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Virat Kohli's Test form - A cause for concern?

Tbh, Umar averaged 35 after his round of overseas tours. So he was not that bad as people make him out to be.

But in LOIs he has flopped I agree.
 
Suleiman said:
I honestly thought you and Sidilicious were the same person for the longest time.

I don't even know anymore.
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Although honestly I haven't been following Sidilicious' or any one's posts for that matter closely, but I am intrigued to know why you felt that we were the same person.
 
Statsman said:
Although honestly I haven't been following Sidilicious' or any one's posts for that matter closely, but I am intrigued to know why you felt that we were the same person.
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Neither have profile pictures

And somewhat similar name and similar views
 
Slog said:
He's been injured since May 2015

Even when he eventually returns he will have to start from scratch
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injured for an year?

These guys really need to up their fitness. Bowlers I understand, but batsmen shouldn't be down for so long.
 
He does not enjoy slow conditions a lot, that's one reason. Another and even bigger factor is Indian tracks that have been very hard to bat on.
 
The thread's been created. Now watch Virat Kohli score a magnificent double hundred :yk

There is a quote by someone at PP along these lines: "If you compare a lizard with Umar Akmal, it'd become a Godzilla" :))
 
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Slog said:
Neither have profile pictures

And somewhat similar name and similar views
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A lot of profiles don't have profile pictures, although I used to have one earlier (a smiling Courtney Walsh). Regarding views - why would I make another profile with "similar" views? :yk

Any way, Statsman is one and only...without any branches...since 2011 :srt
 
How many tests has umar even played to be compared to kohli. First let umer be part of pakistan test eleven then this thread will have any relevance.
 
Statsman said:
A lot of profiles don't have profile pictures, although I used to have one earlier (a smiling Courtney Walsh). Regarding views - why would I make another profile with "similar" views? :yk

Any way, Statsman is one and only...without any branches...since 2011 :srt
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Haha. Obviously I know you are different people
 
Sidilicious said:
i was really impressed by what I got to see from Haris in the WC match against India last year. Was hoping he'd do more.

Dissapointing to see he is fading away now.
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Players like Harris are one trick ponies .... After some great shots early in the innings MSD figured out his fav zones and blocked them off and thereafter he was struggling to rotate strike and fell straight into the typical MSD trap. The thing is in modern day cricket top teams will figure out your weaknesses and make life difficult. Sharjeel is another such player who will find it difficult to score against better teams.
 
Sachin136 said:
I've posted the stats here more times than I can count, but people still make statements like this.

Against non-minnows away from home (excluding Zimbabwe, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka and West Indies):

Kohli averages 48.84 with 7 centuries over 17 matches http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...orderby=default;template=results;type=batting

Williamson averages 40.02 with 5 centuries over 22 matches http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...orderby=default;template=results;type=batting

Root averages 41.84 with 1 century over 15 matches. http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...orderby=default;template=results;type=batting

Shafiq averages 36.25 with 2 centuries over 9 matches http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...orderby=default;template=results;type=batting

Azhar Ali averages 29.60 with 1 century over 13 matches http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...orderby=default;template=results;type=batting

If you include Sri Lanka, the difference is just as wide.

According to this, Kohli is a league above Williamson and Root, and you are comparing him with Shafiq and Azhar. His home record is behind the others but he doesn't have the luxury of being served flat pitches at home (for example, Azhar Ali averages 51.52 in the UAE and 29.60 away against non-minnows).
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9, 15, 17 matches are not enough to make a fair judgement on a player's ability. Did you also take into account that four of Kohli's 17 were played on extremely flat tracks, possibly the flattest of the last 20 years and that Smith looked like Bradman on them, with tailenders scoring fifties for fun?

Your stats are useless. Kohli is not as good as the Kane, Smith and Root trio and is instead a level below with Azhar and Shafiq.
 
His form is not a cause for concern, he's performing at his best.
 
Bilal7 said:
9, 15, 17 matches are not enough to make a fair judgement on a player's ability. Did you also take into account that four of Kohli's 17 were played on extremely flat tracks, possibly the flattest of the last 20 years and that Smith looked like Bradman on them, with tailenders scoring fifties for fun?

Your stats are useless. Kohli is not as good as the Kane, Smith and Root trio and is instead a level below with Azhar and Shafiq.
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If 20 matches are not enough to make a judgement, then what are you making your judgement on?
 
Firstly his numbers are rubbish as it is and stats are not the be and end all or Sachin would be the undisputed no.1 of all time when in reality he'd just about get into the top 10 and that's being extremely kind when you look at all his sawwf runs, was a greedy man who never played for India but himself.
 
