Pakistan removed from UK's Red List for COVID-19 risk

[Barragan]

The price includes the hotel and all meals for 10 days, transport, multiple covid tests and permanent security staff. I highly doubt the government are making any/much money at all on it.

Definitely not £1750 worth!

A good hotel for 10 nights around £350 with breakfast incl. and other meals around £15-20 easy.

Most likely one pcr covid (£150) test and the other lft test which is very cheap.

Transport around £55.

Most likely around £700-£800

Definitely profitable.

 

[Mamoon]

Firstly, this is a very welcome decision. All countries need to put a ban on travel from Pakistan because Pakistani people are among the most careless and lax as far as COVID is concerned.

Pakistan is currently going through the third wave and it is worse than the first two waves. The mortality rate is also higher but the public doesn’t seem to care at all.

Every country including the UK has the right to look after the safety of its own citizens.

Secondly, those who are playing the victim card and complaining that the UK is playing politics, why do you think that is the case?

For 3 years, I have been hearing a lot of stories of how Imran Khan has improved the image of Pakistan around the globe and how the west now respects Pakistan.

We we are also told that the Modi regime in India has tarnished India’s image and they are now viewed as a fascist nation.

So how come Pakistan is on the red list with its much improved image rather than India?

 

[Local.Dada]

Great dual policy from the British government, India has much more corona but let's just ignore that. British government has always sided with India and a certain other country.

India has bigger corona problem if you measure in volumes, absolutely agreed but also India has a lot more credibility than Pakistan in these matters. That’s a fact that might sting.

Also India has if you just consider sheer volumes the worlds largest vaccine drive and from day 1 has actively put policies in place to fight this. There just wasn’t empty rhetoric of Cant have lock down or ghabraana nahi hai. There were lockdowns, vaccine diplomacies with other countries and other contingencies.

Sorry to say but the world doesn’t view India and Pakistan in the same lens anymore.

 

[Mamoon]

Great dual policy from the British government, India has much more corona but let's just ignore that. British government has always sided with India and a certain other country.

But I was told that Imran Khan is a greatly respected figure in Britain and Pakistan’s image has greatly improved under his exemplary leadership. What happened to all of that?

 

[King-Misbah]

India has bigger corona problem if you measure in volumes, absolutely agreed but also India has a lot more credibility than Pakistan in these matters. That’s a fact that might sting.

Also India has if you just consider sheer volumes the worlds largest vaccine drive and from day 1 has actively put policies in place to fight this. There just wasn’t empty rhetoric of Cant have lock down or ghabraana nahi hai. There were lockdowns, vaccine diplomacies with other countries and other contingencies.

Sorry to say but the world doesn’t view India and Pakistan in the same lens anymore.

However you put it, the fact remains that India is going through corona wave as we speak now. Furthermore, UAE, Qatar and Oman are also on the red list, their corona response has been much better then Indias. This is simply Britain favouring India yet again. So shall I also assume that the likes of Qatar, UAE have no credibility too?

 

[King-Misbah]

But I was told that Imran Khan is a greatly respected figure in Britain and Pakistan’s image has greatly improved under his exemplary leadership. What happened to all of that?

Your bitterness towards Khan will adversely impact your health. Your leader Nawaz is a chor (& incompetent) and everyone knows that. I know it hurts you badly.

Should I assume that UAE, Qatar, Oman and Bangladesh are also not respected in the UK? Learn how to construct an argument, patwari logic will not work every where.

 

[Mamoon]

Your bitterness towards Khan will adversely impact your health. Your leader Nawaz is a chor (& incompetent) and everyone knows that. I know it hurts you badly.

Should I assume that UAE, Qatar, Oman and Bangladesh are also not respected in the UK? Learn how to construct an argument, patwari logic will not work every where.

I will ask again - what happened to the admiration for Imran Khan in British politics and what happened to the improved image of Pakistan over the last 3 years?

Is that high fantasy drama over?

 

[King-Misbah]

Definitely not £1750 worth!

A good hotel for 10 nights around £350 with breakfast incl. and other meals around £15-20 easy.

Most likely one pcr covid (£150) test and the other lft test which is very cheap.

Transport around £55.

Most likely around £700-£800

Definitely profitable.

Astra Zeneca and Oxford University saved the UK, we had the worst corona response in the world. I was put into isolation over a false positive test result.

This is all a money making gimmick! First, let people go and then strand them abroad. This is not a good policy. I know of a poor family stranded in Pakistan, their quarantine bill will be £10500 and flights are like £2500 per person. Well done UK, we all need to raise our voices against these illogical policies.

There should be a blanket ban on all arrivals or don't single out countries.

 

[King-Misbah]

I will ask again - what happened to the admiration for Imran Khan in British politics and what happened to the improved image of Pakistan over the last 3 years?

Is that high fantasy drama over?

Stop your dramay bazi.

I have already answered your question, learn to comprehend.

 

[Barragan]

Astra Zeneca and Oxford University saved the UK, we had the worst corona response in the world. I was put into isolation over a false positive test result.

This is all a money making gimmick! First, let people go and then strand them abroad. This is not a good policy. I know of a poor family stranded in Pakistan, their quarantine bill will be £10500 and flights are like £2500 per person. Well done UK, we all need to raise our voices against these illogical policies.

There should be a blanket ban on all arrivals or don't single out countries.

Completely agree.

 

[HitWicket]

Definitely not £1750 worth!

A good hotel for 10 nights around £350 with breakfast incl. and other meals around £15-20 easy.

Most likely one pcr covid (£150) test and the other lft test which is very cheap.

Transport around £55.

Most likely around £700-£800

Definitely profitable.

It's £200 for an international travellers returning test kit. You've missed the cost of having 24/7 security as well as the additional cleaning that will presumably be required given it's clearly going to be a hotspot for positive cases.

Astra Zeneca and Oxford University saved the UK, we had the worst corona response in the world. I was put into isolation over a false positive test result.

Whilst I don't necessarily agree with you on the whole here, I'd be curious to know how you're sure your test was a false positive and how putting someone into isolation over a positive test is an example of a bad corona response.

This is all a money making gimmick! First, let people go and then strand them abroad. This is not a good policy. I know of a poor family stranded in Pakistan, their quarantine bill will be £10500 and flights are like £2500 per person. Well done UK, we all need to raise our voices against these illogical policies.

There should be a blanket ban on all arrivals or don't single out countries.

The £1750 is for the first traveller, it's £650 for additional adults and £325 for any children, their bill won't come anywhere close to £10,5000 and can be spread over 12 months. This is a risk they would/should have been fully aware of and willing to take when they decided their specific circumstances were exceptional enough to travel abroad for multiple weeks during a pandemic.

 

[HitWicket]

Whilst I don't necessarily agree with you on the whole here,

Disagree*

 

[Mamoon]

Stop your dramay bazi.

I have already answered your question, learn to comprehend.

There is nothing to comprehend because you did not answer my question. You merely sidestepped it and engaged in personal attacks as usual.

I know you do not have an answer and perhaps it is time to take you out of your misery, but I hope PTI supporters will learn from examples like these and overcome there delusions about how Pakistan’s image has improved under Imran and how the west now treats us with greater respect.

The reality is that Pakistan continues to have a poor image and has zero credibility. The world didn’t, doesn’t and will not take us seriously no matter how many songs Imran supporters sing.

 

[saeedhk]

Asad Umar is criticising the UK for this ban! Why can’t you guys fix your own home first? Pakistan has one lowest testing rates so the UK’s decision is fully justified. This victim mentality will never go away!

 

[Mamoon]

Asad Umar is criticising the UK for this ban! Why can’t you guys fix your own home first? Pakistan has one lowest testing rates so the UK’s decision is fully justified. This victim mentality will never go away!

After lasting for 8 seconds as finance minister because he proved to be utterly clueless in spite of being advertised as an economic genius for years, Asad Umar has spent a lot of time hyping up the positive image of Pakistan under the premiership of Imran Khan and how the world respects us now.

Another foot in mouth situation for this circus government.

