Kevin Pietersen undermines Joe Root's record, says batting is easier today than before

[shaz619]

KP was a special player, injuries & off-field issues robbed him a little, he was the closest batter to Viv Richards in Tests who made their debut post 2005. At his best, he could brutalise some of the greatest players to ever play the game, and it has to be said, during his time the top 5-6 in the world were very strong. So I can understand him feeling a tad jealous because of all the capabilities he had and leaving on a bit of a sour note and perhaps not as appreciated as he should be. I rate him very highly, however, Joe Root would do well in any era, he’s a rock solid hand, mentally tough, gritty, reliable and England’s most consistent batter ever, in-fact his numbers would be even better if he was never captain, that stint weighed on him heavily; Root is up there with the greatest of all time.

 

[AZulfi]

Pietersen has a point

Kulsener? (a good batting all-rounder in white ball cricket only)

Both Dale Steyn and Saqlain Mushtaq deserve to be in that list ahead of some of the others..

 

[jnaveen1980]

Kevin Pietersen is wrong to say batting was harder 20 years ago

In the wake of Joe Root’s rise to No 2 in the all-time Test-run rankings, it appears the former England international is not so impressed

www.telegraph.co.uk

Kevin Pietersen did not often bowl, although he first came to English attention when he represented KwaZulu-Natal as an off-spinner on England’s 1999-2000 tour of South Africa, but he has delivered some bouncers at Joe Root.
Root in the course of his 150 at Old Trafford rose to second place in the all-time list of Test run-scorers. But this was not enough to impress Pietersen. Far from it. He declared, like a real old-timer, that batting was twice as hard back in his day.
“Don’t shout at me but batting these days is way easier than 20/25 years ago!” Pietersen posted on X. “Probably twice as hard back then.”

Pietersen names 22 bowlers of his time and dares the cricket follower of today to name 10 to compare with them.
Of his contemporaries, he nominates four Australians: Glenn McGrath, Brett Lee, Jason Gillespie and Shane Warne; four Pakistanis in Waqar Younis, Shoaib Akhtar, Wasim Akram and Mushtaq Ahmed; three Indians in Anil Kumble, Javagal Srinath and Harbhajan Singh; three New Zealanders in Shane Bond, Chris Cairns and Daniel Vettori; three South Africans in Allan Donald, Shaun Pollock and, bizarrely, Lance Klusener but not Dale Steyn; two Sri Lankans in Chaminda Vaas and Muttiah Muralitharan; and two West Indians in Curtly Ambrose and Courtney Walsh.

A single England bowler was nominated by Pietersen in Darren Gough. His colleagues in the Ashes-winning attack of 2005 seem not to have impressed him.

Most of the variable factors in Test cricket have changed little in this century: balls, pitches, DRS and so forth. The biggest change has been the impact of T20 – the first professional T20 tournament was started in England in 2003, by when Pietersen was starting out for Nottinghamshire.

My interpretation, therefore, would be that Pietersen is wrong to say that the standard of pace bowling has gone down. The finest seamers today are a match for their equivalents of “20/25 years ago”.

“Please name me 10 modern bowlers that can compare to the names above,” Pietersen goes on to say.
Well, in that case, Australia’s Pat Cummins, Mitchell Starc, Josh Hazlewood and Nathan Lyon can all compare; South Africa’s Kagiso Rabada is up with his forebears, not bowling so fast but moving the ball more; Mark Wood and Jofra Archer have been timed as England’s quickest ever; New Zealand’s Will O’Rourke is a serious customer, as is Jayden Seales, even if West Indies are nowhere near what they were; while a case for Jasprit Bumrah being rated the best of all time has been made, although he has been down on pace in the Old Trafford Test.
Where Pietersen is right, although he does not spell it out, is that the standard of finger-spin bowling in Test cricket has decreased, while that of wrist-spin has plummeted. And this is where T20 must have had its impact: spinners bowl a higher percentage of the overs in a T20 game than they do in a red-ball or Test match, but it is a different sort of spin: fired in, flat, at the batsman’s legs, denying him room. It is a distant relation of flight and dip and turn and defeating the batsman past either inside or outside edge.

The presence of finger-spinners in international cricket has faded. If the Test match is in Asia, they will have their say all right, but elsewhere? New Zealand and West Indies might not select one at home. Pakistan, to defeat England last autumn, had to dust down a couple of veterans. It is Lyon and South Africa’s Keshav Maharaj who keep this show on the road outside Asia.

