[VIDEOS] Muslim Convert/Revert Stories Thread - What made them make this choice?

[szrana007]

I can see why religion is still growing and why people are converting, and also why (outside of the west) non-religion is not.

Agnosticism can be argued as a logical position to take. Much about our existence as organic beings is unknown, or potentially even unknowable, and agnosticism humbly respects those very human limitations.

I tried Atheism a long time ago and have enjoyed listening to some Atheist opinions, but I found the whole thing too brutal and hopeless in the end. Atheism also has a tendency to be quite smug and superior at times.

Things like Young Earth, book bashing, placard waving and televangelism are IMO deeply cringeworthy, and a real turn off; and I understand why people would find them such a turn off that they might dismiss all of religion as ridiculous.

But there are good points to religion. And they’re some interesting premises for the universe having been created. I find the “Five Ways” of Thomas Aquinas to be one of the most profound and convincing multilayered arguments that I have read.

Good post, I would argue that the belief in God is biologically rooted and aligns and resonates with our deepest intuitions as human beings.

Thats why throughout history, overwhelming majority of humanity has believed in God in some form or the other. Even today around 85 % of humanity believes in God or some sort of higher power.

This shows that atheism is an aberration in human civilization and it is abnormal for human beings, while theism is normal and the default position for humanity.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Good post, I would argue that the belief in God is biologically rooted and aligns and resonates with our deepest intuitions as human beings.

Thats why throughout history, overwhelming majority of humanity has believed in God in some form or the other. Even today around 85 % of humanity believes in God or some sort of higher power.

This shows that atheism is an aberration in human civilization and it is abnormal for human beings, while theism is normal and the default position for humanity.

I would go further, there is no such thing as a true athiest.

Ive used this example before.

Dont try this at home but if you lock up 10 atheists, in their own room , turn off the lights and go away. It may take 10 mins or 10 hours or longer but sooner or later every one of them will call for help from a higher power.

 

[Heisenberg111]

Well according to the pew report 23 percent leaving, 23 percent coming. According to UN 26 percent er leaving and 24 percent coming in . As I said earlier I think these numbers are under reported in my opinion due to the stigma of leaving religion and repercussions .. the only place I see conversations is prisons. A large percentage of prisons are full of African Americans. There is a network and trend in that community to convert to Islam. According to the pew report the biggest reason for the increase in Muslim population in the world is high birth rate and if you read the full report all these are variables. If education level goes up in these places with high birth rate , child birth will also go down. Also education level goes up and people will also leave religion. So plenty of if an buts.

In America, Islam gains about as many people as it loses, but globally there are more people joining Islam rather than leaving.

 

[szrana007]

I would go further, there is no such thing as a true athiest.

Ive used this example before.

Dont try this at home but if you lock up 10 atheists, in their own room , turn off the lights and go away. It may take 10 mins or 10 hours or longer but sooner or later every one of them will call for help from a higher power.

True, at best, you can be an agnostic but you can't be a convinced atheist.

There is no scientific or empirical evidence that disproves the existence of God, so being an atheist is just blind faith in the supposed non existence of God.

 

[Heisenberg111]

Atheism is on the rise in many developed educated countries. Not just the west. New Zealand, Australia, South Korea, Japan

Not in the Gulf countries though, which are developed as well.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Not in the Gulf countries though, which are developed as well.

Closet atheists. No one dares to declare openly that they are atheists in any Muslim majority country. Apostasy is punishable by death.

 

[Technics 1210]

Closet atheists. No one dares to declare openly that they are atheists in any Muslim majority country. Apostasy is punishable by death.

Nonsense.

Many Athiests in the Gulf, are they being put to death? Please provide examples.

The reality is no one dare declare they are Muslims in parts of India, they are certainly put to death.

 

[corleone]

Well according to the pew report 23 percent leaving, 23 percent coming. According to UN 26 percent er leaving and 24 percent coming in . As I said earlier I think these numbers are under reported in my opinion due to the stigma of leaving religion and repercussions .. the only place I see conversations is prisons. A large percentage of prisons are full of African Americans. There is a network and trend in that community to convert to Islam. According to the pew report the biggest reason for the increase in Muslim population in the world is high birth rate and if you read the full report all these are variables. If education level goes up in these places with high birth rate , child birth will also go down. Also education level goes up and people will also leave religion. So plenty of if an buts.

You seem to keep repeating the point that as education levels go up, people will leave religion. What are the facts/theory to support this point? I'm from England where almost 100% of the population is 'educated' (particularly the Muslim population) yet I have never in 29 years heard of anyone leaving Islam. This isn't a country where there'd be stigma or backlash for leaving Islam. Yet I've heard countless conversion stories

 

[Heisenberg111]

Closet atheists. No one dares to declare openly that they are atheists in any Muslim majority country. Apostasy is punishable by death.

