The Babar Azam versus Virat Kohli comparison

[shaz619]

Babar had a bad day, but it seems they forget what happened 12 months ago. Anyhow it is good to see Kohli play with more courage.

 

[pratiktc]

Babar will never be close to Kohli because he can never play an inns like Kohli did today. What a player. What a man

 

[Buffet]

It's unfair to Babar. No need to compare him to Kohli. Two are in different leagues.

Kohli is one of the best batsmen in history. Kohli in his last leg can pull off something which many batsmen will find it hard.

 

[Protea Fan]

Even if we keep babar aside all other fab 3 are not anywhere close to kohli the allround batsman

We can say that smith or root is a better test batsman than kohli but overall kohlis batsmanship is on a different league all together compared to his peers period

 

[Buffet]

Even if we keep babar aside all other fab 3 are not anywhere close to kohli the allround batsman

We can say that smith or root is a better test batsman than kohli but overall kohlis batsmanship is on a different league all together compared to his peers period

That's why, it's unfair to make comparison with Babar.

 

[GreenBee]

I'll be blunt, Babar is a statistical wonder of playing weaker teams on flatter tracks.

He is still a very good batsman, but I would put him in Rohit league. While Rohit is a beast and total a ODI match winner on his day, Babar makes up for it with consistency across the formats.

 

[Asif321]

I can’t see babar playing such innings even against lower ranked team

 

[ChTab]

Kohli with one leg & one arm would be 10 times better than babar

 

[topspin]

I remember when guys like [MENTION=129948]Bilal7[/MENTION] used to go on about how Babar will go on to dethrone Kohli. Today was a much needed reality check for those who doubted the latter.

The innings played by Kohli was an ATG knock. Babar can only dream of playing such an innings.

 

[Xoib]

Babar has played some world class test and odi knocks his 196 in 4th innings at Karachi or 119 at Galle on a tricky track were great knocks under pressure. So it's unfair to call him stats padder. T 20 despite good numbers is his weakest format and he struggles especially if he has to make pace from ball 1.

 

[Xoib]

If Babar comes at 1 down he can play an innings like this, has the skill, Shan/ some other leftie should open

Yes I think he is thick he should understand opening is reducing his T 20 effectiveness would be much better at 3.

 

[Buffet]

I remember when guys like [MENTION=129948]Bilal7[/MENTION] used to go on about how Babar will go on to dethrone Kohli. Today was a much needed reality check for those who doubted the latter.

The innings played by Kohli was an ATG knock. Babar can only dream of playing such an innings.

Some time random players are also able to play on really great inning so I won't count Babar out. Also, he needs to not open to play a knock like this.

But Kohli has many sensational knocks and that's what makes him different. He has been in poor form and not doing well in last 1-2 years, but reminded everyone what he can do.

 

[Local.Dada]

Babar has got a bit of an expanding waist. Sure he will have phases were he is as good as Kohli or even better but to sustain at the level Kohli does over a long career you need that level of fitness too. Till then he will unfortunately considered tier 2 kind of like Inzamam who never hit that Sachin-Lara-Ponting tier even though he was as good as them if not better at times.

 

[topspin]

Some time random players are also able to play on really great inning so I won't count Babar out. Also, he needs to not open to play a knock like this.

But Kohli has many sensational knocks and that's what makes him different. He has been in poor form and not doing well in last 1-2 years, but reminded everyone what he can do.

The reason I don't believe in him is because he's mentally weak. He's not someone who can impose his presence in the big games.

Having said that, I'd love to be proven wrong.

 

[ChTab]

To be fair Babar is opener so comparison is not right, he is not supposed to chase down total, he is suppose to give good platform for middle order which he do

Good platform is what Fin Allen provide the other day not what Babar does

 

[SilentWatcher]

People have a bad habit of getting disillusioned due to recency bias. If Babar plays a good innings next match, they will put him up again.

Honestly, Babar is on his way to greatness and people pre-maturely started comparing him to Kohli.

This doesn’t mean that Babar can’t play an innings like this. It just means that Kohli is setting a benchmark for Babar to achieve to be compared to him which alone puts this comparison to rest for now.

Batsman evolve, especially the great one. Babar still can reach 2016 Kohli level.

 

[ask_analyse_act]

This thread should be put to bed until Babar plays an inns like this in the world's biggest stage from being down under (nearly defeated)..

Finishing off games is something Babar has not done many and need to do consistently... Thats where Kohli stands tall above the rest..

 

[Nikhil_cric]

I said this before and I will repeat this again. Even peak Babar can't play the kind of impact knocks that late era Virat Kohli seems to play. Babar is an overrated LOI batsman if people think he is anywhere near Virat in LOIs.

