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Would India have become a rising tiger economy if BJP-style rule had prevailed?

Cpt. Rishwat

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The early years after partition saw India adopt English as a major language. With a population that broadly spoke English, this has given India significant global relevance in the age of connectivity.

The BJP is the political face of the RSS, a fiercely Hindutva organization that has promoted Hindu culture and would presumably have frowned upon the influence of the English language. Would the Indian economy have been as successful under a government that prioritized Hindi and Hindu culture?
 
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I don't think their economy is a strong one. If it was strong, there wouldn't be so many illegal immigrants moving out of India.

China has a proper rising economy and that shows in their migration pattern (very little illegal immigration).

Anyway, if BJP-style rule had prevailed in the past, India might have been a bankrupt country like Hungary. Chaiwala's tactics can seem euphoric in the short term but are damaging in the long run.
 
gujrat, maharashta, and in particular baniyas have a long long tradition on entrepreneurialism, all the government had to do was not get in the way, and given the entrepreneurial class was funding the politicians it worked out pretty good once the nationalised institutions got out of the way. the bjp has never antagonised the business class of india much, nor has it ever been particularly proactive on wealth redistribution, so i think if anything it would have seen a speedier development of the business class.

the lack of english wouldnt have been too much of an issue, the indians would have learned it organically once they realised it was needed to make money, much like they learned tech and engineering without particular government promotion.
 
I don't think their economy is a strong one. If it was strong, there wouldn't be so many illegal immigrants moving out of India.

China has a proper rising economy and that shows in their migration pattern (very little illegal immigration).

Anyway, if BJP-style rule had prevailed in the past, India might have been a bankrupt country like Hungary. Chaiwala's tactics can seem euphoric in the short term but are damaging in the long run.
India's economy is fifth largest in the world by nominal GDP and third largest by purchasing power parity. However its rank is much lower on per capita basis. Had the population swapping happened fairly during partition this would not have been the case as well. Still awaiting when you will make a single post that makes sense.
 
I don’t think things would have been any different. There’s a misconception that Congress did our country a huge favour by building educational institutions. It was their job and education is very integral part of Hindu culture in general. It’s been like that for thousands of years so Congress building some IITs is not what made people of this country send their kids to colleges. This country is known for having Universities and libraries centuries before Jawahar Lal Nehru gave the nod to build IITs. Who knows BJP might have built 10x more and better institutions?

Like Raja bhai also said, some of these communities had entrepreneurial talent in their blood. Mohammad Ali Jinnah was also a descendent of a Hindu man who started a successful import and export business. He didn’t need an IIT degree to lead a successful business.
 
gujrat, maharashta, and in particular baniyas have a long long tradition on entrepreneurialism, all the government had to do was not get in the way, and given the entrepreneurial class was funding the politicians it worked out pretty good once the nationalised institutions got out of the way. the bjp has never antagonised the business class of india much, nor has it ever been particularly proactive on wealth redistribution, so i think if anything it would have seen a speedier development of the business class.

the lack of english wouldnt have been too much of an issue, the indians would have learned it organically once they realised it was needed to make money, much like they learned tech and engineering without particular government promotion.

I think the tech and engineering industry was probably accomodated a lot by being proficient in English. About the govt staying out of the way, that is the key factor. I do remember not that long ago there were Hindutva groups running campaigns against Valentine's Day presumably because of their foreign influence. I have seen the same issues when theologians get too much say in Islamic countries, and I've seen echoes of it in recent BJP legislation.
 
I think the tech and engineering industry was probably accomodated a lot by being proficient in English. About the govt staying out of the way, that is the key factor. I do remember not that long ago there were Hindutva groups running campaigns against Valentine's Day presumably because of their foreign influence. I have seen the same issues when theologians get too much say in Islamic countries, and I've seen echoes of it in recent BJP legislation.
but being proficient in english is not a guarantee of the latter, look at Zimbabwe, Nigeria or Kenya have significantly higher English proficiency, but lacked the business class, or the educational proactivity of the indians to develop those industries.

also let's zero in on the actual states which did this in india, cos a lot of indian states, which did not have those cultural traits, like UP, Bihar, etc, despite having the same access to english did not develop to those levels as say tamil nadu, kerela, Maharashtra, gujarat, etc.
 
but being proficient in english is not a guarantee of the latter, look at Zimbabwe, Nigeria or Kenya have significantly higher English proficiency, but lacked the business class, or the educational proactivity of the indians to develop those industries.

also let's zero in on the actual states which did this in india, cos a lot of indian states, which did not have those cultural traits, like UP, Bihar, etc, despite having the same access to english did not develop to those levels as say tamil nadu, kerela, Maharashtra, gujarat, etc.

Safe to say the world didn’t start in 1947 and the centuries old history of education and skill development of people in this part of the world is often overlooked.

Only a few centuries ago, at the height of the Mughal empire, this was the richest region in the world. No other empire was generating the wealth the Mughal empire did. No English. No IIT. Just skilled work, astute merchants.
 
Safe to say the world didn’t start in 1947 and the centuries old history of education and skill development of people in this part of the world is often overlooked.

Only a few centuries ago, at the height of the Mughal empire, this was the richest region in the world. No other empire was generating the wealth the Mughal empire did. No English. No IIT. Just skilled work, astute merchants.
whilst i agree in principle, that the indian subcontinent has a varied cultural history which is often overlooked for the sake of the modern nations that form it, IMO you cannot draw a economic equivalence between the indian subcontinent of an agrarian world where healthy human capital was the most valuable resource, versus an industrialised world where access to technology and knowledge of non-human capital became far more influential in determining a nation states economic trajectory. im not taking away anything from india here, however india was modernised by implementing non-indigenous knowledge.

so its not one or the other IMO, its a mix of both, if im being pushed to an alternate history to explain my pov, i think a non-colonised india would have eventually modernised industrially and commercially, however in a far more unequal way.
 
