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Is Steve Smith already a better batsman than Ricky Ponting?

Smudger

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I mean Smith has scored runs all over the world and wasn't a walking wicket like punter in India. Moreover he lead from front in India. Smith too has scored a ODI world SF century against India coming in at 2 for 1. He also scored important fiftes against Pakistan and New Zealand. Last but not least Ponting was never in discussion of best batsman of his generation but Smith is. Ponting had a strong team but Smith side isn't as strong
 
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Ponting's peak was incredible and Smith hasn't matched it yet. If Smith can continue as he has played over the last three years he'll overtake Ponting and indeed if Smith can continue as he has over the last three years all around the world he'll have to be in contention for better than Tendulkar and Lara.
 
Steve Smith is an amazinggggg test batsman.

I still can't believe how he got a century in Pune (yes, with tons of chances) facing our spinners. Then 2 other centuries in that series. Mind boggling stuff.

Now this is one player I don't mind beating Tendulkar's run record. It's gonna be bloody hard though. Plus his technique doesn't guarantee longevity.

A few more years of vintage Steve Smith and he would have surpassed Ponting and reached the Tendulkar/Lara league. To surpass them, he really needs to play for long but I am sure most cricket fans would love to see him do that.

941 ICC points AFTER the visiting toughest place to tour in the world.

I mean WHAT THE HECK.
 
Yeah, if he can continue this golden streak. Ponting had a hard time in India, Smith already better in many respects. But he needs a longer peak to match Punter. Sachin, that would be tough. It was hard enough for Sachin to be Sachin - he came out of two major slumps caused by injuries to become what he is known as. Let us see how Smithy copes and recovers when he hits those lean patches.
 
He just needs his peak to last longer. As OP mentioned he has outperformed Ponting in India. Also at the moment he's clearly the best batsmen in the world, Ponting always had Sachin and Lara infront of him.

If Smith can continue his run for another 3/4 years he will surpass Punter and enter the league of Lara and Tendulkar. One thing is for sure, the peak of Steve Smith will be talked about for generations to come.
 
Give Ponting the phattas of Australia which have been a norm since 2015 and see him skyrocketing his average to 60
 
Can't agree with the phrase that ponting was never in discussion of best batsman of his generation

Peak ponting was as good as any batsman in the history

I am not sure how long smith can carry this limelight but his eager to get runs is meritorious so no surprise if he surpass ponting/lara or even sachin
 
It's unfair to judge a player who has completed his career to one who is just in the middle of his career.
 
Ponting's peak was incredible and Smith hasn't matched it yet. If Smith can continue as he has played over the last three years he'll overtake Ponting and indeed if Smith can continue as he has over the last three years all around the world he'll have to be in contention for better than Tendulkar and Lara.

Smith's peak has been almost as remarkable as Ponting's. Since the home ashes in 2013-14, Smith has put together a run of form as good as anyone in cricket history.
 
100 cricket writers and players voted on the best cricketer of the decade (00's) and they selected Ponting.

I hope Smith does surpass Ponting but he still has a long way to go yet.
 
100 cricket writers and players voted on the best cricketer of the decade (00's) and they selected Ponting.

I hope Smith does surpass Ponting but he still has a long way to go yet.

Smith already showing signs of better batsman than ponting.And I say this as being a ponting's batting fan. Hated him for non cricketing reasons though. Was a thorough crass.whole
 
I have put this up for the op thinking maybe he didnt follow cricket when Ponting was playing.

Ricky Ponting has been voted Player of the Decade by an overwhelming majority by a jury comprising former and current players and cricket writers.

Ponting got 60 points (a first-place vote fetched three points, a second place two, and third place one), 23 more than second-placed Jacques Kallis. Adam Gilchrist was ranked third (29 points), while positions four to seven went to Muttiah Muralitharan, Glenn McGrath, Sachin Tendulkar and Shane Warne.

Ponting scored more runs and centuries in both forms of the game than any other batsman in the decade, and he was the only one to go past the 9000-mark in both Tests and ODIs. In 107 Tests between 2000 and 2009, he scored 9458 runs at 58.38, and 32 of his 38 centuries. Ponting and Kallis, along with Mohammad Yousuf, were the only batsmen to average more than 58 in Tests in the decade.

