"You can say that breaking the opening partnership with Babar Azam has caused some damage": Mohammad Rizwan

[Mamoon]

Haris or Azam. Who would you pick? At the crease, behind the wickets and as an outfielder? Of course. It is a no brainer.

If I am forced to choose between the two then obviously Haris. I would literally play with 10 men but not have Azam in the team.

 

[mominsaigol]

Remind me again who else scored any runs that day?

Chacha and rizzu both played chasing a target of 157 as Sri lanka bowled like 14 wides in the very first over along with no balls.

Despite this and the fact that rizzu and chacha both contributed to an 87 run partnership which in almost every t20 game is match winning unless target is 180+, Pakistan still got butchered.

No one told rizzu to make 55 of 49 and chacha to make 32 of 31. By the time these 2 departed Pakistan were at 110 of 5 in 16.1 requiring the middle order to chase 60 of 23?

You could have had any MO in the world and that wasn't gonna be chased. It was 100% their fault and your bickering and support for rizzu won't change that

 

[heddie19]

In recent times? By any team? The sheer presence of Azam Khan in the squad propels this team to the most pathetic squad selection in all of international cricketing history across all formats across all time.

It is hard to believe we have self proclaimed experts on here who are prepared to defend not just the inclusion of Azam Khan, but why he is better than Babar and Rizwan.

Probably. I was just trying to be polite. Azam Khan is an insult to cricket fraternity. He should have never been anywhere near to international cricket with this shape and size.

Regarding selection, a friend of mine was mocking Shadab's selection as I pointed out the match-winning perfromances Shadab gave, particularly against SA in last T20 WC but when I say how can you talk about Shadab's selection when the merit of the selection criteria are Azam and Amir. He didn't argue further.

 

[Mamoon]

If you have a problem with Babar and Rizwan opening then you should have a problem with Saim.

Direct your anger and frustration at him not at anyone else. He received all the support and backing to close the chapter on this pair that has given you lot sleepless nights but he blew his chances.

There are no excuses for his failures. He batted in his favored position, he played all matches and on flat decks vs averaging bowling attacks. It is not like he was asked to face Bumrah or Cummins or Rabada or Boult.

Thankfully he wasn’t played in the middle-order. God forbid if he was, the usual suspects would have bashed Babar like no tomorrow and claimed that Saim would be scoring 25 ball centuries if he was trusted as an opener.

 

[heddie19]

With this squad the best combination I could find is the following.

Saim
Rizwan (WK)
Babar (C)
Usman
Fakhar (if he can bat at 4. he can bat at 5. too )
Iftikhar
Imad
Shaheen
Abbas
Rauf
Abrar

 

[UzmanBeast]

Shadab at 5 is criminal. He is not a better batsman than someone like Pat Cummins or Mitchell Starc, who would barely qualify as bowling all-rounders and who would never bat in the top 5 for Australia.

Pakistan have absolutely no chance with a middle-order compromising of players like Shadab, Iftikhar, Azam and Imad when then people will blame Babar and Rizwan.

Fakhar can make the middle-order look good on his day when he fires at 4, but when he doesn’t, it is probably a worse middle-order than most of the associate sides.

If Shadab were an actual all-rounder, I wouldn't mind using him as a floater. But the fact of the matter is that he compromised his great bowling and useful lower order contributions in the unnecessary attempted change to become some batting all-rounder.

The team didn't need Shadab Khan the misfire with both bat and ball that he has become now. PSL pressure cannot compete with international level pressure, he has good contributions with the bat but he is not a batsman. For all the potential he had as a bowler, he has completely fallen off, and is not an asset to the team anymore like he once was.

Worse off is the fact that Iftikhar, if he wasn't so awful against spin, could have been a good #3 or #5 for Pakistan.

To me, Azam Khan is the biggest liability in the team. He needs to be dropped, it is a wasted slot in the World Cup team.

And even more so, Pakistan are a batter short in this tournament. Packing Abbas Afridi as a 5th seam option was unnecessary for such surfaces in the West Indies given the comeback of Haris Rauf.

I reckon the batting lineup today was the best to be conjured with the resources available. Maybe Pakistan could have tried Usman Khan as an opener earlier rather than give Saim such a long rope, but it's far too late now.

Rizwan (wk)
Babar
Usman
Fakhar
Imad (better at #5 than Shadab Khan in my opinion)
Iftikhar
Shaheen
Amir
Haris
Abrar

I think Shadab's "all-rounder" status is eating up Abrar Ahmed's opportunities, we desperately require a wicket-taking spinner.

Only on perhaps flatter tracks would I be tempted to swap Abrar for Shadab, but one serious flaw in Babar's captaincy is how little he uses Iftikhar, despite him being a very decent bowler to give two overs where needed.

 

[heddie19]

If you have a problem with Babar and Rizwan opening then you should have a problem with Saim.

Direct your anger and frustration at him not at anyone else. He received all the support and backing to close the chapter on this pair that has given you lot sleepless nights but he blew his chances.

There are no excuses for his failures. He batted in his favored position, he played all matches and on flat decks vs averaging bowling attacks. It is not like he was asked to face Bumrah or Cummins or Rabada or Boult.

Thankfully he wasn’t played in the middle-order. God forbid if he was, the usual suspects would have bashed Babar like no tomorrow and claimed that Saim would be scoring 25 ball centuries if he was trusted as an opener.

