[PICTURES/VIDEOS] Intolerance and violence are on the rise in India

[CricketCartoons]

If you don’t want to eat something, just don’t go to places like that. Muslims particular about zabeeha, don’t eat at McDonald’s. Simple!

Maybe some cutting edge tech Hindu innovator can come up with an app to determine who has eaten beef or not. Lol


Please put a blood or stool sample here in the Apple Watch please.

That is why we demand transparency. If you agree that hindus should avoid such eateries, then it can only be achieved if there is transparency on the owner.

Just because some problem cannot be solved 100% doesn't mean it should not be solved 95%.

 

[CricketCartoons]

We don’t need it.

we have halal or zabeeha certifications in place in most civilized countries where Muslims live. There is a central or local body that certifies meat in the US as zabeeha. Sly Muslims think of everything!

The bodies which certify do they witness the slaughtering? How does it apply to butchers who sell fresh meat?

 

[Red-Indian]

Do you not see Brahmin restaurants mentioned? I have seen it.

Hindus eating cow meat commit sin. Its written in the dharmashastras. Its as big a sin as brahma hatya.

Ofcourse. Some are open about it...some use loaded descriptions so that those in the know can identify them.

I don't like this but I don't oppose it. If restaurants self-certify or voluntarily go to associations that are willing to certify them as Halal, Sattvik, Brahmin etc., I'm not standing in the way.

However, if the government steps in and starts backing these absurd certifications, I'm opposed.

None of these certifications are worth the paper they're printed on anyway. There's no way any organisation can verify the entire chain for all food products they certify as Halal. It's just like organic and fair trade certifications that have become popular nowadays. One of my friends eats nothing but fish in restaurants even they claim to be serving Halal meat because he claims it's all a fraud.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

The bodies which certify do they witness the slaughtering? How does it apply to butchers who sell fresh meat?

Meat is purchased usually from certified slaughterhouses.

For someone selling Fresh meat where no audits are possible then we are content with taking the word of the butcher.

If he is a liar and is trying to hoodwink Muslims like you guys claim Muslims have hoodwinked you and pretends to have a Muslim name but is actually a Hindu who slaughters it by saying jai Sri ram ( hypothetical example) then the sin is on him, not on the one who has eaten it in good faith.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Meat is purchased usually from certified slaughterhouses.

For someone selling Fresh meat where no audits are possible then we are content with taking the word of the butcher.

If he is a liar and is trying to hoodwink Muslims like you guys claim Muslims have hoodwinked you and pretends to have a Muslim name but is actually a Hindu who slaughters it by saying jai Sri ram ( hypothetical example) then the sin is on him, not on the one who has eaten it in good faith.

Yes, and that is a reasonable way. You don't care to verify if the muslim butcher killed the chicken in halaal way or not, but his word is good enough for you. You don't need any gadget like @Stewie was suggesting.

The world works on trust and perception. A muslim will trust the word of a muslim when it comes to religion. Hindus cannot trust muslims to adhere to the same standards of cooking food for hindus, even if not out of malice, then out of ignorance. Many hindus don't eat out at restaurants which serve both veg and meat dish, even if the owner or cook are hindu. It is their dietary and religious requirement. They don't deserve to be hated or called bigots for that.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Ofcourse. Some are open about it...some use loaded descriptions so that those in the know can identify them.

I don't like this but I don't oppose it. If restaurants self-certify or voluntarily go to associations that are willing to certify them as Halal, Sattvik, Brahmin etc., I'm not standing in the way.

However, if the government steps in and starts backing these absurd certifications, I'm opposed.

None of these certifications are worth the paper they're printed on anyway. There's no way any organisation can verify the entire chain for all food products they certify as Halal. It's just like organic and fair trade certifications that have become popular nowadays. One of my friends eats nothing but fish in restaurants even they claim to be serving Halal meat because he claims it's all a fraud.

The problem is the enforced syncretism. Before partition there would be Aligarh Muslim University, Benares Hindu University, Muslim Hotel, Hindu Hotel, Halaal meat Shop, Jhatka Meat Shop. People accepted that people are different and have different needs. Even cricket teams were Hindu and Muslim based.

Now a new college for Muslims would send an outcry. There was outcry when a food delivery service wanted to provide separate service for people who want only vegetarian food. This is what fascism looks like. Extreme intolerance for others, and forced syncretism.

Hindus should be free to eat from eateries catering to them. Doesn't make sense that a muslim owned Vaishno Dhaba is run, where even onion and garlic are not to be used. What happened to freedom of choice? Why calling people bigots just because they want to lead their own way of life without harming anyone?

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Yes, and that is a reasonable way. You don't care to verify if the muslim butcher killed the chicken in halaal way or not, but his word is good enough for you. You don't need any gadget like @Stewie was suggesting.

The world works on trust and perception. A muslim will trust the word of a muslim when it comes to religion. Hindus cannot trust muslims to adhere to the same standards of cooking food for hindus, even if not out of malice, then out of ignorance. Many hindus don't eat out at restaurants which serve both veg and meat dish, even if the owner or cook are hindu. It is their dietary and religious requirement. They don't deserve to be hated or called bigots for that.

Word is good enough for us but not for you. There is a two fold issue here. One is as you have said Muslims may inadvertently make your food impure. Joshilla however was talking about disguised Muslims tricking Hindus while pretending to be Hindus. In such a scenario you guys would definitely need a device to make sure that a sly Muslim hasn't played a cruel trick.

Furthermore you must realize that we Muslims don't have a 5th column amongst the general masses. Alhumdulilah most are steadfast and even if they err themselves they wouldn't deliberately sabotage others.

You guys are plagued with sickulars, anti nationals, Hindu athiests and Muslim appeasers. There is a risk they may also sabotage your food like the crafty Muslims.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Word is good enough for us but not for you. There is a two fold issue here. One is as you have said Muslims may inadvertently make your food impure. Joshilla however was talking about disguised Muslims tricking Hindus while pretending to be Hindus. In such a scenario you guys would definitely need a device to make sure that a sly Muslim hasn't played a cruel trick.

Furthermore you must realize that we Muslims don't have a 5th column amongst the general masses. Alhumdulilah most are steadfast and even if they err themselves they wouldn't deliberately sabotage others.

You guys are plagued with sickulars, anti nationals, Hindu athiests and Muslim appeasers. There is a risk they may also sabotage your food like the crafty Muslims.

I haven't read Joshila Bhai's posts but I have a feeling he was debating something else. I only read the replies to his posts.

If he was suggesting that he will be OK with a muslim serving Vaisho food to hindus as long as he didn't disguise his identity and gave his word, I do not hold ittefaq with his views. I will not be comfortable with a muslim cooking my food with strict religious requirements.