 

[King-Misbah]

Again, you didn’t answer my question so there is nothing to comprehend apart from your straw-clutching and hold-digging.

Here is the deal - Imran might be worshipped by the white Brits as per your personal experience, but the reality says otherwise.

The reality is that Pakistan has been humiliated by the UK government and all the so-called admiration for Imran and the so-called newfound respect for Pakistan did not stop the UK from banning Pakistanis.

Yes, the governments of UAE, Qatar, Oman, Bangladesh etc also got humiliated. You make a lot of sense. The UK government has no respect for these countries.

 

[Barragan]

It's £200 for an international travellers returning test kit. You've missed the cost of having 24/7 security as well as the additional cleaning that will presumably be required given it's clearly going to be a hotspot for positive cases.

Yeah, it's still a pcr test!

The first test will test for any variants and the next 8 day one will be an lft, to make sure you are not positive.

Complete nonsense regarding the "International test"!

As for security, its basically the staff already employed and they are definitely not going to recruit new staff just for this temporary procedure.

You're very naive to think otherwise, hotels are businesses and run like one.

 

[King-Misbah]

It's £200 for an international travellers returning test kit. You've missed the cost of having 24/7 security as well as the additional cleaning that will presumably be required given it's clearly going to be a hotspot for positive cases.





Whilst I don't necessarily agree with you on the whole here, I'd be curious to know how you're sure your test was a false positive and how putting someone into isolation over a positive test is an example of a bad corona response.



The £1750 is for the first traveller, it's £650 for additional adults and £325 for any children, their bill won't come anywhere close to £10,5000 and can be spread over 12 months. This is a risk they would/should have been fully aware of and willing to take when they decided their specific circumstances were exceptional enough to travel abroad for multiple weeks during a pandemic.

My tests very soon after were negative, I have been in isolation for months and I had no symptoms. I am 100% sure an anti body test will confirm that I had no corona.

I do apologise as you are right about the second passenger etc. However, I know people who travelled due to ill parents so its bests not to paint all with the same brush. This is no way to implement a policy. The quick announcement with limited days till the 9th of April raised the airline ticket prices. People should have been given a lot more time, British citizens have a right to enter/abode in the country, extortionate prices will not allow them to.

 

[LongHorn]

However, I know people who travelled due to ill parents so its bests not to paint all with the same brush. This is no way to implement a policy. .

This.
A lot of people vehemently against international travel tend to be those with either 1) dysfunctional relationships with their parents/siblings, or 2) have their entire families living on the same street

They cannot comprehend that others may have sick or elderly parents.

People are testing 3 or 4 times before and after flights. If testing negative every single time is no guarantee, then nothing in life is a guarantee. Why single out international travel? Lets just stop travelling out of your street for the rest of our lives, lest we pick up some disease in some other part of town.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

I'm no fan of the tories but I don't have much sympathy for these people that are out there who will now be scrambling to get back before the cut off date of April 9.

They knew they were taking a risk as the gov. made it clear that any country could be added to the list at any time without notice. Pakistan being added to that list was always on the cards with the sheer number of people going there from the UK.

It was also clear that travelling abroad was only for essential purposes or the 'legally permitted reasons' as the gov. called it. Some travelled for weddings which was fine but the conditions to which wedding you could attend changed.

But we all know most were out just for a jolly. Now it's going to be very tough to get back before the cut off due to the flights getting booked up fast and the prices shooting up. It could come down to paying an extortionate amount for flights or the extortionate amount for quarantining in a hotel.

Agree with this. People who are still travelling to Pakistan in full knowledge of the current restrictions are obviously taking risks. I am not really interested in what the restrictions are for Indians, but not really bothered. I would hope that the govt would not be taking any undue chances with people travelling there and back, we can only get our own house in order.

 

[HitWicket]

Yeah, it's still a pcr test!

The first test will test for any variants and the next 8 day one will be an lft, to make sure you are not positive.

Complete nonsense regarding the "International test"!

As for security, its basically the staff already employed and they are definitely not going to recruit new staff just for this temporary procedure.

You're very naive to think otherwise, hotels are businesses and run like one.

Nowhere have I mentioned an "International test". I've mentioned an "international travellers returning test kit", i.e the 2 test kit that must be used by anyone coming into the country and must come from an approved supplier. These generally cost £200+. The suggestion that all these hotels are using the security they already had is blatant nonsense given G4S and Mitie were awarded contracts specifically for the purpose of providing security for this.

My tests very soon after were negative, I have been in isolation for months and I had no symptoms. I am 100% sure an anti body test will confirm that I had no corona.

Fair enough, clearly there's a reasonable chance it was a false-positive, I'm not sure that's really an example of poor management of the pandemic though. You tested positive, the sensible thing to do was to tell you to (continue to) isolate. Out of curiosity if you were already in isolation and symptomless why were you tested?

I do apologise as you are right about the second passenger etc. However, I know people who travelled due to ill parents so its bests not to paint all with the same brush. This is no way to implement a policy. The quick announcement with limited days till the 9th of April raised the airline ticket prices. People should have been given a lot more time, British citizens have a right to enter/abode in the country, extortionate prices will not allow them to.

I don't want to paint anyone with a brush here, but anyone who went abroad recently did so with the full knowledge that they would potentially have to pay to quarantine upon return and would likely get short notice of that given how quickly situations change at the moment. The allowance for delayed payment is there to avoid immediate financial issues.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Agree with this. People who are still travelling to Pakistan in full knowledge of the current restrictions are obviously taking risks. I am not really interested in what the restrictions are for Indians, but not really bothered. I would hope that the govt would not be taking any undue chances with people travelling there and back, we can only get our own house in order.

Most are coming back via Turkey, its a bit more expensive but those who reguarly go to Pakistan arent exactly poor people.

I think the UK is just playing politics, Tories dont know what day of the week it is most of the time, so to think they have some sort of magical data regarding Pakistan but not other countries is the height of stupidy.

Of course the usual Pakistan bashers are lapping this up like their cat licks cream from the floor.

 

[Kroll]

Politics aside, you would be very naive if you didn't think there was a possibility of this happening owing to the blatant disregard and flouting of the rules by those rushing off on a jolly to Pakistan.

As a result some put their Pakistan travel plans on hold in the last few weeks because of the risks and uncertainty. But many still chose to take that risk. Some of you may have seen tik tok videos of these people whooping it up out there while others are locked away at home back in the UK.

Unfortunately, many apnay banday have this selfish attitude and everyone else and everything can go and do one. So, it's no surprise they've been caught off guard. Now they will be flapping around like headless chickens because the situation has the potential of costing a lot of money.

You could plan to stay in Turkey for 10 days on return should you still choose to go. But who's to say restrictions will not happen with Turkey? What happens if Turkey ends up on the red list however unlikely or that they themselves put restrictions on people entering the country from Pakistan?

 

[Bi_Jamalo]

Politics aside, you would be very naive if you didn't think there was a possibility of this happening owing to the blatant disregard and flouting of the rules by those rushing off on a jolly to Pakistan.

As a result some put their Pakistan travel plans on hold in the last few weeks because of the risks and uncertainty. But many still chose to take that risk. Some of you may have seen tik tok videos of these people whooping it up out there while others are locked away at home back in the UK.

Unfortunately, many apnay banday have this selfish attitude and everyone else and everything can go and do one. So, it's no surprise they've been caught off guard. Now they will be flapping around like headless chickens because the situation has the potential of costing a lot of money.

You could plan to stay in Turkey for 10 days on return should you still choose to go. But who's to say restrictions will not happen with Turkey? What happens if Turkey ends up on the red list however unlikely or that they themselves put restrictions on people entering the country from Pakistan?

Uk’s economy is already down the drain thanks to all the ‘Little englanders’ who voted for Brex(sh)it. Now Torries are sealing it down for the tourism sector for the summer.

Why not introduce measures like Covid passports? Afterall its a scientifically proven thing.

Sad to see UK going down hill like this under the successive Torry governments and lack lustre Labour, who do not offer any better alternative.

