Can Dale Steyn ever match the greatness of Wasim Akram?

[cricketfanfirst]

Wasim Akram is generally rated by many people, because of the sheer variety at his disposal but as few posters above have noted, Wasim did not do justice to his immense talent. His performances are no doubt are superb but they are not as outstanding as some others. Dale Steyn has been the best fast bowler in the world by a distance from the last 3 to 4 years and he will probably eclipse Wasim when he hangs his boots.

 

[AlizeeFan]

What great moments of Steyn do we remember?

His 7 wicket haul in India? Where his victims were Vijay, Badrinath, the tail enders? Only prized scalp was of Sachin's and boy did Sehwag still belt him that innings.

His 5 wicket haul in the WC vs India? when he was smashed all over the park and and picked up 5 wickets at the end while still having an expensive economy rate? and his only major scalp was that of Gambhir? Where was Steyn when Sachin and Sehwag were going all guns blazing at the start?

You should read other replies in the thread. Wasim bowled well against many greats of 90s, but among great bowlers he was least fluent in picking pick top-order wickets, forget wickets of great batsmen.

Waqar and Imran were main bowlers to dismiss top-order batsmen during those days and Wasim used to clean up tail mostly after other bowlers had done their job.

But you can always claim how tail-enders of 90s were better than tailenders these days on flat tracks.

 

[Jo_Don]

Hahaha mate trust me I meant AKRAM and NOT AKHTAR.
It was a massive typo. Just noticed. Maybe you won't believe now but seriously and if you have seen my posts in the Akhtar vs Waqar thread you'll notice that I don't rate Akhtar at all.
I agree with you that it is disrespectful to compare Steyn to Akhtar.

Hehe no harm no foul buddy, it could happen to anyone

 

[Mamoon]

Btw, if you read my whole post, it is obvious that it was a typo. Why would I bring Shoaib for one line and then revert back to Akram? But it was a clever of you to pick on this single line only and ignore the rest of the post because quite frankly I made it quite clear why Steyn isn't in Wasim's league.

 

[Jo_Don]

Btw, if you read my whole post, it is obvious that it was a typo. Why would I bring Shoaib for one line and then revert back to Akram? But it was a clever of you to pick on this single line only and ignore the rest of the post because quite frankly I made it quite clear why Steyn isn't in Wasim's league.

Because most of your points have already been addressed in this thread

I've said from the start that firstly it is difficult to compare across eras, and secondly it is difficult to compare someone who is still playing.

However one telling factor against Akram is that he was never rated the best bowler in the world at any point of his career. And his highest points ranking suggests that he was nowhere near as consistent as any of the top tier bowlers.

 

[Mamoon]

Because most of your points have already been addressed in this thread

I've said from the start that firstly it is difficult to compare across eras, and secondly it is difficult to compare someone who is still playing.

However one telling factor against Akram is that he was never rated the best bowler in the world at any point of his career. And his highest points ranking suggests that he was nowhere near as consistent as any of the top tier bowlers.

Steyn would have ranked lower than Akram in that era and Akram would have been number 1 today.

 

[Jo_Don]

[/B]

Steyn would have ranked lower than Akram in that era and Akram would have been number 1 today.

How do you know? This era is more batsman-centric than the previous one. Steyn may well have achieved even greater things then, as that was a bowler's era, and Wasim could have been even worse today. As I said, it's difficult to compare across eras.

 

[AlizeeFan]

[/B]

Steyn would have ranked lower than Akram in that era and Akram would have been number 1 today.

If Steyn can average 23 in decade best of batting in history of cricket, then he would have averaged below 20 with SR of 35.

Since tail-enders are better batsmen these days, I guess Akram would have struggled bit more in this era?

 

[Zarrar]

C&B series 1996-97 Akram was no.1

Was that a test series???

A lot of kids and Indians, conflate Wasim bhai's ODI exploits with his performances, ability and record in tests...the latter is usually the proper guage of a bowlers position in the all-time totum pole...

As a test bowler Wasim was probably an all-time great, but he was certainly not the all time top 5 bowler, leave alone the best bowler of all time that kids and Indians make him out to be...

