This is New Zealand's greatest pace attack of all-time

[Ab Fan]

Credit where due but what a terrific display of short bowling we just saw from NZ today. Led by Neil Wagner and supported by Boult, Jamieson and Southee, this is pace bowling at its best. It looked like we are back into 80s cricket where the game was all about being stubborn, grinding out and absorbing all the way you can.

They made Rahane look like a sheep and was all under sea. Hats off to Cheteswar Pujara though for being so stubborn and aggressive (in the sense of not giving anything to opposition).

Wagner, Boult, Southee and Jamieson looks the most formidable attack of this era.

Discuss!

 

[Aman]

Jamieson

If Lockie gets it together damn.. we could have a bowling attack for Aus.

 

[Dingolfy]

Didn't they get blasted in Australia few months back? Southee was horrible in that series. Boult also didnt do much then.Newzeland bowlers always did well at home. They had the likes of Sachin, Dravid out for 99. So this is nothing new.

 

[Aman]

Didn't they get blasted in Australia few months back? Southee was horrible in that series. Boult also didnt do much then.Newzeland bowlers always did well at home. They had the likes of Sachin, Dravid out for 99. So this is nothing new.

Boult didn't play in that series, IIRC he got injured early.

 

[Energy]

Boult and Southee are already well-established among top bowling pairs of 'all-time'. That is credit to New Zealand management for ensuring the longevity of world class bowlers and batters in their ranks.

 

[Saurav]

Jamieson

If Lockie gets it together damn.. we could have a bowling attack for Aus.

Why wasn't Jamieson picked for Aus tour months ago.His height would have been useful

 

[MMHS]

NO.

In 1980s, they had an one man army - good enough to win the war alone.

 

[Aman]

Why wasn't Jamieson picked for Aus tour months ago.His height would have been useful

He was in the squad but not used.

 

[Ab Fan]

Boult and Southee are already well-established among top bowling pairs of 'all-time'. That is credit to New Zealand management for ensuring the longevity of world class bowlers and batters in their ranks.

Wagner as a test bowler looks on his way to reach unreal heights. I would argue Wagner and Boult have established now as second and third best fast bowler to have come from NZ respectively considering Bond was an underachiever due to injuries.

 

[Dingolfy]

Boult didn't play in that series, IIRC he got injured early.

He played the second test. Took only one wicket in the first innings for 90 runs and none in second.

 

[Aman]

He played the second test. Took only one wicket in the first innings for 90 runs and none in second.

Yes, he fractured his hand in that match.

 

[Dingolfy]

Wagner as a test bowler looks on his way to reach unreal heights. I would argue Wagner and Boult have established now as second and third best fast bowler to have come from NZ respectively considering Bond was an underachiever due to injuries.

He will be 34 in few days and probably have one more year left. Will be a Kiwi legend for sure. Has poor record in England, India and West Indies and don’t think he will get time to rectify that.

 

[Heisenberg111]

NO.

In 1980s, they had an one man army - good enough to win the war alone.

I know in the 80's NZ had a great side,but what were the support bowlers for Hadlee? Its about the overall pace attack here not one ATG bowler.

 

[Junaids]

Wagner as a test bowler looks on his way to reach unreal heights. I would argue Wagner and Boult have established now as second and third best fast bowler to have come from NZ respectively considering Bond was an underachiever due to injuries.

Wagner is about to turn 34 and as much as I like him, he’s into the final 14 months of his Test career. He will retire after the 2021 World Test Championship Final - Jamieson is actually his successor.

I still think the best Kiwi attack was one which barely got on the park together in 1995:

Chris Cairns
Danny Morrison
Dion Nash
Simon Doull

Probably only Trent Boult of the current team would get into that quartet.

 

[Heisenberg111]

Wagner is about to turn 34 and as much as I like him, he’s into the final 14 months of his Test career. He will retire after the 2021 World Test Championship Final - Jamieson is actually his successor.

I still think the best Kiwi attack was one which barely got on the park together in 1995:

Chris Cairns
Danny Morrison
Dion Nash
Simon Doull

Probably only Trent Boult of the current team would get into that quartet.

Nonsense, Boult, Southee and Wagner>>> Morrison, Nash and Doull

 

[Junaids]

I know in the 80's NZ had a great side,but what were the support bowlers for Hadlee? Its about the overall pace attack here not one ATG bowler.