The only contest is in test cricket where Bavar can, potentially, surpass Virat in the years to come. It is not guaranteed but there's half a chance atleast in the long format.

 

[Grunge101]

I've always maintained this ; an in-form Kohli is simply a level above Babar, Smith or Williamson.
It's down to versatility. That extra gear, the ability to clear the boundary regularly once he's set is something that Babar simply doesn't possess. It's a fact

 

[Suleiman]

Kohli is at another level entirely.

Say what you want skill wise, but even skill wise, Kohli can manufacture shots Babar can’t.

His ability to absorb pressure is unlike any other.

But we’ll see Babar lovers storm this thread once he bullies some random attack on another bilateral series.

 

[light]

Good knock today, India should win the WT20 I gather then on the back of his greatness

Instead of being sour about the loss, how about show appreciation towards the innings Kohli crafted (no ball or not saga)? A bit immature from you. I am not a Pak team supporter, however, whenever Rizwan or co bats their heart out, you will see appreciation from me (win or lose) and many others. Respect goes both ways ...

 

[shaz619]

Kohli is at another level entirely.

Say what you want skill wise, but even skill wise, Kohli can manufacture shots Babar can’t.

His ability to absorb pressure is unlike any other.

But we’ll see Babar lovers storm this thread once he bullies some random attack on another bilateral series.

It seems 12 months is a long time, he ended the streak, is a major star on the world level with loads to achieve. The same people bending over for Kohli wanted him out the side 4 weeks ago

 

[Suleiman]

It seems 12 months is a long time, he ended the streak, is a major star on the world level with loads to achieve. The same people bending over for Kohli wanted him out the side 4 weeks ago

We’ll see at the end of the career for both. But Kohli’s innings today is superior to anything Babar has done so far in this format. Including last year’s innings.

 

[topspin]

Kohli is at another level entirely.

Say what you want skill wise, but even skill wise, Kohli can manufacture shots Babar can’t.

His ability to absorb pressure is unlike any other.

But we’ll see Babar lovers storm this thread once he bullies some random attack on another bilateral series.

Exactly what happened when we lost the Asia Cup final in embarrassing fashion, then eleven days later we beat England by 10 wickets.

All the Babar loves had their heads in the clouds. It was as if the Asia Cup final never happened.

 

[Savak]

People need to cut out the dissing and abusing of Babar. Its not like he announced in the press conference about him being as good as Kohli or even better. Babar at best is like a Hashim Amla batsman where he can only win games at the top or with some support from the lower order but he will freeze under pressure when there is no support from anyone else.

In a thoroughly mediocre Pakistani batting side where there are no immediate alternatives and no champion batsman waiting in the wings in domestic cricket, it is incredible to see the amount of abuse Babar gets.

 

[Savak]

Babar has got a bit of an expanding waist. Sure he will have phases were he is as good as Kohli or even better but to sustain at the level Kohli does over a long career you need that level of fitness too. Till then he will unfortunately considered tier 2 kind of like Inzamam who never hit that Sachin-Lara-Ponting tier even though he was as good as them if not better at times.

Babar right now has too much power in the team which he is abusing as you can tell in his team selections. Ramiz has given him a complete free hand to select the players he wants and conduct the team's practice, net sessions as he wants provided he gets him the final results. Well sorry to say but i see Babar being made the scapegoat for the team's below par showing in this T-20 WC.

Shan Masood in a recent article confirmed that Babar since becoming captain has encouraged a foodie culture in the team where the boys in order to get together and feel good always make sure to have meals in the top resteraunts wherever they are. You can also see the amount of cakes the players indulge in the Youtube videos the PCB releases for minor achievements. It is no surprise to see Misbah coming down hard on the players declining fitness, fielding levels and how slow the guys are in the outfield and running between the wickets.

Contrast this to the ruthless fitness culture Kohli introduced in the team as captain where he led by examples and where everyone was told to meet basic fitness levels or to go home especially if their performances did not consistently cover it up.

Wasim, Waqar have many times commented how they would be terrified to even let Imran Khan catch them eating burgers, pizzas or indulge in soft drinks on tours. It is the captain of the team who sets the tone and sadly our Pakistani players are so unprofessional and indiscipline, the PCB has no choice but to treat them like school kids because they cannot be trusted to discipline themselves on and off the field.

 

[pillionrider]

People need to cut out the dissing and abusing of Babar. Its not like he announced in the press conference about him being as good as Kohli or even better.