 

[Barragan]

Nowhere have I mentioned an "International test". I've mentioned an "international travellers returning test kit", i.e the 2 test kit that must be used by anyone coming into the country and must come from an approved supplier. These generally cost £200+. The suggestion that all these hotels are using the security they already had is blatant nonsense given G4S and Mitie were awarded contracts specifically for the purpose of providing security for this.

There's only two tests, either you do the pcr or lft.

Clearly, they're fooling people with this whole "international travellers returning test kit" and making it sound expensive, but in reality it is one of those two tests because there is no other tests out there.

Yeah, they clearly were desperate enough to get approval because they knew they could make a profit, otherwise it wouldn't make any business sense.

Once again, very naive thinking!

 

[LongHorn]

As a result some put their Pakistan travel plans on hold in the last few weeks because of the risks and uncertainty. But many still chose to take that risk. Some of you may have seen tik tok videos of these people whooping it up out there while others are locked away at home back in the UK.

So its all about those feeling bitter that others are living life while they are forced to be miserable?

Who would have thought that normal stuff like meeting family, attending weddings and so on could elicit such outrage..... these people are testing multiple times, and doing home quarantine after return If they arent, let them be punished

This bitterness is not something new. There was a window of 3-4 weeks when Italy was in full lockdown, while the UK was free last March,
Every now and then you could see bitter comments from Brits stuck in Italy on how dare people in the UK lead normal lives while they were stuck in their flats.

A year later, the UK is actually doing better than Italy

 

[KingKhanWC]

Politics aside, you would be very naive if you didn't think there was a possibility of this happening owing to the blatant disregard and flouting of the rules by those rushing off on a jolly to Pakistan.

As a result some put their Pakistan travel plans on hold in the last few weeks because of the risks and uncertainty. But many still chose to take that risk. Some of you may have seen tik tok videos of these people whooping it up out there while others are locked away at home back in the UK.

Unfortunately, many apnay banday have this selfish attitude and everyone else and everything can go and do one. So, it's no surprise they've been caught off guard. Now they will be flapping around like headless chickens because the situation has the potential of costing a lot of money.

You could plan to stay in Turkey for 10 days on return should you still choose to go. But who's to say restrictions will not happen with Turkey? What happens if Turkey ends up on the red list however unlikely or that they themselves put restrictions on people entering the country from Pakistan?

People travelled within the rules, weddings were allowed and many in Paksitan get married before Ramadan.

You dont have to stay in Turkey, you can return via Turkey before the 9th and not have to isolate in a hotel.

 

[Last Monetarist]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">PIA has arranged 07 extra special flights between 02 April till 08 April to facilitate passengers returning to UK(London & Manchester).<br><br>Visitors are advised to make their way back before 9th after which UK’s new mandatory quarantine policy will come in effect. <a href="https://t.co/n4MFrcdgLj">pic.twitter.com/n4MFrcdgLj</a></p>— Sayed Z Bukhari (@sayedzbukhari) <a href="https://twitter.com/sayedzbukhari/status/1378400177006936076?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">April 3, 2021</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[HitWicket]

There's only two tests, either you do the pcr or lft.

Nowhere have I or anyone else suggested otherwise.

There's only two tests, either you do the pcr or lft.

Clearly, they're fooling people with this whole "international travellers returning test kit" and making it sound expensive, but in reality it is one of those two tests because there is no other tests out there.[/QUOTE]

They're not fooling anyone, you arrive from overseas and you have to order the 2 tests together from one of the (many) approved suppliers. My point the entire time has been that those 2 tests generally cost £200+.

Yeah, they clearly were desperate enough to get approval because they knew they could make a profit, otherwise it wouldn't make any business sense.

Once again, very naive thinking!

Didn't seem very clear to you 1 post ago when you were claiming that they weren't hiring any more security than usual... But yeah, clearly that's the case. After all, it's impossible that during a global pandemic a government may want to heavily monitor the entry and safety of those coming from a country seeing a massive spike in cases despite a pretty poor testing rate, especially whilst we start to ease restrictions. It's also impossible that they potentially have data available to them on a significant amount of covid variants in specific countries.

 

[Barragan]

Nowhere have I or anyone else suggested otherwise.

Clearly, they're fooling people with this whole "international travellers returning test kit" and making it sound expensive, but in reality it is one of those two tests because there is no other tests out there.

They're not fooling anyone, you arrive from overseas and you have to order the 2 tests together from one of the (many) approved suppliers. My point the entire time has been that those 2 tests generally cost £200+.




Didn't seem very clear to you 1 post ago when you were claiming that they weren't hiring any more security than usual... But yeah, clearly that's the case. After all, it's impossible that during a global pandemic a government may want to heavily monitor the entry and safety of those coming from a country seeing a massive spike in cases despite a pretty poor testing rate, especially whilst we start to ease restrictions. It's also impossible that they potentially have data available to them on a significant amount of covid variants in specific countries.[/QUOTE]

I'm just letting you know, that the tests are not that expensive and these two are the only ones available.

As for extra security, if a hotel spends extra on security then they clearly see a profitable opportunity, hence the point of this move being money making is bang on!

 

[Kroll]

People travelled within the rules, weddings were allowed and many in Paksitan get married before Ramadan.

You dont have to stay in Turkey, you can return via Turkey before the 9th and not have to isolate in a hotel.

I was referring to people that are still planning to go from now onwards as I know some that are. It could work out fine but its still very risky.

In regards to the weddings, yes they were allowed but this has been one of the main factors contributing to the huge covid spike.

Because of these mass gatherings, some people have came back infected while its helped spread it in some areas of Pakistan.

People working in the UK airports and airlines knew Pakistanis were taking the p|$$ hopping en masse on these flights with their 'legitimate' reasons. It was only a matter of time before the govt. shut it down.

 

[Yossarian]

So how come Pakistan is on the red list with its much improved image rather than India?

It's called economics.

A country with a population of over 1.3 billion, and the economic power that goes with it, is going to carry far more clout compared with it's next door neighbour with 1/6th the size of the population (and an even greater differential in the size of the economy).
Especially when the UK is desperate for new trade deals after Brexit.

Surely even you can see that.

Or maybe not.

 

[Kroll]

We shouldn't be treating the red list as competition with India. As mentioned, any country could be added at any time.

If the govt. assesses there is a threat of mutant covid from India, then indeed, it will get slapped on the list.

Watch this space...

 

[Yossarian]

I don't want to paint anyone with a brush here, but anyone who went abroad recently did so with the full knowledge that they would potentially have to pay to quarantine upon return and would likely get short notice of that given how quickly situations change at the moment. The allowance for delayed payment is there to avoid immediate financial issues.

Unfortunately a weeks notice is not short enough. With over a week to get back, how many of them will potentially be coming back covid positive, possibly with new variants? And then go on to infect others after their arrival?
The rules should have come into effect from midnight on the day they were announced, and not 8 days later.

 

[PakLFC]

They will be still Flights available but less.
People are paying over £1000 1 way to come to UK recently, prices have increased with high demands for Flights.
Best option will be get a flight to Turkey from Pakistan, stay there for 10 days then you don't need to Quarantine in UK Hotel.

I am more interested in going to Pak from the UK in May. I guess that will be problematic as things stand unless the situation improves.

 

[prakash]

https://www.dawn.com/news/1616198/asad-umar-questions-britains-decision-to-ban-entry-from-pakistan

Sources told Dawn one of the reasons behind Pakistan’s inclusion on the “red list” is that a significant percentage of those arriving from Pakistan tested positive on day two and day eight of their arrival in the UK.
----
UK doesn't believe the COVID test reports from other countries, so conducts it own tests. And they found a significant percent returning from Pakistan tested positive, hence added Pakistan to red list. So why is everyone saying UK is treating Pakistan unfairly.

 

[HitWicket]

I'm just letting you know, that the tests are not that expensive and these two are the only ones available.

These are the prices being charged by the approved suppliers of the testing kits.

As for extra security, if a hotel spends extra on security then they clearly see a profitable opportunity, hence the point of this move being money making is bang on!

The hotel have nothing to do with the security. They're government contracts, governments regularly spend money on things that aren't profitable hence why the majority of them are in debt.

