shakeel which he actually highly deserves because he is the one who can play spin better than any other member of the squad right now.

so eventually our tail will get started from 6 i reckon!

 

[Justcrazy]

India should not bother about tail rather go with strongest possible bowling Bumrah , Shami , Siraj , kuldeep / ashwin and jadeja.

 

[Rana]

i dont think they gonna giva a chance to saud shakeel which he actually highly deserves because he is the one who can play spin better than any other member of the squad right now.

so eventually our tail will get started from 6 i reckon!

At 4 bro. It started at 4 against Sri Lanka too. It was a total mess. Hoping for something to click rather than a proper plan

Your 3,4,5 need to be proper Test class batsmen.

Babar at 3 is proper. I don’t hate Rizwan and it’s fine he should play, but he shouldn’t be in the top 5

 

[Farabi]

I would argue:

4. Rizwan
5. Salman
6. Nawaz
7. Shadab
8. Iftikhar

Question said lower order not middle order.
Also Ifti and Rizzy have been in good form. Surprised to see him at no8. Takes away from the authenticity of your argument

 

[Farabi]

Weakest lower order 8, 9, 10, and 11 has to be India’s and Bangla’s. Pretty bad

 

[Rana]

Question said lower order not middle order.
Also Ifti and Rizzy have been in good form. Surprised to see him at no8. Takes away from the authenticity of your argument

I put Ifti at 8 because that’s where he has batted in 2 games recently, or 7.

Maybe you should question PCB management’s authenticity?

 

[Cricket Warrior]

At 4 bro. It started at 4 against Sri Lanka too. It was a total mess. Hoping for something to click rather than a proper plan

Your 3,4,5 need to be proper Test class batsmen.

Babar at 3 is proper. I don’t hate Rizwan and it’s fine he should play, but he shouldn’t be in the top 5

I think to further solifdy the middle order they can play abdullah in Middle Order, there is no need to go with nawaz when Iftikhar can also bowl. i think we can do the adjustment like this:

Fakhar
Imam
Babar
Saud (can bowl as well)
Abdullah
Rizwan
Iftikhar
Shadab
Shaheen
Hassan
Haris

 

[topspin]

If we exclude Netherlands, Afghanistan and etc, it has to be Pakistan. Imad's absence will be felt during the tournament.

 

[Rana]

I think to further solifdy the middle order they can play abdullah in Middle Order, there is no need to go with nawaz when Iftikhar can also bowl. i think we can do the adjustment like this:

Fakhar
Imam
Babar
Saud (can bowl as well)
Abdullah
Rizwan
Iftikhar
Shadab
Shaheen
Hassan
Haris

Looks good to me

 

[deltexas]

Excluding Netherlands and Afghanistan's- it has to be India. Bumrah Shami Siraj Kuldeep- horrible tail . All 4 wickets possible in one over ala Malibga! But still better to pick quality bowlers like these 4 vs players like jadeja or thakur

 

[Ab Fan]

In white ball cricket, Ashwin is just a slight upgrade over Jadeja. He is still no match to Kuldeep. But he is better than Shardul/Axar although Axar is a more capable impact bat at 8.

7. Jadeja( never shown any impact with bat)
8. Ashwin( Shami on Ahmedabad,Dharamshala type wicket)
9. Bumrah
10. Kuldeep
11. Siraj

 

[Farabi]

I put Ifti at 8 because that’s where he has batted in 2 games recently, or 7.

Maybe you should question PCB management’s authenticity?

Not really. He has been pretty regular at no6.
Rizwan averages 63 at the no4 slot with a SR of 93 in 2023 so far.
Ifti, who has played majority of his games at no6, and just 3 games at no7, averages 69 with a SR of 110 in 2023 so far.

Pakistan’s middle order is no longer as big an issue in ODIs as people are making it out to be.

Shadab, Nawaz, Hassan Ali, Shaheen, and Rauf also OK for no7, 8, 9, 10, and 11.

Only problems right now in batting are no5 slot and the form of Fakhar.

 

[giri26]

India's lower order is the worst. None of India's bowlers can actually bat. This becomes a problem due to which India are having to play Shardul. If not India would be going with Shami, Bumrah & Siraj.

 

[giri26]

In white ball cricket, Ashwin is just a slight upgrade over Jadeja. He is still no match to Kuldeep. But he is better than Shardul/Axar although Axar is a more capable impact bat at 8.