Ian Chappell, the former Australian captain who was part of the jury, said Ponting's ability to survive difficult periods and also counterattack successfully, made him the best batsman of the decade. New Zealand captain Daniel Vettori said Ponting was the player of the decade "for his ability to dominate bowlers all across the world for such a long time".

http://www.espncricinfo.com/decadereview2009/content/story/443957.html
 
Smith already showing signs of better batsman than ponting.And I say this as being a ponting's batting fan. Hated him for non cricketing reasons though. Was a thorough crass.whole

Showing signs doesn't matter, it all depends on how long he will last, if he fizzles out as soon as his purple patch is over then he will have trouble reaching ponting, if he is able to sustain good performance till 10k runs then he will surely be better than ponting, rightnow however, he isn't better than ponting
 
Smith is a really tough character.

Real grit, concentration with good hand-eye.

And yet he is still only 28, Surely he has a shot over at many records, What a turn around it has been for him.
 
The bar is high to surpass Ponting but Smith is one guy who certainly can do that if he continues to perform for few more years.
 
I wouldn't say he is yet but I reckon he will be. Steven Smith is still young and can play for at least another 5 years before he retires/performance starts to go down. Great player is Steve Smith, remember how he started his career as a mediocre leg spinner now one of the best batsmen in the world
 
Ponting also scored on patta australian pitches but failed miserably in india on kabadi pitches
 
Easily

After 56 matches, Ponting averaged 45.51 with 10 hundreds.

Smith averages 59.66 with 20 hundreds with almost 2k more runs!

Even the excuse of flat tracks won't work due to the enormous difference in their numbers and for the fact that Smith has done better in India.
 
Easily

After 56 matches, Ponting averaged 45.51 with 10 hundreds.

Smith averages 59.66 with 20 hundreds with almost 2k more runs!

Even the excuse of flat tracks won't work due to the enormous difference in their numbers and for the fact that Smith has done better in India.

Ponting was facing Ambrose/Pollock/Wasim/Donald/Murli in his first 50 matches ...
 
Ponting was facing Ambrose/Pollock/Wasim/Donald/Murli in his first 50 matches ...

It's more simple he wasn't as good during the first years of his career and towards the end the bowlers were similar throughout.
Smith is in his prime similar to what Ponting had after 50 matches it remains to be seen if Smith carries on or his average goes down that will determine who is better.
 
Ponting's peak was incredible and Smith hasn't matched it yet. If Smith can continue as he has played over the last three years he'll overtake Ponting and indeed if Smith can continue as he has over the last three years all around the world he'll have to be in contention for better than Tendulkar and Lara.

He does need better players around him though. Think about how stacked Pontings team was full of great batting. Smith hasn't got that luxury, so he's under more pressure to perform - maybe he is driven by that though?

Either way I think that's a factor you have to include.
 
Ponting had such class style, technique of batting. Was one of my favourite. I remember as a young boy early highschool, watching his innings against India 2003 WC final live on Sky.Was absolute beast.When I remember Ponting, that particular innings pops up in mind.
 
Smith also scored a century coming at 10 for 1 instead if 107 for 1after 14 overs. He scored an important 50 vs pak.Smith is also a more stylish batsman
 
Ponting was facing Ambrose/Pollock/Wasim/Donald/Murli in his first 50 matches ...

So what? Were these the bowlers Punter was facing each and every match, ball after ball? All batsmen encounter easy and difficult pitches, easier and harder bowlers, inform and out of form teams. Many of these factors tend to cancel out over an entire career. A good/great career batting average was 50-60 in the past and has remained the same way ever since, for this reason.
 
Very close, give 2 more years and he'll comfortably surpass Ponting. His stats in India is something Ponting could dream of.
 
Ponting was facing Ambrose/Pollock/Wasim/Donald/Murli in his first 50 matches ...

And he was doing nothing in those matches.

His numbers are like avg of 40 in first 50 matches, 75 in next 50 and 40 in last 50. Either side of that great run from 2002-06, he wasn't great.
 
Does no one remember how flat the pitches were in the 2000s? Most bowling attacks apart from Australia were very weak too compared to 90s and even today.
 
From debut to 22 Feb 2002
Matches: 54
Runs: 3235
Avg: 43.71
100s: 9

From 8 March 2002 to 1 Dec 2006
Matches: 53
Runs: 6004
Avg: 75.05
100s: 24

From 14 Dec 2006 to end
Matches: 61
Runs: 4139
Avg: 39.79
100s: 8

7374 runs outside that period at avg of 41.4
 
Does no one remember how flat the pitches were in the 2000s? Most bowling attacks apart from Australia were very weak too compared to 90s and even today.
It's precisely this reason why they were flat, it blunted the opposition attacks very easily. The only time that they lost the Ashes in the last 3 decades, at home, was when the pitches had something in it for the bowlers & the Aussies lost 3 tests by an innings!
 