He went missing on many occassions in tests and left a lot to be desired...perhaps in his defence didn't do justice to his talent/ability...

 

[Zarrar]

If Steyn can average 23 in decade best of batting in history of cricket, then he would have averaged below 20 with SR of 35.

Since tail-enders are better batsmen these days, I guess Akram would have struggled bit more in this era?

Yes a proper moniker for Wasim bhai ought to be "The All time greatest tail-end destroying bowler"

 

[lilFlip]

I guess some people's logic makes Lara and Alec Stewart tailenders!! hahahaha

 

[Eye_Done]

Akram wipes the floor with Steyn.

 

[gengiskhan]

I would put steyn ahead anyday of the week he as he averages in low 20s in the era of flat pitches and big bats. Very few can swing the ball so prodigious at such quick pace.

Right now Steyn is on pace of out gunning Akram. But Akram is still ahead with 100+ tests & 400+ wickets.

It will be very important what Dale Steyn can do btw the age 28-32. his current age.

we all have to remember, Akram was just a good "containment" bowler at the ages of 28-32. rather than "strike" bowler. waqar & shoaib were.

273 wkts from just 57 tests at strike rate of 41.5 is just SICK !!

If Akram had the lefty advantage, steyn has advantage of playing on non-dead non-dustball wickets of SA so it even out!

I have always said Talent is extremely overrated. Performance is the only thing that counts & elevates your greatness.

We'll have to see where Steyn ends up on his 100th test.

 

[GentleMan]

Steyn is like a serial killer, Akram is like the charming seducer..
Steyn treats the ball like a weapon, Akram treats the ball like a woman..
Steyn has the mind of a primal warrior, Akram has the mind of a chess player..
Steyn kills brutally and spits at the corpse, Akram kills and writes a poem at the corpse to tease the detectives..

 

[AlizeeFan]

If Akram had the lefty advantage, steyn has advantage of playing on non-dead non-dustball wickets of SA so it even out!

I have always said Talent is extremely overrated. Performance is the only thing that counts & elevates your greatness.

We'll have to see where Steyn ends up on his 100th test.

Non-Pakistani pacers enjoyed success on so called Pakistani dead dustballs, so that doesn't even out.

Why wait till 100th test if Steyn gets 400 wickets before that only?

 

[AlizeeFan]

Yes a proper moniker for Wasim bhai ought to be "The All time greatest tail-end destroying bowler"

Yes, that was certainly his best quality in terms of results. I remember one match in which India were going good, somewhere around 200 for 5 or 6 on a 230+ pitch and Wasim cleaned up tail to prevent Indian team to take a lead. He took 4 wickets.

 

[bmwduran]

Your entire post is rendered null and void by that one line )

Steyn has played more matches, has more wickets, averages better, has one of the top strike rates of all time, has more 5'fers and more 10'fers, and didn't make the news for getting genital warts.

But of course he's not Pakistani so that makes him worse by default

Steyn has to strike big in big matches, averages and wickets are for stats, he has to take wickets in WC finals to turn the match on its head. Something Akram showed and on that account Akram is a first choice in my eleven, steyn breaks when going gets tough,

 

[Jo_Don]

Steyn has to strike big in big matches, averages and wickets are for stats, he has to take wickets in WC finals to turn the match on its head. Something Akram showed and on that account Akram is a first choice in my eleven, steyn breaks when going gets tough,

People who advocate LOIs over test matches are simpletons with a limited attention span.

 

[LethalSami]

Steyn chokes on big stage

that's a big stain on his career

 

[bmwduran]

People who advocate LOIs over test matches are simpletons with a limited attention span.

Even in tests, steyn has to be born again to bowl the magical spells Akram has delivered,

 

[AlizeeFan]

Even in tests, steyn has to be born again to bowl the magical spells Akram has delivered,

I guess saffers will take wickets over magical spells.

 

[Executioner]

ive no doubt that steyn will be rated higher than wasim akram in a matter of few years. Steyn still has around 10 yrs of cricket left in him. The way he is going he cant get any worse isnt he?