It is an interesting question but I am going to comment instead on a tangential matter.

The contemporary right critiques Nehruvian economics as having shackled the Indian economy. But how the Indian right thinks about economic matters has changed significantly from the early years.

After independence, the conservative wing of the Congress party were not enthusiastic supporters of Nehru’s top-down planned economy, but nor were they unrestrained advocates of free markets which were not moored to moral and social obligations.

The thinking of Gandhi was of course key to early conservative thinking on the economy. For Gandhi independence was never simply about Indians replacing English rulers and inheriting colonial structures, but entailed a moral revolution. This was to be change from the bottom-up where individuals were motivated by spiritual rather than materialistic goals. The economy was to rest on moral foundations which took into account reciprocal social obligations and was to be geared towards fulfilling ‘needs’ rather than creating ‘greeds’. In this Gandhi glorified supposed Indian traditions and rejected Western ideas on wealth and large-scale production.

Some members of the Congress right eventually became so frustrated by Nehru’s statist agenda that they went on to found the Swatantra Party in 1959. It was led by the veteran Congressman, Rajagopalachari (1878-1972). In his inaugural address he said, “We stand for the great principle enunciated by Gandhiji and constantly emphasised by him of maximum freedom for the individual and minimum interference by the State.”

As indicated here, this belief in a non-statist vision was not grounded in an unfettered faith in the free market based on Western thinking. Rather it was to be based on ideas derived from Indian tradition. As he said elsewhere:

“We must organise a new force and movement to replace the greed and class hatred of Congress nationalism with a renovated spiritual outlook emphasising the restraints of good conduct as of greater importance than organised covetousness. Every effort should be made to foster and maintain spiritual values and preserve what is good in our national culture and tradition and avoid dominance of a purely material philosophy of life which thinks only in terms of the standard of life without any reference to its content of quality.”

An alternative vision from the right was represented by the Bharatiya Jana Sangh (BJS), which was established in 1951 and is seen as a precursor to the BJP. Perhaps more surprisingly, in this case, the influence of Gandhian thought is visible at the outset. Its manifesto in 1951 stated: “the village has been the centre of Bhartiya life in all times. The ideal of “Sarvodya” cannot be achieved until and unless the village is restored to its original position as the basic economic unit.”

The key ideologue of the BJS was Deendayal Upadhyaya (1916-1968), who was also a RSS prachark. Upadhyaya sought a ‘third way’, arguing against the pure adoption of either capitalism or socialism. In his words, “democracy and capitalism join hands to give free reign to exploitation, socialism replaced capitalism and brought with it an end to democracy and individual freedom.”

Instead, he stressed the importance of indigenous Indian tradition which for him created reciprocal moral and social obligations that laid the basis for a harmonious spiritual society.

When we compare the contemporary right to the ‘old’ Congress right or the ‘old’ Hinduvta right, the economic thinking has evolved. The contemporary right is far more unrestrained in advocating a pro-business capitalist stance, far less suspicious of large enterprises, and far less interested in idealised visions of village society.
 
but being proficient in english is not a guarantee of the latter, look at Zimbabwe, Nigeria or Kenya have significantly higher English proficiency, but lacked the business class, or the educational proactivity of the indians to develop those industries.

also let's zero in on the actual states which did this in india, cos a lot of indian states, which did not have those cultural traits, like UP, Bihar, etc, despite having the same access to english did not develop to those levels as say tamil nadu, kerela, Maharashtra, gujarat, etc.

Kerala isn't developed in terms of industry or economy as such. Communist rule in Kerala has finished most of its industry.

It now relies on tourism and remittance.
 
The early years after partition saw India adopt English as a major language. With a population that broadly spoke English, this has given India significant global relevance in the age of connectivity.

The BJP is the political face of the RSS, a fiercely Hindutva organization that has promoted Hindu culture and would presumably have frowned upon the influence of the English language. Would the Indian economy have been as successful under a government that prioritized Hindi and Hindu culture?
Not all but you got some aspects of this right - Hindutva was not a factor in the slow development of India but rather the adoption of a socialistic society by a communist sympathiser Nehru which set back the country by decades. A far right govt would never have conceded the security council seat to China, nor would have dampened innovation by encouraging monopolistic incompetency in the form of nationalisation. The country should have never agreed either to have different laws for different religions and tribes.
 
Not all but you got some aspects of this right - Hindutva was not a factor in the slow development of India but rather the adoption of a socialistic society by a communist sympathiser Nehru which set back the country by decades. A far right govt would never have conceded the security council seat to China, nor would have dampened innovation by encouraging monopolistic incompetency in the form of nationalisation. The country should have never agreed either to have different laws for different religions and tribes.

To be fair, communism was a very popular ideology back in those days, it was sweeping across the world and it was mainly the US which was fighting on several fronts, including close to home. You could actually argue that the flexibility which had been synonymous with Hinduism has been a strength in that you could make a case for adopting more or less any ideology and claiming them as your own. That was part of the reason I asked the question in the OP, because when I see RSS literature, it seems they see this as a fault, and wish to draw lines in the sand more similar to what we see in Islamic countries.
 
