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Who would win a potential India-Pakistan knockout clash in the 2023 World Cup?

Who would win a potential India-Pakistan knockout clash in the 2023 World Cup?

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mikeypbadana86

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Indian fan here. As the 2023 worldcup euphoria is slowly building, wanted to discuss chance of india/pakistan in a likely knock out.

History of knock outs:

1996 ind vs pak....pakistan overwheling favoruties . wasim akaram pulled out of the match at the last minitue. Pak was crusing well in chase of 289 and lost in the end. PAK burdened by tag of favourites and lost it

2011. sachin was dropped 4 times on a pitch where india were set for 230 but ended up 260. pak undone by spin choke and not so great chase throwing wickets


2023. a possible/potential knock out with Ind/pak both reaching semis/final. India playing under home conditions an advantage with kohli back to form . expectation of home crowd cane be a double edged sword

Pakistan has better batting and even better bowling.


I feel , pak has equal odds of beating India, as much as India has equal odds of beating pak.


whats your thoughts?
 
Assume that Pakistan will play in the World Cup.

All other discussions on that topic are in a different thread.
 
History suggests India gets the better of Pakistan in World Cups. They tend to deal with pressure better whereas Pakistani players and ex-players always put extra pressure on themselves by making needless statements in the media.

Currently the only good thing is it will be unlike what we saw in previous world cups with Misbah and Sarfraz as captains. The games will be tightly contested. That is the only thing which seems probable.
 
I will put Pakistan slightly ahead as bumrah absence Indian bowling is weak
 
India have historically faired better but Pakistan have closed the distance more recently so I’d expect the contest to be competitive
 
Probable Indian playing XI

Subhman Gill
Rohit Sharma (c)
Virat Kohli
Shreyas Iyer
KL Rahul (WK)
Hardik Pandya
Ravindra Jadeja
Axar Patel
Mohammed Shami
Mohammed Siraj
Yuzi Chahal

Probable Pakistan playing XI

Fakhar Zaman
Imam-ul-Haq
Babar Azam (c)
Abdullah Shafiq
Mohammed Rizwan (wk)
Iftikhar Ahmed
Shadab Khan
Mohammed Nawaz
Shaheen Afridi
Haris Rauf
Naseem Shah


Present form comparison (man to man)

Gill > Fakhar
Rohit < Imam
Kohli < Babar
Iyer > Shafiq
KL > Rizwan
Pandya < Iftikhar
Jadeja > Nawaz
Chahal < Shadab
Axar < Shaheen
Shami > Naseem
Siraj < Hariz

Verdict : 5 - 6 in Pakistan's favour
 
It's a round-robin format, so qualifying for the semis won't be that easy as it was in 2011. I hope they don't end up depending on other teams results to sneak into KO stage.
 
If India does not open with Gill and Jaiswal and they send a predictable old men team, then they will not win.

Indian bowling is pretty decent with Shami and Siraj to go along with Axar and Jaddu. If Bumran can make it, then they become a dangerous bowling unit. A lot of question marks on players fitness.
 
Depends on what the josh is that day in both sides.
 
India tend to win the World Cup encounters but Pakistan have broken the streak with that 152/0 game. So, I say it can go either way.
 
Pakistan have the team to beat India. It can go either way. I'll put Pakistan as slight favourites if they select the right team.
 
In a 50 over World Cup

I wouldn’t put Pakistan as favourites in Pakistan against India, let alone in India itself
 
India full team recently lost a series vs depleted Bangladesh.

Pakistan are slight favourites. And partisan Ahmedabad crowd of hundred thousand will inspire Pakistan to give it all.
 
There won't be any.

Pakistan will most probably finish somewhere between 5th and 7th. Looks like beating some depleted sides has given Pak fans a false sense security regarding their team strength. World Cup will be a completely different ball game.

Taking the conditions and team strength into consideration, the Pak team of 2019 had a better chance of making it to the knockouts than the current one.
 
Rana said:
In a 50 over World Cup

I wouldn’t put Pakistan as favourites in Pakistan against India, let alone in India itself
Click to expand...

