Is Alastair Cook an all-time great?

[The_Odd_One]

Cook is not an ATG for me for the following simple reasons:

1. He has never been among the top 3 batsmen in the world in his entire career.
2. The quality of bowling he has faced is pretty low.
3. He has a history of failing whenever he faced a quality attack.
4. He was never even the best batman in his own team.

The only two things he has achieved in his career as a batsman are:

1. One Ashes performance in Australia
Everyone will have one good series if they play a dozen series against one opponent and that too when the opposition had a mediocre bowling attack.

2. Performance in India
Aging Indian team caught at wrong time when they were phasing out oldies

 

[Ted123]

How many series has Tendulkar won with his batting in those countries? The hypocrisy here is mind-boggling.

Bowling attack means nothing when we are talking about Cook and series winning ability means nothing when we are talking about Tendulkar but for Younis, both the things matter and even then posters will find holes in his CV.

 

[UN talkz]

How many series has Tendulkar won with his batting in those countries? The hypocrisy here is mind-boggling.

It doesn't matter what Cook, YK or SRT have done in different conditions....
What all matters is publicity and these are just stunts to attain that.

 

[Ted123]

Cook is not an ATG for me for the following simple reasons:

1. He has never been among the top 3 batsmen in the world in his entire career.
2. The quality of bowling he has faced is pretty low.
3. He has a history of failing whenever he faced a quality attack.
4. He was never even the best batman in his own team.

The only two things he has achieved in his career as a batsman are:

1. One Ashes performance in Australia
Everyone will have one good series if they play a dozen series against one opponent and that too when the opposition had a mediocre bowling attack.

2. Performance in India
Aging Indian team caught at wrong time when they were phasing out oldies

Cook is an inferior test batsmen to Sangakkara, Smith, Younis, Amla, KP, Clarke and de Villiers post 2000s.

 

[Robert]

It's not about simply facing the best bowlers, it's about doing well against them. Cook has failed against every good attack that has come up against him.

Well, I would argue that the good Australian attack failed against him in 2010 when he got 766 runs in five tests. Confidence is a funny thing. Johnson was superb in 2012/3 but he got pulled out of the attack after his first four overs because he was getting hit. Then he came back after a couple of wickets had gone down and the batters were nervy. In 2010 he got knocked off his line by Cook and went into Sloop John B mode all series.

 

[Bilal7]

Well, I would argue that the good Australian attack failed against him in 2010 when he got 766 runs in five tests. Confidence is a funny thing. Johnson was superb in 2012/3 but he got pulled out of the attack after his first four overs because he was getting hit. Then he came back after a couple of wickets had gone down and the batters were nervy. In 2010 he got knocked off his line by Cook and went into Sloop John B mode all series.

I agree with all you said but apart from a few instances, Cook hasn't been successful against the best bowling attacks.

 

[CricFan2012]

Cook is not an ATG for me for the following simple reasons:

1. He has never been among the top 3 batsmen in the world in his entire career.
2. The quality of bowling he has faced is pretty low.
3. He has a history of failing whenever he faced a quality attack.
4. He was never even the best batman in his own team.

The only two things he has achieved in his career as a batsman are:

1. One Ashes performance in Australia
Everyone will have one good series if they play a dozen series against one opponent and that too when the opposition had a mediocre bowling attack.

2. Performance in India
Aging Indian team caught at wrong time when they were phasing out oldies

Good post, others would have ignored details like this, opposition's bowling attack, pitches, and hindsight all matter if you really want to rank someone.

 

[Ab Fan]

Well, I would argue that the good Australian attack failed against him in 2010 when he got 766 runs in five tests. Confidence is a funny thing. Johnson was superb in 2012/3 but he got pulled out of the attack after his first four overs because he was getting hit. Then he came back after a couple of wickets had gone down and the batters were nervy. In 2010 he got knocked off his line by Cook and went into Sloop John B mode all series.

Harris played in one match too. Wasn't Harris a top bowler back then?

I think he would have performed in all other era although his avg would have taken a big hit particularly in 80s and 90s.

 

[Hitman]

You don't average 46 odd and become an ATG.

 

[Robert]

Harris played in one match too. Wasn't Harris a top bowler back then?

I think he would have performed in all other era although his avg would have taken a big hit particularly in 80s and 90s.

Nearly all modern batters would have averaged less then.

