Why do Pakistani pacers lose their pace so quickly after a promising start to their careers?

[ExpressPacer]

Amir, Junaid Khan, Hasan Ali... this list goes on and on. And now, our brightest fast-bowling talent in years, Shaheen Afridi.

Why do our faster men keep losing their pace? Other bowlers get injured as well but they are able to retain their pace like Starc, Bumrah, Archer, Wood, Boult, Cummins etc.

Will Shaheen be able to recover his glory days of bowling at 143 KPH on average and the effort delivery hitting 150? Without speed, his bowling becomes very innocuous.

 

[ArabKnight]

This is what happens when you have cake parties every 2-4 days.

 

[Major]

Because of false ages, injury and marriage.

You lose pace as you get older, and our players are atleast 3-5 years older than what they have mentioned officially. Thus, when they come in the team, they are actually 25 years old, and its always after the 5 year mark they start to lose their pace.

Also, recovering from injury isnt that easy. Pakistani players dnt have access to good health care as easily as someone in Australia does. Also, the guys want to make money and play through injury whichh we saw Naseem do by continuing to play leagues.

Marriage also plays a role. These guys came from poor backgrounds, never had an AC to cool themselves. As they earn money they start enjoying life as they start to get what they never had. The training becomes less, especially after marriage.

Alot of people critisize the team for eating habits, but alot of people dont know, once upon a time thesse guys never had access to such foods till their 20s.

 

[TheSultan]

Amir, Junaid Khan, Hasan Ali... this list goes on and on. And now, our brightest fast-bowling talent in years, Shaheen Afridi.

Why do our faster men keep losing their pace? Other bowlers get injured as well but they are able to retain their pace like Starc, Bumrah, Archer, Wood, Boult, Cummins etc.

Will Shaheen be able to recover his glory days of bowling at 143 KPH on average and the effort delivery hitting 150? Without speed, his bowling becomes very innocuous.

one of the answers is they don’t recover properly. They are not given the opportunity to recover because we think taking them along is “worth the risk”

Bumrah sat out even the t20 World Cup last year. Shaheen played and ultimately got injured again. Then back to PSL (his own choice) and then beyond, needless ODIs, the test series vs SL etc etc.

Shaheen needed a good 6-9 months out.

We bring him back because we want the name. We don’t care that he’s not back to full pace and fitness.

Do you honestly think India would have brought back Bumrah when he was at 130k? Nope, they waited till he was fully fit again to bowl at his normal pace.

I’ve said in another thread - Shaheen should be declared unfit because just because he can bowl, we don’t want the half cooked Shaheen, we need the fully cooked version.

 

[ExpressPacer]

Because of false ages, injury and marriage.

You lose pace as you get older, and our players are atleast 3-5 years older than what they have mentioned officially. Thus, when they come in the team, they are actually 25 years old, and its always after the 5 year mark they start to lose their pace.

Also, recovering from injury isnt that easy. Pakistani players dnt have access to good health care as easily as someone in Australia does. Also, the guys want to make money and play through injury whichh we saw Naseem do by continuing to play leagues.

Marriage also plays a role. These guys came from poor backgrounds, never had an AC to cool themselves. As they earn money they start enjoying life as they start to get what they never had. The training becomes less, especially after marriage.

Alot of people critisize the team for eating habits, but alot of people dont know, once upon a time thesse guys never had access to such foods till their 20s.

Agreed on the age related point you make. However, I don't think Shaheen should have lost his pace for that reason - he doesn't look dramatically older than what he is. In fact, if he is actually 25-28, he should only be getting faster.

The rest probably plays somewhat of a role.

Anyway, mudday ki baat - do you think he will be able to go back to his glory days wali pace? I remember he used to hit 151 KPH with his effort ball. Seen this on live TV.

 

[Major]

Agreed on the age related point you make. However, I don't think Shaheen should have lost his pace for that reason - he doesn't look dramatically older than what he is. In fact, if he is actually 25-28, he should only be getting faster.

The rest probably plays somewhat of a role.

Anyway, mudday ki baat - do you think he will be able to go back to his glory days wali pace? I remember he used to hit 151 KPH with his effort ball. Seen this on live TV.

he doenst need to get his pace back, he needs to bring up more weapons in his bowling. If he cant bowl that pace, if he can have more variety in his bowling, he can still be effective. Its not like he is slow, he is still faster than any other indian bowler as he still touches 140kph

 

[ExpressPacer]

I’ve said in another thread - Shaheen should be declared unfit because just because he can bowl, we don’t want the half cooked Shaheen, we need the fully cooked version.

Do you think he can get there again? I'm starting to think otherwise given he was back to high levels of fitness in the English leagues and about 80% in Asia Cup as his pace seemed high in the first game ...but its dropped again.

So, I'm wondering if this is a career-threatening injury like the ones that Amir had which forever rendered him to be a 130s bowler.

 

[Savak]

Knee injuries are not easy to deal with. Umar Gul and Junaid Khan lost a good 10 km/hr of pace because they no longer put the same kind of stress, pressure on their knee during the jump when running into bowl.

Not everyone can be like Akhtar ie blowing at the same speeds inspite of 3 major knee surgeries.

 

[ExpressPacer]

he doenst need to get his pace back, he needs to bring up more weapons in his bowling. If he cant bowl that pace, if he can have more variety in his bowling, he can still be effective. Its not like he is slow, he is still faster than any other indian bowler as he still touches 140kph

Definitely not faster than Bumrah. But I also disagree in that he doesn't need his pace back. He absolutely does. He will fair to get reverse swing at the 130s stuff he was bowling. Heck, he wont even get inswing the way he was bowling at 131 KPH in his first over.