7. Jadeja( never shown any impact with bat)
8. Ashwin( Shami on Ahmedabad,Dharamshala type wicket)
9. Bumrah
10. Kuldeep
11. Siraj

Kuldeep has a decent FC record with a hundred and 6 fifties but hasn't done anything at the international level. Jadeja in this format is a worry as he has struggled over the last 2 years. That's why I am surprised that we never tried someone like Shreyas Gopal in the ODI setup. He could bat and he is a wrist spinner as well with good List A record.

 

[Ab Fan]

Kuldeep has a decent FC record with a hundred and 6 fifties but hasn't done anything at the international level. Jadeja in this format is a worry as he has struggled over the last 2 years. That's why I am surprised that we never tried someone like Shreyas Gopal in the ODI setup. He could bat and he is a wrist spinner as well with good List A record.

Kuldeep in white ball cricket is just a blocker. His utility is worse than Shami and Bumrah.

Shreyas Gopal is a huge downgrade as a bowler to Kuldeep. We are better going with Bishnoi instead of Shreyas Gopal as former is a better batsman than kuldeep for white ball cricket. You have to be a smart batter, not necessarily technically sound at 8-9.

 

[BunnyRabbit]

India, Netherlands, SL (without Hasaranga).
Eng and NZ have the strongest.

SA's lower order isn't that strong this time if they play Shamsi ahead of Maharaj. Rabada can bat but doubt he can hit around.

 

[ExpressPacer]

Excluding Netherlands and Afghanistan's- it has to be India. Bumrah Shami Siraj Kuldeep- horrible tail . All 4 wickets possible in one over ala Malibga! But still better to pick quality bowlers like these 4 vs players like jadeja or thakur

You guys are trying too hard to reverse-jinx or have become ultra pessimistic like Pakistan fans on PP.

Don't know much about the rest but Bumrah is a fine batsman. I have seen him consistently make contributions lower down the order. Also, doesn't he have a 30+ run over in Tests?

 

[MANU ROY]

Definitely India

 

[ArabKnight]

I would argue:

4. Rizwan
5. Salman
6. Nawaz
7. Shadab
8. Iftikhar

I know Shoaib Malik can’t buy a run these days. But, seriously. I’m sure could’ve done better than most of these names on here. It’s only fair that he gets to retire at his wife’s home country (India).

As we know, Shoaib Malik is someone who keeps making big public statements about Babar. Hence, he’s not selected.

These days, stroking captain’s egos is more important than winning the World Cup in Pakistan.

Babar Azam can’t never be like Imran Khan and repeat 1992 heroics.

Bring back the days, when players used to physically fight in the locker-rooms & get back on the field to win matches. It’s a national cricket team, not some buddies club that play in playgrounds and travel around the world.

 

[Rana]

“Pakistan’s middle order is no longer as big an issue in ODIs as people are making it out to be.”

Yeah just like that. Flick of the switch

 

[pratiktc]

Best depth is with England with Woakes #9 and Adil #10

Second are Australia who have striking ability upto #9 thanks to Cummins and Starc

Pakistan is prolly 3rd best with Nawaz- Shaheen- Hasan at #8-10 but will be hamstrung on depth if Wasim Jr has to replace Nawaz.

New Zealand are in a dicey position where they can play Neesham and Santner at #7-8 to lengthen batting but then have to squeeze 10 ovs out of Philips + Neesham+Daryl

Least depth is India and South Africa who both are pretty weak with Thakur/Ashwin/Maharaj helming #8

Rest of the teams aren't only there to try for upsets so doesn't really matter what their composition is like.

 

[deltexas]

You guys are trying too hard to reverse-jinx or have become ultra pessimistic like Pakistan fans on PP.

Don't know much about the rest but Bumrah is a fine batsman. I have seen him consistently make contributions lower down the order. Also, doesn't he have a 30+ run over in Tests?

It's just the reality. Bumrah had that 30 run over against stuart broad. But those are freaky cases- had edges and wild swings. But yes teams should pick the 4 best bowlers they have and not use bits and pieces cricketers. Australia won the 2015 world cup without a frontline spinner. Fake allrounders are such a bane and only India and Pakistan have those amongst the major cricket nations.

 

[hass]

Pakistan has to be up there. Lower middle to tailenders are genuinely abysmal. Shadab/Nawaz/Mir, Hassan, Shaheen, Rauf. Out of that list I have more respect for Shaheen and Rauf.

