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England [353 & 313/8d] beat South Africa [175 & 252] by 239 runs to take a 2-1 series lead

Probably slight advantage to Poms, but if there is a winner in this match, it'll be decided by 2nd innings. SAF are not out of it, but they need to bat well against new ball.
 
A middling total who's worth will be defined by the bowling effort.

England should be up for it after the criticism from Trent bridge.
 
Have anyone noticed - latest improved version of CricInfo has taken out Phillander from SAF bowling sheet?
 
MMHS said:
Have anyone noticed - latest improved version of CricInfo has taken out Phillander from SAF bowling sheet?
Click to expand...

Yep, Morkel was gone first, now Philander is...

I actually reported it to cricinfo. This new site isn't ready imho.
 
England will win this easily.

will bowl out SA for 250 260.

Make 300 in 3rd innings declare.

give em 380 odd to chase bowl em out for under 200.

rule Britannia
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">BREAKING:<a href="https://twitter.com/OfficialCSA">@OfficialCSA</a>'s <a href="https://twitter.com/VDP_24">@VDP_24</a> taken to hospital for tests after suffering from stomach upset on first 2 days against <a href="https://twitter.com/englandcricket">@englandcricket</a>. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/SSN?src=hash">#SSN</a> <a href="https://t.co/hVIzjzGK2O">pic.twitter.com/hVIzjzGK2O</a></p>— Sky Sports News (@SkySportsNews) <a href="https://twitter.com/SkySportsNews/status/890942721350922242">July 28, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
Good decision by Aleem Dar.

Eng will enjoy their tea.

Elgar could have played another stubborn inns like Trent Bridge.
 
Don't think ENG attack has much to offer on Day 2/3 Oval wicket after first 20 overs or so, but SAF failed to capitalize on that. Still, Amla can hit a big ton, but I think, ENG in charge here - SAF must not go to dinner 4 down, to compete here (at most 3 down, and that 1 wicket can't be Amla).
 
Toby gets his third wicket! Where has this kid been hiding!

A pretty much unplayable short ball to take Amla's glove.

England flying in this match now.
 
I was thinking, who are going to be ENG's pacer in Ashes? Or the bowling combination?

I don't think any English finger spinner is going do better than Ashwin down under, therefore Moeen has to play on his batting merit, which makes Adil a must for at least 3 of the 5 Tests (WACA & may be Gabba excluded).
So, Stokes, Moeen & Adil should be fixed - may be at WACA, they can drop Adil for another pacer.

That leaves 3 pacers - at his younger days, Jimmy at best was mediocre in AUS, don't think he should be even taken to AUS this time, rather he should focus on the 2018 summer, which has 7 Tests. Berbi should go there for one last time - that leaves 2 fast bowlers' spot. Don't think, Woakes will enjoy bowling in AUS, or may be only as 4th seemer in 1/2 Tests replacing Adil.

Ronald-Jones enjoying a great debut, may be he can be part of the squad. That leaves, 2 more slots from Wood, Ball, Plucknet. But, Just don't feel any of them has the pace & experience to bowl in AUS - not sure, how he is now, but I would have taken Finn for sure, if he is fit. Still, one more express pacer required.

Braod, Finn, Woakes, 4th & 5th pacer - who should be those 2? Fast, tall & must be fit enough to carry the work load. Is Tymal Mills a Test option?
[MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] [MENTION=139981]HitWicket[/MENTION]
 
MMHS said:
Is Tymal Mills a Test option?
Click to expand...

I think his back condition won't allow that.

“I had all my tests done, and sat down with the doctors and the chief executives of the Sussex team. Retirement was one of the options I had to consider. To hear that at 22 wasn’t nice at all. Another option was to play only T20 cricket, as the injury occurred only when I bowled 14-15 overs in a day,” Mills says, in a media interaction here on Friday.

Mills explains that his back condition does not affect his off-the-field routines. “It gives me no problems in terms of my day-to-day life. I don’t wake up in the morning in pain. I take medication every day, and I’ve adjusted my gym schedule. It flares up only when I have to take on long spells. So even at nets, I don't usually bowl more than 24 balls," he says.

http://www.sportstarlive.com/cricke...career-threatening-injury/article17752642.ece
Click to expand...
 
