No Pakistan player in Asia XI for Bangladesh T20s (due to PSL): Ehsan Mani [Update Post#176]

[thelandofthebravepeople]

I am sorry, seems I missed this reply of yours. Bhanuka is a talented bat and a prodigious hitter of the cricket ball, why would I pick a line length trundler over him?

Rashid, Mujib are levels above Imad Wasim on bowling merit. I do not watch IPL so had to check records before putting together the XI. They tormented and toyed with batsmen far above Imad's pay grade. I am sorry but I can't take Imad's performance in UAE seriously where 140-150 is per score and Babar saves the day with his blistering 52 ball 70.

Mujib and Shadab are both playing in BPL right now.

Mujib: 6 games 8 wicket. average 14.62. econ 5.08. SR 17.2
Shadab 4 games 2 wickets. average 51.50. econ. 7.35. SR 42.

Add to that Mujeeb bowls in powerplay and usually opens the bowling.

 

[aloo paratha]

You gotta be kidding right? Please tell me you are kidding. Imad and Shadab aren't even decent for God sake. Padded their stats by bullying second string sides in UAE.

Are you seriously doubting Shami based on t20 ranking? T20 rankings are a joke, holds less credibility than my dog's morning poop. For example their are at least a dozen bats out there who are better than Babar Azam in this shortest format of the game.

I am sorry but the likes of Faheem and Fakhar aren't even cricketers in my book. We have higher standards.

Why are you acting like "your books" matter. Look at the stats, they'll show you what you need to see.

Shami averages more at a higher economy, compared to Faheem. I don't rate Faheem either, which is why Shaheen would be a much much better choice than both Shami and Faheem, he averages 20.5 against good opposition too.

Fakhar averages same as Tamim but at a much better Strike Rate.

So again, your books don't matter. Seems you're diluting your own XI with your hate for Pakistan.

 

[aloo paratha]

Over hyping ki bhi ek had hoti hai bhai.

Stats are overhyping then, not me.

 

[Test lover]

Haha imad ,Shadab are better spinners than Rashid ,mujeeb????

 

[Ronaldo7]

Haha imad ,Shadab are better spinners than Rashid ,mujeeb????

CWC19 Stats.

"rAsHiD kHaN"

 

[Hyperion66]

Shadab averages almost similar to Kuldeep in ODIs if we exclude one SA series and Chahal averages worse than Shadab if that one series is excluded. Not to forget Shadab has 50s in ODIs and is much better fielder. In T20s as well he has a much better record than Chahal who also played against similar sides.

Imad on the other hand is a much better bowler in T20s than Pandya and Jadeja and his batting is as poor as Pandya but better than Jadeja (Stats can be seen). Shami is a top bowler but nothing exceptional in T20s, based upon any stat Amir, Shaheen and Hasan Ali are better than him in T20s.

Other than, Kohli, Rohit, Bumrah and Kuldeep(Based upon stats as recent form isnt great) I dont think any other player is good enough to make Asian Xi in T20s.

If you really think the likes of Amir, Hasan, Shadab are better than Shami, Kuldeep and Chahal then I guess I have no other go but to give a statwise rebuttal.

Why would you exclude SA series when comparing Kuldeep and Chahal with their Pakistani counterparts? They toyed with a full strength SA side in SA unlike Imad and Shadab who built their careers upon minnowbashing. Do you Exclude Hasan's CT performance while evaluating him?

So anyways this is what Shadab averages against top sides in ODI

Eng:34.33
India:58.25
SA:40.38
NZ:28.36

Why do I not rate him at all? Because he is a typical minnowbasher

Hong kong:15
Zimbabawe: 17
SL: 22

Averages 19 in UAE and 30 overall, so not only a bits and pieces minnow basher but a home track bully as well.

A bottom tier team like Pakistan might value his batting but I don't see anything other than a part time bowler who can hold the bat.

Now let's see how Chahal fared against top teams

Aus:23.73
Eng: 111 (Pretty bad but he played all the matches in England)
NZ: 29.71
SA:15.65

So it is pretty evident from the stats that apart from the horrible average against Eng he did pretty decent to great against top sides unlike Shadab who was ordinary against all top sides.

Now here's the fun part unlike Shadab the home track Bully, Chahal averages 29 at home and 25 away which pretty awesome for a desi spinner. That terrible England stint messed up his average, he is a better bowler than that, leagues above overrated Shadab.

Now let's see what Imad's got in t20

Averages a mighty 4 against Aus, 13 against NZ and 9 against SA. Man this is so poor I almost felt sad for your team for a moment.

Pandiya averages 25 against Aus, 22 against Eng and 24 against SA, hardly impressive by his standard still much better than Imad. So I would like to know how his batting is "As poor as Imad"? Clearly you are either lying or made a genuine mistake of casually hinting stat to me of all people. You have no idea how much I enjoy beating people black and blue with facts and records.

Let's come to the bowling part

As I have been repeatedly saying he is a harmless darter who becomes laughably unplayable in joke of a pitches in UAE. Averages 13 in UAE which massively boosted his stat. A typical slow low track bully, worse than HTBs.