 

[hass]

Best depth is with England with Woakes #9 and Adil #10

Second are Australia who have striking ability upto #9 thanks to Cummins and Starc

Pakistan is prolly 3rd best with Nawaz- Shaheen- Hasan at #8-10 but will be hamstrung on depth if Wasim Jr has to replace Nawaz.

New Zealand are in a dicey position where they can play Neesham and Santner at #7-8 to lengthen batting but then have to squeeze 10 ovs out of Philips + Neesham+Daryl

Least depth is India and South Africa who both are pretty weak with Thakur/Ashwin/Maharaj helming #8

Rest of the teams aren't only there to try for upsets so doesn't really matter what their composition is like.

Hahaha 3rd best!! Unreal

 

[pratiktc]

Hahaha 3rd best!! Unreal

This aged very badly
Did not expect that both Nawaz and Shadab would be so useless with bat

 

[nish_mate]

Overhyped Kiwis tail didnt wag at all today......

 

[Saj]

Nawaz at 7. Yikes.

The balance of the team is shocking to be honest.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Overhyped Kiwis tail didnt wag at all today......

Indian bowling has been on absolute song so far in the WC. They are bound to have a bad day. Hope it does not happen at the absolute wrong time.

 

[nish_mate]

Indian bowling has been on absolute song so far in the WC. They are bound to have a bad day. Hope it does not happen at the absolute wrong time.

Or have faith and believe whilst we will have a bad day but are good enough to make our opponents to have a worse day.

 

[Justcrazy]

Indians despite weakest lower order according to some posters is winning all games

Having deep batting does not matter , what matters what quality of players you have.

If you play Faheem , Shadab , Nawaz, Ameer Yamine and Anwar Ali , you will still lose games.

All rounders means those who can play as at least 75 % as a bowler or 75 % as a batsman in games.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Indians despite weakest lower order according to some posters is winning all games

Having deep batting does not matter , what matters what quality of players you have.

If you play Faheem , Shadab , Nawaz, Ameer Yamine and Anwar Ali , you will still lose games.

All rounders means those who can play as at least 75 % as a bowler or 75 % as a batsman in games.

India has deep bowling line up. All 5 bowlers are match winners with ball on their day. It would be even better if one of the 3 fast bowlers can bat like say Cummins.

 

[jnaveen1980]

So far in this world cup 8 to 11 batting by different teams. England looks good. But it also means England had a top order/middle order collapse more often. They can only cover so much.

 

[Justcrazy]

India has deep bowling line up. All 5 bowlers are match winners with ball on their day. It would be even better if one of the 3 fast bowlers can bat like say Cummins.

India strength over Pakistan is match awareness , Pakistan lacks that completely. Even when they are in strong position , they can fail easily at any point.

I give you example , before India Pakistan game all Pakistan bowlers were asked who was best batsman of pull shot in the world , all said Rohit sharma, but next match they kept bowling short to same batsman. Now no coach can teach you this , you need to have that game awareness yourself.

 

[Srinath_cricket]

Indian lower order is the worst in the tournament. I hope Indian team management gives a huge promotion to kuldeep/bumrah (who have some ability to bat and are circumspect which is a good attitude in building partnerships) in some upcoming game when the target is low so that they get some match time with bat and running between the wickets.

Siraj can't score a run to save his life.

Shami has good ability with the bat, but he is a gung ho batter who bats the way his heart feels at that moment. So no point in giving gametime.

 

[Justcrazy]

Indian bowling has been on absolute song so far in the WC. They are bound to have a bad day. Hope it does not happen at the absolute wrong time.

All bowlers cannot fail together , that is why Pandya will cover them.

 

[Justcrazy]

Indian lower order is the worst in the tournament. I hope Indian team management gives a huge promotion to kuldeep/bumrah (who have some ability to bat and are circumspect which is a good attitude in building partnerships) in some upcoming game when the target is low so that they get some match time with bat and running between the wickets.

Siraj can't score a run to save his life.

Shami has good ability with the bat, but he is a gung ho batter who bats the way his heart feels at that moment. So no point in giving gametime.

India top six are so solid that they do not care .

 

[Srinath_cricket]

India top six are so solid that they do not care .

True. But just in case of an emergency, atleast Kuldeep/Bumrah should be able to give a stand or rotate strike to give strike to the better batsman.

That bare minimum of insurance needs to be there considering we're going to play all 3 fast bowlers hereon on non turning wickets.

