[VIDEOS] Ben Stokes - England’s best ever all-rounder? / England’s Test captain

Stokes was let down by teammates. He singlehandedly made it 2-2. Otherwise, it could've been worse for England.

Stokes has achieved objective successes. Flintoff's successes were mostly subjective (apart from 2005 Ashes, very little to show for).

Incorrect, Stokes let down his teammates in India and Australia every single time inspite of multiple tours.
 
True, I wish India had the wc success that Bangladesh did.
Gambhir must be better than lara and kallis considering that he won 2 wcs and they won 0.
In England, the ashes will always the holy grail, the most important thing that a player can win.
Stokes hasn't won a single away ashes match, hasn't won an ashes series at home

Yeah, doesn't make sense to bring this Indian narrative here. The response is to a post which says, Stokes is greater than Botham and Flintoff and England's best ever A/R. Bringing this Indian narrative is pretty absurd, what has Stokes winning title got to do here with Indians. :facepalm
 
Yeah, doesn't make sense to bring this Indian narrative here. The response is to a post which says, Stokes is greater than Botham and Flintoff and England's best ever A/R. Bringing this Indian narrative is pretty absurd, what has Stokes winning title got to do here with Indians. :facepalm
Agreed, Neither stokes, botham or flintoff are Indians.
 
Stokes has more runs than Filntoff with a better average. Both Test and ODI.

Stokes has won home ashes (2015 Ashes) just like Flintoff did (2005 Ashes). Neither won an away Ashes.

Stokes won 2019 World Cup and 2022 World T20. Flintoff won none.

It is only in bowling where Flintoff did better.

When we consider all of these things, Stokes clearly wins.
 
Stokes is now bowling less than part timer.
In test Since 2023
10 test , 38 overs , 4 wickets , Avg 36

In comparison Root
10 test , 145 overs , 13 wickets , Avg 37
 
Batting: Stokes > Flintoff
Bowling: Flintoff > Stokes
Fielding: Stokes > Flintoff
Achievement: Stokes = Flintoff
Captaincy: Stokes >>>>>>> Flintoff

Stokes wins for me.
 
Two of the best all rounders of all time, sounds good to me!

Yes but those were weaker suits of the mentioned names. In that regard, he has been just a good cricketer who played an ATG knock in ODI World Cup Final.
 
Batting: Stokes > Flintoff
Bowling: Flintoff > Stokes
Fielding: Stokes > Flintoff
Achievement: Stokes = Flintoff
Captaincy: Stokes >>>>>>> Flintoff

Stokes wins for me.

Even in achievement section, Stokes wins.

Stokes won 2015 home Ashes while Flintoff won 2005 and 2009 home Ashes.

Neither Stokes nor Flintoff won an away Ashes.

Stokes won 2 world titles and he contributed in both finals. Flintoff won none.
 
Winning a home Ashes vs ATG Australian side as a standout performer is not same as winning a home Ashes vs the Australian side of 2015 who could barely play the moving ball and that series was won thanks to the standout performance of Joe Root and the career best bowling spell of Stuart Broad.
 
Winning a home Ashes vs ATG Australian side as a standout performer is not same as winning a home Ashes vs the Australian side of 2015 who could barely play the moving ball and that series was won thanks to the standout performance of Joe Root and the career best bowling spell of Stuart Broad.

Additionally, Flintoff has drawn a test series in India 1-1 as a captain and was a standout performer, winning the player of series in 2006. Stokes has not won England a single match in India or even done anything worth remembering in India till date.

These two achievements put Flintoff as a superior test cricketer than Stokes. Flintoff not only won it but he was standout performer in them. Also, it's not like Stokes statistically has great numbers in Tests which is why the idea that Stokes is better A/R than Flintoff is highly debatable.

As of today, Flintoff has a stronger case than Stokes. Stokes can change things if he does something worth remembering in his 100th test which will be played in India. Ideally, he needs some performance in Australia too but next tour has some time to go.
 
Additionally, Flintoff has drawn a test series in India 1-1 as a captain and was a standout performer, winning the player of series in 2006. Stokes has not won England a single match in India or even done anything worth remembering in India till date.

These two achievements put Flintoff as a superior test cricketer than Stokes. Flintoff not only won it but he was standout performer in them. Also, it's not like Stokes statistically has great numbers in Tests which is why the idea that Stokes is better A/R than Flintoff is highly debatable.

As of today, Flintoff has a stronger case than Stokes. Stokes can change things if he does something worth remembering in his 100th test which will be played in India. Ideally, he needs some performance in Australia too but next tour has some time to go.

Random bilateral games don't count as much as World Cups.

Winning a home Ashes vs ATG Australian side as a standout performer is not same as winning a home Ashes vs the Australian side of 2015 who could barely play the moving ball and that series was won thanks to the standout performance of Joe Root and the career best bowling spell of Stuart Broad.

This comment is highly subjective.