@Mamoon I love you! Never thought we could have opinions on the game. But Lots of love and respect.

 

[heddie19]

If Shadab were an actual all-rounder, I wouldn't mind using him as a floater. But the fact of the matter is that he compromised his great bowling and useful lower order contributions in the unnecessary attempted change to become some batting all-rounder.

The team didn't need Shadab Khan the misfire with both bat and ball that he has become now. PSL pressure cannot compete with international level pressure, he has good contributions with the bat but he is not a batsman. For all the potential he had as a bowler, he has completely fallen off, and is not an asset to the team anymore like he once was.

Worse off is the fact that Iftikhar, if he wasn't so awful against spin, could have been a good #3 or #5 for Pakistan.

To me, Azam Khan is the biggest liability in the team. He needs to be dropped, it is a wasted slot in the World Cup team.

And even more so, Pakistan are a batter short in this tournament. Packing Abbas Afridi as a 5th seam option was unnecessary for such surfaces in the West Indies given the comeback of Haris Rauf.

I reckon the batting lineup today was the best to be conjured with the resources available. Maybe Pakistan could have tried Usman Khan as an opener earlier rather than give Saim such a long rope, but it's far too late now.

Rizwan (wk)
Babar
Usman
Fakhar
Imad (better at #5 than Shadab Khan in my opinion)
Iftikhar
Shaheen
Amir
Haris
Abrar

I think Shadab's "all-rounder" status is eating up Abrar Ahmed's opportunities, we desperately require a wicket-taking spinner.

Only on perhaps flatter tracks would I be tempted to swap Abrar for Shadab, but one serious flaw in Babar's captaincy is how little he uses Iftikhar, despite him being a very decent bowler to give two overs where needed.

Your team has 10 players. Bring Saim in and its the same 11 as mine.

 

[UzmanBeast]

Chacha and rizzu both played chasing a target of 157 as Sri lanka bowled like 14 wides in the very first over along with no balls.

Despite this and the fact that rizzu and chacha both contributed to an 87 run partnership which in almost every t20 game is match winning unless target is 180+, Pakistan still got butchered.

No one told rizzu to make 55 of 49 and chacha to make 32 of 31. By the time these 2 departed Pakistan were at 110 of 5 in 16.1 requiring the middle order to chase 60 of 23?

You could have had any MO in the world and that wasn't gonna be chased. It was 100% their fault and your bickering and support for rizzu won't change that

You can chat all you like about secluded instances to prove your point. Let me ask you this, who would you rather open and what are their numbers?

Who do you know that hasn't been given an opportunity and failed on the international level already?

One dimensional perspectives are fine if you want to stick to your knowledge of league and club cricket.

International cricket is a different ball game.

Neither Saim, Fakhar, Sharjeel, Haider, Abdullah, Farhan have sealed a spot in the top order with any notable performances.

At least Fakhar worked enough to merit a spot in the middle order of the squad.

If there were better options than Babar and Rizwan to open, and more importantly (please bear this in mind), to score runs, then I will immediately ask for them to break their opening partnership.

The fact of the matter is that we don't have Virat Kohli or ABD on our bench to replace these two with. We have a bunch of mindless sloggers who have already failed at international level.

 

[Rana]

@Mamoon I love you! Never thought we could have opinions on the game. But Lots of love and respect.

Glad to see you have found a common ground now that Mamoon is doing PZ’s promotion campaign here

 

[mominsaigol]

You can chat all you like about secluded instances to prove your point. Let me ask you this, who would you rather open and what are their numbers?

Who do you know that hasn't been given an opportunity and failed on the international level already?

One dimensional perspectives are fine if you want to stick to your knowledge of league and club cricket.

International cricket is a different ball game.

Neither Saim, Fakhar, Sharjeel, Haider, Abdullah, Farhan have sealed a spot in the top order with any notable performances.

At least Fakhar worked enough to merit a spot in the middle order of the squad.

If there were better options than Babar and Rizwan to open, and more importantly (please bear this in mind), to score runs, then I will immediately ask for them to break their opening partnership.

The fact of the matter is that we don't have Virat Kohli or ABD on our bench to replace these two with. We have a bunch of mindless sloggers who have already failed at international level.

I gave my options on every single thread and people ignore it. And this isn't an isolated incident, I highlighted this one cause its the most annoying one as it was a final.

Regardless you people don't watch acc emerging cups nor do you watch proper domestic?

Our acc emerging cup team would butcher our current team 5-0 in a t20 series. Infact no one from acc is playing besides saim and saim failing isn't a suprise. If people watched the acc cup they'd know that he was actually the worst performer even in that tournament with everyone outperforming besides Hasebullah who failed and got dropped after a single game

 

[UzmanBeast]

Your team has 10 players. Bring Saim in and its the same 11 as mine.

Forgot to slot in Shadab/Azam.

Desperately lacking in batsmen, neither of these two should play in the team.

Saim has had enough of a run I think. If need be, he can be tried again if the batting lineup needs to be stretched, but he has had enough chances.

 

[mominsaigol]

Glad to see you have found a common ground now that Mamoon is doing PZ’s promotion campaign here

Ya he's loving the guy who bullied him black and blue. Just say babar azam > Saeed anwar and you'll get an I love you message as well.

It ain't that difficult

 

[Rana]

Ya he's loving the guy who bullied him black and blue. Just say babar azam > Saeed anwar and you'll get an I love you message as well.