Pandiya Averages 26 in Australia, 28 in India, 16 in England and 32 in SA. Pretty effing great for a 3rd/4th seamer.

I don't even wanna dig into Kuldeep's stats, he is so far ahead of your mediocre bunch that i don't think I would insult him by even trying.

Shami hardly plays T20, it's mostly been Bumrah and Bhuvi until recently. But anyone with a keen cricketing eye and a sane mind will tell you that he is head and shoulders ahead of the likes of Amir. I agree he doesn't have a handsome stat but that is because he only played 8 T20 matches till date for crying out loud. If you think Amir is better in t20 based on stats, fair enough, I will still have Mustafizur in my Asia XI not Amir, purely on stats.

You are a much better poster than what you posted, I think you must have gotten carried away or let emotions cloud your judgement. If you really believe what you wrote then I am afraid another very rude reality check awaits you this upcoming Asia Cup.

 

[Titan24]

Never understood the hype Rashid Khan gets by many, he is a good leggy exceptional in leagues with many inexperienced batsmen but lets look at what he has done against the top 8 teams in T20s (Not even touching the ODIs inflated record yet);

-> Havent played a match against Aus and NZ
-> Went for 51 runs without a wicket against SA in his only match against them
-> Did well against Eng with 17/2
-> Averages 27 against Srl from 1 match and 22 against WI in 8 matches
-> Yet to play against Pak and Ind in T20s

If we exclude the T20 leagues' how has he done anything to be called a top spinner; his stats are inflated by 29 wickets against Ireland, 12 against BD, 11 against UAE and 13 against Zim.

 

[Hyperion66]

If you really think the likes of Amir, Hasan, Shadab are better than Shami, Kuldeep and Chahal then I guess I have no other go but to give a statwise rebuttal.

Why would you exclude SA series when comparing Kuldeep and Chahal with their Pakistani counterparts? They toyed with a full strength SA side in SA unlike Imad and Shadab who built their careers upon minnowbashing. Do you Exclude Hasan's CT performance while evaluating him?

So anyways this is what Shadab averages against top sides in ODI

Eng:34.33
India:58.25
SA:40.38
NZ:28.36

Why do I not rate him at all? Because he is a typical minnowbasher

Hong kong:15
Zimbabawe: 17
SL: 22

Averages 19 in UAE and 30 overall, so not only a bits and pieces minnow basher but a home track bully as well.

A bottom tier team like Pakistan might value his batting but I don't see anything other than a part time bowler who can hold the bat.

Now let's see how Chahal fared against top teams

Aus:23.73
Eng: 111 (Pretty bad but he played all the matches in England)
NZ: 29.71
SA:15.65

So it is pretty evident from the stats that apart from the horrible average against Eng he did pretty decent to great against top sides unlike Shadab who was ordinary against all top sides.

Now here's the fun part unlike Shadab the home track Bully, Chahal averages 29 at home and 25 away which pretty awesome for a desi spinner. That terrible England stint messed up his average, he is a better bowler than that, leagues above overrated Shadab.

Now let's see what Imad's got in t20

Averages a mighty 4 against Aus, 13 against NZ and 9 against SA. Man this is so poor I almost felt sad for your team for a moment.

Pandiya averages 25 against Aus, 22 against Eng and 24 against SA, hardly impressive by his standard still much better than Imad. So I would like to know how his batting is "As poor as Imad"? Clearly you are either lying or made a genuine mistake of casually hinting stat to me of all people. You have no idea how much I enjoy beating people black and blue with facts and records.

Let's come to the bowling part

As I have been repeatedly saying he is a harmless darter who becomes laughably unplayable in joke of a pitches in UAE. Averages 13 in UAE which massively boosted his stat. A typical slow low track bully, worse than HTBs.

Pandiya Averages 26 in Australia, 28 in India, 16 in England and 32 in SA. Pretty effing great for a 3rd/4th seamer.

I don't even wanna dig into Kuldeep's stats, he is so far ahead of your mediocre bunch that i don't think I would insult him by even trying.

Shami hardly plays T20, it's mostly been Bumrah and Bhuvi until recently. But anyone with a keen cricketing eye and a sane mind will tell you that he is head and shoulders ahead of the likes of Amir. I agree he doesn't have a handsome stat but that is because he only played 8 T20 matches till date for crying out loud. If you think Amir is better in t20 based on stats, fair enough, I will still have Mustafizur in my Asia XI not Amir, purely on stats.

You are a much better poster than what you posted, I think you must have gotten carried away or let emotions cloud your judgement. If you really believe what you wrote then I am afraid another very rude reality check awaits you this upcoming Asia Cup.

[MENTION=138508]aloo paratha[/MENTION] bhai for you too.

 

[Hyperion66]

Mujib and Shadab are both playing in BPL right now.

Mujib: 6 games 8 wicket. average 14.62. econ 5.08. SR 17.2
Shadab 4 games 2 wickets. average 51.50. econ. 7.35. SR 42.

Add to that Mujeeb bowls in powerplay and usually opens the bowling.

Thanks for the info. I was flabbergasted to see people comparing Rashid and Mujeeb with bits and pieces players like Imad and Shadab.