So yes, steyn > akram

 

[Bewal Express]

Test Bowlers in the 90`s. Not based on stats but personal observations having watched all of them.
Mcgrath>Ambrose>Donald>Waqar>Pollack=Akram=Walsh.

PS
Each one on their day was brilliant but mine is an overall view of the 90`s.

 

[AlizeeFan]

ive no doubt that steyn will be rated higher than wasim akram in a matter of few years. Steyn still has around 10 yrs of cricket left in him. The way he is going he cant get any worse isnt he?

So yes, steyn > akram

10 years, lol, he is a fast bowler and not a batsman.

 

[lilFlip]

Steyn is like a serial killer, Akram is like the charming seducer..
Steyn treats the ball like a weapon, Akram treats the ball like a woman..
Steyn has the mind of a primal warrior, Akram has the mind of a chess player..
Steyn kills brutally and spits at the corpse, Akram kills and writes a poem at the corpse to tease the detectives..

Killed it there man! :dexter

 

[Jo_Don]

Even in tests, steyn has to be born again to bowl the magical spells Akram has delivered,

I'll take the wickets thanks. Magical spells don't win you test matches, 20 wickets does.

And in terms of these magical spells, have you forgotten Nagpur? Or Cape Town against Tendulkar? It's not like Steyn lacks skill either, I can't remember seeing a bowler pitch leg and hit off at 140km/h+.

 

[Mamoon]

Steyn has to win a World Cup and deliver a match winning performance in the final to be compared with Akram.

Test cricket is the pinnacle but nothing is bigger than the World Cup.

 

[supersix]

I'll take the wickets thanks. Magical spells don't win you test matches, 20 wickets does.

And in terms of these magical spells, have you forgotten Nagpur? Or Cape Town against Tendulkar? It's not like Steyn lacks skill either, I can't remember seeing a bowler pitch leg and hit off at 140km/h+.

Your talking as if Wasim did not take any wicket.

 

[Kwremb]

Steyn has to win a World Cup and deliver a match winning performance in the final to be compared with Akram.

Test cricket is the pinnacle but nothing is bigger than the World Cup.

What if Steyn never plays a WC final? Malcolm Marshall also doesn't have a WC win and never played in a WC final. According to your logic Akram is a better bowler than Marshall as well.

 

[Jo_Don]

Steyn has to win a World Cup and deliver a match winning performance in the final to be compared with Akram.

Test cricket is the pinnacle but nothing is bigger than the World Cup.

No. By your reasoning, Arivinda de Silva is better than Tendulkar, Lara or Kallis because he performed in a world cup final. Cricket is a team game, players don't make it to the final on their own.

Test cricket was and always will be the gold standard. Some of the justifications to back Akram here are ridiculous.

 

[speed]

donald>waqar>wasim>pollock>steyn

 

[Mamoon]

Waqar > Wasim > Steyn > Donald > Pollock

 

[Mamoon]

No. By your reasoning, Arivinda de Silva is better than Tendulkar, Lara or Kallis because he performed in a world cup final. Cricket is a team game, players don't make it to the final on their own.

Test cricket was and always will be the gold standard. Some of the justifications to back Akram here are ridiculous.

Wrong.

There is daylight between the Aravinda and the other players you mentioned.

But Wasim vs Steyn is closer and when you compare two players who are close to each other in terms of ability, World Cup definitely comes into consideration.

 

[nish_mate]

Wrong.

There is daylight between the Aravinda and the other players you mentioned.

But Wasim vs Steyn is closer and when you compare two players who are close to each other in terms of ability, World Cup definitely comes into consideration.

Then surely Dhoni and then daylight and then?

 

[Jo_Don]

Wrong.

There is daylight between the Aravinda and the other players you mentioned.

But Wasim vs Steyn is closer and when you compare two players who are close to each other in terms of ability, World Cup definitely comes into consideration.

Cool, so it's ok to apply a different set of criteria to suit your argument.

And is Steyn meant to reach a WC final on his own?

 

[Bewal Express]

There is no doubt Akram bowled well in the final but through the WC in 92 he had struggled,Mushtaq and Aaqib had consistently bowled better. Most of the guys that actually watched this period in the 90`s know who the top bowlers were, who the good ones were and who the decent ones were. Akram was amongst the top but more towards the bottom end of the top bowlers.