It ain't that difficult

He’s getting pretty aggressive too. Don’t mind it. He can celebrate Babar’s 36 runs as if he is a proud missus Babar

 

[mominsaigol]

He’s getting pretty aggressive too. Don’t mind it. He can celebrate Babar’s 36 runs as if he is a proud missus Babar

I don't mind heddie bro . He gets aggressive with me anytime babar scores anything > 30. He's gotten 100× more aggressive then this with me before.

I just wait for the next game where Bobby gets out under 10 and he vanishes and wipes his tears for a while.

 

[UzmanBeast]

I gave my options on every single thread and people ignore it. And this isn't an isolated incident, I highlighted this one cause its the most annoying one as it was a final.

Regardless you people don't watch acc emerging cups nor do you watch proper domestic?

Our acc emerging cup team would butcher our current team 5-0 in a t20 series. Infact no one from acc is playing besides saim and saim failing isn't a suprise. If people watched the acc cup they'd know that he was actually the worst performer even in that tournament with everyone outperforming besides Hasebullah who failed and got dropped after a single game

The team winning or losing doesn't amount to Babar and Rizwan.

People want everything is the problem. You cannot expect 50+ opening partnership every game at a 200+ SR.

It is a simple truth, Pakistan lacks both the talent to meet those requirements, and the mindset to produce talent. Our talent rises to the top and is dismembered by top level teams.

I would rather take a pair that is giving runs and helping the team win in 8 games out of 10 than a pair that will score runs in 2 games out of 10.

Yes, I fully agree Rizwan and Babar were horrible in 2022, not just Asia Cup but even the World Cup.

But who stepped up in that world cup with the bat? Nobody.

Even in the Asia Cup. Nobody.

You can say that they should have played better, they probably know that themselves.

But time and time again we have seen players come and go in the middle order. And they go because the lack the mental strength to handle pressure.

What happened in the 2023 WC when Babar and Rizwan got out against India?

What happened in that tournament itself when runs weren't coming for Babar?

It is easy to sit and poke fingers at people, but Babar and Rizwan are not frontrunners for copping criticism at the moment.

Why has Saim Ayub failed in the 20 odd chances he has gotten? If you reckon 20 is a short rope, most players are lucky to get one chance for their team.

Why has Azam Khan been a failure of fitness and in cricketing skill?

Why has Iftikhar Ahmed been unable to live up to our expectations as a sensible middle order batsman?

Why has Shadab Khan been unable to contribute with both bat and ball in the recent year or so?

Why has Shaheen still not learned to pull his length back when the ball stops swinging?

I guarantee you there are a lot of questionmarks in this Pakistan Team.

Babar and Rizwan aren't responsible for them, no matter how much you may be hoping that one problem can fix all problems.

 

[UzmanBeast]

Amir was out-performed by at least 5 local pacers in PSL and most of them aren’t even on PCB’s radar. Even Hassan Ali bowled better than him.

He did nothing to merit selection. PCB is trying to recreate the past but it won’t happen because Amir was finished years ago.

He has tried to be a hero and a savior by making a grand comeback but he will only suffer humiliation and regret his decision.

Fitting Amir into the squad for no reason means we are a batter short for the WC. If a middle order batsman is out of form, like now, we are stranded for options.

 

[mominsaigol]

The team winning or losing doesn't amount to Babar and Rizwan.

People want everything is the problem. You cannot expect 50+ opening partnership every game at a 200+ SR.

It is a simple truth, Pakistan lacks both the talent to meet those requirements, and the mindset to produce talent. Our talent rises to the top and is dismembered by top level teams.

I would rather take a pair that is giving runs and helping the team win in 8 games out of 10 than a pair that will score runs in 2 games out of 10.

Yes, I fully agree Rizwan and Babar were horrible in 2022, not just Asia Cup but even the World Cup.

But who stepped up in that world cup with the bat? Nobody.

Even in the Asia Cup. Nobody.

You can say that they should have played better, they probably know that themselves.

But time and time again we have seen players come and go in the middle order. And they go because the lack the mental strength to handle pressure.

What happened in the 2023 WC when Babar and Rizwan got out against India?

What happened in that tournament itself when runs weren't coming for Babar?

It is easy to sit and poke fingers at people, but Babar and Rizwan are not frontrunners for copping criticism at the moment.

Why has Saim Ayub failed in the 20 odd chances he has gotten? If you reckon 20 is a short rope, most players are lucky to get one chance for their team.

Why has Azam Khan been a failure of fitness and in cricketing skill?

Why has Iftikhar Ahmed been unable to live up to our expectations as a sensible middle order batsman?

Why has Shadab Khan been unable to contribute with both bat and ball in the recent year or so?

Why has Shaheen still not learned to pull his length back when the ball stops swinging?

I guarantee you there are a lot of questionmarks in this Pakistan Team.

Babar and Rizwan aren't responsible for them, no matter how much you may be hoping that one problem can fix all problems.

This is what you people always do, you extend the conversation beyond the premise.

Your premise was Rizwan and babar are proven performers and any time even a single one of them performs Pakistan win.

I responded highlighting why that's not the case.

If you agree which you did, then you agree plain and simple. All this extra paragraphs diving deep into the history and structure of pcb, Pakistan, selections etc isn't relevant.

