Does one always need the girl on his side for arranged marriages today?

[Savak]

All my life my parents and elders raised me to believe that all a guy has to do whenever he fancies someone is to just tell his parents and that they will go the girls parents, elders and try to get the ball rolling.

But i am now learning the hard way that times have changed in certain cases.

I have always had a crush on my bhabi's cousin for the last 7 years who is ten years younger than me and i first saw her when my elder brother got married in 2011. Back then she was very young i.e. 17 years old while i was 27 years old and i just dismissed it as an innocent crush.

I then moved to a new country and had to reeducate myself in order to start a new life and to pursue a new career pathway. Professionally and Academically things have not been easy, i had been fired 4 times as i was unable to cope with the fast paced working environments of those organizations where they had a sink or swim culture and those experiences have badly scarred me and hit my confidence to the core where the last time i got fired in extremely humiliating circumstances i.e. where i turned up to work, the office receptionist stopped me, went to tell my boss i was here, he came out of his office, without saying hello, anything just instructed me to follow him to a board room where there was a female lawyer present and politely requested me to sit down and then basically went like "_______ (My name), your employment is now being terminated effective immediately, ________ (Lawyers name), will explain all the details to you, thank you for your service" and then proceeded to storm out of the board room and into his office slamming the door shut.

Alhamdullilah i have been working for a big Jewish firm now for the last 6 months where the working environment has been really nice and even though people and recruiter reach out to me on Linkedln with requests for interviews, i desperately just want stability right now and dont have the stomach or courage to take any more risks at this time.

Anyways so during this whole process of working, studying, being fired, struggling to find another job, my parents, elders kept teasing me about being single, about how now that i am in my 30's i had aged out for really good attractive catches and that my options had now diminished very badly and all my relatives and extended relatives were aggressively lobbying for girls in their families who had broken engagements or were in their late 20's, early to mid 30's and were looking for someone without giving a damn about whether i was interested in them or not.

The last straw for me was when my parents recommended a first cousin on mine to me whom i had always regarded as a young sister more than anything else. I realized that my naive beliefs and hopes that i held since childhood that "All you have to do is just focus on your studies, on getting set career wise and your parents, elders will find a nice match for you which you will be very happy with" was badly misplaced and that i could no longer rely on my parents, elders for getting me the kind of match i would be happy with.

It was during this time period i thought about my bhabi's cousin and i looked her up on facebook and saw that had now grown up and i still felt the same way about her all these years but this time i began to feel why not. To be very honest, she is very pretty and 90% of people after looking at her pic and my pic will straight away flat out say "You are not in her league, forget it, you are punching above your weight".

I told my folks about my interest in her but they were not supportive at all and were off the opinion that the girl's family and her was a complete misfit and categorically accursed me that you just see her as a doll and that you are just interested in her because of her looks and nothing else.

I tried talking to the girl a few times on facebook but i had to do most of the talking and eventually in a few days in 2016 she completely shut me out and ignored my messages. When i reached out to 30-40 of my closest friends and confidants worldwide on what to do about this, the most common feedback was that "You have to have the girl on your side and you need to be dating her or have her reciprocate your feelings before you get your folks involved", yes there were a few people who were like "It is possible for you to pursue this girl via the arranged marriage route even if she has not reciprocated or if you don't know her or if she doesn't like you". And yes lol i also got told by a few people "This is highly immature high school type behavior from you where you are just interested in someone for there looks".

When i asked my elders and other relatives for advice they basically told me that my perceptions that a guy's family goes to the girls family just like that was misplaced and they told me that i was being extremely selfish and that i had no care or regard for my parents name and respect

Anyways i kept battling with my parents to ask for her hand for me but one obstacle after the other kept coming up

- The girls father drinks

- The girls mother is a social butterfly

- The girls parents were once separated at one point in time and that is apparently a red flag

- The girls khala and mamu have been divorced

I still didn't give up and battled with my parents that i don't believe in these things, i don't believe in the crap that marriages are between 2 families and that i believe that it is ultimately between 2 people at the end of the day. Then my parents made me feel bad and were like "She is a Human Being, you are treating her as a doll, you are being very self centered in this whole thing"

I didn't let these comments phase me, i was off the opinion that i was following my heart, that these moments come once in a lifetime and that you can't miss the boat. So i didn't give up and kept trying to press my parents to go and then other obstacles came up

- The girl was in a steady relationship with a guy in her University but the guy's father was opposed to the union

- The girl had been in relationships before and therefore according to my folks this was a red flag and was a sign that she is not marriage material

I still didn't give up and finally my folks were like, look if you really like her this much, we don't have any problems it is your life, but you have to do this yourself and get her on your side, we aren't doing anything otherwise.