Of wrist-spinners, Pietersen had to face Warne, Kumble and Mushtaq, and he might have added Yasir Shah who took five wickets per Test for Pakistan. Their successors are not visible, in England or anywhere else: India do not select Kuldeep Yadav, and while Afghanistan have Rashid Khan, they have been able to play only 11 Tests.
England have been as culpable as any country in allowing spin to decline, whether in the County Championship or the national side, and especially wrist-spin. In almost 150 years of Test cricket only one wrist-spinner has taken a hundred Test wickets for England, Doug Wright, and only one other has managed 50 wickets, Adil Rashid.
Pietersen is half-right.

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

I think this was a stroke of genius from KP.

He’s a clever guy, he very very subtly trolls Indians.

Indians want root’s record to be diminished by saying the current bowlers are no good. But then they have to admit a lot of their current overhyped bowlers are trash too.

It’s a tough life for poor Indian fans.

This is where hypocrisy of some of my fellow Indian fans gets exposed.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Pietersen has a point

Kulsener? (a good batting all-rounder in white ball cricket only)

Both Dale Steyn and Saqlain Mushtaq deserve to be in that list ahead of some of the others..

But pitches were not really that helpful for bowlers to be honest. Angelo matthews was averaging around 52 at that time. Samaraweera was averaging 50 too. Who can forget the 624 run partnership between Sanga and Mahela. Then the whole sham of pakistan pitches where India made 410 for 1. Also he only named the good bowlers while ignoring the bad bowlers which you find in every single era. So he is not entirely honest. Indian pitches these days are toughest ever in their cricketing history. It is very hard to score runs here.

 

[Vikram1989]

When you analyse in granular detail every batsman has some flaws. Even many of the so called GOATs. No player is completely perfect. When we bring in things like "difficult" pitches or "pressure" situation then it becomes highly subjective. Even today some were criticising Gill for succumbing to pressure, despite the fact that he had already scored a ton in 4th innings which is difficult to do.

There are some measures for impact, but these are mathematical models and often different from what a fan describes as "impact". As an example, despite VVS Laxman 281* being an impactful knock in the follow on test, it will pass through the filters of many fans as it didn't come abroad.

In other sports and games , there are lots of dynamic variables and factors are introduced to gauge the common model. cricket should have one or better to segregate the records per decade or that phase.they shouldn't club everything and make players go at each other

 

[jnaveen1980]

In other sports and games , there are lots of dynamic variables and factors are introduced to gauge the common model. cricket should have one or better to segregate the records per decade or that phase.they shouldn't club everything and make players go at each other

It is very tough to come up with when you factor in umpiring, law changes, general attitude towards the format in an era, workload. SO many intangible variables. It is better to compare players with their peers rather than someone from 50 years back.

 

[Vikram1989]

It is very tough to come up with when you factor in umpiring, law changes, general attitude towards the format in an era, workload. SO many intangible variables. It is better to compare players with their peers rather than someone from 50 years back.

I like cricviz models but not sure how accurately they can get everything correct.every one will say Botham decimated Aussies (130 target) on Headingly 5th day pitch.same Botham today will cry or get obliterated on the same Headingly 5th day pitch ( this series first match where almost 400 chased with out a sweat).Definitely high time to bring some sane comparison

 

[jnaveen1980]

I like cricviz models but not sure how accurately they can get everything correct.every one will say Botham decimated Aussies (130 target) on Headingly 5th day pitch.same Botham today will cry or get obliterated on the same Headingly 5th day pitch ( this series first match where almost 400 chased with out a sweat).Definitely high time to bring some sane comparison

Bazball approach never happened in history. Closest is Australia in the 2000s where they would go at 4 an over thanks to guys like Haydos, Gilchrist. These guys go much faster. They load the side with batsmen and bowlers who can bat keep going harder and harder. Then they bowl relentlessly with energetic bowlers with good strategies. This methodology never was used by any team in history of cricket. So far they are more successful than they have failed.

 

[Vikram1989]

Bazball approach never happened in history. Closest is Australia in the 2000s where they would go at 4 an over thanks to guys like Haydos, Gilchrist. These guys go much faster. They load the side with batsmen and bowlers who can bat keep going harder and harder. Then they bowl relentlessly with energetic bowlers with good strategies. This methodology never was used by any team in history of cricket. So far they are more successful than they have failed.