Ashes win is an Ashes win whether it is 2005 or 2015.

2015 Aussie side wasn't that bad. They went to Ashes right after winning the World Cup.
 
Random bilateral games don't count as much as World Cups.



This comment is highly subjective.

Ashes win is an Ashes win whether it is 2005 or 2015.

2015 Aussie side wasn't that bad. They went to Ashes right after winning the World Cup.
You are comparing odis to tests which makes no sense.

Random bilateral doesn't apply to test cricket, ask any english fans and they would take drawing a test series in India over a t20 wc anyday.

T20 don't have any value in SENA, test cricket reigns supreme. Only South asians hype it up.

The 2005 aussies team was goat level, 2nd best team in history
 
Stokes isn't half as good as Botham in tests, Botham is the English GOAT. Maybe better than Flintoff but about time Stokes contributes something in India or Australia, the two toughest places to tour in world cricket today.
 
Thread is about England's best ever all-rounder. It didn't specify Test format.

So, all formats need to be taken into account.

Stokes wins easily.
 
Random bilateral games don't count as much as World Cups.



This comment is highly subjective.

Ashes win is an Ashes win whether it is 2005 or 2015.

2015 Aussie side wasn't that bad. They went to Ashes right after winning the World Cup.

Wow!

1. Being player of series in India in a test series doesn't count as it is random bilateral lol

2. Ashes win is Ashes win whether it was 2005 or 2015, it is same.

That's right up there as the two most absurd comments I have ever come across in PP.

Btw, what did Stokes do in Ashes 2015 for the starters? Did he hit two hundreds or pick 20 wickets? It's not even worth comparing.

:facepalm
 
Flintoff is widely regarded as England's greatest ODI cricketer. That won't change just because he didn't had the team capable of winning the title.

I used to rate Stokes as someone who will surpass Flintoff easily but because nowadays, he doesn't bowl and his batting has not shown any improvement, there is no reason to rate him higher than Flintoff. You can't be considered a great player unless you move that batting average up to 40 or win a series in India or Australia.
 
Flintoff is widely regarded as England's greatest ODI cricketer. That won't change just because he didn't had the team capable of winning the title.

LOL. What has he won in ODI? That 7-match ODI series in India?

Stokes has more runs and higher average along with a world title.

Objectively speaking, Stokes wins without a doubt.
 
Flintoff is widely regarded as England's greatest ODI cricketer.

By who?

Little doubt that Flintoff would be in an all-time England ODI XI, but there are a number of candidates for the England ODI Goat.

Morgan, Buttler? Pietersen, Root, Bairstow? Collingwood, Trescothick, Gooch? As well as Botham and Stokes.

There is no “widely considered” agreement on this. It is a debate.

Morgan is England’s highest ODI run scorer and won the ODI World Cup as captain. He revolutionised the way that England plays in limited overs cricket after decades of mediocrity and failure. I’d probably go for him as the best.
 
LOL. What has he won in ODI? That 7-match ODI series in India?

Stokes has more runs and higher average along with a world title.

Objectively speaking, Stokes wins without a doubt.

Firstly, you can't look at batting stats like that. In the 2000s, 270-280 was a good score but in 2010s, 300+ became pretty common.

Flintoff , in Stokes era, would probably average 38-39 at same strike rate as Stokes. Stokes would be slightly better batsman but several leagues inferior bowler to Flintoff who averaged an ATGesque 24 with the bowl.

Secondly, it seems you have forgotten that Flintoff was a bowler first and then batsman. He averages 24 with bowl which is 17 lower than Stokes part time bowling which yielded an average of 41. The gulf of difference in bowling is massive.

Flintoff as a bowler itself will merit a place in England side. Add to that, his batting where he averaged 30+ with numerous ODI hundreds coming to bat at 5 or 6. He was undoubtedly an ATG ODI cricketer and one has to be absolutely a rookie to deny this.
 
By who?

Little doubt that Flintoff would be in an all-time England ODI XI, but there are a number of candidates for the England ODI Goat.

Morgan, Buttler? Pietersen, Root, Bairstow? Collingwood, Trescothick, Gooch? As well as Botham and Stokes.

There is no “widely considered” agreement on this. It is a debate.

Morgan is England’s highest ODI run scorer and won the ODI World Cup as captain. He revolutionised the way that England plays in limited overs cricket after decades of mediocrity and failure. I’d probably go for him as the best.

Flintoff averages 24 with bowl. Which England bowler even averages less than that? Tell me.

Additionally, he averages 30+ with bat at S/R of 90 and has several hundreds coming to bat at 5 or 6. Just because he played in a weak England team, that shouldn't take away any credit of him.
 
LOL.

What about batting? What about trophy cabinet?

This thread is not about bowling department only.

What batting? This thread is about all rounder.

Flintoff is miles ahead of Stokes as bowler.