To be fair, communism was a very popular ideology back in those days, it was sweeping across the world and it was mainly the US which was fighting on several fronts, including close to home. You could actually argue that the flexibility which had been synonymous with Hinduism has been a strength in that you could make a case for adopting more or less any ideology and claiming them as your own. That was part of the reason I asked the question in the OP, because when I see RSS literature, it seems they see this as a fault, and wish to draw lines in the sand more similar to what we see in Islamic countries.
What RSS literature have you read? Based on your posts I refuse to believe you have read any literature but that’s another debate lol.

Having said that RSS is not a political party. I partly agree with you here.RSS is very socialistic in nature. It is not a religious “tanzeem”. Its issue is hyper-nationalism. That would have been an issue and definitely a roadblock to some extent .

So it would just be the opposite of Nehru socialism but that is not always good.

Right wing party like BJP on the other hand definitely would have accelerated growth.

There is a difference between a socialist/ nationalist organization and a right wing political party. Remember that next time you read the “literature”.

Whatever progress India has made today, the chain of events were set in the 90s when we had 2 right wing PM’s. PV Narasimha Rao who was Congress but had right leaning and Vajpayee who was BJP.

Information about India’s transformation since 90s and what caused it is available on Google and usually common knowledge even for the most casual “economic and diplomacy” enthusiasts.

So if you want to start topics out of your depth like this you need to start with basics than going for RSS literature which I am pretty sure is a pamphlet handed over to you outside some non Hindu-religious place or maybe some post on PP.
 
I don't think their economy is a strong one. If it was strong, there wouldn't be so many illegal immigrants moving out of India.

China has a proper rising economy and that shows in their migration pattern (very little illegal immigration).

Anyway, if BJP-style rule had prevailed in the past, India might have been a bankrupt country like Hungary. Chaiwala's tactics can seem euphoric in the short term but are damaging in the long run.
Incorrect on the Chinese, they have been doing the illegal record pretty high as well for a country with actual good economic stats.

 
For that we have to think about who were the initial Right wing leaders.

1.Sardar Patel might have supported Congress but is considered a right wing icon but with someone that believed in Raj Dharma, easily was a better and pragmatic leader than Nehru.

2.Charan Singh , capitalist only time UP was of any good was under him.

So no I would say India would had done way better under Capitalist leaders like the above two and later under N Rao who was also right wing.

The only notable leader from Congress was Shastriji and he died early, but even he believed in economic reforms.

India’s entrepreneurship was hurt deeply due to communist/socialist leadership , Bengal which was so ahead in GDP became utter trash under those rules.
 
What RSS literature have you read? Based on your posts I refuse to believe you have read any literature but that’s another debate lol.

Having said that RSS is not a political party. I partly agree with you here.RSS is very socialistic in nature. It is not a religious “tanzeem”. Its issue is hyper-nationalism. That would have been an issue and definitely a roadblock to some extent .

So it would just be the opposite of Nehru socialism but that is not always good.

Right wing party like BJP on the other hand definitely would have accelerated growth.

There is a difference between a socialist/ nationalist organization and a right wing political party. Remember that next time you read the “literature”.

Whatever progress India has made today, the chain of events were set in the 90s when we had 2 right wing PM’s. PV Narasimha Rao who was Congress but had right leaning and Vajpayee who was BJP.

Information about India’s transformation since 90s and what caused it is available on Google and usually common knowledge even for the most casual “economic and diplomacy” enthusiasts.

So if you want to start topics out of your depth like this you need to start with basics than going for RSS literature which I am pretty sure is a pamphlet handed over to you outside some non Hindu-religious place or maybe some post on PP.

Could follow up on some of that but there's so much vinegar dripping from it, probably best just to leave it be. :jaya
 
The early years after partition saw India adopt English as a major language. With a population that broadly spoke English, this has given India significant global relevance in the age of connectivity.

The BJP is the political face of the RSS, a fiercely Hindutva organization that has promoted Hindu culture and would presumably have frowned upon the influence of the English language. Would the Indian economy have been as successful under a government that prioritized Hindi and Hindu culture?
What India really missed was a ferocious leader like Imran Khan. India would have been a true superpower on par with the US if they had someone with the vision, morals, values and foresight of Imran Khan.
 
For that we have to think about who were the initial Right wing leaders.

1.Sardar Patel might have supported Congress but is considered a right wing icon but with someone that believed in Raj Dharma, easily was a better and pragmatic leader than Nehru.

2.Charan Singh , capitalist only time UP was of any good was under him.

So no I would say India would had done way better under Capitalist leaders like the above two and later under N Rao who was also right wing.

The only notable leader from Congress was Shastriji and he died early, but even he believed in economic reforms.

India’s entrepreneurship was hurt deeply due to communist/socialist leadership , Bengal which was so ahead in GDP became utter trash under those rules.
Fully agree with this. Sardar Patel would have been a great choice to lead the country after independence, but unfortunately sidelined because of Nehru/Gandhi.
 
What RSS literature have you read? Based on your posts I refuse to believe you have read any literature but that’s another debate lol.

Having said that RSS is not a political party. I partly agree with you here.RSS is very socialistic in nature. It is not a religious “tanzeem”. Its issue is hyper-nationalism. That would have been an issue and definitely a roadblock to some extent .

So it would just be the opposite of Nehru socialism but that is not always good.

Right wing party like BJP on the other hand definitely would have accelerated growth.

There is a difference between a socialist/ nationalist organization and a right wing political party. Remember that next time you read the “literature”.

Whatever progress India has made today, the chain of events were set in the 90s when we had 2 right wing PM’s. PV Narasimha Rao who was Congress but had right leaning and Vajpayee who was BJP.

Information about India’s transformation since 90s and what caused it is available on Google and usually common knowledge even for the most casual “economic and diplomacy” enthusiasts.

