Younis Khan: A better Test batsman than Rahul Dravid?

[TalentSpotterPk]

Very close at the moment.

Let the English, Aussie & NZ test tour end and than we will be able to judge better.

Wait 15 innings.

Khan isn't going anywhere.


Many times in last 4 years we thought he is gone but he rose again and stunned all.

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[MMHS]

Scores of 96, 51, 105, 92, 51 in the 10 innings that he played against Murali. The only time he failed was on the 2011 tour when Murali was no longer playing.

I don't understand what's the point here - he struggled against spinners in Asia & that's a fact. You are trying to make Bhaji stand-out which is not required here. As I already mentioned that playing finger spinners in AUS is different. And, he has a 123 & 140 against Bhajii as well, but in general, I felt him uncomfortable against finger spinners bringing ball in.

These are his 10 innings against Murali in SRL

96, 51, 1, 105*, 21, 28, 10, 27, 92, 20 ~ 450@ 50. And these Tests were played between 1999 to 2004, a period when, apart from Bradman, none ever has piled up such volume of runs - probably over 8K runs at around 75 average.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Scores of 96, 51, 105, 92, 51 in the 10 innings that he played against Murali. The only time he failed was on the 2011 tour when Murali was no longer playing.

Ponting avgs 48 in SL.So he hasnt struggled in SL.But he avgd only 26 in India and struggled massively vs Bhajji,but some people have trouble givin credit to Indian players,thats a different thing altogether.

 

[Ab Fan]

Did you mean outside of Asia? He surely has more than 4 overseas tons.

To be precise, just 4 centuries outside Asia excluding Zim as opponents.

 

[Ab Fan]

This is not even a comparision.YK is nowhere near Dravid as a batsman.YK is far behind Inzy who himself is behind Dravid by some distance.If YK had played the amount of tests Dravid did outside Asia i wonder if he would have avgd even 50.The guy just cant handle fast bowlers on a good pitch.

YK is certainly not far behind Inzy. He has a 173 vs England and a 149* vs NZ and also a century vs Steyn and Philander outside Asia.

 

[cricketjoshila]

YK is certainly not far behind Inzy. He has a 173 vs England and a 149* vs NZ and also a century vs Steyn and Philander outside Asia.

You are picking off single innings from here there.Sehwag has a century in ENG and SA againist very good attacks,that doesnt mean he doesnt struggle againist the moving ball.Except that century in SA where he only had 1 good innings he rest two innings came 10-12 years earlier.

YK is nowhere near Inzamam as a batsman.Not even close.

 

[Mamoon]

You are picking off single innings from here there.Sehwag has a century in ENG and SA againist very good attacks,that doesnt mean he doesnt struggle againist the moving ball.Except that century in SA where he only had 1 good innings he rest two innings came 10-12 years earlier.

YK is nowhere near Inzamam as a batsman.Not even close.

Pakistan doesn't have a great batting history but we have certainly produced far more skilled batsmen than Younis.

 

[big_gamer007]

Lol forgot this thread existed.. Like I said earlier if you do a poll a lot of Pakistani's would chose Dravid over YK in their team but NO INDIAN would ever chose YK over Dravid in their team... This gives you the answer so you can close this thread out...

 

[Hitman]

Dravid was struggling before England series. He wanted to retire after England tour but after the successful tour he thought it would be too selfish to retire when the team needed him, so he went on AU's tour and when he failed there he decided to hang his boots in a very dignified manner. Didn't ask for a farewell series in front of his home crowd.

You think the BCCI would have granted him one if he asked for it?

 

[LastManstanding]

You think the BCCI would have granted him one if he asked for it?

You are right. Farewell series are generally arranged for certain players who play for records and choose IPL over international matches.

 

[Hitman]

You are right. Farewell series are generally arranged for certain players who play for records and choose IPL over international matches.

Not really. Farewell series are arranged for players who have earned it. Players who are loved beyond death by fans in their country. Players who have attained universal acclaim beyond belief, the ones who are counted among the very best ever to have ever laced up a pair of boots. Players whom their boards revere and respect more than any other player from their country. Players whose retirement brought their country to a still, and became the biggest news of his country at that time.

Any other player asking for a farewell series would result in people and the BCCI laughing at that certain player's request.

 

[Hitman]

You are right. Farewell series are generally arranged for certain players who play for records and choose IPL over international matches.