 

[shokz1408]

Well with Pakistan losing 40-8, and 36-6 in last 2 matches, I would say we have the worst lower order in this World Cup.

 

[SamNJ]

Indian lower order is the worst in the tournament. I hope Indian team management gives a huge promotion to kuldeep/bumrah (who have some ability to bat and are circumspect which is a good attitude in building partnerships) in some upcoming game when the target is low so that they get some match time with bat and running between the wickets.

Siraj can't score a run to save his life.

Shami has good ability with the bat, but he is a gung ho batter who bats the way his heart feels at that moment. So no point in giving gametime.

So true about Shami. Even yesterday when he went in to face 2 balls, Rohit looked worried and from lip reading it seemed like he said "ye bat na ghuma de" (hope he doesn't go and swing his bat).

 

[Justcrazy]

True. But just in case of an emergency, atleast Kuldeep/Bumrah should be able to give a stand or rotate strike to give strike to the better batsman.

That bare minimum of insurance needs to be there considering we're going to play all 3 fast bowlers hereon on non turning wickets.

You need to be positive , if batting fails it fails . If that kind of top six cannot win you game , number 8 will not trust me.

Going in with 5 specialist bowlers , India will always keep opposition batsmen under pressure.

 

[Justcrazy]

Well with Pakistan losing 40-8, and 36-6 in last 2 matches, I would say we have the worst lower order in this World Cup.

They are not worst , but those whom the project as all rounders are not proper all rounders.

 

[FearlessRoar]

Pakistan, Bangladesh, Afghanistan and Sri Lanka

 

[sweep_shot]

I say it is Bangladesh. They have the worst tail in this World Cup.

Bangladeshi tail can barely contribute. They only contribute if a main batter is batting alongside them and protecting them.

 

[jeetu]

ODI batting position 8-12. From 2021 against SENA+Ind+Pak+SL

Team	Players	Mat	Runs	Avg	SR	100	50
Ireland	11	9	404	23.76	106.87	1	0
England	18	27	971	21.57	97.98	0	1
Australia	20	29	916	18.69	86.66	0	2
West Indies	17	24	694	15.08	71.1	0	1
Sri Lanka	19	25	854	14.47	68.26	0	1
Bangladesh	16	26	781	14.46	73.19	1	0
India	24	37	531	14.35	71.17	0	2
Scotland	6	2	98	14	95.14	0	0
Nepal	5	2	72	12	78.26	0	0
Afghanistan	12	14	310	11.07	94.8	0	1
South Africa	16	26	315	10.86	80.35	0	0
Netherlands	15	18	518	10.57	67.62	0	1
Pakistan	15	23	316	10.53	83.81	0	0
New Zealand	15	25	464	9.46	72.04	0	1
Zimbabwe	9	10	237	9.11	69.91	0	0
Oman	4	1	14	4.66	35	0	0
U.A.E.	4	1	11	3.66	35.48	0	0

 

[AMSS]

Lower order batting or batting depth is one of the greatest red herrings of our times. Fans and serious analysts both allow themselves to be confused by this almost irrelevant piece of the puzzle.

 

[Unbiased-Fan]

If we include Shami in our next match, then hands down we have the weakest lower order.

Shami (slogger)
Bumrah (slogger with less power)
Kuldeep (can't even loft)
Siraj (can't even defend)

None of these guys can defend good balls, they can't even hit boundaries.
It will be risk to carry all these four players in any knockout/pressure match.

 

[Unbiased-Fan]

I say it is Bangladesh. They have the worst tail in this World Cup.

Bangladeshi tail can barely contribute. They only contribute if a main batter is batting alongside them and protecting them.

Nasum is capable number 8 batsman, better than SHAMI

 

[jnaveen1980]

If we include Shami in our next match, then hands down we have the weakest lower order.

Shami (slogger)
Bumrah (slogger with less power)
Kuldeep (can't even loft)
Siraj (can't even defend)

None of these guys can defend good balls, they can't even hit boundaries.
It will be risk to carry all these four players in any knockout/pressure match.

Broad will disagree with that

 

[WengerOut]

Hands down India

 

[BouncerGuy]

It should be india and Bangladesh in my opinion.
If Indian playing shami then definitely they are weak

 

[mominsaigol]

India but it doesn't matter. Their top 7 are gun

 

[Sunzi]

Jadeja coming in at 8 is not a sign of weakness; it's after the fact, but he demonstrated (again) his capability with the bat vs NZ.