Lance Cairns and Ewan Chatfield, who retired as the second and third most successful Kiwi Test wicket takers behind Hadlee, both averaging 32.

 

[Heisenberg111]

Lance Cairns and Ewan Chatfield, who retired as the second and third most successful Kiwi Test wicket takers behind Hadlee, both averaging 32.

So Hadlee was the only great bowler in that lineup. Current NZ attack has no one of Hadlee's quality, but overall as a pace attack they are better than the Kiwi attack of the 80's.

 

[leg-side-flick]

Wagner is about to turn 34 and as much as I like him, he’s into the final 14 months of his Test career. He will retire after the 2021 World Test Championship Final - Jamieson is actually his successor.

I still think the best Kiwi attack was one which barely got on the park together in 1995:

Chris Cairns
Danny Morrison
Dion Nash
Simon Doull

Probably only Trent Boult of the current team would get into that quartet.

People don't play fast bowling as well these days and hence the current crop has a higher ceiling, plus they have a good captain as well

 

[Ab Fan]

Wagner is about to turn 34 and as much as I like him, he’s into the final 14 months of his Test career. He will retire after the 2021 World Test Championship Final - Jamieson is actually his successor.

I still think the best Kiwi attack was one which barely got on the park together in 1995:

Chris Cairns
Danny Morrison
Dion Nash
Simon Doull

Probably only Trent Boult of the current team would get into that quartet.

Lol, Morrison averages 35 with the bowl and Simon Doull averages 30 and doesn't even has 100 test wickets. Cairns better than this trio??

The best five bowlers to come from NZ ever as follows:-

Sir Richards Hadlee
Neil Wagner
Trent Boult
Shane Bond( should be no.2 but didn't played enough)
Tim Southee

This is by far the greatest NZ attack of all-time. Lol on some 35 averaging blokes who played in 80s pace bowling friendly era are being rated higher than the veterans who have got almost 300 wickets now and Wagner who has shown the world how great he is even though he only recently got passed to 200 wickets.

 

[Junaids]

Nonsense, Boult, Southee and Wagner>>> Morrison, Nash and Doull

Dion Nash was a magnificent bowler whose career - like Shane Bond - was ruined by injury. Best swing bowler I’ve ever seen. His performance at Lords in 1994 was astonishing.

Then again, the lucky, lucky guy is married to Bernice Mene, so I have absolutely no sympathy for him. It’s like the apocryphal George Best “where did it all go wrong?” line - some guys just have all the luck!

 

[Robert]

NO.

In 1980s, they had an one man army - good enough to win the war alone.

Hmm, Hadlee benefitted from having Chatfield and Morrison keeping it tight at the other end and chipping away.

I remember watching Cairns get a 7fer with banana swingers in a match where Hadlee didn’t take a wicket.

 

[Junaids]

Nonsense, Boult, Southee and Wagner>>> Morrison, Nash and Doull

In the 1994 Lords Test Dion Nash scored 56 and took 6-76 and 5-93 against Gooch, Atherton, Stewart, Smith and Hick.

The commentators endlessly compared him to one man - Kapil Dev. The swing, the batting, even the pace resembled a young Kapil Dev.

It’s a big, big call to say that Kapil Dev wouldn’t get into this NZ attack.

 

[Dingolfy]

In the 1994 Lords Test Dion Nash scored 56 and took 6-76 and 5-93 against Gooch, Atherton, Stewart, Smith and Hick.

The commentators endlessly compared him to one man - Kapil Dev. The swing, the batting, even the pace resembled a young Kapil Dev.

It’s a big, big call to say that Kapil Dev wouldn’t get into this NZ attack.

I am pretty sure commentators said so many things about various players all the time. Doesn’t matter much unless you can put some consistent performances on the ground.

 

[tyron_woodley]

absolute nonsense perpetuated by junaids to make pakistan look good. In truth, this is the best ever n.z bowling attack by far.

 

[Heisenberg111]

In the 1994 Lords Test Dion Nash scored 56 and took 6-76 and 5-93 against Gooch, Atherton, Stewart, Smith and Hick.

The commentators endlessly compared him to one man - Kapil Dev. The swing, the batting, even the pace resembled a young Kapil Dev.

It’s a big, big call to say that Kapil Dev wouldn’t get into this NZ attack.

lol, are you seriously trying to compare Kapil with Nash?