Also, players whose retirement makes International channels like the BCCI run programs like below -

 

[Bonafide Hustler]

This is a ridiculous proposition. Khan isn't in the same class as Dravid. It isn't about the statistics, Dravid time and time again used to stand up against tough bowling attacks when it counted most, even when other batting greats around him used to fail. I would pick Dravid over Younis in my side any day, on any track against any attack.

 

[LastManstanding]

Not really. Farewell series are arranged for players who have earned it. Players who are loved beyond death by fans in their country. Players who have attained universal acclaim beyond belief, the ones who are counted among the very best ever to have ever laced up a pair of boots. Players whom their boards revere and respect more than any other player from their country. Players whose retirement brought their country to a still, and became the biggest news of his country at that time.

Any other player asking for a farewell series would result in people and the BCCI laughing at that certain player's request.

Also, the players who put their centuries ahead of their team's win, the players who got a fit when asked to change their favourite batting position, the players who started sulking in the public when their captain declared the innings before they could reach a milestone.

It is absolutely fitting that public would laugh at other players who play for the team without caring for their statistics. After all such players aren't good role models for the youngsters, aspiring cricketers should try to emulate great cricketers who choose $ over country. That's how you get BBC to run documentaries for you.

 

[Smbhayi]

.

That was an unnecessary rant. so here's my bit of it.
BCCI was forced arrange thattikkoot series against poor Windies bcz someone scared to play against SA

 

[Hitman]

Also, the players who put their centuries ahead of their team's win, the players who got a fit when asked to change their favourite batting position, the players who started sulking in the public when their captain declared the innings before they could reach a milestone.

It is absolutely fitting that public would laugh at other players who play for the team without caring for their statistics. After all such players aren't good role models for the youngsters, aspiring cricketers should try to emulate great cricketers who choose $ over country. That's how you get BBC to run documentaries for you.

Errr ... opinions are like noses, everyone has one. Millions and millions of people believe otherwise. Yet the said player got a farewell like no other player has ever got in history. Why? Did he ask for it? Nope, he was complimented with it by the cricketing world? Why? Could it be that he was v.v. special and no other player even remotely comes across him in terms of stature? I mean his retirement almost brought his country to a still, didn't it? Why is that his no one from his country got even 1% of the epic farewell that he got?

 

[Hitman]

That was an unnecessary rant. so here's my bit of it.
BCCI was forced arrange thattikkoot series against poor Windies bcz someone scared to play against SA

That certain player averages 48 in SA, unlike a certain snail that averages 29 in SA.

 

[Smbhayi]

That certain player averages 48 in SA, unlike a certain snail that averages 29 in SA.

and yet he scared to land there nah.
I mean for last tour.

 

[James]

Perhaps the answer to this question is to be found by comparing Khan's last tour of England (this one - totally abject thus far), to Dravid's last tour of England where he played like Graeme Pollock for 4 Tests despite his team throwing in the towel half way through the series at Trent Bridge and then constantly disintegrating around him.

 

[LastManstanding]

Errr ... opinions are like noses, everyone has one. Millions and millions of people believe otherwise. Yet the said player got a farewell like no other player has ever got in history. Why? Did he ask for it? Nope, he was complimented with it by the cricketing world? Why? Could it be that he was v.v. special and no other player even remotely comes across him in terms of stature? I mean his retirement almost brought his country to a still, didn't it?

Yes he asked for it. He got bcci to change the venue from Kolkata to Mumbai. And the same wankhade crowd booed him fee years ago. People are fickle, their opinions and sentiments keep on changing with time. Rajni fans put him on a even higher pedestal than Sachin fans and same with modi bhakts. Does that mean they are better than others in their respective fields?

And fans like you consider their patriotic duty to defend the honour of their beloved heroes on internet forums. You know how irritating it gets?

 

[Abhilash93]

I don't understand what's the point here - he struggled against spinners in Asia & that's a fact. You are trying to make Bhaji stand-out which is not required here. As I already mentioned that playing finger spinners in AUS is different. And, he has a 123 & 140 against Bhajii as well, but in general, I felt him uncomfortable against finger spinners bringing ball in.

These are his 10 innings against Murali in SRL

96, 51, 1, 105*, 21, 28, 10, 27, 92, 20 ~ 450@ 50. And these Tests were played between 1999 to 2004, a period when, apart from Bradman, none ever has piled up such volume of runs - probably over 8K runs at around 75 average.