 

[Realromeo]

So all this Pakistani fans cursing, Indian fans thumping, politicians assuming is for some clash in schedule which is pretty normal and happened many times in past.

WE WANT BLOOD. This is dissapointing. Not entertaining.

 

[ahsan17]

Haha imad ,Shadab are better spinners than Rashid ,mujeeb????

One of your boys has played 3 out of his 45 games against the top 8 teams. Other has played none.

 

[ahsan17]

Thanks for the info. I was flabbergasted to see people comparing Rashid and Mujeeb with bits and pieces players like Imad and Shadab.

One of your boys has played 3 of his 45 matches against top 8 teams. The other has played none.

 

[Titan24]

So anyways this is what Shadab averages against top sides in ODI

Eng:34.33
India:58.25
SA:40.38
NZ:28.36

Why do I not rate him at all? Because he is a typical minnowbasher

If you look at the sample you have provided its small in comparison to what Chahal has played against top teams. Shadab has only played 2 matches against Eng and none against Aus, has a decent record against NZ and poor against Ind and SA.

Chahl averages over 60 vs Pak and BD.

Averages 19 in UAE and 30 overall, so not only a bits and pieces minnow basher but a home track bully as well.

What about home track bullying of Yadav while of Ashwin and Jadeja in Tests. Why is it that UAE is being considered an advantage with its slow spin but not Indian conditions with cobra spin?

A bottom tier team like Pakistan might value his batting but I don't see anything other than a part time bowler who can hold the bat.

Last time I checked Pak was no 1 in T20s; happy to rebuttal any claims by you or anybody regarding a false theory of others trying new faces while Pak didnt.

Now let's see how Chahal fared against top teams

Aus:23.73
Eng: 111 (Pretty bad but he played all the matches in England)
NZ: 29.71
SA:15.65

So it is pretty evident from the stats that apart from the horrible average against Eng he did pretty decent to great against top sides unlike Shadab who was ordinary against all top sides.

Shadab hasnt played against Aus yet, so Chahal has only done better against SA while averaged 60+ against Pak and BD. Against NZ both were similar.

Pandiya averages 25 against Aus, 22 against Eng and 24 against SA, hardly impressive by his standard still much better than Imad. So I would like to know how his batting is "As poor as Imad"? Clearly you are either lying or made a genuine mistake of casually hinting stat to me of all people. You have no idea how much I enjoy beating people black and blue with facts and records.

Again its a selection bias, Pandya averages 8 against NZ matches 9 against Srl in 7 matches and career average is of 16.

As I have been repeatedly saying he is a harmless darter who becomes laughably unplayable in joke of a pitches in UAE. Averages 13 in UAE which massively boosted his stat. A typical slow low track bully, worse than HTBs.

Not sure home conditions or favourible conditions are inflating the stats of Pak bowlers only and not others around the world.

Shami hardly plays T20, it's mostly been Bumrah and Bhuvi until recently. But anyone with a keen cricketing eye and a sane mind will tell you that he is head and shoulders ahead of the likes of Amir. I agree he doesn't have a handsome stat but that is because he only played 8 T20 matches till date for crying out loud. If you think Amir is better in t20 based on stats, fair enough, I will still have Mustafizur in my Asia XI not Amir, purely on stats.

We are talking about T20 format; I would love to listen to the expert Shami being ahead of Shaheen and Hassan in the format let alone Amir.

You are a much better poster than what you posted, I think you must have gotten carried away or let emotions cloud your judgement. If you really believe what you wrote then I am afraid another very rude reality check awaits you this upcoming Asia Cup.

India has 2 ATGs in Rohit and Kohli which gives them the edge in LOIs (Maybe a bit less in T20s but still will be there) and ofcourse makes them a better team than many on most occasions and good talent in Bumrah at the death and Yadav; other than that there isnt anything to write home about.

 

[Hyperion66]

One of your boys has played 3 of his 45 matches against top 8 teams. The other has played none.

Already countered this argument of yours, kindly read post# 218 when you get a chance.

 

[Titan24]

Never understood the hype Rashid Khan gets by many, he is a good leggy exceptional in leagues with many inexperienced batsmen but lets look at what he has done against the top 8 teams in T20s (Not even touching the ODIs inflated record yet);

-> Havent played a match against Aus and NZ
-> Went for 51 runs without a wicket against SA in his only match against them
-> Did well against Eng with 17/2
-> Averages 27 against Srl from 1 match and 22 against WI in 8 matches
-> Yet to play against Pak and Ind in T20s

If we exclude the T20 leagues' how has he done anything to be called a top spinner; his stats are inflated by 29 wickets against Ireland, 12 against BD, 11 against UAE and 13 against Zim.

[MENTION=148927]Hyperion66[/MENTION]

Your insights regarding this? Bowlers should be rated based upon leagues and associate level performances?

 

[aloo paratha]

[MENTION=138508]aloo paratha[/MENTION] bhai for you too.

These are T20 games, ODI stats don't matter.

This post is the epitome of "I'll use stats where it's convenient and ignore them where they disprove me."