This is different than having food cooked by a muslim at my home ( I have had muslim cooks at home), because the environment, utensils etc are controlled by me, so the muslim can cook any standard fare. Even then if I have to make kheer for some pooja, I will do it myself and not have it cooked by a muslim. In fact I would first have to bathe before cooking any food meant for pooja.

At my home, I have designated meat cooking on the terrace, with separate utensils, grills and separate refrigerators. The problem is not meat eating, it is the mixing of utensils. The food we eat for religious occasions is very simple but has strict rules to be adhered to. I cannot allow that to be cooked at the hands of a muslim. Does it mean that the food would be made with the right requirements if done by a hindu? Not 100%, but I will take a hindus word for it, unless I know if he is a commie, in which case I will trust a muslim over the commie.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

I haven't read Joshila Bhai's posts but I have a feeling he was debating something else. I only read the replies to his posts.

If he was suggesting that he will be OK with a muslim serving Vaisho food to hindus as long as he didn't disguise his identity and gave his word, I do not hold ittefaq with his views. I will not be comfortable with a muslim cooking my food with strict religious requirements.

This is different than having food cooked by a muslim at my home ( I have had muslim cooks at home), because the environment, utensils etc are controlled by me, so the muslim can cook any standard fare. Even then if I have to make kheer for some pooja, I will do it myself and not have it cooked by a muslim. In fact I would first have to bathe before cooking any food meant for pooja.

At my home, I have designated meat cooking on the terrace, with separate utensils, grills and separate refrigerators. The problem is not meat eating, it is the mixing of utensils. The food we eat for religious occasions is very simple but has strict rules to be adhered to. I cannot allow that to be cooked at the hands of a muslim. Does it mean that the food would be made with the right requirements if done by a hindu? Not 100%, but I will take a hindus word for it, unless I know if he is a commie, in which case I will trust a muslim over the commie.

This works at the home of a rich man like you but not outside of the home.

Outside you really have a few options. Complete banishment of all visible Muslims from hotels where food is being prepared and pull down the pants of all staff to check if they really are Hindus or sly Muslims trying to hoodwink Hindus.

 

[CricketCartoons]

This works at the home of a rich man like you but not outside of the home.

Outside you really have a few options. Complete banishment of all visible Muslims from hotels where food is being prepared and pull down the pants of all staff to check if they really are Hindus or sly Muslims trying to hoodwink Hindus.

Yes, I have the privilege to practice this food separation, but even when I lived in a slum, meat was cooked at a buffalo shed. We would eat rice and mutton/fish (never chicken) in the buffalo shed, all sweating and swatting away house flies. Then run to a well to bathe, change clothes and then come back home. You were only allowed back home after eating meat was if you had bathed and changed your clothes.

We don't need banishment of muslims from hotels. We just need transparency. So that secular hindus can patronize those muslim businesses and hindus following their religious requirements can patronize hindu operated eateries. Everyone should have freedom of choice. We only demand transparency. We have no problem if some hindus want to go eat at muslim eateries out of their own will. This is not like a boycott, where you want everyone else to join your boycott. This is only about freedom of choice.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Meat is purchased usually from certified slaughterhouses.

For someone selling Fresh meat where no audits are possible then we are content with taking the word of the butcher.

If he is a liar and is trying to hoodwink Muslims like you guys claim Muslims have hoodwinked you and pretends to have a Muslim name but is actually a Hindu who slaughters it by saying jai Sri ram ( hypothetical example) then the sin is on him, not on the one who has eaten it in good faith.

Exactly. When a hindu says he is selling Satwik food we take his word for it. If he is hoodwinking anyone the sin is on him.

 

[KingKhanWC]

First of all learn what the hindu scriptures are. Ramayana or Gita doesn't talk about this.

The dharmashastras do.




Which scriptures? Now you are an expert on Hindus and their scriptures.

Muslims will have to display their names on their eateries and Hindus will have the choice if they want to eat there or not.

There is no Hindu scripture stating Hindus cannot eat food prepared or sold by a non Hindu . This is extremist. Hindu mentality . As mentioned some won’t eat from other Hindus either if they are deemed lower caste .

Beef isn’t even banned in the state you live . It’s not as big as deal as you claim

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Are muslim businessmen so insecure of their muslim names? Why their business are going around with Hindu names?

For the same reason desis will take on English forenames to appeal to the locals. So you will get Tony Singh, Steven Seghal, or Jimmy Khan to appear less foreign to the natives.

When I was growing up I used to wonder why every Sikh I knew was called Bobby or Tony, but turns out they had genuine Sikh names as well.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Exactly. When a hindu says he is selling Satwik food we take his word for it. If he is hoodwinking anyone the sin is on him.

You keep describing this as hoodwinking, but if they are selling to hindus then they might well be just trying to sell into a market where religious bigotry is rife. That is why I gave the example of Pakistani and Bangladeshi restaurants in the UK presenting as Indian.

 

[cricketjoshila]

You keep describing this as hoodwinking, but if they are selling to hindus then they might well be just trying to sell into a market where religious bigotry is rife. That is why I gave the example of Pakistani and Bangladeshi restaurants in the UK presenting as Indian.

What bigotry? Muslims wanting to eat halal is bigotry? Or Jews eating kosher is bigotry?

 

[cricketjoshila]

There is no Hindu scripture stating Hindus cannot eat food prepared or sold by a non Hindu . This is extremist. Hindu mentality . As mentioned some won’t eat from other Hindus either if they are deemed lower caste .

Beef isn’t even banned in the state you live . It’s not as big as deal as you claim

Which hindu scriptures have you studied?

Again I don't need to learn my religion from a muslim.

My state has been ruled by leftists and communists for nearly 50 years. They don't even heed court directions on cow slaughtering.

I don't need to convince you about how big deal cow slaughter and beef eating is for a Hindu.

 

[cricketjoshila]

I haven't read Joshila Bhai's posts but I have a feeling he was debating something else. I only read the replies to his posts.

If he was suggesting that he will be OK with a muslim serving Vaisho food to hindus as long as he didn't disguise his identity and gave his word, I do not hold ittefaq with his views. I will not be comfortable with a muslim cooking my food with strict religious requirements.

This is different than having food cooked by a muslim at my home ( I have had muslim cooks at home), because the environment, utensils etc are controlled by me, so the muslim can cook any standard fare. Even then if I have to make kheer for some pooja, I will do it myself and not have it cooked by a muslim. In fact I would first have to bathe before cooking any food meant for pooja.

At my home, I have designated meat cooking on the terrace, with separate utensils, grills and separate refrigerators. The problem is not meat eating, it is the mixing of utensils. The food we eat for religious occasions is very simple but has strict rules to be adhered to. I cannot allow that to be cooked at the hands of a muslim. Does it mean that the food would be made with the right requirements if done by a hindu? Not 100%, but I will take a hindus word for it, unless I know if he is a commie, in which case I will trust a muslim over the commie.

