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Pakistan v West Indies | 1st Test (D/N) | Dubai (DSC) | Oct 13-17, 2016 | Day 2

heddie19 said:
I always tipped him to be special, Even kohli did. I want to see him next as wasim akram not next junaid khan :'(
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He is still special on green tracks like the Asia Cup, but Wasim was able to do that on flat wickets as well. Looks like that ship has sailed already, he is not in Wasim's league.
 
If Sohail can't swing it, no one can. Yasir being tight. I don't think this is out but good signs.
 
We are just so reliant on Yasir its unbelievable.

He performs, we win; he doesn't perform, we get hammered.

Lord's, Old Trafford, Edgbaston and Oval tell a story . . . . . .
 
This is not the pitch to play test cricket on. This is not the kind of pitch to play any cricket on. Two out of the three wickets fell to shots where the batsmen tried to be aggressive. One was a missed sweep shot.

You can play with a fluorescent ball under purple lights and disco music with cheer leaders running around in circles but if you make such pitches, people won't still come and watch test cricket. Good for batsmen, not good for cricket overall.
 
Mamoon said:
We are just so reliant on Yasir its unbelievable.

He performs, we win; he doesn't perform, we get hammered.

Lord's, Old Trafford, Edgbaston and Oval tell a story . . . . . .
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Name me one team at the moment, or in last 5 years that is not reliant on one main strike bowler. Go on.
 
GoUgandaCranes said:
This is not the pitch to play test cricket on. This is not the kind of pitch to play any cricket on. Two out of the three wickets fell to shots where the batsmen tried to be aggressive. One was a missed sweep shot.

You can play with a fluorescent ball under purple lights and disco music with cheer leaders running around in circles but if you make such pitches, people won't still come and watch test cricket. Good for batsmen, not good for cricket overall.
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WI are 1 down already, poor pitch tho I agree with that.
 
Mamoon said:
We are just so reliant on Yasir its unbelievable.

He performs, we win; he doesn't perform, we get hammered.

Lord's, Old Trafford, Edgbaston and Oval tell a story . . . . . .
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Actually, in that regard Bangladesh will be most balanced attack, because we don't depend on anyone to give 500 - take out Ashwin, Herath, Strac, Styen - their team will struggle to take 20 wickets.
 
Mamoon said:
Definitely. Even among contemporary bowlers, he is nowhere near among the best.

Starc is Wasim's true heir.
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Good thing about Amir is that he is still only 24. He still has potential to be a Pak ATG. Hopefully his knees don't collapse like Akhtar and Junaid's.
 
GoUgandaCranes said:
Name me one team at the moment, or in last 5 years that is not reliant on one main strike bowler. Go on.
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South Africa, England and Australia.

All teams have one strike bowler, but they have several other bowlers who are consistently good.

For every Steyn, Anderson and Starc, they have Philander, Rabada, Morkel, Broad, Finn, Hazlewood etc. who have all won games for their with game changing spells frequently.

Ever since Yasir has come into the team, I can't recall any significant Test victory in which Yasir has not been the main protagonist in terms of bowling.

We simply have become a lazy bowling unit who is too reliant on Yasir. It is like Ajmal in Limited Overs few years back, where it became a rarity for Pakistan to win a match without Ajmal performing to a high level.
 
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Rahat would've been a better option than Wahab in this Test.
 
Mamoon said:
He is still special on green tracks like the Asia Cup, but Wasim was able to do that on flat wickets as well. Looks like that ship has sailed already, he is not in Wasim's league.
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He bowled much better than he did in the UK, gets better every game. I think judgement on his caliber should be reserved till at least a year, a proper sample size.
 
Mamoon said:
We are just so reliant on Yasir its unbelievable.

He performs, we win; he doesn't perform, we get hammered.

Lord's, Old Trafford, Edgbaston and Oval tell a story . . . . . .
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He can target an average around 27-28
 
Sarfu (and slip fielders) seriously need to come forward... standing way behind...it's a slow pitch and ball is not carrying well.
 
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MMHS said:
Actually, in that regard Bangladesh will be most balanced attack, because we don't depend on anyone to give 500 - take out Ashwin, Herath, Strac, Styen - their team will struggle to take 20 wickets.
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Sri Lanka is simply a poor team at the moment, but other teams struggle less than Pakistan when their strike bowler goes missing.

If Ashwin misses out in India you can still bank on Jadeja, SA have Rabada at the moment and Australia have Hazlewood.

Apart from Yasir, none of our bowlers are performing at a consistent level these days in Tests. I won't look into Sohail's consecutive 5-fers much, let him play more Tests.
 
shah_1 said:
I mean Amir
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Main thing is how many matches he wins for Pakistan. Averages alone don't tell the whole story. Anderson and Broad with their 30 averages have won England many, many matches.

At the moment, Yasir is the sole match-winner in the bowling department.
 
This attack (excluding Amir) Sohail, Wahab and Yasir are 30 or above. Yasir as spinner can last for few years but don't think I can say the say for other two mentioned.

We certainly have dearth in fast bowling department. Amir in okayish but need to find 2 more bowlers to support/surpass him.
 
Mamoon said:
Sri Lanka is simply a poor team at the moment, but other teams struggle less than Pakistan when their strike bowler goes missing.

If Ashwin misses out in India you can still bank on Jadeja, SA have Rabada at the moment and Australia have Hazlewood.