 

[Last Monetarist]

https://www.samaa.tv/news/2021/04/pia-allowed-two-additional-uk-flights-before-april-9-ban/

The Pakistan International Airlines has been allowed to operate two additional flights to the UK ahead of April 9, when the country would ban the entry of people from Pakistan and three other countries.

Booking for the flights are open till 10pm tonight, according to a PIA spokesperson.

The UK will be putting Pakistan, Bangladesh, Kenya and Philippines on its red list due to an increase in coronavirus infections, the British government announced Friday.

The first PIA flight will depart from Islamabad to Manchester on April 7, the PIA spokesperson told SAMAA TV.

The airlines asked the UK government to allow four additional flights but it permitted only two.

 

[Technics 1210]

Have any of you actually read the definition of the Red List?

The ban does not apply to British/Dual nationals.

Plus there are no flight bans.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/...ist-to-protect-uk-against-variants-of-concern

 

[Technics 1210]

Excerpt:

From 4am on Friday 9 April, international visitors who have departed from or transited through Philippines, Pakistan, Kenya and Bangladesh in the previous 10 days will be refused entry into England. Only British and Irish citizens, or those with residence rights in the UK (including long-term visa holders), will be allowed to enter and they must stay in a government-approved quarantine facility for 10 days. They will also be required to arrive into a designated port. No direct flight bans from these countries will be put in place, but passengers are advised to check their travel plans before departing for England.

 

[ahmedzee]

We should've banned flights from UK to enter Pakistan last November/December due to the rapid spreading UK strain (which is now prevalent worldwide).

Just like how people were blaming China for COVID-19 and hiding the outbreak, can be blame Uk for hiding the Uk strain long enough for it to spread. I don't see sanctions from world community against UK.

 

[Last Monetarist]

We should've banned flights from UK to enter Pakistan last November/December due to the rapid spreading UK strain (which is now prevalent worldwide).

Just like how people were blaming China for COVID-19 and hiding the outbreak, can be blame Uk for hiding the Uk strain long enough for it to spread. I don't see sanctions from world community against UK.

Pakistan did ban travellers from the UK momentarily back in December once the transmission rate of the UK strain became evident: https://www.dawn.com/news/1597036

It's just that they didn't follow through with that commitment and reversed course.

The UK never tried to hide the fact that there was a deadly strain infecting people within its borders much as there were different strains in Brazil and South Africa, unlike China so there's no need for any public censure.

 

[HitWicket]

Have any of you actually read the definition of the Red List?

The ban does not apply to British/Dual nationals.

Not sure anyone has suggested otherwise?

Plus there are no flight bans.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/...ist-to-protect-uk-against-variants-of-concern

No flight bans but airlines are not likely to run many/any direct flights due to (what will be) a sudden drop in demand and additional restrictions such as only being able to fly into certain airport.

 

[emranabbas]

Have any of you actually read the definition of the Red List?

The ban does not apply to British/Dual nationals.

Plus there are no flight bans.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/...ist-to-protect-uk-against-variants-of-concern

Thanks for pointing it out but people are well aware of that what people are trying to avoid is quarantine for 10 days in a hotel costing £1750

 

[Shaddy86]

I'm stuck in Pakistan and have been trying to get a ticket since Friday for myself and my daughter. There is nothing available, whatever is available is costing me twice the price of quarantine fee, even that I'm not sure if these random agents are playing with me to get some money or they genuinely have tickets. PIA themselves have a very unreliable and untrustworthy set up, you spend 2 days at their office, do all the khuwari and then you're told sorry the ticket we issued you ourselves is invalid. I might in the end just up go to a holiday to Turkey or Spain for 10 days, I don't know how I could entertain a 5 year old in a hotel room for 10 days.

 

[saeedhk]

A very good measure by the UK government.

 

[emranabbas]

British government warned people not to travel out of country unless it's business or essential yet Pakistanis traveled to avoid lockdowns and attend weddings on top they have spread the virus in Pakistan I have no sympathy for those stuck in Pakistan. Definitely a good measure by the UK government and this should continue untill we have the virus under control

 

[emranabbas]

We should've banned flights from UK to enter Pakistan last November/December due to the rapid spreading UK strain (which is now prevalent worldwide).

Just like how people were blaming China for COVID-19 and hiding the outbreak, can be blame Uk for hiding the Uk strain long enough for it to spread. I don't see sanctions from world community against UK.

Uk government has always been open about its situation regarding this virus
It's down to the incompetent Pakistan government to stop people from crossing it's borders

We have been in lockdown since November and are not allowed to travel to diffrent cities within UK but Pakistan welcomed these effected people with open arms

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

I'm stuck in Pakistan and have been trying to get a ticket since Friday for myself and my daughter. There is nothing available, whatever is available is costing me twice the price of quarantine fee, even that I'm not sure if these random agents are playing with me to get some money or they genuinely have tickets. PIA themselves have a very unreliable and untrustworthy set up, you spend 2 days at their office, do all the khuwari and then you're told sorry the ticket we issued you ourselves is invalid. I might in the end just up go to a holiday to Turkey or Spain for 10 days, I don't know how I could entertain a 5 year old in a hotel room for 10 days.

You did realise we'd been in lockdown for a year right?

 

[Kroll]

British government warned people not to travel out of country unless it's business or essential yet Pakistanis traveled to avoid lockdowns and attend weddings on top they have spread the virus in Pakistan I have no sympathy for those stuck in Pakistan. Definitely a good measure by the UK government and this should continue untill we have the virus under control

Unfortunately, people used the lockdowns as a good excuse to go on a jolly to Pakistan. They stuck two fingers up at everyone and the establishment which isn't necessarily a bad thing lol.

The risk of something like this was mounting every minute since this red list was introduced. As the saying goes "the chickens have come home to roost."

 

[Last Monetarist]

https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/pakistan-flights-islamabad-london-red-list-b1828309.html

Planespotters in the Birmingham area have never seen anything like it: a fleet of Polish-registered Boeing 737s flying from Islamabad via Moscow to the West Midlands.

The trio of Enter Air planes making for Birmingham airport from the Pakistani capital are among the many unusual aircraft movements bringing British citizens to the UK before 4am on Friday.

That is the moment when Pakistan – and three other nations – join the UK’s “red list” of high-risk countries.

A traveller arriving after the deadline will need to pay £1,750 for 11 nights of hotel quarantine. Before 4am on Friday they can simply travel home by public transport and self-isolate for 10 days (or less, if a test taken after five days proves negative).

As demand and fares have soared, British Airways, Virgin Atlantic and the Pakistani carrier PIA have laid on extra nonstop services. But with thousands of UK citizens in Pakistan, and no indication of when the red list restrictions might ease, enterprising travel agents have chartered in many additional aircraft to take part in the airlift.

An Airbus A330 belonging to Air Senegal and operated by HiFly Malta has shuttled between Islamabad and Manchester five times in the past week. The website FlightRadar24 show the jet typically leaving the Pakistani capital at 4am local time and arriving in Manchester at 8am.


As the deadline approaches, more planes are being brought in – with airlines from Bulgaria, Iceland and Spain joining the airlift. Another A330, belonging to GullivAir of Bulgaria, is flying from Islamabad via Sofia to Birmingham.

Icelandair operated a Boeing 767 from the Pakistani capital to Heathrow. A charter from the Spanish carrier Wamos Air is scheduled from Islamabad to London Stansted. The last seats were being sold at around 300,000 rupees – over £1,400 one way.

Other services have operated from Lahore to Heathrow and Manchester, but planned flights by Qatar Airways to London appear to have been cancelled.

The Independent calculates that at least 30 extra flights have been operated in the week since the UK government announced Pakistan would join the red list, with around 5,000 to 7,000 arrivals in addition to the normal numbers.

Arrivals from Bangladesh, Kenya and the Philippines – the other three nations to join the list – are fewer.

Many of those travellers will be arriving via hubs in third countries such as Istanbul in Turkey, but the traditional Gulf routes via Dubai, Abu Dhabi and Doha are not feasible since the UAE and Qatar are already on the red list.