He has scores of 76, 43, 141, 7, 44, 150 against Pakistan in Asia. So how did Ponting 'fail in Asia' ?

 

[Hitman]

and yet he scared to land there nah.

The one who averaged 88 with 2 centuries in 3 Tests the last time he toured there in 2011? Yeah sure, whatever helps you sleep better at night.

 

[Rightarmfast]

I think most of the posters here are quite young.They really havent seen Inzy at his best. I have watched him from the day he made his debut, and man, what a player he was. Pure class! Being an Indian, we still used to love Inzy, always. If anyone on this forum thinks YK is better than Inzy, I would pity him! Coz clearly, they havent watched the best of Inzy. If you have to compare, compare Inzy with Dravid or Sachin, Not YK

 

[Hitman]

Yes he asked for it. He got bcci to change the venue from Kolkata to Mumbai. And the same wankhade crowd booed him fee years ago. People are fickle, their opinions and sentiments keep on changing with time. Rajni fans put him on a even higher pedestal than Sachin fans and same with modi bhakts. Does that mean they are better than others in their respective fields?

BTW, has Rajni acclaimed universal acclaim by his peers? The said player has received more acclaim from his peers and the cricketing world than other players would earn in another 100 lives. He earned them, didn't demand them. Why do you think other players couldn't attract such acclaim?

And fans like you consider their patriotic duty to defend the honour of their beloved heroes on internet forums. You know how irritating it gets?

Excuse me, Sir. It was you who started this unnecessarily. Don't put the blame on me. It's you who made the snide remark in order to feed you ego and glorify your hero.

 

[Abhilash93]

And, he has a 123 & 140 against Bhajii as well, but in general, I felt him uncomfortable against finger spinners bringing ball in.

No, he has only 1 century in 14 Tests in India. And that was on his fifth tour in 2008 when he scored 123 in Bangalore.

 

[LastManstanding]

BTW, has Rajni acclaimed universal acclaim by his peers? The said player has received more acclaim from his peers and the cricketing world than other players would earn in another 100 lives. He earned them, didn't demand them. Why do you think other players couldn't attract such acclaim?



Excuse me, Sir. It was you who started this unnecessarily. Don't put the blame on me. It's you who made the snide remark in order to feed you ego and glorify your hero.

Dravid doesn't need me to glorify him. Anybody who understands cricket knows what he has achieved in his career. Its just some insecure fans like you who can't take anything written against your hero and will use all sort of absurd logic and arguments to defend his honour.

 

[cricketjoshila]

You think the BCCI would have granted him one if he asked for it?

He and VVS were both offered one againist NZ at home

 

[Hitman]

Dravid doesn't need me to glorify him. Anybody who understands cricket knows what he has achieved in his career. Its just some insecure fans like you who can't take anything written against your hero and will use all sort of absurd logic and arguments to defend his honour.

Then why exactly were you going gaga over him in a thread related to Younis Khan unnecessarily? And what absurd logic and arguments from my side? The simple fact that Sachin has acclaimed more acclaim from his peers and the cricketing world burns up insecure Dravid fans like yourself to death. And that's the reason why you often feel the need to degrade Sachin in order to praise your hero. Sachin fans never have to bring in Dravid's name or degrade him in order to praise their hero. Why exactly were you bringing Sachin in your post while trying to glorify your hero? If that's not insecurity than what is it?

 

[marlonbrowndo]

Lol some Sachin obsessed fans are even arguing with other Indians on a thread about Rahul Dravid.... Dravid was way less selfish than Sachin if that is the argument.

 

[LastManstanding]

Then why exactly were you going gaga over him in a thread related to Younis Khan unnecessarily? And what absurd logic and arguments from my side? The simple fact that Sachin has acclaimed more acclaim from his peers and the cricketing world burns up insecure Dravid fans like yourself to death. And that's the reason why you often feel the need to degrade Sachin in order to praise your hero. Sachin fans never have to bring in Dravid's name or degrade him in order to praise their hero. Why exactly were you bringing Sachin in your post while trying to glorify your hero? If that's not insecurity than what is it?

Insecurity is not able to tolerate anything written against your hero. And what did I say wrong in the first place? That he didn't want a farewell series in front of his home crowd? Why did you get hurt? And it was you who started all that "would be laughed at by bcci and fans" rubbish.

And what's wrong if I consider Dravid to be more dedicated than Sachin? Can't a person have different opinion?