Yeah. In fact, he's often out of his way to talk down such comparisons. The other day, during the joint presscon, when asked about what Indian and Pakistani players talk when they meet each other, he said something like - he (Rohit) is senior to me, so when I meet them, I'm trying to learn from them.

 

[Saurav]

Kohli is a very high benchmark in LOIs

 

[WengerOut]

Babar in his first ODI WC has already done better than what Kohli did in 3 WCs. T20 is another matter though.

 

[Joseph Gomes]

Kohli across the format is an ATG, means he is one of the greatest players of all time. Babar is great but he'd nowhere near Kohli's stature yet. Kohli had dozens of memorable innings in every format. The way he can single handedly win you lost matches is a special skill that Babar lacks.

The only chink in Kohli's armour is his performance in ODI World Cup elimination rounds. That's it. Kohli is a 8.5-9/10 in everything else. Has done it all

 

[Gullycricket]

Zimbabar showing his class in a crunch situation.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

OP is a ridiculously poor and biased analyst .

 

[TheNeutralist]

Patience and faith. I think Pakistani fans need to be patient, Babar will come good. No need to compare him with Kohli now, he still has time to go to that stage. Till then enjoy the ride

 

[GreenBee]

Patience and faith. I think Pakistani fans need to be patient, Babar will come good. No need to compare him with Kohli now, he still has time to go to that stage. Till then enjoy the ride

I think it's not about time, but a realisation that he won't get there. At 28 years of age, the only question is if he can emulate the likes of Amla. His trajectory is closer to Amla with a difference that Amla actually had many quality knocks.

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

Babar in his first ODI WC has already done better than what Kohli did in 3 WCs. T20 is another matter though.

Good for him. (although you are wrong)

If we are just stating randon facts, then I have one from my side

Gambhir did better in one than Ab deviliers did in 4.

 

[WengerOut]

Good for him. (although you are wrong)

If we are just stating randon facts, then I have one from my side

Gambhir did better in one than Ab deviliers did in 4.

Gambhir did not have that good ODI career compared to ABDV. Babar and Kohli have comparable records in ODI and if anything Babar has better WC track record in only 1 WC he has played at this point.

 

[Grunge101]

It's not just Babar, the others in the fab 5 aren't any closer to Kohli either.
Just like Babar, Williamson, Smith and Root have all at their peaks "outperformed" Kohli in that period of time however, an in form Kohli is simply atleast half a tier above these 4.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Kohli is from the same under-19 batch (2008 batch) as Williamson and Steve Smith. Kohli was the captain when India won the under-19 world cup. Babar played as an under-19 player in 2010 world cup. Captain was someone else. Pakistan lost the final. Next edition in 2012 Babar took over the captaincy. Pakistan finished 8th in the playoff.

This is blast from the past. Babar was the captain. Some were not happy with Babar's captaincy after letting the last batting pair survive 7 overs and win the match

2010 India vs Pakistan under-19 commentary thread

http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/s...arter-Final-U19-WC-Townsville-20-08-12/page27

 

[jnaveen1980]

It's not just Babar, the others in the fab 5 aren't any closer to Kohli either.
Just like Babar, Williamson, Smith and Root have all at their peaks "outperformed" Kohli in that period of time however, an in form Kohli is simply atleast half a tier above these 4.

I don't think Smith originally started his career as a batsman. He was a lower-middle-order batsman who could bowl. To his credit he completely turned it around and became an ATG test batsman.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

This pitch was difficult especially if you bowled short of a length.

All other batsmen in the match scored 57 runs off 57 balls short of a length.

Kohli scored 30 off 14 balls.

 

[jnaveen1980]

This pitch was difficult especially if you bowled short of a length.

All other batsmen in the match scored 57 runs off 57 balls short of a length.

Kohli scored 30 off 14 balls.

yes. I have seen only AB playing those kind of outrageous shots. Tennis type of shots. Gill from India is very much there. He can swat those high balls for fours.

 

[Grunge101]

I don't think Smith originally started his career as a batsman. He was a lower-middle-order batsman who could bowl. To his credit he completely turned it around and became an ATG test batsman.

I personally rate Smith the lowest of that lot. I know he has an outrageously good record but he is also the one with the most limitations in all 5.He hit an absolute purple patch for a number of years but since then hes never quite touched the same level.

Kohli has the ability to counter attack an aggressor, especially in the Test match format that the rest dont have. Root would come closest to him in that record with his recent turn of form. Babar, Smith or Williamson have never really displayed that attribute.

Similarly the ability to accelerate and go into ''power hitter mode'' at the end is something none of the others have. Kane tries his best but is never really there. Babar and Smith are both pretty toothless in that regard.

