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ICC World Cup 2023: South Africa (357/4) seals dominant victory over New Zealand (167) by 190 runs

Marooned said:
It will be a close game.

I don't think we should be worried about either side winning with whatever margin because Pakistan is well and truely dusted in this tournament.
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Speaking too much truth their fam. People will cling on to the last hope of mediocrity
 
jnaveen1980 said:
NZ gambled big time by going in with batting strong with light weight bowling unit. That is a huge gamble in world cups. You would rather want to go in with atleast 4 gun bowlers.
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These are the best bowlers they have. Who else is there for them to pick? The next in line are guys like Shipley, Jamieson , Ben Lister etc and that 80's movie star looking guy.

All of them were terrible in bilaterals when they were tried.
 
SportsWarrior said:
Very difficult to get past SA on NRR. Only way is thru points. This match will be close. NZ is very methodical and strategic in its approach. They will target to get to 300 and see where they are. If still four or more overs remaining they will go for it. There won’t be any panic batting in the beginning to win it in 45 overs. It will be normal batting mixed with a dose of aggression
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You don't need to panic when you chase big totals in India. But you should be smart enough to know that dew will come down by 20th over. Keeping wicket is very vital. You need to see off new ball threat something ENgland failed to do.
 
Nikhil_cric said:
These are the best bowlers they have. Who else is there for them to pick? The next in line are guys like Shipley, Jamieson , Ben Lister etc and that 80's movie star looking guy.

All of them were terrible in bilaterals when they were tried.
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Adam Milne.
 
jnaveen1980 said:
India will not want to face NZ in semis once more lol
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Why? India would smash them. All in form and bowling is fire. SA have the best chance for an upset and only if they bat first and post 300plus.

Can india chase 300 plus in a pressure game under lights? Will be interesting.
 
jnaveen1980 said:
No SA's NRR is far and away from Pakistan's NRR.
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You are not reading or just trying to argue for the sake of it. Remember NRR is a function of the win margin, doesn’t matter if you score 150 or 450 in 50 overs.

SAF’s NRR is far superior because they have won games with higher margins & lost only once. Theoretically, they can loose this game closely, but can loose their last two games by a combined 200+ margin - their NRR will come down.

Contrary, PAK can win next two games with 200+ margin (or inside 70 overs together), their NRR will bump up.

If SAF looses today, it can be 5 teams on 10 points - add SRL & AFG as well.
 
Nikhil_cric said:
These are the best bowlers they have. Who else is there for them to pick? The next in line are guys like Shipley, Jamieson , Ben Lister etc and that 80's movie star looking guy.

All of them were terrible in bilaterals when they were tried.
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Shirley sucks
Lister is useless
Jaimeson is decent in odi but he is more of a test player. He only does well in bouncy or swinging conditions.
 
I would like to see the percentage of Bavuma's contribution in South African total runs in this world cup
 
SA bowling attack is mediocre in middle overs. If NZ gets a good start, they might chase it down. Just know that Kiwis are very methodical and won't give away match if they get into winning position
 
MMHS said:
You are not reading or just trying to argue for the sake of it. Remember NRR is a function of the win margin, doesn’t matter if you score 150 or 450 in 50 overs.

SAF’s NRR is far superior because they have won games with higher margins & lost only once. Theoretically, they can loose this game closely, but can loose their last two games by a combined 200+ margin - their NRR will come down.

Contrary, PAK can win next two games with 200+ margin (or inside 70 overs together), their NRR will bump up.

If SAF looses today, it can be 5 teams on 10 points - add SRL & AFG as well.
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You are talking about unreliastic margins for both teams.
 
kron said:
Shirley sucks
Lister is useless
Jaimeson is decent in odi but he is more of a test player. He only does well in bouncy or swinging conditions.
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Give respect to lister. Babar shamshed him
jnaveen1980 said:
I would like to see the percentage of Bavuma's contribution in South African total runs in this world cup
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Wait for India game for his runs. We have a habit of making careers
 
kron said:
Why? India would smash them. All in form and bowling is fire. SA have the best chance for an upset and only if they bat first and post 300plus.

Can india chase 300 plus in a pressure game under lights? Will be interesting.
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Bad memories of losing to NZ in must win games multiple times will add to pressure
 
NZ is not chasing it if they lose more quick wickets.
 
Conway gone
1st major player gone who could have won it single handedly.

Ravindra and Mitchell left now.
 