 

[ExpressPacer]

Knee injuries are not easy to deal with. Umar Gul and Junaid Khan lost a good 10 km/hr of pace because they no longer put the same kind of stress, pressure on their knee during the jump when running into bowl.

Not everyone can be like Akhtar ie blowing at the same speeds inspite of 3 major knee surgeries.

Very true. Shaheen probably deserved to be wrapped in cotton wool until this WC from the time that he had his injury.

Now here's the important question, do you think he can get it back or is he forever a trundler now? I'm sorry ...but his opening spell of 131 KPH is what I would call trundling.

 

[Savak]

Shaheens problem like Gautam Gambhir has rightfully identified is his predictability. He has become addicted to the full inswinger to the right hander and he habitually bowls it every delivery with the new ball.

That delivery is no problem to a world class batter like Rohit Sharma who has made the adjustment in stance to counter it.

Shaheen when he was reversing the ball into Usman Khawaja who was batting on 150 not out kept racing in and bowling that inswinging yorker for 4-5 consecutive overs which Khawaja was comfortably able to deal with as the delivery was no longer a surprise.

Waqar in the commentary box for frustrated and mentioned that Shaheen needed to work on the art of setting up the batsmen.

The guy has now been playing professional cricket against various teams in different countries and conditions for a good 6-7 years, he is not a rookie anymore and he should have been able to been a better bowler given the experience he has under his belt and a more diverse arsenal.

 

[hafizexpress]

Shaheens problem like Gautam Gambhir has rightfully identified is his predictability. He has become addicted to the full inswinger to the right hander and he habitually bowls it every delivery with the new ball.

That delivery is no problem to a world class batter like Rohit Sharma who has made the adjustment in stance to counter it.

Shaheen when he was reversing the ball into Usman Khawaja who was batting on 150 not out kept racing in and bowling that inswinging yorker for 4-5 consecutive overs which Khawaja was comfortably able to deal with as the delivery was no longer a surprise.

Waqar in the commentary box for frustrated and mentioned that Shaheen needed to work on the art of setting up the batsmen.

The guy has now been playing professional cricket against various teams in different countries and conditions for a good 6-7 years, he is not a rookie anymore and he should have been able to been a better bowler given the experience he has under his belt and a more diverse arsenal.

Let's not forget when he bottled the 2021 t20 world cup semi-final. Bowled the exact same delivery for 3 balls in a row and got dispatched for a six every single time by Matthew Wade. Despite Hasan Ali dropping a sitter, the game was still within reach but Shaheen bowled the most uninnovative, predictable, gun barrel straight, trio of deliveries to end the game-ending over. Although the excuse of lack of experience can be given, it just shows in the current time that he hasn't learned and developed his game much. Still looks predictable

 

[Nikhil_cric]

he doenst need to get his pace back, he needs to bring up more weapons in his bowling. If he cant bowl that pace, if he can have more variety in his bowling, he can still be effective. Its not like he is slow, he is still faster than any other indian bowler as he still touches 140kph

You wish. Only shardul thakur is slower than him currently from our lot.

 

[ExpressPacer]

Shaheens problem like Gautam Gambhir has rightfully identified is his predictability. He has become addicted to the full inswinger to the right hander and he habitually bowls it every delivery with the new ball.

That delivery is no problem to a world class batter like Rohit Sharma who has made the adjustment in stance to counter it.

Shaheen when he was reversing the ball into Usman Khawaja who was batting on 150 not out kept racing in and bowling that inswinging yorker for 4-5 consecutive overs which Khawaja was comfortably able to deal with as the delivery was no longer a surprise.

Waqar in the commentary box for frustrated and mentioned that Shaheen needed to work on the art of setting up the batsmen.

The guy has now been playing professional cricket against various teams in different countries and conditions for a good 6-7 years, he is not a rookie anymore and he should have been able to been a better bowler given the experience he has under his belt and a more diverse arsenal.

He did set RS pretty nicely in the first match vs India in the Asia Cup. Two outswingers and then an inswinger. I personally think it has to do with his dip in pace. A fast inswinging yorker at 145+ KPH will be hard to play for anyone in the world, whether it is RS or VK or Brian Lara.

However, he will not even trouble Afghan and Bangla openers bowling it at 135 KPH let alone 130 KPH like he has been doing lately. At the end of the day, pace makes a difference. There needs to be some serious investigation into this and some serious questions asked as to why Shaheen has lost such a massive chunk of his pace.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Ex-coach Waqar Younis tells Shaheen to copy Bumrah World Cup blueprint

Younis, who is in India as a commentator, says the missing link in Shaheen's bowling is discipline.

www.dawn.com

Ex-coach Waqar Younis tells Shaheen to copy Bumrah World Cup blueprint​

 

[ExpressPacer]

You wish. Only shardul thakur is slower than him currently from our lot.

What do you think Nikhil? Peak Shaheen was bowling 150 KPH and I have seen this live across multiple tournaments and international cricket. That, I agree with @Major, is something most Indian bowlers can only dream of, with the exception of Umran and perhaps Varun Aaron.

What went wrong and can he get his pace back? I rate your insight into Pakistan Cricket so curious to hear your views.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Shoriful, Fiz, Madhushanka all had more discipline than Shaheen. Today Madhushanka was highly impressive. Used the right variations at the right time. Effort bouncer in between.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

What do you think Nikhil? Peak Shaheen was bowling 150 KPH and I have seen this live across multiple tournaments and international cricket. That, I agree with @Major, is something most Indian bowlers can only dream of, with the exception of Umran and perhaps Varun Aaron.