 

[ahsan17]

I am sorry, seems I missed this reply of yours. Bhanuka is a talented bat and a prodigious hitter of the cricket ball, why would I pick a line length trundler over him?

Why would you pick Shami over Amir, given Amir's stats are far superior.

Rashid, Mujib are levels above Imad Wasim on bowling merit. I do not watch IPL so had to check records before putting together the XI. They tormented and toyed with batsmen far above Imad's pay grade. I am sorry but I can't take Imad's performance in UAE seriously where 140-150 is per score and Babar saves the day with his blistering 52 ball 70.

And they are levels above based on league performance only? What merit? League performance isn't indicative of international performance. Let them play international cricket then talk. You are only interested in hyping up non-Pakistani players based on league performance since they have no international performance to fall back on.

 

[ahsan17]

Already countered this argument of yours, kindly read post# 218 when you get a chance.

It's not a counter. You are using league games to make your point. You are cherry picking stats that suit you. The fact that your guys have barely played any games against the top 8 teams is far more important, at any objective level.

 

[ahsan17]

These are T20 games, ODI stats don't matter.

This post is the epitome of "I'll use stats where it's convenient and ignore them where they disprove me."

I don't think this guy is here to argue objectively. He is cherry picking stats, mish-mashing stats that help him, to come up with a cocktail that only suits his view.

 

[ahsan17]

[MENTION=148927]Hyperion66[/MENTION]

Your insights regarding this? Bowlers should be rated based upon leagues and associate level performances?

You don't even have to go that far. He's played a grand total of 3 of his 45 games against the top 8 teams.

 

[ahsan17]

Thanks for the info. I was flabbergasted to see people comparing Rashid and Mujeeb with bits and pieces players like Imad and Shadab.

"Bits and pieces" players who have played almost all their games against top 8 teams. You, on the other hand, are making Rashid and Mujeeb appear like they are legends already.

 

[ahsan17]

Mujeeb has different role.he bowls in PPs and has done extremely well wherever he has played including the IPL and BBL. His economy against WI & BD is less than 5 which incredibly good.

I am aware that Afghanistan is ranked above Bangladesh and West Indies & they have reached there only because of their spin trio. Remove them and Afghanistan would be losing to associates. It has only been after Rashid's debut that Afghanistan started dominating a side like Ireland and then owned Zimbabwe. Now with the inclusion of Mujeeb,they became even better and have reached no.8 in t20i rankings.

An the reason for not having Shadab in the XI is his current form.Even most Pakistan fans have wanted him to get dropped from the Pakistan XI because he hasn't been picking up wickets in the middle overs and hasn't made any positive positive impact for his side.

You can criticize Shadab's recent performance, but that performance has come against the top 8 teams. A tanking in form against better team is fundamentally different to really good performance against only bottom teams. Most players start looking good when they play against the likes of BD and WI.

 

[Ronaldo7]

View attachment 98028

CWC19 Stats.

"rAsHiD kHaN"

Thanks for the info. I was flabbergasted to see people comparing Rashid and Mujeeb with bits and pieces players like Imad and Shadab.

 

[aloo paratha]

Proper Asia XI:

Rohit
Babar
Kohli
Rahul (Would probably be Shakib if he wasn't banned)
Kusal Perera (WK)
Pandya
Shanaka
Imad
Kuldeep
Shaheen
Bumrah

Bench: Rashid Khan, Shikhar Dhawan, Mustafizur Rahman, Najibullah Zadran, Mushfiqur Rahim

 

[aloo paratha]

I don't think this guy is here to argue objectively. He is cherry picking stats, mish-mashing stats that help him, to come up with a cocktail that only suits his view.

Exactly. Where stats can help, he'll use stats, then when he looks another player who's stats are bad (Shami), he goes "Any sane person who's watched cricket should know player X is better than player Y".

 

[ahsan17]

Exactly. Where stats can help, he'll use stats, then when he looks another player who's stats are bad (Shami), he goes "Any sane person who's watched cricket should know player X is better than player Y".

And the best one of them all: league performance are as important or more important than playing against top 8 teams. My hats off, for going through the mental gymnastics to make the point.

 

[ahsan17]

You gotta be kidding right? Please tell me you are kidding. Imad and Shadab aren't even decent for God sake. Padded their stats by bullying second string sides in UAE.

Which sides were second string? Have Mujib and and Rashid even played against second string top 8 teams?

Are you seriously doubting Shami based on t20 ranking? T20 rankings are a joke, holds less credibility than my dog's morning poop. For example their are at least a dozen bats out there who are better than Babar Azam in this shortest format of the game.

Then just go by his stats. He averages 27.50 in T20Is which an economy of 10. Truly below average stats.

I am sorry but the likes of Faheem and Fakhar aren't even cricketers in my book. We have higher standards.

We are here to argue objectively. Your book doesn't matter when it comes to stats and performance against top 8 teams.

 

[Hyperion66]

If you look at the sample you have provided its small in comparison to what Chahal has played against top teams. Shadab has only played 2 matches against Eng and none against Aus, has a decent record against NZ and poor against Ind and SA.