Pandya in for SKY (good T20 hitter but Pandya more than capable of doing what SKY can, and has proven that he can do more TBH, whilst offering utility by being able to bowl a full quota IF needed) Shami in for Thakur.

 

[Unbiased-Fan]

Broad will disagree with that

Bhaisahab, there is difference between test and ODI cricket.
I know Shami has 2 test fifties and Bumrah has improved alot recently, but do you really think they reliable enough to bat on number 8 and 9 in ODIs?

 

[Unbiased-Fan]

Jadeja coming in at 8 is not a sign of weakness; it's after the fact, but he demonstrated (again) his capability with the bat vs NZ.

Pandya in for SKY (good T20 hitter but Pandya more than capable of doing what SKY can, and has proven that he can do more TBH, whilst offering utility by being able to bowl a full quota IF needed) Shami in for Thakur.

Jadeja always performs against Newzealand

 

[Sunzi]

Jadeja always performs against Newzealand

Irrespective. It's a fact that he is a capable batter. I'd rather have him coming in at 8 than Hassan, Nawaz or Shaheen. You might get a quick 22 with them, but Jadeja is assured and adaptable.

 

[Unbiased-Fan]

Irrespective. It's a fact that he is a capable batter. I'd rather have him coming in at 8 than Hassan, Nawaz or Shaheen. You might get a quick 22 with them, but Jadeja is assured and adaptable.

Jadeja at 8? Means we are a bolwer short.
Hassan who?

 

[pratiktc]

You need to be positive , if batting fails it fails . If that kind of top six cannot win you game , number 8 will not trust me.

Going in with 5 specialist bowlers , India will always keep opposition batsmen under pressure.

In WC 2019 semifinal playing a #8 allrounder was the difference between a 90-100 run loss and the eventual 20 run loss with some semblance of hope.

The argument of if 7 batters can't, 8 won't is outdated and makes no sense.
Top 7 cannot bat freely and will have to delay charge of they know that at 6 wkts down the team is only looking at survival of overs in best case.

In essence if a team is 200/4 in 35 ovs rather than both batters at crease trying to maximize last 5 overs of 2nd PP, at best one batter will start hitting knowing that only one more batting resource is available.

In today's white ball cricket #8 has to bat. #9 and #10 need to have slogging ability. The absolute rabbit batter is not an acceptable compromise anymore.

 

[Sunzi]

Jadeja at 8? Means we are a bolwer short.
Hassan who?

Sorry I meant:

Top 5
6. Pandya
7. Jadeja
4 Bowlers (Kuldeep, 3 x Quicks)

 

[Justcrazy]

In WC 2019 semifinal playing a #8 allrounder was the difference between a 90-100 run loss and the eventual 20 run loss with some semblance of hope.

The argument of if 7 batters can't, 8 won't is outdated and makes no sense.
Top 7 cannot bat freely and will have to delay charge of they know that at 6 wkts down the team is only looking at survival of overs in best case.

In essence if a team is 200/4 in 35 ovs rather than both batters at crease trying to maximize last 5 overs of 2nd PP, at best one batter will start hitting knowing that only one more batting resource is available.

In today's white ball cricket #8 has to bat. #9 and #10 need to have slogging ability. The absolute rabbit batter is not an acceptable compromise anymore.

So you will get mediocre bowler in the team at the expense of genuine bowler ? If you expect 8 , 9 , 10 to contribute with the bat , why not top six bowl? Why you have double standards?

 

[pratiktc]

So you will get mediocre bowler in the team at the expense of genuine bowler ? If you expect 8 , 9 , 10 to contribute with the bat , why not top six bowl? Why you have double standards?

The way modern white ball cricket has evolved, batters who can bowl are no longer workable solutions.

This is not 90s or 00s wherein you could pick 4 bowlers and likes of Waugh/Yuvraj/Ganguly can make up the 5th bowler. Opposition team will take full toll of such bowlers even if captains try to sneak 1-2 overs from them. Every team has to go in with minimum 5 specialist bowlers today

Batters who can bowl reasonably (Maxwell, Ifthikar) is a 'nice to have' option. They can be used sometimes to relieve a couple of overs or work a potential matchup if match situation supports. But it does not significantly impact team bowling strategy and bowling playing style if batters cannot bowl.

However bowlers who can bat are almost non negotiable. Teams cannot afford to carry 3-4 rabbits. It severely inhibits the batting strategy and batting play style.