 

[Ab Fan]

He will be 34 in few days and probably have one more year left. Will be a Kiwi legend for sure. Has poor record in England, India and West Indies and don’t think he will get time to rectify that.

When they will be past it then we will talk. Right now, all three are at their peak and Jamieson looks an exciting addition to the squad as well. Boult and Southee are set to take over 350 test wickets while Wagner is at his peak and he too will have 250 wickets to their name. This is best ever NZ attack of all-time, also better than anything England have put up in past 30 years.

 

[leatherface58]

Jamieson

If Lockie gets it together damn.. we could have a bowling attack for Aus.

The bowling did okay in Australia at least in the beginning. Our batting was complete trash for the whole series. The bowling inevitably crumbled under the pressure of carrying the batsmen.

 

[Aman]

The bowling did okay in Australia at least in the beginning. Our batting was complete trash for the whole series. The bowling inevitably crumbled under the pressure of carrying the batsmen.

Batting definitely crumbled but the next time we go we'll likely have Conway and Young while Kane and Taylor will definitely do better.

Early days for Jamieson but he looks exciting, if we can get Lockie sorted we'll definitely do much better.

 

[Junaids]

When they will be past it then we will talk. Right now, all three are at their peak and Jamieson looks an exciting addition to the squad as well. Boult and Southee are set to take over 350 test wickets while Wagner is at his peak and he too will have 250 wickets to their name. This is best ever NZ attack of all-time, also better than anything England have put up in past 30 years.

Southee remains only marginally down from his peak: his height allows him to stay economical even when he isn’t taking wickets.

Boult was previously by far the best of the three, but he is in significant decline: his pace is down to around 132K and he is too short to keep the scoring rate in check.

Wagner is just Wagner: making a living out of exposing batsmen who can’t handle short bowling. But his lack of height means that if/when his pace falls below 130K due to age - probably in the next 12 months - his career will end within a few months.

 

[leg-side-flick]

In the 1994 Lords Test Dion Nash scored 56 and took 6-76 and 5-93 against Gooch, Atherton, Stewart, Smith and Hick.

The commentators endlessly compared him to one man - Kapil Dev. The swing, the batting, even the pace resembled a young Kapil Dev.

It’s a big, big call to say that Kapil Dev wouldn’t get into this NZ attack.

Commies also said

Irfan Pathan is next Wasim Akram

Amir is better than Akram

 

[Aman]

Southee remains only marginally down from his peak: his height allows him to stay economical even when he isn’t taking wickets.

Boult was previously by far the best of the three, but he is in significant decline: his pace is down to around 132K and he is too short to keep the scoring rate in check.

Wagner is just Wagner: making a living out of exposing batsmen who can’t handle short bowling. But his lack of height means that if/when his pace falls below 130K due to age - probably in the next 12 months - his career will end within a few months.

Thoughts on Jamieson? Do you rate him?

Apparently was getting it up to 140 in some spells.

 

[Junaids]

Thoughts on Jamieson? Do you rate him?

Apparently was getting it up to 140 in some spells.

Very very good - tall and he can bat.

I still think NZ should switch to the Dukes ball though.

 

[Ab Fan]

Southee remains only marginally down from his peak: his height allows him to stay economical even when he isn’t taking wickets.

Boult was previously by far the best of the three, but he is in significant decline: his pace is down to around 132K and he is too short to keep the scoring rate in check.

Wagner is just Wagner: making a living out of exposing batsmen who can’t handle short bowling. But his lack of height means that if/when his pace falls below 130K due to age - probably in the next 12 months - his career will end within a few months.

Actually, Boult was mentally down and disturbed after the World Cup fiasco which was affecting his performance. He is good now, back in rythm playing home games on friendly conditions to him and will continue to do well. But even till now, he has 275 test wickets to his name for a country that doesn't play as many games, it's quite excellent, as good as what Mohammad Amir was expected to be.

Wagner is a really phenomenal bowler you know it more than anyone else here. The way he made the mockery of modern day Bradman in his own dent, I will rate him at same level as Windies legend Andy Roberts. He owned Smith in Australia, the batsmen who is better than anyone not named Don Bradman and is not an Indian or West Indian.