Bazball never succeeded on outside eng as bazball is all about bullying helpless bowlers on flat tracks.if a model is not sustainable outside certain parameters, i can't call it successful. They are Mostly successful but as good as our 90s Indian team headline"tigers at home lambs abroad".They have perfectly mixed the recipe of flat tracks to their ftbs.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Bazball never succeeded on outside eng as bazball is all about bullying helpless bowlers on flat tracks.if a model is not sustainable outside certain parameters, i can't call it successful. They are Mostly successful but as good as our 90s Indian team headline"tigers at home lambs abroad".They have perfectly mixed the recipe of flat tracks to their ftbs.

THe thing is on helpful fast bowling pitches they have done okay. They beat NZ in NZ comfortably. Only place it won't work is subcontinent. But it is not like they were dominating before bazball era. THey were losing even before that. This is not sustainable. But it definitely helped them get more wins. From their perspective it works. Probably it would have worked in another era on docile wickets from 2000. Remember teams were making 700, 600 for fun back then. In 2000 alone 50 times teams crossed 600 pplus totals. In 2010s only 37 times. In 2020s so far 13 times.

 

[Golu-momin]

I think this was a stroke of genius from KP.

He’s a clever guy, he very very subtly trolls Indians.

Indians want root’s record to be diminished by saying the current bowlers are no good. But then they have to admit a lot of their current overhyped bowlers are trash too.

It’s a tough life for poor Indian fans.

Its is more tougher for pakistanis if goes by kp’s statement in pas era pitches werw bowling heaven still overhyped pakistani wasim, imran,waqar despite consistently cheating, ball tempering can’t match Bumrah in stat or winning matches or performances in sena countries Bumrah>>>>>>Wasim+Imran

 

[Bhaijaan]

KP only echoed the opinion of many educated cricket fans and ex cricketers. Every batting record being broken in the post 2010s era must be thoroughly scrutinised as both the pitches and a much inferior quality of bowling in general have aided the flow of runs since 2010.

I generally subtract 10 runs from modern batters and 15 from their SR before I compare them with batters of 70,80,90s

When comparing with 2000s batters where quality of bowling was top class but pitches were much flatter, I only subtract 5 runs and 10 in SR.

Let’s be clear.
The piece just isn’t there. Shoaib, Lee, Bond, Lawson, Harmison, Edwards etc were seriously quick bowlers.

There’s nothing like spin wizards Warny, Murli, Jambo, Mushy, Saqi etc in the modern era.

Nobody like Curtly talk to no man Ambrose

No Wasim, Waqar, No Shaun, No McGrath.

It’s very easy these days

 

[jnaveen1980]

KP only echoed the opinion of many educated cricket fans and ex cricketers. Every batting record being broken in the post 2010s era must be thoroughly scrutinised as both the pitches and a much inferior quality of bowling in general have aided the flow of runs since 2010.

I generally subtract 10 runs from modern batters and 15 from their SR before I compare them with batters of 70,80,90s

When comparing with 2000s batters where quality of bowling was top class but pitches were much flatter, I only subtract 5 runs and 10 in SR.

Let’s be clear.
The piece just isn’t there. Shoaib, Lee, Bond, Lawson, Harmison, Edwards etc were seriously quick bowlers.

There’s nothing like spin wizards Warny, Murli, Jambo, Mushy, Saqi etc in the modern era.

Nobody like Curtly talk to no man Ambrose

No Wasim, Waqar, No Shaun, No McGrath.

It’s very easy these days

NOt for everyone. Kohli averaged 30 in the last 5 years. Puajra, Rahane. Many batsmen average very low. Only a handful of guys make a lot of runs. Also AUstralia never had 4 world class bowlers bowling at the same tiem for a decade. ENgland was never this good before peak Anderson, peak Broad. West Indies bowlers are good. Make no mistake Roach would have been a box office bowler in any other Windies era. Their batsmen and fielders have let their bowlers down. INdia has finally had a great pace unit. SA is never short of good pace attack. Rabada has the best strike rate in history for someone with 200 plus wickets. Yes individually they were brilliant. But if you are looking at as a unit post 2010 most teams were good. Even Srilankan pace unit has come a long way. Back then you have vaas and Murali. That is pretty much it. For every one good bowler two crap bowlers were there. Heck even Bangladesh has decent set of pacers. We also have to understand batsmen have tremendously improved against pace with all the new technique to practice against Also T20 has emboldened players to take on bowlers. VIrendar sehwag vs Sohaib akhtar in tests 130 balls 130 runs or something like that. We have many of them these days.

 

[TheSultan]

Its is more tougher for pakistanis if goes by kp’s statement in pas era pitches werw bowling heaven still overhyped pakistani wasim, imran,waqar despite consistently cheating, ball tempering can’t match Bumrah in stat or winning matches or performances in sena countries Bumrah>>>>>>Wasim+Imran

The difference is we’re totally comfortable with our bowling back then. I’m just happy I got to watch live our bowlers, their skills, their comebacks, their aggression.