So if you want to start topics out of your depth like this you need to start with basics than going for RSS literature which I am pretty sure is a pamphlet handed over to you outside some non Hindu-religious place or maybe some post on PP.
Exactly - RSS has always been a grass roots organization and never been remotely related to capitalism.
 
The early years after partition saw India adopt English as a major language. With a population that broadly spoke English, this has given India significant global relevance in the age of connectivity.

The BJP is the political face of the RSS, a fiercely Hindutva organization that has promoted Hindu culture and would presumably have frowned upon the influence of the English language. Would the Indian economy have been as successful under a government that prioritized Hindi and Hindu culture?
India is not a rising Tiger economy at all. Indian has a huge population which translates to a huge market.

India changed its data sources and methodology for estimating real gross domestic product (GDP) for the period since 2011-12. This paper shows that this change has led to a significant overestimation of growth. Official estimates place annual average GDP growth between 2011-12 and 2016-17 at about 7 percent.

Indian Population is on par or greater then China & compare India and China from 1949 on wards where China was ravaged, backwards, poor Infrastructure while India was on relatively good financial footing (compared to Pakistan and light years ahead of China). Indian Nationalists compare India to Pakistan when it should be compared to China, now tell me the true state of Indian economy, Indian cities, Indian Infrastructure etc?

Leave Pakistan out of the discussion and see how quickly the Indian Balloon deflates! Pakistan has severe, serious, structural and fundamental issues but even if Pakistan was well governed the Indian population and its Markets would always have an advantage. When Honda setup factories in Pakistan and India they produced motorcycles for their respective markets and the cost of producing and selling in India will always be lower, this is directly from Honda marketing studies (and common sense) and if I find the study, I will post it.​
 
I don't think both the BJP and the Congress were strong at the same time at any point in Indian democratic history.

In other words, we have been a one party state one way or the other since independence. Politicians change their spots depending on which way the wind is blowing, and less said about the faceless IAS and other officers on the rungs below, the better.

The BJP today is basically the Congress in saffron clothing.
 
As subramaniyam swamy pointed out by 76 it was evident for Indira gandhi too that Nehru economic model is not working and they have to follow China capitalism for growth. But Indira and rajiv kept on dilly-dallying as they are from the same branch to over ride root branch politics.as soon as we got an outsider and efficient pm, Pv was able to bring he changes. Swamy pointed out india is lagging with China exactly like above period of ineffectiveness and indecision as i dian wasn'table to capitalise the double digit economic growth period.
 
Exactly - RSS has always been a grass roots organization and never been remotely related to capitalism.

No one is suggesting that RSS had any sort of fiscal policy, but if you have social policies they will at some point conflict with financial ones. If you have any knowledge of Islamic theocracies you would have seen some signs of this. Just for arguments sake, restrictions on Bollywood if they what is perceived as anti-Hindu agenda.
 
No one is suggesting that RSS had any sort of fiscal policy, but if you have social policies they will at some point conflict with financial ones. If you have any knowledge of Islamic theocracies you would have seen some signs of this. Just for arguments sake, restrictions on Bollywood if they what is perceived as anti-Hindu agenda.
RSS is very pragmatic that way - it has never entered the financial area. TBH though, I don’t think they have much relevance in our society - their ideological influence is far exaggerated by the PPers here. You go to any Tier 1 power centers and you will barely notice any RSS presence - after all they are usually a bunch of old men in shorts who hold no sway over the modern youth or businesses.

The moot point is that ‘conservative’ RSS ideology has never been any cause of financial distress unlike the ‘liberal’ socio-communist policies which had a direct impact on India’s stunted growth in the first 4 decades after independence.
 
RSS is very pragmatic that way - it has never entered the financial area. TBH though, I don’t think they have much relevance in our society - their ideological influence is far exaggerated by the PPers here.

Actions speak louder than words. Modi is worshipped and gets votes. Modi got his education in the RSS. As for financial conflicts we will see. It is relatively early days yet, the rubber is still to meet the road.
 
Actions speak louder than words. Modi is worshipped and gets votes. Modi got his education in the RSS. As for financial conflicts we will see. It is relatively early days yet, the rubber is still to meet the road.
No point arguing with you - because you are pretty dogmatic in your opposition to RSS and Modi. You will never take the words of Indians who say that RSS has no say in the financial world, because of your experience with the theological mullahs in your own part of the world.
 
No point arguing with you - because you are pretty dogmatic in your opposition to RSS and Modi. You will never take the words of Indians who say that RSS has no say in the financial world, because of your experience with the theological mullahs in your own part of the world.

Yes but it's experience nonetheless. It's usually the thin end of the wedge, and you would be surprised how these things escalate once they become entrenched.
 
Pakistanis here and an average congress supporter give too much importance to Hindutva for BJP’s rise in India. But on the contrary, it is limited to few regions in the North. What BJP sold to average middle class was the economic development they would bring.

Congress leaders became foolish enough to buy into this whole hindutva thing and they continue to dig deeper in the hole by themselves with appeasement politics rather than focusing on economic mismanagement.

Come down south India, and all people care about is development of the region and better job opportunities for them and their kids.

People can jest about how bad India is and its growth is fake, blah, blah, but there are enough people like me who chose to stay in India as we saw better job opportunities in India too. Though its limited to Metro cities in India.

We will never grow at China’s pace because of few structural issues like One party policy which enables a long term policy making, an early mover advantage etc as compared to China. But some posters like @sweep_shot need to be more receptive of news other than anti-India themes. Hyderabad is becoming the Global GCC hub while Bengaluru and Mumbai continue to build on IT and Finance markets. Our future is very much positive that I am confident. But serious issues persist on parts of North India. As an Indian, no point in blaming. Lucknow is also getting good FDI’s and hopefully it will turnaround and Bihar may follow in future.