Buffet said:
NZ is not chasing it if they lose more quick wickets.
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THey are not chasing. SA has 5 proper bowlers. Ball will swing for 10 overs. You cannot see off 10 overs and think of scoring everything in 40 overs if you don't have massive strike power in your arsenal.
 
Jansen reminds me of Wasim Akram in term of effortless short run and that great momentum at the end. I'm not talking about overall ability, just the run up, load and release.
 
Conway has gone, caught brilliantly by Markram at second skip. NZ needed a good start chasing such abig score and they haven't had it so....
NZ 8/1 (3)
 
jnaveen1980 said:
You are talking about unreliastic margins for both teams.
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That’s why words like “theoretically”, “mathematically” comes. Otherwise, even before WC starting, my four SF were IND, AUS, SAF & NZ. Wasn't around in pp that time around therefore it’s not recorded here.

Practically, what will happen is that this will be a close game; AUS, IND, NZ & SAF will thrash ENG, SRL, SRL & AFGs; Ind - SAF, PAK - NZ close games with Ind & Kiwis winning. BD-SRL, AFG-NED, PAK-Poms again close games…. And if still that game has any significance, Aussies will make that game against BD ugly.
 
MMHS said:
That’s why words like “theoretically”, “mathematically” comes. Otherwise, even before WC starting, my four SF were IND, AUS, SAF & NZ. Wasn't around in pp that time around therefore it’s not recorded here.

Practically, what will happen is that this will be a close game; AUS, IND, NZ & SAF will thrash ENG, SRL, SRL & AFGs; Ind - SAF, PAK - NZ close games with Ind & Kiwis winning. BD-SRL, AFG-NED, PAK-Poms again close games…. And if still that game has any significance, Aussies will make that game against BD ugly.
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If Pakistan scores 400 in the last 2 innings and bowl opposition out for 200 runs in both the innings their NRR will be 0.91. That is still well below NRR of SA which is 2.00. SA just has to lose gracefully assuming they lose. So they are all but safe for semi finals.
 
If you take away Conway's 150+ against Poms, he has flopped in the remaining 5 or 6 games.
 
Marooned said:
It will be a close game.

I don't think we should be worried about either side winning with whatever margin because Pakistan is well and truely dusted in this tournament.
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This is our nature and our cricket is mirroring our country.

we pakistanis are not hard working we are always looking for shortcuts And depending on others
 
SA has a good balance. Good bowlers. Good batsmen. Only thing is poor shot selection while chasing.
 
jnaveen1980 said:
NZ will beat SL for sure. I don't see them troubling.
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Pakistan would need to defeat both poms and kiwis and then hope for SL to beat kiwis. Can of course happen, but very little chances.
 
Jansen probably has taken wicket in every opening spell in this WC
 
jnaveen1980 said:
If Pakistan scores 400 in the last 2 innings and bowl opposition out for 200 runs in both the innings their NRR will be 0.91. That is still well below NRR of SA which is 2.00. SA just has to lose gracefully assuming they lose. So they are all but safe for semi finals.
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You won, leave it here bro.
 
Marooned said:
I don't find Jansen that special. Not my cup of tea.
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First 5 overs of kookaburra swings for any half decent swing bowler. That is what he is doing. His height helps him generate steep bounce. That is an inherent advantage for him. Only Jamieson can do that. But he is atleast 10k slower than Jansen
 
Jansen truly might be top 5 best bowler in odi now.

He has improved leaps and bound.

No longer is the same odi bowler that used to get tonked around.
 
kron said:
Jansen truly might be top 5 best bowler in odi now.

He has improved leaps and bound.

No longer is the same odi bowler that used to get tonked around.
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In the last few overs you can still tonk him once swing is gone. Early on he can be dangerous.
 
Jansen obviously one of the most improve bowler. Not long he was bowling to Kohli in the nets.
 
jnaveen1980 said:
In the last few overs you can still tonk him once swing is gone. Early on he can be dangerous.
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Maybe but he has been deadly in this world cup.

He averaged 39 prior to this world cup in odi

Now shaved it by 10 almost. 30
 
jnaveen1980 said:
First 5 overs of kookaburra swings for any half decent swing bowler. That is what he is doing. His height helps him generate steep bounce. That is an inherent advantage for him. Only Jamieson can do that. But he is atleast 10k slower than Jansen
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Jamieson isn't 10k slower. 5k maybe. I rate Jamieson higher.

Jansen is a good bowler but I have heard people comparing his talent with Shaheen and in terms of talent he isn't close imo.
 