 

[Ab Fan]

Nearly all modern batters would have averaged less then.

Yes but among all the modern great batters, I think Cook's average would have taken a bigger hit than others while KP's would have been hit by least or even remained same.

 

[AAli98]

If you look at english players history they tend to decline rapidly at the age of 32/33 Cook out for 0 today as we speak.. he may have run his race.

 

[bilalmasaud]

Let's get this clear for once and all. Many posters consider him an ATG. Do you think he is an ATG given his weaknesses against quality pace bowling?

He failed in 10 straight consecutive Ashes and then continued failing vs India and SL at home, latter winning a test series there. He never did well vs South Africa or Australia at home. He never faced Ajmal or Yasir in UAE and struggled against Jadeja in India.

Is he an ATG opener and better batsmen than other openers like Gooch, Boycott, Greendige, Smith, Kirsten and Hayden?

Who is better test player- KP or Cook?

I will keep it short
he's englands shiv chanderpaul ...
i don't consider him an ATG mostly because he doesn't dominate and dismantle the oppositions psyche much like kp could so kp is better was kp an atg? nope didn't have a long enough career to become one

 

[James]

If you look at english players history they tend to decline rapidly at the age of 32/33 Cook out for 0 today as we speak.. he may have run his race.

It was only a warm up game.

 

[Robert]

Yes but among all the modern great batters, I think Cook's average would have taken a bigger hit than others while KP's would have been hit by least or even remained same.

Probably true.

 

[Robert]

It was only a warm up game.

He is dropping catches too. His eyes may have gone.

 

[Mamoon]

Hayden is better than Cook but no one considers him ATG. They consider him a great player but not at the same level as a true ATG opener like Gavaskar.

As for the opening in England is tough: I agree with you in general but these days even in England some of the pitches are quite flat. Lords and Oval for example are quite nice for batting.

I have mentioned this at some point before but check out Cook's record at Trent Bridge where the ball swings around.

351 runs for 16 dismissals at an average of under 22!!! A highest score of 50 in 17 innings!

And even that includes a cheap 43 not out he got against West Indies when England needed 100 to win. Pretty shocking for a so called ATG.

Hayden certainly has a very strong case of being better than Cook, and a lot of people do consider him an ATG. Cook's record in Trent Bridge is poor, but if you do micro-analysis of each and every player you will find such outliers. For example, Hayden himself didn't cover himself in glory when the ball swung.

You have to look at the overall achievements and the impact that they have had. Both Hayden and Cook have done enough - in spite of their weaknesses - to be considered greats IMO.

 

[Mamoon]

Anyway, Cook will have to play out of his skin to score many runs in this Ashes. I agree that he is past his prime now and is edging close to retirement. He is not getting anywhere close to Tendulkar's record.

 

[Mamoon]

How many series has Tendulkar won with his batting in those countries? The hypocrisy here is mind-boggling.

Tendulkar never had the bowling to assist him. Obviously, one man cannot beat 11 if he doesn't have adequate support. Cook would not have won in Australia and India had the bowlers and some other batsmen not showed up.

However, Younis has not been able to capitalize even when he had the support of the other players. The best example is England last year, where the bowling was good and a lot of batsmen made contributions in the first 3 Tests except Younis.

It was his golden opportunity to finally produce an impactful series-winning performance in a big country but he wasn't good enough. In Australia, our bowling was rubbish but he was useless when the series was alive.

 

[Mamoon]

The reason we didn't win in 2005 and 2007 in India is because we had a desperately weak bowling attack. I wouldn't blame the batsmen or claim Younis was one of the main reasons for us failing to win.

Younis was statistically our best batsman on that 2005 tour, scoring a career saving hundred in the Kolkata Test before even outshining Inzamam in Bangalore with a series saving double ton so its bizarre to use his India record as a stick to beat him with.

Fans overestimate the effect one individual can have on winning a series and its an unfair standard to judge players. Cricket is ultimately a team game. Brian Lara was outstanding in the 2001 tour of Sri Lanka but his heroics meant nothing as the rest of the West Indies team was so weak that it got whitewashed 3-0.

The 2005 series was certainly Younis Khan's best in my opinion. However, it is a valid criticism that he has generally not been able to have a dominate series in a major country which is a major reason why he has not had the fanfare and status as some of the other top batsmen.