Very good counterattacking 45 here. Seems like insignificant number but was scored on a minefield and helped India come out of uncertain situation
 
Chrish said:
Very good counterattacking 45 here. Seems like insignificant number but was scored on a minefield and helped India come out of uncertain situation
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Yep - class batsman.
 
Bilal7 said:
9, 15, 17 matches are not enough to make a fair judgement on a player's ability. Did you also take into account that four of Kohli's 17 were played on extremely flat tracks, possibly the flattest of the last 20 years and that Smith looked like Bradman on them, with tailenders scoring fifties for fun?

Your stats are useless. Kohli is not as good as the Kane, Smith and Root trio and is instead a level below with Azhar and Shafiq.
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These same tracks where kane scored one century in 3 games and Root 0 in 5 :))).
 
Hasan123 said:
These same tracks where kane scored one century in 3 games and Root 0 in 5 :))).
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To be fair, Root had to face a peak Johnson. I doubt Kohli would have done much better.

But Australian pitches have been like this for a while and no other touring batsman did as well as Kohli.
 
Sidilicious said:
i was really impressed by what I got to see from Haris in the WC match against India last year. Was hoping he'd do more.

Dissapointing to see he is fading away now.
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He scored 36 runs @ 4.5 an over, chasing a team target of 300 @ 6 an over. That raises the rate for the other batsmen to 6.29 an over. That is not impressive.
 
Kohli didn't allow Johnson togo into peak mode if youbat like a girl against Mitch, he was going to own you. Kohli and Rahane just walked out of the crease and smashed Mitch.

If you are going to play the "he wasnt in peak"thing, you can give excuse to Kohli's failure in England like Kohli wasnt mentally ready, it wasn't peak Kohli etc
 
Sachin136 said:
To be fair, Root had to face a peak Johnson. I doubt Kohli would have done much better.
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Or Johnson was not able to bowl well due to counter attacks? Is that a possibility?
 
Bilal7 said:
Neither of those batsmen played on pitches as flat as the ones Kohli received.



Maybe double the number of matches?
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You clearly haven't seen any of the matches you are talking about, if you think the pitches Williamson played on weren't as flat as the ones Kohli played on.

First match: Warner and Khawaja 150s, 556/4 dec. Second innings, centuries from Burns and Warner, 264/4 dec.

Second match: 250 from Warner and a century by Khawaja, 559/9 dec. 290 from Taylor and 160 from Williamson, 624 AO. Centuries from Smith and Voges, 385/7 dec.

Third test was the pink ball D/N test, where Williamson scored 22 and 9.

In the 13/14 Ashes, Haddin, Warner and Rogers scored 450+ runs, Clarke scored 360+ and Watson scored 340+.
 
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Williamson scored 2 centuries in 3 test series in Aus.He had a 140 in Brisbane and 160 in Perth and those two were completely flat pitches where Taylor also scored 290 in Perth test.

But still Williamson got value for piling runs in that series.Kohli also got value for his 4 100s in 4 tests in Aus.

Not accepting it won't change things.But he averages 45 and hence has some way to go to be called one of the top test batsmen in the world.
 
Bilal7 said:
Neither of those batsmen played on pitches as flat as the ones Kohli received.



Maybe double the number of matches?
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The pitches weren't that different. Stop being so bitter and biased. It wasn't as if the pitches that Root and Williamson were playing on were tank turners or impossible to score on.
 
Sachin136 said:
To be fair, Root had to face a peak Johnson. I doubt Kohli would have done much better.

But Australian pitches have been like this for a while and no other touring batsman did as well as Kohli.
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Kohli had to face Johnson one year later.

You still have to score the runs even if the pitches were a little flat
 
Napa said:
He scored 36 runs @ 4.5 an over, chasing a team target of 300 @ 6 an over. That raises the rate for the other batsmen to 6.29 an over. That is not impressive.
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Its not just the runs, it was the way he was doing it. Shehzad was the major culprit.
 
Hasan123 said:
The pitches weren't that different. Stop being so bitter and biased. It wasn't as if the pitches that Root and Williamson were playing on were tank turners or impossible to score on.
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You yourself just admitted that the pitches were different, smartass. No one is claiming that they were rank-turners before that series but it was easy to see that there was a difference when the same bowlers were so effective in one series and looked like fodder in the next.

Kane had to play a D/N test and are you also oblivious to the fact that D/N tests are played on green pitches?
 