MMHS said:
It works both ways - in fact, if SAF looses, then they are in bigger trouble. NZ had games against PAK & SRL - no way they’ll loose both. SAF has games against Ind & AFG - they have higher chances to loose both.
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Even if sa lose today and the next 2 games- their nrr is so high that they are pretty much through to sf
 
Marooned said:
Jamieson isn't 10k slower. 5k maybe. I rate Jamieson higher.

Jansen is a good bowler but I have heard people comparing his talent with Shaheen and in terms of talent he isn't close imo.
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He's already better and achieved more. Plus he's a batsman. Shaheen is overrated and goes missing in the big games.
 
@jnaveen1980: just found that Aussies also can finish with 10 points, if they loose to AFG & one of BD/ENG game - that’s six teams on 10 points!!!

Only thing so far confirmed is that IND in SF, ENG/BD out and PAK/NZ; AFG/NED/SRL together can’t make it. It’ll be either of these blocks.
 
emranabbas said:
This is our nature and our cricket is mirroring our country.

we pakistanis are not hard working we are always looking for shortcuts And depending on others
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That is the core problem. Looking for short cuts has been ingrained in DNA of the country, right from Cricket to reaching out to other countries for necessary financial aid.
 
Ahmed216 said:
I am expecting the pitch to get better n better as the game progresses
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It will get better. But your asking rate will be through the roof. This is why when you elect to field first you should have a target in your mind. By the look of it , SA has 30 or 40 above their expectation
 
Cric_lover4487 said:
Bad memories of losing to NZ in must win games multiple times will add to pressure
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In odi literally happened just once in 2019 since 2003. All losses happened to India in t20 which no one really cares about or takes seriously. I think india will be just fine vs nz. I guarantee you, India wouldn't want to take chances vs Aussies in a ko. Much rather nz or SA anyday.
 
GLORY OF '92 said:
He's already better and achieved more. Plus he's a batsman. Shaheen is overrated and goes missing in the big games.
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Nah. Shaheen has done wonderfully in big games. Delivered in 2 big games vs India. No one can perform every game. You win some battles, lose some. Jansen wouldn't excite me greatly if he were pakistani.
 
jnaveen1980 said:
Is NZ already worried about their toss call?
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No, it’ll be a close game still - in fact batting first and losing the game could have dented their NRR more. They can play safe and settle for a 35 runs defeat here. Batting first, couple of untimely wickets, could have restricted them to 270….. SAF would have taken 35-38 overs, just like kiwis did that to Poms
 
jnaveen1980 said:
You don't need to panic when you chase big totals in India. But you should be smart enough to know that dew will come down by 20th over. Keeping wicket is very vital. You need to see off new ball threat something ENgland failed to do.
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I agree. Just play safe normal cricket for first 20 to 25 overs. Don’t worry even if you go just by 5 or 5.5. Teams will be around 140 or 145 by 25 overs. As long as you not lost more than couple of overs 330/340 is chasable. Anything more depends. Anyway NZ doesn’t need to win this. They just need to ensure they don’t lose badly. They have SL and PAK games and they will back themselves to win atleast one of them
 
Marooned said:
Nah. Shaheen has done wonderfully in big games. Delivered in 2 big games vs India. No one can perform every game. You win some battles, lose some. Jansen wouldn't excite me greatly if he were pakistani.
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WT20 Final and Semi say hi.

He's a softie like his friends
 
deltexas said:
Even if sa lose today and the next 2 games- their nrr is so high that they are pretty much through to sf
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That’s true - they actually made SF sure with the win over Aussies. Just got derailed a bit with the Dutch game, otherwise a certain SF team. Last 10-12 games prior to WC, they have demolished whoever came on their path.
 
One of the thing about SA is they are vulnerable against swing. Under lights it is a good option to bowl to them.
 
GLORY OF '92 said:
WT20 Final and Semi say hi.

He's a softie like his friends
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The problem is hazy memory.

Wt20 final? He did well. He removed dangerman hales and was 1-13 in 2.1 overs.

Check out that his 1st over vs Aus in that semi. Straight from hell. Come to me when Jansen comes close to that level of skill and fury.

Bowling has to be supported by fielding and that's where Shaheen is at a disadvantage. He basically removed Wade only for Hasan to drop a dolly. You can't create unlimited chances.
 
Dont see nz chasing this.. also their chase against aus was day game..the sf is still
 
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