Should Mohammad Rizwan still be in the squad after such performances?

[Rana]

With all that happened during the game, it still came down to the Super Over and Amir had the fate of the match in his hands and he bottled it

So why didn’t Karan Arjun come out to bat with 18 runs needed and went and to hide in their kit bags??

Those besharams can only hit the ball when there are 2 fielders outside the circle? And even then strike at 110???

 

[Mamoon]

Yes yes, he scored 0 (9) in the CPL few weeks back. No one could have scored a run in that innings.

 

[Mamoon]

So why didn’t Karan Arjun come out to bat with 18 runs needed and went and to hide in their kit bags??

Those besharams can only hit the ball when there are 2 fielders outside the circle? And even then strike at 110???

The match was done and shared when Mr. Big moments player conceded 19 runs. No point in blaming the batsmen. Babar and Rizwan are not power hitters anyway and you send your power hitters for Super Overs.

It is not written anywhere that your regular openers should also bat in the Super Over. In fact, for most teams, the regular openers won’t be the one batting in the Super Over.

 

[Rana]

Yes yes, he scored 0 (9) in the CPL few weeks back. No one could have scored a run in that innings.

Well who sent Peshawar Zalmi home crying in this year’s PSL? What about the tears of Babar fans that still haven’t dried up at Rawalpindi?? Who did that? Who made them cry??

 

[bunda_bindaas]

Social media didn’t make him average 40+ in all formats. Rizwan is an excellent cricketer and as far as his T20 SR is concerned, it is the same as that of Dhoni and Pant, two players who are treated like heroes in India.

Unfortunately, Pakistanis always find way to discredit and downplay their successful cricketers. They get no protection unlike players from other countries.

As far as his future is concerned, his position is under no threat at all because none of the other WKs anywhere near him.

Rizwan will remain a mainstay in all formats for years to come unless a prodigy appears out of nowhere.

Your use of stats is quite dubious.

First, MSD played his last T20I 5.5 years ago -- that's an eternity in T20 cricket. The game has since moved on.

Second, Dhoni was not an opener and he didn't have to maximize the use of powerplay overs.

Third, Pant is hardly eulogized for his 'heroics' in T20Is. He's rightly lauded for his skills in Test cricket.

 

[TheSultan]

When did this become an Imad and Amir thread?

This is about Rizwan and with 0 off 12, where does he go from here.

This match was the ultimate humiliation for Babar and Rizwan. It’s not as if either got absolute Jaffa’s or got a first baller which you can sometimes excuse because they can be caught cold.

Babar let England back in the game with his slow batting and was outscored and outgunned by Naseem and even Shaheen.

Rizwan couldn’t even get off the mark off 12 balls!

And all the posturing “we are nothing without Babar and Rizwan”, well we made 526 without them in this innings. So what’s the next piece of propaganda?

 

[Mamoon]

Your use of stats is quite dubious.

First, MSD played his last T20I 5.5 years ago -- that's an eternity in T20 cricket. The game has since moved on.

Second, Dhoni was not an opener and he didn't have to maximize the use of powerplay overs.

Third, Pant is hardly eulogized for his 'heroics' in T20Is. He's rightly lauded for his skills in Test cricket.

Dhoni was a bang average cricketer, the biggest scam in Indian cricket history.

 

[bunda_bindaas]

Dhoni was a bang average cricketer, the biggest scam in Indian cricket history.

Still, his trophy cabinet is bigger than the homes of people who criticize him!

 

[Mamoon]

First, MSD played his last T20I 5.5 years ago -- that's an eternity in T20 cricket. The game has since moved on.

None of that actually happened. Time to expose this myth too. The average scores in T20 WCs have not changed much. You are looking too much into IPL scoring rates that don’t reflect T20Is.

Dhoni was always a mediocre T20I batsman just like he was a mediocre Test batsman. It had nothing to do with eras.

He was decent in ODIs with his finisher gimmick, but it wasn’t a difficult or a vital role to begin with. He took advantage of excellent top order players.

 

[bunda_bindaas]

I think Rizwan can still be excused from criticism because he had a good series against Bangladesh.

But what about Babar? 30 off 71 balls on this pitch?

 

[Mamoon]

Still, his trophy cabinet is bigger than the homes of people who criticize him!

Yes, the CT becomes relevant when it comes to flexing Dhoni’s trophy count but it becomes irrelevant when it comes to deflecting the biggest a** whooping any team has ever suffered in an ICC final.

 

[Mamoon]

I think Rizwan can still be excused from criticism because he had a good series against Bangladesh.

But what about Babar? 30 off 71 balls on this pitch?

Babar is going through a bad patch. Literally every batsman in history minus perhaps the Don has gone through such patches. It is not the end of the world.

Babar is only entering his prime years as a batsman now (30-31) and he will score lots of runs in the coming years.

Indian fans should be worried about how big of a clown Kohli has been in Test cricket for 4 years now and for how long will BCCI look to carry him.

 

[bunda_bindaas]

None of that actually happened. Time to expose this myth too. The average scores in T20 WCs have not changed much. You are looking too much into IPL scoring rates that don’t reflect T20Is.

Dhoni was always a mediocre T20I batsman just like he was a mediocre Test batsman. It had nothing to do with eras.

He was decent in ODIs with his finisher gimmick, but it wasn’t a difficult or a vital role to begin with. He took advantage of excellent top order players.

When we are discussing batsmen, in this case Rizwan and his SR, you can't just shift the goalpost by talking about average scores.

Here are the Highest Strike Rates since Dhoni retired: (among Test playing nations)

SKY -- 169
Salt -- 165
Jaiswal -- 164
Head -- 163
Josh Inglis -- 160

This is what you are trying to hide by bringing up dubious stats.

 

[shariqnoor]

Amir was the reason why Pakistan lost. With all that happened during the game, it still came down to the Super Over and Amir had the fate of the match in his hands and he bottled it.

We all know what you would have said had Hassan Ali bowled that over.

Similarly, Imad was the reason why Pakistan lost to India. The equation was run a ball when Rizwan and Fakhar got out and Imad bottled it.

We all know what you would have said had Nawaz played that innings.

So don’t talk about truth. Everyone knows you are a pathological liar with zero intelligence and zero knowledge of cricket.

Why do you even waste your time dealing with a clown who thought Abid Ali should replace Fakhar Zaman as opener in ODI and Asif Ali should replace Fakhar as opener in T20s. And to top it all off, said that Salman Butt was maturing into an ideal opener in T20 cricket with a career SR of 108. That's the level of intelligence you are dealing with here. Better to spend your time somewhere else.

 

[bunda_bindaas]

Yes, the CT becomes relevant when it comes to flexing Dhoni’s trophy count but it becomes irrelevant when it comes to deflecting the biggest a** whooping any team has ever suffered in an ICC final.

You can take away CT and you'd still have a smaller house than his trophy cabinet!

 

[bunda_bindaas]

Babar is going through a bad patch. Literally every batsman in history minus perhaps the Don has gone through such patches. It is not the end of the world.

Babar is only entering his prime years as a batsman now (30-31) and he will score lots of runs in the coming years.

Indian fans should be worried about how big of a clown Kohli has been in Test cricket for 4 years now and for how long will BCCI look to carry him.

LOL

Kohli still averages 49! Try harder next time.

And yeah, keep believing that Babar is still 30-31.