 

[heddie19]

I don't mind heddie bro . He gets aggressive with me anytime babar scores anything > 30. He's gotten 100× more aggressive then this with me before.

I just wait for the next game where Bobby gets out under 10 and he vanishes and wipes his tears for a while.

If Bobby getting out under 10 was that common, he wouldn't have had most runs across the globe across formats in last 5,6 years. My point is simple. He is your best player, if you are mocking at your best perfromers, the problem is with you not with them. Have you ever seen me bashing Babar or Shaheen or Abdullah or Rizwan or Fakhar? Bec they perform more often the ones you guys advocate are tried and tested failures (Sharjeel, Azam etc)

I will always respect someone who does better for my country than someone who doesn't even justify his place.

 

[Flat_Track_Bully]

Babar and Rizwan are needed in the last 10 overs because they are more reliable.

This should be the order.

Top 3 have free hand to go bezerk even if they get out.

Fakhar
Saim
Ifti
Babar
Usman K
Rizwan

 

[mominsaigol]

If Bobby getting out under 10 was that common, he wouldn't have had most runs across the globe across formats in last 5,6 years. My point is simple. He is your best player, if you are mocking at your best perfromers, the problem is with you not with them. Have you ever seen me bashing Babar or Shaheen or Abdullah or Rizwan or Fakhar? Bec they perform more often the ones you guys advocate are tried and tested failures (Sharjeel, Azam etc)

I will always respect someone who does better for my country than someone who doesn't even justify his place.

You automatically bash every single player in existence by calling Bobby the best of all time and taking it to such an extreme.

Which always ends in humiliation as that wasn't the case in 2023 wc nor has it been the case in any 2024 series.

Aren't you bashing saeed anwar by claiming Babar is superior to him? Babar in a batting friendly era with bigger bats, Smaller boundaries, bowlers who no longer consistently bowl 150kph like in the old days, 2 new balls which means middle overs and less spin in odi formats can't even perform properly against India, him averaging low because India is the only team Babar has never played b string against as India and Pakistan meet only in tours?

Whereas saeed in an atrociously difficult era bullied classy bowlers left and right and had zero weaknesses especially against spin? Saeed is in the class of butler, Warner, gilchrist, Travis, maxwell, quinton etc etc all players who are a million times superior to Bobby whereas Bobby isn't even on the field of amla yet. Not even close.

 

[Cricket Warrior]

No more trolling, guys. If you have nothing useful to discuss, please avoid posting here. No more personal attacks.

 

[Rana]

It is not those 36 runs that have upset you as he usually scores more than that. It is his T20 SR which is around 145 since 2023. I can see you crumbling already

We have appreciated those performances from him at number 3 for the country. What irks us is his self promotion with Rizwan. You genuinely think me and my friends who criticise him do so because we personally just don’t like him? And it’s not cricket related?

 

[heddie19]

Babar and Rizwan are needed in the last 10 overs because they are more reliable.

This should be the order.

Top 3 have free hand to go bezerk even if they get out.

Fakhar
Saim
Ifti
Babar
Usman K
Rizwan

What if I tell you that Babar Azam has a better career SR than Ifti and Saim. Fakhar only marginally better. Also, you never save the best for last.

 

[UzmanBeast]

You automatically bash every single player in existence by calling Bobby the best of all time and taking it to such an extreme.

Which always ends in humiliation as that wasn't the case in 2023 wc nor has it been the case in any 2024 series.

Aren't you bashing saeed anwar by claiming Babar is superior to him? Babar in a batting friendly era with bigger bats, Smaller boundaries, bowlers who no longer consistently bowl 150kph like in the old days, 2 new balls which means middle overs and less spin in odi formats can't even perform properly against India, him averaging low because India is the only team Babar has never played b string against as India and Pakistan meet only in tours?

Whereas saeed in an atrociously difficult era bullied classy bowlers left and right and had zero weaknesses especially against spin? Saeed is in the class of butler, Warner, gilchrist, Travis, maxwell, quinton etc etc all players who are a million times superior to Bobby whereas Bobby isn't even on the field of amla yet. Not even close.

Yes, him mentioning current Pakistan players is bashing the likes of Saeed Anwar.

Until people remove the glass dome around the batsmen in the middle order of Pakistan as if they are going to turn water into gold, we will have just Babar, Rizwan, and the tailenders in our team.

 

[heddie19]

We have appreciated those performances from him at number 3 for the country. What irks us is his self promotion with Rizwan. You genuinely think me and my friends who criticise him do so because we personally just don’t like him? And it’s not cricket related?

I don't mind him at no. 3 either. The way your opening does without Babar makes him an opener apparently at no. 3 too. Yes, if you start reading your posts. You will realize that its more personal and less cricket related.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

The damage indeed, by letting Babar and Rizwan open, has been significant.

 

[Rana]

What if I tell you that Babar Azam has a better career SR than Ifti and Saim. Fakhar only marginally better. Also, you never save the best for last.

Don’t tell us anything, we’ve seen plenty of cricket to tell that Babar’s position is number 3. At worst number 4.

 

[Flat_Track_Bully]

What if I tell you that Babar Azam has a better career SR than Ifti and Saim. Fakhar only marginally better. Also, you never save the best for last.

No denying but with the middle order we have, even if they get 100 runs in 10 overs, they will still collapse.

So what I'm saying is let the top order go hard and Babar/Rizwan pace the last 10 overs.