Southee is probably third on list compared to the above two but considering the lack of highly successful pace bowling history of NZ barring one, he still makes it to top 5 NZ fast bowlers of all-time.

 

[Kingpin786]

Not at all

 

[tyron_woodley]

rofl Danny Morrison- fodder
dion Nash - fodder
simon doull - fodder

all cannon fodders compared to current GOAT attack. Stop living in nostalgia. This is best n.z attack of all time. Easily.

Chris cairns was a great all rounder. so is Cdg. They have jamieson who is even better now.

 

[Junaids]

rofl Danny Morrison- fodder
dion Nash - fodder
simon doull - fodder

all cannon fodders compared to current GOAT attack. Stop living in nostalgia. This is best n.z attack of all time. Easily.

Chris cairns was a great all rounder. so is Cdg. They have jamieson who is even better now.

Interesting point.

Everyone is comparing Jamieson to Ambrose or McGrath.

But to me he is actually more similar to Tony Greig. Very, very similar to Tony Greig. And of the geriatric members of the current team, I reckon he is as likely to replace De Grandhomme as Wagner.

 

[Kashmirilion]

Good on swinging and seaming wickets. But if they was too get flat tracks on pitches with not too much bounce these lot in for a right hammering. Too many 130kph dobblers. Hence Aussies smashed them. Need lockie to sort himself out and maybe one more pacer around 140-145. Degrandhomme and southee are useless on flat decks.

 

[Hasan123]

It is 1 of New Zealand best attacks. Overall this is 1 of NZ strongest teams.

 

[tyron_woodley]

Good on swinging and seaming wickets. But if they was too get flat tracks on pitches with not too much bounce these lot in for a right hammering. Too many 130kph dobblers. Hence Aussies smashed them. Need lockie to sort himself out and maybe one more pacer around 140-145. Degrandhomme and southee are useless on flat decks.

this is true. On any non swing friendly wickets this attack of n.z becomes useless.

 

[Slog]

Wagner is workhorse
Southee is inconsistent and not elite anyway in my opinion
Jamieson too early to judge
Boult is only one genuinely world class

 

[Ab Fan]

Wagner is workhorse
Southee is inconsistent and not elite anyway in my opinion
Jamieson too early to judge
Boult is only one genuinely world class

Wagner is workhorse but done enough to be considered a better bowler than three names- Hadlee, Bond and Boult( debatable). New Zealand simply didn't had any great bowler with 200+ test wickets in past under 30 average.

In NZ's all time history, the only elite fast bowlers produced are Richard Hadlee, Trent Boult, Neil Wagner, Shane Bond and two are from this era.

 

[BD-fan]

Yes. The trio of Boult, Southee, and Wagner are the best fast bowling attack NZ have ever produced. They have been winning more lately.

 

[Ab Fan]

This NZ quartet pace attack is better than anyone that NZ ever field.

Boult
Wagner
Southee
Jamieson

 

[Junaids]

Wagner is about to turn 34 and as much as I like him, he’s into the final 14 months of his Test career. He will retire after the 2021 World Test Championship Final - Jamieson is actually his successor.

I still think the best Kiwi attack was one which barely got on the park together in 1995:

Chris Cairns
Danny Morrison
Dion Nash
Simon Doull

Probably only Trent Boult of the current team would get into that quartet.

The current team was slaughtered by a good but not special Australia last year.

My All-Time Kiwi pace pantheon

1. Sir Richard Hadlee
2. Shane Bond
3. Dion Nash
4. Chris Cairns
5. Trent Boult

 

[tyron_woodley]

This NZ quartet pace attack is better than anyone that NZ ever field.

Boult
Wagner
Southee
Jamieson

This is true.
Althought Southee is old. Not sure how old Boult is but he is also not young.

I agree though. Their best ever attack for sure.

Whatever junaids says, just ignore it. He is very biased towards past era.

It's always the opposite of what junaids says.
This current attack would literally rip through any of past n.z's so called great attacks.

 

[Smudger]

This NZ quartet pace attack is better than anyone that NZ ever field.

Boult
Wagner
Southee
Jamieson

The other are very good but I a am not sure about Jamieson for now. Has'nt played enough cricket

 

[shah_1]

The current team was slaughtered by a good but not special Australia last year.