 

[Mamoon]

And then imagine you have the likes of Fleming, Atherton, Kirsten, Langer and Hayden opening the innings against ATG bowlers in 90s and early 00s. How underrated are they in comparison to Cook who has to gel only with Australian and Saffers attack?

Kirsten, Langer and Hayden were outstanding openers as well. Kirsten in particular is quite underrated. Atherton and Fleming were very good too but a little below the level of those three, Smith and Cook, who has been the most prolific of them all in his peak.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Tendulkar never had the bowling to assist him. Obviously, one man cannot beat 11 if he doesn't have adequate support. Cook would not have won in Australia and India had the bowlers and some other batsmen not showed up.

However, Younis has not been able to capitalize even when he had the support of the other players. The best example is England last year, where the bowling was good and a lot of batsmen made contributions in the first 3 Tests except Younis.

It was his golden opportunity to finally produce an impactful series-winning performance in a big country but he wasn't good enough. In Australia, our bowling was rubbish but he was useless when the series was alive.

What? Now the bowling in England was good? Said by someone who consider Yasir a serial match loser outside Asia, does not rate Aamir, and once said that the gap between Indian and Pakistani bowling is as much as batting.

You do realize that Younis was 40, right? At same age, Tendulkar could not score even in India and Ponting was embarrassingly bad against every bowling attack.

First test in NZ 2001, Younis scored 91 and 149*.

2006, Younis scored in 2nd and 3rd tests in England. He did not play 1st test.
Double century against Zimbabwe in the first test
Series saving century in WI in 2005
Series saving double century in England 2016
Series saving double century in Bangalore
Series winning marathon inning in SL in the final test

 

[Mamoon]

What? Now the bowling in England was good? Said by someone who consider Yasir a serial match loser outside Asia, does not rate Aamir, and once said that the gap between Indian and Pakistani bowling is as much as batting.

You do realize that Younis was 40, right? At same age, Tendulkar could not score even in India and Ponting was embarrassingly bad against every bowling attack.

First test in NZ 2001, Younis scored 91 and 149*.

2006, Younis scored in 2nd and 3rd tests in England. He did not play 1st test.
Double century against Zimbabwe in the first test
Series saving century in WI in 2005
Series saving double century in England 2016
Series saving double century in Bangalore
Series winning marathon inning in SL in the final test

Indian was a bowling minnow in the 90s. Kumble was a great bowler in home conditions but irrelevant outside. Their bowling improved in the 2000s and they did beat England in England in 2007. Besides, Tendulkar's greatest feat is his longevity. To be a world class batsman for almost 180 Tests is mind-boggling and something we may never see again.

Secondly, India's bowling attack is excellent now and if you put a peak Tendulkar in this team, he would definitely win a Test series in a major country.

You don't need to list Younis' innings because I have watched him from his debut. He has rarely dominated a series and has largely been overshadowed by the likes of MoYo (England 2006) when they played together. He stood out when MoYo left because he was the only world class batsman in the team.

Series saving centuries are not good enough to be an ATG, and his Oval 200 was series saving because he was the main reason why Pakistan could not win the series in the first place. Had he showed up at Edgbaston in either the first or the second innings, Pakistan would have won that match as well.

 

[Bilal7]

Younis Khan is far better than Cook. That much is clear.

 

[Ted123]

<B>Indian was a bowling minnow in the 90s. Kumble was a great bowler in home conditions but irrelevant outside. Their bowling improved in the 2000s and they did beat England in England in 2007. </B>Besides, Tendulkar's greatest feat is his longevity. To be a world class batsman for almost 180 Tests is mind-boggling and something we may never see again.

Secondly, India's bowling attack is excellent now and if you put a peak Tendulkar in this team, he would definitely win a Test series in a major country.

You don't need to list Younis' innings because I have watched him from his debut. He has rarely dominated a series and has largely been overshadowed by the likes of MoYo (England 2006) when they played together. He stood out when MoYo left because he was the only world class batsman in the team.

Series saving centuries are not good enough to be an ATG, and his Oval 200 was series saving because he was the main reason why Pakistan could not win the series in the first place. Had he showed up at Edgbaston in either the first or the second innings, Pakistan would have won that match as well.

Dravid, his own teammate, drew a test series in England 2002 and Australia 2003 and Windies 2006 away.