 

[Rana]

The damage indeed, by letting Babar and Rizwan open, has been significant.

This has to be the worst beating we have taken since the 2022 World Cup today, yet you see these RizBar cheerleaders acting as if all our problems have been solved

 

[Rana]

No denying but with the middle order we have, even if they get 100 runs in 10 overs, they will still collapse.

So what I'm saying is let the top order go hard and Babar/Rizwan pace the last 10 overs.

Let’s be plain and simple

Babar and Rizwan CANT BAT in T20 when the first ball they face is with 5 fielders on the boundary. They are that bad!

Pick one of the two, I think Babar to stay at 3 and let him play how he does. Just accept him for what he is. Go on son get your little 50…whilst others swing hard for the fences. Let him bat to the 17th over.

Kick this Rizwan out

 

[heddie19]

You automatically bash every single player in existence by calling Bobby the best of all time and taking it to such an extreme.

Which always ends in humiliation as that wasn't the case in 2023 wc nor has it been the case in any 2024 series.

Aren't you bashing saeed anwar by claiming Babar is superior to him? Babar in a batting friendly era with bigger bats, Smaller boundaries, bowlers who no longer consistently bowl 150kph like in the old days, 2 new balls which means middle overs and less spin in odi formats can't even perform properly against India, him averaging low because India is the only team Babar has never played b string again of st as India and Pakistan meet only in tours?

Whereas saeed in an atrociously difficult era bullied classy bowlers left and right and had zero weaknesses especially against spin? Saeed is in the class of butler, Warner, gilchrist, Travis, maxwell, quinton etc etc all players who are a million times superior to Bobby whereas Bobby isn't even on the field of amla yet. Not even close.

No, none of the players you mentioned are better than Babar. Maxwell and Head are not even close. Head scored 1 run in last 3 games that were final and playoffs. If Babar would have done it, you would make fun of it for 5 years at least. I have seen Saeed Anwar play, MoYo play, Inzi play. I can proudly say that Babar is the best of them all as far as white-batting is concerned. For red ball of the game, he needs to prove a lot. No disrespect to anyone tbh.

 

[Rana]

What did Rizwan do today? How has he been head and shoulders better than Saim?!!

 

[heddie19]

Let’s be plain and simple

Babar and Rizwan CANT BAT in T20 when the first ball they face is with 5 fielders on the boundary. They are that bad!

Pick one of the two, I think Babar to stay at 3 and let him play how he does. Just accept him for what he is. Go on son get your little 50…whilst others swing hard for the fences. Let him bat to the 17th over.

Kick this Rizwan out

And give gloves to Azam Khan who will drop 2 catches every match.

 

[Rana]

No, none of the players you mentioned are better than Babar. Maxwell and Head are not even close

Head and Maxwell are not even close to Babar?





Oh boy..

 

[heddie19]

What did Rizwan do today? How has he been head and shoulders better than Saim?!!

Rizwan averages 50 at 128. Saim averages 15 at 127. Do you even realize how many runs difference is there?

PS. I love Saim, but he is not justifying his spot.

 

[Rana]

And give gloves to Azam Khan who will drop 2 catches every match.

You can jump up and down all you want today. Players have bad games but not be incompetent 119 T20s on the job…that’s another level of failure.

 

[Rana]

Rizwan averages 50 at 128. Saim averages 15 at 127. Do you even realize how many runs difference is there?

PS. I love Saim, but he is not justifying his spot.

Who’s better, Rizwan or Fin Allen? Let’s hear it

 

[heddie19]

Head and Maxwell are not even close to Babar?





Oh boy..

No they're not. Maxwell is a failure at red-ball and Head has been fantastic for last 2,3 years accros formats but Babar has been doing the same for twice as much time.

 

[mominsaigol]

No, none of the players you mentioned are better than Babar. Maxwell and Head are not even close. Head scored 1 run in last 3 games that were final and playoffs. If Babar would have done it, you would make fun of it for 5 years at least. I have seen Saeed Anwar play, MoYo play, Inzi play. I can proudly say that Babar is the best of them all as far as white-batting is concerned. For red ball of the game, he needs to prove a lot. No disrespect to anyone tbh.

Why is it that babar who according to you is the greatest of all time gets outperformed by almost every batter in odi world cups? A format where he's considered no 1 ranked whereas in t20 he isn't no 1 ranked.

 

[Cricket Warrior]

The damage indeed, by letting Babar and Rizwan open, has been significant.

other options are worst so why not give them a go and if never performs in WC so kick them out once for all

 

[Rana]

No they're not. Maxwell is a failure at red-ball and Head has been fantastic for last 2,3 years accros formats but Babar has been doing the same for twice as much time.

So Babar is a better T20 or white ball batter than Maxwell and Head because,

“Maxwell is a Test failure” and “Babar has scored more runs over the years than Head”?

 

[heddie19]

You can jump up and down all you want today. Players have bad games but not be incompetent 119 T20s on the job…that’s another level of failure.

4000 runs, most 50+ scores, 3 Tons (2 while succesfully chasing 200+) The Greatest of All Time, Babar KING Azam.

 

[heddie19]

So Babar is a better T20 or white ball batter than Maxwell and Head because,

“Maxwell is a Test failure” and “Babar has scored more runs over the years than Head”?

I was talking about all-format. That is why I mentioned red ball too.