He is only slightly below Stokes as batsman. If T20 World Cups happened, Flintoff would have won a few too. Flintoff absolutely decimates Stokes as a ODI cricketer and is also superior to him in Tests cricket. You have failed to dismiss any of my point.

Initially , you said Stokes is England's best ever all rounder and better than Botham and Flintoff both.

Then you deliberately started comparing Stokes with Flintoff because you already gave up on comparison with Botham lol.

Then you started claiming absurd statements like drawing a test series in India is a random bilateral. Yeah, he should have won in Bangladesh. Additionally, claiming that Ashes 2005 or Ashes 2015 both are same even though Stokes did nothing special in Ashes 2015 either lol.

Now, you are stucked on one argument - Stokes batting vs Flintoff batting in ODIs? This is all rounder debate. Flintoff is a far superior bowler and only slightly inferior batsman in ODIs, being a better batsman doesn't make Stokes a better all rounder.

I don't know how much more embarassment you want to get served because all you have to show up is the World Cup titles even though you probably agree yourself that Flintoff played for a much weaker side than Stokes. Thank God! I am debating on an English player with another English player. Imagine if this was an Indian player, you would have probably stooped to a new low and embarass yourself even more.
 
What batting? This thread is about all rounder.

Batting is something an all-rounder has to be good at by definition.

Stokes wins in batting department just like he has trophies to show for.

Stokes 2 - Fintoff 1
 
To conclude,

Tests -

1. Botham
2. Flintoff
3. Stokes

Flintoff wins it over Stokes due to sheer impact vs ATG Aus side and performance in India. Stokes has no impact in India or Australia. Botham obviously was #1.

ODIs -

1. Flintoff
2. Stokes
3. Botham

Flintoff with an average of 24 with bowl probably walks in the team as arguably the most valuable bowler alone. Additionally, with bat he averages 32 at SR of 90 in early 2000s era.

Btw, Stokes and Botham, it is close call but since Stokes played an ATG knock in ODI WC Final, he edges Botham in white ball cricket.
 
England are sitting at 8th or 9th spot in the World Test Championship standings. Seems like the ODI World Cup winner, Stokes is not capable of winning titles or qualifying to the finals in Test cricket.
 
England are sitting at 8th or 9th spot in the World Test Championship standings. Seems like the ODI World Cup winner, Stokes is not capable of winning titles or qualifying to the finals in Test cricket.

England would be 5th in this table, and one win away from going into the top two qualifying spots for the final, without over rate penalties.
 
Captain Ben Stokes says his 100th cap is "just a number" as he prepares to become the 16th man to reach a century of Tests for England.

Stokes will reach the milestone when he leads England in the third Test against India in Rajkot on Thursday.

"Every Test is just as important as the next one," said Stokes. "Then there's the next one, which will be 101 - it's just one more."

"It's a sign of longevity, but 99, 100 or 101 doesn't make much difference."


BBC
 
I think he could have easily played more than 150 Tests by now, but unfortunately fitness issues have held him back.
 
Ben Stokes To Join England's 100 Test Club

Star all-rounder Ben Stokes is set to become the 16th England cricketer to appear in 100 Tests, against India at Rajkot on Thursday. The 32-year-old England captain will join an elite club, including current internationals James Anderson and Joe Root, when he leads the tourists in the third of a five-match series currently all square at 1-1.

Full list of England cricketers with 100 or more Test caps (caps, player, career span):

184 - James Anderson - (2003-)

167 - Stuart Broad - (2007-2023)

161 - Alastair Cook - (2006-2018)

137 - Joe Root - (2012-)

133 - Alec Stewart - (1990-2003)

118 - Graham Gooch - (1975-1995)

118 - Ian Bell - (2004-2015)

117 - David Gower - (1978-1992)

115 - Michael Atherton - (1989-2001)

114 - Colin Cowdrey - (1954-1975)

108 - Geoffrey Boycott - (1964-1982)

104 - Kevin Pietersen - (2005-2014)

102 - Ian Botham - (1977-1992)

100 - Graham Thorpe - (1993-2005)

100 - Andrew Strauss - (2004-2012)

Listen to the latest songs, only on JioSaavn.com

Note: Test careers of Anderson and Root still ongoing

SOURCE: NDTV
 
Stokes is gettin ready to swing his arms. His team needs him in the bowling department and this will give them the opportunity to play an extra batter.

-------------

England set for major boost ahead of fourth India Test

England captain Ben Stokes has hinted he may make a return to bowling duties for the remainder of the series in India.

England's faltering ICC World Test Championship hopes could receive a massive boost with news that skipper Ben Stokes may return to the bowling crease for the fourth Test against India in Ranchi.

Stokes hasn't bowled during the first three Tests on the sub-continent as he continues to recover from an operation on his knee last year and his absence as a bowler has been felt as India have won two Tests on the trot to hold a 2-1 series lead in the five-match contest.