 

[Rana]

Why do you even waste your time dealing with a clown who thought Abid Ali should replace Fakhar Zaman as opener in ODI and Asif Ali should replace Fakhar as opener in T20s. And to top it all off, said that Salman Butt was maturing into an ideal opener in T20 cricket with a career SR of 108. That's the level of intelligence you are dealing with here. Better to spend your time somewhere else.

But but but the players don’t take Shan’s approach seriously

 

[mominsaigol]

LOL

Kohli still averages 49! Try harder next time.

And yeah, keep believing that Babar is still 30-31.

Babar's real age should be 30-31? I dont think he's age fudged.

His loss of fitness has made him looker older then kohli though

 

[bunda_bindaas]

Babar's real age should be 30-31? I dont think he's age fudged.

His loss of fitness has made him looker older then kohli though

His loss of form seems related to age-related decline. His reaction times are definitely slower.

I'm guessing he's at least 2-3 years older than his official age.

It's not uncommon for South Asian cricketers to fudge their ages. It happens in India as well, before someone jumps on my comments!

 

[bunda_bindaas]

His loss of form seems related to age-related decline. His reaction times are definitely slower.

I'm guessing he's at least 2-3 years older than his official age.

It's not uncommon for South Asian cricketers to fudge their ages. It happens in India as well, before someone jumps on my comments!

30-32, otherwise, is statistically the age when most, if not all, Batsmen hit their peak form.

There are other factors in play as well. Babar is a touch player and relies a lot on his hand-eye coordination. That's the first thing that slows down with age.

 

[mominsaigol]

His loss of form seems related to age-related decline. His reaction times are definitely slower.

I'm guessing he's at least 2-3 years older than his official age.

It's not uncommon for South Asian cricketers to fudge their ages. It happens in India as well, before someone jumps on my comments!

Yes but I don't this is the case with bobby, I've seen him play when he was even in under 13's. It's clear he's under 13 then.

He and sami aslam were in the same ballpark.

 

[mominsaigol]

30-32, otherwise, is statistically the age when most, if not all, Batsmen hit their peak form.

There are other factors in play as well. Babar is a touch player and relies a lot on his hand-eye coordination. That's the first thing that slows down with age.

Even if he was 32, 32 is not the age where your reactions slow down to such an extent bhai.

4 years ago steve smith was 31 and still hit a 62 ball 100 against India which included bumrah then a year later at 32 hit a double century in test.

The slow reactions thing only happened to him at age 35.

Warner even in 2023 was taking pakistan to the cleaners and still butchered rubbish bowling. Yes he wasnt as good in 2023 and 2024 as compared to his 2015 self but he was still murdering bowlers and not every shot was brute force. His favourite shot which is getting on one knee and scopping it and his drives and touch plays were still fine.

Babar can't even deal with rubbish bowling at 29 or let's say age fudged to 32. Infact Shan is older then he is and more rubbish but still somehow performing better then the King.

It's time to admit to he's lost fitness, interest in test and was overhyped to begin with.

 

[bunda_bindaas]

Yes but I don't this is the case with bobby, I've seen him play when he was even in under 13's. It's clear he's under 13 then.

He and sami aslam were in the same ballpark

Joe Root still looks like he's under 30! Looks can be deceiving.

I'm not saying he has definitely fudged his age. But his game is clearly not the same.

Shots that can be played in youth become all the more difficult when someone ages beyond a certain point.

It happens to all cricketers, even the greatest ones. Tendulkar under the age of 30 was a completely different (awe-inspiring and domineering) batsman but he had the skill and the temperament to adapt his game with age.

Hence the reason for his longevity, and of course his records.

 

[bunda_bindaas]

Even if he was 32, 32 is not the age where your reactions slow down to such an extent bhai.

4 years ago steve smith was 31 and still hit a 62 ball 100 against India which included bumrah then a year later at 32 hit a double century in test.

The slow reactions thing only happened to him at age 35.

Warner even in 2023 was taking pakistan to the cleaners and still butchered rubbish bowling. Yes he wasnt as good in 2023 and 2024 as compared to his 2015 self but he was still murdering bowlers and not every shot was brute force. His favourite shot which is getting on one knee and scopping it and his drives and touch plays were still fine.

Babar can't even deal with rubbish bowling at 29 or let's say age fudged to 32. Infact Shan is older then he is and more rubbish but still somehow performing better then the King.

It's time to admit to he's lost fitness, interest in test and was overhyped to begin with.

Babar was hyped up beyond a certain point, there is no doubt about that.

It's also true that his game relies on less feet movement and more hand-eye coordination. He doesn't have a great defensive game either.

Players who rely heavily on hand-eye coordination start to decline the earliest. Sehwag is a prime example and now Steve Smith is also going to struggle because of it.

Warner was supremely fit, probably the fittest in the Australian squad, which is why he could extend his decline by a few more years.

 

[mominsaigol]

Joe Root still looks like he's under 30! Looks can be deceiving.

I'm not saying he has definitely fudged his age. But his game is clearly not the same.

Shots that can be played in youth become all the more difficult when someone ages beyond a certain point.

It happens to all cricketers, even the greatest ones. Tendulkar under the age of 30 was a completely different (awe-inspiring and domineering) batsman but he had the skill and the temperament to adapt his game with age.

Hence the reason for his longevity, and of course his records.

Bro root does not look under 30. It's clear as day he's in his 30's lol. Maybe the short height, but looking at his face I can tell his early 30's.

Tendulkar doesn't have any relevance here, everyone knows about his longetivity and why he's an ATG, actually no an ATG's of ATG's.

However all I'm saying is babar is rubbish due to fitness, loss of interest and just losing form, but it doesn't have anything to do with age.

29-32 isn't the age to falter. He's faltering because the simple hype mantra has died down. Almost everyone has figured bobby out now. Dude always had a non existent backfoot play and uneven balance at the crease, even against woakes, he got out due to poor balance, he got himself into a very awaknward position, a bit better balance and he could have nudged it away on the legside for a single

 

[mominsaigol]

Babar was hyped up beyond a certain point, there is no doubt about that.

It's also true that his game relies on less feet movement and more hand-eye coordination. He doesn't have a great defensive game either.

Players who rely heavily on hand-eye coordination start to decline the earliest. Sehwag is a prime example and now Steve Smith is also going to struggle because of it.

Warner was supremely fit, probably the fittest in the Australian squad, which is why he could extend his decline by a few more years.

He wasnt hyped by me. Regardless I don't disagree with you. I agree with you but we're looking at things from different perspectives that's all.

 

[bunda_bindaas]

Bro root does not look under 30. It's clear as day he's in his 30's lol. Maybe the short height, but looking at his face I can tell his early 30's.

Tendulkar doesn't have any relevance here, everyone knows about his longetivity and why he's an ATG, actually no an ATG's of ATG's.

However all I'm saying is babar is rubbish due to fitness, loss of interest and just losing form, but it doesn't have anything to do with age.

29-32 isn't the age to falter. He's faltering because the simple hype mantra has died down. Almost everyone has figured bobby out now. Dude always had a non existent backfoot play and uneven balance at the crease, even against woakes, he got out due to poor balance, he got himself into a very awaknward position, a bit better balance and he could have nudged it away on the legside for a single

Babar takes his guard on the off-stump and then proceeds to stand slightly outside it to combat any LBW shouts.

Woakes set him up with an outswinger followed by an inswinger and Babar fell into the trap.

The ball was new, which meant it had more zip and carry from the surface, his reaction time was slow and he got caught on the crease.