I do not understand, what exactly do you want? First you said Shadab is similar or better than Chahal and Kuldeep when it comes to stats. Now that I destroyed that argument by providing a statwise breakdown you are saying he hasn't played enough to be compared with them? What Kind of straw-man argument is that? Your stature here won't be affected if you just acknowledge that you made a mistake and move on.

Chahl averages over 60 vs Pak and BD.

Shadab averages 45 against Afghans, so? When you have good stats against top ranked teams and a great overall stats, doesn't matter what you average against lower tier teams.

What about home track bullying of Yadav while of Ashwin and Jadeja in Tests. Why is it that UAE is being considered an advantage with its slow spin but not Indian conditions with cobra spin?

Another strawman. Test is the grandest format of cricket, you have to be pretty great to be a home track bully in test. Not only Ashwin and Jadeja, Shewag, Philander, Anderson, Warner are all home track bullies as well. Likes of Imad and Shadab are not fit to tie the show laces of the names I just mentioned, I can't believe you actually made that argument. When you do home track bullying in pyjama chap cricket you are bits and pieces.

BTW Kuldeep averages 29 at home and 22 away Which Yadav are you talking about? Umesh?

Last time I checked Pak was no 1 in T20s; happy to rebuttal any claims by you or anybody regarding a false theory of others trying new faces while Pak didnt.

Last I checked Pak got thrashed beyond recognition at home against SL of all teams. When you suck at two major formats and ranked no 1 in other it means sneaked your way to the rank while other teams weren't half as serious with bilateral t20s. For example Kohli started to appear in bilateral t20s only recently to prepare for the upcoming world t20. Now that all top teams going to take this format seriously again I fully expect Pak to come down to 5 or 6 in ranking. Just bookmark this post and wait for the Asia cup, you have no idea what awaits you.

Shadab hasnt played against Aus yet, so Chahal has only done better against SA while averaged 60+ against Pak and BD. Against NZ both were similar.

Good luck if you think he will do better than 23 against Aus. As i said averages against lower ranked teams don't matter as long as you perform against top teams and have a good average overall.

Again its a selection bias, Pandya averages 8 against NZ matches 9 against Srl in 7 matches and career average is of 16.

So what if he averages 8 against NZ? He did way better than Imad against other top teams. I am still waiting to hear how he is as poor as Imad with the bat?

Not sure home conditions or favourible conditions are inflating the stats of Pak bowlers only and not others around the world.

I already mentioned multiple times that the likes of Chahal, Kuldeep and Pandiya has better away records than home, that actually makes their stats even more impressive. While Shadab and Imad are typical slow, low, sluggish track bullies, which the worst kind of bullies.

We are talking about T20 format; I would love to listen to the expert Shami being ahead of Shaheen and Hassan in the format let alone Amir.

You should read properly before jump into replying. I clearly said Shami has an inferior stat in t20 as he played only 8 matches since 2014!! If not him I will still have Mustafizur to pick as a second pacer for the Asia XI who played enough matches in this format and hold a fantastic record.

India has 2 ATGs in Rohit and Kohli which gives them the edge in LOIs (Maybe a bit less in T20s but still will be there) and ofcourse makes them a better team than many on most occasions and good talent in Bumrah at the death and Yadav; other than that there isnt anything to write home about.

Shami has a fine ODI record and an out and out wicket taking option. WIth the likes of Iyer chipping in and rahul slowly finding his mojo I hope for even better days in ODI.

In t20 we have one of the most explosive line ups, Rohit, Kohli, Iyer, Pant, Pandya, Rahul all can bat at 180+ and hit sixes at will. So there are plenty to write home about if you have a unbiased mind.

It is pretty gloomy for Pak actually, your best batsman is decent at best in t20, not to mention lack of talent and star power.

 

[Titan24]

I do not understand, what exactly do you want? First you said Shadab is similar or better than Chahal and Kuldeep when it comes to stats. Now that I destroyed that argument by providing a statwise breakdown you are saying he hasn't played enough to be compared with them? What Kind of straw-man argument is that? Your stature here won't be affected if you just acknowledge that you made a mistake and move on.

Shadab averages 45 against Afghans, so? When you have good stats against top ranked teams and a great overall stats, doesn't matter what you average against lower tier teams.

Another strawman. Test is the grandest format of cricket, you have to be pretty great to be a home track bully in test. Not only Ashwin and Jadeja, Shewag, Philander, Anderson, Warner are all home track bullies as well. Likes of Imad and Shadab are not fit to tie the show laces of the names I just mentioned, I can't believe you actually made that argument. When you do home track bullying in pyjama chap cricket you are bits and pieces.

BTW Kuldeep averages 29 at home and 22 away Which Yadav are you talking about? Umesh?

Last I checked Pak got thrashed beyond recognition at home against SL of all teams. When you suck at two major formats and ranked no 1 in other it means sneaked your way to the rank while other teams weren't half as serious with bilateral t20s. For example Kohli started to appear in bilateral t20s only recently to prepare for the upcoming world t20. Now that all top teams going to take this format seriously again I fully expect Pak to come down to 5 or 6 in ranking. Just bookmark this post and wait for the Asia cup, you have no idea what awaits you.