For an average Indian, in choosing government, economic development > religion. Look at the election mandates from BJP and Congress from past 3 elections and decide yourself
 
The Kerala economic experience has for many years intrigued me. Finally, here is a fascinating article which offers an explanation for its distinctive trajectory:

https://aeon.co/essays/how-did-kerala-go-from-poor-to-prosperous-among-indias-states

The authors seek to explain, “Kerala’s miracle of human wellbeing with economic growth.”

Kerala has always scored highly on social development indicators but in the last 20 or so years, it has also witnessed significant growth in income levels. The article points to a confluence of factors that have stimulated private investment. There is, first, the existence of propitious environmental conditions that have supported agricultural productivity and encouraged natural resource extraction. There is, second, a deeply rooted history of connections to the global economy and of labour migration to the Persian Gulf. Many of the migrants are highly skilled and literate due to the state's historic commitment to social development. As a result, the remittances that have flowed back to the state, have not only supported consumption but crucially have also been directed towards capital expenditure. Consequently, "the state has one of the highest concentrations of startups." There is, thirdly, the political choices made. As noted, welfare oriented policies have always been favoured in the state due to a history of Leftist governments being elected in the area. What changed in the new century, was that the ‘New Left’ was far less suspicious of the market and private investment. The authors argue, ”now there is a symbiosis between the private sector and the state, as market activity supports public welfare commitments.”
 
No point arguing with you - because you are pretty dogmatic in your opposition to RSS and Modi. You will never take the words of Indians who say that RSS has no say in the financial world, because of your experience with the theological mullahs in your own part of the world.

RSS was supposed not to take part in politics as well , but eventually they did.
 
The Kerala economic experience has for many years intrigued me. Finally, here is a fascinating article which offers an explanation for its distinctive trajectory:

https://aeon.co/essays/how-did-kerala-go-from-poor-to-prosperous-among-indias-states

The authors seek to explain, “Kerala’s miracle of human wellbeing with economic growth.”

Kerala has always scored highly on social development indicators but in the last 20 or so years, it has also witnessed significant growth in income levels. The article points to a confluence of factors that have stimulated private investment. There is, first, the existence of propitious environmental conditions that have supported agricultural productivity and encouraged natural resource extraction. There is, second, a deeply rooted history of connections to the global economy and of labour migration to the Persian Gulf. Many of the migrants are highly skilled and literate due to the state's historic commitment to social development. As a result, the remittances that have flowed back to the state, have not only supported consumption but crucially have also been directed towards capital expenditure. Consequently, "the state has one of the highest concentrations of startups." There is, thirdly, the political choices made. As noted, welfare oriented policies have always been favoured in the state due to a history of Leftist governments being elected in the area. What changed in the new century, was that the ‘New Left’ was far less suspicious of the market and private investment. The authors argue, ”now there is a symbiosis between the private sector and the state, as market activity supports public welfare commitments.”
Kerala succeeds only because it’s in India, it would be Cuba at best outside of it.
All the Malayalee entrepreneurs live outside of Kerala not inside of it, it’s unfortunately a model that gives nothing but takes everything from outside of it, Kerala model on its own is unsustainable.
-

Above is only my opinion.

Better Models State Wise:
Maharastra, Tamil Nadu, Gujarat, Andhra-Telengana

These states that let other Indian states experiment their atrocious policies and boast on random articles but provide no economic opportunities for the population living within the state.
 
After reading and listening to indian videos speaking to indian workers and watching indian news recently - Found out so many indians are angry at the Indian model.

Video breaks down how economic crises, corruption, and public anger are often amplified by external forces looking to destabilize the region. We also ask the big question: what does this mean for India? Could similar regime change be engineered here? Spoiler—they tried in recent years, but failed




Recent times nepal sri lanka , burma and maldives are voicing their anger at you, bangladesh have turned thr backs n you and are increasing improving trade relations with pakistan, Pakistan keep downing your jets, China keeps putting you in your place, Afghanistan Taliban is the only really nearby country which has increased its relationship with you = not like many countries are liking any support with the taliban.

Russia, just using yourselves to buy russian jets / arms / oil and forcing you lot to bu this in UAE currency, as the indian rupee is declining

@JaDed @Vikram1989 @Rajdeep @Devadwal - what are your thoughts


o yeh any other poster feel free to contribute
 
After reading and listening to indian videos speaking to indian workers and watching indian news recently - Found out so many indians are angry at the Indian model.

Video breaks down how economic crises, corruption, and public anger are often amplified by external forces looking to destabilize the region. We also ask the big question: what does this mean for India? Could similar regime change be engineered here? Spoiler—they tried in recent years, but failed




Recent times nepal sri lanka , burma and maldives are voicing their anger at you, bangladesh have turned thr backs n you and are increasing improving trade relations with pakistan, Pakistan keep downing your jets, China keeps putting you in your place, Afghanistan Taliban is the only really nearby country which has increased its relationship with you = not like many countries are liking any support with the taliban.

Russia, just using yourselves to buy russian jets / arms / oil and forcing you lot to bu this in UAE currency, as the indian rupee is declining

@JaDed @Vikram1989 @Rajdeep @Devadwal - what are your thoughts


o yeh any other poster feel free to contribute

Overthrowing sanghis would be beneficial for India. :inti

Sanghis have caused India to suffer global and regional isolation (alongside declines in various metrics).
 