We are not diminishing the certification of those ATG players. The major point is that winning a test series in those big series is a team effort and not individuals callibre.

It is absurd to expect one player to win test series in Australia and South Africa or win a World Cup event. Sometimes it clicks while sometimes it doesn't and Dravid vs Tendulkar is the best analogy.

 

[Mamoon]

Dravid, his own teammate, drew a test series in England 2002 and Australia 2003 and Windies 2006 away.

We are not diminishing the certification of those ATG players. The major point is that winning a test series in those big series is a team effort and not individuals callibre.

It is absurd to expect one player to win test series in Australia and South Africa or win a World Cup event. Sometimes it clicks while sometimes it doesn't and Dravid vs Tendulkar is the best analogy.

There are other factors that push Dravid into the ATG category. He played a lot of cricket in tough conditions against top teams and was prolific. The problem with Younis is that not only does he not have series defining performances in the big countries, he has also played very little cricket in those countries.

Now that is not his fault, but it is how it is. He is simply not an ATG, but a top player in his own right and one of Pakistan's greatest Test batsmen. Stature wise, he is in the league of batsmen like VVS and Mahela. Excellent players but short of the ATG league.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Indian was a bowling minnow in the 90s. Kumble was a great bowler in home conditions but irrelevant outside. Their bowling improved in the 2000s and they did beat England in England in 2007. Besides, Tendulkar's greatest feat is his longevity. To be a world class batsman for almost 180 Tests is mind-boggling and something we may never see again.

Secondly, India's bowling attack is excellent now and if you put a peak Tendulkar in this team, he would definitely win a Test series in a major country.

You don't need to list Younis' innings because I have watched him from his debut. He has rarely dominated a series and has largely been overshadowed by the likes of MoYo (England 2006) when they played together. He stood out when MoYo left because he was the only world class batsman in the team.

Series saving centuries are not good enough to be an ATG, and his Oval 200 was series saving because he was the main reason why Pakistan could not win the series in the first place. Had he showed up at Edgbaston in either the first or the second innings, Pakistan would have won that match as well.

India still did not win a series in Australia and SA with an ATG team even in the 2000s.

When Younis and Yousuf played together, Younis averaged better than Yousuf against Australia, NZ, India, and SL. Yousuf average better against WI, Zimbabwe, and SA (by 2 points, though he never scored a century against SA which Younis did). So much for being overshadowed by Yousuf.

 

[Mamoon]

India still did not win a series in Australia and SA with an ATG team even in the 2000s.

When Younis and Yousuf played together, Younis averaged better than Yousuf against Australia, NZ, India, and SL. Yousuf average better against WI, Zimbabwe, and SA (by 2 points, though he never scored a century against SA which Younis did). So much for being overshadowed by Yousuf.

Yousuf played the better knocks. No innings of Younis against Australia can match the class of MoYo's 111 at the MCG against McGrath and Warne, and his innings at Cape Town (when no one else went past 20) was superior to Younis' century at Cape Town 6 years later.

During the time when they played together, the Indian series in 2005 and the Auckland Test in 2001 was the only time where Younis stole the limelight from MoYo, and that was because MoYo had the ability to get on top of the bowling especially fast bowlers.

MoYo was the better player throughout the early 2000s and Younis couldn't even make a permanent place in the team till 2005-2006. Younis was a better player of spin, but there is no comparison between the two when it comes to ability against pace and swing. Both weren't great against bounce, but Younis was still better.

Overall, there is no comparison between the two, since Yousuf wasn't a stroke-less wonder and was a very good ODI player as well. In Tests, Younis gives him a good fight, but all the records that he holds today (i.e. most hundreds, 10,000 runs) would have MoYo's but his relationship soured with the PCB after he went with Inzamam to the ICL.

India were the only team that competed with the great Australian side and they were robbed by Bucknor in 2008.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Yousuf played the better knocks. No innings of Younis against Australia can match the class of MoYo's 111 at the MCG against McGrath and Warne, and his innings at Cape Town (when no one else went past 20) was superior to Younis' century at Cape Town 6 years later.

During the time when they played together, the Indian series in 2005 and the Auckland Test in 2001 was the only time where Younis stole the limelight from MoYo, and that was because MoYo had the ability to get on top of the bowling especially fast bowlers.

