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Lord of the Rings Fans

Geordie Ahmed said:
Racism in The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe? :O :O
I was well young when i used to watch it so it obviously went whoosh - would be interesting to watch it again
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Not in the Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe, but it was pretty obvious in the Horse and his Boy. Obvious enough for me to pick it up when I was reading it then. However as I was unfamiliar with the western image of muslims, I thought hewas taking the **** out of Sikhs :))
 
Apparently Lord of the Rings is Bob Willis' favourite novel and film.
 
Daoud said:
Not in the Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe, but it was pretty obvious in the Horse and his Boy. Obvious enough for me to pick it up when I was reading it then. However as I was unfamiliar with the western image of muslims, I thought hewas taking the **** out of Sikhs :))
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I'd heard the racism accusation before but i couldnt place it in the Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe. What's racist in the horse and his boy?

LOTR is a favourite amongst racists as they feel its about the superiority of the white race (Europeans) whom they equate with the Elves.
 
Mercenary said:
I'd heard the racism accusation before but i couldnt place it in the Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe. What's racist in the horse and his boy?

LOTR is a favourite amongst racists as they feel its about the superiority of the white race (Europeans) whom they equate with the Elves.
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The evil country - Calerman or whatever it was called had people with dark skin, beards and turbans. The good countries - Narnia and Archenland had natives who had fair skin, blue eyes and light hair.

I dont think LOTR was too bad on the racism front even though in the movie the men who were on Sauron's side did look arab in nature
 
Daoud said:
The evil country - Calerman or whatever it was called had people with dark skin, beards and turbans. The good countries - Narnia and Archenland had natives who had fair skin, blue eyes and light hair.

I dont think LOTR was too bad on the racism front even though in the movie the men who were on Sauron's side did look arab in nature
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In David Edding's books the racial demarcation was very clear.

Their were 5 different lands which clearly represented Europe (or white nations) and they were ranged up against a huge land mass of 'the evil people' who were generally faceless hordes of what could be interpeted as Arabic/Eastern people whom served a cruel God. Their leader was quite noble (perhaps based on Salahudin) and was just a pawn of the evil 'God' character

At the time i didnt notice it as blatantly as i would know but in retrospect it's quite clear.

Also I was/am a huge fan of David Gemmel and in his Drenai novels (which are excellent) the race called 'Nadir' are the 'bad guys' and are a fierce Arabic or African people but looking back i'm sure they were meant to represent Muslims because the heroes were 'Temple Knights' or 'Knights Templar' as I now know them better. However the Nadir are portrayed as being noble and respectable in nature however their culture and traditions are what make them so hostile.

I suppose its upto us how we choose to look at it.

You can view it as racism if you wish or look at it as I see it. I feel since the works were written from a western viewpoint they incorporated western fears or mythologies of the time and that adds to the mood and mystery of these books.

Im sure the eastern versions of these stories paint the opposite picture.

In fact we know for sure that in our own Islamic tales of the crusades and other wars, the crusaders are the ones painted as the Barbarians beyond compare whilst the Muslims are nobler than noble.

Whilst we all know the crusaders werent the nicest people, its never as black and white as all that.

If you can get over the stereotypes and enjoy the story then it makes for some good reading.

Having said that reading some of those books again whilst being able to see through the stereotypes may end up with me getting angry as opposed to fascinated.
 
i think the time period in lotr was well b4 islam or christianity. so im not sure abt this racism issue related to any relgion. as far as the dark and white races r concerned that might be true but again if any writer who'll create a world, will most probably consider his own geographic or cultural backgrounds.
anyone here, who has a better understanding of the work can enlighten us!
 
robosapien said:
i think the time period in lotr was well b4 islam or christianity. so im not sure abt this racism issue related to any relgion. as far as the dark and white races r concerned that might be true but again if any writer who'll create a world, will most probably consider his own geographic or cultural backgrounds.
anyone here, who has a better understanding of the work can enlighten us!
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i think this racism issue is smaller than is being made here

tolkien did indeed consider his own background when writing the book and the mythology behind it because he moulded the concept of the shire and the hobbits and there happy go round lives on his Irish compatriots.

has anyone read the mythology behind the book?