Oh my double down on ignorance and showcasing that as an expert on “Indian” Model
 
Oh my double down on ignorance and showcasing that as an expert on “Indian” Model
still didnt change my mind on this topic, above video shows good depth of analysis, yet sanghis like yourself just can't be bothered to post anything valid to challenge the view,

share us the video and articles you read which states the opposite, do some work


your not even posting like a indian keyboard warrior, cmon - feels like your gonna ring jd vance or trump to ask us stop - you waving the white flag again.
 
still didnt change my mind on this topic, above video shows good depth of analysis, yet sanghis like yourself just can't be bothered to post anything valid to challenge the view,

share us the video and articles you read which states the opposite, do some work


your not even posting like a indian keyboard warrior, cmon - feels like your gonna ring jd vance or trump to ask us stop - you waving the white flag again.

They have no factual comebacks.

Their comebacks are --> whining, whataboutism, derailment etc. :inti
 
Overthrowing sanghis would be beneficial for India. :inti

Sanghis have caused India to suffer global and regional isolation (alongside declines in various metrics).
Worry about the Islamist nuts in your own country. India is doing well the way it is.

Also ask your 4 crore Bangladeshi trash to get the hell out of India. All of them are low wage laborers in a country with bad per capita. They have no access to sanitation and **** in the open. :mv
 
Better Models State Wise:
Maharastra, Tamil Nadu, Gujarat, Andhra-Telengana
There was an Economist article (“Which is India’s superstar state?”) earlier this month comparing two states, with high growth rates: Gujarat and Tamil Nadu. It is behind a pay-wall, but the thrust of the piece:

Gujarat has for many years been strong in the manufacture of textiles, the polishing of diamonds and as a hub for shipping. Recently it has sought to promote capital-intensive heavy industry, such as petrochemicals and pharmaceuticals. Significant investments in physical infrastructure like roads and power has been a key selling point. The Gujarat model is, therefore, more focused on physical capital.

The drawbacks of the model are that the growth has not been inclusive, with nearly 12% of the population living in “multidimensional poverty” . One factor is that while the mega-factories can generate large profits they do so without creating many jobs. But another factor is the low investment in human capital (education and healthcare). Less than half of the students complete high school - below the 58% average in India.

Tamil Nadu is a “big maker of cars, motorbikes, and lorries.” Recently they have successfully courted electronics manufacturing, such as Apple and picked up some “tech-services and other back-office work” that in the past was usually placed in Bangalore and Hyderabad. A highly skilled and healthy workforce have been key selling points.

The Tamil Nadu Model has, in contrast to Gujarat, prioritised human capital. The focus has been on social reforms, healthcare, and education. Over 80% stay in school for the maximum period. There are far more doctors and far more hospital beds than Gujarat. There are far fewer poor people in the state compared with Gujarat.

The drawback of the model is that physical infrastructure (power grids, highways) lags behind. The article quotes one expert as saying that the electricity grid is “atrocious.”

The article concludes that while politicians often prefer the immediate visibility of building infrastructure (laying concrete), long-term success and inclusive growth requires sustained investment in health and education. In other words there is much to be learned from the Tamil Nadu model.
 
There was an Economist article (“Which is India’s superstar state?”) earlier this month comparing two states, with high growth rates: Gujarat and Tamil Nadu. It is behind a pay-wall, but the thrust of the piece:

Gujarat has for many years been strong in the manufacture of textiles, the polishing of diamonds and as a hub for shipping. Recently it has sought to promote capital-intensive heavy industry, such as petrochemicals and pharmaceuticals. Significant investments in physical infrastructure like roads and power has been a key selling point. The Gujarat model is, therefore, more focused on physical capital.

The drawbacks of the model are that the growth has not been inclusive, with nearly 12% of the population living in “multidimensional poverty” . One factor is that while the mega-factories can generate large profits they do so without creating many jobs. But another factor is the low investment in human capital (education and healthcare). Less than half of the students complete high school - below the 58% average in India.

Tamil Nadu is a “big maker of cars, motorbikes, and lorries.” Recently they have successfully courted electronics manufacturing, such as Apple and picked up some “tech-services and other back-office work” that in the past was usually placed in Bangalore and Hyderabad. A highly skilled and healthy workforce have been key selling points.

The Tamil Nadu Model has, in contrast to Gujarat, prioritised human capital. The focus has been on social reforms, healthcare, and education. Over 80% stay in school for the maximum period. There are far more doctors and far more hospital beds than Gujarat. There are far fewer poor people in the state compared with Gujarat.

The drawback of the model is that physical infrastructure (power grids, highways) lags behind. The article quotes one expert as saying that the electricity grid is “atrocious.”

The article concludes that while politicians often prefer the immediate visibility of building infrastructure (laying concrete), long-term success and inclusive growth requires sustained investment in health and education. In other words there is much to be learned from the Tamil Nadu model.
I grew up in Chennai so I’m biased towards the TN model.

TN has been lucky that occasionally it has had decent leaders in one aspect or other, the state socially is also ahead due to continuous political Dravidian revolutions, that has helped create inclusive development.

TN has a rich Tamil history, with a Tamil diaspora around the world with intellectual capacity that has worked in creating a self belief among Tamizhans.(Telugu folks will overtake this aspect soon though).

Now issues with TN: political pettiness, the state saw lot of violence between the two dravidian parties when I was growing up, the dominant caste of Vaaniyar(has a political party) has been a pain and a hurdle towards ending Dalit violence in TN hotspots.

Hero worship is crazy in TN almost leading to violence or stampedes.