MoYo was the better player throughout the early 2000s and Younis couldn't even make a permanent place in the team till 2005-2006. Younis was a better player of spin, but there is no comparison between the two when it comes to ability against pace and swing. Both weren't great against bounce, but Younis was still better.

Overall, there is no comparison between the two, since Yousuf wasn't a stroke-less wonder and was a very good ODI player as well. In Tests, Younis gives him a good fight, but all the records that he holds today (i.e. most hundreds, 10,000 runs) would have MoYo's but his relationship soured with the PCB after he went with Inzamam to the ICL.

India were the only team that competed with the great Australian side and they were robbed by Bucknor in 2008.

What is Yousuf's overall average against Australia and SA? Playing one good inning absolve him from dozen other failures? Even, Ijazz has played better innings against Australia than Inzy. That does not make Ijazz a better batsman. A very good ODI player who does not have a single 50 against non-minnows in 3 WCs?

Anyway, this is not a Younis and Yousuf thread. Long story short, Yousuf was a more talented batsman but when it came to performing in a pressure situation, Yousuf always went missing. No wonder, Yousuf did not win or even draw any games for Pakistan while Younis has a long list of such games.

 

[FreePalestine]

Cook is an inferior test batsmen to Sangakkara, Smith, Younis, Amla (maybe, if he can get out of his lean patch), KP, Clarke and de Villiers post 2000s.

May not agree with all of these... But most of them for sure. Thread compared him to openers as well, so is he better than Gooch, Boycott, Smith, Hayden, Langer, Anwar, Gavaskar, Sehwag?

For the record, I do think Cook is an ATG, but maybe not as good as many other great openers.

 

[Ab Fan]

May not agree with all of these... <B>But most of them for sure</B>. Thread compared him to openers as well, so is he better than Gooch, Boycott, Smith, Hayden, Langer, Anwar, Gavaskar, Sehwag?

<B>For the record, I do think Cook is an ATG,</B> but maybe not as good as many other great openers.

You cant be an ATG if most of your contemporaries are ahead of him.

 

[FreePalestine]

You cant be an ATG if most of your contemporaries are ahead of him.

Most of them are not his contemporaries, although there was some overlap with a few of them, they are all really from a different generation to Cook.

Contemporary: Playing at the same time.

That was a list of the best openers that I can think of over history, not a comprehensive list. He could just be the worst of the best, if you see what I am saying. i.e. still ahead of most of his 'contemporaries' - Dean Elgar, Kraigg Brathwaite, Azhar Ali, Tom Latham

Only contemporary opener who I can think can be classed as a better batsman than Cook is Warner.

 

[Ab Fan]

<B>Most of them are not his contemporaries, </B> although there was some overlap with a few of them, they are all really from a different generation to Cook.

Contemporary: Playing at the same time.

That was a list of the best openers that I can think of over history, not a comprehensive list. He could just be the worst of the best, if you see what I am saying. i.e. still ahead of most of his 'contemporaries' - Dean Elgar, Kraigg Brathwaite, Azhar Ali, Tom Latham

Only contemporary opener who I can think can be classed as a better batsman than Cook is Warner.

I was referring to these ones- Sangakkara, KP, Clarke, ABDV, Younis and Amla..

As you said most of them not all are better than Cook but when most of them are better than him, then how can he be ATG because that would mean the likes of Clarke, KP, Amla and ABDV are also ATG. Then it would be like many cricketers are ATGs.

 

[FreePalestine]

I was referring to these ones- Sangakkara, KP, Clarke, ABDV, Younis and Amla..

As you said most of them not all are better than Cook but when most of them are better than him, then how can he be ATG because that would mean the likes of Clarke, KP, Amla and ABDV are also ATG. Then it would be like many posters are ATGs.

Ah, I suppose it is debatable. But openers would be a better comparison, I think. He is definitely better than his contemporary openers. But perhaps not as great as some of the all-time great openers. However, his longevity and powers of concentration are pretty epic. Helped by a busy England test calendar.

 

[Ted123]

ATG Cook starts with a score of 2 in the first test of the biggest series of the year.

 

[Buffet]

Going by his record against decent pace attack, I don't think he will find it easy to score.

 

[Cuts_and_cuts_hard]

Of course he's not an ATG. But he is undoubtedly an England great and a very good batsman overall.