 

[Suleiman]

Comparison can be made in test cricket.

In ODIs and T20s Babar is far behind unless he helps Pakistan lift a World Cup before Virat can. Or becomes the greatest chaser in history.

 

[shamaan]

That was Kohli greatest Innings in t20s breathtaking.

 

[Joseph Gomes]

Babar in T20I is kinda overrated, I will be honest. Kohli was a T20I GOAT contender by the time he was 28. Now Kohli is the undisputed GOAT, of course. But 2016 Kohli was already already in the conversation

Here's Kohli's overall T20I World Cup stats when he was the same age Babar is now (14 Nov 2016)

Mat - 16
Not out - 7
Runs - 777
Highest score - 89*
Average - 86.33
SR - 133.04
50s - 9

The fun part? Kohli was lightyears ahead of every other batsman in his team and carried it all by himself.

 

[jnaveen1980]

I personally rate Smith the lowest of that lot. I know he has an outrageously good record but he is also the one with the most limitations in all 5.He hit an absolute purple patch for a number of years but since then hes never quite touched the same level.

Kohli has the ability to counter attack an aggressor, especially in the Test match format that the rest dont have. Root would come closest to him in that record with his recent turn of form. Babar, Smith or Williamson have never really displayed that attribute.

Similarly the ability to accelerate and go into ''power hitter mode'' at the end is something none of the others have. Kane tries his best but is never really there. Babar and Smith are both pretty toothless in that regard.

Jo Root is better than Smith in shorter formats. Especially at his peak. He plays Test match liek T20 these days.

 

[Joseph Gomes]

Kohli is lightyears ahead of Babar in T20I, it seems. Babar's only hope is trying to match Kohli in Tests and ODIs.

 

[MenInG]

Misbah-ul-Haq in an interview:

“There shouldn’t be a comparison between the two. Kohli has played a lot of cricket, Babar is just starting. When Babar will play the same amount of cricket, then you can make a comparison. Kohli has played more cricket, and no one can match him at the moment. Yes, Babar is a class player and he might achieve the same things as Kohli in the future, but at the moment, comparison between the two doesn’t make sense because it’s just a start for Babar,”

 

[Hitman]

The guy has already played international cricket for 7 years. And yet he is still at the 'start' of his career.

 

[W63L35]

Babar has played 111 ODIs until now. So if we compare Kohli's ODI stats in his first 111 ODIs, with Babar's 111 ODIs, Babar has pretty decent edge over Kohli.



Breaking first 111 ODIs by opposition and comparing..

 

[bala977]

Babar has played 111 ODIs until now. So if we compare Kohli's ODI stats in his first 111 ODIs, with Babar's 111 ODIs, Babar has pretty decent edge over Kohli.


View attachment 137900
Breaking first 111 ODIs by opposition and comparing..

View attachment 137901

You don't get the "impact" concept do you? It appears averages are more important to you, and I am glad Babar is making you feel better.

 

[Farabi]

Babar has played 111 ODIs until now. So if we compare Kohli's ODI stats in his first 111 ODIs, with Babar's 111 ODIs, Babar has pretty decent edge over Kohli.


View attachment 137900
Breaking first 111 ODIs by opposition and comparing..

View attachment 137901

Like your data-driven approach. No comparison here based on data as Babar is miles ahead at the same stage. Surprisingly, after 11 ODI games, even Kohli had a mediocre record against Pak with avg of 37 vs 31 for Babar.

 

[W63L35]

You don't get the "impact" concept do you? It appears averages are more important to you, and I am glad Babar is making you feel better.

Unfortunately "impact" is extremely subjective factor if you can't prove it with some concrete evidence.

If I punch person A as hard I can, and then his twin with the exact same force, how are you going to figure out the impact?
By their screams or .... something else?

 

[160KPH]

Babar has played 111 ODIs until now. So if we compare Kohli's ODI stats in his first 111 ODIs, with Babar's 111 ODIs, Babar has pretty decent edge over Kohli.


View attachment 137900
Breaking first 111 ODIs by opposition and comparing..

View attachment 137901

Woah this is brutal for all the Babar haters. If you compare Babar to the same point in Kohli’s career, Babar has a higher average, higher strike rate, more 50’s, more 100’s, more 4’s, more 6’s, and a way way better record against South Africa, Australia, and England.

“Babar doesn’t make me feel the same way Kohli does” is literally the argument Babar’s haters are making.

 

[W63L35]

Woah this is brutal for all the Babar haters. If you compare Babar to the same point in Kohli’s career, Babar has a higher average, higher strike rate, more 50’s, more 100’s, more 4’s, more 6’s, and a way way better record against South Africa, Australia, and England.