LOTR was the grand ending to the mythology that Tolkien had created and it took him 30 years to mould the stories behind the final peice. An amazing amount of work and creativity went into his stories...he was scripting the LOTR in his school days of the 1920s before finally writing it in the 1950s.
 
Tolkien is from Birmingham - if he wrote it today you could say he based it around his surroundings (we know how us asians create ghettos) BUT since it was written over 50 years ago we can rule that out
 
z10 said:
i think this racism issue is smaller than is being made here
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I agree i dont think the racism should be made a huge issue as strereotypes are something every society indulges in.
 
I never read the LOTR books, but a huge fan of the movie. One of my all time fav's
 
Got the DVD boxset with the Super Duper Special Edition Extended Director's Cuts™ that last about 8hrs each. Absolute brilliant films, Viggo Mortensen is unbelievably cool and Samwise Gamgee is basically the Ranadinho of the trilogy. What a hero that guy is :cool:
 
Oh and JRR Tolkien used to go to my school way back in the day. I rule.
 
Big Mac said:
Got the DVD boxset with the Super Duper Special Edition Extended Director's Cuts™ that last about 8hrs each. Absolute brilliant films, Viggo Mortensen is unbelievably cool and Samwise Gamgee is basically the Ranadinho of the trilogy. What a hero that guy is :cool:
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he is well wicked - i havnt liked him in the films he has made since LOTR
I thought Gandalf was class until i found out he batted for the other team :31:
 
I have read the LOTR series and I even read through the appendix and read through the geneology of the Numenor line and all that. I read the hobbit, which was very good I think, but the backstory of the LOTR and its amazing ability to show small characters in world changing situations, thats what was great about it. I read the silmarillion and tried reading the book of lost tales but it wasn't the same.

The movies were well made I would say, but nothing beats the battle of peleanor fields in the book. Seemed like the movie rushed through it.
 
MCMLXXXII said:
I have read the LOTR series and I even read through the appendix and read through the geneology of the Numenor line and all that. I read the hobbit, which was very good I think, but the backstory of the LOTR and its amazing ability to show small characters in world changing situations, thats what was great about it. I read the silmarillion and tried reading the book of lost tales but it wasn't the same.

The movies were well made I would say, but nothing beats the battle of peleanor fields in the book. Seemed like the movie rushed through it.
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the silmarillion is a brilliant book

i love the way Tolkien plays on the weakness in the hearts of the Kings of Numenor
 
i notice how marooned has only made one post on his own thread ;)
 
Yes...I'm a fan of the movies and have read sections of the book since then. It's the imagination and as you mentioned the creation of an entire mythology that impresses. Though I'd like to have seen Saruman prevail in the end (somehow!). He did manage quite a speech before the end though.

First it got entraed and then it turned to racism and thus...
 
Marooned said:
Yes...I'm a fan of the movies and have read sections of the book since then. It's the imagination and as you mentioned the creation of an entire mythology that impresses. Though I'd like to have seen Saruman prevail in the end (somehow!). He did manage quite a speech before the end though.

First it got entraed and then it turned to racism and thus...
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only passages of the book?

read it all mian...if ur a fan i assure u it will be great

the silmarillion is the real book on the mythology...it traces the story that Tolkien created right back from the creator to the days of the Shire

a brilliant acheivement for one man to create a mythology that a whole race would have been proud of
 
I will, I've sort of selected scenes since I've seen the movie. But I'll read the whole thing at some point soon.

Lee cheeta hay thought he was brilliant. How many 80 year olds go about making LOTRs (and Star wars).
 
Lee was indeed brilliant

was perfect for the role

at the end, i think, although Saruman had fallen, he had made progress and someone would have taken that up

the industrial revolution i think was not one of Tolkien's favorite passages of history
 
Yes couldn 't be a fan of it.

progress to what?

Wiesey one can't really understand the movies (in the Tolkien sense) unless the book is read. There's just too much not there in the movies. Even though they were great on their own.

Supposedly Lee is a huge fan. He said he had to do it and reads the book every year.
 
Marooned said:
Yes couldn 't be a fan of it.

progress to what?

Wiesey one can't really understand the movies (in the Tolkien sense) unless the book is read. There's just too much not there in the movies. Even though they were great on their own.

