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Actually Cena has rebuffed Triple H's comments. @shaz619 @Suleiman @The_KING Looks like Pinocchio is back to old tricks. No wonder that nose keeps getting bigger and bigger... :kp

Thing is h the way I saw him treat Cena in that unreal doc makes it seem like he tries too hard to come off as Cena’s mentor or something… but in reality Cena is qualified to be his mentor, and that’s the look Cena as on his face whenever h tries to downplay him like “buddy I came into the wwe years after you, and made you my ***** and surpassed you in a matter of 4 years, hope you had fun on my undercard”
 
Thing is h the way I saw him treat Cena in that unreal doc makes it seem like he tries too hard to come off as Cena’s mentor or something… but in reality Cena is qualified to be his mentor, and that’s the look Cena as on his face whenever h tries to downplay him like “buddy I came into the wwe years after you, and made you my ***** and surpassed you in a matter of 4 years, hope you had fun on my undercard”
Triple H is trying to be Mr. WWE but truth is he will never be. Even if Vince commits 50 heinous new crimes, people will always think of him when they think of the person behind WWE. H has tried his best to weasel his way into this position for decades. He has gotten here but the reality is that he didn't build anything. He was simply lucky to be in the right position at the right time. Had Vince not done what he did, he likely would have left his position as head of creative when he died. H's desperation on the other hand couldn't be more evident and the fans see it.
 
Thing is h the way I saw him treat Cena in that unreal doc makes it seem like he tries too hard to come off as Cena’s mentor or something… but in reality Cena is qualified to be his mentor, and that’s the look Cena as on his face whenever h tries to downplay him like “buddy I came into the wwe years after you, and made you my ***** and surpassed you in a matter of 4 years, hope you had fun on my undercard”

This is my favourite post of all time
 
On this occasion, even we got worked by the true intentions of the snake, and majority of fans don’t know half of what a kanjjar H is.

For context, there's suddenly a rumor going around that MVP and The Hurt Syndicate are tough to work with and won't put over FTR. Which many people are saying is planted by you know who.
 
Triple H is trying to be Mr. WWE but truth is he will never be. Even if Vince commits 50 heinous new crimes, people will always think of him when they think of the person behind WWE. H has tried his best to weasel his way into this position for decades. He has gotten here but the reality is that he didn't build anything. He was simply lucky to be in the right position at the right time. Had Vince not done what he did, he likely would have left his position as head of creative when he died. H's desperation on the other hand couldn't be more evident and the fans see it.

Reading your post, I was reminded of the below, this is basically H for real:


@Suleiman @Rafale Nidhal @RedwoodOriginal
 

For context, there's suddenly a rumor going around that MVP and The Hurt Syndicate are tough to work with and won't put over FTR. Which many people are saying is planted by you know who.

It is believable when you read his comments about colour, but he defo has a PR team when it comes to his own perception, and with the paid blue ticks, it’s even easier to spread misinformation.
 
It is believable when you read his comments about colour, but he defo has a PR team when it comes to his own perception, and with the paid blue ticks, it’s even easier to spread misinformation.
Knowing the $hit $how that AEW generally is, none of these rumors are that hard to believe, but there have actually been a number of weird rumors about AEW talent in recent months that have been proven to be false. Which is why many are starting to point the finger towards Pinocchio.

This is another thing btw that shows how small-minded Triple H is. When Vince was in-charge he didn't even acknowledge AEW's existence because he thought it was beneath him. Could be that H is still butthurt over the fact that AEW kicked NXT's a$$ in the ratings a few years ago, which led to NXT being completely rebranded and taken away from H by Vince.
 
With JC he is out of touch with dirt sheets, rumours & modern gimmicks such as MITB, he also gives H more respect then he deserves. And in his world, the whole angle was beyond absurd, we actually agreed that H is dumb enough to book something so ridiculous and pathetic so we saw it coming, maybe Dave on this occasion had a good insider but as @Rafale Nidhal mentioned, H has been giving Seth some special treatment so it wasn’t without possibility that the Cringe Lord was going to be out his sight. The super recovery from injury can be done so much better when it’s genuine & you keep it all under wraps, H leaked it thinking he’s some genius & for the twitter likes, half the time on Unreal the dweeb is on his phone, I actually think that Stephanie would do much better because she cares about the business more than herself; did you see her reaction to Chelsea Green winning the title? she said am so happy for her, then that stooge Vampire said what was that? she repeated it and he replied ‘oh right’, H meanwhile ignored the whole thing because he was too busy admiring himself on the phone.

Bro they could have done the injury so many ways but they went out of their way to make LA Knight look like a chump.
I agree, I find that aspect of his analysis to be a bit annoying. He is never as harsh on Triple H as he is on Tony Khan. Eventhough when it comes to booking decisions, H has made some stunning blunders this year.

I don't know about Stephanie. I have heard/read alot about her from people who worked with her when she was running SmackDown. And she does not exactly seem cut out for this business either. She also comes off as really fake to me. The way she tries to take the credit for the "women's evolution" and stuff. She has stepped away from the public eye a bit after the Vince stuff came out and TBH I'd prefer if it stayed that way. She is much better at doing these interview shows.

Out of all of them, I think Shane was probably the best person to run WWE. But H and Stephanie politicked him out of the picture and he was smart enough to step away rather than have that headache. Remember, it was Shane's idea to revive ECW as an internet-exclusive show where they could preserve the legacy of the original. He also told Vince to buy UFC back when they hadn't even gotten that TV deal with Spike. But for some reason, Vince never trusted him and always favored his daughter and doofus son-in-law more. It's a shame because it feels like Shane was always trying to do his best to get in Vince's good graces. Something evident by the crazy $hit he would do in the ring.

The LA Knight situation just keeps getting worse and worse. It's depressing honestly. To see him being put in these situations and then pulling the rug from under him. He is having the prime years of his career completely wasted, while company mascots and freakin' YouTubers are getting the pushed to the moon. I wonder how much of this he will take before he decides he has had enough...
 
I agree, I find that aspect of his analysis to be a bit annoying. He is never as harsh on Triple H as he is on Tony Khan. Eventhough when it comes to booking decisions, H has made some stunning blunders this year.

I don't know about Stephanie. I have heard/read alot about her from people who worked with her when she was running SmackDown. And she does not exactly seem cut out for this business either. She also comes off as really fake to me. The way she tries to take the credit for the "women's evolution" and stuff. She has stepped away from the public eye a bit after the Vince stuff came out and TBH I'd prefer if it stayed that way. She is much better at doing these interview shows.

Out of all of them, I think Shane was probably the best person to run WWE. But H and Stephanie politicked him out of the picture and he was smart enough to step away rather than have that headache. Remember, it was Shane's idea to revive ECW as an internet-exclusive show where they could preserve the legacy of the original. He also told Vince to buy UFC back when they hadn't even gotten that TV deal with Spike. But for some reason, Vince never trusted him and always favored his daughter and doofus son-in-law more. It's a shame because it feels like Shane was always trying to do his best to get in Vince's good graces. Something evident by the crazy $hit he would do in the ring.

The LA Knight situation just keeps getting worse and worse. It's depressing honestly. To see him being put in these situations and then pulling the rug from under him. He is having the prime years of his career completely wasted, while company mascots and freakin' YouTubers are getting the pushed to the moon. I wonder how much of this he will take before he decides he has had enough...
Shane is the only sane McMahon. I have so much respect for him, as he never had to do any of the crazy stuff that he did in the ring, but he did so because he wanted his dad’s approval. Sadly, it seems that Stephanie was always Vince’s favourite and as a result, he probably saw his son-in-law as more of a son than his own actual son.
 