My All-Time Kiwi pace pantheon

1. Sir Richard Hadlee
2. Shane Bond
3. Dion Nash
4. Chris Cairns
5. Trent Boult

That team had no Jamieson

 

[Ab Fan]

The current team was slaughtered by a good but not special Australia last year.

My All-Time Kiwi pace pantheon

1. Sir Richard Hadlee
2. Shane Bond
3. Dion Nash
4. Chris Cairns
5. Trent Boult

Neil Wagner must be there. He made a GOAT test batsman like Smith dance to his tune.

 

[Ab Fan]

The other are very good but I a am not sure about Jamieson for now. Has'nt played enough cricket

He has had a dream start. Bowls with good pace, tall enough. Very solid prospect.

 

[Ab Fan]

This is true.
Althought Southee is old. Not sure how old Boult is but he is also not young.

I agree though. Their best ever attack for sure.

Whatever junaids says, just ignore it. He is very biased towards past era.

It's always the opposite of what junaids says.
This current attack would literally rip through any of past n.z's so called great attacks.

My all time top 5 pace bowlers of NZ:-

1. Richard Hadlee
2. Shane Bond
3. Trent Boult
4. Neil Wagner
5. Tim Southee

 

[sindhiboy]

It's Jamieson who has made the difference, he is currently unplayable.
If only lockie is fit enough for tests, it will make this bowling attack frightening and lethal.

 

[TeamPak95]

Boult-Wagner-Southee-Jamieson the four horsemen of the Kiwi Apocalypse. I am not looking forward to this upcoming test series

 

[wrongun]

It probably is their strongest overall attack. Considering they even have depth with Ferguson & Milne both seriously quick bowlers to play when occasion suits.

It lacks a truly great bowler though. Boult doesn't quite cut it for great- he has a poor record in Oz, in India & in SA. You don't have to succeed absolutely everywhere but you need to do it vs SOME of the best on their own patch at least.

Boult- excellent
Southee- above average
Wagner- very good
Jamieson- promising at this stage, I expect him to be very good at least, above average at worst

If they had a spinner they'd be am excellent all round attack.

 

[Babbar]

So this in NZ’s greatest pace attack of all time and Australia has their lousiest pace attack of all time.

Is this a reflection of who these two teams are playing against?

 

[tyron_woodley]

So this in NZ’s greatest pace attack of all time and Australia has their lousiest pace attack of all time.

Is this a reflection of who these two teams are playing against?

Australia's attack is their best ever btw.

 

[Aman]

It probably is their strongest overall attack. Considering they even have depth with Ferguson & Milne both seriously quick bowlers to play when occasion suits.

It lacks a truly great bowler though. Boult doesn't quite cut it for great- he has a poor record in Oz, in India & in SA. You don't have to succeed absolutely everywhere but you need to do it vs SOME of the best on their own patch at least.

Boult- excellent
Southee- above average
Wagner- very good
Jamieson- promising at this stage, I expect him to be very good at least, above average at worst

If they had a spinner they'd be am excellent all round attack.

Yeah, Boult really needs to do it abroad. I've been disappointed with what he's down overseas and with the older ball.

 

[Ab Fan]

So this in NZ’s greatest pace attack of all time and Australia has their lousiest pace attack of all time.

Is this a reflection of who these two teams are playing against?

Name a few Australian pace attack which is better than this?

 

[Ab Fan]

Yeah, Boult really needs to do it abroad. I've been disappointed with what he's down overseas and with the older ball.

Southee seems to have hit a late bloomer. He has been brilliant in last few years. Boult has been a disappointment post 2019 WC.

 

[Aman]

Southee seems to have hit a late bloomer. He has been brilliant in last few years. Boult has been a disappointment post 2019 WC.

The funny thing is Southee has some performances abroad, he just isn't consistent.

 

[wrongun]

Name a few Australian pace attack which is better than this?

I kind of agree that this is one of the stronger Australian attacks. I guess it doesn't have a McGrath or a Warne in it. But that period aside, this attack is the strongest since Lillee/Thompson. Better than any from '85 when Thommo went kaput until about '93 when Warne really came good.

Even compared to McGrath & Warne days... OK Lyon is no Warne but he IS a really good spinner. Possibly the 2nd best since Benaud (McGill is the other contender).

Cummins will probably go down as an ATG by the time he's done, so we are possibly watching a great in action. He seems to have that x factor for mine, always has.