Supposedly Lee is a huge fan. He said he had to do it and reads the book every year.
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very true

the way Tolkien shaped his book had a lot more intrigue and mystery about it

certainly the first book was a lot darker than the film

but then again, Hollywood does have this effect on most stories
 
Look, it was a fad, fashion - people wanted to come out and show their "adventurous side" blah, blah...."oh it's just like how I imagined it"! Yea right!

A story about a ring, a couple of battles and some gay little dwarfs does not interest me....
 
Naved said:
Look, it was a fad, fashion - people wanted to come out and show their "adventurous side" blah, blah...."oh it's just like how I imagined it"! Yea right!

A story about a ring, a couple of battles and some gay little dwarfs does not interest me....
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it is more than the battles, the rings and the dwarfs...

its the fact that tolkien created a whole mythology on his own in thirty years.

It took whole nations of the past to create mythologys and this one is as every bit as rich in detail as them.

This has to one of the greatest acheivements of the 20th centruy
 
z10 no one can exactly justify why they don't like a certain movie because everyone looks at it from a different angle. I too admire the creativity in there but then so does have the Star Wars trilogy but I hate it. Its just what things you pick from the beginning and keep focussing on those negative points.
 
entralinks said:
z10 no one can exactly justify why they don't like a certain movie because everyone looks at it from a different angle. I too admire the creativity in there but then so does have the Star Wars trilogy but I hate it. Its just what things you pick from the beginning and keep focussing on those negative points.
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we can't compare lotr with star wars. lotr is a literary classic and has so much worth just as a book. star wars, on the other hand, can only be classified as children comics.
when we talk about fiction, i have only seen such power of imagination (in 20th century writers) in gabriel garcia marquez, though in a different form and scale.
 
robosapien said:
we can't compare lotr with star wars. lotr is a literary classic and has so much worth just as a book. star wars, on the other hand, can only be classified as children comics.
when we talk about fiction, i have only seen such power of imagination (in 20th century writers) in gabriel garcia marquez, though in a different form and scale.
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you can't argue with robo :)
 
robosapien said:
we can't compare lotr with star wars. lotr is a literary classic and has so much worth just as a book. star wars, on the other hand, can only be classified as children comics.
when we talk about fiction, i have only seen such power of imagination (in 20th century writers) in gabriel garcia marquez, though in a different form and scale.
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A matter of opinion. To a man of science who knows the possibilities and boundaries of technology and human advancement in future will admire Star Wars more on its creativity and innovations. A man of history, adventure and classicism will praise Tolkien on his book. And I disagree about Star Wars being only seen as children comics, thats what I said its all about from which angle you see it, you have to immerse yourself in the story to fully understand what is why.
 
I think Star Wars originally started off as an epic space opera, it was simply a tale of love, family and fighting for what's right (read democracy/anti dictatorship) and the other stuff such as special effects and exotic creatures just made it more appealing to the younger masses but when it became a hit and Lucas decided to cash in on hype built up over time to a frenzy, he threw everything including the kitchen sink in his efforts to turn the whole thing into nothing but a special effects extravaganza, introducing space vehicles, battleships, creatures, aliens, devices and whatnot and totally strayed away from the original theme that made it work. No character development of interest or underlying themes, dialogue was pretty crappy, etc.
So the second series can be considered nothing but a comic book, the first one though was a fine piece of work.

LOTR on the other hand in my opinion is the finest piece of film making ever. The fact it was based on an intellectual piece of literature obviously helped but speaking purely of the films, I have to say it doesnt get any better than LOTR.
 
entralinks said:
A matter of opinion. To a man of science who knows the possibilities and boundaries of technology and human advancement in future will admire Star Wars more on its creativity and innovations. A man of history, adventure and classicism will praise Tolkien on his book. And I disagree about Star Wars being only seen as children comics, thats what I said its all about from which angle you see it, you have to immerse yourself in the story to fully understand what is why.
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Lotr and Star Wars are different media of art and can't be judged with the same criteria. However, i think that Lotr is a greater piece of art. This is because, despite the innovations, the central theme of star wars is the battle between good and evil, the battle between jedi and sith and, especially in the later 3 films, this theme was woefully undercooked.
The presentation of the later three films was also notable for its almost childish look. The characters were weak, and even in the last film, which was the best of the three, Samuel L jackson looked like he only had one facial expression. The script was also clumsy and rushed imo.
 