Babar haters really seem to be just all about the vibes and emotions, don’t they?

“Babar doesn’t make me feel the same way Kohli does” is literally the argument being made.

I do understand Indian fans belittling Babar but when Babar is put down by Pakistani fans (espcially who used to worship Misbah - the ODI batsman), I do not understand at all.

 

[Front Foot Pull]

it is a joke to compare babar and virat.
babar gets to play either lower ranked sides or depleted 11 of top ranked sides, more often. That inflates his stats. He also seldom misses any matches which helps him not to lose any rating and maintain his ICC ranking.

here are some stats against some premier pacers

AVG vs starc, cummins, hazlewood:
in tests: babar - 36.4, virat - 41.6
in ODIs: babar - 39.5 (s/r 82), virat - 50.9 (s/r 90.4)

AVG vs boult, southee, henry:
in tests: babar - 83, virat - 53
in ODIs: babar - 24 (s/r 67), virat - 40 (s/r 100)

AVG vs rabada, nortje, ngidi:
in tests: babar - 28, virat - 40.5
in ODIs: babar - 50 (s/r 88), virat - 102 (s/r 78)

it is laughable how most critics and commentators just mention the rankings and average without checking the strength of the sides they are facing on a regular basis.

 

[Farabi]

it is a joke to compare babar and virat.
babar gets to play either lower ranked sides or depleted 11 of top ranked sides, more often. That inflates his stats. He also seldom misses any matches which helps him not to lose any rating and maintain his ICC ranking.

here are some stats against some premier pacers

AVG vs starc, cummins, hazlewood:
in tests: babar - 36.4, virat - 41.6
in ODIs: babar - 39.5 (s/r 82), virat - 50.9 (s/r 90.4)

AVG vs boult, southee, henry:
in tests: babar - 83, virat - 53
in ODIs: babar - 24 (s/r 67), virat - 40 (s/r 100)

AVG vs rabada, nortje, ngidi:
in tests: babar - 28, virat - 40.5
in ODIs: babar - 50 (s/r 88), virat - 102 (s/r 78)

it is laughable how most critics and commentators just mention the rankings and average without checking the strength of the sides they are facing on a regular basis.

This is a really interesting cut of data and shows that Kohli indeed has a better record against the best pacers of the day.
I would have liked it if you introduced spinners as well.
Any reason you didn’t include Eng?

 

[160KPH]

This is a really interesting cut of data and shows that Kohli indeed has a better record against the best pacers of the day.
I would have liked it if you introduced spinners as well.
Any reason you didn’t include Eng?

It doesn’t include which country the game was played in either. For example, facing Anderson in England is a completely different world than facing Anderson in other conditions. Aside from one tour, Kohli has been a horrendous failure in England in Test cricket while Babar found success there immediately.

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

Babar has played 111 ODIs until now. So if we compare Kohli's ODI stats in his first 111 ODIs, with Babar's 111 ODIs, Babar has pretty decent edge over Kohli.


View attachment 137900
Breaking first 111 ODIs by opposition and comparing..

View attachment 137901

I have seen that you are comparing Kohli Babar Sachin using stats, are you taking era differences into consideration?
Do you know how odi cricket has changed after 2015?
Comparing Babars stats to Sachin and Kohli is illogical.

 

[Farabi]

It doesn’t include which country the game was played in either. For example, facing Anderson in England is a completely different world than facing Anderson in other conditions. Aside from one tour, Kohli has been a horrendous failure in England in Test cricket while Babar found success there immediately.

That’s a fair challenge, specially because I doubt many of these bowlers have visited Pakistan, so likely Babar’s performances are all away while Kohli’s are mixed.

@Front Foot pool, can you pull the same view as above and select Away and Neutral only.

 

[Hitman]

I have seen that you are comparing Kohli Babar Sachin using stats, are you taking era differences into consideration?
Do you know how odi cricket has changed after 2015?
Comparing Babars stats to Sachin and Kohli is illogical.

For batsmen who played majority of their ODI cricket before 2013, Babar has better stats than every single batsman. Heck, even King Viv's numbers look ordinary compared to Babar's. We all know why.

Like I said some days before, any one dimensional player can average 45 odd with the bat in ODI cricket now. Pre 2011/12, only the exceptionally consistent ones touched or surpassed an average of 45 like Viv and Tendulkar. Only Michael Bevan before that time averaged more than 50. While he was an exceptional finisher, his average was mostly because of the disproportionate amount of times he was not out.