The reason I call his defensive game into question is because he doesn't move his feet too much. There is no trigger movement, he's almost static at the crease.

If he had a back and across trigger movement for instance, he'd have little difficulty in playing the ball defensively.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

Babar is going through a bad patch. Literally every batsman in history minus perhaps the Don has gone through such patches. It is not the end of the world.

Babar is only entering his prime years as a batsman now (30-31) and he will score lots of runs in the coming years.

Indian fans should be worried about how big of a clown Kohli has been in Test cricket for 4 years now and for how long will BCCI look to carry him.

Babar has been in bad patch all his career with the exception of one or two knocks.

You give him Nepal and he will magically get back into form.

You can deceive the average Joe but if you going to try mental gymnastics for people with some intelligence, you will need something better than politics to try to weasel an average player like Babar into a world class batsmen.

 

[Mamoon]

When we are discussing batsmen, in this case Rizwan and his SR, you can't just shift the goalpost by talking about average scores.

Here are the Highest Strike Rates since Dhoni retired: (among Test playing nations)

SKY -- 169
Salt -- 165
Jaiswal -- 164
Head -- 163
Josh Inglis -- 160

This is what you are trying to hide by bringing up dubious stats.

There are outliers in every era and including the first 10 years of T20 cricket when Dhoni played.

Players had 180+ SR even in the last T20 World Cup that Dhoni played.

That proves nothing. If you claim that that the T20 game has moved on since Dhoni’s retirement was true, it would have reflected in the average team totals.

The average team totals is a true indicator of a paradigm shift. This paradigm shift has not happened in T20I in the last 5 years. It may have happened in the IPL but it has not happened at the international level.

You cannot prove it by numbers and I can prove it by numbers. The average team totals year by year + the average totals in each T20 WC reflects that there has no significant change in how T20 cricket is played at the international and Dhoni’s SR was poor even for his era.

There has been a paradigm shift in how ODI cricket is played and we saw that in early 2010s but that has not happened in T20Is yet.

 

[Mamoon]

LOL

Kohli still averages 49! Try harder next time.

And yeah, keep believing that Babar is still 30-31.

And Babar still averages 45 in spite of being out of form for 2 years and there is every chance that Babar gets his average above 49 in the next few years because he is in a bad moment in his career while Kohli is a spent force considering he is close to 37-38 now.

And Babar is 30-31 unless you can prove it otherwise which you can’t

Had you watched him make his debut in 2015 and had you followed him earlier than that, you would know that he isn’t an age fudger. Check his pictures from early 2010 and you would see that his age is correct.

Age fudgers in Pakistan are the likes of Iftikhar, Naseem, Shafique currently but Babar isn’t one of them.

 

[Mamoon]

Babar has been in bad patch all his career with the exception of one or two knocks.

You give him Nepal and he will magically get back into form.

You can deceive the average Joe but if you going to try mental gymnastics for people with some intelligence, you will need something better than politics to try to weasel an average player like Babar into a world class batsmen.

An average player does not average 45 in Tests (while being in poor form for 2 years), 56 in ODIs and 41 in T20Is.

An average player does not score 13k+ runs by 28-29

An average player doesn’t score 30+ tons.

If Babar is average with this body work, then I wonder what adjective you’d use to define actually average players, for example, 99% of the batsmen to play for Pakistan in the last 15-20 years.

You are insulting actually intelligent people by demanding to be grouped alongside them because the quality and depth of your arguments regarding Babar are the complete opposite of what I would categorize as intelligent. You talk out of your backside.

 

[mominsaigol]

And Babar still averages 45 in spite of being out of form for 2 years and there is every chance that Babar gets his average above 49 in the next few years because he is in a bad moment in his career while Kohli is a spent force considering he is close to 37-38 now.

And Babar is 30-31 unless you can prove it otherwise which you can’t.

Had you watched him make his debut in 2015 and had you followed him earlier than that, you would know that he isn’t an age fudger. Check his pictures from early 2010 and you would see that his age is correct.

Age fudgers in Pakistan are the likes of Iftikhar, Naseem, Shafique currently but Babar isn’t one of them.

Babar is 29, I doubt he's an age fudger, he was born in walled city of Lahore. Not in some random area of balochistam or any under developed part.

 

[Mamoon]

Babar is 29, I doubt he's an age fudger, he was born in walled city of Lahore. Not in some random area of balochistam or any under developed part.

Anyone who has followed Babar’s career and cricketing journey from the beginning (circa 2009 etc.) would know that his stated age is correct. I’m not saying it is 100% but he clearly doesn’t fall in the age cheating spectrum like some of the other players who do are clearly 4-5 years older than what they claim.

But these Indians who started watching cricket 4 years ago start handing out age validation certifications because that is what their rectum told them.

 

[Mamoon]

Why do you even waste your time dealing with a clown who thought Abid Ali should replace Fakhar Zaman as opener in ODI and Asif Ali should replace Fakhar as opener in T20s. And to top it all off, said that Salman Butt was maturing into an ideal opener in T20 cricket with a career SR of 108. That's the level of intelligence you are dealing with here. Better to spend your time somewhere else.

Well said. It is always a pleasure reading your intelligent and insightful posts, too bad posters like you are getting outnumbered big time.

The quality of content here is certainly going down the drain and a lot of it has to do with the liberty that these low intelligent trolls enjoy.

The number of quality posters has decreased by about 50% in the last couple of years.

If we talk about Indians only, you would only get 2-3 quality posters these days.

 

[RyanRyan10]

When we are discussing batsmen, in this case Rizwan and his SR, you can't just shift the goalpost by talking about average scores.

Here are the Highest Strike Rates since Dhoni retired: (among Test playing nations)

SKY -- 169
Salt -- 165
Jaiswal -- 164
Head -- 163
Josh Inglis -- 160

This is what you are trying to hide by bringing up dubious stats.

He is struggling to defend Rizwan so bringing other players into discussion and taking digs at people's identity.

 

[bunda_bindaas]

There are outliers in every era and including the first 10 years of T20 cricket when Dhoni played.

Players had 180+ SR even in the last T20 World Cup that Dhoni played.

That proves nothing. If you claim that that the T20 game has moved on since Dhoni’s retirement was true, it would have reflected in the average team totals.

The average team totals is a true indicator of a paradigm shift. This paradigm shift has not happened in T20I in the last 5 years. It may have happened in the IPL but it has not happened at the international level.

You cannot prove it by numbers and I can prove it by numbers. The average team totals year by year + the average totals in each T20 WC reflects that there has no significant change in how T20 cricket is played at the international and Dhoni’s SR was poor even for his era.

There has been a paradigm shift in how ODI cricket is played and we saw that in early 2010s but that has not happened in T20Is yet.

First off, the five players I've mentioned have the highest strike rates in the history of T20Is (excluding associate nations) -- and they all made their debut after Dhoni retired. Which proves the point that the game has moved on, in a significant way.

Second, out of those top 5, 4 are openers, which Rizwan is as well. And he strikes at 126 compared to 160+ strike rates recorded by others. Process that stat for a moment.

These are not outliers, this is how the game has progressed.

Third, these are AVERAGE strike rates. When you compare a player's strike rate, you don't compare AVERAGE scores a team makes. You'd fail Math 101, if not straight up thrown out of class.

Fourth, you are on a mission to prove yourself worse than that Sri Lankan clown Daniel Alexander. If Dhoni's SR was poor for his era, you are calling Rizwan great for barely being able to match it, more than half a decade later. HALF A DECADE LATER!