Hazlewood & Starc are as good a support act as McDermott or Gillespie or Lee. All very good bowlers in their own ways.

I'm not trying to say this attack is as good as Warne/McGrath (an atg attack) but it is still an excellent attack in my view.

 

[Xoib]

Current aus attack is good but it's fair way below an attack of Mcgrath/Warne Gillispie and Lee.

 

[wrongun]

The funny thing is Southee has some performances abroad, he just isn't consistent.

He seems to have improved in his overseas performances in the last few years of his career now.

 

[Aman]

He seems to have improved in his overseas performances in the last few years of his career now.

Yup.

Thoughts on Lockie? I reckon he's starting to become the main man of our attack in LOIs.

Its just the WI but man he looked like he had gone up a level or two this year.

 

[Ab Fan]

I kind of agree that this is one of the stronger Australian attacks. I guess it doesn't have a McGrath or a Warne in it. But that period aside, this attack is the strongest since Lillee/Thompson. Better than any from '85 when Thommo went kaput until about '93 when Warne really came good.

Even compared to McGrath & Warne days... OK Lyon is no Warne but he IS a really good spinner. Possibly the 2nd best since Benaud (McGill is the other contender).

Cummins will probably go down as an ATG by the time he's done, so we are possibly watching a great in action. He seems to have that x factor for mine, always has.

Hazlewood & Starc are as good a support act as McDermott or Gillespie or Lee. All very good bowlers in their own ways.

I'm not trying to say this attack is as good as Warne/McGrath (an atg attack) but it is still an excellent attack in my view.

As pace attack, they are as good as it gets.

Lillee = Cummins
Thompson = Starc
Len Pasco < Hazelwood

Australian pace attack of 70s maybe more feared attack but the current one is arguably better.

McGrath- Gillispie- Lee is not as great a pace attack as other two but with the addition of Warne, it becomes the best Australian attack ever.

 

[Ab Fan]

I kind of agree that this is one of the stronger Australian attacks. I guess it doesn't have a McGrath or a Warne in it. But that period aside, this attack is the strongest since Lillee/Thompson. Better than any from '85 when Thommo went kaput until about '93 when Warne really came good.

Even compared to McGrath & Warne days... OK Lyon is no Warne but he IS a really good spinner. Possibly the 2nd best since Benaud (McGill is the other contender).

Cummins will probably go down as an ATG by the time he's done, so we are possibly watching a great in action. He seems to have that x factor for mine, always has.

Hazlewood & Starc are as good a support act as McDermott or Gillespie or Lee. All very good bowlers in their own ways.

I'm not trying to say this attack is as good as Warne/McGrath (an atg attack) but it is still an excellent attack in my view.

Both Hazelwood and Starc are better test bowlers than Lee.

 

[wrongun]

Yup.

Thoughts on Lockie? I reckon he's starting to become the main man of our attack in LOIs.

Its just the WI but man he looked like he had gone up a level or two this year.

I didn't watch the ODI's so not sure. I've seen him bowl fast but I can't really add much beyond what I read in papers or from fans.

 

[Thunderbolt14]

This NZ quartet pace attack is better than anyone that NZ ever field.

Boult
Wagner
Southee
Jamieson

Hadlee??

 

[Ab Fan]

Hadlee??

Hadlee was a one-man army but a one-man army will always be inferior to an attack comprising four quality fast bowlers.

Boult- Excellent
Wagner- Very good
Southee- Very good
Jamieson- Excellent young prospect

 

[tyron_woodley]

Current aus attack is good but it's fair way below an attack of Mcgrath/Warne Gillispie and Lee.

It's better. They play in a batsman friendly era.
Current attack is their best ever.

 

[tyron_woodley]

In swing conditions, new Zealand are a top 2 side. Outside that they are yet to prove how good they truly are.

Jamieson
Southee
Wagner
Boult

Lockie for depth. That's great. Lockie is a poor test bowler imo from what I have seen. The other 4 are quality in swing friendly Condtions. Probably top 2.

Let's see them do it in Asia vs quality sides and perhaps south Africa, Australia.

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

The current team was slaughtered by a good but not special Australia last year.

My All-Time Kiwi pace pantheon

1. Sir Richard Hadlee
2. Shane Bond
3. Dion Nash
4. Chris Cairns
5. Trent Boult

New Zealand has won only a single series in Australia and that too when their main players were missing.
So New Zealand getting slaughtered in Aus is nothing new.