They won't be favts in Pakistan considering their recent home record. They were actually doing better in UAE when it was their home.

Also, Pakistan never do well on dead flat wickets where 350 is par, they do better on sportive wickets.
 
Smbhayi said:
If Kohli found his usual form against them it's India's game.. otherwise it's 50-50.. India doesn't have a good/settled batting unit for upcoming wc..
Click to expand...


Key thing is stages of their career. They are not the same anymore. Dhawan phased out. No Bumrah. Shami is also old. Not sure if he can sustain 10 overs. Siraj blows hot and cold. Only area where India can gain some control is spin.
 
Man it's been a long time since I got food and drinks to enjoy a full game of Cricket. Hopefully this will be next.
 
Pakistan is the stronger team on paper but India has the home court advantage.

The first powerplay of each innings will decide the game. Ideally, our openers get 60 runs against their bowlers and Shaheen and Naseem take out Rohit, Gill and Kohli.
 
India for sure, big favourites and not just due to historical reasons, they have a better team, playing with home advantage and have the X-factor in guy like Kohli who can swing it in India's favour if the going gets tough.

We are mental midgets against them.
 
Kroll said:
India for sure, big favourites and not just due to historical reasons, they have a better team, playing with home advantage and have the X-factor in guy like Kohli who can swing it in India's favour if the going gets tough.

We are mental midgets against them.
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Is this why Pakistan were one Kohli wicket away from beating them twice in two years in world cup matches? They don't have the better team.
 
Bilal7 said:
Is this why Pakistan were one Kohli wicket away from beating them twice in two years in world cup matches? They don't have the better team.
Click to expand...


50 over cricket is a completely different story from T20s. Ofcourse Pakistan can compete with India in a the shortest format but our team is a lot different in ODIs with addition of guys like Gill, Siraj, Kuldeep, Iyer, Samson etc who were not part of the T20 wc games.

Pakistan right now is the poor man's version of India 2019 where the entire dependence is on the top 3 playing through 40 overs and a bowling attack that blows hot and cold.
 
On paper, Pakistan look good. But we cannot discount the choke factor. I want to see Pakistan playing their best cricket at the World Cup, especially Afridi and Rauf👍
 
Indian top order is wobbly. Take out Rohit Sharma and Virat Kohli early and all expert analysis goes out of the window
 
I have said it before and will say it again here that in a KO match the team batting first has a major advantage regardless of conditions and form. Score board pressure can be very daunting and of course I am talking about 50 overs LOI

We saw this on the 2017 CT final and more recently in the 2019 SF (India vs NZ..). Also the 2003 / 2007 WC final is a good reminder of this fact
 
With Bumrah back in the squad, Indian bowling has become dangerous all of a sudden. Batting is still a cause of concern. Rohit is over the hill and Gill has lost his form. This will put too much pressure on middle order which has not performed well whenever they got tested.
 
Indian T20 team seems to be growing strong! ODI team - agree there should be some seniors but not all 3 of them (Rohit, Kohli, Rahul) - looks outdated! England, Australia, NZ will better this team on most days and even Pakistan, South Africa, Sri Lanka can trouble them now and then...
 
India has the upper hand. T20s are different where lesser-ability teams beat higher-ability teams because of the nature of the format. However, with ODIs and Tests, it's usually the higher-ability teams that come out on top because the formats give multiple chances of a comeback.

I expect India to win the Asia Cup easily and the World Cup match against Pakistan. However having said that, the current Pakistan team should give India a close contest in the World Cup. The gap between the two sides has indeed reduced. And this Pakistan team is probably the most well-equipped team to handle pressure against India compared to all the Pakistan teams we've seen before. No Hafeez, Shoaib Malik, Wahab, Hasan, Sarfraz is a huge plus for Pakistan. They were all mental midgets who used to love giving verbal volleys and surrender like meek cats in the actual game.
 
Pakistan consistently performs well in knockout matches so i believe Pakistan holds an advantage in this situation.
 
In a knockout match pakistan 100%, India is the type to lose to minnows in knockouts.

However in a normal tourney match idk, in the past I would say India 9 out of 10 times but currently both India and Pakistan are Equal teams.
 
