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3rd Test: England v South Africa at Lord's, Aug 16-20, 2012 | Day 3

Saffers feeling the pressure, need to counter attack or they might find themselves at 60/4 again.
 
Come on! My Fat Boi :kallis do your thing! Bat like you did in Cape Town! Do it for Bouchy!
 
perplexing negativity from south africa, pitch is dead and the bowling is solid at best but they have just shut down somebody needs to tell them there are still 7 sessions in the game to go.
 
trogger said:
perplexing negativity from south africa, pitch is dead and the bowling is solid at best but they have just shut down somebody needs to tell them there are still 7 sessions in the game to go.
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What would you do if I held your throat tightly? :)
 
Come on, let's be having a choke.

Prior is endurin a rare crappy test though.
 
Hmmm why was Amla's leg bye allowed? 28.1 he ducked under that means he wasn't attempting a shot. I say that's missed out be the umpires. And Eng. players didn't protest either. hmmm.
 
evasive action, if he hadn't ducked(evasive action) and hadn't played a shot and the ball strikes him then it would be a dead ball.
 
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match over SA will win easily

England had best chance this morning but stupid shot from Prior and nervousness of Jaohny cost them dearly

no way they chase anything above 240
 
musaarthali said:
match over SA will win easily

England had best chance this morning but stupid shot from Prior and nervousness of Jaohny cost them dearly

no way they chase anything above 240
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Two quick wickets here will change your opinion real quick.
 
Marshland said:
Two quick wickets here will change your opinion real quick.
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lol

we have seen enough matches like this which tempt to go down to wire only to fizzle out at end

SA will set England a target above 400

England 215 allout
 
musaarthali said:
lol

we have seen enough matches like this which tempt to go down to wire only to fizzle out at end

SA will set England a target above 400

England 215 allout
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There's not enough time left for such a scenario, considering the snail-like pace at which SA do their business. And England will not go about chasing 400, they'd play for the draw.
 
musaarthali said:
lol

we have seen enough matches like this which tempt to go down to wire only to fizzle out at end

SA will set England a target above 400

England 215 allout
Click to expand...

Haha, this is not day 1 and day 2 pitch. SA will be either all out before 300 or they will declare somewhere around 330. Approx 190 overs are left in this match. SA would like to give themselves 110-115 overs to bowl out England.
 
musaarthali said:
lol

we have seen enough matches like this which tempt to go down to wire only to fizzle out at end

SA will set England a target above 400

England 215 allout
Click to expand...

In the last 2-3 years we have seen a heck of a lot of third innings collapses, been a trend all round the test cricket world.

How anybody can say a team 2 down and 80 ahead is safe with more than two days to go on a flat deck is beyond me.
 
AlizeeFan said:
Haha, this is not day 1 and day 2 pitch. SA will be either all out before 300 or they will declare somewhere around 330. Approx 190 overs are left in this match. SA would like to give themselves 110-115 overs to bowl out England.
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Why on earth would south africa give england a target of 3 rpo in a game they don't need to win?

They may get bowled out but they aren't setting england anything under 5 an over.
 
Marshland said:
There's not enough time left for such a scenario, considering the snail-like pace at which SA do their business. And England will not go about chasing 400, they'd play for the draw.
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if no more wicket fell today..they can play at aRR of over 4.5 for next 2 sessions..

its happened before will happen again
 
trogger said:
Why on earth would south africa give england a target of 3 rpo in a game they don't need to win?

They may get bowled out but they aren't setting england anything under 5 an over.
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first thing SA will do is bat ENgland out of the match..simple
 
trogger said:
Why on earth would south africa give england a target of 3 rpo in a game they don't need to win?

They may get bowled out but they aren't setting england anything under 5 an over.
Click to expand...

This is not Chennai pitch where India chased 387. Chasing anything above 300 would be very difficult here.

Why would SA give a team 400+ target to team which hardly managed 300 runs and run rate of below 3 while playing in best batting conditions in the match while England has to bat in probably worst condition on 5th day?
 
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AlizeeFan said:
This is not Chennai pitch where India chased 387. Chasing anything above 300 would be very difficult here.

Why would SA give a team 400+ target to team which hardly managed 300 runs and run rate of below 3 while playing in best batting conditions in the match while England has to bat in probably worst condition on 5th day?
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first of all why would SA will take any sort of risk when they are so near to No 1 ranking
 
AlizeeFan said:
This is not Chennai pitch where India chased 387. Chasing anything above 300 would be very difficult here.
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It would be tough to chase over 300..yeah of course but i fail to see the link between that theory and the one about setting england 3 an over in a game england need to win and SA don't.

teams routinely set more than they think is likely to be chased down, even if you think you will roll the opposition for 200 that doesn't mean you only set them 220.
 
trogger said:
It would be tough to chase over 300..yeah of course but i fail to see the link between that theory and the one about setting england 3 an over in a game england need to win and SA don't.

teams routinely set more than they think is likely to be chased down, even if you think you will roll the opposition for 200 that doesn't mean you only set them 220.
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Run rate would hardly be a big factor imo. Surviving 110 overs would be way too difficult than scoring at 3. Scoring 250-260 has been very difficult in this match. 330 would be very safe here.
 