I do think TN can learn from Gujarat and Gujarat can learn from them.. I also the right balance is struck between the two Telugu states..in the next 10 years it will be visible, if the two telugu states hadn’t separated they would be ahead of TN right now in GDP.
 
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The Rupee has breached 90 & is inching closer to the 100 mark against the US dollar. Yet, the Godi media and the government are busy convincing people that a falling rupee is somehow a “boom” for the economy. But the falling rupee has exposed 3 BIG LIES of fhe Modi Govt​

Rupee Collapse Exposes 3 BIG LIES About Indian Economy & The Modi Govt​


 
From endless freebies to caste-based reservations and deep-rooted corruption India’s system feels rigged for those who play it, not those who work hard. The honest taxpayer pays for political giveaways, merit takes a back seat to vote-bank politics, and mediocrity is rewarded over effort.No wonder more Indians are asking: Is it even worth staying here anymore



Over 2 Lakh Indians Gave Up Citizenship In 2024: Centre:​


Indians are giving up passports in record numbers​



@JaDed, @Devadwal @Champ_Pal - are you thinking off jumping ships as well
 
I grew up in Chennai so I’m biased towards the TN model.

TN has been lucky that occasionally it has had decent leaders in one aspect or other, the state socially is also ahead due to continuous political Dravidian revolutions, that has helped create inclusive development.

TN has a rich Tamil history, with a Tamil diaspora around the world with intellectual capacity that has worked in creating a self belief among Tamizhans.(Telugu folks will overtake this aspect soon though).

Now issues with TN: political pettiness, the state saw lot of violence between the two dravidian parties when I was growing up, the dominant caste of Vaaniyar(has a political party) has been a pain and a hurdle towards ending Dalit violence in TN hotspots.

Hero worship is crazy in TN almost leading to violence or stampedes.

I do think TN can learn from Gujarat and Gujarat can learn from them.. I also the right balance is struck between the two Telugu states..in the next 10 years it will be visible, if the two telugu states hadn’t separated they would be ahead of TN right now in GDP.
I have limited knowledge on Tamil Nadu but two points I find interesting.

Madras, Calcutta and Bombay were the three great Presidency Towns in colonial India, where the East India Company dug its earliest and deepest roots. Madras was the earliest major settlement, emerging as a leading Asian port from the 1660s to the 1730s. Its prominence faded with the rise of Calcutta, but it remained a major administrative hub and home to some of the earliest educational institutions. These helped nurture a professional, rather than commercial, middle class.

Calcutta would itself be eclipsed by Bombay. Calcutta’s economy was dominated by British managing agencies (‘expatriate capitalism’). Bombay’s industrialisation on the other hand was driven by Indian capital (‘indigenous capitalism’), much of it accumulated through opium trade and later redeployed into cotton textiles and other industries. Bombay would also become a global hub connected to global markets through the Suez Canal. Calcutta’s economy was more oriented towards the Indian hinterland and therefore more inward focussed.

All of this left Bombay in better shape to consolidate itself as Indian financial heart in the independence period. Calcutta on the other hand suffered decline, adversely impacted by partition (loss of the hinterland), the ‘freight equalisation’ policy (which reduced its locational advantage) and a more intense labour conflict.

Perhaps most interesting was Madras. In 1947, it was a a conservative trading post with a relatively modest industrial base. But its early emphasis on universal schooling and technical education laid the foundation for a deep talent tool - one that would later power the state’s manufacturing, engineering and IT sectors.

The second point is to consider the legacies of two of its most famous politicians: Rajaji (Rajagopalachari) and Periyar (E.V. Ramaswamy). The former was a famous national statesmen. He was a devoted Gandhian, a conservative and someone who believed in minimal interference from the state (see post #10). Yet, it was the latter - Periyar - who arguably shaped the long-term trajectory of the state, more profoundly. He launched the the Self-Respect movement in 1925, which attacked the caste system, religious superstition and gender inequality. The Justice Party that he led, also promoted compulsory education and the empowerment of the non-Brahmin groups. He also championed Dravidian identity, an ideology which fuelled regional pride and sense of distinct cultural identity, and which later became a foundation for DMK and AIADMK.

The consistent political focus on social justice, therefore had deep roots in the state. Education was seen as a key tool of empowerment. The unique political culture, centred on social justice, has done much to shape the later economic success.
 
I have limited knowledge on Tamil Nadu but two points I find interesting.

Madras, Calcutta and Bombay were the three great Presidency Towns in colonial India, where the East India Company dug its earliest and deepest roots. Madras was the earliest major settlement, emerging as a leading Asian port from the 1660s to the 1730s. Its prominence faded with the rise of Calcutta, but it remained a major administrative hub and home to some of the earliest educational institutions. These helped nurture a professional, rather than commercial, middle class.

Calcutta would itself be eclipsed by Bombay. Calcutta’s economy was dominated by British managing agencies (‘expatriate capitalism’). Bombay’s industrialisation on the other hand was driven by Indian capital (‘indigenous capitalism’), much of it accumulated through opium trade and later redeployed into cotton textiles and other industries. Bombay would also become a global hub connected to global markets through the Suez Canal. Calcutta’s economy was more oriented towards the Indian hinterland and therefore more inward focussed.

All of this left Bombay in better shape to consolidate itself as Indian financial heart in the independence period. Calcutta on the other hand suffered decline, adversely impacted by partition (loss of the hinterland), the ‘freight equalisation’ policy (which reduced its locational advantage) and a more intense labour conflict.

Perhaps most interesting was Madras. In 1947, it was a a conservative trading post with a relatively modest industrial base. But its early emphasis on universal schooling and technical education laid the foundation for a deep talent tool - one that would later power the state’s manufacturing, engineering and IT sectors.