Not a fan of overrating past legends but let's be honest here, this isn't even a comparison at the moment. Sure, he averages a good 60 odd in Test cricket and this is legendary stuff we see from him everyday but he is nowhere near Punter. Punter played in the golden era of fast bowlers for a good chunk of his career and was YET so prodigious.
 
It's precisely this reason why they were flat, it blunted the opposition attacks very easily. The only time that they lost the Ashes in the last 3 decades, at home, was when the pitches had something in it for the bowlers & the Aussies lost 3 tests by an innings!

Yes. Many great bowlers(Wasim, Waqar, Walsh, Ambrose, Donald etc) retired about a small time window between 2001-2004. So there was a four or five year transition period there when only Australia could boast of great bowling unit featuring two ATG bowlers in McGrath and Warne. Many great batsmen like Punter and Dravid made lots of runs at high average during this transition period but these runs are somewhat inferior to the runs made by Sachin and Lara in the 90s.
 
Steve Smith is an amazinggggg test batsman.

I still can't believe how he got a century in Pune (yes, with tons of chances) facing our spinners. Then 2 other centuries in that series. Mind boggling stuff.

Now this is one player I don't mind beating Tendulkar's run record. It's gonna be bloody hard though. Plus his technique doesn't guarantee longevity.

A few more years of vintage Steve Smith and he would have surpassed Ponting and reached the Tendulkar/Lara league. To surpass them, he really needs to play for long but I am sure most cricket fans would love to see him do that.

941 ICC points AFTER the visiting toughest place to tour in the world.

I mean WHAT THE HECK.

You watched that series, and I'm sure yu know that the pitches weren't anything close to being the toughest place to tour. The last two matches were very flat, Bangalore was tough and he failed. His only performance on a tough pitch was in Pune where he gave 6 chances.
 
Not a fan of overrating past legends but let's be honest here, this isn't even a comparison at the moment. Sure, he averages a good 60 odd in Test cricket and this is legendary stuff we see from him everyday but he is nowhere near Punter. Punter played in the golden era of fast bowlers for a good chunk of his career and was YET so prodigious.

Lol no he did not. He played 3 years in the 90s and by 1999 all the great fast bowler apart from McGrath had either retired or were on their last legs.
 
He will be better than tendulkar for sure
 
Punter played in the golden era of fast bowlers for a good chunk of his career

Ponting's average blossomed after the ATG bowlers retired. In a similar way, Tendulkar learned to hit double centuries after guys like McGrath left the scene. Smith's facing similar quality attacks as Ponting did, and arguably is doing better in Asian conditions.
 
Ponting's average blossomed after the ATG bowlers retired. In a similar way, Tendulkar learned to hit double centuries after guys like McGrath left the scene. Smith's facing similar quality attacks as Ponting did, and arguably is doing better in Asian conditions.

Really? Out of 6 double hundreds in his Test career, he scored just 2 of them after McGrath retired.
 
You watched that series, and I'm sure yu know that the pitches weren't anything close to being the toughest place to tour. The last two matches were very flat, Bangalore was tough and he failed. His only performance on a tough pitch was in Pune where he gave 6 chances.

I did and India is the toughest place to tour for a batsman for 2 reasons.

One, because of the pitches (not saying pitches are all rank turners but they aren't a breeze to bat apart from a few series like England 2016 tour) .
Two, because we have the most amazing spin bowling duos operating at tandem.

As for Smith, yes, he did not get to face 4 tough pitches. But he did face 2 tough pitches, 1 patta and 1 sporting one (albeit flat on day 1). If we check how past ATGs scored in tough away tours, we would see that they would have a good knock on a tough track mixed in with cashing in on relatively easier tracks/conditions/situations which would round up their numbers nicely. Smith averaged so high in that tour because he scored the Pune 100, then scored a big 100 in Rajkot and then another 100 in a series decider.

That's a bloody good performance facing the toughest home attack of this era. While one can say one of our spinners wasn't upto the mark in that series, the fact that Smith has bullied that spinner a lot of times (in Aus 2014, in India 2013 tour whenever he got a chance) should make up for it.

All in all....the 2017 India tour for Smith was a legendary one which will be talked up for decades and rightly so.
 
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Pointing would have scored 80+ avg if he faces current bowling Era.
 