 

[Babbar]

Australian pace attack is the worst ever right now. It will suddenly become the greatest in a few months when they play against other teams.

 

[tyron_woodley]

Australian pace attack is the worst ever right now. It will suddenly become the greatest in a few months when they play against other teams.

It is their best ever man.
Cummins
Starc
Hazelwood
Lyon

Doesn't get better than that for Aussies. It's their best ever attack. Better than even McGrath's bowling attack.

 

[Xoib]

It's better. They play in a batsman friendly era.
Current attack is their best ever.

LOL everyone knows 2000-2010 was the time the lurches were flattest in the world

You are just covering yourself if India loses then you will say they faced the best aus attack ever if they win they win against the best ever aus attack.

This Aus attack is good but it's 30-40 % below that Aus attack.

 

[tyron_woodley]

LOL everyone knows 2000-2010 was the time the lurches were flattest in the world

You are just covering yourself if India loses then you will say they faced the best aus attack ever if they win they win against the best ever aus attack.

This Aus attack is good but it's 30-40 % below that Aus attack.

Nope. Their ability, quality and their competition is the reason why I am saying it's their best attack. This is their best attack ever.

This one would tear ponting's attack apart. Put this attack with ponting or Waugh's batting line-up and they would have dominated even more.

I would never praise an attack if it weren't good. Btw I don't think they are even the best all round attack in the world right now either. however it is their best attack ever.

It is the best attack for Australian Condtions.

Cummins is on par with McGrath in terms of skill and ability and he is faster.

Starc better than Lee
Hazelwood better than Gillespie
Lyon on par with Warne.
They also have patto who is better than Symonds or whatever fodder they have at 7.

 

[wrongun]

LOL everyone knows 2000-2010 was the time the lurches were flattest in the world

You are just covering yourself if India loses then you will say they faced the best aus attack ever if they win they win against the best ever aus attack.

This Aus attack is good but it's 30-40 % below that Aus attack.

I have to agree with you & disagree with [MENTION=150610]tyron_woodley[/MENTION] on this one.

Warne is one of the greatest cricketers of all time, he's a couple of rungs better than Lyon, who is a very good spinner.

McGrath is a great fast bowler, in any era, by any measure. For arguments sake, lets assume Cummins comes somewhere close to great a well.

An attack with 2 all time greats in it will never be bested by one with only 1 (generous assessment of where Cummins might go). Especially when the next best bowler in each is roughly equal.

Hazlewood isn't any better than Dizzy. Both are very good bowlers but Gillespie did the business in Oz, SA during their strongest period, did ok in England overall and was superb in India across 2 tours. That's a resume Hazlewood can just about match but there's no way you could say he was better.

Starc a better red ball bowler than Lee? Probably. Both inconsistent. Both could be destructive too. But when you have McGrath, Warne & Dizzy it hardly matters. There's just not a batsman alive who'd fear Lyon more than Warne.

 

[tyron_woodley]

I have to agree with you & disagree with [MENTION=150610]tyron_woodley[/MENTION] on this one.

Warne is one of the greatest cricketers of all time, he's a couple of rungs better than Lyon, who is a very good spinner.

McGrath is a great fast bowler, in any era, by any measure. For arguments sake, lets assume Cummins comes somewhere close to great a well.

An attack with 2 all time greats in it will never be bested by one with only 1 (generous assessment of where Cummins might go). Especially when the next best bowler in each is roughly equal.

Hazlewood isn't any better than Dizzy. Both are very good bowlers but Gillespie did the business in Oz, SA during their strongest period, did ok in England overall and was superb in India across 2 tours. That's a resume Hazlewood can just about match but there's no way you could say he was better.

Starc a better red ball bowler than Lee? Probably. Both inconsistent. Both could be destructive too. But when you have McGrath, Warne & Dizzy it hardly matters. There's just not a batsman alive who'd fear Lyon more than Warne.

To me their current attack is more complete. Hazelwood is definitely better than Gillespie. Gillespie lived off McGrath.

I agree Warne was the big difference.

I honestly believe Cummins is about 80% of McGrath. He is close.

But the rest of pack is better than Aussies of 2000era in bowling depth. In terms of pace bowling ofcourse.