Shane is the only sane McMahon. I have so much respect for him, as he never had to do any of the crazy stuff that he did in the ring, but he did so because he wanted his dad’s approval. Sadly, it seems that Stephanie was always Vince’s favourite and as a result, he probably saw his son-in-law as more of a son than his own actual son.
Yup, it's really sad. He seems like a really nice guy in real life too. Has a stable marriage and a loving family. At one point he seemed like the heir apparent but then somewhere done the line Vince changed his mind.

It seemed to me like Vince was always pushing him to show him what he was capable of. Yet when he did, Vince was like nah, do better. Must have been tough for Shane having that kind of relationship with his father. But I think he has done well for himself in life, all things considered.
 
Yup, it's really sad. He seems like a really nice guy in real life too. Has a stable marriage and a loving family. At one point he seemed like the heir apparent but then somewhere done the line Vince changed his mind.

It seemed to me like Vince was always pushing him to show him what he was capable of. Yet when he did, Vince was like nah, do better. Must have been tough for Shane having that kind of relationship with his father. But I think he has done well for himself in life, all things considered.

A lot of that was driven by Vinces own relationship with his father, he didn’t want to make it easy for Shane as a result.

But they are on good terms now and I feel Vince probably regrets investing in Triple Doofus & Steph.
 
I agree, I find that aspect of his analysis to be a bit annoying. He is never as harsh on Triple H as he is on Tony Khan. Eventhough when it comes to booking decisions, H has made some stunning blunders this year.

I don't know about Stephanie. I have heard/read alot about her from people who worked with her when she was running SmackDown. And she does not exactly seem cut out for this business either. She also comes off as really fake to me. The way she tries to take the credit for the "women's evolution" and stuff. She has stepped away from the public eye a bit after the Vince stuff came out and TBH I'd prefer if it stayed that way. She is much better at doing these interview shows.

Out of all of them, I think Shane was probably the best person to run WWE. But H and Stephanie politicked him out of the picture and he was smart enough to step away rather than have that headache. Remember, it was Shane's idea to revive ECW as an internet-exclusive show where they could preserve the legacy of the original. He also told Vince to buy UFC back when they hadn't even gotten that TV deal with Spike. But for some reason, Vince never trusted him and always favored his daughter and doofus son-in-law more. It's a shame because it feels like Shane was always trying to do his best to get in Vince's good graces. Something evident by the crazy $hit he would do in the ring.

The LA Knight situation just keeps getting worse and worse. It's depressing honestly. To see him being put in these situations and then pulling the rug from under him. He is having the prime years of his career completely wasted, while company mascots and freakin' YouTubers are getting the pushed to the moon. I wonder how much of this he will take before he decides he has had enough...

I am getting desperate hence I suggested Steph as she’s there and despite her own issues back in the day, she still was part of a successful era of SD and would do a much better job then her Husband, I also feel she has come across more genuine recently opposed to the past. I think JC hates AEW so much as a business and their practice that nothing else matters, a bit like his relation with Russo, while with the WWE, it may not be perfect but it’s a professional set-up that he can tolerate and therefore a bridge he can maintain for any business endeavour in the future.

I think he will leave mate unless they pay him stupid money, by now he has probably figured out that they will only go as far as throwing him a bone.
 
Shane is the only sane McMahon. I have so much respect for him, as he never had to do any of the crazy stuff that he did in the ring, but he did so because he wanted his dad’s approval. Sadly, it seems that Stephanie was always Vince’s favourite and as a result, he probably saw his son-in-law as more of a son than his own actual son.

Shane made his own way without his father and lived a completely ordinary life, while Steph wanted to be heavily involved in the business, it was a mistake because Shane at his core, went to crazy lengths for the company & the fans and he respected his father more then any of them. Sometimes a person may seem suitable on paper but it’s always better to invest in people who value integrity.
 
Knowing the $hit $how that AEW generally is, none of these rumors are that hard to believe, but there have actually been a number of weird rumors about AEW talent in recent months that have been proven to be false. Which is why many are starting to point the finger towards Pinocchio.

This is another thing btw that shows how small-minded Triple H is. When Vince was in-charge he didn't even acknowledge AEW's existence because he thought it was beneath him. Could be that H is still butthurt over the fact that AEW kicked NXT's a$$ in the ratings a few years ago, which led to NXT being completely rebranded and taken away from H by Vince.

H is actually the kind of guy that would remain butt-hurt about the AEW/NXT affair for decades so it’s completely plausible, he doesn’t let go of grudges.
 
On August 6, 2025, WWE and ESPN announced a five-year, $1.6 billion deal making ESPN the exclusive U.S. home for all WWE Premium Live Events starting in 2026. These events, including WrestleMania and Royal Rumble, will stream on ESPN’s new $29.99/month platform launching August 21, 2025, with select simulcasts on ESPN’s cable channels. Until then, Peacock will retain WWE event rights through 2025. Meanwhile, WWE’s international content—including Raw and SmackDown—is already available on Netflix under a separate 10-year deal that began in January 2025.
 
I agree, I find that aspect of his analysis to be a bit annoying. He is never as harsh on Triple H as he is on Tony Khan. Eventhough when it comes to booking decisions, H has made some stunning blunders this year.

I don't know about Stephanie. I have heard/read alot about her from people who worked with her when she was running SmackDown. And she does not exactly seem cut out for this business either. She also comes off as really fake to me. The way she tries to take the credit for the "women's evolution" and stuff. She has stepped away from the public eye a bit after the Vince stuff came out and TBH I'd prefer if it stayed that way. She is much better at doing these interview shows.

Out of all of them, I think Shane was probably the best person to run WWE. But H and Stephanie politicked him out of the picture and he was smart enough to step away rather than have that headache. Remember, it was Shane's idea to revive ECW as an internet-exclusive show where they could preserve the legacy of the original. He also told Vince to buy UFC back when they hadn't even gotten that TV deal with Spike. But for some reason, Vince never trusted him and always favored his daughter and doofus son-in-law more. It's a shame because it feels like Shane was always trying to do his best to get in Vince's good graces. Something evident by the crazy $hit he would do in the ring.

The LA Knight situation just keeps getting worse and worse. It's depressing honestly. To see him being put in these situations and then pulling the rug from under him. He is having the prime years of his career completely wasted, while company mascots and freakin' YouTubers are getting the pushed to the moon. I wonder how much of this he will take before he decides he has had enough...
Steph isn't a booker or promoter. Her strengths are handling meetings and being an executive. The on screen kind of stuff, she isn't made for that.
i don't think there will be another booker like vince. He was just much much better than all of his rivals.
Another person I think whose presence is being felt is Pat Patterson. The guy doesn't get much attention as he should. He was behind some of the best moments in WWE.
 
Lol Trips' bs isn't going to work on Cena. He gives it back much more brutally and the funny thing is Trips can't do anything about it. Randy needs to do that to Trips as well. He's been treated like a joke since his return.
 
Steph isn't a booker or promoter. Her strengths are handling meetings and being an executive. The on screen kind of stuff, she isn't made for that.
i don't think there will be another booker like vince. He was just much much better than all of his rivals.
Another person I think whose presence is being felt is Pat Patterson. The guy doesn't get much attention as he should. He was behind some of the best moments in WWE.

The childhood, overly excited smark version of me would almost certainly agree with your comment on Steph. But captain hindsight & time can help clear many things.