All arrivals to the UK must provide evidence of a negative Covid test before boarding the plane, and take further tests on days two and eight after arrival.

 

[Kroll]

Under 12 hours to go. The countdown has begun.

 

[Firebat]

Islamabad airport, on the last day before Pakistan is added to the UK's travel ban list.

<div style="width: 100%; height: 0px; position: relative; padding-bottom: 176.667%;"><iframe src="https://streamable.com/e/6sjgzu" frameborder="0" width="100%" height="100%" allowfullscreen style="width: 100%; height: 100%; position: absolute;"></iframe></div>

 

[emranabbas]

^^^^^
No social distance
Selfish ********

 

[Shaddy86]

Took me over 28 hours to get back from isb to London via 3 different countries on a chartered plane. Worst day of my life. Islamabad airport was hell today, no staff, no management.

 

[Yossarian]

Islamabad airport, on the last day before Pakistan is added to the UK's travel ban list.

<div style="width: 100%; height: 0px; position: relative; padding-bottom: 176.667%;"><iframe src="https://streamable.com/e/6sjgzu" frameborder="0" width="100%" height="100%" allowfullscreen style="width: 100%; height: 100%; position: absolute;"></iframe></div>

Absolutely zero sympathy. They shouldn't have been there on a jolly in the first place.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

^^^^^
No social distance
Selfish ********

More like just sheer dumbness. If the airport staff can't organise queue management during a pandemic, hardly surprising that the public are clueless.

Even more reason why no one with any sense should be travelling to third world countries.

 

[MenInG]

ISLAMABAD: Minister for Human Rights Dr Shireen Mazari on Sunday described including Pakistan in the red list of travel ban countries and the compulsory quarantining in the UK as an inhumane move by the British government.

“This is absolutely shameful. These people have paid 1,750 pounds per person to undergo 10 days of compulsory quarantine in the UK and are being treated in this inhumane manner simply because they happen to be of Pakistani origin,” the minister tweeted.

Dr Mazari said this was a discriminatory approach towards Pakistani and British nationals of Pakistani origin. “It is yet another reflection of putting Pakistan in the list of red zone countries but leaving out states like India, which has one of the fastest spirals of Covid cases plus a new lethal variant also.”

Mazari calls it a discriminatory approach

With these messages, she also uploaded a video made by Pakistanis quarantined in the UK showing the predicament of about 18 to 19 families. They complained that they were being denied food and their children having to eat cold food with cases of food poisoning. They also complained of having to fast without Sehri.

“We want food that is edible by elders and children alike,” said a Pakistani quarantined in the UK, requesting that their basic human rights should be met.

On April 2, British High Commission Christian Turner said his government was keeping its border measures under close review because of Covid-19. “It is being announced that Pakistan has been added to the UK’s red list of travel ban countries,” he said in a video message posted on his twitter account.

He explained that red listing meant that only UK/Irish nationals and those with residency rights will be “allowed to travel from Pakistan to the United Kingdom from 0400 (UK time) on Friday, April 9. Anyone arriving into England after that will have to book a managed quarantine hotel (room) in advance”.

While direct flights would continue to operate between the two countries, Dr Turner said he realised that this news would be unwelcomed by so many of the British-Pakistani community.

In response to questions about some of the reasons Pakistan was being included in the red list of countries regarding Covid-19 pandemic, how satisfied was the British government with the SOPs being followed at airports in Pakistan and if the British government could elaborate on the effectiveness of home testing kits provided to its citizens, the UK government said it was because of the large shared community that the UK was looking to limit the spread of Covid-19 among friends and families and taking further action.

The UK government said the decision by ministers to add and remove countries from the red list was based on latest scientific data and public health advice from a range of world-leading experts.

The risk assessments covered a range of factors, including assessment of surveillance/sequencing capability, available surveillance/genome sequencing data, evidence of in-country community transmission of Covid-19 variants, evidence of exportation of new variants to the UK or other countries, and travel connectivity with the UK.

Published in Dawn, April 19th, 2021

 

[Kroll]

More like just sheer dumbness. If the airport staff can't organise queue management during a pandemic, hardly surprising that the public are clueless.

Even more reason why no one with any sense should be travelling to third world countries.

Queuing is an alien concept in Pakistan whereas pushing, shoving, jostling etc. to get to front is the norm. Add to this the sheer number of people in panic mode trying to get from A to B, its not going to be a pretty sight.

But you're right, people shouldn't have been swarming in their droves for a jolly in the middle of a full blown pandemic.

 

[LongHorn]

Lets see if India is put in the red list in the next review

 

[LongHorn]

With these messages, she also uploaded a video made by Pakistanis quarantined in the UK showing the predicament of about 18 to 19 families. They complained that they were being denied food and their children having to eat cold food with cases of food poisoning. They also complained of having to fast without Sehri.

Same exact thing happens in the UAE's capital , and only to people of Pakistani or Indian origin.....
Added bonus is if you are single man, you are made to share rooms after your flight
Only good thing is meals are free, but may not be on time.

But Gulf Asians are so scared that they actually praise it (saying stuff like we are so lucky to get free food in the quarantine center)

 

[sjahmed23]

Some of my relatives in UK went to Pakistan to escape UK shutdown, they are all taking unemployment benefits aswell. Pakistanis dont give a damn about Covid lol then when someone in the family gets sick sub ki halat tight and government ki fault.

 

[emranabbas]

Pre 09/04 I know of a family friend who was tested positive for covid-19 in Pakistan. She paid authorities £50 to change her positive result to negative just so she could get back to UK

Uk government are 100% right to put this Corrupt country on the red list

 

[MenInG]

LONDON: Two High Court judges ordered the British government to improve hotel quarantine services in response to a petition for interim relief filed by a lawyer representing a British family of Pakistani origin.

Barrister Zahab Jamali filed the petition on behalf of a family of five that had returned from Pakistan earlier this month and had to follow a mandatory, 10-day hotel quarantine for travellers returning from ‘red-list’ countries.

Mr Jamali said the family at the Holiday Inn Express T4 Heathrow were served pork, not given food on time and did not have their towels and bed linen changed.

Travellers from Pakistan pay £1,750 per room for hotel quarantine.

An order made by Mrs Justice Lang DBE on April 16 to the Secretary of State for Health and Social Care Matt Hancock said the defendant should take “all necessary steps to provide larger rooms… permit regular outdoor exercise, provide suitable food at appropriate times and clean bed linen and towels”.

On April 19, when the lawyer informed the court that the government had not complied with the order, Mr Justice Henshaw noted: “I am not satisfied that Lang J’s order has been fully complied with, so as to address the genuine difficulties which the claimants appear to be experiencing in quarantine.”

The judge said it is not possible to justify a situation where the family has “insufficient food and insufficient chairs to sit on”.

It also ordered the government to act for the health and wellbeing of children and respect the families’ dietary needs as Muslims.

Mr Jamali said the hotels are charging hefty amounts and that it is “unacceptable” for them to provide poor service. “Many of the families in hotel quarantine don’t earn much and some of them are on benefits. This means that they have to repay the hotel charges to the government on a 12-month installment,” he told Dawn.

He spoke of a separate family of two who had £50 and £10 pounds each left in their bank accounts. “How will this family even pay those installments?”

Separately, traveller Asim Bilal, who is in quarantine with his family at the Mercure London Heathrow Hotel, told Dawn his family’s requests for bottled water were “turned down by hotel staff”.

The father of two, who works at a KFC restaurant, said his wife and children are not served food for hours and requests to the hotel end in vain.

“When we ask for milk for our child, it shows up after hours in a small glass the size of a coffee cup,” he said.

Mr Bilal shared a harrowing account of how a nurse at the hospital took pity on his wife and intervened to provide food to his children after repeated requests were ignored by the hotel staff.

The UK government added Pakistan to the ‘red list’ of countries effective April 9, in an effort to strengthen virus prevention as the country enters a phased reopening.

Published in Dawn, April 23rd, 2021

 

[LongHorn]

Some people have lost all perspective

By all means, make people do hotel quarantine if needed. But giving milk for a child after hours is not right.