I live in Dubai and have lived in other gulf countries as well, have met a few atheists, but they were foreign expats not locals. You must have an insider knowledge of the locals in gulf countries, since you are claiming there are closet atheists but atheism certainly isn't a rising trend in the gulf.

 

[szrana007]

In this video, 25 year old gypsy multi millionaire entrepreneur, Alfie Best junior talks about his conversion to Islam. He talks about everything from his upbringing, leaving school at 12 years old to pursue business, working with his father Alfie Best senior, and his conversion to Islam.

 

[sweep_shot]

In this video, 25 year old gypsy multi millionaire entrepreneur, Alfie Best junior talks about his conversion to Islam. He talks about everything from his upbringing, leaving school at 12 years old to pursue business, working with his father Alfie Best senior, and his conversion to Islam.

Subhanallah. Glad to see he found the light.

May he find peace and success in life.

 

[szrana007]

Subhanallah. Glad to see he found the light.

May he find peace and success in life.

He has found peace in Islam, thats what he talked about in this interview.

 

[Poseidon]

NON MUSLIM SCIENTISTS EMBRACED ISLAM AFTER DISCOVERING THE MIRACLES OF THE NOBLE QUR'AN

 

[The_Odd_One]

I would go further, there is no such thing as a true athiest.

Ive used this example before.

Dont try this at home but if you lock up 10 atheists, in their own room , turn off the lights and go away. It may take 10 mins or 10 hours or longer but sooner or later every one of them will call for help from a higher power.

This only shows that you don't even know any atheists personally and your opinion is based on false propaganda.

I know plenty of people personally who will never seek help from a higher power because there's no such thing. None had ever presented any evidence for such an entity.

I have been in worse turbulences on flights. Instead of praying to a higher power and over stressing myself, I can relax and stay calm knowing that there is a robust science and technology that built the plane and thousands of hours of pilot training and experience that will keep the plane safe. When you know how things work, you don't rely on made up sources of peace. You trust science and humans.

 

[MenInG]

Post videos without any summary of what it has and it will be deleted.

 

[SalimBhai]

This only shows that you don't even know any atheists personally and your opinion is based on false propaganda.

I know plenty of people personally who will never seek help from a higher power because there's no such thing. None had ever presented any evidence for such an entity.

I have been in worse turbulences on flights. Instead of praying to a higher power and over stressing myself, I can relax and stay calm knowing that there is a robust science and technology that built the plane and thousands of hours of pilot training and experience that will keep the plane safe. When you know how things work, you don't rely on made up sources of peace. You trust science and humans.

I agree. I endorse this post

 

[Waq]

I respect when an atheist says that they don’t believe and nothing will change their mind and their belief is science but I personally find it hard to change my thoughts that in your deepest and dangerous moments, we all ask for some kind of help from God.

 

[SalimBhai]

I respect when an atheist says that they don’t believe and nothing will change their mind and their belief is science but I personally find it hard to change my thoughts that in your deepest and dangerous moments, we all ask for some kind of help from God.

Are u a believer? If so its hard for you to understand maybe.

 

[LongHorn]

I live in Dubai and have lived in other gulf countries as well, have met a few atheists, but they were foreign expats not locals. You must have an insider knowledge of the locals in gulf countries, since you are claiming there are closet atheists but atheism certainly isn't a rising trend in the gulf.

While rate of atheism in the Gulf is definitely far lower than in other Muslim countries, there are a growing number of atheists, but they will never admit it in front of you or others. Only their family members and close friends would know .
It is not socially acceptable in the Gulf to be an open atheist so atheist Gulf Arabs wont say it out loud....

https://www.al-monitor.com/originals/2014/03/gulf-atheism-uae-islam-religion.html

 

[Robert]

True, at best, you can be an agnostic but you can't be a convinced atheist.

There is no scientific or empirical evidence that disproves the existence of God, so being an atheist is just blind faith in the supposed non existence of God.

This is a logical fallacy. You cannot prove a negative proposition.

Given that there is no evidence for the existence of gods, it is safe to assume that there are no gods. In the same way as it is safe to assume that there are no unicorn herds on Neptune. When someone provides evidence that there are unicorn herds on Neptune, I will believe in Unicom herds as n Neptune.

 

[Robert]

I would go further, there is no such thing as a true athiest.

Ive used this example before.