The consecutive losses have also seen England slip to eighth on the World Test Championship standings and Stokes' side need to salvage something from their final two matches in India if they are to stay in contention of reaching next year's final at Lord's.

Being able to use Stokes with the ball would allow England to select a more balanced XI for the crucial fourth Test that commences on Friday and the experienced skipper was bullish about his prospects when quizzed on the idea following his team's 434-run loss to India during the third Test in Rajkot.

"I'm not saying yes, I'm not saying no," Stokes pondered when asked if he would bowl during the remainder of the India series.

"Me being me, I'm always very optimistic about most things. That will be a more detailed chat with the medical team about what workload I have done to pass me off as not being a massive risk.

"I managed to bowl at 100 percent in one of the warm-up days here which made me feel pretty good. I felt like I could have bowled in the game but that would have been stupid."

If Stokes does make himself available as a bowler then England have the option of re-jigging their XI completely, or he could join James Anderson and Mark Wood in a three-player pace attack next to a trio of spinners that includes Rehan Ahmed, Tom Hartley and fellow all-rounder Joe Root.

England coach Brendon McCullum said a decision on Stokes' bowling availability and the make-up of his final XI would not be made until the team gets the chance to monitor the conditions in Ranchi and that all members of the travelling party would come into contention of featuring.

"We've got two really good options on the sideline as well with Ollie Robinson and Gus Atkinson," McCullum posed.

"So we've got a really good squad to pick from. We just need to work out when we get there what conditions we're going to be confronted with and see the health of the army, and then make a decision on what we go with.

"Obviously we haven't seen the conditions in Ranchi yet. I think it might spin. I guess it should spin but we'll see when we get there. But, look, we're really comfortable with what we've got and we're certainly not going to add to the squad.

"We've got a group of players here who have played some outstanding cricket so far over the last three Test matches and whatever XI we decide to go with we will fully back. Hopefully we'll be in a different situation to what we're in now."

McCullum said it was a positive sign that Stokes is considering making a return to the bowling crease, but he doesn't expect his captain to put his hand up for lengthy spells unless he knows his body can put up with the rigours of bowling in difficult conditions faced on the sub-continent.

"Well, it's good that he's actually getting into a state where he thinks he might bowl," McCullum said.

"But Ben is clever; he's really clever as well. He won't bowl unless he thinks he's legitimately able to bowl. The problem would be if he starts getting into a spell and then he can't get out of the spell. So we'll see what unfolds.

"If he does get that bit between his teeth, then let's see where the danger lies there and try and pull him away from it. But it's a good sign."

ICC
 
Surely he is not ready to play as an all rounder yet. Might be able to do one short spell in each of the two remaining Tests and see how he pulls up.
 
Stokes is gettin ready to swing his arms. His team needs him in the bowling department and this will give them the opportunity to play an extra batter.

-------------

England set for major boost ahead of fourth India Test

England captain Ben Stokes has hinted he may make a return to bowling duties for the remainder of the series in India.

England's faltering ICC World Test Championship hopes could receive a massive boost with news that skipper Ben Stokes may return to the bowling crease for the fourth Test against India in Ranchi.

Stokes hasn't bowled during the first three Tests on the sub-continent as he continues to recover from an operation on his knee last year and his absence as a bowler has been felt as India have won two Tests on the trot to hold a 2-1 series lead in the five-match contest.

The consecutive losses have also seen England slip to eighth on the World Test Championship standings and Stokes' side need to salvage something from their final two matches in India if they are to stay in contention of reaching next year's final at Lord's.

Being able to use Stokes with the ball would allow England to select a more balanced XI for the crucial fourth Test that commences on Friday and the experienced skipper was bullish about his prospects when quizzed on the idea following his team's 434-run loss to India during the third Test in Rajkot.

"I'm not saying yes, I'm not saying no," Stokes pondered when asked if he would bowl during the remainder of the India series.

"Me being me, I'm always very optimistic about most things. That will be a more detailed chat with the medical team about what workload I have done to pass me off as not being a massive risk.

"I managed to bowl at 100 percent in one of the warm-up days here which made me feel pretty good. I felt like I could have bowled in the game but that would have been stupid."

If Stokes does make himself available as a bowler then England have the option of re-jigging their XI completely, or he could join James Anderson and Mark Wood in a three-player pace attack next to a trio of spinners that includes Rehan Ahmed, Tom Hartley and fellow all-rounder Joe Root.

England coach Brendon McCullum said a decision on Stokes' bowling availability and the make-up of his final XI would not be made until the team gets the chance to monitor the conditions in Ranchi and that all members of the travelling party would come into contention of featuring.

"We've got two really good options on the sideline as well with Ollie Robinson and Gus Atkinson," McCullum posed.

"So we've got a really good squad to pick from. We just need to work out when we get there what conditions we're going to be confronted with and see the health of the army, and then make a decision on what we go with.