For one, lets assume that hypothetically, Steph was a terrible booker, she was made the head of creative around 2002/2003; and I ask myself this question, what was it about Smackdown during her leadership that I really hated? Honestly, not a lot, Steph was put in a difficult spot to prove her worth to her Father by having to manage wrestlers who watched her grow up in the business quiet literally, she was a child to them; just imagine how difficult that must have been, it’s like being an employee in a top company and your nephew ends up in a managerial role. To make the environment even more intense, Heyman was bought in, a guy who was still very much on edge from the fallout of ECW going down under, he came in with a big chip on his shoulder & a huge but justified ego because he was a genuine visionary unlike the whore he is tasked to manage at the moment. I don’t know if Steph’s position was going to be permanent, because her Father had her do a variety of roles as he was shaping her to run the business so it was a part of her learning curve, and in the environment she had to work in, Stephanie did a good job actually. I could have bet £100k if I had the money that Heyman was going to clash with whoever was the head of creative in 2002, he clashed with Gerwitz and even Vince, like I said, childhood me would have said something like ‘Haha Steph clashed with Heyman, such a hoe! Jericho was right!’ Heyman was wrestling royalty for smarks & the godfather of the independent circuit which would be shaped in his name, ECW literally was split into ROH & CZW, so reading a bit of dirt about the two was always going to get blown way out of proportion!

In-fact, if memory serves me well, Heyman got along much better with Stephanie then he did with Vince, Steph had great instincts & became to appreciate Heyman & accepted what he wanted for Smackdown was best, I think there was more heat between the two when it came to some of the segments which Heyman wanted Stephanie to do as GM, but thank God we got to see those if it’s the ones I think, because they are forever etched in my memory :imad Stephanie repeatedly refused Heyman’s resignation as well, she knew how good he was, Heyman wasn’t ‘fired’ in the way we assume & it certainly wasn’t Stephanie’s decision in the end. There is an old interview out there where Heyman is praising her and I don’t even think he was on the WWE pay-roll at the time of the interview, if I find it I will share it here.

Having said that, I would agree with you she is more suited to exec type roles, however, I just wanted to highlight this to support the view that she would do a much better job then H and isn’t anywhere near as big a narcissist as he is.

In the end Vince was shaping Steph for the business and saw a lot of her in himself and he was right because she was also responsible for putting him out, kind of like Vince being a rebel against his own Father once he got the keys to the kingdom.

The biggest criticism I have of Steph is marrying that 4/10 garbage can, during one of her ‘internships’ as head writer in the 2000, you can guess who was the biggest beneficiary of that stint………
 
The childhood, overly excited smark version of me would almost certainly agree with your comment on Steph. But captain hindsight & time can help clear many things.

For one, lets assume that hypothetically, Steph was a terrible booker, she was made the head of creative around 2002/2003; and I ask myself this question, what was it about Smackdown during her leadership that I really hated? Honestly, not a lot, Steph was put in a difficult spot to prove her worth to her Father by having to manage wrestlers who watched her grow up in the business quiet literally, she was a child to them; just imagine how difficult that must have been, it’s like being an employee in a top company and your nephew ends up in a managerial role. To make the environment even more intense, Heyman was bought in, a guy who was still very much on edge from the fallout of ECW going down under, he came in with a big chip on his shoulder & a huge but justified ego because he was a genuine visionary unlike the whore he is tasked to manage at the moment. I don’t know if Steph’s position was going to be permanent, because her Father had her do a variety of roles as he was shaping her to run the business so it was a part of her learning curve, and in the environment she had to work in, Stephanie did a good job actually. I could have bet £100k if I had the money that Heyman was going to clash with whoever was the head of creative in 2002, he clashed with Gerwitz and even Vince, like I said, childhood me would have said something like ‘Haha Steph clashed with Heyman, such a hoe! Jericho was right!’ Heyman was wrestling royalty for smarks & the godfather of the independent circuit which would be shaped in his name, ECW literally was split into ROH & CZW, so reading a bit of dirt about the two was always going to get blown way out of proportion!

In-fact, if memory serves me well, Heyman got along much better with Stephanie then he did with Vince, Steph had great instincts & became to appreciate Heyman & accepted what he wanted for Smackdown was best, I think there was more heat between the two when it came to some of the segments which Heyman wanted Stephanie to do as GM, but thank God we got to see those if it’s the ones I think, because they are forever etched in my memory :imad Stephanie repeatedly refused Heyman’s resignation as well, she knew how good he was, Heyman wasn’t ‘fired’ in the way we assume & it certainly wasn’t Stephanie’s decision in the end. There is an old interview out there where Heyman is praising her and I don’t even think he was on the WWE pay-roll at the time of the interview, if I find it I will share it here.

Having said that, I would agree with you she is more suited to exec type roles, however, I just wanted to highlight this to support the view that she would do a much better job then H and isn’t anywhere near as big a narcissist as he is.

In the end Vince was shaping Steph for the business and saw a lot of her in himself and he was right because she was also responsible for putting him out, kind of like Vince being a rebel against his own Father once he got the keys to the kingdom.

The biggest criticism I have of Steph is marrying that 4/10 garbage can, during one of her ‘internships’ as head writer in the 2000, you can guess who was the biggest beneficiary of that stint………
I agree but the thing is one person can't be simultaneously a booker, promoter, exec, on air personality unless its Vince.
If I were to hire Steph I would hire her as an exec which is where her strength lies.
And for trips, i think the only role he is suited to is Talent Relations. He shouldn't get higher than that.
 
The rock is the biggest clown. He ruined the bloodline story and cena's heel turn.

It was obvious cena's original heel turn was going to involve Rock heavily and the storyline would involve Cena associated with the rock.

But due to rock's absence and the Travis Scott botch, they turned cena into a crybaby, who whined and acted out of character for 5 months before doing a 360 and deciding he wants to he babyface again.

Now wwe will sweep this under the rug during the upcoming feud with brock acting like he never became heel in the first place since they dont wish to associate themsleves with the rock.

Honestly this heel thing should not have happened with rock considering he even ruined the dceu lol.

Should have kept Cena as face, win the Chamber fairly, beat Cody at Wrestlemania in a clean fashion, beat punk and orton in a clean fashion, scrap that nonsense logan Paul and r truth partnership nonsense, and lose to Cody fairly with brock returning as the true final boss.

Stupid stupid rock.
 
Yet another character arc ruined by H.

Didn’t need Cena to turn face this early and in such a weak way.

Imagine heel Cena vs face Brock.
 
The rock is the biggest clown. He ruined the bloodline story and cena's heel turn.

It was obvious cena's original heel turn was going to involve Rock heavily and the storyline would involve Cena associated with the rock.

But due to rock's absence and the Travis Scott botch, they turned cena into a crybaby, who whined and acted out of character for 5 months before doing a 360 and deciding he wants to he babyface again.

Now wwe will sweep this under the rug during the upcoming feud with brock acting like he never became heel in the first place since they dont wish to associate themsleves with the rock.

Honestly this heel thing should not have happened with rock considering he even ruined the dceu lol.

Should have kept Cena as face, win the Chamber fairly, beat Cody at Wrestlemania in a clean fashion, beat punk and orton in a clean fashion, scrap that nonsense logan Paul and r truth partnership nonsense, and lose to Cody fairly with brock returning as the true final boss.

Stupid stupid rock.

The Rock didn’t ruin sh!t, the responsibility entirely belongs with H. Dwayne didn’t ruin The Bloodline storyline, there is a strong argument that he wanted to make it even better by feuding with Roman Reigns, but due to the fan reaction at the time & Cody’s push, we got the tag team match instead. H got a huge ego and can’t manage big personalities, The Rock got him back for treating him poorly when he returned to wrestling; everything Rocky was involved with wrestling-wise was top tier TV & we got a new character from him that was well received, I wouldn’t mix the movie garbage with the wrestling world which he was born to be great in, even during sleep. The Rock’s a terrible movie star, highest paid chamchah blah blah don’t get me wrong, he has to pitch to serious directors about doing serious acting while the serious directors come to Batista with their pitch! But the biggest snake in the WWE is Triple H, if you’ve watched the Unreal show and read between the lines & analyse H, you will see his severe personality defects such as his narcism. And btw whatever did happen involving Travis Scott at WM were all H calls, he basically ruined the main-event on the grandest stage of them all.