What went wrong and can he get his pace back? I rate your insight into Pakistan Cricket so curious to hear your views.

Then you're mistaken. Quite a few Indian bowlers have clocked 150 kph on the speed gun over the last decade.

And in terms of sustaining good speeds over a long period , guys like Shami and Umesh sustained speeds for way longer than any bowler you've had in recent times and that too while playing multiple formats.

Shaheen has elbow issues directly related to his action. Unless he works with a coach and works on it, he'll be another in a long list of Pakistani bowlers who will be consigned to the rubbish heap while some other youngsta beauty is hyped up as the next sensation.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Pakistan bowlers are known for bowling full balls. No wonder he is obsessed with full balls. But he is not using his height well like Topley, Jansen, Kieth Jamieson, Prasidh Krishna. Even at 135 kph bounce of a good length is disconcerting. He should be able to generate a lot of bounce. He is totally wasting it

 

[jnaveen1980]

Then you're mistaken. Quite a few Indian bowlers have clocked 150 kph on the speed gun over the last decade.

And in terms of sustaining good speeds over a long period , guys like Shami and Umesh sustained speeds for way longer than any bowler you've had in recent times and that too while playing multiple formats.

Shaheen has elbow issues directly related to his action. Unless he works with a coach and works on it, he'll be another in a long list of Pakistani bowlers who will be consigned to the rubbish heap while some other youngsta beauty is hyped up as the next sensation.

Shaheen is not Sohaibl AKhtar to sustain pace. It requires tremendous energy, stamina to sustain. Infact very few are close to Lee and Akhtar. Pace demons. Also how much effort you put to generate 150k also matters. Some do it effortlessly. Some give everything and eventually get injured. Alzaari Joseph for example without breaking sweat effortlessly bowl at 149 kph. Nortje is another one. But guys like Naseem Shah uses a lot of shoulder into each delivery to bowl quick which invariably results in injury. One of the glaring omission in bowling of Shaheen is natural bounce. Look at Prasidh Krishna. He recently clocked 140 plus and generated steep bounce of good length. You see that with even 125k Jamieson, 135k Jansen. This guy being tall should be able to do that. HE is wasting his height if you ask me.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Shaheen is not Sohaibl AKhtar to sustain pace. It requires tremendous energy, stamina to sustain. Infact very few are close to Lee and Akhtar. Pace demons. Also how much effort you put to generate 150k also matters. Some do it effortlessly. Some give everything and eventually get injured. Alzaari Joseph for example without breaking sweat effortlessly bowl at 149 kph. Nortje is another one. But guys like Naseem Shah uses a lot of shoulder into each delivery to bowl quick which invariably results in injury. One of the glaring omission in bowling of Shaheen is natural bounce. Look at Prasidh Krishna. He recently clocked 140 plus and generated steep bounce of good length. You see that with even 125k Jamieson, 135k Jansen. This guy being tall should be able to do that. HE is wasting his height if you ask me.

I'm not talking about Akhtar level pace. I'm talking about 2021 version of Shaheen.

His current action is inhibiting him. Considering his workload, I don't think we'll see that again either

 

[moghul]

Because of false ages, injury and marriage.

You lose pace as you get older, and our players are atleast 3-5 years older than what they have mentioned officially. Thus, when they come in the team, they are actually 25 years old, and its always after the 5 year mark they start to lose their pace.

Also, recovering from injury isnt that easy. Pakistani players dnt have access to good health care as easily as someone in Australia does. Also, the guys want to make money and play through injury whichh we saw Naseem do by continuing to play leagues.

Marriage also plays a role. These guys came from poor backgrounds, never had an AC to cool themselves. As they earn money they start enjoying life as they start to get what they never had. The training becomes less, especially after marriage.

Alot of people critisize the team for eating habits, but alot of people dont know, once upon a time thesse guys never had access to such foods till their 20s.

Well said, also there is no culture or awareness of maintaining physical fitness and professionalism. Age fudging is a very important factor for older players like Hasan Ali who is close to 35 I'm sure.

 

[daytrader]

Marriage also plays a role. These guys came from poor backgrounds, never had an AC to cool themselves. As they earn money they start enjoying life as they start to get what they never had. The training becomes less, especially after marriage.

I think you're on to something Major sb. Shaheen, Haris and Shadab are out of form and all 3 got married this year. Coincidence??

 

[Major]

I think you're on to something Major sb. Shaheen, Haris and Shadab are out of form and all 3 got married this year. Coincidence??

same happened with Hassan Ali and even Umar Gul.

Thing is, after marriage their focus is more towards their family, and thus less training most probably (im not that sure as i dont live with cricketers). But thats my take. Before the bachelor life these guys spent 8-10 hours of daily practice.

 

[ArabKnight]

Well said, also there is no culture or awareness of maintaining physical fitness and professionalism. Age fudging is a very important factor for older players like Hasan Ali who is close to 35 I'm sure.

Nah he’s not. He’s a Jatt. They are strong fit and have good hormones.

He can still bowl at 140 kmph. He relies on variations; in-swing, reverse swing. He attacks the stumps, he bowls full, and of course he has a nasty slow ball. He’s the only pacer with a high IQ, skill set, and fitness in our country.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Could be poor nutrition and lack of guidance on eating habits.

 

[Kianig89]

Fitness Fitness relate fitness to health and it is important in every aspect of life to excel, Hassan Ali looks more fit than SSA

 

[chinaman00]

They play all these monkey circus T20 leagues nonstop throughout the year, so they preserve their longevity by reducing their pace and not taking unnecessary risks.