 

[Front Foot Pull]

This is a really interesting cut of data and shows that Kohli indeed has a better record against the best pacers of the day.
I would have liked it if you introduced spinners as well.
Any reason you didn’t include Eng?

doing this spinners would take more effort and me being lazy here. cause best spinners are spread across more countries than SENA and also not the same spinners play both tests and ODIs. same reason why i ignored england in the above stats cause they played too many bowlers, but here they are

Bat AVG vs anderson, broad, stokes, woakes in tests:
babar - 33.4, virat - 40.4

Bat AVG vs woakes, plunkett, willey, wood (their top wicket taking pacers in ODIs in last 10 years) in ODIs:
babar - 38.8, virat - 40.8

 

[Front Foot Pull]

It doesn’t include which country the game was played in either. For example, facing Anderson in England is a completely different world than facing Anderson in other conditions. Aside from one tour, Kohli has been a horrendous failure in England in Test cricket while Babar found success there immediately.

Bat AVG in ENG vs their top pacers in tests in last 10 years ( broad, anderson, stokes, woakes):
babar - 30.2, virat - 35

 

[160KPH]

Bat AVG in ENG vs their top pacers in tests in last 10 years ( broad, anderson, stokes, woakes):
babar - 30.2, virat - 35

Something is pretty clearly being missed here. Let's just compare Babar and Kohli's most recent tours of England.

Kohli in 2021 faced an attack of:
- Anderson
- Broad
- Robinson
- Curran

Babar in 2022 faced an attack of:
- Anderson
- Broad
- Archer
- Woakes

Kohli averaged 31.14.
Babar averaged 48.75.

So one year after Kohli toured England, Babar toured England against an even better attack and performed better. The only previous match Babar played against England in England in Tests was one innings where he scored 68* not out.

If you were to look it as the basis of a person's first full tour through England then

Kohli in 2014 during his first tour through England averaged 13.40 when he faced:
- Anderson
- Broad
- Stokes
- Plunkett

Could you please share which site/calculator you're using to calculate this? The numbers do not seem consistent with the fact that in England against England:

Babar averages 65.75, while Kohli averages 33.65, while facing almost the exact same attacks.

 

[Vikram1989]

Something is pretty clearly being missed here. Let's just compare Babar and Kohli's most recent tours of England.

Kohli in 2021 faced an attack of:
- Anderson
- Broad
- Robinson
- Curran

Babar in 2022 faced an attack of:
- Anderson
- Broad
- Archer
- Woakes

Kohli averaged 31.14.
Babar averaged 48.75.

So one year after Kohli toured England, Babar toured England against an even better attack and performed better. The only previous match Babar played against England in England in Tests was one innings where he scored 68* not out.

If you were to look it as the basis of a person's first full tour through England then

Kohli in 2014 during his first tour through England averaged 13.40 when he faced:
- Anderson
- Broad
- Stokes
- Plunkett

Could you please share which site/calculator you're using to calculate this? The numbers do not seem consistent with the fact that in England against England:

Babar averages 65.75, while Kohli averages 33.65, while facing almost the exact same attacks.

India went to England and played 4 matches .Eng toured pak and played on Phattas where run rate was abnormal.

 

[Front Foot Pull]

Something is pretty clearly being missed here. Let's just compare Babar and Kohli's most recent tours of England.

Kohli in 2021 faced an attack of:
- Anderson
- Broad
- Robinson
- Curran

Babar in 2022 faced an attack of:
- Anderson
- Broad
- Archer
- Woakes

Kohli averaged 31.14.
Babar averaged 48.75.

So one year after Kohli toured England, Babar toured England against an even better attack and performed better. The only previous match Babar played against England in England in Tests was one innings where he scored 68* not out.

If you were to look it as the basis of a person's first full tour through England then

Kohli in 2014 during his first tour through England averaged 13.40 when he faced:
- Anderson
- Broad
- Stokes
- Plunkett

Could you please share which site/calculator you're using to calculate this? The numbers do not seem consistent with the fact that in England against England:

Babar averages 65.75, while Kohli averages 33.65, while facing almost the exact same attacks.

My numbers are correct, sourced them from cricmetric. babar azam scored 100 runs in england vs dom bess, joe root and never got out to them which boosts his average a bit. His cashing in on 2nd tier bowlers is surprising to you as well now, so much so that you begin to doubt the numbers as well.

yes, kohli failed in his first tour but later he did bounce back. you are free to use the "first tour" filter to suit your agenda.
i am not even a kohli fan but kohli was, is and will always be a much better batsman, match winner than babar.