Yeah I personally thought Cena’s turn was still done very well, John delivered for me though I can see some had other views, he managed to get heat during a farewell tour and it was all unexpected & unpredictable in the way his turn was executed, however, I agree that it would have been more interesting to see the heel version of him go up against Lesnar.

And you can never win with wrestling fans, for decades we’ve been dying for a heel turn, if we knew that we’d never ever get it, would we seriously be against the last 5 months? I don’t think so. This entire farewell tour is a love letter from John Cena to his fans, the heel turn, bringing back his biggest rivals, getting the 17th championship etc We just don’t see it yet. He is going to be around for a very limited period and unfortunately December is the retirement date, that’s a shoot, so when you consider such a small window to squeeze just about every fan request, I think for me this has been a success.
 
Yet another character arc ruined by H.

Didn’t need Cena to turn face this early and in such a weak way.

Imagine heel Cena vs face Brock.

I think Brock had to be a heel due to the woke audience, although WWE fans seem to be a bit more chill I think. However, Lesnar is the only heel out there who you could book against another top heel imo E.g. similar to when Bryan faced him as a heel, taking that extra step when it comes to aggression / intensity to negate the beast, with Cena being in his twilight, perhaps that’s what he’d need to do as well to compete against Brock? There are so many ways you could justify it creatively as a one-off.

But remember, that piece of crap doesn’t have a single good idea.
 
The Rock didn’t ruin sh!t, the responsibility entirely belongs with H. Dwayne didn’t ruin The Bloodline storyline, there is a strong argument that he wanted to make it even better by feuding with Roman Reigns, but due to the fan reaction at the time & Cody’s push, we got the tag team match instead. H got a huge ego and can’t manage big personalities, The Rock got him back for treating him poorly when he returned to wrestling; everything Rocky was involved with wrestling-wise was top tier TV & we got a new character from him that was well received, I wouldn’t mix the movie garbage with the wrestling world which he was born to be great in, even during sleep. The Rock’s a terrible movie star, highest paid chamchah blah blah don’t get me wrong, he has to pitch to serious directors about doing serious acting while the serious directors come to Batista with their pitch! But the biggest snake in the WWE is Triple H, if you’ve watched the Unreal show and read between the lines & analyse H, you will see his severe personality defects such as his narcism. And btw whatever did happen involving Travis Scott at WM were all H calls, he basically ruined the main-event on the grandest stage of them all.

Yeah I personally thought Cena’s turn was still done very well, John delivered for me though I can see some had other views, he managed to get heat during a farewell tour and it was all unexpected & unpredictable in the way his turn was executed, however, I agree that it would have been more interesting to see the heel version of him go up against Lesnar.

And you can never win with wrestling fans, for decades we’ve been dying for a heel turn, if we knew that we’d never ever get it, would we seriously be against the last 5 months? I don’t think so. This entire farewell tour is a love letter from John Cena to his fans, the heel turn, bringing back his biggest rivals, getting the 17th championship etc We just don’t see it yet. He is going to be around for a very limited period and unfortunately December is the retirement date, that’s a shoot, so when you consider such a small window to squeeze just about every fan request, I think for me this has been a success.
I disagree.

We wanted heel Cena, but we didn't want cry baby Cena who acts out of character.

Heel cena hating his fans is fine, but that should have been one promo not every god damn promo where people are mad 24/7.

Heel Cena should have just been Super Cena but Evil and doing his own thing with harsher promos, bigger insults and a willingness to cheat more to win rather then always playing it safe.

They didn't give fans what they wanted.

Wwe fans would know that they wanted a new song temporarily, a new Heel attire, and a Brand new Super Cena run but with a heel twist.

Also the other reason you are wrong is because Cena himself confirmed it and blamed the rock for it. In the promo and even outside he clearly explained that the heel saga is being ended pre maturely due to the absence of rock which started it all.

The original plans were different and obviously involved the rock.

Triple H has issues when it comes to storylines but this wasnt one of em.

Rock's original idea was to have heel Cody fight babyface Cena but Teiple H rejected it and then proposed the opposite which cena accepted. But their was suppose to be a different storyline at play. Not the one we got.
 
I disagree.

We wanted heel Cena, but we didn't want cry baby Cena who acts out of character.

Heel cena hating his fans is fine, but that should have been one promo not every god damn promo where people are mad 24/7.

Heel Cena should have just been Super Cena but Evil and doing his own thing with harsher promos, bigger insults and a willingness to cheat more to win rather then always playing it safe.

They didn't give fans what they wanted.

Wwe fans would know that they wanted a new song temporarily, a new Heel attire, and a Brand new Super Cena run but with a heel twist.

Also the other reason you are wrong is because Cena himself confirmed it and blamed the rock for it. In the promo and even outside he clearly explained that the heel saga is being ended pre maturely due to the absence of rock which started it all.

The original plans were different and obviously involved the rock.

Triple H has issues when it comes to storylines but this wasnt one of em.

Rock's original idea was to have heel Cody fight babyface Cena but Teiple H rejected it and then proposed the opposite which cena accepted. But their was suppose to be a different storyline at play. Not the one we got.

If you got what you wanted which was NWO Hogan, Cena would be cheered by all the marks which defeats the purpose of a heel character, you hated this heel turn and that’s the whole point of Cena’s character approach, he got heat from people like you, the hardcore fanbases got upset, not realising they got worked by a modern legend. The whole point of his turn was to give you what you wanted but without actually giving you the things you wanted such as an edgier character, all you are doing there is creating a super baby face who is going to get cheered like mad while you’re trying to build Cody as the new super Cena.

Cena has not formally blamed the Rock for anything, and shoot promos are just material for the smark fans to get excited over on the internet. The Rock not showing up is something you have to fault the management for, especially the head booker who has a certain history when it comes to clashing with much bigger stars then him, in-fact this same idiot was talking down to Cena on the unreal documentary & tried to throw his name under the bus when it came to the return of Lesnar, now this is not shoot promos but interviews done with big time media.

I think you’re overlooking how H needs to show more leadership and keep his ego in check when dealing with stars much bigger then him. I agree that all off the Rock’s pitches were pretty much rejected & H got what he wanted and the fans got what they wanted to so criticising The Rock overly doesn’t make sense, but there was going to be a price to pay for that. Good leadership would have been to meet The Rock in the middle with what he wanted, & that could have meant he worked this years WM as well, but how could H have done that when he has been politicking against the Rock & his family since the. late 90’s.
 
If you got what you wanted which was NWO Hogan, Cena would be cheered by all the marks which defeats the purpose of a heel character, you hated this heel turn and that’s the whole point of Cena’s character approach, he got heat from people like you, the hardcore fanbases got upset, not realising they got worked by a modern legend. The whole point of his turn was to give you what you wanted but without actually giving you the things you wanted such as an edgier character, all you are doing there is creating a super baby face who is going to get cheered like mad while you’re trying to build Cody as the new super Cena.

Cena has not formally blamed the Rock for anything, and shoot promos are just material for the smark fans to get excited over on the internet. The Rock not showing up is something you have to fault the management for, especially the head booker who has a certain history when it comes to clashing with much bigger stars then him, in-fact this same idiot was talking down to Cena on the unreal documentary & tried to throw his name under the bus when it came to the return if Cena, now this is not shoot promos but interviews done with big time media.

I think you’re overlooking how H needs to show more leadership and keep his ego in check when dealing with stars much bigger then him. I agree that all off the Rock’s pitches were pretty much rejected & H got what he wanted and the fans got what they wanted to so criticising The Rock overly doesn’t make sense, but there was going to be a price to pay for that. Good leadership would have been to meet The Rock in the middle with what he wanted, & that could have meant he worked this years WM as well, but how could H have done that when he has been politicking against the Rock & his family since the. late 90’s.
Bro wdym people like me 😭😭.