Among post 1990s openers, I would rank him as:

Smith
Sehwag
Hayden
Cook
Langer

 

[Hasan123]

Easy to bump threads like these after 1 failure. Let's see how he does by the end of the series.

 

[Ab Fan]

Could well be his last series ever.

 

[Convict]

Easy to bump threads like these after 1 failure. Let's see how he does by the end of the series.

Cook has always struggled against world class pace attacks.

 

[Hasan123]

Cook has always struggled against world class pace attacks.

Series has just started. Let's see how he does.

 

[Abdullah719]

Series has just started. Let's see how he does.

He last scored an Ashes ton in 2011.

 

[Bilal7]

Scoring in Australia is far easier these days. The pitches are extremely flat and the only thing that has given the bowlers some sort of respite are the D/N matches.

Cook should score at least two tons this series but that will not change a thing about how he is viewed by anyone familiar with his career. He is weak against good pace bowling and definitely not an ATG.

 

[CricFan2012]

No, played in an era of batting, inferior bowlers, flatter tracks.

 

[Hasan123]

He last scored an Ashes ton in 2011.

I'm just making a point, people are writing him off when 1 innings has been played. Let's see how he does when the series is finished.

 

[James]

Getting a bit worried now [MENTION=7774]Robert[/MENTION], Cook doesn’t seem to be seeing the ball that well any more.

 

[Chief Destroyer]

Better than ABD apparently.

 

[Robert]

Getting a bit worried now [MENTION=7774]Robert[/MENTION], Cook doesn’t seem to be seeing the ball that well any more.

I think his career is nearly over. He might hang onto his place for a bit because there is no obvious test class replacement.

 

[James]

I think his career is nearly over. He might hang onto his place for a bit because there is no obvious test class replacement.

I think he should retire from Tests at the end of the next home season. A wonderful servant who deserves a good send off. But he is not looking good at all.

 

[Mamoon]

He hasn't been a top class batsman against top class pace, and this weakness of his is only going to compound in the twilight of his career. He is also shelling quite a few catches in the slips which suggests that his reflexes are waning.

Nonetheless, if he thinks it is time to go, the ECB should postpone his retirement till the English summer. The Australians should not be allowed to boast about forcing another Pom into retirement.

 

[Gilly]

He hasn't been a top class batsman against top class pace, and this weakness of his is only going to compound in the twilight of his career. He is also shelling quite a few catches in the slips which suggests that his reflexes are waning.

Nonetheless, if he thinks it is time to go, the ECB should postpone his retirement till the English summer. The Australians should not be allowed to boast about forcing another Pom into retirement.

Boasting about forcing players into retirement seems to be a Pakistani supporter thing, I've never heard any other team supporter do it.

 

[Mamoon]

Boasting about forcing players into retirement seems to be a Pakistani supporter thing, I've never heard any other team supporter do it.

You are obviously aware of the fact that I am referring to Lyon's statement, which was clearly a nod to the 2013/2014 Ashes which ended the careers of multiple English cricketers.

Cook retiring after this Ashes is simply going to provide more ammo for the future. Surely ECB is smart enough to postpone retirements till the English summer.

 

[AAli98]

He hasn't been a top class batsman against top class pace, and this weakness of his is only going to compound in the twilight of his career. He is also shelling quite a few catches in the slips which suggests that his reflexes are waning.

Nonetheless, if he thinks it is time to go, the ECB should postpone his retirement till the English summer. The Australians should not be allowed to boast about forcing another Pom into retirement.

Cook will be facing the mighty indian trundlers next summer xpect a 250+ score. Retirement will be postponed before the next ashes series.

 

[WengerOut]

Cook will be facing the mighty indian trundlers next summer xpect a 250+ score. Retirement will be postponed before the next ashes series.

Cooks avg

India - 50.09
Pakistan - 50.06

 

[James]

Boasting about forcing players into retirement seems to be a Pakistani supporter thing, I've never heard any other team supporter do it.

The South Africans have done it as well.

 

[pakistani pride]

Has been average for a LONG time. Lets see if he can turn it around. Dont think so.

 

[Ted123]

Series has just started. Let's see how he does.

Yes, there are three tests still left. We will definitely watch him score a 200 probably in the dead rubber game and then put him in ATG league again.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Needs a last air show, a last hurrah.

 

[Ab Fan]

He hasnt done much since winning test series in India in 2012.