i have never seen any of the star movies but i was told sometime ago that the first movie and popular characters are based on a couple of legendry japanese director, akira kurosawa's movies (which i happened to watch last year). so if this is true, then SW is not an original work (as mentioned by cartman as well). secondly, it has also progressed like a typical soap based on director's convenience and popularity of characters. i tend to agree on entra's point that the series could be a source of imagination for a scientific mind, although i havent come across any such person. Most of the fans i've seen r younger ppl.
 
loved the triology, but the closest i came to reading lotr was when i read The Hobbit. pretty good book, i liked it.
 
PP lord of the rings fans thread

LOTR is the the finest literary work I've ever read.An epic myth.Easily better than harry potter or any other fantasy book out there.So any LOTR fans on pp? I m reading The silmarrilion atm.
 
TM Riddle said:
LOTR is the the finest literary work I've ever read.An epic myth.Easily better than harry potter or any other fantasy book out there.So any LOTR fans on pp? I m reading The silmarrilion atm.
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Big fan. But i think JKR is a better writer for modern readers. LOTR drags on a lot in the middle about Ents, Tom Bombadil and what not? Where did you get The Silmarillion?
 
An uncle of mine owns the copy.I tried to find it online but was unsuccessful..I agree with you that hp is more fun but LOTR is way cooler and has more depth to it.And this is coming from a die hard hp fan.
 
Tolkien set the basis of almost all modern high fantasy, id say only Terry Pratchett doesn't rip him off and to an extent GRR Martin

anyone of you read the Children of Hurin?

It was a good read in depressing kind of way, a bit like Oedipus Rex
 
I plan to read unfinished tales and children of hurin after finishing the silmarillion.
 
TM Riddle said:
[MENTION=113824]Nikhil_cric[/MENTION] Also have you read the unfinished tales ?
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Only read The Hobbit and LOTR. None of his other works. Honestly, in the last couple of years i've lost all interest in high fantasy especially in Middle-Earth Universe.
 
[MENTION=57355]pakistanigoneaussie[/MENTION] history of middle earth? It's a huge compendium of Tolkiens writings by his son Christopher.
 
Tried Rowling but found her prose so bland that I gave up after one book. Found her really derivative too. The concept of a bespectacled boy wizard with a pet owl was lifted straight out of DC Comics.

Big fan of old JRR, ever since I read The Hobbit back in the 1970s. Even thirty years after I first read LOTR, I can still enjoy the sheer lyrical beauty of so many of the passages.

It's a lovely restatement of the old Journey of the Hero story.

JRR set out to write a myth-cycle for the English - the Welsh have their King Arthur, and the Irish have their Finn Mac Huil, but we don't have one of our own.

Recently I found a web site which provides a timeline for the First Age and before that, while brought the Silmarillion stories to life. I was amused to learn that Galadriel is older than the Sun and the Moon, for example! She came into the world when there were two lamps to light the day and night, set at the ends of the world.
 
LOTR>>>>>>>>> HP series

Plz dont even compare... HP series are good in their own regard. Great fun to read.

But LOTR is a literary masterclass.
 
LOTR is not a smooth read though.

I remember triying to read it in Grade 6 and not understanding or following it much. It came across as dry to me. Watched the movie instead :misbah
 
anakin said:
LOTR>>>>>>>>> HP series

Plz dont even compare... HP series are good in their own regard. Great fun to read.

But LOTR is a literary masterclass.
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:)) literary masterclass, lol. yes, fantasy story to entertain teenagers and nothing for the intellectuals is a literary masterclass. rofl
 
But don't you think LOTR is kind of copy of JK Rowling's work? #JustSaying
 
There was a movie in 1986 called Troll. That movie's lead was named Harry Potter. Plus, there were goblins and witches in the film apart from obviously, a troll. #JustSaying
 
TM Riddle said:
LOTR is the the finest literary work I've ever read.An epic myth.Easily better than harry potter or any other fantasy book out there.So any LOTR fans on pp? I m reading The silmarrilion atm.
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what is the minimum age who can read the books of this series?
 