Cena wont formerly blame the rock cause rock is on the board and will cause a hissyfit.

Dude literally threw a tamper tantrum for cena beating him in a promo with that notes on my wrist comment.

However it is 100% confirmed the heel run was cut short. And that the original storyline involved the rock heavily with cena.

^^ These are undeniable facts, idkw you're defending or denying this when the whole original concept was cena sold his soul to the rock, not cena became evil for XYZ reason.
 
Bro wdym people like me 😭😭.

Cena wont formerly blame the rock cause rock is on the board and will cause a hissyfit.

Dude literally threw a tamper tantrum for cena beating him in a promo with that notes on my wrist comment.

However it is 100% confirmed the heel run was cut short. And that the original storyline involved the rock heavily with cena.

^^ These are undeniable facts, idkw you're defending or denying this when the whole original concept was cena sold his soul to the rock, not cena became evil for XYZ reason.

I meant as in hardcore fans like us, not just you but me to, if I got NWO Hogan, I would cheer Cena every night!

And Cena / Rock have a great relationship, I will never accept in the current timeline that The Rock would do something to undermine Cena. What you’re saying is from years ago bro lol They are mates now.

But I am sure that if H was giving him cheek then he was going to use his influence and make him pay for it.

Knowing H’s booking style, I think SS was always the plan for them to do the face turn so fans have more time to properly celebrate Cena for the few months he has left. At SS, H tends to hit the reset button, everything he does is all predictable that you can ask me what we will see at at the next PPV and I will get 70-80% right.

I am not denying some of the accusations levelled against the Rock, all I am saying is that H is a much bigger snake and most fans are starting to get fed up with him, I’ve been saying this for much longer though! If there’s something you’re not happy with in wrestling, it’s usually the booker who is at fault 99% off the time.
 
I meant as in hardcore fans like us, not just you but me to, if I got NWO Hogan, I would cheer Cena every night!

And Cena / Rock have a great relationship, I will never accept in the current timeline that The Rock would do something to undermine Cena. What you’re saying is from years ago bro lol They are mates now.

But I am sure that if H was giving him cheek then he was going to use his influence and make him pay for it.

Knowing H’s booking style, I think SS was always the plan for them to do the face turn so fans have more time to properly celebrate Cena for the few months he has left. At SS, H tends to hit the reset button, everything he does is all predictable that you can ask me what we will see at at the next PPV and I will get 70-80% right.

I am not denying some of the accusations levelled against the Rock, all I am saying is that H is a much bigger snake and most fans are starting to get fed up with him, I’ve been saying this for much longer though! If there’s something you’re not happy with in wrestling, it’s usually the booker who is at fault 99% off the time.
Agree to disagree but I'm simply stating facts that I am aware of. You know that even on cricket sections I never speak in could have would have narratives and onpy talk about the information available.

Triple H's problem with cena was that he refused to change the theme song and the attire that cena requested.

Cena was in an agreement with wwe to constantly wear different colored t shorts across different shows to increase merchandise sales and cena wanted things to be different.

That killed cena's momentum as the whole vibrant fruit loops gimmick doesnt work when you are a heel. Cena wanted to return to his thugonomcis attire.

Triple H also restricted some of Cena's promos so that he doesnt overshadow Cody Rhodes. He was never allowed to go all out as a heel. Even randy orton during the feud wanted cena to do something similar to what Triple H did dueing their rivalry but H wasnt having any of it.

Lots of rivalries were watered down as a result.

However only a rivalry with Randy and Cody was planned. The rivalry with Cm Punk was added randomly and many of the matches such as cena and Logan Paul team up or cena vs r truth was made up by wwe due to rock's absence preventing a storyline which cena outright stated and H stated himself.

My guess is the original plan was for a cena and rock tag team teamup and not a logan Paul teamup which makes zero sense?

Cena ruining wrestling by teaming up with a youtuber 🤣🤣🤣.

Again the intital premise was that cena sold his soul to the final boss. Not that he became a heel out of the blue.

Rock in the storyline even promised that he would raise cena to new heights as his personal champion which never happened as Rock never showed up.

The initial story never happened which made the heel turn feel like a waste.

^^ All of this information is at display. Lastly the face turn was planned at summer slam, not before summerslam but they had to cut it short as well.
 
Agree to disagree but I'm simply stating facts that I am aware of. You know that even on cricket sections I never speak in could have would have narratives and onpy talk about the information available.

Triple H's problem with cena was that he refused to change the theme song and the attire that cena requested.

Cena was in an agreement with wwe to constantly wear different colored t shorts across different shows to increase merchandise sales and cena wanted things to be different.

That killed cena's momentum as the whole vibrant fruit loops gimmick doesnt work when you are a heel. Cena wanted to return to his thugonomcis attire.

Triple H also restricted some of Cena's promos so that he doesnt overshadow Cody Rhodes. He was never allowed to go all out as a heel. Even randy orton during the feud wanted cena to do something similar to what Triple H did dueing their rivalry but H wasnt having any of it.

Lots of rivalries were watered down as a result.

However only a rivalry with Randy and Cody was planned. The rivalry with Cm Punk was added randomly and many of the matches such as cena and Logan Paul team up or cena vs r truth was made up by wwe due to rock's absence preventing a storyline which cena outright stated and H stated himself.

My guess is the original plan was for a cena and rock tag team teamup and not a logan Paul teamup which makes zero sense?

Cena ruining wrestling by teaming up with a youtuber 🤣🤣🤣.

Again the intital premise was that cena sold his soul to the final boss. Not that he became a heel out of the blue.

Rock in the storyline even promised that he would raise cena to new heights as his personal champion which never happened as Rock never showed up.

The initial story never happened which made the heel turn feel like a waste.

^^ All of this information is at display. Lastly the face turn was planned at summer slam, not before summerslam but they had to cut it short as well.

The way Cena’s heel turn was executed is open for debate and I don’t really have a problem with that as it’s subjective in terms of what you like or don’t like, and yes, that’s something both H & Cena would have had to figure out.

And yes Cena selling his soul to The Rock was the basis for his heel turn & there wasn’t a pay-off; but what you need to accept is that the head booker is responsible for that, and additionally, once he was aware off the no-show, he had the opportunity to recover from it months later and at least give the fans a satisfying WM main-event, but our pay off was H booking Travis Scott to interfere in the main-event of Wrestlemania, that’s more unforgivable then anything Rock did or didn’t do.
 
The way Cena’s heel turn was executed is open for debate and I don’t really have a problem with that as it’s subjective in terms of what you like or don’t like, and yes, that’s something both H & Cena would have had to figure out.

And yes Cena selling his soul to The Rock was the basis for his heel turn & there wasn’t a pay-off; but what you need to accept is that the head booker is responsible for that, and additionally, once he was aware off the no-show, he had the opportunity to recover from it months later and at least give the fans a satisfying WM main-event, but our pay off was H booking Travis Scott to interfere in the main-event of Wrestlemania, that’s more unforgivable then anything Rock did or didn’t do.
I never blamed Cena as a heel. Literally no one blames Cena.

Unlike Rock he is a phenomenal actor. Rock is a nepo baby fraud with no aura and is badly carried by production teams doing stuff for him. His promos aren't anything special either.

Cena on the other hand is a phenomenal actor in both wwe and Hollywood, an amazing seller, and nails every gimmick. Theirs a reason why he is the only person James gunn wanted to keep from the otherwise collapsed dceu.

Cena is also no fraud and is genuinely a good person. Unlike that lying clown who faked his life and success story Mrbeast and who frequently lies about wanting to help people and has been called out on end,

Cena actually does his absolute best in philanthropy and doesnt have an ego. He hold the record for make a wish foundation and wwe didnt want him to make a promo but cena forced them to make a promo qith sting congratulating a girl for battling through cancer.