Sachin136 said:
You clearly haven't seen any of the matches you are talking about, if you think the pitches Williamson played on weren't as flat as the ones Kohli played on.

First match: Warner and Khawaja 150s, 556/4 dec. Second innings, centuries from Burns and Warner, 264/4 dec.

Second match: 250 from Warner and a century by Khawaja, 559/9 dec. 290 from Taylor and 160 from Williamson, 624 AO. Centuries from Smith and Voges, 385/7 dec.

Third test was the pink ball D/N test, where Williamson scored 22 and 9.

In the 13/14 Ashes, Haddin, Warner and Rogers scored 450+ runs, Clarke scored 360+ and Watson scored 340+.
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The pitches before that Australia vs India series were much better than what the Aussie pitches have become since then. They were still flat but bowlers were encouraged by the boune and pace on offer. There was none of that in that infamous series and that is the reason everyone criticized those roads.

KW had to play a D/N test which made his task more difficult than Kohli's. Other than that, he did just as well as Kohli did, no?
 
His ton in Adelaide was on anything but flat wicket.

Some people I guess have a gift of looking at scoreboard to know exactly what was going on
 
Bilal7 said:
You yourself just admitted that the pitches were different, smartass. No one is claiming that they were rank-turners before that series but it was easy to see that there was a difference when the same bowlers were so effective in one series and looked like fodder in the next.

Kane had to play a D/N test and are you also oblivious to the fact that D/N tests are played on green pitches?
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Different yes but not impossible to score runs or anything. Stop trying to play down the achievement of scoring 4 centuries in 4 games vs Australia. Weather the pitches were flat or not to score that in Australia is a difficult achievement not many players score that in there whole career and virat did in 4 games so regardless weather the pitches where flat or not, his 4 centuries means he clearly out performed root and williamson.

Also the bowling attack was still a good one especially in home conditions.


Day/night test was one match anyway. It wasn't all 3.

Also in 2013 the pitches weren't that bad and you could score runs on them. So don't act like it was impossible for root not to score a single century in 5 games.
 
I am glad Kohli is failing on Indian wickets.

Otherwise, people would call him flat track bully (even though it is very difficult to bat on Indian wickets.)

I guess unless you score in England, nothing matters.
 
Hasan123 said:
Different yes but not impossible to score runs or anything. Stop trying to play down the achievement of scoring 4 centuries in 4 games vs Australia. Weather the pitches were flat or not to score that in Australia is a difficult achievement not many players score that in there whole career and virat did in 4 games so regardless weather the pitches where flat or not, his 4 centuries means he clearly out performed root and williamson.

Also the bowling attack was still a good one especially in home conditions.


Day/night test was one match anyway. It wasn't all 3.

Also in 2013 the pitches weren't that bad and you could score runs on them. So don't act like it was impossible for root not to score a single century in 5 games.
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You have a habit of constructing strawmen at every opportunity you get. No one said that it was impossible to score runs on Aussie pitches three-four years ago. I merely said that it has gotten a lot easier in recent times which is why even tailenders were smashing fifties against MJ and co during the Australia vs India series.

Williamson had a D/N test where he wasn't able to perform but he scored two centuries in the other two matches. Nothing to suggest that he couldn't have gotten four in four.

Kohli did outperform Root in Australia but I have an issue with people not taking into account the nature of the pitches in which Kohli scored those four centuries.
 
Bilal7 said:
You have a habit of constructing strawmen at every opportunity you get. No one said that it was impossible to score runs on Aussie pitches three-four years ago. I merely said that it has gotten a lot easier in recent times which is why even tailenders were smashing fifties against MJ and co during the Australia vs India series.

Williamson had a D/N test where he wasn't able to perform but he scored two centuries in the other two matches. Nothing to suggest that he couldn't have gotten four in four.

Kohli did outperform Root in Australia but I have an issue with people not taking into account the nature of the pitches in which Kohli scored those four centuries.
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"even tailenders were smashing fifties against MJ and co during the Australia vs India series."

Please get your facts right. No Indian tailender scored a 50 in that series (Ashwin scored one, but he is hardly a tailender).
 
Sachin136 said:
"even tailenders were smashing fifties against MJ and co during the Australia vs India series."

Please get your facts right. No Indian tailender scored a 50 in that series (Ashwin scored one, but he is hardly a tailender).
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MJ and co, as in MJ and the rest of the bowlers in that series. Unless you don't consider Indian bowlers as actual bowlers but for the sake of clarity, let's give them the benefit of the doubt here.
 