Dont try this at home but if you lock up 10 atheists, in their own room , turn off the lights and go away. It may take 10 mins or 10 hours or longer but sooner or later every one of them will call for help from a higher power.

Have you carried out this experiment?

How many times?

Did you do a double-blind test to eliminate false positives?

If not, then your hypothesis is untested and therefore meaningless.

 

[szrana007]

This is a logical fallacy. You cannot prove a negative proposition.

Given that there is no evidence for the existence of gods, it is safe to assume that there are no gods. In the same way as it is safe to assume that there are no unicorn herds on Neptune. When someone provides evidence that there are unicorn herds on Neptune, I will believe in Unicom herds as n Neptune.

Just because there is no empirical evidence for God doesn't mean that he doesn't exist.

There are plenty of intelligent philosophical arguments proving the existence of God. How do you know for sure that God doesn't exist ?

Also children are born with natural belief in God, as proven by various studies. This shows that belief in God is biologically rooted and resonates with our deepest intuitions as human beings.

https://www.smh.com.au/national/infants-have-natural-belief-in-god-20080725-3l3b.html

 

[Technics 1210]

There no empirical evidence of Darwinian evolution, it is a untestable hypothesis, not science, but hijacked by Arhiests.

When Darwin put forward his hypothesis, it was based on the understanding that a cell was a mere black dot. Fast forward to today, and DNA alone disproves a materialistic universe - the cornerstone of Atheism

 

[szrana007]

Fast forward to today, and DNA alone disproves a materialistic universe

Yes, one can argue that the DNA is based on intelligent design, therefore its result of a creator.

 

[Technics 1210]

Yes, one can argue that the DNA is based on intelligent design, therefore its result of a creator.

Abiogenesis is another, it has given Athiests nightmares. They just cannot figure it out and rely on their God, chance.

 

[szrana007]

Abiogenesis is another, it has given Athiests nightmares. They just cannot figure it out and rely on their God, chance.

Scientists are yet to prove the origin of life, but atheists believe its all by accident. The universe is fine tuned for life but atheists think its all by chance. That to me is a bigger leap of faith than to believe in God.

 

[Technics 1210]

Scientists are yet to prove the origin of life, but atheists believe its all by accident. The universe is fine tuned for life but atheists think its all by chance. That to me is a bigger leap of faith than to believe in God.

Yup, the faith in chance require a bigger leap in faith.

Whats more, chance cannot be repeated by definition, therefore untestable, and not science.

There is a reason why Athiest scientists subscribed to the notion of a creator - fine tuning of the universe.

What is hillarious is that Athiests now push the multiverse nonsense just to justify a chances based universe.

 

[Robert]

Just because there is no empirical evidence for God doesn't mean that he doesn't exist.

There are plenty of intelligent philosophical arguments proving the existence of God. How do you know for sure that God doesn't exist ?

Also children are born with natural belief in God, as proven by various studies. This shows that belief in God is biologically rooted and resonates with our deepest intuitions as human beings.

https://www.smh.com.au/national/infants-have-natural-belief-in-god-20080725-3l3b.html

Of course not. Just as the lack of evidence for pink Neptune unicorns doesn’t mean there are none of those. I’ll believe in them when someone sends a probe past Neptune which sends back unicorn photos.

Clearly you didn’t read my point about negative propositions. You cannot prove that something is false, only that something else is true.

You misquote the article you posted. Kids may *develop* belief in gods early on, as they come to understand causation, but they need parents to identify the “correct” one(s). It doesn’t mean gods are real.

 

[Robert]

Scientists are yet to prove the origin of life, but atheists believe its all by accident. The universe is fine tuned for life but atheists think it’s all by chance. That to me is a bigger leap of faith than to believe in God.

Again this is a misunderstanding, of what you term chance. And you are mixing up two concepts - the universe as a whole, and life on one single small planet.

The Copenhagen Interpretation of Quantum Mechanics implies multiple universes. We just happen to be in one where the four forces are in a combination where the universe didn’t instantly implode in a Big Crunch just after the Big Bang, or instantly fly apart in a Big Rip.

Read Professor Dawkins on speciation. He will explain to you that chance is not a factor - natural selection kills off some mutations and favours others. Each generation builds on the one before. It’s an organising system - but a blind directionless one. Any gods creating such a system would be extremely inefficient. We might have as easily been intelligent horses or lizards as monkeys.

After four billion years, evolution came up with some very smart monkeys who can think about these concepts.

 

[KingKhanWC]

This only shows that you don't even know any atheists personally and your opinion is based on false propaganda.

I know plenty of people personally who will never seek help from a higher power because there's no such thing. None had ever presented any evidence for such an entity.