The board should put serious limits on how many T20 leagues and if possible, totally eliminate non-PSL & County Cricket matches for contracted senior players.

The unsustainable number of T20 league matches these players commit to has killed Pakistan’s ODI & Test cricket winning chances with senior players routinely being injured ahead of major competitions.

 

[BouncerGuy]

They play all these monkey circus T20 leagues nonstop throughout the year, so they preserve their longevity by reducing their pace and not taking unnecessary risks.

The board should put serious limits on how many T20 leagues and if possible, totally eliminate non-PSL & County Cricket matches for contracted senior players.

The unsustainable number of T20 league matches these players commit to has killed Pakistan’s ODI & Test cricket winning chances with senior players routinely being injured ahead of major competitions.

I think PCB has brought a clause where players can only play 2 leagues per year if I am not wrong.

 

[chinaman00]

I think PCB has brought a clause where players can only play 2 leagues per year if I am not wrong.

I mean even if they bring in restrictions, what’s the point if you’re not prioritizing domestic red ball and county cricket where players actually develop skills and grow. Instead, players are selected based on these circus T20 shows. Once selected, they get exposed on the big stage consistently.

 

[Savak]

I mean even if they bring in restrictions, what’s the point if you’re not prioritizing domestic red ball and county cricket where players actually develop skills and grow. Instead, players are selected based on these circus T20 shows. Once selected, they get exposed on the big stage consistently.

Not sure if County Cricket 4 day is as good. English bowlers have struggled badly in India. Similarly Shaheen and Hassan Ali have played a decent amount of 4 day county cricket now for a few seasons and even they look lost at sea in international cricket right now.

 

[chinaman00]

Not sure if County Cricket 4 day is as good. English bowlers have struggled badly in India. Similarly Shaheen and Hassan Ali have played a decent amount of 4 day county cricket now for a few seasons and even they look lost at sea in international cricket right now.

It will be interesting to see how many T20 matches Shaheen, Naseem & Hassan played this year compared to red ball cricket.

Both Shaheen & Hassan and also Rauf are missing their basic line and length and bowling atrociously.

 

[mominsaigol]

Because of false ages, injury and marriage.

You lose pace as you get older, and our players are atleast 3-5 years older than what they have mentioned officially. Thus, when they come in the team, they are actually 25 years old, and its always after the 5 year mark they start to lose their pace.

Also, recovering from injury isnt that easy. Pakistani players dnt have access to good health care as easily as someone in Australia does. Also, the guys want to make money and play through injury whichh we saw Naseem do by continuing to play leagues.

Marriage also plays a role. These guys came from poor backgrounds, never had an AC to cool themselves. As they earn money they start enjoying life as they start to get what they never had. The training becomes less, especially after marriage.

Alot of people critisize the team for eating habits, but alot of people dont know, once upon a time thesse guys never had access to such foods till their 20s.

I always doubt the ages like ihsanullah is really 22? like the bro is really just a year older then me? How? Ik what 22 year olds look like. Its like saying rashid khan is 25 .

Shaheen shpuld be 25-27 logically. Its when people tried to convince me shahid afridi was 16 on debut when he was 21 .

Like ik their cricketers and all but oh hell naw. Only people who are likely accurate about their real age is babar, Imam, rizzu, and a few others.

Pur fast bowlers are liars except naseem. Naseem should be 20

 

[Major]

I always doubt the ages like ihsanullah is really 22? like the bro is really just a year older then me? How? Ik what 22 year olds look like. Its like saying rashid khan is 25 .

Shaheen shpuld be 25-27 logically. Its when people tried to convince me shahid afridi was 16 on debut when he was 21 .

Like ik their cricketers and all but oh hell naw. Only people who are likely accurate about their real age is babar, Imam, rizzu, and a few others.

Pur fast bowlers are liars except naseem. Naseem should be 20

his age is fake. Now adays you can catch them lie from their fb profile. Go back to their pics form 5-7 years ago and would be laughing. Rashid Khan, Ihsanullah and Naseem shahs pics are there on the net for 5-6 years ago and you can tell their age.

Bro, even Babar and others have fake age. The only person with real age is someone like Shan Masood because he is educated and if he faked his age, his education would go to waste.

 

[mominsaigol]

his age is fake. Now adays you can catch them lie from their fb profile. Go back to their pics form 5-7 years ago and would be laughing. Rashid Khan, Ihsanullah and Naseem shahs pics are there on the net for 5-6 years ago and you can tell their age.

Bro, even Babar and others have fake age. The only person with real age is someone like Shan Masood because he is educated and if he faked his age, his education would go to waste.

How old are the guys really?

Ik rashid khan defo isn't 25, the guy is old enough to be my uncle lol.

 

[Major]

How old are the guys really?

Ik rashid khan defo isn't 25, the guy is old enough to be my uncle lol.

the max you can fake is 5 in Pakistan i think.

Naseem fake it by 2-3 years maybe.

Even Misbah faked his age as well. PCB allows this to happen to be honest at senior level, as they are more understanding to this

 

[chinaman00]

his age is fake. Now adays you can catch them lie from their fb profile. Go back to their pics form 5-7 years ago and would be laughing. Rashid Khan, Ihsanullah and Naseem shahs pics are there on the net for 5-6 years ago and you can tell their age.

Bro, even Babar and others have fake age. The only person with real age is someone like Shan Masood because he is educated and if he faked his age, his education would go to waste.

Don’t they have birth certificates?

 

[Major]

Don’t they have birth certificates?

Most of them dont. They either forge one or get information changed by bribing an official.