Good luck if you think he will do better than 23 against Aus. As i said averages against lower ranked teams don't matter as long as you perform against top teams and have a good average overall.


So what if he averages 8 against NZ? He did way better than Imad against other top teams. I am still waiting to hear how he is as poor as Imad with the bat?


I already mentioned multiple times that the likes of Chahal, Kuldeep and Pandiya has better away records than home, that actually makes their stats even more impressive. While Shadab and Imad are typical slow, low, sluggish track bullies, which the worst kind of bullies.


You should read properly before jump into replying. I clearly said Shami has an inferior stat in t20 as he played only 8 matches since 2014!! If not him I will still have Mustafizur to pick as a second pacer for the Asia XI who played enough matches in this format and hold a fantastic record.

Shami has a fine ODI record and an out and out wicket taking option. WIth the likes of Iyer chipping in and rahul slowly finding his mojo I hope for even better days in ODI.

In t20 we have one of the most explosive line ups, Rohit, Kohli, Iyer, Pant, Pandya, Rahul all can bat at 180+ and hit sixes at will. So there are plenty to write home about if you have a unbiased mind.

It is pretty gloomy for Pak actually, your best batsman is decent at best in t20, not to mention lack of talent and star power.

Looks like you were already triggered before getting into the conversation.

So lets clear the things here, India is a much better team than Pakistan currently across the formats.

-> I never said Shadab is better than Kuldeep however, Kuldeep has been pretty mediocre lately as he averages 34 in 2019 in 23 matches. I said stats are somewhat similar and Shadab outperformed both Kuldeep and Chahal on the biggest platform that is WC so he isnt as poor as you are making him look like.

-> As said earlier; Chahal has only bettered Shadab against SA while Shadab is yet to play against Aus. Other than that I dont exactly know how is Chahal being rated.

-> In 20s Chahal averages 63 against Aus and 35 against NZ, 103 against SA and 19 against Eng. Shadab averages 21 against Aus, 19 against NZ and 43 against SA along with much better economy.

Its a no brainer for an unbiased brain who it will pick in T20s Shadab or Chahal. In ODIs both have been pretty similar except against 1 or 2 oppositions but Shadab with his batting and fielding is much superior. Its my opinion and if anyone wants to pick Chahal who is mediocre in T20s and provides nothing other than bowling he has full right to.

-> Home track bullying is home track bullying irrespective of the format, rather it is magnified i tests due to much more extreme pitch conditions. So arguing about T20 stats to be because of home track bullying is a flawed argument.

-> Its a mistake at your end that you only checked when Pak lost a series; you should also check the record consecutive series wins before that.

-> Coming to Pandya never said he is poor than Imad with bat but he averages 16 with the bat while Imad averages 13 odd; so whats the hype about? Imad is a much more superior bowler and his stats would show that. Again just because Pak players do well in UAE doesnt mean other teams dont have an advantage at home.

-> Againt pretty biased view regarding Mustafizur and Shami; Amir and Shaheen both have average 20 just like Mustafizur but with a much better economy and not to forget they havent played as many matches against Afghanistan and Ireland.

You look to be triggered today and giving extreme statements unlike you usual self.

 

[ahsan17]

You ignored the other stats I presented you about Shami vs Shaheen/Faheem and Tamim vs Fakhar, so maybe you're blind as well but what you really are, is just heavily biased, or probably just dumb.

Yup, I mentioned this before too. Amir is a "trundler" averaging 20 in T20Is with an economy of 7, but Shami is world-class averaging 27 with an economy of 10. Fakhar "isn't a cricketer" in his books, but averages the same as Tamim with a better strike rate. He's not here to argue objectively. What a waste of time.

 

[aloo paratha]

Yup, I mentioned this before too. Amir is a "trundler" averaging 20 in T20Is with an economy of 7, but Shami is world-class averaging 27 with an economy of 10. Fakhar "isn't a cricketer" in his books, but averages the same as Tamim with a better strike rate. He's not here to argue objectively. What a waste of time.

I'll agree that I was wrong when I said Shadab is the best spinner in Asia, I forgot about Kuldeep(I even fixed my mistake in post #264), but other than that I am being unbiased, and using stats to back up my choices, whereas he is cherry picking useful stats while ignoring those that disprove him, and then making random judgements on players like "If you watch cricket you would know...". Like make up your mind, either use stats, or don't.

 

[ahsan17]

Jesus Christ man!! You asked the same thing like a dozen times in a single page. I already gave my response to Titan and I do not like to repeat myself still i will do this once for you. Shami has played only 8 t20 matches so far, he doesn't have a very good looking stat that I agree, but considering how much he underplayed in this format and how much he is ahead of Amir in other two formats, is it two far fetched to predict that he will go past Amir in this shortest and most easiest format of the game if he gets sufficient games to play? You wanna say Amir is better in t20, fair enough, but if I am creating an Asia XI I will have Mustafizur over Amir anyday.

This is an objective discussion, not whom you will pick. You have clearly shown your bias, so whom you will pick doesn't matter.