I never said that a Muslim handling food and calling it vaishno food is ok. It never will be. It cannot be.

Most hindus wont hire muslim cooks or domestic helps because most have a shrine or pooja room at home.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Which hindu scriptures have you studied?

Again I don't need to learn my religion from a muslim.

My state has been ruled by leftists and communists for nearly 50 years. They don't even heed court directions on cow slaughtering.

I don't need to convince you about how big deal cow slaughter and beef eating is for a Hindu.

I think you do , as imo your version of Hinduism is extreme .

Just post the holy texts which clearly state a Hindu cannot buy /consume food from non Hindus ?

 

[FearlessRoar]

Warning:

Guys, this thread is not for discussing halal and haram food. Please stay on topic

 

[RexRex]

The simple reason is that everyone should be free to do business with whom they want. If muslims want to prefer buying from muslims, that is good, and if hindus want to prefer buying from hindus, that is good too.

Everyone should be free to support their own community.

What is the problem?

Police are forcing restaurants to show their employee names to customers; this is none of their business.

 

[cricketjoshila]

I think you do , as imo your version of Hinduism is extreme .

Just post the holy texts which clearly state a Hindu cannot buy /consume food from non Hindus ?

Your opinion on Hinduism means zilch.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Police are forcing restaurants to show their employee names to customers; this is none of their business.

It is a secular act, as it applies to all religions. And in India, secular is a good thing no?

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

What bigotry? Muslims wanting to eat halal is bigotry? Or Jews eating kosher is bigotry?

Not having any clear distinction on what is forbidden food for hindus then describing Muslims who try to sell food which they think will be acceptable to hindus as hoodwinking - that is bigotry.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Police are forcing restaurants to show their employee names to customers; this is none of their business.

Not employee name. Name of the owner whose name is on the License.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Not having any clear distinction on what is forbidden food for hindus then describing Muslims who try to sell food which they think will be acceptable to hindus as hoodwinking - that is bigotry.

Who will decide what is forbidden for Hindus and why do they need to tell it to Muslims?

Muslims using names as

Vaishnav Dhaba
Jai Mata Di pure veg Hotel

Etc etc are hoodwinking Hindus.

Why are Muslims making claims of Vaishno Dhaba or using names of Hindu deities?

 

[Stewie]

Read my last line. I don't have any preference or dislike for any particular religion. Crappy discrimination is discrimination, sir.
Having rules and rituals are something religions and cultures have. Discrimination stems if your rules and rituals exclude people on the basis of their sex/religion/belief/skin color etc. I think its self explanatory.

If Jews have rules about a food that if touched by a certain group of people, based on their identity, becomes unfit for consumption that's very well discrimination. Simple. I don't see it any different from the untouchability practiced under caste system. Discrimination is discrimination, no divine word of God can justify that.

I think Its hard for you to fathom that I can be practically very objective about all religions.

Now that I understand the concept of negative energy and bad karma, I don't feel its discrminatory. It is a personal preference.

You can hold your views, whatever, who am I to tell you that.

But I feel you have zero to little understanding of the concept of Kosher and Zabeeha in the Abrahamic tradition. We are not Hindus who believe in bad karma or negative energy. We just want the animal sacrificed in the name of God and in a certain way for us to consume it. Once its slaughtered that way, a Hindu or Buddhist or Rastafarian or whomever can make nice beef kebabs out of it and serve us and we will eat it. We do not discriminate for touch of achoots or lower caste or people of other faiths... those are distinctly Hindu concepts.

Perhaps read up and educate yourself on those before issuing blanket judgments on them being discriminatory.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Who will decide what is forbidden for Hindus and why do they need to tell it to Muslims?

Muslims using names as

Vaishnav Dhaba
Jai Mata Di pure veg Hotel

Etc etc are hoodwinking Hindus.

Why are Muslims making claims of Vaishno Dhaba or using names of Hindu deities?

Because historically there has never been any consensus on what constitutes an acceptable hindu diet.

 

[Stewie]

Not employee name. Name of the owner whose name is on the License.

That's categorically false. You obviously did not read the post and have just been ranting and raving.

The news article mentioned the employee names and their faiths were to be made public.

 

[Stewie]

I never said that a Muslim handling food and calling it vaishno food is ok. It never will be. It cannot be.

Most hindus wont hire muslim cooks or domestic helps because most have a shrine or pooja room at home.

we hire Christians and Hindus for domestic help all the time. In fact most domestic help in Pakistan is Christian, and I have encountered some Hindus as well.

I think we are seeing a pattern here but of course the Hindu defense league here will claim oh no we don't discriminate as much as Muslims.

 

[Stewie]

Not having any clear distinction on what is forbidden food for hindus then describing Muslims who try to sell food which they think will be acceptable to hindus as hoodwinking - that is bigotry.

THIS IS JUST ABSOLUTELY HILARIOUS!

They are equating the concept of halal or kosher with their ideas of not allowing people to touch their food if they eat beef or kill animals. lol

 

[cricketjoshila]

we hire Christians and Hindus for domestic help all the time. In fact most domestic help in Pakistan is Christian, and I have encountered some Hindus as well.

I think we are seeing a pattern here but of course the Hindu defense league here will claim oh no we don't discriminate as much as Muslims.

Muslims are beef eaters. That's unacceptable to most Hindus and Hindus have a pooja room in their houses that's why Muslims are usually not hired for household work.

Most Christians in Pakistan are lowe caste Hindu converts and belong to the lower socio economic strata

 

[Stewie]

Muslims are beef eaters. That's unacceptable to most Hindus and Hindus have a pooja room in their houses that's why Muslims are usually not hired for household work.

Right, no I understand what you saying. That's all well and good. I am just curious if you explain this to a non Hindu, and a non Muslim, someone neutral, what would they feel is more discriminatory in nature. Hinduism or Islam. I am not making a judgment here, I am just posing a question. Obviously we cannot expect to give a sound and reasonable answer ourselves because we are biased towards our own faiths.

 

[cricketjoshila]

THIS IS JUST ABSOLUTELY HILARIOUS!

They are equating the concept of halal or kosher with their ideas of not allowing people to touch their food if they eat beef or kill animals. lol

Ofcourse religion of others and their beliefs are hilarious for you guys.

Not surprised. You have shown such disregard before too.

 

[Stewie]

Muslims are beef eaters. That's unacceptable to most Hindus and Hindus have a pooja room in their houses that's why Muslims are usually not hired for household work.

Most Christians in Pakistan are lowe caste Hindu converts and belong to the lower socio economic strata

Hindus and people of other faiths are most welcome to enter our masjids and sit with us on our prayer mat if they like. Just thought I should share.