 

[Rana]

4000 runs, most 50+ scores, 3 Tons (2 while succesfully chasing 200+) The Greatest of All Time, Babar KING Azam.

4000 runs

119 games played consistently

Ranked top 5 in ICC T20 rankings for quite some time…


Pakistan is ranked 7 and is probably the lowest they have ever been as a team…how does this work?

 

[Rana]

I was talking about all-format . That is why I mentioned red ball too.

Right…so I’m the idiot now because you have been celebrating the independence of Pakistan today because Babar scored 36 in a T20…

Which gave you the audacity to suddenly say Head and Maxwell are not even close to Babar? What is your argument?

Is Babar a better overall white ball batter than Head and Maxwell?

 

[heddie19]

Why is it that babar who according to you is the greatest of all time gets outperformed by almost every batter in odi world cups? A format where he's considered no 1 ranked whereas in t20 he isn't no 1 ranked.

As a matter of fact, Babar out performed the likes of Kohlis, Smiths, Buttlers, De Kocks in his debut ODI WC. Similarly, He outperformed each and every batter in his debut t20 WC that also includes (Kohlis, Williamsons, Smiths, Maxwells etc)

 

[heddie19]

Right…so I’m the idiot now because you have been celebrating the independence of Pakistan today because Babar scored 36 in a T20…

Which gave you the audacity to suddenly say Head and Maxwell are not even close to Babar? What is your argument?

Is Babar a better overall white ball batter than Head and Maxwell?

Of course he is, that too by some distance. You need to start watching more cricket to understand that.

 

[Rana]

As a matter of fact, Babar out performed the likes of Kohlis, Smiths, Buttlers, De Kocks in his debut ODI WC. Similarly, He outperformed each and every batter in his debut t20 WC that also includes (Kohlis, Williamsons, Smiths, Maxwells etc)

I guess you were born yesterday. Otherwise you wouldn't have commented this nonsense.

So Babar just became crap with time whilst those who he outperformed initially got better and took their teams to the SF of the 2023 wc in alien conditions?

 

[Rana]

Of course he is, that too by some distance. You need to start watching more cricket to understand that.

Is that what you will use to educate me when explaining to me that Babar is a better white ball player than Maxwell and Head?

 

[mominsaigol]

As a matter of fact, Babar out performed the likes of Kohlis, Smiths, Buttlers, De Kocks in his debut ODI WC. Similarly, He outperformed each and every batter in his debut t20 WC that also includes (Kohlis, Williamsons, Smiths, Maxwells etc)

As a matter of fact, Babar out performed the likes of Kohlis, Smiths, Buttlers, De Kocks in his debut ODI WC.

Again thats not the point. You're claim is he's the greatest of all time and he's some Don Bradman correct? Aka he's always ontop no matter what just like Don Bradman was in literally every game besides his final innings where he got dismissed for a single digit score for the first time in history.

So why did warner and rohit end up scoring more then him in 2 world cups back to back? If hes the greatest of all time he should be no 1 in both period. And if hes the greatest of all time aka even > Bradman then he should never go out of form and have a 17 avg in t20 world cups either?

whats the science behind that?

 

[Dr_Bassim]

Of course he is, that too by some distance. You need to start watching more cricket to understand that.

Babar's ceiling is a washed up Amla in limited overs.

In Tests I would argue Amla is better than the .

Babar is not even a speck in the pantheon of T20 and ODI greats.

Michael Bevan's one knock alone is better than any ODI knock played by Babar over this century.

That is how average Babar is.

You won't be able to bear the heat, if you start counting Babar's useless knocks.

 

[heddie19]

So Babar just became crap with time whilst those who he outperformed initially got better and took their teams to the SF of the 2023 wc in alien conditions?

The Chairman leaked his chat, the selector made to resign amidst WC in a country where his players never played at. His bowlers were simply getting smacked right, left and centre. Still Averging 40+ with 4/9 50s in such circumstances is truly commendable. Sign of a class. Sign of a best of bests.

 

[heddie19]

Babar's ceiling is a washed up Amla in limited overs.

In Tests I would argue Amla is better than the .

Babar is not even a speck in the pantheon of T20 and ODI greats.

Michael Bevan's one knock alone is better than any ODI knock played by Babar over this century.

That is how average Babar is.

You won't be able to bear the heat, if you start counting Babar's useless knocks.

There is nothing useless when it comes to international level. Messi and Ronaldo don't score useless goals, Djokovic and Nadal don't win useless titles or matches. Similarly there are no international runs as useless runs. I would not even argue with someone who doesn't understand what sports is.

 

[mominsaigol]

The Chairman was leaked his chat, the selector made to resign amidst WC in a country where his players never played at. His bowlers were simply getting smacked right, left and centre. Still Averging 40+ with 4/9 50s in such circumstances is truly commendable. Sign of a class. Sign of a best of bests.

Again not the point, you said he's the greatest ever. The greatest ever never went out of form.

 

[Rana]

The Chairman was leaked his chat, the selector made to resign amidst WC in a country where his players never played at. His bowlers were simply getting smacked right, left and centre. Still Averging 40+ with 4/9 50s in such circumstances is truly commendable. Sign of a class. Sign of a best of bests.

It’s because of Zaka Ashraf Babar was giving catching practice to Netherlands short mid wicket

 

[heddie19]

It’s because of Zaka Ashraf Babar was giving catching practice to Netherlands short mid wicket

I wish he gave some catching practice to Azam Khan too the SM wouldn't have murdered him as they have.