"Obviously we haven't seen the conditions in Ranchi yet. I think it might spin. I guess it should spin but we'll see when we get there. But, look, we're really comfortable with what we've got and we're certainly not going to add to the squad.

"We've got a group of players here who have played some outstanding cricket so far over the last three Test matches and whatever XI we decide to go with we will fully back. Hopefully we'll be in a different situation to what we're in now."

McCullum said it was a positive sign that Stokes is considering making a return to the bowling crease, but he doesn't expect his captain to put his hand up for lengthy spells unless he knows his body can put up with the rigours of bowling in difficult conditions faced on the sub-continent.

"Well, it's good that he's actually getting into a state where he thinks he might bowl," McCullum said.

"But Ben is clever; he's really clever as well. He won't bowl unless he thinks he's legitimately able to bowl. The problem would be if he starts getting into a spell and then he can't get out of the spell. So we'll see what unfolds.

"If he does get that bit between his teeth, then let's see where the danger lies there and try and pull him away from it. But it's a good sign."

ICC
Stokes bowling will be a fit to Indian team. His bowling is overrated especially in the subcontinent.
 
Ben Stokes' performance in this 5-Test series against India has been disappointing, especially considering his role as an all-rounder. He is not bowling, and his contributions with the bat have been lackluster, failing to fulfill his potential as a middle-order batter. To truly impact the team, he needs to adapt to the situation, providing stability and contributing significantly to the team's overall score.

5htJXQG.jpg
 
Unnecessarily hyped test cricketer. He is not better than Shane Watson at the test arena.
 
Roger Binny, BCCI president on Ben Stokes' captaincy:

"Well, the captaincy of Ben Stokes so he has been more aggressive, and I think that has been the (reason for their) downfall in the few Test matches,"

"Being so aggressive and trying to take on the Indian spinners in difficult times (situations) rather than hanging around and trying to make a big score,"

"Rohit Sharma again has been very tactful. You know he knew exactly what he wanted to do and he got his bowlers to do that."

"I don't think England changed their strategy. They went on the same attacking mode like what they did in the first Test match. But, I think, Rohit was more patient because he had the first Test in his pocket at one stage and then he let it go. He was patient enough in the next two Tests and won both."

"I think England have themselves to blame for the situation they are in at the moment. I think they started well in the morning, they looked as if they would put up a fighting score."

"So far, it has been India's day. They have been batting well also so far and I think the Test series has been very one-sided after the first Test that England won. From then onwards, the Indian team has done well and it has dominated the series."

Source: NDTV
 
Ben stokes non-achievement will massively eclipse his achievements. Okay he scored 30 or 40 in T20 final to win. That was a safe innings. Just had to play without losing his head. You could say that was a compensation for hsi horror show against Brathwhite. Will give him that win in the final despite with a bit of luck. Same way the century against Australia was good one. But it was a nothing to lose situation. He got over the line. So you can say 3 or 4 telling contributions. But list his "non-contributions". There are plenty of them.
 
So you can say 3 or 4 telling contributions. But list his "non-contributions". There are plenty of them.

It’s the same for a lot of cricketers to be honest. Cricket as we know has a recency bias and accompanying nostalgia problem.

When do you ever read about all the low scores, wicketless spells and poor performances of players from past eras? Almost all of them had their fair share, but these fade into the void.

It’s primarily the big performances, match winning displays, great rare innings that get remembered after cricketers retire.
 
It’s the same for a lot of cricketers to be honest. Cricket as we know has a recency bias and accompanying nostalgia problem.

When do you ever read about all the low scores, wicketless spells and poor performances of players from past eras? Almost all of them had their fair share, but these fade into the void.

It’s primarily the big performances, match winning displays, great rare innings that get remembered after cricketers retire.
More he prolongs his career with current form more it will be a blot in his achievements. Same question was raised about Pujara, Rahane as well. Rahane was picked mainly as a SENA specialist. But he offset all the achievements overseas with a string of poor performances in subsequent tours. Sure we get nostalgic about his contribution to some of those wins. But he also let us down many times.
 
Stokes will never be remembered for his career statistics. He is going to be remembered for some of the legendary and clutch knocks he produced - including the one which won England its first ODI WC. He already is a legend, regardless of what he does from now onwards based on that alone.
 
Stokes is done and this adds to England’s Bazball woes. They have so heavily invested in the captaincy of playing style of a player who is now a lability in his individual capacity.

He barely scores, he doesn’t bowl and he walks around as if he has sneaked out of an NHS clinic.

His body is breaking apart. He doesn’t have any mileage left. He needs to retire from international cricket and spend the last 2-3 years of his career playing franchise cricket.

After all, that is why he retired from ODIs in the first place.
 
Sir Ian Botham is by far the best English test Allrounder.

Stokes takes the title for the limited overs .
 
Ben Stokes' first ball in 8 months was too good for Rohit Sharma...

What have England been doing?
 
Ben Stokes' first ball in 8 months was too good for Rohit Sharma...