When cena stated that he has spent 25 years raising more kids then you, he meant it. Backstage he even apologised to the kid and asked him to forgive him since it was a part of his gimmick at the time and he didnt want to say what he said. Even then the kid didnt mind and responded with a we love you.

No one blames Cena itself, its obviously the management's fault but Rock is the biggest one to blame. He is the one who started this story and you can blame H all you want, it is not easy rewriting a story.

Rock was suppose to appear at mania, he was even booked for it in leaked scripts, but he didnt show. The storyline was about Rock raising cena to new heights and about selling his soul to the rock

Well neither of these 2 events occurred and wwe had to make so much stuff up while also constantly checking in with the rock if he was going to appear hence many last minute changes were made.
 
I never blamed Cena as a heel. Literally no one blames Cena.

Unlike Rock he is a phenomenal actor. Rock is a nepo baby fraud with no aura and is badly carried by production teams doing stuff for him. His promos aren't anything special either.

Cena on the other hand is a phenomenal actor in both wwe and Hollywood, an amazing seller, and nails every gimmick. Theirs a reason why he is the only person James gunn wanted to keep from the otherwise collapsed dceu.

Cena is also no fraud and is genuinely a good person. Unlike that lying clown who faked his life and success story Mrbeast and who frequently lies about wanting to help people and has been called out on end,

Cena actually does his absolute best in philanthropy and doesnt have an ego. He hold the record for make a wish foundation and wwe didnt want him to make a promo but cena forced them to make a promo qith sting congratulating a girl for battling through cancer.

When cena stated that he has spent 25 years raising more kids then you, he meant it. Backstage he even apologised to the kid and asked him to forgive him since it was a part of his gimmick at the time and he didnt want to say what he said. Even then the kid didnt mind and responded with a we love you.

No one blames Cena itself, its obviously the management's fault but Rock is the biggest one to blame. He is the one who started this story and you can blame H all you want, it is not easy rewriting a story.

Rock was suppose to appear at mania, he was even booked for it in leaked scripts, but he didnt show. The storyline was about Rock raising cena to new heights and about selling his soul to the rock

Well neither of these 2 events occurred and wwe had to make so much stuff up while also constantly checking in with the rock if he was going to appear hence many last minute changes were made.

Under Vince McMahon, we never had any problem with The Rock and his appearances, that should be enough for you to question the head booker.

Chopping & changing is part of the wrestling business and no-shows are not ideal, how did Triple H handle himself after that? The quality of the booking is there for all to see, Triple H is responsible for navigating the waters and he ruined the Wrestlemania main-event, he didn’t need to involve Travis Scott.

However, what I am trying to get you to see is that the whole thing could have been avoided if Triple H was a good booker, what he kept doing was clashing with the biggest star in the entertainment business, like seriously wth?

Sometimes in life you need to know your place and calm your huge ego, but as a former talent who always was out to get The Rock in the past, there’s a clear conflict of interest here. Just as an example and there’s footage of this on the Unreal documentary, H is literally saying to Cena ‘Better not F this up’ like really, who does he think he is? He couldn’t draw a dime and is nothing in this business without marrying Stephanie, not even 1% of his work remotely compares to what Cena has achieved, I am just showing you this example to highlight that H isn’t the victim he likes to portray himself and he played a huge part in the deteriorated relationship with The Rock.
 
@mominsaigol

I don’t deny what happened, but I am saying this was revenge for what Triple H did to The Rock at WM 40 & for all the backstabbing in the late 90’s. This is nothing, big personalities in wrestling have done far worse, but Vince knew how to handle them and get them to do what he wanted. And Triple H deserves it to be honest, we’re all sick of him and seen enough of his pathetic booking which shows that he is not up to the job and his politics/ego are stunting the push of the wrestlers we want to see at the top.
 
Enjoyed this interview. Interesting to hear how different it is coming up in Europe where chops, forearms, upper cuts are focused on more than your average, garden-variety punch. One thing that I had heard before but doesn't surprise me is Gunther's influences. Guys like; Stan Hansen, Bruiser Brody, (though he doesn't mention him here) Vader

 
Enjoyed this interview. Interesting to hear how different it is coming up in Europe where chops, forearms, upper cuts are focused on more than your average, garden-variety punch.

No offense to Michelle, but she gotta go imo…

I never understood why they need a third person in all these podcasts with legends… same thing with that Mike Tyson podcast and same thing with Rampage Jackson’s podcast (MMA legend)
 
@mominsaigol

I don’t deny what happened, but I am saying this was revenge for what Triple H did to The Rock at WM 40 & for all the backstabbing in the late 90’s. This is nothing, big personalities in wrestling have done far worse, but Vince knew how to handle them and get them to do what he wanted. And Triple H deserves it to be honest, we’re all sick of him and seen enough of his pathetic booking which shows that he is not up to the job and his politics/ego are stunting the push of the wrestlers we want to see at the top.
H’s time might be near… even the normies are rioting online now with that stupid espn deal.

This guy always fumbles, hope Orton punts him for real
 
No offense to Michelle, but she gotta go imo…

I never understood why they need a third person in all these podcasts with legends… same thing with that Mike Tyson podcast and same thing with Rampage Jackson’s podcast (MMA legend)
Lol I was about to mention that. She gets in the way alot. Needlessly interrupting and not really adding anything worthwhile..
 
When wrestling was at it's peak in Japan from the mid-1970s to 1990s, the 'Gaijins' aka the foreign heels, were massive draws. Guys like Stan Hansen, Brusier Brody, Vader, 'Dr. Death' Steve Williams, Terry Gordy, embodied what it meant to be a Gaijin: big, unrelenting and intimidating with larger than life personas. Because promos have never really mattered much in Japan anyway, these guys were able to get over because of their sheer physical presence, punishing in-ring style, and unforgettable matches.

Guys like Misawa, Kenta Kobashi, Kawada, Jumbo Tsuruta and even Inoki may never gave reached the legendary status they enjoy today if they did not have these towering foreign heels beating the ever-living crap out of them.

When you look at someone like Gunther, you can't help but see that. And hearing to him talk it seems it is very deliberate. And while alot of modern fans may not have seen much All Japan or New Japan from that era, it's nice to see Gunther serving as a conduit and bringing it back to a time when physical dominance and a relentless in-ring style were all you needed to be a massive star. Thankfully, he is great on the mic too, so it all works out. But as I've said many times before, this guy could have made it in any territory, in any era of wrestling.
 
Enjoyed this interview. Interesting to hear how different it is coming up in Europe where chops, forearms, upper cuts are focused on more than your average, garden-variety punch. One thing that I had heard before but doesn't surprise me is Gunther's influences. Guys like; Stan Hansen, Bruiser Brody, (though he doesn't mention him here) Vader


Damn need to put this on my list keep forgetting, it looks pretty good based on the few clips I’ve seen
 
No offense to Michelle, but she gotta go imo…

I never understood why they need a third person in all these podcasts with legends… same thing with that Mike Tyson podcast and same thing with Rampage Jackson’s podcast (MMA legend)

I think she is keeping a close eye on him due to his past promiscuity before marriage or maybe Taker has stopped going to Church recently :yk Michelle got him into that, Taker said he thought he would get struck by lightening based on his past gimmicks lol Bah gawd he should have gone to Church as the Ministry Taker
 
When wrestling was at it's peak in Japan from the mid-1970s to 1990s, the 'Gaijins' aka the foreign heels, were massive draws. Guys like Stan Hansen, Brusier Brody, Vader, 'Dr. Death' Steve Williams, Terry Gordy, embodied what it meant to be a Gaijin: big, unrelenting and intimidating with larger than life personas. Because promos have never really mattered much in Japan anyway, these guys were able to get over because of their sheer physical presence, punishing in-ring style, and unforgettable matches.