I have been in worse turbulences on flights. Instead of praying to a higher power and over stressing myself, I can relax and stay calm knowing that there is a robust science and technology that built the plane and thousands of hours of pilot training and experience that will keep the plane safe. When you know how things work, you don't rely on made up sources of peace. You trust science and humans.

This shows you are making foolish assumptions as you dont know me. Ive met plenty who dont believe in God when they are in serious trouble ie, family member ill, they will ask for help from a higher power.

I think you're lying.

 

[SalimBhai]

This only shows that you don't even know any atheists personally and your opinion is based on false propaganda.

I know plenty of people personally who will never seek help from a higher power because there's no such thing. None had ever presented any evidence for such an entity.

I have been in worse turbulences on flights. Instead of praying to a higher power and over stressing myself, I can relax and stay calm knowing that there is a robust science and technology that built the plane and thousands of hours of pilot training and experience that will keep the plane safe. When you know how things work, you don't rely on made up sources of peace. You trust science and humans.

I will second that. Same experience.

 

[Robert]

This only shows that you don't even know any atheists personally and your opinion is based on false propaganda.

I know plenty of people personally who will never seek help from a higher power because there's no such thing. None had ever presented any evidence for such an entity.

We don’t know that there is no such thing.

But due to the lack of evidence, it is safe to *assume* that there isn’t.

 

[szrana007]

Of course not. Just as the lack of evidence for pink Neptune unicorns doesn’t mean there are none of those. I’ll believe in them when someone sends a probe past Neptune which sends back unicorn photos.

Clearly you didn’t read my point about negative propositions. You cannot prove that something is false, only that something else is true.

You misquote the article you posted. Kids may *develop* belief in gods early on, as they come to understand causation, but they need parents to identify the “correct” one(s). It doesn’t mean gods are real.

Humans are hard wired for belief in God, that has been proven by various studies.

https://evolutionnews.org/2014/08/more_studies_sh/

The innate predisposition of the human mind is to believe that there is some kind of an intelligent creator God.

Here is an intelligent argument for God's existence

I invite you to do your research on the Kalam cosmological argument.

 

[The_Odd_One]

This shows you are making foolish assumptions as you dont know me. Ive met plenty who dont believe in God when they are in serious trouble ie, family member ill, they will ask for help from a higher power.

I think you're lying.

And how does it help? The chances of your prayers getting answered are 50/50 which are as good as not praying at all. It's doctors, nurses, and technicians who save patients. God does not save anyone. God cannot grow back an amputated leg. People who understand this simple fact of life do not pray to a fictional character.

 

[The_Odd_One]

We don’t know that there is no such thing.

But due to the lack of evidence, it is safe to *assume* that there isn’t.

Agreed. I have no reason to not believe in God if anyone can present an irrefutable evidence for his existence. Until then, there is no God.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Scientists are yet to prove the origin of life, but atheists believe its all by accident. The universe is fine tuned for life but atheists think its all by chance. That to me is a bigger leap of faith than to believe in God.

Then why do you have places like Antarctica? Why did God need to create a universe with billions of galaxies when humans needed a tiny planet to live on?

 

[KingKhanWC]

And how does it help? The chances of your prayers getting answered are 50/50 which are as good as not praying at all. It's doctors, nurses, and technicians who save patients. God does not save anyone. God cannot grow back an amputated leg. People who understand this simple fact of life do not pray to a fictional character.

Im surprised you are back tbh. Its been years since your daily attacks and frankly lies about Islam which were confronted easily.

The point isnt if the prayers come true but the very nature of offering.

A woman got stuck in a lift in China in a building site. When they opened , they saw claw/nail marks all over the lift, as of course the lady was desperate. Its frankly daft to suggest you in the same situation wouldn't ask for help from a higher power when about to suffer alone, die alone in a lift.

There is no such thing as an atheist for this reason and the 2nd reason being nobody can prove there is no god, so atheists are one of the most dumbest people around.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Im surprised you are back tbh. Its been years since your daily attacks and frankly lies about Islam which were confronted easily.

The point isnt if the prayers come true but the very nature of offering.

A woman got stuck in a lift in China in a building site. When they opened , they saw claw/nail marks all over the lift, as of course the lady was desperate. Its frankly daft to suggest you in the same situation wouldn't ask for help from a higher power when about to suffer alone, die alone in a lift.

There is no such thing as an atheist for this reason and the 2nd reason being nobody can prove there is no god, so atheists are one of the most dumbest people around.

Atheist don't have to prove anything. The burden of proof lies on person making the claim.

I'm surprised that you are not even aware of such a basic rule of logic.