Infact, club coaches used to encourage us to do this 2 months before the trials.

 

[BouncerGuy]

Note:
Guys please stick to the topic of the thread. No need to discuss people's ages here.

 

[ExpressPacer]

Then you're mistaken. Quite a few Indian bowlers have clocked 150 kph on the speed gun over the last decade.

And in terms of sustaining good speeds over a long period , guys like Shami and Umesh sustained speeds for way longer than any bowler you've had in recent times and that too while playing multiple formats.

Shaheen has elbow issues directly related to his action. Unless he works with a coach and works on it, he'll be another in a long list of Pakistani bowlers who will be consigned to the rubbish heap while some other youngsta beauty is hyped up as the next sensation.

Speaking about the current lot and I don’t think anyone from this lot can do that. Shaheen was, albeit for a short period, consistently hitting 150. I don’t think Shami has ever done that. Yadav has hit 150 though a few times, I agree and bowled at pretty high average speed. Not like Haris Rauf though. Haris, I would compare more to Varun Aaron who was definitely express.

You reckon it’s elbow while some on here think it’s his knee. Could be a mix of both explaining why he’s down to 130 KPH and not 135-138.

 

[kron]

same happened with Hassan Ali and even Umar Gul.

Thing is, after marriage their focus is more towards their family, and thus less training most probably (im not that sure as i dont live with cricketers). But thats my take. Before the bachelor life these guys spent 8-10 hours of daily practice.

8 to 10 is a lot man. More like 5 to 6 5 days a week. 30 hours a week of training. Still that is a fair bit obviously. Yea I totally agree family commitments take a toll.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Speaking about the current lot and I don’t think anyone from this lot can do that. Shaheen was, albeit for a short period, consistently hitting 150. I don’t think Shami has ever done that. Yadav has hit 150 though a few times, I agree and bowled at pretty high average speed. Not like Haris Rauf though. Haris, I would compare more to Varun Aaron who was definitely express.

You reckon it’s elbow while some on here think it’s his knee. Could be a mix of both explaining why he’s down to 130 KPH and not 135-138.

Shaheen wasnt consistently hitting 150. The odd ball he went as high as 154 but he was a high 140's bowler. Haris doesnt play Test cricket. I'm not talking about 140's for a 10 year multi-format career. No Pakistani bowler has done that since maybe Wahab and he didn't even play much. They've all lost average pace after 3, 4 years.

Shami, Umesh, Ishant all have done that.

 

[ExpressPacer]

Shaheen wasnt consistently hitting 150. The odd ball he went as high as 154 but he was a high 140's bowler. Haris doesnt play Test cricket. I'm not talking about 140's for a 10 year multi-format career. No Pakistani bowler has done that since maybe Wahab and he didn't even play much. They've all lost average pace after 3, 4 years.

Shami, Umesh, Ishant all have done that.

I should have clarified: I didn't mean "consistently" to suggest that he was hitting every single ball at 150 or around that but I meant that he was doing so consistently in every match.

But yes, I agree that they lose their pace after 3-4 years. For Shaheen, it was barely a blitz of express pace that lasted half a year to a year, at most. To Wahab's credit, he never really "lost" his pace. He just got old and his pace went down. He's probably still faster than Shaheen.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

I should have clarified: I didn't mean "consistently" to suggest that he was hitting every single ball at 150 or around that but I meant that he was doing so consistently in every match.

But yes, I agree that they lose their pace after 3-4 years. For Shaheen, it was barely a blitz of express pace that lasted half a year to a year, at most. To Wahab's credit, he never really "lost" his pace. He just got old and his pace went down. He's probably still faster than Shaheen.

Yeah that's why I singled out Wahab. Only he maintained consistent average speeds until very late in his career.

Very durable fast bowler. Though he wasn't selectable a lot of the time.

 

[BouncerGuy]

Fast bowlers can lose their pace due to physical strain, poor workload management, demanding schedules, and lack of practice or fitness. LOL, getting married is not one of the reasons for the decline until the player is not giving enough time to cricket due to it.

 

[ExpressPacer]

Fast bowlers can lose their pace due to physical strain, poor workload management, demanding schedules, and lack of practice or fitness. LOL, getting married is not one of the reasons for the decline until the player is not giving enough time to cricket due to it.

I want to agree with you but there probably is some sort of street truth to it because I definitely do see a trend. Shadab was bowling beautifully in the WC before his marriage, Hasan's form went completely haywire after his marriage and now we're seeing the same with Shaheen. It could be a crazy, crazy coincidence but I remember the same happened to VK in India and I also remember that all of India ridiculed and blamed Anushka Sharma for it, to the point that she stopped coming to watch VK play. Even UA seemed to be a decent enough bat before his marriage, after which he could never find a consistent spot in the team.

It's so crazy that and I can't believe I'm saying this but there's definitely a trend geared towards this conclusion.

 

[BouncerGuy]

I want to agree with you but there probably is some sort of street truth to it because I definitely do see a trend. Shadab was bowling beautifully in the WC before his marriage, Hasan's form went completely haywire after his marriage and now we're seeing the same with Shaheen. It could be a crazy, crazy coincidence but I remember the same happened to VK in India and I also remember that all of India ridiculed and blamed Anushka Sharma for it, to the point that she stopped coming to watch VK play. Even UA seemed to be a decent enough bat before his marriage, after which he could never find a consistent spot in the team.

It's so crazy that and I can't believe I'm saying this but there's definitely a trend geared towards this conclusion.

Yeah. I can see that trend as well. It can be one of the reasons if a player is not focusing on his cricket after marriage. Surely it can be a reason.