What have England been doing?

There has been a lot of concern after knee surgery and with his captaincy role that a return to bowling would damage his body too much to continue in any discipline. Have to see how he pulls up after this spell and take it from there. But if he can play as an all rounder again, that will help England to improve the balance of their side.
 
There has been a lot of concern after knee surgery and with his captaincy role that a return to bowling would damage his body too much to continue in any discipline. Have to see how he pulls up after this spell and take it from there. But if he can play as an all rounder again, that will help England to improve the balance of their side.

Mark Wood's reaction (as mine too)

GIISAooWEAAQUkR
 
Only two men currently have more than 200 Test wickets as well as more than 6,000 Test runs: Garfield Sobers (8,032 runs and 235 wickets) and Jacques Kallis (13,289 runs and 292 wickets)

Ben Stokes now has 198 Test wickets to go with 6,314 runs.
 
He just surprised us all today.
====
Bowling the second over of the afternoon session, Stokes produced a peach that seamed away a touch from good length to dislodge Rohit's off-stump.

"He's (Stokes) a freak. It was almost written in the stars that he was going to bowl a jaffa first up and get Rohit Sharma out who was on 100. We all know how we can round our attack out, especially in conditions like these where you've usually got two spinners, two seamers and then you want your third in Stokesy.

"It was nice to see him back at the crease but we've just got to be careful we don't push him too far, it's still early days for him. I'm sure he'll rest up tonight, get some ice on it and see where it fronts tomorrow," said the former New Zealand spinner.

The dressing room too was amazed at Stokes when he came on to bowl the second over after lunch.

"A little bit of amazement, a little bit written in the stars, a lot of people laughing. It's quite funny because he came on to bowl when the English crowds are waking up - they're flicking on the TV and the first thing they see is Ben Stokes bowling a really good delivery to Rohit Sharma.

"It's so nice to see him back; he's got better and better with his bowling skills (in the nets) over the tour so that's a huge positive for us. There's a lot of cricket to be played this year so it will be nice to have him back at the crease," said Patel.
 
England offspinner-allrounder Moeen Ali, during an interview with a sports channel, said:

"He did really well. The way he backs his spinners - even when I played in the UK, he had [innovative] field settings against Australia [like] a guy dead-straight behind the [bowler's] arm. He is always willing to do things like that. I had Joe Root and Alastair Cook as my captains [previously] but Stokesy was just different. Everyone knows that. The way he's taking the game and team forward, it's really amazing. In such a short period of time, he took England from not playing great cricket to amazing and entertaining cricket. Everyone is talking about Bazball. [The team themselves] actually don't believe much in [the term]. They just want to play this brand of cricket. I think he is a special captain and a special player."
 
Good surprise delivery but the series remains a failure for him.

He averages 28.65 in India with bat over 27 innings with 1 more innings to go.

With bowl, he averages 38.
 
Excellent ball for Rohit. But aren't English going overboard with titles like this?

Ben Stokes’ remarkable bowling return could be transformative for Bazball 2.0​

 
Excellent ball for Rohit. But aren't English going overboard with titles like this?

Ben Stokes’ remarkable bowling return could be transformative for Bazball 2.0​

That is way too over the top of a headline for someone who only bowled 5 overs after so so long.

Stokes can no not really justify his spot in the side as a batsmen, but if he contributes some overs of bowling he can probably stick around for a bit longer.
 
Excellent ball for Rohit. But aren't English going overboard with titles like this?

Ben Stokes’ remarkable bowling return could be transformative for Bazball 2.0​

My goodness. The level of delusional is extraordinary.

It appears that one thrashing wasn’t enough for burst their bubble. Hopefully Australia will end this little Bazball gimmick for good.
 
Good surprise delivery but the series remains a failure for him.

He averages 28.65 in India with bat over 27 innings with 1 more innings to go.

With bowl, he averages 38.
Apart from that crazy knock in South Africa in 2016, he has always been a failure outside England and always will be.

He is technically just not sound enough.
 
I am fully convinced now that this guy is overhyped just because he plays in an era where there are no other pace bowling allrounders in any major team.

His away record is shambles and has been a non performer in Asia, his bowling works only in England.

Just look at how people are hyping him after taking a solitary wicket.

He is in no way comparable to the likes of Botham or Kapil forget Imran.

I am quite sure that performance wise Flintoff also beats him in test cricket.
He was a proper allrounder unlike Stokes
 
I am fully convinced now that this guy is overhyped just because he plays in an era where there are no other pace bowling allrounders in any major team.

His away record is shambles and has been a non performer in Asia, his bowling works only in England.

Just look at how people are hyping him after taking a solitary wicket.

He is in no way comparable to the likes of Botham or Kapil forget Imran.

I am quite sure that performance wise Flintoff also beats him in test cricket.
He was a proper allrounder unlike Stokes
Stokes is a relatively better batsman than Flintoff, but the gap isn’t that big. However, the gap between the two in terms of bowling is gigantic.