We should not be treating travelers like criminals and treat them the way we treat a murderer or robber

If you have your entire family with you and so dont give a damn about those who have elderly parents or even kids in other continents, then remember the wheels of fortune turn

Maybe decades later you will be the one longing to see your children in old age but wont be able to because of some other dystopian system which treats travelers like criminals.
And then you will remember your holier than thou comments and your cheering for locking travelers up for daring to "travel during a pandemic"

 

[LongHorn]

After Saudia imposed many exorbitant visa fees in 2018,many expat desis sent their wives or kids back to the Subcontinent.
Not just blue collar workers, but even many white collar engineers etc did the same ,however they would visit their countries twice a year to see their spouse/children. Or bring their family to Saudi during Ramadan

For some reason for many months Saudi have stopped all flights from India Pakistan and 18 other states including UAE, USA , UK (Bangladesh somehow was still allowed flights)

As such many people have not seen families for 1-2 years , putting immense emotional stress

Others got stuck in their countries. This is inhumane, even Kuwait does similar stuff

At least the UAE allows people to travel back home.

 

[MenInG]

On April 3, when British government decided to put Pakistan on the red list of travel restrictions due to surge in Covid-19 cases, Asad Umar, the head of National Command and Operation Center (NCOC), took to Twitter to question the move, asking if it was based on science or foreign policy.

Even some Muslim members of the UK parliament called into question the decision, insisting that it was discriminatory and not data driven.

The criticism stemmed from the fact that some other countries including India –which now has also been put on the red list – and some European countries had far worse situations in terms of Covid-19 than Pakistan but they had not been put on the red list.

The move had raised suspicion that the British government might have other motives behind putting restrictions on Pakistan.

However, over two weeks after the imposition of the ban, UK High Commissioner Christian Turner has given a detailed explanation and even challenged myths doing the rounds about the red listing.

“This was not a political decision. This was not about politics,” Turner told The Express Tribune in an exclusive interview at his residence in the Diplomatic Enclave. “The decision was based on data and evidence collected not here in Pakistan but in the UK.”

He said the UK tests all arrivals from every country on the second day and the eighth day 8 – a practice that provides it with data. “If this was just about the disease in the country you would simply look at the country which is most affected in the world and put them on and this would not include Pakistan.”

Turner gave three specific reasons as to why Pakistan was put on the red list.

“Firstly, Pakistan was the largest single source of international air travelers into the UK in March; Secondly, Covid positivity amongst those travelers from Pakistan was high – a higher than average percentage of them were testing positive in that day-2 tests.

“Thirdly, our testing showed that some variants of concerns were those variants that we are worried about but were present in passengers from Pakistan including the South African one.”

The British envoy stressed that the decision to place any country on the red list had nothing to do with a Covid situation in a country.

“I can look at the data [to find out] how many cases [have emerged] in Somalia; how many cases in India and how many cases in Pakistan. What concerns us is the traveler to the UK.

“And that’s why we are not relying on the Covid-19 data from Somalia or anywhere else. It’s the numbers that are coming to the UK.”

He strongly dismissed the perception that the decision was meant to punish Pakistan. “There is sort of undertone somehow this is about punishing the country. No, it is not true.”

Turner assured that the red listing does not mean diminishing of what he described as “UK-Pakistan Dosti.” “You accept my headline that this is not political. There is no diminishing of the very close ties and affection between the UK and Pakistan and the UK-Pak dosti,” he remarked.

He said the UK is helping Pakistan in securing the vaccines and helping its healthcare capability. “We have turned about 20 million pounds aid to help Pakistan fight Covid-19.”

When asked, the envoy said he could not give any timeline regarding the lifting of the ban on Pakistan. As a high commissioner, he said he would be “happier’ if Pakistan was removed from the list sooner.

Nawaz Sharif extradition

Last week when Minister for Interior Sheikh Rashid met the British high commissioner, he brought up the issue of bringing back three-time former prime minister Nawaz Sharif from the UK. The Interior minister’s statement suggested that the British envoy’s response was not positive.

When asked about the possibility of Nawaz Sharif being extradited to Pakistan, Turner said under the UK immigration laws he was not authorized to talk about individual cases.

But he then went on to explain how the Pakistan government could secure the extradition of the former prime minister. “The UK and Pakistan do not currently have an extradition treaty and I have said before on the record I will be very pleased to see those negotiations concluded,” he said.

He said extradition of any individual was possible “even without a treaty” provided that Pakistan put a formal request for that.

“So there is a mechanism, called extradition as you can ask questions you can make affidavits but under the UK law and under the Pakistani law the only way two countries can formally request an individual to come back is an extradition request.”

“If an extradition request is made then we will respond absolutely accordingly,” the British high commissioner said. He, however, added that the Pakistani government has not yet formally made a request for the extradition of Nawaz.

“My message on this has not changed. I have said many, many times to many people: we play things with a straight bat; we play by the rule of law – no sweep shots, no googlies, no funny business. We will play this according to our immigration laws with a straight bat,” he stressed.

Kashmir issue

Britain has been historically part of the overt and covert efforts to seek rapprochement between Pakistan and India. Some even believe that it has a moral obligation to help resolve the longstanding Kashmir dispute because it was Britain’s wrong policies that never let India and Pakistan become friends.

As tensions between Pakistan and India eased in recent months, there have been speculations that other than the UAE, the UK is also involved behind the scene to seek de-escalation in tensions between the two nuclear-armed neighbours.

When asked a specific question as to whether the UK was involved in quiet diplomacy, the British high commissioner opted not to respond. However, he went on to say that there was no secret that the UK has been advocating for dialogue between the two countries.

“We have always been clear that Kashmir must be resolved between India and Pakistan in accordance with the wishes of the Kashmiri people,” he said, adding that the people of Kashmir are party to this long standing dispute.

Turner said he and his counterpart in New Delhi have always said: “Please find channels to talk to each other”. According to him, confrontation along the Line of Control (LoC) – the de facto border dividing the disputed Himalayan valley of Kashmir – is in neither country’s strategic interest.

No military solution of Afghan issue

As the US administration announced a withdrawal plan from Afghanistan, there has been concern that Afghanistan may slip into yet another cycle of civil war. Britain also has troops in Afghanistan, which according to the British high commissioner, would leave along with the US troops.

Turner was of the view that like Pakistan, the UK was also absolutely clear that there is no military solution to the Afghan conflict.

“All the parties in Afghanistan have got to come together now because the alternative is civil war; further suffering for the people of Afghanistan and further instability for the region and in the neighborhood – something that none of us wants.”

He agreed that the next few months are crucial to determine the future of Afghanistan, stressing that all the Afghan stakeholders would seize the historic opportunity for putting an end to the war.

He acknowledged Pakistan’s role in the Afghan peace efforts and dismissed the notion that the country is supporting the Afghan Taliban to achieve its strategic interests. Turner said he found the Pakistani leadership ‘deeply committed’ to the Afghan peace process.

Bilateral ties

The bilateral trade between the UK and Pakistan is currently around 2.8 billion pounds and one of the big agendas of the current high commissioner is to increase trade, jobs and economic growth. “The potential is absolutely enormous,” Turner said when asked about the prospects of bilateral trade.

“I think you would have talked to many of my predecessors and they would have talked about security.

“I am saying unapologetically that the success for the UK and Pakistan in our relationship is around the economy and trade. Our current bilateral trade is about 3 billion pound a year. We would like to double that. I think that is entirely achievable,” he said.

He identified renewable energy, health care and education as some of the potential sectors where British companies could come and invest since they have expertise in those areas.

He said the British government also has a “credit guarantee facility” to offer “cheap loans” to companies doing business between the two countries. “So for Pakistani businessmen only need a 20% deal to link back to the UK and they can apply for these loans.”

Unlike the US, British government is also keen to become a part of the China Pakistan Economic Corridor (CPEC). The British high commissioner travelled to Gwadar to get the firsthand account and explore the prospects of the British companies investing in CPEC.

“I would be pleased to see British companies investing in CPEC,” he said.