 

[Hitman]

Insecurity is not able to tolerate anything written against your hero. And what did I say wrong in the first place? That he didn't want a farewell series in front of his home crowd? Why did you get hurt? And it was you who started all that "would be laughed at by bcci and fans" rubbish.

And what's wrong if I consider Dravid to be more dedicated than Sachin? Can't a person have different opinion?

Of course you can consider Dravid better. But you don't necessarily have to degrade Sachin order to do so, which is the trademark of you Dravid fans.

 

[LastManstanding]

Of course it's not your problem. But that does show who's the insecure and bitter one, LOL.

Oh the irony of Hitman calling someone else insecure.

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[Ab Fan]

You are picking off single innings from here there.Sehwag has a century in ENG and SA againist very good attacks,that doesnt mean he doesnt struggle againist the moving ball.Except that century in SA where he only had 1 good innings he rest two innings came 10-12 years earlier.

YK is nowhere near Inzamam as a batsman.Not even close.

Inzi was no ATG either. But he has well rounded record against good teams everywhere although failed vs top teams like Aus and SA . Inzi, Sehwag and Yoni are all comparable. The likes of Dravid and Miandad are a notch ahead though.

 

[street cricketer]

Dravid is in a different league.

I rate Inzi and Laxman better than Younis. He is a very good batsman and will be in my team in Asia, but not even close to being Pakistan's best ever batsman.

 

[Bewal Express]

YK is a good batsman but an Atg he isn't. I find his meltdown bizarre, and I am not on about his loss form which is part of the game but the pointless jumping around like a nervous 20 year making his debut.

 

[Prince_]

He's on par with dravid. His ability to play spin is second to none.......... A true legend of the game.

 

[Smbhayi]

The one who averaged 88 with 2 centuries in 3 Tests the last time he toured there in 2011? Yeah sure, whatever helps you sleep better at night.

then why he retired before SA series? (he clearly said that he wanted to play SA series). and how Windies tour comes from nowhere?

 

[Hitman]

then why he retired before SA series? (he clearly said that he wanted to play SA series). and how Windies tour comes from nowhere?

Maybe because every player has to retire at a time and there'll be a certain series scheduled for his team after he retires.

The bigger question is whether the said player averages 48 in that certain country or whether he averages a laughable 29 in that country

 

[MMHS]

No, he has only 1 century in 14 Tests in India. And that was on his fifth tour in 2008 when he scored 123 in Bangalore.

I know, the other one is either at Adelaide or SCG. I didn't mention those centuries in India.

 

[Hitman]

Oh the irony of Hitman calling someone else insecure.

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BTW, a team man who played for his team with a wonderful strike rate of 40 odd, compared to a selfish player who played for himself at a strike rate of a bare 55 odd. What a wonderful team man

 

[Big Mac]

Dravid is too good for a farewell tour, doesn't need one to remind fans that he is a legend.

Apparently he is also too good for a PP smiley :dravid:

 

[cricketjoshila]

BTW, a team man who played for his team with a wonderful strike rate of 40 odd, compared to a selfish player who played for himself at a strike rate of a bare 55 odd. What a wonderful team man

I dont know if you are trolling here or what.

 

[Hitman]

I dont know if you are trolling here or what.

Didn't he play with a tremendous strike of 41 odd? Or I'm I lying?

 

[cricketjoshila]

Didn't he play with a tremendous strike of 41 odd? Or I'm I lying?

He had a role in the team and he fulfilled it.SR is of little use in Tests and esp when the rest of the team is filled with stroke players.

 

[LastManstanding]

Dravid is too good for a farewell tour, doesn't need one to remind fans that he is a legend.

Apparently he is also too good for a PP smiley :dravid:

That's the sad part. Even Sreeshant has one.

 

[Tera Gawaandi]

[MENTION=133315]Hitman[/MENTION] and [MENTION=139682]LastManstanding[/MENTION] - You both have ruined this thread. Start your own thread.

On topic - If Younus Khan fails on this England tour and upcoming NZ/Australia tour then very few will rate him above Rahul Dravid, majority will see them as equals. Still best batsmen produced by Pakistan.

 

[cricketjoshila]

[MENTION=133315]Hitman[/MENTION] and [MENTION=139682]LastManstanding[/MENTION] - You both have ruined this thread. Start your own thread.

On topic - If Younus Khan fails on this England tour and upcoming NZ/Australia tour then very few will rate him above Rahul Dravid, majority will see them as equals. Still best batsmen produced by Pakistan.