 

[Stewie]

Ofcourse religion of others and their beliefs are hilarious for you guys.

Not surprised. You have shown such disregard before too.

I never said I find your faith hilarious. Perhaps learn to read and improve your comprehension capability.

I found your weak attempts to equate the two concepts of Islam and hinduism hilarious. I am actually defending your kind now because I feel you are within your rights, whether I believe its discrminatory or not is a different question. But I feel if you guys feel eating beef brings karma, more power to you. I DEFINITELY AM NOT DISREGARDING.

 

[Red-Indian]

Now that I understand the concept of negative energy and bad karma, I don't feel its discrminatory. It is a personal preference.

You can hold your views, whatever, who am I to tell you that.

But I feel you have zero to little understanding of the concept of Kosher and Zabeeha in the Abrahamic tradition. We are not Hindus who believe in bad karma or negative energy. We just want the animal sacrificed in the name of God and in a certain way for us to consume it. Once its slaughtered that way, a Hindu or Buddhist or Rastafarian or whomever can make nice beef kebabs out of it and serve us and we will eat it. We do not discriminate for touch of achoots or lower caste or people of other faiths... those are distinctly Hindu concepts.

Perhaps read up and educate yourself on those before issuing blanket judgments on them being discriminatory.

Most religious folks like to believe there is clarity in their religion but from a cursory reading

- Some Muslim scholars believe only an adult Muslim can do the slaughter. Some opine otherwise
- Some believe Zabiha is not even relevant and that only Haram food is prohibited

All religious folks including Hindus, Muslims,Jews and Jains have to make choices based on their interpretations of the scriptures, tradition and the scholars that they follow.

As long as there's no legal involvement, I think everyone should be allowed to and pissed off if they're hoodwinked. I've seen news of meat manufacturers caught mislabeling food as halal and of Muslims mislabeling their restaurants as pure-vegetarian during pilgrimage season. Both should be morally wrong but not legally.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Right, no I understand what you saying. That's all well and good. I am just curious if you explain this to a non Hindu, and a non Muslim, someone neutral, what would they feel is more discriminatory in nature. Hinduism or Islam. I am not making a judgment here, I am just posing a question. Obviously we cannot expect to give a sound and reasonable answer ourselves because we are biased towards our own faiths.

Muslims are employed in offices factories shops etc etc and there are usually no issues.

Cow slaughterers and beef eaters are commuting big sins in the eyes of Hindus and even Sikhs. To allow them anywhere near a place of worship is equivalent to desecration of the place

 

[cricketjoshila]

Hindus and people of other faiths are most welcome to enter our masjids and sit with us on our prayer mat if they like. Just thought I should share.

Islam is proselytising religion. Sanatan isn't.

 

[Stewie]

Most religious folks like to believe there is clarity in their religion but from a cursory reading

- Some Muslim scholars believe only an adult Muslim can do the slaughter. Some opine otherwise
- Some believe Zabiha is not even relevant and that only Haram food is prohibited

All religious folks including Hindus, Muslims,Jews and Jains have to make choices based on their interpretations of the scriptures, tradition and the scholars that they follow.

As long as there's no legal involvement, I think everyone should be allowed to and pissed off if they're hoodwinked. I've seen news of meat manufacturers caught mislabeling food as halal and of Muslims mislabeling their restaurants as pure-vegetarian during pilgrimage season. Both should be morally wrong but not legally.

Yes, you are correct, there will always be religious interpretations. At the most extreme, in Islam, people avoid food that could be suspect and not truly zabeeha. Then there are those who believe that non zabeeha is halal but makrooh (frowned upon)
so you see it becomes and more relaxed.

I have also heard from scholars that if a merchant claims to be Muslim and says it's zabeeha, you take their word in good faith and its halal for you. God will decide if they lied to you.

I, of course, cannot speak to what goes on in India. If Muslim owners try to lie and cheat Hindus by claiming their are Hindus and not Muslims and have never eaten beef, I feel that's definitely wrong.

 

[Stewie]

Islam is proselytising religion. Sanatan isn't.

While I feel grateful for you to try and defend your religion to me, I assure you there is no need for it.

 

[rpant_gabba]

While I don’t agree with all your thoughts here, it is probably the best explanation I have seen so far. Thank you for your candor. So it IS based on personal and individual preference in this particular case.

and religions and thier dogma isn't a personal individual preference? It like a club you join voluntarily isn't it?

 

[Stewie]

and religions and thier dogma isn't a personal individual preference? It like a club you join voluntarily isn't it?

Perhaps for you it is.
But for Muslims it is different. Muslims follow a codified lifestyle. If you choose to be a Muslim, you have to follow that lifestyle. So you may some individual preferences going against what Islam is telling you to do but if you want to be true to your faith your faith trumps your individual preference. I don't know if you understand that concept or not. I have come to believe that for Hindus its a very alien concept even though they have lived with Muslims for centuries.
Hinduism is flexible and all accepting. Islam is not and has set guidelines for everything. This has been discussed at length on these forums for years.

of course the other option is to not be a Muslim at all and that part is voluntary, sure.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Perhaps for you it is.
But for Muslims it is different. Muslims follow a codified lifestyle. If you choose to be a Muslim, you have to follow that lifestyle. So you may some individual preferences going against what Islam is telling you to do but if you want to be true to your faith your faith trumps your individual preference. I don't know if you understand that concept or not. I have come to believe that for Hindus its a very alien concept even though they have lived with Muslims for centuries.
Hinduism is flexible and all accepting. Islam is not and has set guidelines for everything. This has been discussed at length on these forums for years.

of course the other option is to not be a Muslim at all and that part is voluntary, sure.

Hinduism is flexible but it's not all accepting.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

Now that I understand the concept of negative energy and bad karma, I don't feel its discrminatory. It is a personal preference.

You can hold your views, whatever, who am I to tell you that.

But I feel you have zero to little understanding of the concept of Kosher and Zabeeha in the Abrahamic tradition. We are not Hindus who believe in bad karma or negative energy. We just want the animal sacrificed in the name of God and in a certain way for us to consume it. Once its slaughtered that way, a Hindu or Buddhist or Rastafarian or whomever can make nice beef kebabs out of it and serve us and we will eat it. We do not discriminate for touch of achoots or lower caste or people of other faiths... those are distinctly Hindu concepts.

Perhaps read up and educate yourself on those before issuing blanket judgments on them being discriminatory.

Sir, let me take your point 1 by 1.
1. Personal preference .... "Who am i to tell you that" : You have been doing that in the whole of this thread so far. Do I need to start quoting the exact posts too?