 

[Rana]

I wish he gave some catching practice to Azam Khan too the SM wouldn't have been murdered him as they have.

What are you on about? Who was murdered by who?

 

[heddie19]

What are you on about? Who was murdered by who?

Social Media murdered Azam Khan today for his efforts both with the bat and the gloves. I am explaining it you the way I explain anybody

 

[Rana]

Social Media murdered Azam Khan today for his efforts both with the bat and the gloves. I am explaining it you the way I explain my son. As I said earlier, you really need to sleep bro.

Oh murder on social media

I see….

Babar dies a million deaths every day on that platform. He’s referred to as Zimbabar and is the CEO of the Tuk Tuk academy

Does that mean anything?

 

[mominsaigol]

As a matter of fact, Babar out performed the likes of Kohlis, Smiths, Buttlers, De Kocks in his debut ODI WC.

Again thats not the point. You're claim is he's the greatest of all time and he's some Don Bradman correct? Aka he's always ontop no matter what just like Don Bradman was in literally every game besides his final innings where he got dismissed for a single digit score for the first time in history.

So why did warner and rohit end up scoring more then him in 2 world cups back to back? If hes the greatest of all time he should be no 1 in both period. And if hes the greatest of all time aka even > Bradman then he should never go out of form and have a 17 avg in t20 world cups either?

whats the science behind that?

Again not the point, you said he's the greatest ever. The greatest ever never went out of form.

@heddie19 these ones

 

[heddie19]

@heddie19 these ones

Okay! How many times have you watched Bradman play? At least he scored more runs than Bradman did in World Cups, right?

 

[Rana]

So jao Sir ! Subah uth k wapis dekhne parenge yeh posts apko!

You can’t ask the people who you wanted to pick fights with to now go to sleep now that they have pinned you up against the wall.

You have made some ludicrous claims. Why don’t you ask your new found hero to support you in your claim about Babar being a better white ball batsman than Maxwell and Head to support you.

 

[heddie19]

You can’t ask the people who you wanted to pick fights with to now go to sleep now that they have pinned you up against the wall.

You have made some ludicrous claims. Why don’t you ask your new found hero here to support you in your claim about Babar being a better white ball batsman than Maxwell and Head to support you.

Filhal to Babar's 36 has buried you. I can see why you can't sleep

 

[mominsaigol]

Okay! How many times have you watched Bradman play? At least he scored more runs than Bradman did in World Cups, right?

Again my question is if babar is the greatest of all time he shpuld be no 1 period.

Why is warner and rohit outperforming him 2x in 2 cups back to back? And why is the greatest of all time going out of form?

The greatest odi player of all time Sachin is universally praised for never going out of form? Even virat kohli, kohli has failed here and their with 2012 being the most notable but he's never gone out of form, never has anyone seem him olaybwhere he's mistiming, missing, lacking footwork, looking clueless etc.

Whereas with babar his innings against bamgaldesh in 2022 was hilarious with almost every commentator claiming he's out of form, he couldn't connect anything.

 

[Rana]

Filhal to Babar's 36 has buried you. I can see why you can't sleep

Oh I’ll sleep wonderfully knowing Pakistan lost beautifully with Babar and Rizwan as the openers today.

Thank you Butler for this surreal thrashing of Babar Azam’s XI

 

[Dr_Bassim]

There is nothing useless when it comes to international level. Messi and Ronaldo don't score useless goals, Djokovic and Nadal don't win useless titles or matches. Similarly there are no international runs as useless runs. I would not even argue with someone who doesn't understand what sports is.

Lol.

I understand what mediocrity is in sports as I have played tennis, soccer and ran 5k marathons even before you were born all at provincial and national level. But I won't ask your achievements in sports because I don't do below the belt discourses.

On topic.

You are bringing tennis and football superstars into this discussion and worst of all you are using the false equivalence fallacy because the players you mentioned are ATGs so there performances are remembered or watched no matter what.

I would argue that someone like Goran Ivanisevic is better than Tim Henman because he at least has a Slam.

Babar is a Tim Henman type of player, just not good enough.

You are trying to make him seem like Djokovic and Nadal, which would be people like Kohli and Rohit who will transcend generations and each match of theirs is rememberlol.


How many matches of Henman do you remember ? Or even Ivanisevic who won the Wimbledon?

Again if you are going to bring Messi and Ronaldo into the conversation, you are talking about Sangakkara and Ponting type players, not Babar Azam.

Do you know Miroslav Klose scored the most goals for Germany way back in World Cups ever? He is someone you probably don't know even though he is quite famous in German circles.

Babar would be equivalent of Peter Crouch of England. DO you know how many goals he has scored for England? Probably not. because he wasn't good enough.

When Babar goes above average ring me a bell.

I can't celebrate 30s like you.

 

[heddie19]

Again my question is if babar is the greatest of all time he shpuld be no 1 period.

Why is warner and rohit outperforming him 2x in 2 cups back to back? And why is the greatest of all time going out of form?

The greatest odi player of all time Sachin is universally praised for never going out of form? Even virat kohli, kohli has failed here and their with 2012 being the most notable but he's never gone out of form, never has anyone seem him olaybwhere he's mistiming, missing, lacking footwork, looking clueless etc.