YK equal to Dravid and best batsman from Pakistan?Really?

 

[greatone]

This is the most reasonable opinion displayed here. Younis is currently below Dravid but a great 2016 will see him overtake 'The Wall'.

You were saying?

 

[greatone]

BTW, a team man who played for his team with a wonderful strike rate of 40 odd, compared to a selfish player who played for himself at a strike rate of a bare 55 odd. What a wonderful team man

Disgusting to see someone throwing mud at Dravid. Both Dravid and Sachin made our country proud. We should respect them both.

 

[giri26]

Don't want to wait for anything. Younis is a very good player and for sure is a Pakistani great. I don't think he has matched Dravid's performance in his career so far. He is at the end of his career, so don't think he can surpass him anymore. Dravid was a brilliant player and even on his last England tour, he played brilliantly scoring 3 hundreds.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Tendulkar, Dravid, Ponting, Kallis, and Lara were 5 greatest test batsmen of the last 25 years.None else comes even close to them.

 

[Buffet]

Tendulkar, Dravid, Ponting, Kallis, and Lara were 5 greatest test batsmen of the last 25 years.None else comes even close to them.

Sanga is behind Kallis/Dravid, but not that far behind.

 

[greatone]

Sanga is behind Kallis/Dravid, but not that far behind.

Steve Waugh?

 

[The_Odd_One]

Sanga is behind Kallis/Dravid, but not that far behind.

I forgot Sanga. Later in his career, he was as good as any of these batsmen. Manhandled chucker Ajmal when he was destroying batting units left and right.

 

[TalentSpotterPk]

Let his Test Career finish. Than we will talk.

 

[geraltofrivia]

Younis is a good batsman and an asian great but he's not an ATG. Pakistan have not really had an ATG batsman. Miandad is good but then again he failed in Aus and WI and averages 46 outside Asia.

Inzy, Moyo, Younis, Sehwag, Mahela are all same level. Dravid, SRT, Gavaskar are ATGs. Sanga, Miandad a level between?

Averages outside Asia

SRT - 50.9
Dravid - 53.13
Gavaskar - 51.57

Inzy - 44.18
Younis - 38.61
MoYo - 44.11
Misbah - 38.03

What is worrying about Pakistan is that after these guys not a single good Pakistani batsman has debuted. Ali/Shafiq are decent but they are not at the YK/MoYo level (50 overall, 40 outside Asia) forget ATG level.

Outside Asia their averages are
Ali - 29
Shafiq - 27

In comparison
Kohli - 48.3
Rahane - 52.13

 

[Hasan123]

Tendulkar, Dravid, Ponting, Kallis, and Lara were 5 greatest test batsmen of the last 25 years.None else comes even close to them.

What about Steve Waugh? Guy was clutch and was soo good under pressure. If I could choose anyone to bat in a difficult test match spell I would take Waugh

 

[Adil_94]

Dravid was a top tier Test Match Batsman. Younis is not near that level.

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[Buffet]

Steve Waugh?

I rate him highly, but he is a notch below Greg, Ponting & Border for me.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Younis is a good batsman and an asian great but he's not an ATG. Pakistan have not really had an ATG batsman. Miandad is good but then again he failed in Aus and WI and averages 46 outside Asia.

Inzy, Moyo, Younis, Sehwag, Mahela are all same level. Dravid, SRT, Gavaskar are ATGs. Sanga, Miandad a level between?

Averages outside Asia

SRT - 50.9
Dravid - 53.13
Gavaskar - 51.57

Inzy - 44.18
Younis - 38.61
MoYo - 44.11
Misbah - 38.03

What is worrying about Pakistan is that after these guys not a single good Pakistani batsman has debuted. Ali/Shafiq are decent but they are not at the YK/MoYo level (50 overall, 40 outside Asia) forget ATG level.

Outside Asia their averages are
Ali - 29
Shafiq - 27

In comparison
Kohli - 48.3
Rahane - 52.13

This is a fair assessment. However, I do not agree on Miandad. He was as good as any other batsman of his time and is highly rated by almost everybody who played against him.

 

[TalentSpotterPk]

Younis is a good batsman and an asian great but he's not an ATG. Pakistan have not really had an ATG batsman. Miandad is good but then again he failed in Aus and WI and averages 46 outside Asia.

Inzy, Moyo, Younis, Sehwag, Mahela are all same level. Dravid, SRT, Gavaskar are ATGs. Sanga, Miandad a level between?