Bilal7 said:
MJ and co, as in MJ and the rest of the bowlers in that series. Unless you don't consider Indian bowlers as actual bowlers but for the sake of clarity, let's give them the benefit of the doubt here.
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You said that tailenders (obviously Indian ones, Australian tailenders can't score 50s against themselves) were scoring 50s against Johnson and the others. But if no Indian tailender scored a 50, how is your statement correct?
 
troodon said:
I am glad Kohli is failing on Indian wickets.

Otherwise, people would call him flat track bully (even though it is very difficult to bat on Indian wickets.)

I guess unless you score in England, nothing matters.
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Coz we dreeeeeeeeeew a series in England :)))
 
Sachin136 said:
You said that tailenders (obviously Indian ones, Australian tailenders can't score 50s against themselves) were scoring 50s against Johnson and the others. But if no Indian tailender scored a 50, how is your statement correct?
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I meant tailenders were scoring fifties in that series against MJ and the other bowlers. I didn't specify which ones. Are you totally out of ideas which is why you're being so petty?
 
Bilal7 said:
You have a habit of constructing strawmen at every opportunity you get. No one said that it was impossible to score runs on Aussie pitches three-four years ago. I merely said that it has gotten a lot easier in recent times which is why even tailenders were smashing fifties against MJ and co during the Australia vs India series.

Williamson had a D/N test where he wasn't able to perform but he scored two centuries in the other two matches. Nothing to suggest that he couldn't have gotten four in four.

Kohli did outperform Root in Australia but I have an issue with people not taking into account the nature of the pitches in which Kohli scored those four centuries.
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And you have a habit of being biased and getting personal when someone doesn't agree with your opnion.


The pitches weren't that much different bro. Over the last 3 / 4 years most Australian pitches have been flat. So Root failed in Australia. Whilst I don't think he will fail as badly again he won't get 4 centuries in 4 games vs Australia
 
Hasan123 said:
And you have a habit of being biased and getting personal when someone doesn't agree with your opnion.


The pitches weren't that much different bro. Over the last 3 / 4 years most Australian pitches have been flat. So Root failed in Australia. Whilst I don't think he will fail as badly again he won't get 4 centuries in 4 games vs Australia
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Don't make strawmen arguments, if you don't want to get called out for it.

The FACT of the matter is that they were different. They might be a little different, they might have been a lot different, I don't want to discuss this with you since you're just not prepared to face the truth of the matter. So as long as you agree that Kohli and Smith played on pitches different to the ones that Root played on, we don't have to discuss this any longer.

If he can play a match-winning innings and actually win his team a game, he won't cry that he couldn't score four centuries.
 
Bilal7 said:
I meant tailenders were scoring fifties in that series against MJ and the other bowlers. I didn't specify which ones. Are you totally out of ideas which is why you're being so petty?
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So basically the Aus pitches were flat since Aus tailenders scored against Indian bowlers.It being their home ground mind you.

Jeetan Patel,proper tailender almost scored 50 in this match,in alien conditions.Was this pitch super flat too?
 
Bilal7 said:
I meant tailenders were scoring fifties in that series against MJ and the other bowlers. I didn't specify which ones. Are you totally out of ideas which is why you're being so petty?
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Usually when people say something like MJ & co, they mean that bowler and his teammates. Not the opposition team bowlers. That's why I was confused.
 
2 effective knocks on a row.

Bailed his team out of trouble.

Good stuff.

Our ranking consolidation was on the line in this game so this was an important innings.

Still needs to improve. Could have got out twice today.
 
Excellent knock in testing conditions to get the first hundred of the series from either side. Nowadays, with so many variables, you are never truly in on Indian pitches. So all the more creditworthy.
 
Good stuff today. Put the game out of New Zealand's reach on day 1 itself. Should go on and get a big one tomorrow.
 
Bilal7 said:
Good stuff today. Put the game out of New Zealand's reach on day 1 itself. Should go on and get a big one tomorrow.
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Hopefully he gets atleast a 150 tomorrow if not more :D

Can expect a full house tomorrow being a Sunday and with two best batters of the team unbeaten.
 
Bilal7 said:
I meant tailenders were scoring fifties in that series against MJ and the other bowlers. I didn't specify which ones. Are you totally out of ideas which is why you're being so petty?
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Just in case you didn't know ... in cricket the way it works in bilateral Test series is that only 2 teams are involved ... and they cant switch teams or bowl to their own batsmen. So in this case when you say Mitch & Co means Aussie Bowlers and Tailenders implies opposition (Indian) lower order batsmen.

So all you need to do is post scorecards of matches were these 50s were scored ...
 