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AlizeeFan said:
Run rate would hardly be a big factor imo. Surviving 110 overs would be way too difficult than scoring at 3. Scoring 250-260 has been very difficult in this match. 330 would be very safe here.
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3 an over is fairly standard in tests in the last decade, your theory wouldn't have sounded out of place in the 1980's but it's clearly flawed for the modern game.

Why would england be trying to bat out 100+ overs for survival anyway when they are 1-0 down?
 
musaarthali said:
they are already made 130

they can easily make 270 runs in next 2 sessions...
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Scoring 270 in 60 overs is easy here? Your expectations are very high. Overall run rate has been 2.98 in this match and now when pitch is getting more difficult for batting you're expecting scoring at 4.5 to be easy in this match? Wow!
 
trogger said:
3 an over is fairly standard in tests in the last decade, your theory wouldn't have sounded out of place in the 1980's but it's clearly flawed for the modern game.

Why would england be trying to bat out 100+ overs for survival anyway when they are 1-0 down?
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I didn't mean to say that England would try to survive here. My point was that surviving enough overs to score those many runs would be very difficult on last day irrespective of the run rate.
 
AlizeeFan said:
Scoring 270 in 60 overs is easy here? Your expectations are very high. Overall run rate has been 2.98 in this match and now when pitch is getting more difficult for batting you're expecting scoring at 4.5 to be easy in this match? Wow!
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common man..we have seen enough such matches

all they have to do is score 100/110 runs in first session by losing one wicket..then AB can come and smash at over 5rpo

this happened before it will happen again..

just waitt n watch
 
musaarthali said:
common man..we have seen enough such matches

all they have to do is score 100/110 runs in first session by losing one wicket..then AB can come and smash at over 5rpo

this happened before it will happen again..

just waitt n watch
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On batting friendly tracks.

My guess is that SA is going to be all out (end their inning) before or around 330 after tea if they bat well. A collapse will always be on the cards, although SA middle order and tail doesn't seem to throw away.
 
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musaarthali said:
if pitch is that worse England wont even chase 200
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Highest chases at Lords

<table border = 1>
<tr><th>Match</th><th>Runs </th><th>Start Date</th></tr> <tr><td>West Indies (innings 4) v England at Lord's, 1984</td><td>323</td><td>6/28/1984</td></tr> <tr><td>England (innings 4) v New Zealand at Lord's, 2004</td><td>245</td><td>5/20/2004</td></tr> <tr><td>England (innings 4) v New Zealand at Lord's, 1965</td><td>195</td><td>6/17/1965</td></tr> <tr><td>England (innings 4) v West Indies at Lord's, 2012</td><td>175</td><td>5/17/2012</td></tr> <tr><td>England (innings 4) v West Indies at Lord's, 2000</td><td>167</td><td>6/29/2000</td></tr> <tr><td>England (innings 4) v Bangladesh at Lord's, 2010</td><td>151</td><td>5/27/2010</td></tr> <tr><td>England (innings 4) v Australia at Lord's, 1890</td><td>137</td><td>7/21/1890</td></tr> <tr><td>Pakistan (innings 4) v England at Lord's, 1992</td><td>132</td><td>6/18/1992</td></tr> <tr><td>Australia (innings 4) v England at Lord's, 1921</td><td>125</td><td>6/11/1921</td></tr> <tr><td>India (innings 4) v England at Lord's, 1986</td><td>120</td><td>6/5/1986</td></tr></table>
 
Game is on a knife edge. If england can get Amla early they have a chance to restrict S.A, If Amla gets a 100, the S.A could be looking at a total of 300 which will be a tough ask for england to chase.
 
I think we can just about get something like 250, but anything above that would take a monumental once-in-a-blue-moon effort.
 
If England are to win this, they need as many as 3 quick ones to fall early tomorrow.
 
Somebody needs to get a ton basically. Apart from KP who of course isn't playing, our much-vaunted batting lineup has been pretty flaccid in this series. Time for it to deliver, or else we are going to lose 0-2 and only have the right to be called an overrated number two side from that point forward.
 
Marshland said:
If England are to win this, they need as many as 3 quick ones to fall early tomorrow.
Click to expand...

I think if England get Amla early the rest will follow swiftly and get SA probably all-out under the manageable 250.

Anyhows, the best bit, this match is definitely heading towards a result unless the pitch turns into a batting paradise (unlikely) and SA elect to shut England out of the game to secure the series.
 