Averages outside Asia

SRT - 50.9
Dravid - 53.13
Gavaskar - 51.57

Inzy - 44.18
Younis - 38.61
MoYo - 44.11
Misbah - 38.03

What is worrying about Pakistan is that after these guys not a single good Pakistani batsman has debuted. Ali/Shafiq are decent but they are not at the YK/MoYo level (50 overall, 40 outside Asia) forget ATG level.

Outside Asia their averages are
Ali - 29
Shafiq - 27

In comparison
Kohli - 48.3
Rahane - 52.13

Good Post Brother. Informative.


Ali's Average won't go above 35-36 outside Asia.

Shafiq's Average should go above 40 outside Asia.

Misbah's Average & Younis's Average may go above 40 provided they have a Good Last Test vs England and Good tour of Australia.


Rahane has a good chance of joining Kohli, Root, Smith & Williamson Club.

 

[The_Odd_One]

What about Steve Waugh? Guy was clutch and was soo good under pressure. If I could choose anyone to bat in a difficult test match spell I would take Waugh

Steve Waugh was an amazing batsman who scored runs consistently but he never really peaked like the names I mentioned.

Players like Tendulkar, Dravid, Ponting, Kallis, Lara, and Sanga had insane stats at one time. If I am not mistaken, they all averaged 57+ at one point in their careers. Waugh mostly averaged between 49 and 51.

 

[Hasan123]

Steve Waugh was an amazing batsman who scored runs consistently but he never really peaked like the names I mentioned.

Players like Tendulkar, Dravid, Ponting, Kallis, Lara, and Sanga had insane stats at one time. If I am not mistaken, they all averaged 57+ at one point in their careers. Waugh mostly averaged between 49 and 51.

Waugh isn't better than Sachin and Lara, but in pressure situations he was one of the best. I think because he wasn't good to watch is what puts people off rating him higher.

 

[greatone]

I rate him highly, but he is a notch below Greg, Ponting & Border for me.

I was talking about the greatest batsmen of the last 25 years post.

 

[TalentSpotterPk]

So

Miandad 46

Inzamamam 44.18

Yousuf 44.11

Younis 38.61

Misbah 38.03

Azhar 29

Shafiq 27



Saaed Anwar ?

Amir Sohail ?

Shoaib Mohammad ?

Hanif Mohammad ?

Zaheer Abbass ?

Ijaz Ahmed ?

Mohammad Hafeez ?

 

[geraltofrivia]

So

Miandad 46

Inzamamam 44.18

Yousuf 44.11

Younis 38.61

Misbah 38.03

Azhar 29

Shafiq 27



Saaed Anwar ?

Amir Sohail ?

Shoaib Mohammad ?

Hanif Mohammad ?

Zaheer Abbass ?

Ijaz Ahmed ?

Mohammad Hafeez ?

Saaed Anwar - 43

Amir Sohail - 33

Shoaib Mohammad - 37

Hanif Mohammad - 42

Zaheer Abbass - 38

Ijaz Ahmed - 37

Mohammad Hafeez - 16 lol

 

[Ab Fan]

What about Steve Waugh? Guy was clutch and was soo good under pressure. If I could choose anyone to bat in a difficult test match spell I would take Waugh

Waugh is very underraed player.He was one of rare Aussies player to have better away record than home. A clutch player and batted in a very tough era.He is definitely up there wih Dravid and Kallis as an ATG test batsmen.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Waugh isn't better than Sachin and Lara, but in pressure situations he was one of the best. I think because he wasn't good to watch is what puts people off rating him higher.

Not always, Waugh's 3rd and 4th innings averages are not that great and he was not that great player of spin either.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

Steve Waugh was an amazing batsman who scored runs consistently but he never really peaked like the names I mentioned.

Players like Tendulkar, Dravid, Ponting, Kallis, Lara, and Sanga had insane stats at one time. If I am not mistaken, they all averaged 57+ at one point in their careers. Waugh mostly averaged between 49 and 51.

Except Lara.

All others averaged 56-57-58 with big sample sets (100+ tests).

Till 1995...after 30 tests, Lara was averaging 60.

After that he dropped.

 

[Ab Fan]

Except Lara.

All others averaged 56-57-58 with big sample sets (100+ tests).

Till 1995...after 30 tests, Lara was averaging 60.