This the onus today is on bowlers to improve their batting skills. This will also make them more valuable picks in global T20 leagues. It is also easier for a bowler to become reasonably competent slogger than a batter to become a competent white ball bowler. We have seen that likes of a Ben Hilfenhaus in endstage of career has worked on hitting skill to get T20 gigs.

 

[pratiktc]

In the case of Shami vs Thakur it is ok for fans to have differing opinions on who should be picked but it is important for fans to understand the equation.

It is not
(Shardul bowling+ Shardul batting) vs (Shami bowling + Shami batting)

The actual equation is that Shardul is a package with Hardik and Shami is a package with SKY and there is also impact shardul has on India's batting. Thus it is


(Hardik batting + Hardik bowling + Shardul batting+ Shardul bowling + positive impact on India's top 7 having shardul at #8) vs ( SKY batting + Shami bowling - negative impact on India's top 7 having Shami at #8)

 

[jnaveen1980]

This has become moot in most of the matches. But Srilanka was oncourse to get to 400 but thanks to their inept tail they had to settle for 340.

 

[Cricket Warrior]

For me its Pakistan whose lower order is hardly contributing in this tournament, we are only relying on our top 6 batsmen.

 

[rhony]

In the case of Shami vs Thakur it is ok for fans to have differing opinions on who should be picked but it is important for fans to understand the equation.

It is not
(Shardul bowling+ Shardul batting) vs (Shami bowling + Shami batting)

The actual equation is that Shardul is a package with Hardik and Shami is a package with SKY and there is also impact shardul has on India's batting. Thus it is


(Hardik batting + Hardik bowling + Shardul batting+ Shardul bowling + positive impact on India's top 7 having shardul at #8) vs ( SKY batting + Shami bowling - negative impact on India's top 7 having Shami at #8)

To me Shardul is a junk bowler. I don't think he's a decent batter in LOIs either. If there is no Hardik, India should go with Sky and Shami. If there is Hardik, go with Shami/Ashwin depending on conditions.

 

[Justcrazy]

The way modern white ball cricket has evolved, batters who can bowl are no longer workable solutions.

This is not 90s or 00s wherein you could pick 4 bowlers and likes of Waugh/Yuvraj/Ganguly can make up the 5th bowler. Opposition team will take full toll of such bowlers even if captains try to sneak 1-2 overs from them. Every team has to go in with minimum 5 specialist bowlers today

Batters who can bowl reasonably (Maxwell, Ifthikar) is a 'nice to have' option. They can be used sometimes to relieve a couple of overs or work a potential matchup if match situation supports. But it does not significantly impact team bowling strategy and bowling playing style if batters cannot bowl.

However bowlers who can bat are almost non negotiable. Teams cannot afford to carry 3-4 rabbits. It severely inhibits the batting strategy and batting play style.

This the onus today is on bowlers to improve their batting skills. This will also make them more valuable picks in global T20 leagues. It is also easier for a bowler to become reasonably competent slogger than a batter to become a competent white ball bowler. We have seen that likes of a Ben Hilfenhaus in endstage of career has worked on hitting skill to get T20 gigs.

The point is not whether it is workable or not workable, point is you made a statement that in modern day bowlers should multitask , and do some batting , keeping with some logic , why not for the batsman? You cannot have two different criterias.


Now you made a point, part time bowlers will be taken toll on , yes , again the response goes back to your initial argument where you said bowlers should take responsibility and improve their other skill, Same thing the batters can do. Take responsibility and learn to bowl a few tidy overs.

However bowlers who can bat are almost non negotiable. Teams cannot afford to carry 3-4 rabbits. It severely inhibits the batting strategy and batting play style.

Again same applies for batters . They should be able to bowl a few overs when required , teams cannot afford six rabbits who cannot bowl at all . This also affects the batting strategy because , Team can easily drop a bowler and play extra batter .

If batters bowl a few overs , they will also be good picks in leagues , why not ?

Also , bowling fast is much more physical than batting , so its easier for a batter to develop another skill rather than a bowler.

 

[BouncerGuy]

The lower middle order of Pakistan is being tested today against South Africa. ATM Nawaz is doing well but he needs support at the other end tail-ender shaheen is at the other end.

 

[BouncerGuy]

Getting all-out with 21 balls still remaining proves that the lower order is nowhere to be found here for Pakistan. All of them are walking wickets.