 

[siddharth]

I ahve watched all the bowlers through 90s.I would rate Ambrose and Akram as the top bowlers of 90s.As for donald,Waqar and walsh,their pathetic status against Aus especially in Aus says it all.An average of 50 or 40..or even crappier..Ambrose was the best with akram as second.You ahve to make results against the top teams at their place.especially they were the best players of pace..

Wasim was unplayable..and the result was whenever he didn't play the rest of the bolwers choked,like in WC 96 QF...last two overs a crtain top bolwer gon for 46 runs,since there was no clutch bowler from the other end...

 

[Jo_Don]

I ahve watched all the bowlers through 90s.I would rate Ambrose and Akram as the top bowlers of 90s.As for donald,Waqar and walsh,their pathetic status against Aus especially in Aus says it all.An average of 50 or 40..or even crappier..Ambrose was the best with akram as second.You ahve to make results against the top teams at their place.especially they were the best players of pace..

Wasim was unplayable..and the result was whenever he didn't play the rest of the bolwers choked,like in WC 96 QF...last two overs a crtain top bolwer gon for 46 runs,since there was no clutch bowler from the other end...

Donald averaged better against Aus (and in Aus), than Akram did against SA (and in SA). And SA were certainly the second best team of his time. I.e., it doesn't mean much.

 

[bmwduran]

I ahve watched all the bowlers through 90s.I would rate Ambrose and Akram as the top bowlers of 90s.As for donald,Waqar and walsh,their pathetic status against Aus especially in Aus says it all.An average of 50 or 40..or even crappier..Ambrose was the best with akram as second.You ahve to make results against the top teams at their place.especially they were the best players of pace..

Wasim was unplayable..and the result was whenever he didn't play the rest of the bolwers choked,like in WC 96 QF...last two overs a crtain top bolwer gon for 46 runs,since there was no clutch bowler from the other end...

Are u talking tests Odis or what? I believe u started with test averages and example given was of an odi? Waqar by the time of that WC was over his peak, but, the first 4 years of Wakar in tests or Odis are the deadliest ever, he was the brad man of bowlers in those 4 years, with pace and banana swings,

 

[Austin 3:16]

Akram..and too by long margin

 

[siddharth]

Are u talking tests Odis or what? I believe u started with test averages and example given was of an odi? Waqar by the time of that WC was over his peak, but, the first 4 years of Wakar in tests or Odis are the deadliest ever, he was the brad man of bowlers in those 4 years, with pace and banana swings,

Waqar's banana swings are awesome,but his ''test avrage'' in Aus is 40.50...

 

[James]

Akram wipes the floor with Steyn.

Er, no.

 

[SL_Fan]

Steyn is arguably the best of his generation but Akram is way ahead in my book. Steyn and Waqar would be a close battle though.

 

[lilFlip]

http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/video_audio/636938.html

Wasim Akram When I first saw him was in the 1992 World Cup... I think that between him and myself, [we] probably ended up bowling the most number of wides in the whole competition but what struck me most about Wasim was his presence. And he was pretty, pretty swift at that stage... I think his greatest attribute was the way he swung the ball and how late he swung the ball. But having played against Wasim before that... and some of the Australian guys I [had] spoken to... especially Ian Healy said he was incredibly... he had a immense presence but he also had an immense presence in... in... in the area as I would call in the hot zone. And when I played against Wasim and I faced him for the first time in Pakistan, I found out how relentless he is...

And he bowled me a bouncer that hit me square on the side of my head which was... well, which was painful to say the least but the way he handled that, the way he came back in his second innings... And he bowled a spell that I'd probably never forget - in Manchester where he bowled really, really quick at me playing for Lancashire. And I think he nicked me off and the ball carried miles to the 'keeper. I just... everything about Wasim Akram was relentless... he swung the ball both ways. I think his greatest asset was... for me made him the ultimate bowler that he was... was being able to swing the ball when it was reversing both ways. He was the bowler for me that you could not tell which way it was swinging, you could not know what he was up to because he did it over the wicket and around the wicket and that to any batsman in the world was the most intimidating factor. And growing up in Pakistan on those really tough wickets, flat wickets, reversing the ball was their greatest skill and I think that that's for me why Wasim Akram was, I would say, the most complete quick bowler that I've ever come across and ever watched.