 

[Mesozoic]

Kohli has superior record in tests in Australia, New Zealand, South Africa, West Indies etc etc but Babar fans cling onto England where Kohli usually gets lively wickets and Pakistan gets roads on which Zak Crawley scores 267.

I seriously don't believe how poor people here are with their analytical abilities.

 

[160KPH]

My numbers are correct, sourced them from cricmetric. babar azam scored 100 runs in england vs dom bess, joe root and never got out to them which boosts his average a bit. His cashing in on 2nd tier bowlers is surprising to you as well now, so much so that you begin to doubt the numbers as well.

yes, kohli failed in his first tour but later he did bounce back. you are free to use the "first tour" filter to suit your agenda.
i am not even a kohli fan but kohli was, is and will always be a much better batsman, match winner than babar.

I mean in that case it's pretty clear the metric you're using is absolutely useless. Why would you take points away from Babar for scoring against the secondary attack while Kohli failed against them if they're facing similar attacks in similar conditions?

In 2021, Kohli averaged 31.14 when facing Anderson, Broad, Robinson, and Curran in England.
In 2022, Babar averaged 48.75 when facing Anderson, Broad, Archer, and Woakes in England.

Why would I care about the number of runs against the individual bowlers over the number of runs scored in a match when they're facing almost the exact same attack? You can slice and dice it however you want. When Babar played in England he averages 65.75 while Kohli averages 33.65 in the exact same circumstance.

It's pretty simple. Babar scores almost double the runs in England than Kohli does before getting out.

 

[160KPH]

Kohli has superior record in tests in Australia, New Zealand, South Africa, West Indies etc etc but Babar fans cling onto England where Kohli usually gets lively wickets and Pakistan gets roads on which Zak Crawley scores 267.

I seriously don't believe how poor people here are with their analytical abilities.

Why make things up?

Kohli averages 36.00 in New Zealand.
Babar averages 47.33 in New Zealand.

Babar also has a way superior record in Sri Lanka and Bangladesh. It is not Babar's fault that Kohli failed miserably in Bangladesh last year and only managed to average 14.75 across 3 matches there.

Kohli's overall average is carried way more by his runs at home than Babar's is. Kohli has 4144 runs at home while Babar only has 1491.

 

[160KPH]

yes, kohli failed in his first tour but later he did bounce back. you are free to use the "first tour" filter to suit your agenda.
i am not even a kohli fan but kohli was, is and will always be a much better batsman, match winner than babar.

Final post, but this part is also terribly wrong. Kohli had one of the worst tours of England of all time in 2014. He then had a decent tour of England in 2018, but it still was not as good as Babar's average in England. Kohli then had another horrible tour of England in 2021. When Kohli went back in 2022 to complete the 5th match of the tour, he also once again failed horribly.

 

[Front Foot Pull]

Why make things up?

Kohli averages 36.00 in New Zealand.
Babar averages 47.33 in New Zealand.

Babar also has a way superior record in Sri Lanka and Bangladesh. It is not Babar's fault that Kohli failed miserably in Bangladesh last year and only managed to average 14.75 across 3 matches there.

Kohli's overall average is carried way more by his runs at home than Babar's is. Kohli has 4144 runs at home while Babar only has 1491.

Avg in SA:
babar - 37, virat - 51

Avg in AUS:
babar - 27.8, virat - 54

Avg in WI:
babar - 36.5, virat - 44. it is certainly not virat's car driver's problem that babar can't play in caribbean.

overall Avg away from home:
Babar - 39, virat - 42.8. virat's away record is after scoring 4400+ runs, let's see what babar does after playing a few more away series.

 

[Front Foot Pull]

Why make things up?

Kohli averages 36.00 in New Zealand.
Babar averages 47.33 in New Zealand.

Babar also has a way superior record in Sri Lanka and Bangladesh. It is not Babar's fault that Kohli failed miserably in Bangladesh last year and only managed to average 14.75 across 3 matches there.

Kohli's overall average is carried way more by his runs at home than Babar's is. Kohli has 4144 runs at home while Babar only has 1491.

From the last 6 years or so Indian test tracks are an ultimate challenge for any batsman around the world. any good runs scored on them, should be appreciated even more. meanwhile babar can feat on the pak roads, even if it means there are more draw matches.
laughing at myself for spending so much time to compare these two. i am out.

 

[Mesozoic]

Why make things up?

Kohli averages 36.00 in New Zealand.
Babar averages 47.33 in New Zealand.

Babar played a grand total of 2 tests in New Zealand and remained not out in one innings which inflated the averages by a lot. Kohli on his first tour of NZ averaged 71. He scored a hundred and a fifty in 4 innings there. Comparing averaged when the sample size is so small is just cop out...