2. Understanding of Kosher and Zabeeha, Abrahmic Tradition : I do not claim to know better about Abrahamic traditions and hence I am not even questioning those. They are as they are. But you have been through out seem to be instructing other Hindus about their "own religion" and "what their preference " should be. Please go through your posts. You have met a few open Hindus in the west and assume thats all how it should be and are expertly telling others "What Hinduism is"


3. Now you have carefully skipped the part in slaughtering where it specifically says, no matter what, if a polytheist slaughters an animal even if invoking the proper Abrahmic religious words and all. The meat created will remain unfit because it was slaughtered by a polytheist. Let's not skip steps here plz.

Again I will go back to the point, Religious folks have their freedoms and thats a norm in our modern society.(whether its good or bad, thats beside the point). But religions calling each other discriminatory is always funny to me. Religion is a personal choice whether we like it or not. The only reason I am here in this thread is because I find it disingenuous where you are carefully skipping that the "who" slaughters the animal matters in Islamic faith. There is not even an inkling from your end to acknowledge this fact, you just side step to cooking and serving.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Hinduism is flexible but it's not all accepting.

Then hindus should probably arrive at some consensus on what is acceptable and what isn't. Because if you speak to a five different hindus you get five different answers.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

Then hindus should probably arrive at some consensus on what is acceptable and what isn't. Because if you speak to a five different hindus you get five different answers.

Religions dont really care about the comfort of other religions in their traditions, sir.
Which religion gives one consistent narrative on all aspects?? Please tell me, world would have been a lot peaceful if Shias and Sunnis had a consensus. or the Protestants and the Catholics.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Then hindus should probably arrive at some consensus on what is acceptable and what isn't. Because if you speak to a five different hindus you get five different answers.

Hinduism has different sects. The three main being Vaishnava Shaiva and Shakta. There are sub sects within it.

While broadly Hinduism has certain rules as laid down by Vedas anf Upanishads. Its interpretation by the Shankaracharyas.

Each sect and its sub sect has more focussed rules.

But none of the sects will condone cow slaughter.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Your opinion on Hinduism means zil

I think you don’t have an opinion as you don’t know of any such texts .

Any Hindu poster actually knowledgeable about their faith , who can post any evidence in Hindu texts to show Hindus cannot consume food bought from a non Hindu or a beef eater ?

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Hinduism has different sects. The three main being Vaishnava Shaiva and Shakta. There are sub sects within it.

While broadly Hinduism has certain rules as laid down by Vedas anf Upanishads. Its interpretation by the Shankaracharyas.

Each sect and its sub sect has more focussed rules.

But none of the sects will condone cow slaughter.

But there are plenty of hindus who will have no problem with cow slaughter, how do you account for those?

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Religions dont really care about the comfort of other religions in their traditions, sir.
Which religion gives one consistent narrative on all aspects?? Please tell me, world would have been a lot peaceful if Shias and Sunnis had a consensus. or the Protestants and the Catholics.

What have Shias or Protestants got to do with hindu dietary laws though? If you want to bring a comparison with them, then perhaps you should follow halal restrictions or the new testament?

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

What have Shias or Protestants got to do with hindu dietary laws though? If you want to bring a comparison with them, then perhaps you should follow halal restrictions or the new testament?

I just wish they could arrive upon some consensus brother! Nothing else. Dietary laws are peanuts compared to what that level consensus can do for world peace.

 

[Stewie]

Sir, let me take your point 1 by 1.
1. Personal preference .... "Who am i to tell you that" : You have been doing that in the whole of this thread so far. Do I need to start quoting the exact posts too?

2. Understanding of Kosher and Zabeeha, Abrahmic Tradition : I do not claim to know better about Abrahamic traditions and hence I am not even questioning those. They are as they are. But you have been through out seem to be instructing other Hindus about their "own religion" and "what their preference " should be. Please go through your posts. You have met a few open Hindus in the west and assume thats all how it should be and are expertly telling others "What Hinduism is"


3. Now you have carefully skipped the part in slaughtering where it specifically says, no matter what, if a polytheist slaughters an animal even if invoking the proper Abrahmic religious words and all. The meat created will remain unfit because it was slaughtered by a polytheist. Let's not skip steps here plz.

Again I will go back to the point, Religious folks have their freedoms and thats a norm in our modern society.(whether its good or bad, thats beside the point). But religions calling each other discriminatory is always funny to me. Religion is a personal choice whether we like it or not. The only reason I am here in this thread is because I find it disingenuous where you are carefully skipping that the "who" slaughters the animal matters in Islamic faith. There is not even an inkling from your end to acknowledge this fact, you just side step to cooking and serving.

you have to recite a certain prayer and believe in it when you slaughter the animal. Can Hindus do it?

Let us focus on #3, that’s the most contentious. So yes it’s an issue if you feel Hindus are being discriminated. Typically, in a prosperous land there are ample employment opportunities to go around. You can work at a zabeeha khana or jhakta khana.
This light not be the case in India. But more importantly nobody is asking these halal zabeeha khanas to post the names of the people who are working there.

In this case, this is happening. You can rant and rave your sarcastic remarks about how I am trying to show you what Hinduism should be. I assure you and I think you know not very well too that is a falsehood.
I have defended the right of Hindus for their belief. The implementation of it appears discriminatory is my only point.

I will never force a Hindu to but halal meat.
I would never force a Hindu to sell me halal meat.
I would never falsely sell Hindus any good or services that may not be acceptable to them.

I hope you remember my three points above before you launch any personal insulting tirade at me again. If you don’t cease, you lose my respect and go on ignore.
Thanks

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Exactly. When a hindu says he is selling Satwik food we take his word for it. If he is hoodwinking anyone the sin is on him.

I'll be honest with you.

What you are detailing is very strange to those unfamiliar to your tradition.

Here in my city there are many KFCs that are halal. They buy their meat from a halal supplier but the store owner is a white briton, the kitchen staff are African and Indian students.

I don't know what they eat or do in their spare time. There is no concept of their behaviours in their spare time making the food become impure. Before work they could be homosexual satanic blasphemerous. But if they work properly in the kitchen during work hours there is no issue.

What you guys are detailing - i.e food become impure because of who handles it not how they handle it is genuinely strange.

BUT if it is a genuine belief in your faith then some safeguards should be put into place to stop you from eating this stuff.

 

[Red-Indian]

I think you don’t have an opinion as you don’t know of any such texts .

Any Hindu poster actually knowledgeable about their faith , who can post any evidence in Hindu texts to show Hindus cannot consume food bought from a non Hindu or a beef eater ?

You seem to place a lot of importance on religious texts. I'm not sure why...or maybe I am. Muslims believe that religious texts... especially the Koran and the Hadiths are very important. Hindus don't. For Hindus, accepted practice, tradition and interpretation by gurus are far more important.