Stokes isn’t half the bowler Flintoff was. The way Stokes’ Test career has tanked after the highs of 2019 doesn’t get talked about enough.

5 years is a long time in cricket and he has done absolutely nothing in Test cricket since summer of 2019.
 
Stokes has been mediocre outside the 2016-19 period and he has had a decade long career.

Calling him overrated seems to be a fair assessment looking at his overall career and even his 2016-19 peak was more about moments rather than consistency.
 
Stokes produces moments of brilliance which actually takes our mind away from consistency.

As an example, Jadeja has been performing at another level atleast in the last five years but he still gets tagged as a HTB, Stokes even with those mediocre numbers never gets called out for being a HTB.


If Jason Holder played in a major team he would have eclipsed Stokes as an allrounder.


Stokes is usually compared with the likes of Botham, Dev but actually he is in the league of Cairns, Flintoff and that too at the third place, I would happily trade Stokes for someone like Chris Cairns.
 
Apart from that crazy knock in South Africa in 2016, he has always been a failure outside England and always will be.

He is technically just not sound enough.
I am fully convinced now that this guy is overhyped just because he plays in an era where there are no other pace bowling allrounders in any major team.

His away record is shambles and has been a non performer in Asia, his bowling works only in England.

Just look at how people are hyping him after taking a solitary wicket.

He is in no way comparable to the likes of Botham or Kapil forget Imran.

I am quite sure that performance wise Flintoff also beats him in test cricket.
He was a proper allrounder unlike Stokes

He is a good player only in South Africa, England and New Zealand conditions. A proper swing/seam condition bully. Rest everywhere he is a failure with both bat and bowl.
 
Stokes produces moments of brilliance which actually takes our mind away from consistency.

As an example, Jadeja has been performing at another level atleast in the last five years but he still gets tagged as a HTB, Stokes even with those mediocre numbers never gets called out for being a HTB.


If Jason Holder played in a major team he would have eclipsed Stokes as an allrounder.


Stokes is usually compared with the likes of Botham, Dev but actually he is in the league of Cairns, Flintoff and that too at the third place, I would happily trade Stokes for someone like Chris Cairns.

Flintoff is better than Stokes too.

Flintoff won an Ashes vs ATG Australian side in 2005 as standout performer, Stokes could only win one test match at Headingley but couldn't win that series in 2019.

Flintoff has been a player of series in India in a drawn test series where he captained the side and was standout performer. Stokes has nothing to show in India over three tours, not even a player of match or any memorable knock.

Flintoff statistically also has far superior ODI record than Stokes.

Stokes is comfortably England's 4th best all rounder since 1970 and behind Botham, Greig and Flintoff.
 
Stokes is washed up now. Nowhere near among the top all-rounders atm. Over-hyped and should be let go now.
 
199 runs in 10 innings this tour. One wicket.

Please don't compare him with Botham, please just don't. Botham singlehandedly beat India in India in his prime, 10fer and a 100 in 1980 Golden Jubilee test.

Honestly I am not sure Stokes is better than Flintoff who was an ace bowler in these conditions, this series has been a major setback for him.
 
Flintoff was a champion in the 2006 test series in India, won them the 3rd test in Mumbai to draw the series, was man of the match as well as man of the series. Peak Flintoff was a scary beast, his bowling was devastating even on SC pitches.
 
Regarding Freddie's bowling, borrowing the words of the ZLATAN, England had a Ferrari but treated it like a Fiat.
 
@Mobashir

Stokes is a mediocre player and not better than Kohli, Ashwin, Jadeja and Rohit as you were trying to claim few weeks back.

@Forum363

Remember when you were adamant that he is not washed up and I kept telling you that he is finished? :klopp
 
Former Australia captain Ian Chappell has delivered a scathing critique of England skipper Ben Stokes' captaincy, attributing India's series-sealing victory in the fourth Test to a critical lapse in strategy at a pivotal juncture.

In his assessment, Chappell pointed out a pivotal moment in the fourth Test at Ranchi where Stokes' decision-making came under scrutiny. According to Chappell, Stokes' choice to utilize part-time spinner Joe Root instead of deploying the experienced Jimmy Anderson on the third evening of the Test allowed India to gain momentum, ultimately shifting the balance of the match in their favor.

Chappell articulated his viewpoint, stating, "On the third evening Stokes desperately needed to start India's chase with his best two bowlers and try to claim at least one wicket. Incredibly, he gave the ball to a part-timer, Joe Root, and ignored the experienced, probing bowling of Jimmy Anderson."

Furthermore, Chappell criticized Stokes' approach on the final day, suggesting that his cautious field placings allowed India's batsmen to accumulate easy singles, thereby making the chase more manageable for the hosts.

Reflecting on the missed opportunity, Chappell remarked, "The second innings should have been a time to force the Indian batters into taking a risk, but by allowing easy singles, Stokes gave his opponents the upper hand."