This is beyond pathetic, really.

 

[bunda_bindaas]

The best position to bat in T20 is the opener's slot. No question about it. The field is up, the ball stops swinging within 2 overs and the kind of wickets that are there, it's easy to go over the top.

If despite these advantages, Rizwan strikes at 126 and he's compared to Dhoni who retired 5.5 years ago, that just shows the desperation of delusional Rizwan apologists.

If that's not enough, Dhoni, for the last 2 years in the IPL has been striking at 182 and 220!

 

[Mamoon]

First off, the five players I've mentioned have the highest strike rates in the history of T20Is (excluding associate nations) -- and they all made their debut after Dhoni retired. Which proves the point that the game has moved on, in a significant way.

Second, out of those top 5, 4 are openers, which Rizwan is as well. And he strikes at 126 compared to 160+ strike rates recorded by others. Process that stat for a moment.

These are not outliers, this is how the game has progressed.

Third, these are AVERAGE strike rates. When you compare a player's strike rate, you don't compare AVERAGE scores a team makes. You'd fail Math 101, if not straight up thrown out of class.

Fourth, you are on a mission to prove yourself worse than that Sri Lankan clown Daniel Alexander. If Dhoni's SR was poor for his era, you are calling Rizwan great for barely being able to match it, more than half a decade later. HALF A DECADE LATER!

This is beyond pathetic, really.

The best position to bat in T20 is the opener's slot. No question about it. The field is up, the ball stops swinging within 2 overs and the kind of wickets that are there, it's easy to go over the top.

If despite these advantages, Rizwan strikes at 126 and he's compared to Dhoni who retired 5.5 years ago, that just shows the desperation of delusional Rizwan apologists.

If that's not enough, Dhoni, for the last 2 years in the IPL has been striking at 182 and 220!

You are digging harder than a Caterpillar excavator and have become so desperate that you have now resorted to quoting Dhoni’s IPL SR since 2022 to prove that there has been a change in how T20 cricket is approached at the international level.

You know that you have fumbled big time and made a blanket statement that you cannot support, defend and justify with numbers.

I repeat:

In terms of batting approach, if there was a change in how T20I cricket was played over the last few years or since Dhoni retired, it would have reflected in the average team totals.

The average team totals is the most reliable indicator of the collective mindset of teams and how they approach T20I batting.

We saw that in ODIs in early 2010s where there was a global increase in 300+ scores and suddenly, the perception of what a good SR was changed.

T20 cricket has not achieved that evolution at the international level yet. It has happened in IPL where the averages scores have increased significantly in the last few years and therefore, the perception of what a good or bad SR is also changed.

At the international level, that has not happened yet. It might happen in the future but as of now, T20 internationals are being played in the same way as they were played 10 years ago.

Today, a score of 180+ is a high score in T20Is just like it was 10 years ago. A great total and a bad total during Dhoni’s time is still a great total and a bad total.

Therefore, your original assertion that Dhoni’s SR was good for his time and the game has moved on is completely incorrect and baseless.

His SR was not good for his time either. He was just an average T20I batsman just like he was an average Test batsman and is still not a good SR.

A SR of 127 was not good in 2014 and it is not good in 2024. I have no issues with people criticizing Rizwan for his SR but that criticism should be within reason and unfortunately, his critics go overboard with the criticism.

A batsman who averages close to 50 @ 127 is not the perfect T20I batsman but he is far from the worst either, especially when playing for a team that has a very weak batting lineup. At the end of the day, you have to score runs as well and SR not backed up a decent volume of runs will not help a team like Pakistan that has a fragile batting lineup.

All in all, Rizwan is a superior T20 batsman than both Dhoni and Pant at international level because he scores almost twice as many runs as they do at the same SR.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

You are talking absolute nonsense now and the straw clutching is hilarious to witness. You are digging harder than a Caterpillar excavator and have become so desperate that you have now resorted to quoting Dhoni’s IPL SR since 2022 to prove that there has been a change in how T20 cricket is approached at the international level.

You know that you have fumbled big time and made a blanket statement that you cannot support, defend and justify with numbers.

I repeat:

In terms of batting approach, if there was a change in how T20I cricket was played over the last few years or since Dhoni retired, it would have reflected in the average team totals.

The average team totals is the most reliable indicator of the collective mindset of teams and how they approach T20I batting.

We saw that in ODIs in early 2010s where there was a global increase in 300+ scores and suddenly, the perception of what a good SR was changed.

T20 cricket has not achieved that evolution at the international level yet. It has happened in IPL where the averages scores have increased significantly in the last few years and therefore, the perception of what a good or bad SR is also changed.

At the international level, that has not happened yet. It might happen in the future but as of now, T20 internationals are being played in the same way as they were played 10 years ago.

Today, a score of 180+ is a high score in T20Is just like it was 10 years ago. A great total and a bad total during Dhoni’s time is still a great total and a bad total.

Therefore, your original assertion that Dhoni’s SR was good for his time and the game has moved on is completely incorrect and baseless.

His SR was not good for his time either. He was just an average T20I batsman just like he was an average Test batsman and is still not a good SR.

A SR of 127 was not good in 2014 and it is not good in 2024. I have no issues with people criticizing Rizwan for his SR but that criticism should be within reason and unfortunately, his critics go overboard with the criticism.

A batsman who averages close to 50 @ 127 is not the perfect T20I batsman but he is far from the worst either, especially when playing for a team that has a very weak batting lineup. At the end of the day, you have to score runs as well and SR not backed up a decent volume of runs will not help a team like Pakistan that has a fragile batting lineup.

All in all, Rizwan is a superior T20 batsman than both Dhoni and Pant at international level because he scores almost twice as many runs as they do at the same SR.

I dont care about Dhoni.

But nice to see you supporting Greek mythology where Rizwan and Zeus have a bond and if Rizwan fails, Zeus manages to cry as well.

Good luck convincing anyone that Rizwan the clown deserves to be in T20 team.

 

[bunda_bindaas]

You are talking absolute nonsense now and the straw clutching is hilarious to witness. You are digging harder than a Caterpillar excavator and have become so desperate that you have now resorted to quoting Dhoni’s IPL SR since 2022 to prove that there has been a change in how T20 cricket is approached at the international level.

You know that you have fumbled big time and made a blanket statement that you cannot support, defend and justify with numbers.

I repeat:

In terms of batting approach, if there was a change in how T20I cricket was played over the last few years or since Dhoni retired, it would have reflected in the average team totals.

The average team totals is the most reliable indicator of the collective mindset of teams and how they approach T20I batting.

We saw that in ODIs in early 2010s where there was a global increase in 300+ scores and suddenly, the perception of what a good SR was changed.

T20 cricket has not achieved that evolution at the international level yet. It has happened in IPL where the averages scores have increased significantly in the last few years and therefore, the perception of what a good or bad SR is also changed.

At the international level, that has not happened yet. It might happen in the future but as of now, T20 internationals are being played in the same way as they were played 10 years ago.

Today, a score of 180+ is a high score in T20Is just like it was 10 years ago. A great total and a bad total during Dhoni’s time is still a great total and a bad total.

Therefore, your original assertion that Dhoni’s SR was good for his time and the game has moved on is completely incorrect and baseless.

His SR was not good for his time either. He was just an average T20I batsman just like he was an average Test batsman and is still not a good SR.