Apart from Yasir, none of our bowlers are performing at a consistent level these days in Tests. I won't look into Sohail's consecutive 5-fers much, let him play more Tests.
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That's more or less the story for every team man. Take the ENG series - Sohail took a 5fer on Day 1 at Oval; Wahab bowled and absolute gem spell at Lords. At SRL, Imran took 5/5 with 2nd ball; against ENG at UAE, Wahab won a Test, At Lord's Rahat took out ENG top 3 in opening spell, defending 280. Last winter Zulfi took 2/3 in openeing spell to make ENG 50/5 or 6. Obviously you'll depend on a bowler that's taking 6 wickets/Test; but PAK won Test in Asia & outside with the attack - look at what AUS or SAF did in their last tour of Asia.
 
Mamoon said:
Main thing is how many matches he wins for Pakistan. Averages alone don't tell the whole story. Anderson and Broad with their 30 averages have won England many, many matches.

At the moment, Yasir is the sole match-winner in the bowling department.
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And the other concern is age factor of our bowlers. Except Amir, all are 30 or above.
 
These WI guys are really scared of Yasir, 4th over and only 3 runs conceded. It's like he has Jadeja's ER + Ashwin's wicket taking ability :))
 
putF%8id said:
This attack (excluding Amir) Sohail, Wahab and Yasir are 30 or above. Yasir as spinner can last for few years but don't think I can say the say for other two mentioned.

We certainly have dearth in fast bowling department. Amir in okayish but need to find 2 more bowlers to support/surpass him.
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Chattann Ali was pretty good in the ODIs.
 
Mamoon said:
South Africa, England and Australia.

All teams have one strike bowler, but they have several other bowlers who are consistently good.

For every Steyn, Anderson and Starc, they have Philander, Rabada, Morkel, Broad, Finn, Hazlewood etc. who have all won games for their with game changing spells frequently.

Ever since Yasir has come into the team, I can't recall any significant Test victory in which Yasir has not been the main protagonist in terms of bowling.

We simply have become a lazy bowling unit who is too reliant on Yasir. It is like Ajmal in Limited Overs few years back, where it became a rarity for Pakistan to win a match without Ajmal performing to a high level.
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Cannot agree with it at all. The moment Steyn is out of the team, South Africa lose or do badly. Their struggles over the last five years in the absence of Steyn are self explanatory. England partially but Broad has had one good match and that's about it. Take out Anderson and they are equally toothless. They have a balanced attack now with Woakes and Stokes but an Indian tour will exemplify how important an ace in the form of Anderson is. How many tests has Hazlewood won?

Also, the argument that you are missing is that UAE pitches are slow. They don't turn - they aren't rank turners. They are rabidly slow pitches with no bite at all and we've played with Yasir Shah as the main spinner. If you think an Amir or Junaid Khan can run through the opposition team - be my guest.

My point being, take the ace out and no team is any good enough. It's not just us.
 
Zulfi would have choked WI to submission here - their pacers have made nice roughs out side off for Lefties.
 
MMHS said:
That's more or less the story for every team man. Take the ENG series - Sohail took a 5fer on Day 1 at Oval; Wahab bowled and absolute gem spell at Lords. At SRL, Imran took 5/5 with 2nd ball; against ENG at UAE, Wahab won a Test, At Lord's Rahat took out ENG top 3 in opening spell, defending 280. Last winter Zulfi took 2/3 in openeing spell to make ENG 50/5 or 6. Obviously you'll depend on a bowler that's taking 6 wickets/Test; but PAK won Test in Asia & outside with the attack - look at what AUS or SAF did in their last tour of Asia.
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Maybe that is one way of looking at it. I am however taking a more holistic approach and have come to the conclusion that Pakistan have hardly (if any) won any Test matches in the last two years where Yasir has not performed exceptionally well.

I'm waiting for a match or two where Yasir performs poorly (like Old Trafford and Edgbaston) but Pakistan still end up winning. That tells me the diversity of the bowling attack, not good support spells like Rahat at Lord's and Babar in the UAE etc.
 
GoUgandaCranes said:
Cannot agree with it at all. The moment Steyn is out of the team, South Africa lose or do badly. Their struggles over the last five years in the absence of Steyn are self explanatory. England partially but Broad has had one good match and that's about it. Take out Anderson and they are equally toothless. They have a balanced attack now with Woakes and Stokes but an Indian tour will exemplify how important an ace in the form of Anderson is. How many tests has Hazlewood won?

Also, the argument that you are missing is that UAE pitches are slow. They don't turn - they aren't rank turners. They are rabidly slow pitches with no bite at all and we've played with Yasir Shah as the main spinner. If you think an Amir or Junaid Khan can run through the opposition team - be my guest.

My point being, take the ace out and no team is any good enough. It's not just us.
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Speaking of Broad, I would argue that he has actually won more matches for England than Anderson in the last couple of years. Anderson is more consistent and has less off days, but Broad has produced the more impactful spells.

Rabada actually took 13 wickets to route England back in February, so SA without Steyn is not exactly toothless. Wasn't Hazlewood Australia's best pacer last summer?

It could well be the case this summer, because he is the type of bowler whom we struggle more against. Nagging line and length with just enough movement. Might struggle against him more than Starc.
 
West Indies trail by 510 runs with 9 wickets remaining in the 1st innings


That is the end of the day !
 
Good days cricket. PAK would like to go to Tea tomorrow at 153/4 or so, WI not more than 2 down.
 
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