I went to the moon last night. Now prove that I did not.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Atheist don't have to prove anything. The burden of proof lies on person making the claim.

I'm surprised that you are not even aware of such a basic rule of logic.

I went to the moon last night. Now prove that I did not.

I dont need to prove it, you're on a different planet/ on a daily basis.

People who believe in a Creator dont have to prove anything to anyone either. Do you really think I care about your life?

 

[Robert]

Humans are hard wired for belief in God, that has been proven by various studies.

The innate predisposition of the human mind is to believe that there is some kind of an intelligent creator God.

I don’t understand why you think this is significant. Humans instinctively look for patterns, even where no pattern exists. We have to do this in order to come up with some sort of internal working model of the world to navigate through it. I’d call it an evolutionary adaptation.

Here is an intelligent argument for God's existence

I invite you to do your research on the Kalam cosmological argument.

Ok, I looked it up. The basic argument appears to be:

1. Everything that begins to exist has a cause.
2. The universe began to exist.
3. Therefore, the universe has a cause.

Except that causality collapses (along with everything else) at a Singularity - such as that which existed at the Big Bang. Time didn’t exist, so there was no time for a cause to act during.

 

[Robert]

2nd reason being nobody can prove there is no god, so atheists are one of the most dumbest people around.

How many more times? At least I am smart enough to know that

You
Can’t
Prove
A
Negative
Proposition

 

[The_Odd_One]

I dont need to prove it, you're on a different planet/ on a daily basis.

People who believe in a Creator dont have to prove anything to anyone either. Do you really think I care about your life?

Yes, you have to prove it. When you get a speeding ticket, an evidence is provided to you that you were over speeding because the state makes a claim so the burden of proof lies on the entity making the claim.

That's how legal system works. The prosecutor has to convince the jury. The defendant does not even have to open his mouth.

You can believe in anything you want. It's your right but it does not make your belief true.

 

[KingKhanWC]

How many more times? At least I am smart enough to know that

You
Can’t
Prove
A
Negative
Proposition

THis isnt the 60's Robert.

The Creator is simply the one who created the Universe. With the tech today, prove the universe wasn't created.

Your arguments are something out of Dads army or Faulty towers mate.

 

[Technics 1210]

Lets put everything to side, the universe popped out of nothing.

This is the Athiest belief.

 

[The_Odd_One]

I don’t understand why you think this is significant. Humans instinctively look for patterns, even where no pattern exists. We have to do this in order to come up with some sort of internal working model of the world to navigate through it. I’d call it an evolutionary adaptation.



Ok, I looked it up. The basic argument appears to be:

1. Everything that begins to exist has a cause.
2. The universe began to exist.
3. Therefore, the universe has a cause.

Except that causality collapses (along with everything else) at a Singularity - such as that which existed at the Big Bang. Time didn’t exist, so there was no time for a cause to act during.

Then God must have a cause as well. Now if we make an assumption that God cannot have a cause then what stops us from having a simpler assumption that the universe has no cause.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Yes, you have to prove it. When you get a speeding ticket, an evidence is provided to you that you were over speeding because the state makes a claim so the burden of proof lies on the entity making the claim.

That's how legal system works. The prosecutor has to convince the jury. The defendant does not even have to open his mouth.

You can believe in anything you want. It's your right but it does not make your belief true.

Speeding ticket .

If I dont prove it , I will be fined.

IF I dont prove God, there is no difference.

Those who believe in the Creator are happy within themselves, they owe nobody any proof ,esp those who spread hate and lies on a daily basis.

You can of course prove Islam is wrong/false/immoral if you can.

I CHALLENGE you to start a thread on proving Islam wrong/incorrect. Bring Robert and Dads army with you.

 

[Technics 1210]

THis isnt the 60's Robert.

The Creator is simply the one who created the Universe. With the tech today, prove the universe wasn't created.

Your arguments are something out of Dads army or Faulty towers mate.

Physicists agree the universe was 'created'.

Theists are criticised for believing in a non entity, but that's ok we should believe the universe popped out of nothing instead.

On Earth, it is impossible to demonstrate something from nothing - Athiest logic falsified and destroyed without even leaving the Earth's atmosphere.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Speeding ticket .

If I dont prove it , I will be fined.

IF I dont prove God, there is no difference.

Those who believe in the Creator are happy within themselves, they owe nobody any proof ,esp those who spread hate and lies on a daily basis.

You can of course prove Islam is wrong/false/immoral if you can.

I CHALLENGE you to start a thread on proving Islam wrong/incorrect. Bring Robert and Dads army with you.