After that he dropped.

yes and that 60 avg reached because of 375 he made and form he was in.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

yes and that 60 avg reached because of 375 he made and form he was in.

Uptil that point Lara was super insane beast.

Mad mad fellow.

Then got inconsistent.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Except Lara.

All others averaged 56-57-58 with big sample sets (100+ tests).

Till 1995...after 30 tests, Lara was averaging 60.

After that he dropped.

Yes but remember that Lara was considered the greatest test batsman in the world by the end of 1999 by a large number of fans.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

Yes but remember that Lara was considered the greatest test batsman in the world by the end of 1999 by a large number of fans.

I was talking about stats and the Waugh discussion going on. His legacy is well known.

 

[Buffet]

Steve Waugh was an amazing batsman who scored runs consistently but he never really peaked like the names I mentioned.

Players like Tendulkar, Dravid, Ponting, Kallis, Lara, and Sanga had insane stats at one time. If I am not mistaken, they all averaged 57+ at one point in their careers. Waugh mostly averaged between 49 and 51.

More noteworthy was gun averages after lots of tests. That gets very difficult to maintain.

55+ average after 100+ tests.

SRT after 177 tests - - 56.96

Dravid after 109 tests - - 57.46

Ponting after 132 test - 56.68

Kallis after 160 tests - 56.73


Lara was a bit different here because after 50 tests , he never got to 55+ average any time. I think it's very hard to average 55+ after 100 tests. Sanga also had 55+ average after playing lots of tests. I rate him below those 5, but still it's not easy to maintain 55+ average after playing 100+ tests.

I wasn't really ranking batsmen here by this stat, but just piggybacking on your earlier point here. Often in PP, folks ignore longevity, but it's extremely hard to maintain high standards with a very large sample size. 160 Tests for Kallis and 177 tests for SRT with 55+ average is extremely difficult irrespective of your talent level.

 

[The_Odd_One]

I was talking about stats and the Waugh discussion going on. His legacy is well known.

I was talking about their peaks. Lara at his peak was one of the greatest batsman people had ever watched. Steve Waugh never had such peak which put people in awe.

 

[The_Odd_One]

More noteworthy was gun averages after lots of tests. That gets very difficult to maintain.

55+ average after 100+ tests.

SRT after 177 tests - - 56.96

Dravid after 109 tests - - 57.46

Ponting after 132 test - 56.68

Kallis after 160 tests - 56.73


Lara was a bit different here because after 50 tests , he never got to 55+ average any time. I think it's very hard to average 55+ after 100 tests. Sanga also had 55+ average after playing lots of tests. I rate him below those 5, but still it's not easy to maintain 55+ average after playing 100+ tests.

I wasn't really ranking batsmen here by this stat, but just piggybacking on your earlier point here. Often in PP, folks ignore longevity, but it's extremely hard to maintain high standards with a very large sample size. 160 Tests for Kallis and 177 tests for SRT with 55+ average is extremely difficult irrespective of your talent level.

That's why it annoys me a lot when someone says Kallis scored soft runs. We are talking about someone who has scored 45 test centuries.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

I was talking about their peaks. Lara at his peak was one of the greatest batsman people had ever watched. Steve Waugh never had such peak which put people in awe.

Yeah....true.

 

[Buffet]

I was talking about the greatest batsmen of the last 25 years post.

Well, he played a decent part of his career outside of that period. Others had pretty much entire career within 25 years.

 

[street cricketer]

Younis is a good batsman and an asian great but he's not an ATG. Pakistan have not really had an ATG batsman. Miandad is good but then again he failed in Aus and WI and averages 46 outside Asia.

Inzy, Moyo, Younis, Sehwag, Mahela are all same level. Dravid, SRT, Gavaskar are ATGs. Sanga, Miandad a level between?

Averages outside Asia

SRT - 50.9
Dravid - 53.13
Gavaskar - 51.57

Inzy - 44.18
Younis - 38.61
MoYo - 44.11
Misbah - 38.03

What is worrying about Pakistan is that after these guys not a single good Pakistani batsman has debuted. Ali/Shafiq are decent but they are not at the YK/MoYo level (50 overall, 40 outside Asia) forget ATG level.

Outside Asia their averages are
Ali - 29
Shafiq - 27

In comparison
Kohli - 48.3
Rahane - 52.13

Missed Laxman in the list.

 

[greatone]

Well, he played a decent part of his career outside of that period. Others had pretty much entire career within 25 years.

But i don't think he did much in the 80s.