However, he had a word of caution: “There is danger that sometimes we talk about things like CPEC if it is the great game and its territory and the influence is being carved up.”

“Pakistan needs investment if that investment is being done in a way that benefits Pakistan.

“In terms of CPEC that means things like good labour laws; skills are being transferred, environment terms are being met, the debt structure is positive not punitive. Why should any other country object? We want to be part of that.”

“I have been clear if it is done in the right way I think CPEC would benefit Pakistan and I like the UK to be a part of that,” he said. “It does not have to be binary choices.”

He said Pakistan has longstanding ties with China.

“So all countries have to deal and engage with China which is going to become third of the global economy right in the middle of the century. Pakistan as a neighbor will have to do the same. Why Pakistan should have to make binary choices between that and other countries.”

England cricket team tour

The British high commissioner, who himself is a keen cricket fan, confirmed that the England cricket team would undertake the first official tour to Pakistan since 2008 to play three T20 internationals in October. England women's cricket team would also visit Pakistan, he added.

“In the autumn of 2022, the England cricket team is planning to undertake a full bilateral tour that will include test, one-days and T20 international matches,” the British high commissioner said.

https://tribune.com.pk/story/2296738/red-listing-pakistan-not-punishment-uk-envoy

 

[Mamoon]

It's called economics.

A country with a population of over 1.3 billion, and the economic power that goes with it, is going to carry far more clout compared with it's next door neighbour with 1/6th the size of the population (and an even greater differential in the size of the economy).
Especially when the UK is desperate for new trade deals after Brexit.

Surely even you can see that.

Or maybe not.

I knew this post won’t age well.

India finds itself on the UK red list now. What happened to the “economics”?

Maybe you will put a new spin on it now,

Or maybe not.

 

[Yossarian]

I knew this post won’t age well.

India finds itself on the UK red list now. What happened to the “economics”?

Maybe you will put a new spin on it now,

Or maybe not.

Boris only went ahead with it because of pressure from the media. You're not in the UK so you wouldn't know.
There are two very powerful tv programmes, called Newsnight (shown on BBC every evening) and the Andrew Marr show on Sunday mornings, along with it's equivalents on ITV and Sky News, where time and again senior politicians from the Tory govt cabinet were grilled as to why India was not on the last. In the end, Boris was forced to cancel his own trip to India as well as imposing the travel ban.

However, the economic factor hasn't gone away. But in your constant vilification of Pakistan and praise of India, the economic factor vis-a-vis India's economic clout due to it's massive population size is something that doesn't appear to register with you.

 

[Yossarian]

Mr Jamali said the hotels are charging hefty amounts and that it is “unacceptable” for them to provide poor service. “Many of the families in hotel quarantine don’t earn much and some of them are on benefits. This means that they have to repay the hotel charges to the government on a 12-month installment,” he told Dawn.

So they had the money to travel to Pakistan in the first place despite being on benefits.
And then, presumably, continue claiming the benefits whilst in Pakistan (a common practice those on benefits and then travelling to Pakistan, India, Bangladesh etc).

Note: Whilst you're allowed to claim benefits when abroad, not only do you need to inform the relevant benefits authority, but there's only certain countries that you can travel to and still claim benefits whilst there. Pakistan, India, Bangladesh are not on that list. ie You can't continue to claim benefits whilst you're in those countries.

Why should UK tax payers be paying benefits to these benefits claimers holidaying in Pakistan or India or Bangladesh ...

 

[Yossarian]

Some of my relatives in UK went to Pakistan to escape UK shutdown, they are all taking unemployment benefits aswell. Pakistanis dont give a damn about Covid lol then when someone in the family gets sick sub ki halat tight and government ki fault.

So they were also breaking the law by scrounging on all the UK tax payers.

Pakistan is not one of the countries on the list that you can travel to and still keep on claiming benefits whilst you were there.

They should be prosecuted for benefit fraud upon their return.

 

[MenInG]

Yvette Cooper, the Labour MP who chairs parliament's Home Affairs Committee, has criticised the delays in putting India on the government's travel-ban "red list".

"Why did PM not put India on the red list 2 weeks earlier when Pakistan and Bangladesh were added to red list? And why did they then delay a further 4 days to implement?" she tweeted.

One of the variants of coronavirus first identified in India has spread to the UK. Just under half of these cases involve international travel and the strain has now been designated a "variant of concern".

India was added to the red list on 23 April, but neighbouring Pakistan and Bangladesh have both been on it since 9 April.

What is the red list?

The red list is the government's list of 43 countries from which there are strict restrictions on travel to England.

Northern Ireland has similar rules in place as does Wales, while Scotland is introducing a list on 17 May.

The restrictions are designed to protect the UK from new variants of Covid, against which existing vaccines may be less effective.

Travel to England is banned for anyone who has been in one of the countries in the past 10 days, except for UK citizens and residents, who have to isolate on arrival at government-approved hotels for 10 days.

What are the criteria for going on the red list?

The decision is based on Joint Biosecurity Centre risk assessments, which include:

how good a country's testing structures are, including checking for variants of concern
how many cases those systems have identified
whether people in that country have been catching new variants at home or the cases have come from overseas
evidence of whether that country has exported cases of new variants to other countries, including to the UK
how good the country's travel links with the UK are
The first point on the list is important, because the genome sequencing needed to identify new variants is very sophisticated and relatively rare.

But just because a country has found new variants, or has many cases of coronavirus, it will not necessarily be on the red list.

On 11 May, the World Health Organization identified:

102 countries where the variant identified in South Africa had been found, of which 26 are on the red list
60 countries with the variant identified in Brazil, of which 20 are on the red list
the variant of concern identified in India has been reported in 31 countries.

Why were Pakistan and Bangladesh put on the red list before India?

Bangladesh had the South Africa but not the Brazil variant and Pakistan had neither when they were added to the red list on 9 April.

India had both, as well as a new variant, but was not added for another two weeks.

On 9 April:

Pakistan had a seven-day average of 21 cases per million people
Bangladesh had twice as many
India had four times as many
Coronavirus cases on 9 April. Seven day average - cases per million. .

In late March, India's health authority said 771 variants of concern had been detected in a sample of almost 11,000 positive cases - a fraction of the millions of cases recorded in the country.

India has a greater sequencing ability than Pakistan or Bangladesh, although it is far behind the UK, which does about half of the world's sequencing.

We asked the government why India wasn't added before. Its response did not directly answer the question but said the red list was kept "under constant review".

"Nobody knows the full criteria - but there may be a political element because the UK wants a trade deal with India," Dr Simon Clarke, associate professor in cellular microbiology, at the University of Reading, said.

Boris Johnson cancelled a planned trade trip to India on 19 April.

"It's not always a data-driven decision," he added, giving the example of Somalia, which is on the red list but has one of the lowest official rates of infection and deaths in the world.

How many cases of the new India variant have been found?
Announcing the decision on India on 19 April, Health Secretary Matt Hancock said 103 cases of the variant had been found in the UK.

On 13 May, the government said the number of cases had risen from 520 to 1,313 in the past week.

One of the variants first identified in India was designated as a variant of concern on 7 May.

The WHO said it appeared to have a higher rate of transmission and that there was preliminary evidence suggesting some vaccines may be less effective against it.

Scottish First Minister Nicola Sturgeon cited fears of the India variant as one of the reasons why Glasgow and Moray will not have restrictions eased as planned.

How much is linked to international travel?

The Civil Aviation Authority said that in February 2021, 50,000 passengers travelled between India and the UK, which is an average of just under 900 a day in each direction.

We asked the government how many travelled from India to the UK between the announcement of the travel ban on 19 April and it coming into force on 23 April, but have not had an answer.

Just under half of people with the India variant of concern in England had been travelling, according to a briefing from Public Health England.

It said that about one third of the cases were in London and a quarter were in the North West of England. Almost 60% of positive Covid19 tests are now sent for genome sequencing to identify new variants, which means the government has a good idea of where the cases are.

Asked about the delays in adding India to the red list, the UK's former chief scientific adviser Prof Mark Walport told the BBC: "These decisions are almost inevitably taken a bit too late in truth."