4th to TRJ. De Kock caught in the gully playing a typically reckless shot.
 
Would have been the 5fer there but declined to review it. Bavuma with the tiniest edge on a bat pad appeal. Should have been braver!! But a brilliant spell nonetheless.
 
James said:
Would have been the 5fer there but declined to review it. Bavuma with the tiniest edge on a bat pad appeal. Should have been braver!! But a brilliant spell nonetheless.
Click to expand...

I thought ball just bounced or was it a clean take by Stokes?
 
Is he swinging or bowling express. The guy isn't a spring chicken - 29+ and has 91 FC matches in 8 years for quite decent stats both with ball & bat. Should have got a call earlier.
 
Seven down, really eight as Philander is in hospital.

Enforce the follow-on England, keep loading rocks on them.
 
Britannia crushing the Saffers. This will be over by Sunday at the latest.
 
[MENTION=141114]Hasan123[/MENTION] - I told you, wait till FaF loses the toss & doesn't get the 1st use of the wicket; batting or bowling first doesn't matter.

Modern cricket is cheap - players groomed to glorify favorable condition. A little bit of trick in wicket/condition (again doesn't matter bat or bowl - I have seen bowling sides going for 400/3 in a day when the wicket needs extra effort from bowlers on Day 1) - game ends one sided - be Test, ODI or T20.

This is because, categorically the balance of the game had been destroyed, by money hungry goons - what left is false bravado, cheap heroics when chips are up. In last few years, I have hardly seen an inspirational spell to bring a game back or the fight from batsmen to buy time in tough condition. Something must not be right, if 3 toss winners end up winning by 200+, 200+ & probably by innings at alternate order - ENG, SAF, ENG .... may be SAF again, if they win the toss in 4th Test and we'll praise FaF for leadership again.
 
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Pathetic from South Africa. Yes the ball has swung a bit but its not 95-7 conditions.

This generation of international batsmen have to be the worst against lateral movement.
 
Enforcing the follow on would be too excitable a decision. Bat them out of the game tomorrow and they will crumble on the 4th day.
 
Markhor said:
Pathetic from South Africa. Yes the ball has swung a bit but its not 95-7 conditions.

This generation of international batsmen have to be the worst against lateral movement.
Click to expand...

Then, they must be great against spin, particularly on a bit sluggish turners - otherwise, please tell me, how can I convince myself that these modern greats would average more than 35 in 80s-90s:(
 
James said:
Enforcing the follow on would be too excitable a decision. Bat them out of the game tomorrow and they will crumble on the 4th day.
Click to expand...

I think they are already batted out of the game. Still need 230 to make England bat again.
 
MMHS said:
Then, they must be great against spin, particularly on a bit sluggish turners - otherwise, please tell me, how can I convince myself that these modern greats would average more than 35 in 80s-90s:(
Click to expand...

Apparently Youtube is the answer to all your questions.
 
Standard Bank Proteas team manager, Dr Mohammed Moosajee, gave the following update on Vernon Philander’s illness:

“Vernon Philander has been admitted to hospital and is being treated for a probable viral infection. He will remain in hospital overnight on intravenous fluids for rehydration and will be reassessed in the morning to determine his participation in the current match.”
 
Abdullah719 said:
Standard Bank Proteas team manager, Dr Mohammed Moosajee, gave the following update on Vernon Philander’s illness:

“Vernon Philander has been admitted to hospital and is being treated for a probable viral infection. He will remain in hospital overnight on intravenous fluids for rehydration and will be reassessed in the morning to determine his participation in the current match.”
Click to expand...

So basically no batting or bowling for the remainder of the game, and will be replaced by a sub-fielder. Probably won't make it to Old Trafford either. Viral infections are grim enough when you are sat at home watching TV, let alone playing top level sport.
 
It's going to rain after Lunch. For the rest of the afternoon.

So for once I really would apply the follow-on, for several reasons:

1. The rain delays will keep the bowlers' workloads down.

2. There may only be 200 overs left in the Test after Lunch today. You don't want to risk a FAF block-a-thon saving the match.

3. By the same token, Day 5 will be Day 4 conditions. So possibly not much rough for the spinners. Even if South Africa are dismissed for 140 this morning and then bat to Lunch on Day 5 for 440 in 140 overs, that would still only be a target of 230 in 70 overs to win the match, without a worn pitch.
 