Warne really that much better than Lyon though? I have seen Lyon rip England out in England. Only place he struggled was in India. Warne was poor vs India in Australia and in India apart from one series.

 

[Xoib]

I have to agree with you & disagree with [MENTION=150610]tyron_woodley[/MENTION] on this one.

Warne is one of the greatest cricketers of all time, he's a couple of rungs better than Lyon, who is a very good spinner.

McGrath is a great fast bowler, in any era, by any measure. For arguments sake, lets assume Cummins comes somewhere close to great a well.

An attack with 2 all time greats in it will never be bested by one with only 1 (generous assessment of where Cummins might go). Especially when the next best bowler in each is roughly equal.

Hazlewood isn't any better than Dizzy. Both are very good bowlers but Gillespie did the business in Oz, SA during their strongest period, did ok in England overall and was superb in India across 2 tours. That's a resume Hazlewood can just about match but there's no way you could say he was better.

Starc a better red ball bowler than Lee? Probably. Both inconsistent. Both could be destructive too. But when you have McGrath, Warne & Dizzy it hardly matters. There's just not a batsman alive who'd fear Lyon more than Warne.

Yeah I am not even going to reply to him most of his post are deluded and he keeps defending his stance no matter how wrong he is.
Cummins is very good but he lacks the ruthlessnes of Mcgrath in dominating the opposition best batsmen this is where Mcgrath scores not only over Cummins but most other all time greats he is so good that he's equal to two great bowlers.
Gillispie was really good at his peak I will put him somewhere close to Cummins. Pat is better but the gap between him and Gillispie is smaller then the gap between Mcgrath and Cummins and big lol at Hazelwood being better then him only kids who started watching on 2010 can call Hazelwood better this Dizzy.
Starc is possibly better then Lee though gap is marginal and you could pick either without losing much. As much as I love Gazza he and Warney don't belong in the same sentence and you talk about Warney record In India as much as you want the gap is so big in other areas that it's even ridiculous to even start a discussion on this.
If I have to grade both attacks

Mcgrath 95
Warne. 92
Gillispie. 84
Lee. 72
Total. 343

Cummins 88
Hazelwood 80
Starc 75
Lyon. 75
Total. 318

 

[tyron_woodley]

Yeah I am not even going to reply to him most of his post are deluded and he keeps defending his stance no matter how wrong he is.
Cummins is very good but he lacks the ruthlessnes of Mcgrath in dominating the opposition best batsmen this is where Mcgrath scores not only over Cummins but most other all time greats he is so good that he's equal to two great bowlers.
Gillispie was really good at his peak I will put him somewhere close to Cummins. Pat is better but the gap between him and Gillispie is smaller then the gap between Mcgrath and Cummins and big lol at Hazelwood being better then him only kids who started watching on 2010 can call Hazelwood better this Dizzy.
Starc is possibly better then Lee though gap is marginal and you could pick either without losing much. As much as I love Gazza he and Warney don't belong in the same sentence and you talk about Warney record In India as much as you want the gap is so big in other areas that it's even ridiculous to even start a discussion on this.
If I have to grade both attacks

Mcgrath 95
Warne. 92
Gillispie. 84
Lee. 72
Total. 343

Cummins 88
Hazelwood 80
Starc 75
Lyon. 75
Total. 318

Hazelwood is better than Gillespie. Gillespie lived off McGrath. Hazelwood doesn't live off Cummins.

The gap between McGrath and Cummins is t wide. What McGrath can do in Australia can be replicated by Cummins too.

Put Cummins and co with that Australian side of 2000, what do you think would happen? Their record would be even better.

Don't respond. Idc. But I know which attack is better. Only nostalgic boys would be deluded enough to gloat about past being superior.

Overall quality of the bowling attack is superior now. Warne being the better spinner. That's about it.

 

[Ahson8]

It probably is their strongest overall attack. Considering they even have depth with Ferguson & Milne both seriously quick bowlers to play when occasion suits.

It lacks a truly great bowler though. Boult doesn't quite cut it for great- he has a poor record in Oz, in India & in SA. You don't have to succeed absolutely everywhere but you need to do it vs SOME of the best on their own patch at least.

Boult- excellent
Southee- above average
Wagner- very good
Jamieson- promising at this stage, I expect him to be very good at least, above average at worst

If they had a spinner they'd be am excellent all round attack.

Lol, Milne is terrible.