A SR of 127 was not good in 2014 and it is not good in 2024. I have no issues with people criticizing Rizwan for his SR but that criticism should be within reason and unfortunately, his critics go overboard with the criticism.

A batsman who averages close to 50 @ 127 is not the perfect T20I batsman but he is far from the worst either, especially when playing for a team that has a very weak batting lineup. At the end of the day, you have to score runs as well and SR not backed up a decent volume of runs will not help a team like Pakistan that has a fragile batting lineup.

All in all, Rizwan is a superior T20 batsman than both Dhoni and Pant at international level because he scores almost twice as many runs as they do at the same SR.

40 out of (70) of the highest match aggregates of ALL TIME in T20Is, excluding associate nations, have come in the time period after Dhoni retired. 34 out of those 70 have come in the last 4 years alone.

So, you are wrong again, as usual.

 

[Master Blaster]

It seems a five day highway. Guessing Rizzu scored a ton in the 1st innings.

 

[Buffet]

I dont care about Dhoni.

But nice to see you supporting Greek mythology where Rizwan and Zeus have a bond and if Rizwan fails, Zeus manages to cry as well.

Good luck convincing anyone that Rizwan the clown deserves to be in T20 team.

Babar and Rizwan, both are very bad in T20. Take a look at 500+ runs by openers and SR. Both should stop playing T20.

 

[bunda_bindaas]

Babar and Rizwan, both are very bad in T20. Take a look at 500+ runs by openers and SR. Both should stop playing T20.

View attachment 146676

Thank you for this!

4 out of the top 5 made their debuts in T20Is after Dhoni retired!

 

[PakPremi]

Rizwan has an impressive average, and both Babar and Rizwan good number of 50s compare to most others. No point having good strike rate even in T20s if on average you getting out in 20s.

 

[Mamoon]

Sasta Daniel Alexander bro,

40 out of (70) of the highest match aggregates of ALL TIME in T20Is, excluding associate nations, have come in the time period after Dhoni retired. 34 out of those 70 have come in the last 4 years alone.

So, you are wrong again, as usual.

I repeat:

If there is no shift in average T20I team totals, that means that the approach towards the format has not changed.

That also means that the perception of what a good SR is or isn’t has also not changed.

That also means that a SR of 127 is not only poor today but was also poor 5 or 10 years ago as well.

That also means that Dhoni was not a good T20I batsman even during his time.

That also means that Rizwan is a better T20I batsman than Dhoni because both have similar SR but Rizwan scores twice as many runs.

I know Dhoni’s poor batting in T20Is has caused you a lot of pain, but next time you want to defend how he played this format, come up with actual facts & figures otherwise you will have trousers pulled down for making baseless assertions.

The problem is that Indian fans are still used to dealing with regular Pakistani fans on PP who would get intimated. Now that I’m ready to stand up for my country and my players, which admittedly I should have done earlier, I am gonna make life hell for low IQ Indian trolls who will step out of their lane.

Tough times ahead for Indian fans. I’m tired of seeing the disrespect and if I can help curb the ever-growing but unwanted population of Indian fans on this forum, I will be proud.

Please don’t compare me to that cowardly fool Daniel Alexander who provokes Indian fans but doesn’t even allow them to respond to him because he disables replies on his Twitter. I on other hand take on Indian trolls face on and make them run away with facts and figures.

 

[Mamoon]

Thank you for this!

4 out of the top 5 made their debuts in T20Is after Dhoni retired!

A SR of 127 was poor in Dhoni’s era as well because the average scores have not changed significantly at the international level.

Dhoni didn’t play in 300 BCE when Alexander The Great had an Indian king on his knees. He played in an era that was not different to today’s as far as T20I cricket is concerned and his SR was poor at the time.

T20I cricket has not changed since Dhoni’s retirement.

 

[Mamoon]

I dont care about Dhoni.

But nice to see you supporting Greek mythology where Rizwan and Zeus have a bond and if Rizwan fails, Zeus manages to cry as well.

Good luck convincing anyone that Rizwan the clown deserves to be in T20 team.

I asked you to pick your team for Pakistan in all formats and also pick your captain(s), but you ran away with tail between your legs because you can’t walk the talk.

If you think Rizwan should not be in the team than please suggest who should be. It is easy to criticize but harder to offer solutions.

Be a problem solver in life. People who are not problem solvers don’t have any value.

Imagine a doctor who always criticizes the approach of other doctors but lacks courage to write a prescription themselves.

 

[Buffet]

Rizwan has an impressive average, and both Babar and Rizwan good number of 50s compare to most others. No point having good strike rate even in T20s if on average you getting out in 20s.

What?

Avg of 35 with SR of 150 will be much much more impactful than avg of 50 with SR in 120s.

It's T20 and not test cricket, you got 120 balls. Easiest time to bat in T20 is as an opener. In most T20 pitches, if you score run a ball then longer you bat, worse it gets for your team. High Avg with very low strike rate as an opener means you are helping your team to lose more often.

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

Social media didn’t make him average 40+ in all formats. Rizwan is an excellent cricketer and as far as his T20 SR is concerned, it is the same as that of Dhoni and Pant, two players who are treated like heroes in India.

Unfortunately, Pakistanis always find way to discredit and downplay their successful cricketers. They get no protection unlike players from other countries.

As far as his future is concerned, his position is under no threat at all because none of the other WKs anywhere near him.

Rizwan will remain a mainstay in all formats for years to come unless a prodigy appears out of nowhere.

Both Pant and Dhoni aren’t rated as t20 batsman so dunno how this argument helps you.

 

[mominsaigol]

Both Pant and Dhoni aren’t rated as t20 batsman so dunno how this argument helps you.

Any allformat batter especially one who captained his side to 2007 victory automatically becomes a non rated one format specialist thanks to creative liberty movies

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

Any allformat batter especially one who captained his side to 2007 victory automatically becomes a non rated one format specialist thanks to creative liberty movies

Whats wrong in my post?
Dhoni was never a good t20i batsman to begin with, he was good in tests and GOAT level in ODI.

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

I repeat:

If there is no shift in average T20I team totals, that means that the approach towards the format has not changed.

That also means that the perception of what a good SR is or isn’t has also not changed.

That also means that a SR of 127 is not only poor today but was also poor 5 or 10 years ago as well.

That also means that Dhoni was not a good T20I batsman even during his time.

That also means that Rizwan is a better T20I batsman than Dhoni because both have similar SR but Rizwan scores twice as many runs.

I know Dhoni’s poor batting in T20Is has caused you a lot of pain, but next time you want to defend how he played this format, come up with actual facts & figures otherwise you will have trousers pulled down for making baseless assertions.

The problem is that Indian fans are still used to dealing with regular Pakistani fans on PP who would get intimated. Now that I’m ready to stand up for my country and my players, which admittedly I should have done earlier, I am gonna make life hell for low IQ Indian trolls who will step out of their lane.

Tough times ahead for Indian fans. I’m tired of seeing the disrespect and if I can help curb the ever-growing but unwanted population of Indian fans on this forum, I will be proud.

Please don’t compare me to that cowardly fool Daniel Alexander who provokes Indian fans but doesn’t even allow them to respond to him because he disables replies on his Twitter. I on other hand take on Indian trolls face on and make them run away with facts and figures.

Can you tell me the source of your data:

I mean where are you seeing average scores in t20 per year?

I doubt that you have the statistics with you.