TM Riddle said:
LOTR is the the finest literary work I've ever read.An epic myth.Easily better than harry potter or any other fantasy book out there.So any LOTR fans on pp? I m reading The silmarrilion atm.
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That's the best book of the lot. The sheer depth of it is just mind boggling.
 
Haven't read the books, but LoTR Trilogy is my favorite movie! Tops it all.

One movie, to rule them all! :baelish

Can't get tired of watching it again and again :)
 
They got Aragorn wrong in the films IMO. He was too pretty. Should have got someone darker and edgier such as Clive Owen or Mark Strong.

Mind you, Gandalf was bang on.
 
Thats an insult to Vito Mortenson's awesome job. Kindly check out the scene in which he kicks some helmet or skull i guess when him, gimli and legolas are told that marry-pippin could be dead, he actually broke his foot while doing that but carried on with the take without showing pain. Perfect shot, the
 
IMO it would have been nicer had they shown more of dwarves and wood elves in the war of ring in 3rd age.Men are boring.
 
If you are really into fantasy then read Terry Pratchett's works, not just fantasy for teenagers, but high class humour. Proper literature.
 
CricketCartoons said:
:)) literary masterclass, lol. yes, fantasy story to entertain teenagers and nothing for the intellectuals is a literary masterclass. rofl
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What on earth is a great piece of literature if LOTR is not ... oh great intellectual!!
 
No point comparing hp to LOTR..HP is like your first love which you can never forget and which would always bring a smile to face everytime you remember it .LOTR is like your wife .Twilight is like that one night stand which you would always want to forget.
 
For me, ASOIAF is easily more enjoyable than HP and LOTR.

HP can get a little wooden at times with J. K. Rowling struggling to invoke the emotions she wanted to while the pace of LOTR is way too slow and sedate for my liking. Overall, a boring piece of literature.

The movies are easily better which is a failure of the literary work. Very rarely will you find the adaption to be better and that's not remotely the case with HP and ASOIAF.

The Hobbit and The Silmarillion are definitely more enjoyable, particularly the former. The latter tends to stagnate as well.
 
ASOIAF has the perfect balance and keeps you engaged. Won't deny the fact that LOTR has made me sleep many times but that could also be that I don't find the story particularly exciting or interesting.
 
As far as adaptations go, Game of Thrones is a much bigger improvement on ASOIAF than LOTR movies are on LOTR, assuming the latter are even an improvement.
 
lol at people who think lotr > hp

LOTR is good, but nowhere near as good as hp

brb watching a movie with no real magic
brb watching a movie where characters cant even fly
brb watching a movie where the mentor gandalf fights with poverty swords and a wooden staff which breaks easily
brb watching a movie where the mentor gandalf dies to a poverty demon whereas dumbledore dies only because he had to, and to the strongest spell
brb watching a movie where the mentor gandalf cant even teleport like 10/10 dumbledore
brb watching a movie where frodo is a poverty hero who isnt even the chosen one
brb watching a movie where frodo cant even complete the task we watched 3 movies for
brb watching a movie where frodo is so inept, the villain smeagol has to complete the job for him
brb watching a movie where the ring affects frodo so much he turns to a pansy whereas the horcrux affects harry moderately
brb watching a movie where the 'dark lord' is just an eyeball

nah bro im sweet
will stick to harry potter
 
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hamzie said:
lol at people who think lotr > hp

LOTR is good, but nowhere near as good as hp

brb watching a movie with no real magic
brb watching a movie where characters cant even fly
brb watching a movie where the mentor gandalf fights with poverty swords and a wooden staff which breaks easily
brb watching a movie where the mentor gandalf dies to a poverty demon whereas dumbledore dies only because he had to, and to the strongest spell
brb watching a movie where the mentor gandalf cant even teleport like 10/10 dumbledore
brb watching a movie where frodo is a poverty hero who isnt even the chosen one
brb watching a movie where frodo cant even complete the task we watched 3 movies for
brb watching a movie where frodo is so inept, the villain smeagol has to complete the job for him
brb watching a movie where the ring affects frodo so much he turns to a pansy whereas the horcrux affects harry moderately
brb watching a movie where the 'dark lord' is just an eyeball

nah bro im sweet
will stick to harry potter
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:facepalm: of the century...
kids who watch movies and think it captures the literary beauty of the texts
 
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