It looks like you have run out of arguments hence the childish smiley faces in every post.

As I said you are free to practice whatever religion you believe in. You don't have to justify it. However, you cannot make a bogus claim that your belief is better than anyone else's.

Proving Islam wrong is not difficult. A large number of people have done so. The mods will not allow such a thread as it may hurt the feelings of majority of the posters who are Muslim.

 

[Abel Reames]

You can of course prove Islam is wrong/false/immoral if you can.

Would you agree that sexual exploitation is immoral? If so what would you say about Allah God permitting sex with slaves as per the Quran?

 

[The_Odd_One]

Physicists agree the universe was 'created'.

Theists are criticised for believing in a non entity, but that's ok we should believe the universe popped out of nothing instead.

On Earth, it is impossible to demonstrate something from nothing - Athiest logic falsified and destroyed without even leaving the Earth's atmosphere.

Then who created God? By this logic, God cannot come from nothing as well. If he can then you have already discarded your own logic.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Would you agree that sexual exploitation is immoral? If so what would you say about Allah God permitting sex with slaves as per the Quran?

What about God torturing non believers for eternity ( think billion billion billion.. years) for a mistake committed in a life that didn't even last 100 years.

 

[KingKhanWC]

It looks like you have run out of arguments hence the childish smiley faces in every post.

As I said you are free to practice whatever religion you believe in. You don't have to justify it. However, you cannot make a bogus claim that your belief is better than anyone else's.

Proving Islam wrong is not difficult. A large number of people have done so. The mods will not allow such a thread as it may hurt the feelings of majority of the posters who are Muslim.

No I remember your daft arguments and 5 years later, they are the same which is amusing.

I can claim anything I want, no atheist will bother me.

You cant prove anything apart from your own hatred. Go for it , as long its a fair point there is no issue.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Would you agree that sexual exploitation is immoral? If so what would you say about Allah God permitting sex with slaves as per the Quran?

Only as Wives, meaning they have rights, while mistresses are normal in secular society. Heck a man can go have intimate relations with a prostitute legally here.

 

[Abel Reames]

What about God torturing non believers for eternity ( think billion billion billion.. years) for a mistake committed in a life that didn't even last 100 years.

What about God practising collective punishment and destroying whole cities/communities man/women and children because some individuals did naughty deeds?

 

[KingKhanWC]

What about God torturing non believers for eternity ( think billion billion billion.. years) for a mistake committed in a life that didn't even last 100 years.

When atheists with your mindset realise there is a Creator, that itself will be the worst torture. Besides you're not worried are you?

 

[KingKhanWC]

What about God practising collective punishment and destroying whole cities/communities man/women and children because some individuals did naughty deeds?

He is the Creator he is entitled to take or end what he created. Or do you think you're more powerful? lol

 

[KingKhanWC]

Physicists agree the universe was 'created'.

Theists are criticised for believing in a non entity, but that's ok we should believe the universe popped out of nothing instead.

On Earth, it is impossible to demonstrate something from nothing - Athiest logic falsified and destroyed without even leaving the Earth's atmosphere.

Some of these militant atheists are only versed from arguments from a hate site. Islam and science agrees where/how the Universe started.

 

[Abel Reames]

He is the Creator he is entitled to take or end what he created. Or do you think you're more powerful? lol

Of course he is entitled to do what he likes, just that collective punishment is immoral.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Only as Wives, meaning they have rights, while mistresses are normal in secular society. Heck a man can go have intimate relations with a prostitute legally here.

Sex with female slaves is allowed as per Quran and sahih Hadith. Prostitutes are not slaves. They can reject you without facing any consequences.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Sex with female slaves is allowed as per Quran and sahih Hadith. Prostitutes are not slaves. They can reject you without facing any consequences.

Lying through your teeth again.

Muslim men can only have sex with their wives.

 

[Abel Reames]

Only as Wives, meaning they have rights, while mistresses are normal in secular society. Heck a man can go have intimate relations with a prostitute legally here.

A master can have sex with slaves/concubines without marriage according to Islam.

 

[The_Odd_One]

What about God practising collective punishment and destroying whole cities/communities man/women and children because some individuals did naughty deeds?

100%

Strongly recommend Dan Barker's book: God the most unpleasant character in all fiction

 

[sweep_shot]

A master can have sex with slaves/concubines without marriage according to Islam.

Slavery has been abolished worldwide.

Islam actually encourages freeing of slaves.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Lying through your teeth again.

Muslim men can only have sex with their wives.

Oh my. Either your knowledge of Islam is extremely poor or you are lying blatantly.