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James said:
Somebody needs to get a ton basically. Apart from KP who of course isn't playing, our much-vaunted batting lineup has been pretty flaccid in this series. Time for it to deliver, or else we are going to lose 0-2 and only have the right to be called an overrated number two side from that point forward.
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Yep, Cook and Trott have especially been disappointing. Bell has got a couple of starts but has failed to carry on - but none in the second test, where he played some horrendous shots to get out. The best bat has arguably been KP, now ejected out of this test. I must say I liked Bairstow though - but he inevitably lost composure as he neared the landmark. Strauss hasn't fired either, but that's nothing new.

The English batting line-up can chase a 200-225 total down. Anything beyond that, they have virtually no chance.
 
I can see this being a 260-70 chase and we are in for a humdinger of a finish!
 
Bairstow came back very well considering his working over by Roach. The young batsman took the criticism on board, went away, improved, and top-scored against South Africa. A fine effort.

England made 250 at Galle, different kind of bowling I know, but it is famously impossible to bat on that pitch in the 4th innings (highest successful run chase = 96). To even get close to the 320 target there took skill and mental strength, and Trott played a blinder in the circumstances, so there's hope yet perhaps. And Prior, Broad, Swann are all capable of a decisive fifty at the death.

But Steyn and Morkel have looked red-hot this summer and you would back them to knock over our out-of-form lineup one more time.
 
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Been meaning to ask you James, is there any pressure on Andrew Strauss's spot from the county circuit? Any new openers coming through?
 
In most areas we have emerging talent, but not sure about openers. Best to ask a guy like Taurus, Malakian (heh) or Big Harvey. They follow the county game very closely. I've always just been an England fan first and foremost.
 
James said:
In most areas we have emerging talent, but not sure about openers. Best to ask a guy like Taurus, Malakian (heh) or Big Harvey. They follow the county game very closely. I've always just been an England fan first and foremost.
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So I suppose Trott would be pushed up the order and they'd bring the next middle-order guy in - where they seem to be better stocked. How about Carberry, the guy they played in Bangladesh a couple of seasons ago?

In any case, Strauss cannot go on like this. He needs a score or his career ends this year.
 
Strauss has three tons in tests in India, he's worth keeping around for that.

Trott could open fine next year, then there's a way to get Pietersen and Bairstow both in there. Unless they want to look at somebody else for the top order altogether, which would be perfectly understandable.

RE Strauss, not sure if they would change captain with two Ashes series next year though. We all know what England are like.
 
James said:
RE Strauss, not sure if they would change captain with two Ashes series next year though. We all know what England are like.
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Er....Vaughan and Nasser exited after similar series against the Proteas?

I know Strauss still has some credit thanks to the Ashes win a couple of years back - but he's been a fading force with the bat for the best part of three seasons now.

The India tour will be do or die for him. I can very well envision Cook facing up to Pup come 2013 if it has to come to that, no problems there.
 
James said:
Strauss has three tons in tests in India, he's worth keeping around for that.

Trott could open fine next year, then there's a way to get Pietersen and Bairstow both in there. Unless they want to look at somebody else for the top order altogether, which would be perfectly understandable.

RE Strauss, not sure if they would change captain with two Ashes series next year though. We all know what England are like.
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I'd open with Bell when Strauss retires. He opens in domestic, and he's not doing bad in ODIs opening. Think it's more the pressure of wickets are falling he panics., coming in at three down for 50-100 runs on the board. Openers start at 0-0 :)). Plus Bell likes to play himself in, and if anything his pretty fifties or so will be of more use up the order giving England a start and wearing down the bowlers than lower down where really need to build on the work of the openers.


Trott's an absolute gun at no.3. Ever since he's been put at no.3 England's success has rocketed, the whole batting team has had a positive effect too. I'd never move him from there.

I'd have something like
1. Cook
2. Bell
3. Trott
4. Taylor
5. Pietersen
6. Bairstow
7. Prior

Maybe Bopara or Morgan could come in for one of the youngsters if they do well. I think might be better for a youngster to play at four between the two guys Trott and Pietersen. The way Pietersen bats, don't think it'll make much difference at four or five, he'll still do well.
 
Amla to make a 100 and quick fire innings from AB will sink England today..same way U19 QF gone
 
Marshland said:
Been meaning to ask you James, is there any pressure on Andrew Strauss's spot from the county circuit? Any new openers coming through?
Click to expand...

James said:
In most areas we have emerging talent, but not sure about openers. Best to ask a guy like Taurus, Malakian (heh) or Big Harvey. They follow the county game very closely. I've always just been an England fan first and foremost.
Click to expand...

Yes there is. Michael Carberry who's been in the mix for some time. Has already played a test for England. Very good batsman.

There's James Vince whom I rate highly but he's more of a one day and LO batsman.

The one guy who I rate the most is Joe Root. I have written a thread on Joe already. Here is the thread link:

http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/showthread.php?p=4985270
 
From this position, with their batting to come and the bowlers they have, the only way the South Africans can lose is by choking
 
"With VVS retiring out, there's no doubt the best wristy player in international cricket is Amla," says Aadil

Cricinfo
 
lol England struggling to remove Steyn..imagine what will happen when AB comes to crease..

long day ahead
 
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