Whereas with babar his innings against bamgaldesh in 2022 was hilarious with almost every commentator claiming he's out of form, he couldn't connect anything.

So Warner and Sharma are GOATs because they outperformed Babar?


Yes I agree Sachin is the GOAT, he also under perfromed in 1999 and failed miserably in 2007, right? Does that change the fact that Sachin is GOAT.

Yes, I also agree his inning against BD in T20 2022 was ugly but his comeback against NZ was world-class and as we say, "Form is temporary but class is permanent" fits perfectly there.

 

[Rana]

So Warner and Sharma are GOATs because they outperformed Babar?

They are GOAT white ball batters regardless

What’s your point? They have World Cup winners medals too. Babar has Hassan Ali’s friendship

 

[heddie19]

Lol.

I understand what mediocrity is in sports as I have played tennis, soccer and ran 5k marathons even before you were born all at provincial and national level. But I won't ask your achievements in sports because I don't do below the belt discourses.

On topic.

You are bringing tennis and football superstars into this discussion and worst of all you are using the false equivalence fallacy because the players you mentioned are ATGs so there performances are remembered or watched no matter what.

I would argue that someone like Goran Ivanisevic is better than Tim Henman because he at least has a Slam.

Babar is a Tim Henman type of player, just not good enough.

You are trying to make him seem like Djokovic and Nadal, which would be people like Kohli and Rohit who will transcend generations and each match of theirs is rememberlol.


How many matches of Henman do you remember ? Or even Ivanisevic who won the Wimbledon?

Again if you are going to bring Messi and Ronaldo into the conversation, you are talking about Sangakkara and Ponting type players, not Babar Azam.

Do you know Miroslav Klose scored the most goals for Germany way back in World Cups ever? He is someone you probably don't know even though he is quite famous in German circles.

Babar would be equivalent of Peter Crouch of England. DO you know how many goals he has scored for England? Probably not. because he wasn't good enough.

When Babar goes above average ring me a bell.

I can't celebrate 30s like you.

Calling Rohit and Virat Djokovic and Nadal while none of them has ever won their country a tournament.

I remember all the goals that Klose scored. I remember some of crouch goals too. You simply can't disrespect Babar or any world-class player like this At least Babar ko Owen ya Kane to bolo

 

[heddie19]

They are GOAT white ball batters regardless

What’s your point? They have World Cup winners medals too. Babar has Hassan Ali’s friendship

Rohit has the World Cup medal? Talking about the WC not WT20.

 

[Rana]

Rohit has the World Cup medal? Talking about the WC not WT20.

He was part of the 2011 wc squad. He won the 2007 T20 World Cup too. He Also won the CT2013 under Dhoni

He’s a decorated legend of the game

 

[Dr_Bassim]

Calling Rohit and Virat Djokovic and Nadal while none of them has ever won their country a tournament.

I remember all the goals that Klose scored. I remember some of crouch goals too. You simply can't disrespect Babar or any world-class player like this At least Babar ko Owen ya Kane to bolo

I only talk cricket here.

You started this by saying I know nothing about sports.

At least have the courtesy to not deflect blame to the other person.

Good night.

 

[heddie19]

He was part of the 2011 wc squad. He won the 2007 T20 World Cup too. He Also won the CT2013 under Dhoni

He’s a decorated legend of the game

Now I am going to SS it and will show you bec it will haunt your cricketing knowledge. No, he was not part of India's 2011 World cup Squad.

And as for Champions Trophy, Babar was an integral part of CT winning squad, having scored 46 in the final and staying not out in SF and and the knockout against SA. That little beast was only 22 years or age at that time. Class apart.

 

[heddie19]

I only talk cricket here.

You started this by saying I know nothing about sports.

At least have the courtesy to not deflect blame to the other person.

Good night.

I am sure you know sports and so do I. Try to respect difference of opinion instead of getting personal. Thanks

 

[Rana]

View attachment 144131


Bro nai dekhi cricket to comment karne se pehle google hi kar lete !

Lol you are right.

I was under the impression he was a part of their squad.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

I am sure you know sports and so do I. Try to respect difference of opinion instead of getting personal. Thanks

I usually stay well clear of this, but if you are going to spout ridiculous opinions like Babar > Head because of his average, you will be called out.

Nevertheless, I will try not to antagonize you in future, as Babar seems to be a sensitive topic for you.

 

[heddie19]

Lol you are right.

I was under the impression he was a part of their squad.

Sir! If you start talking and agreeing like this. I will start loving you too.

Just don't hate someone based on personal biasness, please. Regardless. Iss WC mai boht buri hone wali hai iss team k sath and blame should be on Naqvi for selecting these baffoons.

 

[heddie19]

I usually stay well clear of this, but if you are going to spout ridiculous opinions like Babar > Head because of his average, you will be called out.

Nevertheless, I will try not to antagonize you in future, as Babar seems to be a sensitive topic for you.

Head averages 0.33 in IPL knockouts. But he is better than Babar in your bias world. Sure.

 

[Rana]

Sir! If you start talking and agreeing like this. I will start loving you too.

Just don't hate someone based on personal biasness, please. Regardless. Iss WC mai boht buri hone wali hai iss team k sath and blame should be on Naqvi for selecting these baffoons.

Sharma got injured before the World Cup hence didn’t make it in the squad.

I mixed it up with something else in my mind.