Guys like Misawa, Kenta Kobashi, Kawada, Jumbo Tsuruta and even Inoki may never gave reached the legendary status they enjoy today if they did not have these towering foreign heels beating the ever-living crap out of them.

When you look at someone like Gunther, you can't help but see that. And hearing to him talk it seems it is very deliberate. And while alot of modern fans may not have seen much All Japan or New Japan from that era, it's nice to see Gunther serving as a conduit and bringing it back to a time when physical dominance and a relentless in-ring style were all you needed to be a massive star. Thankfully, he is great on the mic too, so it all works out. But as I've said many times before, this guy could have made it in any territory, in any era of wrestling.

Great point, I would put Hogan in that list to, in 1983 or 1984, he was getting paid $10k a week in Japan! $10k in those days was nuts, but this was after Rocky 3, even then, his value was clearly realised when elevating the status of Japanese stars at the top of the card, Inoki was huge, but his legend propelled even further after working with Hogan. I think Hogan worked with Stan Hansen in Japan as well or were they just partners ?

That’s great insight from you & I never looked at it like that but now I see the Japanese influence in Gunther’s work, if anything, both JBL & Gunther are great examples of incorporating the Japanese style into their base and making it work in North America at the top of the card. Up & coming talent need to insist on touring the world to become better performers, you pick up so much from just riding with the top guys let alone working with them, Hogan wasn’t some fluke, he use to sit & eat with the likes of Jerry Lawler and every other top guy in the territories he was booked in and picked things up rapidly, it’s a respect thing to, if you admire those before you, and sit beneath their learning tree, you will go far. Lesnar use to ride with Taker & Kane, when you see his work, he’s a throwback who has immense love and respect for the business, too much for him to ever admit due to his introversion but another great example of learning from his peers.

No one is bigger then the business but you wont draw a dime unless you respect your peers and are humbled enough to seek their guidance, definitely be confident, professional confidence is respected. But just thinking of Punk’s run in AEW boils my blood.
 
I think she is keeping a close eye on him due to his past promiscuity before marriage or maybe Taker has stopped going to Church recently :yk Michelle got him into that, Taker said he thought he would get struck by lightening based on his past gimmicks lol Bah gawd he should have gone to Church as the Ministry Taker
There's a hilarious bit at the 44 minute mark where Taker is trying to explain how whenever an attractive woman wants to take a picture with him, he tries to get some friend of his in the picture too. The insinuation is that he is scared of wrongly getting MeToo'ed, but if you read between the lines you can tell ol' Michelle has the Deadman on a tight leash :srt
 
Btw about your comment earlier @shaz619

Brock was never a face. He has never been a face in his life. During the roman reigns feud he was a heel taking on another heel.

During the Cody feud he was still a heel. The handshake and hug was an unscripted event which is ehy people thought he became babyfaced.

Brock wasnt suppose to do that, he did it because Cody Rhodes did alot to prove himself going from a joke of a wrestler to a main eventer and challenging the rubbish and biased wwe hierarchy.

But storyline wise it was unscripted. Their wouldnt be a heel cena vs face lesnar. It wouldnt happen. It was possible for a heel cena vs Heel lesnar but not face Lesnar.

Lesnar is incapable of ever being a face.
 
Great point, I would put Hogan in that list to, in 1983 or 1984, he was getting paid $10k a week in Japan! $10k in those days was nuts, but this was after Rocky 3, even then, his value was clearly realised when elevating the status of Japanese stars at the top of the card, Inoki was huge, but his legend propelled even further after working with Hogan. I think Hogan worked with Stan Hansen in Japan as well or were they just partners ?

That’s great insight from you & I never looked at it like that but now I see the Japanese influence in Gunther’s work, if anything, both JBL & Gunther are great examples of incorporating the Japanese style into their base and making it work in North America at the top of the card. Up & coming talent need to insist on touring the world to become better performers, you pick up so much from just riding with the top guys let alone working with them, Hogan wasn’t some fluke, he use to sit & eat with the likes of Jerry Lawler and every other top guy in the territories he was booked in and picked things up rapidly, it’s a respect thing to, if you admire those before you, and sit beneath their learning tree, you will go far. Lesnar use to ride with Taker & Kane, when you see his work, he’s a throwback who has immense love and respect for the business, too much for him to ever admit due to his introversion but another great example of learning from his peers.

No one is bigger then the business but you wont draw a dime unless you respect your peers and are humbled enough to seek their guidance, definitely be confident, professional confidence is respected. But just thinking of Punk’s run in AEW boils my blood.
Oh yeah, Hogan had a solid 5 year long main run from 80' to '85 in NJPW before his WWE commitments started getting in the way. After that he toured every now and then. The reason I didn't mention him is because whenever I watch wrestling from that NJPW just doesn't resonate as strongly for me as AJPW when it comes to the heavyweights. For junior heavyweight wrestling I found NJPW to be miles better. But coming back to your point, you can definitely count Hogan in that category too. I'm not sure if they were partners or not, but they did work a match together, and it's funny you mention it because I just saw it a few days ago when we we discussing Hogan's run in Japan. The match actually happened much later than you would think, in 1990 on one of those inter-promotional supercards. This is back then WWF and AJPW were working together very briefly from 1990 to 1991, before the relationship quickly turned sour. The match itself is not one of Hansen's classics from Japan, but it's very entertaining. Starts off with a bit of technical wrestling before it just devolves into a hard-hitting, stiff brawl. It was quite amusing to see Hansen beat the pi$$ out of Hogan, though Hogan certainly pays him back in kind. Both guys are a bloody mess by the end. Deffo would recommend to anyone who is interested in seeing how different Hogan in Japan was to Hogan in the states.

JBL is a great shout. I haven't heard him talk about this, but it seems fairly obvious that Stan Hansen was a massive influence on him. Everything from the look, to the move-set, to the black tights seems heavily inspired by Hansen. The problem with most modern wrestlers today is that they try to ape Japanese wrestling by copying $hit rather than trying to understand what made it so good in the first place. Gunther and JBL are perfect examples of guys who incorporated stuff without outright copying. Benoit and Jericho are two other good examples. Their work seems very clearly inspired by guys like Dynamite Kid and Tiger Mask. The parallels between Benoit and Dynamite are actually impossible to ignore.

But it all adds up. If you don't care the history of the business and the guys who paved the way before you....if you insist on "doing things your way", because you think you know everything (which is the mentality alot of guys in AEW and the indies have these days) then you're just an idiot who doesn't respect the professional wrestling business enough to be in it. This is why guys like Punk and Gunther stand-out in a sea of unmemorable, interchangeable gymnasts who care more about doing the moves than telling a story. And that's one of the reasons why wrestling is where it is today.
 
Btw about your comment earlier @shaz619

Brock was never a face. He has never been a face in his life. During the roman reigns feud he was a heel taking on another heel.

During the Cody feud he was still a heel. The handshake and hug was an unscripted event which is ehy people thought he became babyfaced.

Brock wasnt suppose to do that, he did it because Cody Rhodes did alot to prove himself going from a joke of a wrestler to a main eventer and challenging the rubbish and biased wwe hierarchy.

But storyline wise it was unscripted. Their wouldnt be a heel cena vs face lesnar. It wouldnt happen. It was possible for a heel cena vs Heel lesnar but not face Lesnar.

Lesnar is incapable of ever being a face.
Brock was a babyface from 2002-03, when Paul Heyman turned on him and aligned with the Big Show. He was a babyface at WrestleMania 19 and he turned back heel by mid-2003 when he and Kurt Angle reignited their feud at SummerSlam.

He was very clearly a babyface in his most recent run too when he returned and feuded with Roman. And then later worked with heels like Lashley and Omos. He turned back heel on the night after WrestleMania when he attacked Cody and started that feud.
 