Babar also has a way superior record in Sri Lanka and Bangladesh.

Another example of poor analytical abilities. Kohli played much better Sri Lankan attacks in 2015 and 2017 which had peak Herath. Babar played his in 2022 and 2023....no comparison at all. And Bangladesh lol...any Asian batter will be judged mostly on his record outside the subcontinent (SENA + WI). Records in Bangladesh hardly would hardly have any impact on Babar or Virat 's legacies.

Kohli's overall average is carried way more by his runs at home than Babar's is. Kohli has 4144 runs at home while Babar only has 1491

Irony just died a thousand deaths. Babar averages 71 in Pakistan while Kohli averages 60 in India despite playing on "bunsen burners". Proportionally, it's Babar's stats which got padded by home bullying.

 

[160KPH]

Avg in SA:
babar - 37, virat - 51

Avg in AUS:
babar - 27.8, virat - 54

Avg in WI:
babar - 36.5, virat - 44. it is certainly not virat's car driver's problem that babar can't play in caribbean.

overall Avg away from home:
Babar - 39, virat - 42.8. virat's away record is after scoring 4400+ runs, let's see what babar does after playing a few more away series.

I mean yeah, Kohli managed to stack up 1400 runs off the roads in Australia and 4400 runs at home. We'll see after a few more series where the record stands.

In SENA countries, Babar is superior in England and New Zealand. Kohli is superior in Australia and South Africa.
Outside of SENA, Babar is better in Sri Lanka and Bangladesh. Kohli is better in West Indies.

 

[Farabi]

Avg in SA:
babar - 37, virat - 51

Avg in AUS:
babar - 27.8, virat - 54

Avg in WI:
babar - 36.5, virat - 44. it is certainly not virat's car driver's problem that babar can't play in caribbean.

overall Avg away from home:
Babar - 39, virat - 42.8. virat's away record is after scoring 4400+ runs, let's see what babar does after playing a few more away series.

Underwhelmed to see an average of 42.8 for Kohli away vs Babar’s 39. Both are overrated.
The way some Indian and Pakistani fans hype Kohli I would have thought it would be at least 50.

 

[160KPH]

Irony just died a thousand deaths. Babar averages 71 in Pakistan while Kohli averages 60 in India despite playing on "bunsen burners". Proportionally, it's Babar's stats which got padded by home bullying.

This right here shows your mathematical illiteracy. You have to look at not just the magnitude but also the amount. 4144 runs at @ 60 would improve Babar's average more than having 1400 runs at @ 70.

Babar played a grand total of 2 tests in New Zealand and remained not out in one innings which inflated the averages by a lot. Kohli on his first tour of NZ averaged 71. He scored a hundred and a fifty in 4 innings there. Comparing averaged when the sample size is so small is just cop out...

You mentioned New Zealand, not me. Babar has only played 2 tests in New Zealand and was successful. You tried to use that as a point in Kohl's favor.

 

[160KPH]

Another example of poor analytical abilities. Kohli played much better Sri Lankan attacks in 2015 and 2017 which had peak Herath. Babar played his in 2022 and 2023....no comparison at all. And Bangladesh lol...any Asian batter will be judged mostly on his record outside the subcontinent (SENA + WI). Records in Bangladesh hardly would hardly have any impact on Babar or Virat 's legacies.

So first you say that we should take the attacks faced into consideration. But at the same time, we should not take into consideration Kohl's stat padding against some of the worst West Indies attacks of all time the last couple of years?

 

[160KPH]

Irony just died a thousand deaths. Babar averages 71 in Pakistan while Kohli averages 60 in India despite playing on "bunsen burners". Proportionally, it's Babar's stats which got padded by home bullying.

I went ahead and did the math for you. If you exchange home records, Babar Azam's average rises from 47.7 to 50.6, while Kohli's falls from 49.29 to 47.0. Pretty clear who's all around career numbers are benefitting more from stacking up runs at home thus far.

Irony truly did just die a thousand deaths.

 

[BouncerGuy]

The simple fact is that you cannot compare 2 players who have started playing almost 8 9 years apart. Different eras, different rules.

 

[Mesozoic]

Virat Kohli

Overall Test average - 49.29
Test average if we exclude home Tests - 42.35


Drop off - 6.94


Babar Azam

Overall Test average - 47.74
Test average if we exclude home Tests - 38.97

Drop off - 8.77

But but but "mAthEmaTicAl iLliTeRateE". Babar fans are truly an embarrassing breed. Poor guy doesn't deserve them.