Did well in 2015 in UAE but there was not a single half decent spinner in that side in comparison of Yasir and Abu Dhabi was one of the flattest wkt of all time.

There wasn't any big expectations from him anyways in this series.

 

[Dead Ball]

He seems to be a consistent failure against Australia since he had a dream series against them in 2010-11.

Its hard to call a batsman an ATG if you've failed in 6 out of the 7 test series you've played against your most important opponent. But surely an England great IMHO.

 

[Last Monetarist]

Against the two best attacks of the past decade he averages 38 and 35 respectively. He's easily an England great but nowhere in the pantheon of all-time players.

 

[Dead Ball]

Against the two best attacks of the past decade he averages 38 and 35 respectively. He's easily an England great but nowhere in the pantheon of all-time players.

Those are not bad numbers for an opener actually, but he has been too inconsistent.

I hope he can score some runs in this series before it turns dead.

 

[Hasan123]

Yes, there are three tests still left. We will definitely watch him score a 200 probably in the dead rubber game and then put him in ATG league again.

He has failed so far no doubt . Wouldn't be surprised to see him retire next summer.

 

[Lefthanded]

You don't average 46 odd and become an ATG.

I think the 4 run difference isn't the issue with Cook, because a 46 average as an opener has more value than a #4s 50. A #4s 50 average involves playing at least half of their innings - if the 1,2 and 3 do their jobs - with an easier ball if the opener blunted the moving ball.

And an opener will never have the luxury of starting with an older ball that a middle order batsman usually has. End of innings, opener runs to face the fresh pacemen.

Cook's problem is that he's had too many feast and famine periods, or ATG quality innings with too many long run droughts.

Cook isn't an ATG for me, but he comes close. If he gets close to Tendulkar, people have to do lots of gymnastics to deny him ATG status.

 

[The_Odd_One]

He has done nothing in this series so far. Survived an LBW yesterday and still got out cheaply.

 

[giri26]

Cook has very poor record in England's pinnacle in test cricket, The Ashes. He had one good series in 2010/11 but has struggled overall. Even in this series, he has been indifferent and has played some daft shots to get out.

 

[Ted123]

ATG scores a 5, 2, 2 in this series.

 

[Ab Fan]

[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION], would you still call Cook an ATG given he fails a lot more than he scores runs?

And the fact that his record outside Asia looks better only because of some not-so-good bowlers bashing? His average is poor in NZ and SA and inflated in England and Australia because of weak attack bashing.

 

[Spectrum]

Lol..averaging 45 in the era of batting friendly wickets, weak bowlers. Cook is surely an English great but calling him ATG is laughable.
Not sure England has produced a single ATG player since WW2.

 

[James]

An England great and a very good Test batsman. I don’t think the last handful of flops has any impact on his legacy. Just last year he got two double tons! - one at home, and then one in Australia (possibly against a tampered ball lol). It does seem as if his eyes are going though, and he does not seem to have the motivation or hunger to open anymore. I would play him down the order and see how that goes.

 

[James]

Not sure England has produced a single ATG player since WW2.

Botham.

 

[Send1983]

Lol at people calling him ATG and some delusional posters thought he is comparable to real ATG like Sachin.

 

[The_Odd_One]

He's in the same bracket as Langer, Kristen, etc. very good test batsman but far from ATG status

 

[Markhor]

He's finished. Keeps getting caught back in his crease and his eyes seems to be going too.

 

[Varun]

Cook has so many holes in his technique, and CV for that matter, it isn't funny.

You know that cliched question some people are asked: Which batsman would you pick to bat for your life? If somebody picks Cook, he must be suicidal!

 

[Ted123]

He's in the same bracket as Langer, Kristen, etc. very good test batsman but far from ATG status

Langer? Good comparison.

Both very good in tests and poor in one-days.

 

[soso_killer]

Great for his country I guess.

 

[soso_killer]

Kirsten was actually decent against quality attacks. I think he averages 43 in Australia against McGrath and co. Cook failed against the best team of his era home and away.

 

[Mercurial]

No, he is not.

 

[Bhaijaan]

Kirsten was actually decent against quality attacks. I think he averages 43 in Australia against McGrath and co. Cook failed against the best team of his era home and away.

Cook was monstrous in the triumphant Ashes & Indian tours in 2010, 2012 respectively.