Not yet. Ponting was the pressure player of his era. Ahead of Lara or Sachin in big games. Smith doesn't have that presence.
 
Smith till now has proved these things:

His ability to hit big match winning hundreds on flat tracks both at home or even away from home.

His ability to perform Vs spin and the recent series in India proved it all. When other teams were struggling for a single drawn match, he made sure his side end the series very competitively by losing it 1-2 is worth respectable given he himself smacked 3 hundreds in 4 matches.

Has issues only vs quality swing and seam and that is the only argument under question for him.

A series in England when conditions are really overcast could really be what could seperate Smith from being regarded as one of the greatest.Apart from that he just needs to keep dominating.
 
Smith potentially better than Tendulkar? Given the quality of bowlers that Tendulkar faced over a long career and still finished with an average over 50? This is getting silly now.
 
Smith potentially better than Tendulkar? Given the quality of bowlers that Tendulkar faced over a long career and still finished with an average over 50? This is getting silly now.

Smith can only face what is infront of him. Not saying he will finish as a better player then Sachin, but you can't use quality of bowling as an excuse when it is something which Smith can't control.
 
Smith can only face what is infront of him. Not saying he will finish as a better player then Sachin, but you can't use quality of bowling as an excuse when it is something which Smith can't control.

It's not an excuse, it is a fact. Throughout his career Tendulkar had to face the most prominent and populous spike of ATG bowlers that has probably ever been seen in cricket history - and who has Smith faced? Steyn, Ashwin and Anderson?
 
It's not an excuse, it is a fact. Throughout his career Tendulkar had to face the most prominent and populous spike of ATG bowlers that has probably ever been seen in cricket history - and who has Smith faced? Steyn, Ashwin and Anderson?


Your missing my point. Smith can only score what's infront of him.
 
Really? Out of 6 double hundreds in his Test career, he scored just 2 of them after McGrath retired.

And the others vs minnows and vs Aussies with no McGrath. Like Ponting, Tendy started going big at a very specific time.

It will be interesting to see what Smith does in the next Ashes.
 
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Your missing my point. Smith can only score what's infront of him.

That's true but he'd need some emphatic performances so folk overlook things like Sachin doing so well against ATG attacks, for example the Don played in an era where attacks were weak but he averaged 99 when his peers were unable to; that indicates greatness. Similarly Smith will need performances in the same vein to be considered amongst elite, not neccesarily average 99 but you get my point
 
Has issues only vs quality swing and seam and that is the only argument under question for him.

.

He still managed 2 big tons in England, though. His chief problem seems to be Steyn and the South Africans. I can't remember his average when the Saffies toured Australia, but I remember Smith doing poorly.
 
And the others vs minnows and vs Aussies with no McGrath. Like Ponting, Tendy started going big at a very specific time.

It will be interesting to see what Smith does in the next Ashes.

What has that got to do with what your original statement was about Sachin learning to score double hundreds after McGrath retired?

And Tendulkar started going big at a very specific time? LMAO. Is that why he averaged 59.38 (minus Zimbabwe) from 1st Jan, 1990 till 31st Dec, 1999 with a century per 4.7 innings, during that time period?
 
He still managed 2 big tons in England, though. His chief problem seems to be Steyn and the South Africans. I can't remember his average when the Saffies toured Australia, but I remember Smith doing poorly.

Those were pattas and I have already said he has proved his worth on pattas by big hundreds both at home and also away from home.But the way he got out in other three games one still gotta doubt his ability vs swing.

SA conditions are similar to Aus as ball comes on bat often and he should do well there or even against them at home.
 
Pointing would have scored 80+ avg if he faces current bowling Era.

Ponting 80 Sachin Lara 100 Bradman 150 in the current era of phatta wickets, paltu bowlers. Now what?

Note this. Sachin averaged 58 in the 90s against the 90s attack which decidedly had somewhat difficult pitches and bowlers. But does not mean that he could up that average to 65 or 70 against the attacks of the noughties? Not at all. Name as many great bowlers u want to. Batsmen are not facing these bowlers match after match, ball after ball. Which is why, over a period these factors cancel out. Sachin is not truly reputed for his batting averages in the 90s per se, but those who watched him live know that he looked at ease facing the quick and slow bowlers in all kinds of conditions. Incidentally Sachin had trouble negotiating Hansie Cronje if many of you still remember, though Cronje was not a great bowler in general. Similarly, Ponting Lara and other ATG batsmen usually looked comfortable most of the time they batted else they cant maintain that 50+ average over a career that spanned 15 years.
 
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