The second point is to consider the legacies of two of its most famous politicians: Rajaji (Rajagopalachari) and Periyar (E.V. Ramaswamy). The former was a famous national statesmen. He was a devoted Gandhian, a conservative and someone who believed in minimal interference from the state (see post #10). Yet, it was the latter - Periyar - who arguably shaped the long-term trajectory of the state, more profoundly. He launched the the Self-Respect movement in 1925, which attacked the caste system, religious superstition and gender inequality. The Justice Party that he led, also promoted compulsory education and the empowerment of the non-Brahmin groups. He also championed Dravidian identity, an ideology which fuelled regional pride and sense of distinct cultural identity, and which later became a foundation for DMK and AIADMK.

The consistent political focus on social justice, therefore had deep roots in the state. Education was seen as a key tool of empowerment. The unique political culture, centred on social justice, has done much to shape the later economic success.
Very well written, I agree on most of it but I would like to point out the downfall of Calcutta also coincided with continuous Leftist policies,union thuggery which happened in Bombay too but was handled better than Calcutta.

Calcutta had good industrial base and highly educated population , the famous Hindustan Motors, ITC etc ,I agree on the freight issue which ruined the Jute sector but no way can the violence from 1977 be forgiven, Strikes and industry lockouts started happening from 1965 itself but the violence under communist party rule is really not talked about.
 
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To be fair, Indians might believe that in an eco-friendly environment, there would be no need to do too much street cleaning. Without man-made roads, it wouldn't matter if horses or cows defecated wherever, the earth would recycle it. Indian culture was about honouring the environment and all living matter is holy. Without industrialisation, there would be less need for civic sense.
 
Lee Kuan Yew REVEALS Why India CAN'T Match China’s Success




Ouch that must hurt - India can't compete with China

@Hitman do you agree +also what do you think about the video regarding indians sheepish behaviour
 
India’s tyre industry often rides on the narrative of scale, domestic demand, and export potential. Yet beneath the rolling momentum lies a set of structural weaknesses that quietly erode competitiveness and long-term resilience.

1. Heavy Dependence on Imported Raw Materials

Natural rubber, synthetic rubber, carbon black, and specialty chemicals form the backbone of tyre manufacturing. India remains significantly dependent on imports for several of these inputs, especially synthetic rubber and advanced chemicals. This exposes tyre manufacturers to currency volatility, global supply disruptions, and sudden cost spikes, making margins fragile and unpredictable.

2. Vulnerability to Crude Oil Price Swings

Synthetic rubber and carbon black are crude-derived. Any fluctuation in global oil prices directly impacts production costs. Tyre companies often struggle to pass these increases to OEMs and consumers in a price-sensitive market, leading to margin compression during commodity upcycles.

3. Intense Price Competition and Thin Margins

The domestic market is overcrowded with large incumbents, regional players, and low-cost imports. Price wars are common, particularly in the replacement segment. As a result, profitability is often sacrificed for volume, discouraging sustained investments in technology, R&D, and premium product segments.

4. Limited Technological Depth

Compared to global leaders, much of India’s tyre industry still lags in advanced tyre technology, especially in areas like EV-specific tyres, ultra-high-performance tyres, and smart tyres. R&D spending remains modest, and innovation is frequently incremental rather than transformative.

5. Environmental and Regulatory Pressures

Tyre manufacturing is energy-intensive and environmentally sensitive. Increasing scrutiny around emissions, waste disposal, and water usage is raising compliance costs. Smaller manufacturers, in particular, struggle to meet evolving environmental norms, risking shutdowns or consolidation under stress.

6. Fragmented Replacement Market

The replacement tyre market, while large, is highly fragmented and driven by unorganized trade, dealer incentives, and discounting. Brand loyalty is weak outside premium segments, leading to inconsistent demand patterns and limited pricing power.

7. Export Constraints and Global Competition

Indian tyres face stiff competition from Chinese, Thai, and Vietnamese manufacturers who often benefit from scale efficiencies, subsidies, and stronger integration into global supply chains. Anti-dumping duties in some markets and quality perception issues further restrict India’s export growth.

8. Capital-Intensive Expansion Cycles

Setting up or expanding tyre manufacturing capacity requires significant capital investment and long gestation periods. Any misjudgment in demand cycles can result in underutilized plants, high fixed costs, and balance-sheet stress.

9. Slow Adaptation to EV and Mobility Shifts

The transition toward electric vehicles and shared mobility demands new tyre designs with lower rolling resistance, higher torque handling, and reduced noise. India’s tyre industry, barring a few leaders, has been slow to realign product portfolios for this shift.

10. Dependence on Auto Sector Cyclicality

Tyre demand remains closely tied to automobile sales, infrastructure spending, and freight movement. Economic slowdowns, regulatory changes, or weak auto cycles quickly translate into inventory pile-ups and demand shocks.
 
Why India Is Falling Behind in Furniture Exports: Craft Without Consistency

India’s woodworking legacy hasn’t translated into global export success. Despite abundant skill, the country lags behind Vietnam, China, and Poland because craftsmanship remains artisanal, informal, and inconsistent, while global markets demand standardization, scale, and repeatable quality.

Indian carpenters excel at one-off pieces but fail at uniform production. Outdated designs, weak ergonomics, and poor finishing undermine export appeal. Limited mechanization, lack of precision tools, and improper wood processing lead to warping, cracking, and dimensional flaws.

A fragmented supply chain, weak quality-control culture, and poor compliance with global certifications further erode buyer confidence. Add cost-first thinking, corner-cutting, and inadequate export packaging, and even decent products fail international standards.
 
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