James said:
So basically no batting or bowling for the remainder of the game, and will be replaced by a sub-fielder. Probably won't make it to Old Trafford either. Viral infections are grim enough when you are sat at home watching TV, let alone playing top level sport.
Click to expand...

Vern's got his pads on!
 
I'm starting to get nervous about the follow-on.

We're only 216 ahead, and of the 266 overs supposedly left in the game, we might lose up to 40 today. (Sixty, but with 10 made upon each of days 4 and 5).

I really, really want to invoke the Follow On.
 
This bavuma is good bat. Has good defence and somehow finds way of scoring in tough conditions
 
shaz619 said:
Big Vern! the tormentor of the English despite his lack of height :broad
Click to expand...

.....and his advanced age.

.....and the fact that modern cameras are less sensitive than old ones.

.....and the quota system.
 
Junaids said:
.....and his advanced age.

.....and the fact that modern cameras are less sensitive than old ones.

.....and the quota system.
Click to expand...

Ha Ha I love it when your jimmies get rustled Junaids :)) But come on you need to give credit to the man, doesn't his skill remind you of Mohammad Asif even a little; I love watching him out fox batsman and he can stick around with the bat as well
 
Jimmy is having a pretty decent series and his body is holding up as well
 
[MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] why do you not have Botham in your top 5 England pace bowlers ? I think you rate Jimmy above him
 
Imagine SA were to cut Eng lead to about 70-100 runs from here :)) would be humiliating
 
So England lead by 178! SA all out and Roland Jones has a 5fer on debut! excellent bowling
 
shaz619 said:
Ha Ha I love it when your jimmies get rustled Junaids :)) But come on you need to give credit to the man, doesn't his skill remind you of Mohammad Asif even a little; I love watching him out fox batsman and he can stick around with the bat as well
Click to expand...

The weird thing is, in the other thread I said that Philander is a brilliant bowler in favourable conditions.

I don't think a player has to be brilliant in every type of conditions. I think Philander is a liability in Asia, but how much cricket do South Africa play there? I think he's terrific!
 
shaz619 said:
[MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] why do you not have Botham in your top 5 England pace bowlers ? I think you rate Jimmy above him
Click to expand...

I change my mind almost every day!

Botham in the period 1977-1980 was the greatest England bowler that I've ever seen. At the Jubilee test in Bombay in 1980 he made Kapil Dev's bowling look like MS Dhoni's in comparison.

I think I'm something like:

1 Trueman
2 Statham
3 Snow
4 Larwood
5 Anderson

.......but it's a moveable feast!
 
Junaids said:
The weird thing is, in the other thread I said that Philander is a brilliant bowler in favourable conditions.

I don't think a player has to be brilliant in every type of conditions. I think Philander is a liability in Asia, but how much cricket do South Africa play there? I think he's terrific!
Click to expand...

It's a bit unfair on him mate, he did quiet well in the UAE which is a bowlers graveyard mind you!
 
Junaids said:
I change my mind almost every day!

Botham in the period 1977-1980 was the greatest England bowler that I've ever seen. At the Jubilee test in Bombay in 1980 he made Kapil Dev's bowling look like MS Dhoni's in comparison.

I think I'm something like:

1 Trueman
2 Statham
3 Snow
4 Larwood
5 Anderson

.......but it's a moveable feast!
Click to expand...

No love for the Typhoon ?


Note [MENTION=134300]Tusker[/MENTION] :mv
 
I like Faf the captain but he is experimenting too much with De Kock's batting position. Stop it now and play him at maximum 6 not above that that.
 
SarfiBabarHaris said:
I like Faf the captain but he is experimenting too much with De Kock's batting position. Stop it now and play him at maximum 6 not above that that.
Click to expand...

Yes, it is a balance between maximizing his destructive potential and making him more vulnerable to an early exit due to bowlers being fresh and the newer ball doing more.
 
Pitched outside leg, going over the stumps, and no bat for a catch. Otherwise a good shout...
 
Westley looks a decent player, puts away the bad ball and plays with a straight bat/good technique.
 
MMHS said:
I was thinking, who are going to be ENG's pacer in Ashes? Or the bowling combination?