 

[Rana]

Can you tell me the source of your data:

Peshawar Zalmi tv

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

Babar and Rizwan, both are very bad in T20. Take a look at 500+ runs by openers and SR. Both should stop playing T20.

View attachment 146676

In t20s Babar can only help you if the target is around 150, anything above that and his style of play wont work.
Rizwan is a limited batsman especially in t20s, Usman Khan is more suited to t20s, but Rizwan is definitely better than Azam khan, that is for sure.

 

[Buffet]

In t20s Babar can only help you if the target is around 150, anything above that and his style of play wont work.
Rizwan is a limited batsman especially in t20s, Usman Khan is more suited to t20s, but Rizwan is definitely better than Azam khan, that is for sure.

Openers shouldn't avg 40-50 with 125-130 SR in T20. Longer you bat with SR of 120s, worse it gets for batting side on most pitches.

 

[SpiritOf1903]

He got a duck on this. Maulvi missed out

 

[Rana]

In t20s Babar can only help you if the target is around 150, anything above that and his style of play wont work.
Rizwan is a limited batsman especially in t20s, Usman Khan is more suited to t20s, but Rizwan is definitely better than Azam khan, that is for sure.

At what number?

Rizwan is a failed middle order batsman turned uselessT20 opener. Azam Khan is a middle order T20 batsman

 

[Mamoon]

Can you tell me the source of your data:

I mean where are you seeing average scores in t20 per year?

I doubt that you have the statistics with you.

Dhoni retired from T20Is on Feb 27, 2019.

Since the inception of T20Is until the day he retired, the average global batting SR was 121.

Since his retirement, the average global batting SR is 114.

This completely destroys the baseless argument of @bunda_bindaas that Dhoni's SR was good for his era and the T20I game has moved on since his retirement. That is complete bull as the above stats show.

If there was a paradigm shift in how teams approach T20Is in terms of batting aggression, it would have reflected in the average SR or average totals but that clearly did not happen. In fact, interestingly enough, teams have actually scored at a lower rate in the last 5 years than they did in the first 15 years of this format.

In comparison, the average SR in ODIs in 2000s was around 71, but it jumped to 83-84 in 2010s, which clearly indicates a revolution in how teams approach ODI batting which means that the perception of a what a good or bad ODI SR was has also altered.

However, no such alteration has taken place in T20Is because there has been 0 revolution in T20I batting approach in the last 5 years. Therefore, a SR of 127 today is as good or bad as it was during Dhoni's era.

 

[Mamoon]

Both Pant and Dhoni aren’t rated as t20 batsman so dunno how this argument helps you.

Dhoni is rated highly by the average Indian fan. It is only cricket nerds on PP that deep-dive into numbers.

If you go around India with a mic and ask 1 million cricket fans how they rate Dhoni as a T20 batsman, the vast majority would rate him very highly because of the finisher moniker, six-hitting reputation, helicopter shot, IPL exploits etc.

That is because Indian fans are very protective of their star players. In comparison, Pakistani fans don't let go of any opportunity to mock their own players. Ironically, the three most trolled cricketers in Pakistan these days happen to be three of the most successful Pakistani cricketers of the last few years. That sums up the mentality of Pakistani supporters.

If Virat Kohli was a Pakistani and he would have done what he did in Test cricket over the last four years, the fans would have made his life a living hell.

Rizwan needs to improve his SR for sure but he is nowhere near as bad as some make him out to be and he clearly deserves to be in the team because he has no competition.

 

[Mamoon]

At what number?

Rizwan is a failed middle order batsman turned uselessT20 opener. Azam Khan is a middle order T20 batsman

Calling Azam Khan a "batsman" is a complete joke. Rizwan is a million times better than him at every single batting position in spite of being a less than successful middle-order T20I batsman in his own right.

 

[Mamoon]

Peshawar Zalmi tv

It is from Cricinfo. You can check the data yourself. There has been zero change in how T20 cricket is being played at the international level in the last few years as reflected by the average global SRs that I showed above.

 

[Rana]

Calling Azam Khan a "batsman" is a complete joke. Rizwan is a million times better than him at every single batting position in spite of being a less than successful middle-order T20I batsman in his own right.

Yeah no he isn’t.

 

[bunda_bindaas]

You are talking absolute nonsense now and the straw clutching is hilarious to witness. You are digging harder than a Caterpillar excavator and have become so desperate that you have now resorted to quoting Dhoni’s IPL SR since 2022 to prove that there has been a change in how T20 cricket is approached at the international level.

You know that you have fumbled big time and made a blanket statement that you cannot support, defend and justify with numbers.

I repeat:

In terms of batting approach, if there was a change in how T20I cricket was played over the last few years or since Dhoni retired, it would have reflected in the average team totals.

The average team totals is the most reliable indicator of the collective mindset of teams and how they approach T20I batting.

We saw that in ODIs in early 2010s where there was a global increase in 300+ scores and suddenly, the perception of what a good SR was changed.

T20 cricket has not achieved that evolution at the international level yet. It has happened in IPL where the averages scores have increased significantly in the last few years and therefore, the perception of what a good or bad SR is also changed.

At the international level, that has not happened yet. It might happen in the future but as of now, T20 internationals are being played in the same way as they were played 10 years ago.

Today, a score of 180+ is a high score in T20Is just like it was 10 years ago. A great total and a bad total during Dhoni’s time is still a great total and a bad total.

Therefore, your original assertion that Dhoni’s SR was good for his time and the game has moved on is completely incorrect and baseless.

His SR was not good for his time either. He was just an average T20I batsman just like he was an average Test batsman and is still not a good SR.

A SR of 127 was not good in 2014 and it is not good in 2024. I have no issues with people criticizing Rizwan for his SR but that criticism should be within reason and unfortunately, his critics go overboard with the criticism.

A batsman who averages close to 50 @ 127 is not the perfect T20I batsman but he is far from the worst either, especially when playing for a team that has a very weak batting lineup. At the end of the day, you have to score runs as well and SR not backed up a decent volume of runs will not help a team like Pakistan that has a fragile batting lineup.

All in all, Rizwan is a superior T20 batsman than both Dhoni and Pant at international level because he scores almost twice as many runs as they do at the same SR.

You still use dubious stats to make the most absurd claims, as is your wont, but this is for the larger audience here.

Since Dhoni retired, here are the average scores for each team:

India --> 181 (165 before his retirement)

Australia --> 175.6 (166.6 earlier)

England --> 178.2 (164.4 earlier)

West Indies --> 173 (153.8 earlier)

South Africa --> 169.8 (163.4 earlier)

Pakistan --> 162 (153.2 earlier) --> This is purely down to Babar and Rizwan opening for Pakistan!

Sri Lanka --> 150.8 (155 earlier)

Bangladesh --> 146 (151.2 earlier)

Afghanistan --> 152 (157.8 earlier)

So, clearly the average SCORE for the best teams has gone up and there's no surprise that the TOP 5 Highest Strike Rates in T20s belong to India, England and Australia, which also have the best Win/Loss ratio among all teams. With India having a Win/Loss ratio of 3:1. No other team has a Win to loss ratio of greater than 1.6!

Besides this, as I've already posted above, 40 out of 70 highest match aggregates in the HISTORY of T20 Internationals have come in the period AFTER 2019, that is Dhoni's retirement.