Gary Kirsten would be one of those who can testify for that because not only did he use the crease so smartly when he was coming over the wicket with the new ball, he found him very tough to line up because he swung the ball so late. I think that his stock delivery - swinging the ball out to the lefties - was a tough line to cover because he swung it from about middle and off stump and he'd use his in-swinger with the new ball very, very smartly because you just never knew when that was coming... and he'd drag you across the crease for some time. But also if anyone had probably one of the best bouncers in the game, it was him. There is no question about it... and that's why he would be my No. 1 most complete fast bowler that I've ever played against and watched.

Take that Jo_Don and stfu.

 

[Buffet]

From another thread,

In test Matches is over rated because of been a left armer.

I think there are at least 10 other better Test bowlers than him.

I have watched few bowler who were better than Wasim but 10 bowlers? Anyone care of to throw at least 10 names who were better than Akaram. Not pleasing to eyes etc , Just better bowler.

 

[Executioner]

So Donald's opinion really matters? Yes, wasim was a complete fast bowler because he could bowl any kind of delivery.

Steyn is a machine, who would bowl bowls at a good length every time, charging in.

 

[Bewal Express]

Donald, Ambrose and Mcgrath were all def better test bowlers. Pollack ,Waqar and Walsh were on par with him. As i said many times on these pages, Akram was a very good bowler but over a long career he was never at anytime in his career the best bowler in the world;at best he was second or third. His peak came in the late 80`s in Australia and he had some highs after that but generally he was consistently a very good bowler.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

From another thread,



I have watched few bowler who were better than Wasim but 10 bowlers? Anyone care of to throw at least 10 names who were better than Akaram. Not pleasing to eyes etc , Just better bowler.

Hmm I can name some.

1. McGrath
2. Ambrose
3. Marshall
4. Waqar (yes I still think he was kinda better)
5. Pollock

And I'll be biased and even put Imran Khan on the list

But at least 5-6 ...

 

[Buffet]

Donald, Ambrose and Mcgrath were all def better test bowlers. Pollack ,Waqar and Walsh were on par with him. As i said many times on these pages, Akram was a very good bowler but over a long career he was never at anytime in his career the best bowler in the world;at best he was second or third. His peak came in the late 80`s in Australia and he had some highs after that but generally he was consistently a very good bowler.

I have watched at least 3 bowlers who were surely better in my opinion. Marshall, Ambrose & McGrath. If you want to count Donald then that will make it 4 but I think anyone will be hard pressed to come up with 10 better bowlers.

 

[Bewal Express]

So Donald's opinion really matters? Yes, wasim was a complete fast bowler because he could bowl any kind of delivery.

Steyn is a machine, who would bowl bowls at a good length every time, charging in.

I doesn`t really matter how many variations he had- there are no points for style in cricket. Its all about results and his wickets were taken a good rate but you wouldn`t describe them earth shattering like Marshalls or Steyns(btw i still rate Donald better than him). Over a long career you would expect a great bowler to run the top order on a regular basis but he didn`t. He ran through the tail on a regular basis but getting Tufnell is not the same as getting Tendulkar(a batsman he never dismissed in a test match).

 

[Dr_Bassim]

I doesn`t really matter how many variations he had- there are no points for style in cricket. Its all about results and his wickets were taken a good rate but you wouldn`t describe them earth shattering like Marshalls or Steyns(btw i still rate Donald better than him). Over a long career you would expect a great bowler to run the top order on a regular basis but he didn`t. He ran through the tail on a regular basis but getting Tufnell is not the same as getting Tendulkar(a batsman he never dismissed in a test match).

Still I doubt anyone could come up with 10 bowlers better than Wasim.

Just no way.

He belongs at the top. Guy took 414 wickets for a reason.

And definitely longevity was not a part of it.

 

[Buffet]

Hmm I can name some.