ODI is a different ball game.

The winless streak will bother us when chasing. Uff chasing or defending, the second innnings will be very difficult to watch.

While i dont doubt Pakistan's ability, but if Pakistan bowls first and gets them out at a low total, I would be in more ease during second innings.
 
it will depend on the conditions. If it’s a turning track, then India will win. If it’s not, Pak is a slight favorite.
 
Farabi said:
it will depend on the conditions. If it’s a turning track, then India will win. If it’s not, Pak is a slight favorite.
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Falt track is where India have uper hand other than that Pakistan is going to be as favourite
 
shariqnoor said:
India has the upper hand. T20s are different where lesser-ability teams beat higher-ability teams because of the nature of the format. However, with ODIs and Tests, it's usually the higher-ability teams that come out on top because the formats give multiple chances of a comeback.

I expect India to win the Asia Cup easily and the World Cup match against Pakistan. However having said that, the current Pakistan team should give India a close contest in the World Cup. The gap between the two sides has indeed reduced. And this Pakistan team is probably the most well-equipped team to handle pressure against India compared to all the Pakistan teams we've seen before. No Hafeez, Shoaib Malik, Wahab, Hasan, Sarfraz is a huge plus for Pakistan. They were all mental midgets who used to love giving verbal volleys and surrender like meek cats in the actual game.
Click to expand...
I don't think India will win the Asia cup easily, they can win the tournament ofcourse, but it won't be that easy.
 
Nobody is talking about srilanka, rememnber ther are a big event team. they can come out of syllabus in this Asia Cup.
 
I would say Pakistan are the favorites. More balanced team and no aged passengers. Better batting and better bowling. India only have the psychological advantage of past wins and home advantage. If Pakistan can hold their nerves they win.
 
Pakistan is winning easily inshallah. Pakistan has a better chance if they chase against India The world cup thanks to Format is going to be very interesting. It will be the test of nerves from Pakistani players. If they have self belief in their abilities treat it as a normal game then they will be winning it.
 
All of this depends on which team absorb the pressure on the day of the match and which team performs better.
 
controversial_man said:
Pakistan is winning easily inshallah. Pakistan has a better chance if they chase against India The world cup thanks to Format is going to be very interesting. It will be the test of nerves from Pakistani players. If they have self belief in their abilities treat it as a normal game then they will be winning it.
Click to expand...
in srilanka chasing is not quite easy. Team batting first would have been a great chance to win.
 
In T20, it's far more unpredictable and the margin for error is miniscule as the match is usually decided on tiny moments. Across 50 overs, our current side should be able to beat them on paper - but under the huge pressure of the occasion, the history and a hostile crowd, I'm not that confident.
 
Rain should be added as a third option in the poll. By the looks of it, rain is going to be the winner.

With a lot of rain predicted the previous day and the day of the match, does not look like even a ball will be bowled.
 
Considering their recent performance of Pakistan, I can confidently say that India holds the advantage over Pakistan in the worldcup match.
 
If Pak play their best XI and upto 80% of their level, it will be a walk in the park.

This will be the easiest match ever in their world cup history of meetings.
 
If they get 3 early wickets , see off Bumrah then we have a good shot
 
Nado_ said:
If they get 3 early wickets , see off Bumrah then we have a good shot
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I see

They did that in the first game. Got 3 early wickets, in fact 4…India racked up 266. That was enough.

Why do you think India doesn’t pick a team of 11 worthy players all capable of winning games?
 
Rana said:
I see

They did that in the first game. Got 3 early wickets, in fact 4…India racked up 266. That was enough.

Why do you think India doesn’t pick a team of 11 worthy players all capable of winning games?
Click to expand...
266 would have been a close chase , could have gone either way.

And all I said is we have a good shot (not guaranteed victory) if those circumstances we’re to happen. Why do you seem so aggravated by this
 
Nado_ said:
266 would have been a close chase , could have gone either way.

And all I said is we have a good shot (not guaranteed victory) if those circumstances we’re to happen. Why do you seem so aggravated by this
Click to expand...
it wasn't chaseable on that track.