Now for your comparison between Dhoni and Rizwan, since Dhoni only batted between numbers 3 and 7 in T20s, I pulled out the numbers for Rizwan batting between 3 and 7 and it's not a pretty sight at all:

Dhoni batting between 3 & 7: Average 37.6, Strike Rate 126

Rizwan batting between 3 & 7: Average 24.9, Strike Rate 102!

Rizwan won't be able to fit into Bangladesh's side with those numbers.

 

[RyanRyan10]

Sasta Daniel Alexander, stats are your enemy and they are my friend! Not that it will make an iota of a difference to your crooked logic, you'd still use dubious stats to make the most absurd claims, as is your wont, but this is for the larger audience here.

Since Dhoni retired, here are the average scores for each team:

India --> 181 (165 before his retirement)

Australia --> 175.6 (166.6 earlier)

England --> 178.2 (164.4 earlier)

West Indies --> 173 (153.8 earlier)

South Africa --> 169.8 (163.4 earlier)

Pakistan --> 162 (153.2 earlier) --> This is purely down to Babar and Rizwan opening for Pakistan!

Sri Lanka --> 150.8 (155 earlier)

Bangladesh --> 146 (151.2 earlier)

Afghanistan --> 152 (157.8 earlier)

So, clearly the average SCORE for the best teams has gone up and there's no surprise that the TOP 5 Highest Strike Rates in T20s belong to India, England and Australia, which also have the best Win/Loss ratio among all teams. With India having a Win/Loss ratio of 3:1. No other team has a Win to loss ratio of greater than 1.6!

Besides this, as I've already posted above, 40 out of 70 highest match aggregates in the HISTORY of T20 Internationals have come in the period AFTER 2019, that is Dhoni's retirement.

Now for your comparison between Dhoni and Rizwan, since Dhoni only batted between numbers 3 and 7 in T20s, I pulled out the numbers for Rizwan batting between 3 and 7 and it's not a pretty sight at all:

Dhoni batting between 3 & 7: Average 37.6, Strike Rate 126

Rizwan batting between 3 & 7: Average 24.9, Strike Rate 102!

Rizwan won't be able to fit into Bangladesh's side with those numbers.

The numbers Mamoon posted are misleading as now there's global t20i status so even matches involving like Cameroon, Gambia, Isle of Man have a T20I status where teams are getting bundled out for 60, 70. He wasn't aware of this fact due to his poor knowledge on associate cricket.

 

[bunda_bindaas]

Dhoni retired from T20Is on Feb 27, 2019.

Since the inception of T20Is until the day he retired, the average global batting SR was 121.

Since his retirement, the average global batting SR is 114.

This completely destroys the baseless argument of @bunda_bindaas that Dhoni's SR was good for his era and the T20I game has moved on since his retirement. That is complete bull as the above stats show.

If there was a paradigm shift in how teams approach T20Is in terms of batting aggression, it would have reflected in the average SR or average totals but that clearly did not happen. In fact, interestingly enough, teams have actually scored at a lower rate in the last 5 years than they did in the first 15 years of this format.

In comparison, the average SR in ODIs in 2000s was around 71, but it jumped to 83-84 in 2010s, which clearly indicates a revolution in how teams approach ODI batting which means that the perception of a what a good or bad ODI SR was has also altered.

However, no such alteration has taken place in T20Is because there has been 0 revolution in T20I batting approach in the last 5 years. Therefore, a SR of 127 today is as good or bad as it was during Dhoni's era.

Goodness gracious me.

Do you realize the GLOBAL AVERAGE for T20Is would include 76 countries, which play T20 Internationals?

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

Dhoni is rated highly by the average Indian fan. It is only cricket nerds on PP that deep-dive into numbers.


If you go around India with a mic and ask 1 million cricket fans how they rate Dhoni as a T20 batsman, the vast majority would rate him very highly because of the finisher moniker, six-hitting reputation, helicopter shot, IPL exploits etc.

That is because Indian fans are very protective of their star players. In comparison, Pakistani fans don't let go of any opportunity to mock their own players. Ironically, the three most trolled cricketers in Pakistan these days happen to be three of the most successful Pakistani cricketers of the last few years. That sums up the mentality of Pakistani supporters.

An Average Pakistani fan would also rate Shahid Afridi as an ATG, that's because he is loved by the whole country, in a similar fashion Dhoni is loved across India due to the happiness he brought by winning trophies as a captain.

The problem is that you don't have match winners right now and that's why the average Pakistani fan won't defend these new stars, I saw how mad Pakistan fans were for Afridi, Akhtar, Mohd Asif, Mohd Amir.

If Virat Kohli was a Pakistani and he would have done what he did in Test cricket over the last four years, the fans would have made his life a living hell.

Rizwan needs to improve his SR for sure but he is nowhere near as bad as some make him out to be and he clearly deserves to be in the team because he has no competition.

Rizwan is definitely not bad, but he is average and doesn't deserve to be rated along with actual aggressive t20 openers.

Do you actually know how Kohli did last year, he averaged 56 in test cricket and was instrumental in our draw series in SA.

As of now, he averages 32 this year and 7 tests are still left.

Kohli has been bad only for three years, one of them was washed away in COViD.

 

[CerebralPatriot]

Rizwan's inability to score runs on the deadest of roads sums up why we have failed to win a single test in over a year. Our players lack any ability to analyse the game and adapt to different tactics. Rizwan is the epitome of this and it is his pathetic batting that will cost us this test

 

[Rana]

Goodness gracious me.

Do you realize the GLOBAL AVERAGE for T20Is would include 76 countries, which play T20 Internationals?

I don’t understand why you are arguing against him?

 

[PakPremi]

What?

Avg of 35 with SR of 150 will be much much more impactful than avg of 50 with SR in 120s.

It's T20 and not test cricket, you got 120 balls. Easiest time to bat in T20 is as an opener. In most T20 pitches, if you score run a ball then longer you bat, worse it gets for your team. High Avg with very low strike rate as an opener means you are helping your team to lose more often.

I was referring to batsmen averaging 20s not 30s..

 

[Mamoon]

@bunda_bindaas @RyanRyan10 @Rana

Absolute drivel yet again. Let me educate you, or better, let me expose your factually incorrect argument further.

You want to only look at the prominent teams? Sure, but that does nothing to support the laughable argument that there has been a paradigm shift in how T20I batting has been approached since the mediocre T20I batsman Dhoni did a favor on the game and retired on 27 Feb 2019.

The average batting SR in T20Is since Dhoni's retirement (AUS, ENG, IND, NZ, SA, PAK, SL, WI, BD) is 131.
The average batting SR in T20Is from 2015-2019 (AUS, ENG, IND, NZ, SA, PAK, SL, WI, BD) is 130.

If there was a shift in how T20I batting was approached, it happened during Dhoni's career, not after he retired, so ergo, the argument that Dhoni's SR was good for his time is absolute nonsense. There has been zero shift in how T20I batting has been approached over the last decade, which means that a SR of 127 is good or bad today as it was during Dhoni's time.

Henceforth, we can draw the following conclusions:

Dhoni was a poor T20I batsman and clearly inferior to Rizwan who has the same SR but scores almost twice as many runs. Dhoni was a bang average cricketer whose reputation and fan following far exceeds his actual pedigree. A nothing player in Tests and T20Is and the GOAT status in ODIs is also highly dubious. We would have seen how much of a finisher he was if here playing for a weak team like Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Bangladesh etc.