Btw about your comment earlier @shaz619

Brock was never a face. He has never been a face in his life. During the roman reigns feud he was a heel taking on another heel.

During the Cody feud he was still a heel. The handshake and hug was an unscripted event which is ehy people thought he became babyfaced.

Brock wasnt suppose to do that, he did it because Cody Rhodes did alot to prove himself going from a joke of a wrestler to a main eventer and challenging the rubbish and biased wwe hierarchy.

But storyline wise it was unscripted. Their wouldnt be a heel cena vs face lesnar. It wouldnt happen. It was possible for a heel cena vs Heel lesnar but not face Lesnar.

Lesnar is incapable of ever being a face.

If you followed his entire run, he did bring back a hybrid of the early 2000’s comedic face character, he is actually unintentionally hilarious, with him playing a heel for so long & really well at that, when he shows any kind of emotion it means that much more. He was starting to really enjoy himself before he left.

My point was that if Brock did come back as a face, it would have been risky only due to the silly allegations levelled against him. As I said, with H’s predictable booking, Cena was always going to turn face by SummerSlam, however, it didn’t have to happen (not that I am terribly upset about it) because a heel Cena vs a heel Lesnar is a lot more interesting with their current standing. Face Lesnar actually feuded against heel Cena when he finally broke out as a heel rapper in 2002 or 2003, I think the blow off was a PPV match at No Way Out, I seem to vividly recall that feud. Lesnar is one of the most under-appreciated wrestling talents in history, he can do it all really.
 
@shaz619 Not the best quality but here's the match incase you wanna see

Hogan v Hansen


Wow I love these hidden gems, I could never have guessed they wrestled in 1990! Surely there has to be a hidden tape from the 80’s? That might just be the tag team stuff, I recently watched Punk in a dark tryout against the Road Warriors, he’s in his classic indie gear, so weird but you can tell even then he was probably marking the hell out, it’s on the Vault channel and Punk gives the background story, he sold their stuff so well lol Do check it out because the background story is hilarious!
 
If you followed his entire run, he did bring back a hybrid of the early 2000’s comedic face character, he is actually unintentionally hilarious, with him playing a heel for so long & really well at that, when he shows any kind of emotion it means that much more. He was starting to really enjoy himself before he left.

My point was that if Brock did come back as a face, it would have been risky only due to the silly allegations levelled against him. As I said, with H’s predictable booking, Cena was always going to turn face by SummerSlam, however, it didn’t have to happen (not that I am terribly upset about it) because a heel Cena vs a heel Lesnar is a lot more interesting with their current standing. Face Lesnar actually feuded against heel Cena when he finally broke out as a heel rapper in 2002 or 2003, I think the blow off was a PPV match at No Way Out, I seem to vividly recall that feud. Lesnar is one of the most under-appreciated wrestling talents in history, he can do it all really.
heel Cena vs heel Brock would’ve been fire.

Cena having a chip on his shoulder that if Brock didn’t leave WWE in 2004 for UFC that he would’ve been the face of WWE And that Cena got lucky that he left which created a vacuum that Vince chose to fill with Cena as the “second best” option. - that could’ve been the kayfabe story right there and Cena wanting to prove to himself that he’s better than Brock and nothing would’ve changed if Brock stayed.

H has 2 brain cells though. One thinking about himself and the other one thinking about his crush Seth
 
heel Cena vs heel Brock would’ve been fire.

Cena having a chip on his shoulder that if Brock didn’t leave WWE in 2004 for UFC that he would’ve been the face of WWE And that Cena got lucky that he left which created a vacuum that Vince chose to fill with Cena as the “second best” option. - that could’ve been the kayfabe story right there.

H has 2 brain cells though. One thinking about himself and the other one thinking about his crush Seth

Now I feel worse because you’ve made me see how compelling the feud could be, I was looking at it more from how interesting the ring action could be with a desperate Cena using every dirty trick in the book to try and overcome Brock’s intensity. H doesn’t both with such genuine box office stars, all he wants to do shove his big nose in their face and act like he is either on their level or more amusingly, superior to them.

We have a UK tour here and they are using Roman & Punk to sell the tickets, if Seth is the draw & champion they seem to try and convince us he is on TV, why not give him actual championship responsibilities? H probably sees a lot of the entitled piece of sh!t he was, in Seth.
 
heel Cena vs heel Brock would’ve been fire.

Cena having a chip on his shoulder that if Brock didn’t leave WWE in 2004 for UFC that he would’ve been the face of WWE And that Cena got lucky that he left which created a vacuum that Vince chose to fill with Cena as the “second best” option. - that could’ve been the kayfabe story right there and Cena wanting to prove to himself that he’s better than Brock and nothing would’ve changed if Brock stayed.

H has 2 brain cells though. One thinking about himself and the other one thinking about his crush Seth
Nah Brock needed to be a face in that feud. Who even wants to boo Brock apart from woke fans? Even during his 2017-20 heel run as champ, he was being cheered when he would be taking guys out.
Brock and Randy have been two of the most consistent and best played characters on air.
 
Fantasy booking WrestleMania 42:

  • Cody Rhodes (c) v Randy Orton - WWE Championship
  • Sami Zayn v Drew McIntyre (c) - World Heavyweight Championship
  • CM Punk v Kevin Owens
  • Brock Lesnar v Gunther
  • Rhea Ripley v Charlotte Flair v Becky Lynch - Women's Championshi
  • Roman Reigns v Jacob Fatu
  • L.A Knight v Ricky Saints
  • A.J Styles (c) v Chad Gable - IC Championship
  • Bron Breakker v Seth Rollins
  • Rey Mysterio & Dragon Lee (c) v Rey Fenix & Penta - World Tag Team Championship
  • US CHampionship Ladder match
  • Stephanie Vaquer v IYO Sky

Guys I don't know what to do with:

Jey Uso
Ilja Draganov
Finn Balor
Sheamus
Dominick Mysterio
Ludwig Kaiser
Too many singles matches for my liking.
My card would be something like
Cody vs Drew - WWE championship
Sami vs Gunther vs Randy - WHC
AJ vs Balor - US Title
Roman vs Seth
Punk vs KO
Rhea vs Bianca
4 way tag team match
Priest vs Sheamus vs Dom vs Rey vs Rusev vs Gable - Ladder Match IC
Bron (+ Bronson?) vs Brock - 2 vs 1
Charlotte vs Alexa vs Vaquer vs Iyo
Usos vs Fraxiom - Tag team championship

But knowing Trips we'll probably have Logan Paul as WHC champion and AJ will probably be wrestling Jellyroll.
 
Btw about your comment earlier @shaz619

Brock was never a face. He has never been a face in his life. During the roman reigns feud he was a heel taking on another heel.

During the Cody feud he was still a heel. The handshake and hug was an unscripted event which is ehy people thought he became babyfaced.

Brock wasnt suppose to do that, he did it because Cody Rhodes did alot to prove himself going from a joke of a wrestler to a main eventer and challenging the rubbish and biased wwe hierarchy.

But storyline wise it was unscripted. Their wouldnt be a heel cena vs face lesnar. It wouldnt happen. It was possible for a heel cena vs Heel lesnar but not face Lesnar.

Lesnar is incapable of ever being a face.

 
So the whole last real champion shtick thrown out the window?

Whatever happened to walking away with the title?

That was supposed to be the major story line

Instead 4/10 kutta retconned to switch flipping in Cena’s head for no reason before summer slam and he becomes the good guy to face Brock…

Except there is no Brock. There is Logan the clown Paul facing Cena in Paris

12 appearance left (now 11) and one of them will be wasted on a YouTube celeb for kids.

Instead of AJ or Brock in Paris

Incredible. This nosedive by triple h to torpedo WWE ratings into the gutter are unprecedented. Speed run to obscurity.

I miss Heel Cena already… 😞
 
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