Ball was seaming around and under the lights it could have become impossible to play, so in such conditions 266 was more than enough.
 
India will whoop us in Ahmedabad, but if we meet in the semis then we're taking it. It's textbook Pakistan, since time immemorial.
 
Rana said:
Textbook means we have knocked them out in ICC semis before?
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I guess it means that whenever we take whooping in the first match then we come back stronger. As we are the famous "unpredictables".
 
Firebat said:
India will whoop us in Ahmedabad, but if we meet in the semis then we're taking it. It's textbook Pakistan, since time immemorial.
Click to expand...

They did it literally once (CT17). And that wasn't even a world cup. The only time India and Pakistan faced each other at the group stages and the knockouts is the 2007 WT20. And we all know what happened there.

These cliches are getting old and cheesy now. :apology
 
After a slow start in the Asia Cup, team India is looking a great force at the moment. On the other hand, team Pakistan in stuggling with a few injuries and a couple of their main players look out of form. India will also have the home advantage so at the moment most of the things are tilting towards India but you can never be sure with Pakistan cricket team. They can perform like the world-beaters when no one giving them a chance so let's see what happens on October 15 first and then possibly in the semi-final or final.
 
Pakistan will most likely lose to India at the group stage. Once that game is out of the way, the players will then relax and play with the burden of reduced pressure in the remaining games. Ideally I would have liked the Pakistan India game to be right at the beginning of the WC
 
India will be the favorite because of this Asia Cup win and Traffic record against Pakistan in ODI World Cups. We need to set our middle order as well as spin department as well.
 
They are walking all over Pakistan in Ahmedabad next month

If I were selected to represent Pakistan, I would need sleeping tablets to help me sleep at night
 
Savak said:
Pakistan will most likely lose to India at the group stage. Once that game is out of the way, the players will then relax and play with the burden of reduced pressure in the remaining games. Ideally I would have liked the Pakistan India game to be right at the beginning of the WC
Click to expand...
They have Australia straight after
 
50/50 i would say, pitch will suit both the teams, pak chase down 315 in 48 overs in 2005 at ahmedabad we just need to work hard bat first and look for 330 mini.
If india bats first they can easily post 340+
 
ind are vulnerable, their bowling will be handful if Bumrah stays fit and Yadav can get the same turn on the flatter ind tracks. PK bowling looks confused, SSA takes too long to assess conditions, Rauf looks good but its not a given that he avoids the crappy short stuff and now Naseem isn't going, we don't have our most consistent bowler. Our spinners are useless and batsman are average
 
mikeypbadana86 said:
Indian fan here. As the 2023 worldcup euphoria is slowly building, wanted to discuss chance of india/pakistan in a likely knock out.

History of knock outs:

1996 ind vs pak....pakistan overwheling favoruties . wasim akaram pulled out of the match at the last minitue. Pak was crusing well in chase of 289 and lost in the end. PAK burdened by tag of favourites and lost it

2011. sachin was dropped 4 times on a pitch where india were set for 230 but ended up 260. pak undone by spin choke and not so great chase throwing wickets


2023. a possible/potential knock out with Ind/pak both reaching semis/final. India playing under home conditions an advantage with kohli back to form . expectation of home crowd cane be a double edged sword

Pakistan has better batting and even better bowling.


I feel , pak has equal odds of beating India, as much as India has equal odds of beating pak.