Quran has a verse that allows it. Hadith books are full of accounts of companions having sex with slave girls.

Here's an Islamic website that confirms it.

https://islamqa.info/amp/en/answers/20802

 

[Technics 1210]

Some of these militant atheists are only versed from arguments from a hate site. Islam and science agrees where/how the Universe started.

They argue more from fear; an athiest is a walking talking example of compensation psychology.

The 4 known forces of the universe couldn't moves stones to built a pyramid let alone DNA and the biological cell. A 5th force is required, that force is intelligence - aka God.

But what do we get from Athiests? The universe popped out of nothing, multiverses which no one has ever observed, and life appeared through sheer luck - and these guys promote causation!

 

[The_Odd_One]

Lying through your teeth again.

Muslim men can only have sex with their wives.

Then can you explain this?

حَدَّثَنِي مُحَمَّدُ بْنُ بَشَّارٍ، حَدَّثَنَا رَوْحُ بْنُ عُبَادَةَ، حَدَّثَنَا عَلِيُّ بْنُ سُوَيْدِ بْنِ مَنْجُوفٍ، عَنْ عَبْدِ اللَّهِ بْنِ بُرَيْدَةَ، عَنْ أَبِيهِ ـ رضى الله عنه ـ قَالَ بَعَثَ النَّبِيُّ صلى الله عليه وسلم عَلِيًّا إِلَى خَالِدٍ لِيَقْبِضَ الْخُمُسَ وَكُنْتُ أُبْغِضُ عَلِيًّا، وَقَدِ اغْتَسَلَ، فَقُلْتُ لِخَالِدٍ أَلاَ تَرَى إِلَى هَذَا فَلَمَّا قَدِمْنَا عَلَى النَّبِيِّ صلى الله عليه وسلم ذَكَرْتُ ذَلِكَ لَهُ فَقَالَ ‏"‏ يَا بُرَيْدَةُ أَتُبْغِضُ عَلِيًّا ‏"‏‏.‏ فَقُلْتُ نَعَمْ‏.‏ قَالَ ‏"‏ لاَ تُبْغِضْهُ فَإِنَّ لَهُ فِي الْخُمُسِ أَكْثَرَ مِنْ ذَلِكَ ‏"‏‏.‏

Narrated Buraida: The Prophet (ﷺ) sent `Ali to Khalid to bring the Khumus (of the booty) and I hated `Ali, and `Ali had taken a bath (after a sexual act with a slave-girl from the Khumus). I said to Khalid, "Don't you see this (i.e. `Ali)?" When we reached the Prophet (ﷺ) I mentioned that to him. He said, "O Buraida! Do you hate `Ali?" I said, "Yes." He said, "Do you hate him, for he deserves more than that from the Khumlus."

Sahih al-Bukhari 4350
https://sunnah.com/bukhari:4350

 

[The_Odd_One]

Slavery has been abolished worldwide.

Islam actually encourages freeing of slaves.

Why encourage and not ban slavery? If Islam could ban alcohol, what was the issue with banning slavery?

 

[The_Odd_One]

Then can you explain this?

حَدَّثَنِي مُحَمَّدُ بْنُ بَشَّارٍ، حَدَّثَنَا رَوْحُ بْنُ عُبَادَةَ، حَدَّثَنَا عَلِيُّ بْنُ سُوَيْدِ بْنِ مَنْجُوفٍ، عَنْ عَبْدِ اللَّهِ بْنِ بُرَيْدَةَ، عَنْ أَبِيهِ ـ رضى الله عنه ـ قَالَ بَعَثَ النَّبِيُّ صلى الله عليه وسلم عَلِيًّا إِلَى خَالِدٍ لِيَقْبِضَ الْخُمُسَ وَكُنْتُ أُبْغِضُ عَلِيًّا، وَقَدِ اغْتَسَلَ، فَقُلْتُ لِخَالِدٍ أَلاَ تَرَى إِلَى هَذَا فَلَمَّا قَدِمْنَا عَلَى النَّبِيِّ صلى الله عليه وسلم ذَكَرْتُ ذَلِكَ لَهُ فَقَالَ ‏"‏ يَا بُرَيْدَةُ أَتُبْغِضُ عَلِيًّا ‏"‏‏.‏ فَقُلْتُ نَعَمْ‏.‏ قَالَ ‏"‏ لاَ تُبْغِضْهُ فَإِنَّ لَهُ فِي الْخُمُسِ أَكْثَرَ مِنْ ذَلِكَ ‏"‏‏.‏

Narrated Buraida: The Prophet (ﷺ) sent `Ali to Khalid to bring the Khumus (of the booty) and I hated `Ali, and `Ali had taken a bath (after a sexual act with a slave-girl from the Khumus). I said to Khalid, "Don't you see this (i.e. `Ali)?" When we reached the Prophet (ﷺ) I mentioned that to him. He said, "O Buraida! Do you hate `Ali?" I said, "Yes." He said, "Do you hate him, for he deserves more than that from the Khumlus."