Mustafizur averages the same as Amir but has worse economy rate. Not to mention, he has played a lot more games against teams below 8 in ranking. So can you tell me any objective reason why you'd pick him over Amir?

I am noticing a trend here. You are using your feelings a lot to make arguments, instead of being objective. "Not in my books" and "I'd pick xx any day" etc, and not backing them up with objective arguments (league performance is not an objective argument).

You are talking about as of they play with tennis balls in leagues, why shouldn't league performances be counted? If England can pick Butler in their test team based on his IPL performance then who the hell are you to cast doubt? League or no league Performing against AB and Kohli matters more than what you do with Silapama and Junior Dala. Both Rashid and Mujeeb troubled the bests of the bests of the world and turned out to be genuine match winners for their respective teams, which is more than enough. Although I must admit I hardly watch IPL myself, I watch clips from websites to observe and evaluate when I need to.

Then going by your logic, performance in first class and domestic cricket should count just as much, since players are picked in international cricket based on that performance. For every AB and Kohli there are 3-4 other walking wickets in league cricket. Its easy to inflate stats in such leagues. The most important thing, objectively, is that Rashid and Mujeeb have played almost no cricket against the top 8 teams. One of them has literally played none of their cricket against top 8 teams. The Pakistani players you are comparing them against have literally played nearly all their cricket against top 8 teams.

 

[Ronaldo7]

Lol another garbage one liner, Shaheen and Shami both hasn't played enough and I have explained multiple times in this page that I would pick Mustafizur over all of them based on stats.

I would surely pick Faheem and Fakhar if I create a clown squad or Hackers XI.

On what basis would you pick Mustafizur?

Use some stats to back up your claim.

 

[Ronaldo7]

View attachment 98028

CWC19 Stats.

"rAsHiD kHaN"

[MENTION=148927]Hyperion66[/MENTION]

You still haven't told me what happened to the GOAT Rashid Khan in the WC.

 

[ahsan17]

Lol another garbage one liner, Shaheen and Shami both hasn't played enough and I have explained multiple times in this page that I would pick Mustafizur over all of them based on stats.

I would surely pick Faheem and Fakhar if I create a clown squad or Hackers XI.

Again, whom you'd pick doesn't matter. We are not here for your blessing on objectively deciding who's better and who's not. We have stats to go by. Amir has better stats than Mustafizur. Fakhar is superior to Tamim, that much is clear on stats. Give a counter-argument based on objective reasoning or stats, and don't bother with those "I'd pick xx" arguments.

 

[Hyperion66]

You are not here to argue logically and objectively. Your posts are littered with "not in my books", "league performance is as important or more important than international games", "UAE stats don't matter", etc kind of arguments.

So can't I have a opinion? You got a problem with that too?

Dude we are talking about friggin t20s, chaddi cricket, the most sadkchap of all format, please don't act this puritan while talking about this format it is laughable. Performing against better players matters more, period. If you are up against the likes of AB, Kohli, Sharma, Warner and Russel in a league of course it matters more than useless bilateral.

UAE tracks don't matter in a sense that entire world got rid of sluggish pitches like that, they are to cricket what Ebola is to humans. When a pitch makes a harmless darter like Imad Wasim seem unplayable, records made on that pitch don't matter.

 

[BreadPakoda]

Proper Asia XI:

Rohit
Babar
Kohli
Rahul (Would probably be Shakib if he wasn't banned)
Kusal Perera (WK)
Pandya
Shanaka
Imad
Kuldeep
Shaheen
Bumrah

Bench: Rashid Khan, Shikhar Dhawan, Mustafizur Rahman, Najibullah Zadran, Mushfiqur Rahim

I would open with Rahul and put Babar at 4.
Chahal in place of Kuldeep.
Amir in place of Shaheen.
Rashid in place of Shanaka.

 

[aloo paratha]

I would open with Rahul and put Babar at 4.
Chahal in place of Kuldeep.
Amir in place of Shaheen.
Rashid in place of Shanaka.

You're gonna move the #1 batsmen in the world from his preferred position?

Shaheen has everything Amir has, with better pace

7 is too high for Rashid, need a genuine finisher, maybe Thisara Perera could also do the job.

 

[BreadPakoda]

You're gonna move the #1 batsmen in the world from his preferred position?

Shaheen has everything Amir has, with better pace

7 is too high for Rashid, need a genuine finisher, maybe Thisara Perera could also do the job.

Rashid is the #1 T20 bowler and you don't even have him in your team. I can at least move the #1 T20 batsman from his preferred position.

The logic behind that is that Rohit is at times a slow starter and Rahul can complement him.

Shaheen and Amir are both good but I will go with the experience of Amir, especially for the death overs.

Regarding Rashid's batting position - yes that can be changed and Thisara is also a good option but too similar to Pandya.

 

[aloo paratha]

Rashid is the #1 T20 bowler and you don't even have him in your team. I can at least move the #1 T20 batsman from his preferred position.

The logic behind that is that Rohit is at times a slow starter and Rahul can complement him.

Shaheen and Amir are both good but I will go with the experience of Amir, especially for the death overs.

Regarding Rashid's batting position - yes that can be changed and Thisara is also a good option but too similar to Pandya.