I know it's very difficult for you to accept such a world view but for most Hindus, it's difficult to accept why you're obsessed with one book among so many.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

I just wish they could arrive upon some consensus brother! Nothing else. Dietary laws are peanuts compared to what that level consensus can do for world peace.

Yes you are right, but that is a different topic, it has nothing to do with religious requirements of hindu eateries does it?

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

I'll be honest with you.

What you are detailing is very strange to those unfamiliar to your tradition.

Here in my city there are many KFCs that are halal. They buy their meat from a halal supplier but the store owner is a white briton, the kitchen staff are African and Indian students.

I don't know what they eat or do in their spare time. There is no concept of their behaviours in their spare time making the food become impure. Before work they could be homosexual satanic blasphemerous. But if they work properly in the kitchen during work hours there is no issue.

What you guys are detailing - i.e food become impure because of who handles it not how they handle it is genuinely strange.

BUT if it is a genuine belief in your faith then some safeguards should be put into place to stop you from eating this stuff.

Exactly. Only Hindus know their religion, it is not the job of others to tell them what they should eat or not eat. But that is why there needs to be clarity on it, and it should be based on something where there is consensus among Hindus, otherwise obviously there will be confusion.

 

[KingKhanWC]

You seem to place a lot of importance on religious texts. I'm not sure why...or maybe I am. Muslims believe that religious texts... especially the Koran and the Hadiths are very important. Hindus don't. For Hindus, accepted practice, tradition and interpretation by gurus are far more important.

I know it's very difficult for you to accept such a world view but for most Hindus, it's difficult to accept why you're obsessed with one book among so many.

Hindu faith is derived from texts .

But sure if some want to make up their own views , laws or rulings based on what you wrote , this is their choice but can’t claim it’s Hinduism.

Ok let’s go to logic :

When you buy a sandwich or salad from a store or supermarket, do you check if the owner doesn’t eat beef ?

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

you have to recite a certain prayer and believe in it when you slaughter the animal. Can Hindus do it?

Let us focus on #3, that’s the most contentious. So yes it’s an issue if you feel Hindus are being discriminated. Typically, in a prosperous land there are ample employment opportunities to go around. You can work at a zabeeha khana or jhakta khana.
This light not be the case in India. But more importantly nobody is asking these halal zabeeha khanas to post the names of the people who are working there.

In this case, this is happening. You can rant and rave your sarcastic remarks about how I am trying to show you what Hinduism should be. I assure you and I think you know not very well too that is a falsehood.
I have defended the right of Hindus for their belief. The implementation of it appears discriminatory is my only point.

I will never force a Hindu to but halal meat.
I would never force a Hindu to sell me halal meat.
I would never falsely sell Hindus any good or services that may not be acceptable to them.

I hope you remember my three points above before you launch any personal insulting tirade at me again. If you don’t cease, you lose my respect and go on ignore.
Thanks

Your first sentence is based on a false premise:
A Hindu can very well recite that prayer, but Islamic traditions will still treat it as haram because a Hindu or an atheist/ Buddhist /agnostic is not a man of the book.
A prayer is rejected or accepted based on the religious identity of the person. That sir is discrimination from my perspective.

Please read your posts calmly and try to see from a third person lens. It will come out as lecturing someone on Hinduism. It might be unintentional. Since, communication is a two way street, plz try to see how it can be perceived negatively.

and We both agree on the discriminatory aspect of this ridiculous step by BJP govt. Where we differ is that I am calling our discrimination in all religions

And lastly What you and me do personally hardly matters on the grand scheme isn't it? Its our own personal ethics and morals. I do not wish any insulting tirades against you, I believe you are one of the few genuine posters here who try to discuss on merit and not try to just gaslight and we can agree and disagree with other.

 

[Red-Indian]

I'll be honest with you.

What you are detailing is very strange to those unfamiliar to your tradition.

Here in my city there are many KFCs that are halal. They buy their meat from a halal supplier but the store owner is a white briton, the kitchen staff are African and Indian students.

I don't know what they eat or do in their spare time. There is no concept of their behaviours in their spare time making the food become impure. Before work they could be homosexual satanic blasphemerous. But if they work properly in the kitchen during work hours there is no issue.

What you guys are detailing - i.e food become impure because of who handles it not how they handle it is genuinely strange.

BUT if it is a genuine belief in your faith then some safeguards should be put into place to stop you from eating this stuff.

I think all these religious rules are very strange and from my teens it's been very difficult to get my head around them.

Jains don't want to harm any life except that life is getting harmed every minute around them
Hindus think cow slaughter is terrible but are willing to abandon cows to their fate once they're useless
Muslims won't eat pork because they're unclean but will eat cows that eat out of a garbage dump

With age though I've learnt to accept all these peculiarities as something they can't help believing in.

I still don't honestly respect the beliefs but respect the folks who have them and am willing to find a way to work around them. I've come to realise that's what life is about - finding a way to see the other
dude/dudette's point of view.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

Yes you are right, but that is a different topic, it has nothing to do with religious requirements of hindu eateries does it?

You asked for consensus and I just gave you examples on how tough consensus is in any religion. Just because people of the book are able to have some unified perspective on food, doesn't mean others can or should have too. Religions should have their own freedoms or you don't believe in religious freedom?

 

[Red-Indian]

Hindu faith is derived from texts .

But sure if some want to make up their own views , laws or rulings based on what you wrote , this is their choice but can’t claim it’s Hinduism.

Ok let’s go to logic :

When you buy a sandwich or salad from a store or supermarket, do you check if the owner doesn’t eat beef ?

No you have zero idea about Hindu faith.

Or about logic to be honest.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Hindus have every right to buy food from people who cook beef in their kitchen. Many Hindus are total vegetarians. So forget Muslims, many Hindus, Jains do not eat food from restaurants that serve chicken and goat.

Every religion has some kind of dietary restrictions its followers can accept or reject food served from certain sources.

 

[KingKhanWC]

No you have zero idea about Hindu faith.

Or about logic to be honest.

pls explain .

Ie

If I eat beef & I’m India . I see a poor hungry Hindu person , should he take a salad from me or risk death due to starvation?

 

[Stewie]

Your first sentence is based on a false premise:
A Hindu can very well recite that prayer, but Islamic traditions will still treat it as haram because a Hindu or an atheist/ Buddhist /agnostic is not a man of the book.
A prayer is rejected or accepted based on the religious identity of the person. That sir is discrimination from my perspective.