Sahih al-Bukhari 4350
https://sunnah.com/bukhari:4350

Rasul Allah not only endorsed Ali's act but actually said that he deserved more.

 

[corleone]

A master can have sex with slaves/concubines without marriage according to Islam.

You say "according to Islam", do you mean the Qur'an? hadith? Please enlighten us.

 

[Abel Reames]

Why encourage and not ban slavery? If Islam could ban alcohol, what was the issue with banning slavery?

That would mean giving up no strings sex. They needed incentives for men to join Islam.

 

[Abel Reames]

You say "according to Islam", do you mean the Qur'an? hadith? Please enlighten us.

Both methinks tho Quran supercedes hadith. Surah 4 Verse 24. Summat about what the right hand posseses.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Rasul Allah not only endorsed Ali's act but actually said that he deserved more.

Hadiths must align with the Quran.

Im not here to educate you on each hadith.

I can simply post rebuttals or videos of rebuttals.

Im happy to debate but you ran off last time.

Can I ask why you are so extreme in attempting to criticise and hate Islam? What do you gain?

 

[Abel Reames]

You say "according to Islam", do you mean the Qur'an? hadith? Please enlighten us.

(4:24) And also forbidden to you are all married women (muhsanat) except those women whom your right hands have come to possess (as a result of war). This is Allah's decree and it is binding upon you.

 

[The_Odd_One]

You say "according to Islam", do you mean the Qur'an? hadith? Please enlighten us.

Muslims should really read their own books. Why do you think ISIS still follows the same practice of making female slaves?

https://islamqa.org/hanafi/askimam/29160/is-having-a-slave-girl-for-sex-nowdyas-is-allowed/

 

[Champ_Pal]

Lying through your teeth again.

Muslim men can only have sex with their wives.

Londi se mubashirat Jayaz hain!!

 

[The_Odd_One]

Hadiths must align with the Quran.

Im not here to educate you on each hadith.

I can simply post rebuttals or videos of rebuttals.

Im happy to debate but you ran off last time.

Can I ask why you are so extreme in attempting to criticise and hate Islam? What do you gain?

Why would you deny something that's in the Quran and Hadith? It's something that all scholars acknowledge. Don't post any rebuttal if you think I'm lying. Go to your local mosque and ask an Imam.

I see that your tone has changed. First you challenged me to prove Islam wrong. When I only touched on the matter of slavery, your feelings got hurt and you started calling me a hater.

I don't even hate Muslims because I know most are normal people who are busy with their every day life. However, when keyboard warriors like you should be exposed when they make false claims and ridicule others and their beliefs.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Why would you deny something that's in the Quran and Hadith? It's something that all scholars acknowledge. Don't post any rebuttal if you think I'm lying. Go to your local mosque and ask an Imam.

I see that your tone has changed. First you challenged me to prove Islam wrong. When I only touched on the matter of slavery, your feelings got hurt and you started calling me a hater.

I don't even hate Muslims because I know most are normal people who are busy with their every day life. However, when keyboard warriors like you should be exposed when they make false claims and ridicule others and their beliefs.

Anyone filled with hate of my faith only makes me giggle and make me feel sorry for them. Relax ,you cant hurt a fly.

You haven't exposed anything, delusions aren't real.

This is simple even for the EDL,RSS intelligence levels.

As I wrote earlier, they are not slaves, they have same rights as a wife.

 

[Abel Reames]

However, when keyboard warriors like you should be exposed when they make false claims and ridicule others and their beliefs.

These same people believe that Zues, Thor, Odin, Hanuman, Shiva etc are not real which would mean that they believe
people across cultures and throughout human history have been making up gods but _theirs_ is real.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Both methinks tho Quran supercedes hadith. Surah 4 Verse 24. Summat about what the right hand posseses.

Please watch the video, its simple enough for you.

You're another one whose posts on here are mostly anti-Islam. Why do you spend so much time attacking a faith? Please explain.

 

[Abel Reames]

Please watch the video, its simple enough for you.

Yes, he is justifying sex with captured women taken as slaves. If God was moral he could have said look after them like your mothers, sisters and daughters, not use them to satisfy battle lust.

If you say the west is no better, that they also rape during war or have relations with prostitution then Islam is no better.