 

[ArabKnight]

his age is fake. Now adays you can catch them lie from their fb profile. Go back to their pics form 5-7 years ago and would be laughing. Rashid Khan, Ihsanullah and Naseem shahs pics are there on the net for 5-6 years ago and you can tell their age.

Bro, even Babar and others have fake age. The only person with real age is someone like Shan Masood because he is educated and if he faked his age, his education would go to waste.

Shaheen Afridi is 23 right now. If he was faking his age (so actually 25-27), he would’ve been married 10 years ago.

He’s a villager. His people marry very early (15-19 yrs). He married this year. His age is real.

 

[gazza619]

Q: Why do our fast bowlers lose their pace?

A: Because they travel around the world and play a lot of Mickey Mouse leagues.

Look at Michelle Starce for instance. He continues to be a 90 mph fast bowler since his international debut 13 years ago. You could argue that our cricketers are poor and need to earn money, but then PCB need to balance it out by paying an extra salary to the key fast bowlers. They can call it “pace premium”.

 

[BunnyRabbit]

A combination of various factors. Lack of awareness about maintaining fitness through diet and exercise. Complacency on maintaining peak physical condition. Poor workload management and burning out their bodies. Awful rehab and handling of injuries on PCB's part.
Wahab Riaz was the only one in recent times to maintain his pace (he was the most aware person of all regarding fitness and diet)

 

[mominsaigol]

Amir, Junaid Khan, Hasan Ali... this list goes on and on. And now, our brightest fast-bowling talent in years, Shaheen Afridi.

Why do our faster men keep losing their pace? Other bowlers get injured as well but they are able to retain their pace like Starc, Bumrah, Archer, Wood, Boult, Cummins etc.

Will Shaheen be able to recover his glory days of bowling at 143 KPH on average and the effort delivery hitting 150? Without speed, his bowling becomes very innocuous.

It's because they return before their 100%, get taken to cleaners and just get unfitter lol.

India refused to play bumrah for 2 years until he was 110% lol.

You need to let an injury fully heal, we don't, it's always their 30% fine, then come back and remain 30% because their playing and not giving rest and time for the wound to heal.

 

[ExpressPacer]

Q: Why do our fast bowlers lose their pace?

A: Because they travel around the world and play a lot of Mickey Mouse leagues.

Look at Michelle Starce for instance. He continues to be a 90 mph fast bowler since his international debut 13 years ago. You could argue that our cricketers are poor and need to earn money, but then PCB need to balance it out by paying an extra salary to the key fast bowlers. They can call it “pace premium”.

Man, these guys are just greedy and want a quick buck instead of a sustained career. Kinda like the chicken that laid golden eggs but sadomasochistic because they themselves are the chickens.

As anyone living in Pakistan would tell you, our cricketers form some of the richest people in the country and PCB pays REALLY well when cost of living in Pakistan in taken into account. Sure, they can't compete with cricketers from India or England but in Pakistan, they live like Kings of Kings.

 

[Mamoon]

That is because they are overhyped. A couple of good spells and their heads are in the clouds.

Pakistani pacers are like soda bottles. They make a loud pop but there is nothing inside.

Hassan Ali is finished and Rauf is also a gone case. He has been badly humiliated by India in back to back World Cup games and he will not mentally recover from this.

Shaheen has high potential but he is also on the ropes. He started believing his own hype and was further fueled by the delusional media who kept peddling the “they cannot play him” narrative that he started to believe himself.

India showed him his aukaat in the last 2 matches and it will be difficult for him to recover from this. In addition, he is also physically handicapped - it seems like he is no longer capable of bowling at 90 mph.

Naseem Shah is the savior these days and the golden boy of Pakistan fast bowling but his drama will also end soon. He too will be gone in 2-3 years.

At least 10 different Pakistani pacers will be compared to Bumrah and every time Pakistani fans will say that their bowler is better but Bumrah will be the last man standing while their soda bottles will fizzle out in 2-3 years every time.

 

[owenhcricket]

Amir, Junaid Khan, Hasan Ali... this list goes on and on. And now, our brightest fast-bowling talent in years, Shaheen Afridi.

Why do our faster men keep losing their pace? Other bowlers get injured as well but they are able to retain their pace like Starc, Bumrah, Archer, Wood, Boult, Cummins etc.

Will Shaheen be able to recover his glory days of bowling at 143 KPH on average and the effort delivery hitting 150? Without speed, his bowling becomes very innocuous.

Shaheen was just bowling at 140 clicks a couple of months back in the Asia Cup before his finer was injured and his knee started playing up again. Given time to recover and if he still only bowls at 130 then you can say this again.

 

[ExpressPacer]

That is because they are overhyped. A couple of good spells and their heads are in the clouds.

Pakistani pacers are like soda bottles. They make a loud pop but there is nothing inside.

Hassan Ali is finished and Rauf is also a gone case. He has been badly humiliated by India in back to back World Cup games and he will not mentally recover from this.

Shaheen has high potential but he is also on the ropes. He started believing his own hype and was further fueled by the delusional media who kept peddling the “they cannot play him” narrative that he started to believe himself.

India showed him his aukaat in the last 2 matches and it will be difficult for him to recover from this. In addition, he is also physically handicapped - it seems like he is no longer capable of bowling at 90 mph.

Naseem Shah is the savior these days and the golden boy of Pakistan fast bowling but his drama will also end soon. He too will be gone in 2-3 years.

At least 10 different Pakistani pacers will be compared to Bumrah and every time Pakistani fans will say that their bowler is better but Bumrah will be the last man standing while their soda bottles will fizzle out in 2-3 years every time.