Please read your posts calmly and try to see from a third person lens. It will come out as lecturing someone on Hinduism. It might be unintentional. Since, communication is a two way street, plz try to see how it can be perceived negatively.

and We both agree on the discriminatory aspect of this ridiculous step by BJP govt. Where we differ is that I am calling our discrimination in all religions

And lastly What you and me do personally hardly matters on the grand scheme isn't it? Its our own personal ethics and morals. I do not wish any insulting tirades against you, I believe you are one of the few genuine posters here who try to discuss on merit and not try to just gaslight and we can agree and disagree with other.

My first sentence is based n absolute truth. Are you aware of the concept of niyah or niyat in Islam? I suggest you read up on it.

Every Muslim says niyat “intention” before offering prayers. The prayer is not accepted if he doesn’t sincerely mean it or believe it. Same goes for halal animal slaughter. You are saying Arabic words but that does not make it zabeeha. A Muslim has to mean it.

Do you think Hindus can mean it? If they have the right or requisite niyah, well they would be a Muslim then.

It’s not about simply saying a few words. I am not lecturing anyone on anything, I’m trying to educate you guys on Islam. Because you have been brainwashed into beliefs and misconceptions. Perhaps that’s the case with me and Hinduism too and I learnt and defend your stance. What’s indefensible is public naming of people’s faiths.

Hindu restaurant owners in the US but their meet from halal places to ensure Muslims can be their customers. And Muslims are happy to give them their business. They don’t ask for a list of people who prepared their food. You keep insisting the two issues are the same but they are not. Irrespective of beliefs, the approach to enforcing it is absolutely discriminatory.



If a Hindu with such beliefs lived in the west, do you think you can pull this law off, be honest? Because you live in India, where no such labor laws exist, it seems ok to you but I assure you if you ever come and live in the west, people will stare at you for even asking “I want to buy this bottle of chatni. Can you please tell me the guys who made it, bottled it and put it on the shelves had not eaten beef?”

 

[Red-Indian]

pls explain .

Ie

If I eat beef & I’m India . I see a poor hungry Hindu person , should he take a salad from me or risk death due to starvation?

Yes he should just like Muslims and Jews shouldn't crib about getting donated pork if they're a bit hungry and don't have the money to buy anything else.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

My first sentence is based n absolute truth. Are you aware of the concept of niyah or niyat in Islam? I suggest you read up on it.

Every Muslim says niyat “intention” before offering prayers. The prayer is not accepted if he doesn’t sincerely mean it or believe it. Same goes for halal animal slaughter. You are saying Arabic words but that does not make it zabeeha. A Muslim has to mean it.

Do you think Hindus can mean it? If they have the right or requisite niyah, well they would be a Muslim then.

It’s not about simply saying a few words. I am not lecturing anyone on anything, I’m trying to educate you guys on Islam. Because you have been brainwashed into beliefs and misconceptions. Perhaps that’s the case with me and Hinduism too and I learnt and defend your stance. What’s indefensible is public naming of people’s faiths.

Hindu restaurant owners in the US but their meet from halal places to ensure Muslims can be their customers. And Muslims are happy to give them their business. They don’t ask for a list of people who prepared their food. You keep insisting the two issues are the same but they are not. Irrespective of beliefs, the approach to enforcing it is absolutely discriminatory.



If a Hindu with such beliefs lived in the west, do you think you can pull this law off, be honest? Because you live in India, where no such labor laws exist, it seems ok to you but I assure you if you ever come and live in the west, people will stare at you for even asking “I want to buy this bottle of chatni. Can you please tell me the guys who made it, bottled it and put it on the shelves had not eaten beef?”

Here is the thing. "Niyat" is a common word for us so no need to explain the meaning. So "niyat" of a Muslim is acceptable while "niyat" of others is unacceptable. The actions are the same but we are classifying the "niyat" of the person based on his religion. Actual "niyat' of the person doesn't matter it seems or all Muslims by default have the right "niyat" on account of their faith. That's discrimination sir.

 

[guard]

Its called being arrogant, and why not.

When you win, have power, you naturally feed your ego. Lets have a brief look at the history of muslims.

Nail hit full on … finally someone said it!

 

[DeadlyVenom]

I think all these religious rules are very strange and from my teens it's been very difficult to get my head around them.

Jains don't want to harm any life except that life is getting harmed every minute around them
Hindus think cow slaughter is terrible but are willing to abandon cows to their fate once they're useless
Muslims won't eat pork because they're unclean but will eat cows that eat out of a garbage dump

With age though I've learnt to accept all these peculiarities as something they can't help believing in.

I still don't honestly respect the beliefs but respect the folks who have them and am willing to find a way to work around them. I've come to realise that's what life is about - finding a way to see the other
dude/dudette's point of view.

I think all these religious rules are very strange and from my teens it's been very difficult to get my head around them.

Jains don't want to harm any life except that life is getting harmed every minute around them
Hindus think cow slaughter is terrible but are willing to abandon cows to their fate once they're useless
Muslims won't eat pork because they're unclean but will eat cows that eat out of a garbage dump

With age though I've learnt to accept all these peculiarities as something they can't help believing in.

I still don't honestly respect the beliefs but respect the folks who have them and am willing to find a way to work around them. I've come to realise that's what life is about - finding a way to see the other
dude/dudette's point of view.

I think all these religious rules are very strange and from my teens it's been very difficult to get my head around them.

Jains don't want to harm any life except that life is getting harmed every minute around them
Hindus think cow slaughter is terrible but are willing to abandon cows to their fate once they're useless
Muslims won't eat pork because they're unclean but will eat cows that eat out of a garbage dump

With age though I've learnt to accept all these peculiarities as something they can't help believing in.

I still don't honestly respect the beliefs but respect the folks who have them and am willing to find a way to work around them. I've come to realise that's what life is about - finding a way to see the other
dude/dudette's point of view.

I agree with you although I am a thiest.

I don't understand Hindu traditions and won't be able to understand them completely through my own religions lens.

Btw although this probably will make it sound more absurd to you..pork isn't forbidden because it's unclean. That's a justification Muslims have came up with retrospectively.

 

[Stewie]

Here is the thing. "Niyat" is a common word for us so no need to explain the meaning. So "niyat" of a Muslim is acceptable while "niyat" of others is unacceptable. The actions are the same but we are classifying the "niyat" of the person based on his religion. Actual "niyat' of the person doesn't matter it seems or all Muslims by default have the right "niyat" on account of their faith. That's discrimination sir.

A Hindus niyat is not the same as a Muslim’s because they pray to different gods and not Allah or God as in the abrahamic tradition.

Discrimination is a word which means unjust or prejudicial treatment of someone based on a criteria.

Can you explain to me how it’s unjust for me to say a Hindu cannot slaughter a cow for me if my faith is dictating to me it needs to be a Muslim who does it?

I’m just following my faith. Or are you one of those atheists who believe all religions are discriminatory by principle and refuse to accept that people should have freedom of faith and religion?