1. McGrath
2. Ambrose
3. Marshall
4. Waqar (yes I still think he was kinda better)
5. Pollock

And I'll be biased and even put Imran Khan on the list

But at least 5-6 ...

I think Waqar and Pollock were not better than Wasim. I haven't watched IK enough to decide if he was better than Wasim.

 

[lilFlip]

Hmm I can name some.

1. McGrath
2. Ambrose
3. Marshall
4. Waqar (yes I still think he was kinda better)
5. Pollock

And I'll be biased and even put Imran Khan on the list

But at least 5-6 ...

Just like that huh??

each to his opinion...

 

[Dr_Bassim]

Just like that huh??

each to his opinion...

Well to be very honest.... even Pollock can take the fall and Waqar...

Imran was a bias really.

But definitely there is no question about Marshall Ambrose or Mcgrath.

I've seen Ambrose and Mcgrath and they were awesome.

Wasim was the complete package, but he did slightly underperform in test arena.

So realistically just 3 : )

 

[Bewal Express]

Are you asking for 10 bowlers during his era or just 10 bowlers period. If you are asking 10 bowlers period then;
Marshall
Mcgrath
Ambrose
Donald
lmran
Steyn
Holding
Hadlee
Joel Garner
Fred Trueman(the only one on the list i haven`t seen bowl live)

 

[Buffet]

Are you asking for 10 bowlers during his era or just 10 bowlers period. If you are asking 10 bowlers period then;
Marshall
Mcgrath
Ambrose
Donald
lmran
Steyn
Holding
Hadlee
Joel Garner
Fred Trueman(the only one on the list i haven`t seen bowl live)

I was mainly asking for bowlers who bowled during Wasim's time. But whole list is also fine, I can get the answer of first category from your list.

 

[Executioner]

Imran was a masterclass bowler, but I think wasim was slightly ahead of him if you consideral overall performance. That is, however considering both tests and ODIs.

If you consider tests only, then Imran wins hands down. Wasim wasnt as lethal in tests, because he relied more heavily on variations. Variations are more effective when batsman are on the lookout for runs. The same way Narine is effective in T20s.

 

[Osman]

Hmm I can name some.

1. McGrath
2. Ambrose
3. Marshall
4. Waqar (yes I still think he was kinda better)
5. Pollock

And I'll be biased and even put Imran Khan on the list

But at least 5-6 ...

 

[Dr_Bassim]

Well Pollock was actually a good test bowler... But yea .. my bad...

Was eager to touch 5 mark : (

As I said, I hold Wasim in high regard.

He is undoubtedly one of the greats of the game : )

 

[Bewal Express]

Imran was a masterclass bowler, but I think wasim was slightly ahead of him if you consideral overall performance. That is, however considering both tests and ODIs.

If you consider tests only, then Imran wins hands down. Wasim wasnt as lethal in tests, because he relied more heavily on variations. Variations are more effective when batsman are on the lookout for runs. The same way Narine is effective in T20s.

Only a person that never the saw the 2 live would even consider Akram better then IK. He went to the Windies in 1988, and took Pakistan to the brink of a series victory with 23 wickets and he was past his best. IK also lost nearly 3 years of his career when he was at his peak. Akram was and will remain a good bowler who despite his good stats underachieved. He was far too reliant on the tail for his wickets but test matches are won when the top orders are destroyed.

 

[Bewal Express]

When one of these debates was took place on a previous occasion i can remember somone did some statistical analysis and backed up my anacdotal observations about Akrams comparative failure to take top order wickets(top 6). I would hazard a guess that, on an all time list he would be between 15 to 20th.

 

[IndianWillow]

When one of these debates was took place on a previous occasion i can remember somone did some statistical analysis and backed up my anacdotal observations about Akrams comparative failure to take top order wickets(top 6). I would hazard a guess that, on an all time list he would be between 15 to 20th.

If comparison between bowlers be based on the art of troubling the batsmen, Akram would be right there in top 10 or perhaps even top 5. If comparison be based on results, i.e, wicket taking then for me Akram would fit in only within the top 15-20. Even amongst Pakistanis, the chances that Waqar or Imran would take you out before Wasim are higher.