I bet Naseem will also be fast-tracked into his come back and stare down batsmen only to be bowling 130 KPH pies.

 

[CerebralPatriot]

I'd say one thing is fame which results in early burnout due to our players playing so many useless leagues.

Also the high-pressure environment of international cricket can cause mental stressors which may have physical impacts.

Age is also a factor

 

[zaidihusain]

Actually some ex cricketers & Media have overhyped Pakistan's bowling by repeatedly calling it as world class, strongest bowling attack etc. The fact is in last 20-22 years Pakistan has failed to produce a bowler who has played 70-100 test matches & no fast bowler has taken more than 200 wickets. Shaheen, Haris & Naseem will rarely bowl 10 good overs in ODIs, they are basically 4 over bowlers i.e. T20 specialists. Same is the case with spinners, they bowl wicket less spells in tests / ODIs like bowling machines. In the recent "The Pavilion program", Wasim Akram correctly pointed out that players like Shadab must play full seasons of first class cricket. He said these players should be given contract only if they agree to play first class cricket. These bowlers will never be successful in long form of cricket unless they play FC cricket and there workload must be managed with strong rotational policy. I bet Haris Rauf will announce retirement if he will be asked to play FC cricket

 

[aukhan]

Some great points have been mentioned above.
Fake ages, marriages, and quick money after years of poverty hinder their progress and hunger. Big cars, houses, and foreign travels go to their heads and they start to believe they have finally made it.

 

[SpiritOf1903]

Zero strength and conditioning

 

[TheSultan]

Do you think he can get there again? I'm starting to think otherwise given he was back to high levels of fitness in the English leagues and about 80% in Asia Cup as his pace seemed high in the first game ...but its dropped again.

So, I'm wondering if this is a career-threatening injury like the ones that Amir had which forever rendered him to be a 130s bowler.

I think it’s possible if he has world class rehab, rest and a serious long term outlook on it.

Does he have a world class medical team available to him? That will not only help him rehab but be honest and strong enough with him to tell him not to play for a while?

Is he serious enough about his rehab to forego lucrative franchise leagues and Pakistan internationals (most of which are pointless)?

Is he willing to ignore his own ego which will be telling him to play so he doesn’t go down the pecking order or ignore the lure of potentially captaining Pakistan (which will be a possibility very soon)?

We don’t know - and the answers to these questions will determine if he can ever get his full pace back.

If he can’t get his full pace back, is he willing to not be Hollywood shaheen with the eye catching inswinging Yorkers and revert to be a solid tall bowler that utilises a hard length and extra bounce?

Who knows

But he needs to really start seriously thinking about his career if he’s going to have a good one.

 

[Flat_Track_Bully]

We know the elephant in the room but we can't discuss it here.

 

[hitthestump]

Too many leagues.

Contracted players should play 1 league outside of PSL and that’s it.

Anyone who wants to play more must play a minimum amount of FC and List A cricket to be eligible so we don’t see more players go the Azam Khan or Amir route.

 

[viking2559]

Naseem Shah is still the fastest pacer in the Asia in terms of average speed.

He regularly clocks 140- 145/146 in test cricket and faster in limited overs cricket
Haris rauf is by a big margin is the fastest pacer in limited overs cricket.

Even in this world cup he is regularly bowling 144-150 kph. He is the 2nd fastest pacer in the world cup

 

[Major]

Shaheen Afridi is 23 right now. If he was faking his age (so actually 25-27), he would’ve been married 10 years ago.

He’s a villager. His people marry very early (15-19 yrs). He married this year. His age is real.

you clearly dont know how the cricket circle works. People from villiage marry early if they have money coming in.

He also has an elder brother, he is more than likely to play with his age, if not by 5 years, than 2-3 years

 

[Major]

That is because they are overhyped. A couple of good spells and their heads are in the clouds.

Pakistani pacers are like soda bottles. They make a loud pop but there is nothing inside.

Hassan Ali is finished and Rauf is also a gone case. He has been badly humiliated by India in back to back World Cup games and he will not mentally recover from this.

Shaheen has high potential but he is also on the ropes. He started believing his own hype and was further fueled by the delusional media who kept peddling the “they cannot play him” narrative that he started to believe himself.

India showed him his aukaat in the last 2 matches and it will be difficult for him to recover from this. In addition, he is also physically handicapped - it seems like he is no longer capable of bowling at 90 mph.

Naseem Shah is the savior these days and the golden boy of Pakistan fast bowling but his drama will also end soon. He too will be gone in 2-3 years.

At least 10 different Pakistani pacers will be compared to Bumrah and every time Pakistani fans will say that their bowler is better but Bumrah will be the last man standing while their soda bottles will fizzle out in 2-3 years every time.

I don't agree with your words on Naseem. Yes, he is a fan favorite , but that kid lives probably the worst life amongst everyone. He lost his mother to sudden death and misses her till this day. Just because fans love him doesnt mean you start calling him a drama.

As for the India and Bumrah reference, lets first wait and see if they actually win the world cup or does it end up being another winless trophy season for them

 

[Bhaijaan]

When did Shaheen ever clock 148 clicks or above? That’s in the territory of Zaheer , Nehra level extreme pace. Don’t think SSA was ever that quick.

 

[hur rizvi]

When did Shaheen ever clock 148 clicks or above? That’s in the territory of Zaheer , Nehra level extreme pace. Don’t think SSA was ever that quick.