We never started a media campaign about their stats or anything of the sort. It’s Indians that are always so insecure and invested in stats and “proving our player X is the best”.

Eg I have no problem admitting Marshall was better than our bowlers. But you say to Indians that any batsman is better than Sachin and see the crying that happens. The twisting of stats, the moving of goalposts, the gutter insults.

This KP tweet is an epic troll - well played sir

 

[mominsaigol]

Its is more tougher for pakistanis if goes by kp’s statement in pas era pitches werw bowling heaven still overhyped pakistani wasim, imran,waqar despite consistently cheating, ball tempering can’t match Bumrah in stat or winning matches or performances in sena countries Bumrah>>>>>>Wasim+Imran

 

[kron]

KP only echoed the opinion of many educated cricket fans and ex cricketers. Every batting record being broken in the post 2010s era must be thoroughly scrutinised as both the pitches and a much inferior quality of bowling in general have aided the flow of runs since 2010.

I generally subtract 10 runs from modern batters and 15 from their SR before I compare them with batters of 70,80,90s

When comparing with 2000s batters where quality of bowling was top class but pitches were much flatter, I only subtract 5 runs and 10 in SR.

Let’s be clear.
The piece just isn’t there. Shoaib, Lee, Bond, Lawson, Harmison, Edwards etc were seriously quick bowlers.

There’s nothing like spin wizards Warny, Murli, Jambo, Mushy, Saqi etc in the modern era.

Nobody like Curtly talk to no man Ambrose

No Wasim, Waqar, No Shaun, No McGrath.

It’s very easy these days

Wrong wrong wrong

Nope

Much tougher post 2010. Especially post 2015.

Sacchu kucchu and bacchu all scored plenty of flat tracks in 2000 era.

They would never average close to what smith achieved in his peak.

Bowling is far superior now compared to past eras.

Batting - well power hitting has improved but defensive technique is weaker. Big totals are getting chased. Never was the case before.

I would give bowling post 2015 the edge

And batting slight edge around the 2000 to 2010 period although that was largely a flat pitch era

Lanka and India scoring 800 runs and crap.

90s was extremely pace friendly so those bowling stats should be taken with a pinch of salt.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Wrong wrong wrong

Nope

Much tougher post 2010. Especially post 2015.

Sacchu kucchu and bacchu all scored plenty of flat tracks in 2000 era.

They would never average close to what smith achieved in his peak.

Bowling is far superior now compared to past eras.

Batting - well power hitting has improved but defensive technique is weaker. Big totals are getting chased. Never was the case before.

I would give bowling post 2015 the edge

And batting slight edge around the 2000 to 2010 period although that was largely a flat pitch era

Lanka and India scoring 800 runs and crap.

90s was extremely pace friendly so those bowling stats should be taken with a pinch of salt.

Unit > Individuals

If you look at post 2010 teams started having units better. like 2nd change 3rd change bowlers are still strong unlike in the past where 1st change was okay. 2nd change was often terrible. Most teams have a well balanced attack these days. THere is a reason England is still talking about 2005 series. That was the only time England had a good unit. After that not much.

Look at the same 2005. Australia lost Mcgrath for a couple of matches. Bam They lost to England. Loss of one bowler can screw you back then. India lost several still won in Australia.

 

[Bhaijaan]

Wrong wrong wrong

Nope

Much tougher post 2010. Especially post 2015.

Sacchu kucchu and bacchu all scored plenty of flat tracks in 2000 era.

They would never average close to what smith achieved in his peak.

Bowling is far superior now compared to past eras.

Batting - well power hitting has improved but defensive technique is weaker. Big totals are getting chased. Never was the case before.

I would give bowling post 2015 the edge

And batting slight edge around the 2000 to 2010 period although that was largely a flat pitch era

Lanka and India scoring 800 runs and crap.

90s was extremely pace friendly so those bowling stats should be taken with a pinch of salt.

Post 2000s, pitches have been flat everywhere on a consistent basis but the bowling ha deteriorated significantly since 2010s.

2000s era had major teams studded with great bowlers.

Smith would have had a tough time playing Murali, Saqlain, Wasim, Bond etc.

 

[kron]

Post 2000s, pitches have been flat everywhere on a consistent basis but the bowling ha deteriorated significantly since 2010s.

2000s era had major teams studded with great bowlers.