 

[Varun]

Steyn's a better bowler. Averaging 23 in this era of batsmen friendly pitches is no joke. Akram had it easy in comparison over 15 years ago.

 

[Sakss]

what a shocker of comparison.....comparing someone who is an all time great with a bowler who hasnt even completed his career yet...


Wasim is miles ahead of many bowlers thats why he wasily walks in to most all time XIs where as steyn wont , although steyn is a brilliant bowler too.

 

[ahmed778]

Steyn's a better bowler. Averaging 23 in this era of batsmen friendly pitches is no joke. Akram had it easy in comparison over 15 years ago.

What a pathetic post, Only in your fantasy world have they started making Batting friendly pitches in SA and Bowling friendly wickets in Pakistan.

 

[Varun]

What a pathetic post, Only in your fantasy world have they started making Batting friendly pitches in SA and Bowling friendly wickets in Pakistan.

Dig up the average scores in South Africa in the 1990s, and the 2000s, and report back to this thread.

I'm talking about tests, obviously. Just look up the first and second innings - as those give the best barometer.

Do likewise for Pakistan. It'll be impossible for any pitch of the 1990s to beat those highways laid out during Pakistan's last series - the home ones for Lanka, and that's just off the top of my head. And Steyn and South Africa won on those in 2007 across a 3-test series. Wasim couldn't accomplish the reverse on the alleged bowling friendly pitches in South Africa.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Re: Steyn vs Akram

Wasim Akram remains one of the best bowlers ever.People tall about each bowler having a stock delivery.Outswingers for Steyn Kapil Dev Lillee etc.Inswinger for Imran Khan Malcolm Marshal and co.

Wasim Akram didnt have a stock ball because he could bowl every delivery equally good.He could swing and seam it both ways.He could bowl both the off cutter and leg cutter slower delivery.He had a wicked bouncer and an unplayable yorker.And he could do it all at pace.I wont even go into his credentials of reverse swing.

There is nothing in the fast bowlers manual or nothing a fast bowler could do and Wasim Akram could not.

Except Marshal i cannot think of another bowler who i would put above Akram.

 

[ahmed778]

Dig up the average scores in South Africa in the 1990s, and the 2000s, and report back to this thread.

I'm talking about tests, obviously. Just look up the first and second innings - as those give the best barometer.

Do likewise for Pakistan. It'll be impossible for any pitch of the 1990s to beat those highways laid out during Pakistan's last series - the home ones for Lanka, and that's just off the top of my head. And Steyn and South Africa won on those in 2007 across a 3-test series. Wasim couldn't accomplish the reverse on the alleged bowling friendly pitches in South Africa.

Steyn is not playing in th 1990s, e is playing in the 2000s, the pitches in SA are bouncy and green perfect conditions for Fast Bowlers.
Conditions in Pakistan have never been good for Fast bowlers, and i have seen enough cricket to be convinced of this.

 

[Bilbo]

I would put steyn ahead anyday of the week he as he averages in low 20s in the era of flat pitches and big bats. Very few can swing the ball so prodigious at such quick pace.

there can never be another Akram, Steyns many, enuf said, end of thread!

 

[Bilbo]

Wasim Akram remains one of the best bowlers ever.People tall about each bowler having a stock delivery.Outswingers for Steyn Kapil Dev Lillee etc.Inswinger for Imran Khan Malcolm Marshal and co.

Wasim Akram didnt have a stock ball because he could bowl every delivery equally good.He could swing and seam it both ways.He could bowl both the off cutter and leg cutter slower delivery.He had a wicked bouncer and an unplayable yorker.And he could do it all at pace.I wont even go into his credentials of reverse swing.

There is nothing in the fast bowlers manual or nothing a fast bowler could do and Wasim Akram could not.

Except Marshal i cannot think of another bowler who i would put above Akram.

add a small run-up to that, and left arm angle, he was the most complete package

 

[Varun]

there can never be another Akram, Steyns many, enuf said, end of thread!

You can't be serious? The second best at the moment is far distant with a 30 average, James Anderson.

 

[Energetic]

Akram anyday.

 

[Justcrazy]

I do not understand the logic that Akram had variations so he is better.