He has clocked more than 150kph several times not once

 

[CerebralPatriot]

Even before injury I had always thought Shaheen was overrated. He only had one delivery which was the big in swinger and although it has been effective, in time big teams will have realised that is his main weapon and develop a plan to counter it

Post injury however he has seen his pace go down 5-10 km's and as a result he has been rendered ineffective. It's sad to see but was quite predictable seeing that he would try to play any league rather than focusing on staying fit for his country

This is why I had always believed Mir Hamza to be a better investment post Amir's retirement. Although not as pacey as Shaheen, he is a brilliant swing- seam bowler who has grinded in domestics for years and I think all that effort should have not gone in-vein.

 

[GLORY OF '92]

Some good posts but generally they just aren't good enough. Pakistan pace bowling has been absolutely mediocre after Asif and Amir. That's a fact.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Shaheen has height, he can work with Akram to learn about setting up batsmen. When the swing is not on offer (white ball kookaburra stops swinging after 5 overs or so) he needs to look for other options.

 

[TheSultan]

We know the elephant in the room but we can't discuss it here.

I’m intrigued - what is it?

 

[Mamoon]

I don't agree with your words on Naseem. Yes, he is a fan favorite , but that kid lives probably the worst life amongst everyone. He lost his mother to sudden death and misses her till this day. Just because fans love him doesnt mean you start calling him a drama.

As for the India and Bumrah reference, lets first wait and see if they actually win the world cup or does it end up being another winless trophy season for them

Naseem is not my' chachay ka puttar'. I don't know and I don't care about his personal life and none of that will impact what I make of him as a cricketer. This is a very slippery slope and if we walk down this road we will have to make exceptions for every cricketer because everyone goes through personal life problems.

For example, you have criticized and used similar words than these for Younis Khan numerous times even though he lost 4-5 immediate family members in a short period of time and you have also dished out all sorts of insults to Afridi who lost his mother at a young age too

 

[Major]

Naseem is not my' chachay ka puttar'. I don't know and I don't care about his personal life and none of that will impact what I make of him as a cricketer. This is a very slippery slope and if we walk down this road we will have to make exceptions for every cricketer because everyone goes through personal life problems.

For example, you have criticized and used similar words than these for Younis Khan numerous times even though he lost 4-5 immediate family members in a short period of time and you have also dished out all sorts of insults to Afridi who lost his mother at a young age too

you are calling naseem a drama. The guy himself has done nothing. He gets selected and plays, now if his fans hype or support him, how is that naseem doing drama?

If you dont care about his personal, atleast dont attack the guy personally for things he has never done.

Naseem is just a kid having gone through troubles in life.

 

[Mamoon]

you are calling naseem a drama. The guy himself has done nothing. He gets selected and plays, now if his fans hype or support him, how is that naseem doing drama?

If you dont care about his personal, atleast dont attack the guy personally for things he has never done.

Naseem is just a kid having gone through troubles in life.

Drama in terms of his performance and long-sustainability as a bowler, it has nothing to do with his personality.

This is the same as how I used to call Pakistan's number 1 ranking in T20s in 2018 a drama.

 

[SpiritOf1903]

I’m intrigued - what is it?

Summat mentioned elsewhere, the reason Pakistan is in the state it is because some people deem it fine to insult a particular region

 

[Mamoon]

If Pakistan is smart, they should already plan for life post Haris Rauf. Maybe replace him with Ihsanullah because Rauf is a gone case.

Only good for "showing eyes" to smaller team with shareef batsmen but turns into a kitten when pitted against alpha batsmen like Kohli and Rohit.

Those two sixes against Kohli and three sixes against Rohit will forever be his legacy.

 

[hoshiarpurexpress]

Fitness and focus. After a certain time in International Cricket, you will be figured out. Especially today, with so many data points available about each and every players strengths and weaknesses.

The Pakistan players of modern time want to make as much money as possible, and as quickly as possible and so they play different leagues all around the world. So in T20I these players are decent, but for ODI/Test Cricket you need a good amount of grind in first class cricket. I don't think any of these current Pakistan players, barring Babar/Rizwan have the drive and mindset to improve themselves day in and day out.

 

[Savak]

If Pakistan is smart, they should already plan for life post Haris Rauf. Maybe replace him with Ihsanullah because Rauf is a gone case.

Only good for "showing eyes" to smaller team with shareef batsmen but turns into a kitten when pitted against alpha batsmen like Kohli and Rohit.

Those two sixes against Kohli and three sixes against Rohit will forever be his legacy.

It's funny how they aren't the legacy of the likes of Starc, Bolt, Rabadda etc when they have suffered against these players as well.

 

[hoshiarpurexpress]

If Pakistan is smart, they should already plan for life post Haris Rauf. Maybe replace him with Ihsanullah because Rauf is a gone case.

Only good for "showing eyes" to smaller team with shareef batsmen but turns into a kitten when pitted against alpha batsmen like Kohli and Rohit.

Those two sixes against Kohli and three sixes against Rohit will forever be his legacy.

Yeah I have observed that. He was making wild gestures against Netherlands batters and Ishan Kishan, but never shows same aggression against Rohit/Kohli/Warner etc.

 

[hoshiarpurexpress]

It's funny how they aren't the legacy of the likes of Starc, Bolt, Rabadda etc when they have suffered against these players as well.

lol are you really comparing current Pakistani bowlers with the likes of Starc/Bolt/Rabada.
Starc is LOI great with WC winning performances. He has an excellent Test Career.
Bolt has 300 Test Wickets and Rabada has 200 plus.
What is the body of work of Hasan/Shaheen/Rauf/Ihsnullah/Naseem etc vs these Great bowlers.