Smith would have had a tough time playing Murali, Saqlain, Wasim, Bond etc.

He would have smashed them all

Just like those batsmen would have struggled vs current goats like bumrah.

ABd even in his prime vs green bumrah had a bad record in tests. What are these guys in front of abd barring kalis?

Even sacchu bacchu doesn’t come close to smith goat.

 

[Golu-momin]

The difference is we’re totally comfortable with our bowling back then. I’m just happy I got to watch live our bowlers, their skills, their comebacks, their aggression.

We never started a media campaign about their stats or anything of the sort. It’s Indians that are always so insecure and invested in stats and “proving our player X is the best”.

Eg I have no problem admitting Marshall was better than our bowlers. But you say to Indians that any batsman is better than Sachin and see the crying that happens. The twisting of stats, the moving of goalposts, the gutter insults.

This KP tweet is an epic troll - well played sir

Are you sure you never said

The difference is we’re totally comfortable with our bowling back then. I’m just happy I got to watch live our bowlers, their skills, their comebacks, their aggression.

We never started a media campaign about their stats or anything of the sort. It’s Indians that are always so insecure and invested in stats and “proving our player X is the best”.

Eg I have no problem admitting Marshall was better than our bowlers. But you say to Indians that any batsman is better than Sachin and see the crying that happens. The twisting of stats, the moving of goalposts, the gutter insults.

This KP tweet is an epic troll - well played sir

yeah we have seen enough how much you glorify a bang average bastman who didn’t have even significant inning) King babar azamNot so long ago here every pakistani had opinion that he was second to noneI haven’t seen any garbage player get so much hype in cricketing history , Bumrah Deserves it he have stat impact +performance ,Greatest asian bowler and second to only malcom marshallwhole world acknowledges him greatest in this generation except Goat Babar Azam cricketer country fans

 

[TheSultan]

Are you sure you never said

yeah we have seen enough how much you glorify a bang average bastman who didn’t have even significant inning) King babar azamNot so long ago here every pakistani had opinion that he was second to noneI haven’t seen any garbage player get so much hype in cricketing history , Bumrah Deserves it he have stat impact +performance ,Greatest asian bowler and second to only malcom marshallwhole world acknowledges him greatest in this generation except Goat Babar Azam cricketer country fans

Lol smileys don’t win arguments son. Ask anyone on the forum, I’ve never glorified Babar Azam, I’m probably his greatest critic

Now get back in your box

 

[Romali_rotti]

Kevin Pietersen undermines Joe Root's record, says batting is easier today than before

Kevin Pietersen has sparked a new debate about modern-day Test cricket by stating that batting today is easier compared to two decades ago. The former England cricketer's comments came after Joe Root became the second-highest run-scorer in Tests during the ongoing match against India in Manchester.

Joe Root surpassed legends Jacques Kallis and Ricky Ponting among the all-time leading run-scorers in Test cricket. The England batter has scored 13,409 runs in 157 Tests at an average of 51.18. He trails only Sachin Tendulkar, who remains the highest run-getter in Test history with 15,921 runs from 200 Tests.

On his X, he penned out:

"Don’t shout at me but batting these days is way easier than 20/25 years ago! Probably twice as hard back then!

Waqar, Shoaib, Akram, Mushtaq, Kumble, Srinath, Harbhajan, Donald, Pollock, Klusener, Gough, McGrath, Lee, Warne, Gillespie, Bond, Vettori, Cairns, Vaas, Murali, Curtley, Courtney and the list could go on and on…I’ve named 22 above.

Please name me 10 modern day bowlers that can compare to the names above?"

View attachment 156394

KP only speaking facts here...


To top it off, Root has only 1 test 100 from 22 test matches in SA & Aus, which forever dented his legacy

 

[mominsaigol]

KP only speaking facts here...


To top it off, Root has only 1 test 100 from 22 test matches in SA & Aus, which forever dented his legacy

To top it off, Root has only 1 test 100 from 22 test matches in SA & Aus, which forever dented his legacy

Good Boy, Now say it again

 

[Romali_rotti]

To top it off, Root has only 1 test 100 from 22 test matches in SA & Aus, which forever dented his legacy

Mashallah

Another post you acknowledge, you seeing the light kid.

 

[mominsaigol]

Mashallah

Another post you acknowledge, you seeing the light kid. Maybe you are not a Madrassa level brain dead afterall..

Not acknowledging, I am asking you to repeat it again

 

[Romali_rotti]

Not acknowledging, I am asking you to repeat it again

Repeat what

 

[zarak]

a valid point for odis not so much tests