Chappell also highlighted the need for instinctive decision-making in captaincy, suggesting that Stokes could benefit from studying the leadership style of seasoned captains like Pakistan's Javed Miandad in demanding situations.

Chappell underscored the importance of bold and intuitive leadership, emphasizing that effective captaincy often relies on gut instincts rather than rigid adherence to statistical analysis or theoretical frameworks.

TOI
 
I think stokes needs to bat better if he wants to take a spot as a batsman. He needs to spend time in middle.

To put it in perspective,

Ben Stokes faced 367 balls in 10 inning

Kuldeep Yadav faced 362 balls from 6 innings


Yadav is a cerified tail, but he applied himself and spent time in middle. Just in 6 innings, Yadav spent as much time in middle as Stokes did in 10 innings. Stokes need to look closely to see if he can occupy a spot as batsman.
 
I think stokes needs to bat better if he wants to take a spot as a batsman. He needs to spend time in middle.

To put it in perspective,

Ben Stokes faced 367 balls in 10 inning

Kuldeep Yadav faced 362 balls from 6 innings


Yadav is a cerified tail, but he applied himself and spent time in middle. Just in 6 innings, Yadav spent as much time in middle as Stokes did in 10 innings. Stokes need to look closely to see if he can occupy a spot as batsman.

Honestly speaking, Stokes is basically Shastri level test all rounder. Not talking about white ball here, in test cricket, Shastri averages same as Stokes despite opening the batting for a long period. He has 11 hundreds in 80 tests while Stokes has 13 in 100+.

Bowling wise, both are again same level. Stokes got 198 wickets in 102 tests while Shastri managed 150 wickets in 80 tests.
 
While speaking to a local English sports channel, England spinner Tom Hartley remarks regarding Ben Stokes for being supportive during the five-test match series against India:

"He was fantastic. He took so much pressure off me, did a lot of the field settings, and it was a bit crazy at times looking around; you'd have a different field every ball. But he just allowed me to get on with it, really, and backed me all the way. That test series probably would have gone a lot differently if he wasn't Captain. I'm ever grateful to him. He's such a great leader."
 
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England Test captain Ben Stokes is set to play his first County Championship match for two years when Durham play Lancashire on Friday

Stokes last featured in a Championship game for Durham in May 2022.

But, as the 32-year-old begins his preparations for England's Test series against West Indies and Sri Lanka later this summer, he will play in the four-day Division One match at Stanley Park in Blackpool.

"I suggest if you've got a few days over the weekend, you get yourself down to Blackpool to watch the great Ben Stokes' return for Durham," said the club's head coach Ryan Campbell.

Stokes is not going to the T20 World Cup in the West Indies and USA next month as he wants to focus on regaining his fitness to fulfil his role as an all-rounder in the Test team.

Following knee surgery in the winter, Stokes played all five Tests on England's tour of India, but he bowled only five overs across the whole series, all in the final Test.

England's first Test against the West Indies begins at Lord's on 10 July, but Durham's match with Lancashire is one of four possible red-ball games he could play before that date.

Stokes did not play any county cricket last summer as he managed his knee injury before the Ashes.

He played three matches for Durham in Division Two in 2022 as preparation for the start of his tenure as England captain.

In that spell he scored a memorable 161 off just 88 balls against Worcestershire at New Road, and also took 4-72 in a match against Middlesex at Lord's.

Source: BBC
 
A five-fer under the belt for Ben Stokes—what a comeback as a bowler!

First innings: 18-2-71-2

Second innings: 20-0-98-5

Seven wickets and 38 overs under the belt for Ben Stokes on his County Championship return.

Because of dedication like this, love for red-ball cricket is alive.

 
Ben Stokes is back in form. His impressive half-century 56(79) in Durham's County Championship 2024 match against Worcestershire showing off his hard work and dedication. He chose to sit out the ICC T20 World Cup 2024 to focus on honing his all-around skills and it's paying off

 
England captain Ben Stokes, on July 11, received a special memento for completing 100 Tests. The veteran allrounder achieved the incredible milestone earlier this year when he led England in the five-match Test series against India.

The third Test of the series in Rajkot was his 100th Test. Ben Stokes became the 16th England player to enter the 100-Test club. The other England players to play 100 or more Tests are James Anderson, Stuart Broad, Sir Alastair Cook, Joe Root, Alec Stewart, Ian Bell, Graham Gooch, David Gower, Michael Atherton, Colin Cowdrey, Sir Geoff Boycott, Kevin Pietersen, Lord Ian Botham, Sir Andrew Strauss and Graham Thorpe.

Ben Stokes received a special Silver Cap for the milestone before the second day's play of the ongoing first Test against West Indies at Lord's. The ongoing game is his 103rd Test. So far, he has scored 6316 runs and picked up 199 wickets in the longest format of the game.

 
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