 

[Justcrazy]

But the fssai law from 2006 says name and details of License have to be prominently displayed. So follow the law.

Its funny how you support Muslims using names of Hindu gods on their eateries to trap unsuspecting Hindus.

I am not supporting them , what I am saying if there is such a law then prosecute them under that .

 

[Justcrazy]

Let the community decide that whatever Tom, dick and Harry they want to decide.

This is exactly what is called cultural relativism.

On what principles and grounds will Hindu community decide? When you say I do not have any base , and constitution , any authority to follow?

 

[Justcrazy]

Decision of the community.

Practices passed down from generation to generation sort of like.

Traditions can be passed down without a book.

But when you say I am not bound by anything , then the same can be said about traditions.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

But when you say I am not bound by anything , then the same can be said about traditions.

You are right.

This is where it gets confusing to non Hindus.

Sometimes they appear flexible. Other times they appear not to be.

But I think guys like @cricketjoshila probably have their finger on the pulse of mainstream belief.

 

[Red-Indian]

I agree with you although I am a thiest.

I don't understand Hindu traditions and won't be able to understand them completely through my own religions lens.

Btw although this probably will make it sound more absurd to you..pork isn't forbidden because it's unclean. That's a justification Muslims have came up with retrospectively.

I absolutely respect that honestly. Over time, I've come to accept that religious belief is a deeply personal connection to the particular god you believe in. I have a lot of respect for people who hold to that belief and accept that they don't need external validation for it...only internal. I only debate with folks who turn that belief outwards.

I spent a lot of my teens and twenties on debating passionately on this stuff (online and (cringe)offline) as if I was the first person on earth who had discovered the true absurdity of religious beliefs and could trap religious guys in their own contradictions. Thankfully I grew up or else my sincerely religious wife would've thrown me out ages ago.

I've got to google a bit more on the pork prohibition. I've always though 6:145 is where it came from (though I'm aware there's a couple more verses on food) and that verse gives the reasoning.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

A Hindu’s n

A Hindus niyat is not the same as a Muslim’s because they pray to different gods and not Allah or God as in the abrahamic tradition.

Discrimination is a word which means unjust or prejudicial treatment of someone based on a criteria.

Can you explain to me how it’s unjust for me to say a Hindu cannot slaughter a cow for me if my faith is dictating to me it needs to be a Muslim who does it?

I’m just following my faith. Or are you one of those atheists who believe all religions are discriminatory by principle and refuse to accept that people should have freedom of faith and religion?

Finally, It took some posts to come to the crux of the matter isn't it? I am not going into the matter of whether its just or not, fair or not. I have been only pointing to that as per Islamic traditions halal meat has to be sourced from animal slaughtered by a person of the book. There is a firm religious restriction on "who" slaughters the animal in the supply chain of a halal meat.

In post 113, you very call out "discrimination based on religion". Here is the difference, The discriminatory aspects of Hindu laws have been outlawed by the Constitution but similar Islamic traditions have been allowed to survive in the name of minority protections. World has evolved and moved forward to discourage the discriminatory aspects of most religions but Islam has remained steadfast to preserve its 7th Century Arabic outlook.

Coming to current topic: There are tons of scriptures on who can cook, when to cook, how to cook, who can handle the food, who can serve the food and who cannot, it will make your head spin. And before we jump the gun, there are millions and millions those who follow that religiously. These "Kanwar yatri" belong to a particular group and have been very aggressive at slight objection to their beliefs system during their religious pilgrimage. Do we have the right to ignore belief system of their sect?


Your point about "what aboutism is very well right".
These BJP/RSS nutjobs instead of assimilating the positives of other religions are looking at the ugliest of the ugly aspects of other cultures/religions and saying to themselves "why can't we do that too!! "

 

[IndoorCricket]

On what principles and grounds will Hindu community decide? When you say I do not have any base , and constitution , any authority to follow?

Almost all Hindu traditions comes from the main Hindu scriptures Vedas (literally mean knowledge) and upanishads. The thing is practicing Hindus doesn't need to read these books. The knowledge is ingrained into their daily traditions and practices. Kind of auto-pilot. The knowledge has been passed down orally (Oral tradition).

These books are not authorities btw these are merely a guide to realise oneself. There are other schools of thoughts in Hinduism. Hindus religiously follow these traditions knowingly or unknowingly.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Yes he should just like Muslims and Jews shouldn't crib about getting donated pork if they're a bit hungry and don't have the money to buy anything else.

Salad is allowed for Hindus , pork isn’t for Muslims . You are again another confusing the food with the person giving . As a Hindu do you ask every food outlet assistant if they ever have eaten beef before buying ? Hindus also eat beef , some openly , others not . This is illogical & not practical

 

[cricketjoshila]

On what principles and grounds will Hindu community decide? When you say I do not have any base , and constitution , any authority to follow?

That's a matter of the Hindu community. No?

 

[Stewie]

Finally, It took some posts to come to the crux of the matter isn't it? I am not going into the matter of whether its just or not, fair or not. I have been only pointing to that as per Islamic traditions halal meat has to be sourced from animal slaughtered by a person of the book. There is a firm religious restriction on "who" slaughters the animal in the supply chain of a halal meat.

In post 113, you very call out "discrimination based on religion". Here is the difference, The discriminatory aspects of Hindu laws have been outlawed by the Constitution but similar Islamic traditions have been allowed to survive in the name of minority protections. World has evolved and moved forward to discourage the discriminatory aspects of most religions but Islam has remained steadfast to preserve its 7th Century Arabic outlook.

Coming to current topic: There are tons of scriptures on who can cook, when to cook, how to cook, who can handle the food, who can serve the food and who cannot, it will make your head spin. And before we jump the gun, there are millions and millions those who follow that religiously. These "Kanwar yatri" belong to a particular group and have been very aggressive at slight objection to their beliefs system during their religious pilgrimage. Do we have the right to ignore belief system of their sect?


Your point about "what aboutism is very well right".
These BJP/RSS nutjobs instead of assimilating the positives of other religions are looking at the ugliest of the ugly aspects of other cultures/religions and saying to themselves "why can't we do that too!! "

I am glad I was able to educate you. I hope you continue this progress and keep at it and don't give up while trying to learn other people's beliefs and cultures.

That being said, look up the definition of "discrimination". I will explain where I am heading with this.

While you do that, let me ask you another question: I want to put up a flag in my front yard. I go looking for poles. One guy is selling a wooden pole and another is selling one made of metal. If I decide to buy the wooden pole, am I discriminating against the guy selling the metal pole?

Think long and hard about this: this point is critical to what I am trying to communicate.

 

[cricketjoshila]

But when you say I am not bound by anything , then the same can be said about traditions.

Who said i am not bound? Where are you getting this?