I don't think any English finger spinner is going do better than Ashwin down under, therefore Moeen has to play on his batting merit, which makes Adil a must for at least 3 of the 5 Tests (WACA & may be Gabba excluded).
So, Stokes, Moeen & Adil should be fixed - may be at WACA, they can drop Adil for another pacer.

That leaves 3 pacers - at his younger days, Jimmy at best was mediocre in AUS, don't think he should be even taken to AUS this time, rather he should focus on the 2018 summer, which has 7 Tests. Berbi should go there for one last time - that leaves 2 fast bowlers' spot. Don't think, Woakes will enjoy bowling in AUS, or may be only as 4th seemer in 1/2 Tests replacing Adil.

Ronald-Jones enjoying a great debut, may be he can be part of the squad. That leaves, 2 more slots from Wood, Ball, Plucknet. But, Just don't feel any of them has the pace & experience to bowl in AUS - not sure, how he is now, but I would have taken Finn for sure, if he is fit. Still, one more express pacer required.

Braod, Finn, Woakes, 4th & 5th pacer - who should be those 2? Fast, tall & must be fit enough to carry the work load. Is Tymal Mills a Test option?
[MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] [MENTION=139981]HitWicket[/MENTION]
Click to expand...

Just seen this, to take an early guess at our Ashes squad :

Cook
Jennings
Stoneman

Root
Westley
Malan
Livingstone/Ballance

Bairstow
Buttler/Foakes (if Foakes had a good end to the championship maybe just let Buttler go get a BBL contract?)

Stokes
Moeen

Anderson
Woakes
Broad
Wood
Roland-Jones
Ball/T Curran/Footitt? (Need a left armer and he's got some pace)

Dawson/Rashid/Crane (1 of them)

To early to to call at the moment really.
 
HitWicket said:
Just seen this, to take an early guess at our Ashes squad :

Cook
Jennings
Stoneman

Root
Westley
Malan
Livingstone/Ballance

Bairstow
Buttler/Foakes (if Foakes had a good end to the championship maybe just let Buttler go get a BBL contract?)

Stokes
Moeen

Anderson
Woakes
Broad
Wood
Roland-Jones
Ball/T Curran/Footitt? (Need a left armer and he's got some pace)

Dawson/Rashid/Crane (1 of them)

To early to to call at the moment really.
Click to expand...

Thanks, no chance for Hameed?
 
206 overs to be bowled on days four and five with the weather set to be very good.

Looks like an England win.
 
Poms to win if rain doesn't interrupt the game any further. Conditions were difficult in South Africa's 1st innings, but they shouldn't have been dismissed so cheaply.
 
So what's this - a 250 lead.

Bat for two sessions, promote Stokes and Moeen, push the lead up to 400, four sessions to bowl SA out.
 
Can SA block 4 sessions? They have shown the ability in the past.
 
the-writing-on-the-wall.jpg
 
Junaids said:
I change my mind almost every day!

Botham in the period 1977-1980 was the greatest England bowler that I've ever seen. At the Jubilee test in Bombay in 1980 he made Kapil Dev's bowling look like MS Dhoni's in comparison.

I think I'm something like:

1 Trueman
2 Statham
3 Snow
4 Larwood
5 Anderson

.......but it's a moveable feast!
Click to expand...

Trueman, Statham, Willis, Snow, Larwood for me.
 
Amla is not the player he used to be. Only chance of the blockathon is Faf Du TheZip. But I don't think their batting lineup could last the 4th innings in these conditions for more than 100 overs really.
 
Last edited:
Early days yet but Tom Westley looks a technically solid player. Worth persisting with.
 
Roooooot seems to score by stealth. He comes in, then next time you check the score he has 34.

Philander reminds me of Terry A;lderman, not even 80 mph but took 81 wickets in twelve tests in England.
 
[MENTION=7774]Robert[/MENTION] Lieutenant Zippy has more of a ring to it :yk

SA are a tough cookie and have the capability to bat for a long time and they will be relying on a bit of rain as well, need an aggressive declaration from Root here and take as many wickets possible today (maybe even finish the game off). If SA manage to survive the day with maybe 1 or 2 wickets down they will fancy themselves on day 5 even though England would still be favourites
 
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