Dhoni is a PR product. Nothing can be more shameless than his team cooking up a fake storyline for his biopic where he met his love interest on a plane before his maiden ODI hundred and who then died in a car crash. She did not even exist. His legal team was lucky to create fake characters to boost his image so that he is not caught up in legal defamation cases.

Dhoni is the biggest scam in Indian cricket history. I would take Rizwan over him in at least two of three formats. India have produced much better players than him who have received far less recognition.

 

[RyanRyan10]

@bunda_bindaas @RyanRyan10 @Rana

Absolute drivel yet again. Let me educate you, or better, let me expose your factually incorrect argument further.

You want to only look at the prominent teams? Sure, but that does nothing to support the laughable argument that there has been a paradigm shift in how T20I batting has been approached since the mediocre T20I batsman Dhoni did a favor on the game and retired on 27 Feb 2019.

The average batting SR in T20Is since Dhoni's retirement (AUS, ENG, IND, NZ, SA, PAK, SL, WI, BD) is 131.
The average batting SR in T20Is from 2015-2019 (AUS, ENG, IND, NZ, SA, PAK, SL, WI, BD) is 130.

If there was a shift in how T20I batting was approached, it happened during Dhoni's career, not after he retired, so ergo, the argument that Dhoni's SR was good for his time is absolute nonsense. There has been zero shift in how T20I batting has been approached over the last decade, which means that a SR of 127 is good or bad today as it was during Dhoni's time.

Henceforth, we can draw the following conclusions:

Dhoni was a poor T20I batsman and clearly inferior to Rizwan who has the same SR but scores almost twice as many runs. Dhoni was a bang average cricketer whose reputation and fan following far exceeds his actual pedigree. A nothing player in Tests and T20Is and the GOAT status in ODIs is also highly dubious. We would have seen how much of a finisher he was if here playing for a weak team like Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Bangladesh etc.

Dhoni is a PR product. Nothing can be more shameless than his team cooking up a fake storyline for his biopic where he met his love interest on a plane before his maiden ODI hundred and who then died in a car crash. She did not even exist. His legal team was lucky to create fake characters to boost his image so that he is not caught up in legal defamation cases.

Dhoni is the biggest scam in Indian cricket history. I would take Rizwan over him in at least two of three formats. India have produced much better players than him who have received far less recognition.

Dhoni debuted in T20Is in 2006, and you are using stats from 2015 to make your point. Dhoni's strike rate after 2015 was 139. Keep trying, doctor!

Your attempt to manipulate stats for your agenda have backfired. You thought you could deceive, but you have encountered the wrong individuals in me and @bunda_bindaas .

@topspin check out this thread

 

[BouncerGuy]

Rizwan gone. Pathetic batting this is.

Needs to be rested along with babar and shaheen.

 

[Rana]

Rizwan gone. Pathetic batting this is.

Needs to be rested along with babar and shaheen.

Nahi nahi Ab banau issey kaptaan

 

[Asif321]

Lmao best Wk batsman in world

 

[CerebralPatriot]

Rizwan gone. Pathetic batting this is.

Needs to be rested along with babar and shaheen.

Shaheen needs to be rested

Babar needs to be dropped

Rizwan needs to be banned from professional cricket and only restricted to regional leagues

 

[bunda_bindaas]

@bunda_bindaas @RyanRyan10 @Rana

Absolute drivel yet again. Let me educate you, or better, let me expose your factually incorrect argument further.

You want to only look at the prominent teams? Sure, but that does nothing to support the laughable argument that there has been a paradigm shift in how T20I batting has been approached since the mediocre T20I batsman Dhoni did a favor on the game and retired on 27 Feb 2019.

The average batting SR in T20Is since Dhoni's retirement (AUS, ENG, IND, NZ, SA, PAK, SL, WI, BD) is 131.
The average batting SR in T20Is from 2015-2019 (AUS, ENG, IND, NZ, SA, PAK, SL, WI, BD) is 130.

If there was a shift in how T20I batting was approached, it happened during Dhoni's career, not after he retired, so ergo, the argument that Dhoni's SR was good for his time is absolute nonsense. There has been zero shift in how T20I batting has been approached over the last decade, which means that a SR of 127 is good or bad today as it was during Dhoni's time.

Henceforth, we can draw the following conclusions:

Dhoni was a poor T20I batsman and clearly inferior to Rizwan who has the same SR but scores almost twice as many runs. Dhoni was a bang average cricketer whose reputation and fan following far exceeds his actual pedigree. A nothing player in Tests and T20Is and the GOAT status in ODIs is also highly dubious. We would have seen how much of a finisher he was if here playing for a weak team like Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Bangladesh etc.

Dhoni is a PR product. Nothing can be more shameless than his team cooking up a fake storyline for his biopic where he met his love interest on a plane before his maiden ODI hundred and who then died in a car crash. She did not even exist. His legal team was lucky to create fake characters to boost his image so that he is not caught up in legal defamation cases.

Dhoni is the biggest scam in Indian cricket history. I would take Rizwan over him in at least two of three formats. India have produced much better players than him who have received far less recognition.

First he said, Average Scores for teams haven't increased since 2019, they have in fact gone down. That was proven wrong with a capital W.

Average scores have gone UP for most teams, although Pakistan, thanks to Rizwan and Babar have increased their average score from 153 to 162!

Then he said that 180 is a good score even today in T20s. That is the AVERAGE score for India, England and Australia. A good score for these teams is 200+

Then he said Rizwan is a superior batsman compared to Dhoni and Pant because he averages close to 50 while having the same strike rate.

That's retarded logic because he's mainly an opener and the other two players weren't/aren't. When I compared Rizwan's averages while batting from #3 to #7, he had nothing to say. In fact, the numbers are so poor that nobody can have anything to say: Average of 24.9 with a Strike Rate of 102!

That's how poor Rizwan is, without the cushion of an opening slot, where there are at least 30+ batsmen above him in terms of Strike Rate.

But back to debunking his claim that average Strike Rates haven't increased since 2019. I took the data before 2019 and after 2019 for all batsmen from positions #1 to #7 and used a criteria of minimum 10 matches played for each player, excluding associate nations, to filter out the results further.

Here are the results for everyone

Up to 2019, the average Strike Rate for batsmen #1 to #7 --> 127.7

After 2019, the average Strike Rate for batsmen #1 to #7 --> 133.67

Basically, Rizwan is batting at a lower AVERAGE Strike Rate that was prevalent BEFORE 2019. There are 34, yes, THIRTY FOUR openers who have a better Strike Rate than him in the last 5 years!

And Rizwan's Strike Rate from #3 to #7, is an astronomical 102.

The more this guy makes absurd claims, the more I will expose his favourites.

 

[mominsaigol]

I kept telling people 24/7, that this rubbish couldn't even handle club bowling in a low level league ,

Magar nahi, 171 on a phatta track convinced everyone that he's the 2nd coming of Bradman.

Everyone said either this or claimed that I am mixing formats. Maafi bhai. Ik rubbish when I see it.

Rizwan, Babar(post 2022), Saud(Post SNGPL), Abdullah (Post SNGPL)

Their all rubbish. And it's time to add saim and abrar on the list now.

 

[Master Blaster]

Not motivated enough to score runs under Masood.

Make him captain and then see the runs flowing like a flooded river.

 

[Aham Brahmasmi]

As per some learned greats here he still will be in the team as he is better than Kohli

 

[gazza619]

Not motivated enough to score runs under Masood.

Why should he? If you dont get what is rightfully yours, then you gotta snatch it, by hook or by crook.