Well, at the end of the day cricket is a team sport , and a bowler can be judged by wickets he takes.

You cannot say a batsman who can play 10 kinds of shots and averages 30 is better than one who can play 5 kinds of shots and averages 40.

I agree Akram can bowl with lots of variations , but give credit to Styen who does not have variations but still has better record.

 

[Hitman]

A valid comparison can be made only after Steyn finishes his career. Would love to see him end with at least 550 Test wickets or more. As for the comments on this thread, it's obvious that Pak fans would pick Akram. Do you think Indian fans would pick Lara over Sachin?

 

[Romali_rotti]

Its like comparing imran khan with darren sammy

Yeah I hear ya, Darren Sammy >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Imran Khan...


Now back to the topic, Wasim is the KING of ODI no comparison here, in test I feel Wasim is slightly better as of now but we will see when Steyn calls it a day..

 

[Sakss]

you ask any expert any ex cricketer , all would say wasim is one of the best ever.,.im ready to bet on that 100%

 

[Jo_Don]

you ask any expert any ex cricketer , all would say wasim is one of the best ever.,.im ready to bet on that 100%

They are yearning for the glory days, as are you.

 

[ethan hunt]

I have said it before and ill say it again that about 99 percent of cricket pundits would rate wasim higher than steyn .You ask anyone of the batting greats like ponting , sachin , lara , hayden , gilchrist , laxman , dravid and they would all put akram ahead of steyn , same with the bowlers , thats how good he was , we are talking about a guy who is the best left arm fast bowler of all time , arguably the greatest ODI fast bowler ever , an all time great in test cricket , a world cup winner capable of turning it on in pressure situations ,plus 3 or 4 international hattricks just to complete his bowling CV .
Akram > steyn

 

[Jo_Don]

Re: Steyn vs Akram

I have said it before and ill say it again that about 99 percent of cricket pundits would rate wasim higher than steyn .You ask anyone of the batting greats like ponting , sachin , lara , hayden , gilchrist , laxman , dravid and they would all put akram ahead of steyn , same with the bowlers , thats how good he was , we are talking about a guy who is the best left arm fast bowler of all time , arguably the greatest ODI fast bowler ever , an all time great in test cricket , a world cup winner capable of turning it on in pressure situations ,plus 3 or 4 international hattricks just to complete his bowling CV .
Akram > steyn

Those same pundits would rate Marshall as the best fast bowler ever, when he had an ODI record which was not much better than Steyn's, and never took a 5-fer in ODIs. In an era favourable to fast bowling. So I'm not sure why all the Akram fanbois are bringing ODIs into this, especially when they played by different rules.

Their opinions are just that, opinions. And Steyn is a better test bowler, that's all that counts.

 

[IndianWillow]

I have said it before and ill say it again that about 99 percent of cricket pundits would rate wasim higher than steyn .You ask anyone of the batting greats like ponting , sachin , lara , hayden , gilchrist , laxman , dravid and they would all put akram ahead of steyn , same with the bowlers , thats how good he was , we are talking about a guy who is the best left arm fast bowler of all time , arguably the greatest ODI fast bowler ever , an all time great in test cricket , a world cup winner capable of turning it on in pressure situations ,plus 3 or 4 international hattricks just to complete his bowling CV .
Akram > steyn

Akram averaged 23.6 in an era when this average was not very unusual. Steyn averages 22.6 in an era when his nearest competitors are around 28-30. Now that speaks for itself.

Akram has 25 5 wkt hauls and 5 10 wkt hauls in 104 tests. Steyn has 21 5 wkt hauls and 5 10 wkt hauls in 65 tests. Easily proves Steyn is a far better impact bowler than Wasim. By the time Steyn finishes his career, he is likely to have 35 5 wicket hauls and 10 10 wkt hauls, about 60% more than Akram! Even at half way through his career Steyn matches Akram in both 5 wkt hauls and 10 wkt hauls, so that ends the argument that Steyn should be compared with AKram only after he finishes his career.

There can be very little doubt that Steyn can run through sides much better than Akram because he bowls very few loose balls, it may be true that Akram had more variations and guile which cannot be used to settle this issue.