Tow back to back match changing knocks. Looked in form even in the last knock.
 
Bilal7 said:
You have a habit of constructing strawmen at every opportunity you get. No one said that it was impossible to score runs on Aussie pitches three-four years ago. I merely said that it has gotten a lot easier in recent times which is why even tailenders were smashing fifties against MJ and co during the Australia vs India series.
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Only tailenders to score 50s during India series were - Mitchell Starc and Mitchell Johnson

Tailenders to score 50 in Ashes were - Ryan Harris and Mitchell Johnson

Pitches might have been easier, but fifties by tailenders are hardly an indicator of that.
 
Buffet said:
Tow back to back match changing knocks. Looked in form even in the last knock.
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Yes I guess that knock may not have been a big one but has just set the tone for him. Hopefully he doesn't give it away tomorrow, he gets out after scoring 100 quite often, its a good thing he didn't bat much after crossing the milestone, he'll come out fresh tomorrow.
 
Can't keep a class player down for long . .
 
Kohli got a century.

Now I guess this should settle the debate as to whether the pitch is bowler friendly or a flat one...LOL..!!!
 
The King of Kings said:
the pitch is a phatta for this test. Did you even watch the game ?
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I didn't. I was quoting on the basis of comments made on the match thread as to how good a pitch it is. I accidentally posted it here and then couldn't delete due to time limit.

I am not for or against the batsmenship of Virat Kohli.
 
Bilal7 said:
I meant tailenders were scoring fifties in that series against MJ and the other bowlers. I didn't specify which ones. Are you totally out of ideas which is why you're being so petty?
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"and co" is short for "and company". One doesn't assume that bowlers of rival teams are "companions".

As [MENTION=134300]Tusker[/MENTION] would say "major wiggle incoming" :)
 
Tusker said:
Just in case you didn't know ... in cricket the way it works in bilateral Test series is that only 2 teams are involved ... and they cant switch teams or bowl to their own batsmen. So in this case when you say Mitch & Co means Aussie Bowlers and Tailenders implies opposition (Indian) lower order batsmen.

So all you need to do is post scorecards of matches were these 50s were scored ...
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I was referrring to all the bowlers, as a group, and all the tailenders, as a group. This has already been clarified earlier so you bringing this up now shows that you don't read before posting, which is an annoying habit.

AamchiMumbaikar said:
Hopefully he gets atleast a 150 tomorrow if not more :D

Can expect a full house tomorrow being a Sunday and with two best batters of the team unbeaten.
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Yeah, being able to score big when you're well-set is a quality that every great batsman has had.
 
Napa said:
"and co" is short for "and company". One doesn't assume that bowlers of rival teams are "companions".

As [MENTION=134300]Tusker[/MENTION] would say "major wiggle incoming" :)
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It is used to refer to a group and the bowlers playing in a match can be bunched together as a group. One doesn't need to assume when the point of contention has already been clarified.

Good try.
 
Don't rate dead rubber knocks tbh.. His 45 remains his highlight of the series.
 
Napa said:
"and co" is short for "and company". One doesn't assume that bowlers of rival teams are "companions".

As [MENTION=134300]Tusker[/MENTION] would say "major wiggle incoming" :)
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good call ... its Already happening ... see below :70:

Bilal7 said:
I was referrring to all the bowlers, as a group, and all the tailenders, as a group. This has already been clarified earlier so you bringing this up now shows that you don't read before posting, which is an annoying habit.
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Which nobody does as explained by [MENTION=142162]Napa[/MENTION] (opponents cannot be company) .... but Iam pretty sure this will have no effect on your burning desire to wiggle in order to be Right on a freakin forum.
 
WhenSultansBowled said:
The thread's been created. Now watch Virat Kohli score a magnificent double hundred :yk

There is a quote by someone at PP along these lines: "If you compare a lizard with Umar Akmal, it'd become a Godzilla" :))
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Not by 'someone', but by our own legend [MENTION=95766]leatherface58[/MENTION]
 
Tusker said:
good call ... its Already happening ... see below :70:



Which nobody does as explained by [MENTION=142162]Napa[/MENTION] (opponents cannot be company) .... but Iam pretty sure this will have no effect on your burning desire to wiggle in order to be Right on a freakin forum.
Click to expand...

I did so live with it, instead of clinging onto that one sentence like it's your life.
 
Vira haters egg faced as usual. Better to pull out all these threads after he retires, because as soon as he is questioned, there is always a hundred lurking around the corner.


giphy.gif


:bow:
 
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