whats your thoughts?
Click to expand...
you are mischaracterizing some of these games:
  1. 1992: An absolute must win for India to stay alive after suffering defeats to Australia and England, and the washed out game against Sri Lanka. Pakistan were never in the game once their innings started. India did not post a large total but they never let the Pakistani batsmen forge any meaningful partnerships.
  2. 1996: Pakistan were not odd on favorites, they were bullish on a 30-19 (or thereabouts) head to head match up. Playing in India against a Tendulkar who was scoring a century every other game, against Kumble on his home ground. Yeah, I would label Pakistan a favorite. And nor were Pakistan cruising in the chase. Except for the first opening wicket partnership, they were always losing a steady stream of wickets.
  3. 1999: Not a knockout game for Pakistan, but certainly a do or die situation for India. The one occasion where you may label Pakistan favorites. India came in to bowl and bowled with purpose, accuracy and stifled pakistani batsmen between the 5th and 13th over and the rest was a domino effect thereafter.
  4. 2003: The game was not of particular significant from the perspective of progression to the next stage.
  5. 2007: This world cup did not exists and has been erased from all databases.
  6. 2011: I find it hilarious that you think Tendulkar's dropped catches were an anomaly. For that game, considering how Raina was dropped, Dhoni was dropped and atleast six (or seven) dropped catches, i would say dropped catches were a norm rather than an anomaly. Heck, were it not for the one delivery that kept low and rushed Sehwag, he had got his eye in and was on his way to smashing Pakistan out of the game. This was never Pakistan's to lose, it was one Pakistan had to work hard for, and the fact they were in the hunt was all thanks to Wahab's double strike.
  7. 2015: Not a game that would have impacted who would progress to the next stage.
  8. 2019: Pakistan needed to win this one to progress and India effectively contributed to their early exit. This was hardly a game of equals. Had Pandya and Dhoni managed to get going in the later stages, India would have batted Pakistan out of the game. Nevertheless, their bowling wrapped the game up spectacularly.
 
Bewal Express said:
ind are vulnerable, their bowling will be handful if Bumrah stays fit and Yadav can get the same turn on the flatter ind tracks. PK bowling looks confused, SSA takes too long to assess conditions, Rauf looks good but its not a given that he avoids the crappy short stuff and now Naseem isn't going, we don't have our most consistent bowler. Our spinners are useless and batsman are average
Click to expand...
how do you state two contradicting statements in the same sentence brother? india are vulnerable, and their bowling will be a handful?
 
ahmadharis1 said:
I mean they beat us pretty easily in Sri Lanka, now to factor in home conditions in Ahmedabad with 100k fans cheering against them? I'll lean towards easy win
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its not the fans, its the pitch. if it is a batsman's paradise, Pakistan have a chance. But if it is a sporting wicket, I expect the Indian bowling to maul the pakistani top order, excluding babar.
 
If Pak bats first and puts 290+, if they can get kohli out early they have a very good chance .If not, India has 60:40 odds of winning. If Ind bats first and puts 290+, they have 70:30
 
People are getting carried away by India win in Asia cup. Before Asia Cup even Indians weren't too positive about India winning the tournament.

Indian defeat really seem to have dent Pakistani fans confidence on Pakistani team. Despite all the worry and cries, I think Pakistan will win the game against India come World Cup. India aren't formidable and have rather been an average team in majority of recent past international tournaments, been a major chokers when it matters the most so why the fuss and cries? If Pakistan doesnt hit the panic then they can convincingly beat India, or even thrash India like in CT or T20 wc style
 
Kriketer said:
People are getting carried away by India win in Asia cup. Before Asia Cup even Indians weren't too positive about India winning the tournament.

Indian defeat really seem to have dent Pakistani fans confidence on Pakistani team. Despite all the worry and cries, I think Pakistan will win the game against India come World Cup. India aren't formidable and have rather been an average team in majority of recent past international tournaments, been a major chokers when it matters the most so why the fuss and cries? If Pakistan doesnt hit the panic then they can convincingly beat India, or even thrash India like in CT or T20 wc style
Click to expand...
Bumrah was not available last year during t20 world cup or 2022 Asia cup. Current indian team is a potent attack with bumrah , sriaj and kuldeep.

Indias decline coincided with emergence of England as undisputed white ball champion winning odi and t20 world cup.

Dhoni is regarded as the greatest captain. India lost 2014 t20 final 2016 t20 final 2015 world cup under him. Similarly lost under kohli in semis in 2019 world cup. Lost under rohit in 2022.

Getting knocked out in semis is no sign of choking since going all the way requires one last push which they failed to cross with all three departments of bowling batting fielding not coming to the party .

Pakistan didn't qualify in 2015 and 2019 world cup . What makes you think they will thrash indian in 2023 odi world cup ??? Pak is a mercurial team . The odds should be 50:50 prior to the match . You cant be certain pak thrashing india while the pressure would be equally on them.
 
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