One became #1 facing the likes of Australia, New Zealand, South Africa, West Indies, England

The other became #1 from manhandling Ireland, UAE, Zimbabwe, Bangladesh

It's not hard to see the difference.

 

[Usman Chadda]

So can't I have a opinion? You got a problem with that too?

Dude we are talking about friggin t20s, chaddi cricket, the most sadkchap of all format, please don't act this puritan while talking about this format it is laughable. Performing against better players matters more, period. If you are up against the likes of AB, Kohli, Sharma, Warner and Russel in a league of course it matters more than useless bilateral.

UAE tracks don't matter in a sense that entire world got rid of sluggish pitches like that, they are to cricket what Ebola is to humans. When a pitch makes a harmless darter like Imad Wasim seem unplayable, records made on that pitch don't matter.

Guys, [MENTION=148927]Hyperion66[/MENTION] has the right to have his opinion. I don't regard KL Rahul or Hardik Pandya as cricketers as well. Doesn't mean this guy can ever change my mind, irrespective of stats. They don't even make their Mohalla XI as far as I'm concerned, as they will always be nobodies in my eyes at international level.

So yeah, let [MENTION=148927]Hyperion66[/MENTION] believe in his views and don't rip him apart like this

 

[BreadPakoda]

One became #1 facing the likes of Australia, New Zealand, South Africa, West Indies, England

The other became #1 from manhandling Ireland, UAE, Zimbabwe, Bangladesh

It's not hard to see the difference.

That's harsh. Rashid is a quality T20 bowler and a handy batsman too. Even Babar has mostly feasted on average attacks or teams that haven't taken T20 seriously. Only a few teams took T20s seriously in the last few years. That's why players like Kohli, Starc kept skipping games. Let's not kid ourselves. If Rashid's ranking is misleading so is Babar's.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

The series is to commemorate Shiekh Mujib-ur-Rehman's birth or death anniversary. No Pakistani player should participate in the series even if they were invited.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

The world 11 team that visited pakistan had players from how many test teams?

It was still called world 11.

There's a big difference. Asia XI is a very specific connotation since there are only 5 test playing nations in Asia. World XI constitutes every country from the West Indies to Australia. It is a very loose term.

 

[The cricket enthusiast]

as expected

 

[Pakhs]

As expected - I think this is fair enough given the occasion and circumstances. I wonder if Asia XI will take it easy against Bangladesh XI? to my eye its almost an insult for this Asia XI to play seriously against Bangladesh XI.

 

[Mesozoic]

As expected - I think this is fair enough given the occasion and circumstances. I wonder if Asia XI will take it easy against Bangladesh XI? to my eye its almost an insult for this Asia XI to play seriously against Bangladesh XI.

It's Asia XI vs World XI.

 

[Pakhs]

It's Asia XI vs World XI.

Ohh okay makes much more sense LOL - Where is the World XI squad?

 

[Ashraful_Rox]

The series is to commemorate Shiekh Mujib-ur-Rehman's birth or death anniversary. No Pakistani player should participate in the series even if they were invited.

Yep it's an insult to our Honorable Prime Minister. Good decision by BCB.

 

[sweep_shot]

Yep it's an insult to our Honorable Prime Minister. Good decision by BCB.

Dude, Pakistani players aren't playing primarily due to PSL. It has nothing to do with anything else.

Also, this is a pretty meaningless tournament. It doesn't matter who plays and who doesn't.

 

[Pakhs]

Yep it's an insult to our Honorable Prime Minister. Good decision by BCB.

But whats is the point of Asian XI playing? Surely to celebrate a Bangladeshi its should have been one team against Bangladesh XI?

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Yep it's an insult to our Honorable Prime Minister. Good decision by BCB.

Don't take it personally. After all one man's traitor is another man's patriot.

 

[Mueez]

Yep it's an insult to our Honorable Prime Minister. Good decision by BCB.

Can you tell me what wrong the Pakistani players have done?

Please let’s forget the past and work towards a better and prosperous future.

Imagine how idiotic it would look if French board would refuse German board to play a football series to commemorate Charles de Gaulle for example...

 

[sweep_shot]

Can you tell me what wrong the Pakistani players have done?

Please let’s forget the past and work towards a better and prosperous future.

Imagine how idiotic it would look if French board would refuse German board to play a football series to commemorate Charles de Gaulle for example...

Most Bangladeshis have moved on. Most of us see Pakistanis as brothers and sisters. Some old Awami League supporters may still hold grudges but young generations don't really care about past.

Pakistani players regularly play in BPL. There is no reason for Pakistani omission here other than PSL.

 

[Mueez]

Most Bangladeshis have moved on. Most of us see Pakistanis as brothers and sisters. Some old Awami League supporters may still hold grudges but young generations don't really care about past.

Pakistani players regularly play in BPL. There is no reason for Pakistani omission here other than PSL.

Glad to hear this!

I wish this series would have been two weeks later and we could’ve seen a very strong Asia XI.

 

[aukhan]

They should have sent players who were not part of PSL squads. I can name many who could have been sent to warm the bench.