BBC

 

[Manunited18]

Yvette Cooper, the Labour MP who chairs parliament's Home Affairs Committee, has criticised the delays in putting India on the government's travel-ban "red list".

"Why did PM not put India on the red list 2 weeks earlier when Pakistan and Bangladesh were added to red list? And why did they then delay a further 4 days to implement?" she tweeted.

One of the variants of coronavirus first identified in India has spread to the UK. Just under half of these cases involve international travel and the strain has now been designated a "variant of concern".

India was added to the red list on 23 April, but neighbouring Pakistan and Bangladesh have both been on it since 9 April.

What is the red list?

The red list is the government's list of 43 countries from which there are strict restrictions on travel to England.

Northern Ireland has similar rules in place as does Wales, while Scotland is introducing a list on 17 May.

The restrictions are designed to protect the UK from new variants of Covid, against which existing vaccines may be less effective.

Travel to England is banned for anyone who has been in one of the countries in the past 10 days, except for UK citizens and residents, who have to isolate on arrival at government-approved hotels for 10 days.

What are the criteria for going on the red list?

The decision is based on Joint Biosecurity Centre risk assessments, which include:

how good a country's testing structures are, including checking for variants of concern
how many cases those systems have identified
whether people in that country have been catching new variants at home or the cases have come from overseas
evidence of whether that country has exported cases of new variants to other countries, including to the UK
how good the country's travel links with the UK are
The first point on the list is important, because the genome sequencing needed to identify new variants is very sophisticated and relatively rare.

But just because a country has found new variants, or has many cases of coronavirus, it will not necessarily be on the red list.

On 11 May, the World Health Organization identified:

102 countries where the variant identified in South Africa had been found, of which 26 are on the red list
60 countries with the variant identified in Brazil, of which 20 are on the red list
the variant of concern identified in India has been reported in 31 countries.

Why were Pakistan and Bangladesh put on the red list before India?

Bangladesh had the South Africa but not the Brazil variant and Pakistan had neither when they were added to the red list on 9 April.

India had both, as well as a new variant, but was not added for another two weeks.

On 9 April:

Pakistan had a seven-day average of 21 cases per million people
Bangladesh had twice as many
India had four times as many
Coronavirus cases on 9 April. Seven day average - cases per million. .

In late March, India's health authority said 771 variants of concern had been detected in a sample of almost 11,000 positive cases - a fraction of the millions of cases recorded in the country.

India has a greater sequencing ability than Pakistan or Bangladesh, although it is far behind the UK, which does about half of the world's sequencing.

We asked the government why India wasn't added before. Its response did not directly answer the question but said the red list was kept "under constant review".

"Nobody knows the full criteria - but there may be a political element because the UK wants a trade deal with India," Dr Simon Clarke, associate professor in cellular microbiology, at the University of Reading, said.

Boris Johnson cancelled a planned trade trip to India on 19 April.

"It's not always a data-driven decision," he added, giving the example of Somalia, which is on the red list but has one of the lowest official rates of infection and deaths in the world.

How many cases of the new India variant have been found?
Announcing the decision on India on 19 April, Health Secretary Matt Hancock said 103 cases of the variant had been found in the UK.

On 13 May, the government said the number of cases had risen from 520 to 1,313 in the past week.

One of the variants first identified in India was designated as a variant of concern on 7 May.

The WHO said it appeared to have a higher rate of transmission and that there was preliminary evidence suggesting some vaccines may be less effective against it.

Scottish First Minister Nicola Sturgeon cited fears of the India variant as one of the reasons why Glasgow and Moray will not have restrictions eased as planned.

How much is linked to international travel?

The Civil Aviation Authority said that in February 2021, 50,000 passengers travelled between India and the UK, which is an average of just under 900 a day in each direction.

We asked the government how many travelled from India to the UK between the announcement of the travel ban on 19 April and it coming into force on 23 April, but have not had an answer.

Just under half of people with the India variant of concern in England had been travelling, according to a briefing from Public Health England.

It said that about one third of the cases were in London and a quarter were in the North West of England. Almost 60% of positive Covid19 tests are now sent for genome sequencing to identify new variants, which means the government has a good idea of where the cases are.

Asked about the delays in adding India to the red list, the UK's former chief scientific adviser Prof Mark Walport told the BBC: "These decisions are almost inevitably taken a bit too late in truth."

BBC

The Indian variant of the virus is unquestionably the most dangerous and the most transmitive of all the variants, the government typically reacted to slowly hence it's spreading alot in dense Indian communities in England.

 

[DonJee]

UK's Red List

Hi guys, not sure if there's a thread on this already (i can't find it)

Does anyone have any idea on when Pakistan will come off UK's red-list? Thinking about going to Pakistan in August after 12 years but am not sure whether to make the trip due to hotel quarantine on return.

Any advice?

Thanks

 

[Kroll]

The Pakistan white-ball squad has arrived in Birmingham where they will shortly depart for Derby.

Upon completion of their 3-day room isolation in Derby, the squad will be allowed to train for 7 days after which they will depart for Cardiff on July 6 to prepare for the first of 3 ODIs against England.

So how come they’re allowed to get away without 10 day quarantine in govt. ‘approvedÂ’ hotel?

As we all know, Pak getting slapped on the UK red list is all **.

 

[Bi_Jamalo]

So they were also breaking the law by scrounging on all the UK tax payers.

Pakistan is not one of the countries on the list that you can travel to and still keep on claiming benefits whilst you were there.

They should be prosecuted for benefit fraud upon their return.

How do you come to that conclusion?

Being entitled to unemployment benefits and travelling abroad are 2 separate and (not necessarily inter-connected) things. And How is that Benefit fraud?
Does the law prescribes you to be homebound while you are looking for a new job?

 

[PetroDollars]

Hi guys, not sure if there's a thread on this already (i can't find it)

Does anyone have any idea on when Pakistan will come off UK's red-list? Thinking about going to Pakistan in August after 12 years but am not sure whether to make the trip due to hotel quarantine on return.

Any advice?

Thanks

the estimate is september/october, Pakistan/india/bang/SL/Afgan have all been grouped toegeher now and will come off at the same time, however if more variants are found it will be delayed further. I really dont think it will come off this year.

 

[Yossarian]

How do you come to that conclusion?

Being entitled to unemployment benefits and travelling abroad are 2 separate and (not necessarily inter-connected) things.

The answer to the first part of the rubbish you posted. Note the line "some of them are on benefits"

Barrister Zahab Jamali ......
....
Mr Jamali said the hotels are charging hefty amounts and that it is “unacceptable” for them to provide poor service. “Many of the families in hotel quarantine don’t earn much and some of them are on benefits. This means that they have to repay the hotel charges to the government on a 12-month installment,” he told Dawn

Published in Dawn, April 23rd, 2021

And How is that Benefit fraud?
Does the law prescribes you to be homebound while you are looking for a new job?

As for the second part of the rubbish you posted:
From the UK Govt website

Benefit fraud

You’re committing benefit fraud if you:

* do not tell the office that pays your benefit you’re going abroad, even if it’s just for a visit

You can keep on claiming benefits if you're travelling to certain countries. But Pakistan is not one of them.

Overview

You may still be able to claim some benefits if you travel or move abroad, or if you’re already living abroad. What you’re entitled to depends on where you’re going and how long for.

 

[James]

The decisions taken throughout the pandemic situation, and the timings of these decisions (including those about Pakistan/India) have largely been political decisions driven by domestic & foreign policy and also mass media pressure. Very few of the choices that politicians are taking have truly been driven by “public health concerns”.

 

[OMB]

The decisions taken throughout the pandemic situation, and the timings of these decisions (including those about Pakistan/India) have largely been political decisions driven by domestic & foreign policy and also mass media pressure. Very few of the choices that politicians are taking have truly been driven by “public health concerns”.

It is economy vs health (World over).
Can speak for India that it was heavily skewed in favour of economy mainly due to too many daily wage workers and no social benefit structure.
I say economy (not politics) because any other party in power would have also chosen economy.