The problem is that all this sounds very good to hear and simple to execute but it was easier said than done for someone like me who had never been good at this. In my absolute state of madness and desperation i wasted $10,000 going to fortune tellers and an Indian Attraction expert with whom i wasted one whole year of trying to adopt his Alpha Male philosophy i.e.

- Go out there and try to date, romance, hit on 100 plus chicks every where you find

- To do rock climbing

- To take photographs of yourself doing Alpha Male Activities

I ultimately had to give up following his instructions when one of his drafted messages did not work for me.

In 2017 when i went for Hajj, i prayed every single moment to get this girl and i was super charged up by the perception that whatever you pray for during Hajj normally comes true.

In April 2018, my bhabi gave birth to 2 fraternal twins and it happened just one day before the girls birthday. I used the opportunity to wish her well on her Birthday and then used it as an excuse to speak to her about the birth of her baby cousins.

From April 2018 to July 2018, i have probably interacted with this girl the most beyond my own expectations, imaginations compared to any other time period in my life. Don't get me wrong, it wasn't extraordinary or anything earth shattering because i was the one who had to initiate the chats, had to do the bulk of the talking to get conversations going and if i didn't send her a message then she would never talk to me but thats the case with all my facebook contacts where if i don't talk or reach out to people myself, no one will chat with me so i didn't make to much of it. But i exchanged many photographs of her twin baby cousins, articles and videos i felt she would be interested in. 70-75% of the times if i would send her a message, i would get a response after like 10-12 hours, 5-10% of the times she would respond instantly but the maximum that would last for was 10 minutes max and then yes there were moments when she would not respond to me and after waiting for one whole day, day and a half if i didn't get a response or if i she read my message but didn't respond then i would send a follow up message where she either responded after 12-14 hours, instantly or not at all and i would repeat.

The difficult i had with those thing was that i was just unable to put or implement any concrete strategy. Everything i had planned in my head in terms of what to talk to her about today and how i will take the conversation forward would go kaput if she didn't respond. My thinking was that i would during this time period build some comfort, confidence before i would tell my parents about this or if possible tell her about my feelings.

Unfortunately everything has gone kaput in the last one month where she has stopped responding to my messages or she reads my messages but does not respond. My parents are maintaining the same position i.e. if she likes you and reciprocates then we are going otherwise we aren't as this is not how arranged marriages work.

The vast majority of people i have spoken to agree with my folks. A few select people are like your folks know you are punching above your weight and also because they are not in favor of the girl and the family, that is why they are adopting this position because if they had been in favor of some other girl then even if that particular girl was not interested or involved with you yet, they wouldn't give a damn about whether she was not interested in you as long as they were in favor of it they would go all out to help hook you up with her and lobby with her parents to influence her to say yes.

The way i see it right now, i just don't have a powerful case or leg to stand on as the girl is just not responding or communicating the way i need her too.

The vast majority of the people and girls i have spoken to have told me "Just tell her the truth and get it over with". But this is easier said than done for people who are not dealing with the situation. It's easier to go gung ho and just tell a girl fearlessly about how you feel when you actually strongly believe that you have other good options out there. The last time i told someone i fancied them was ten years ago when i had no real friendship, connection with them and the girl was a complete stranger and it was very humiliating to deal with rejection. It took me a good 4 plus years to get over that experience and the memory of the whole thing. It wasn't just dealing with the pain and humiliation of rejection but the after math of the entire brigade which kept telling me "Just tell her", where they started making fun of me for the embarrassment and the criticism that followed "You freaked her out", "You are so dumb, what were you thinking? You think you can just go up to a stranger and just tell her you like her just like that?", "Don't you have a brain, what were you thinking and expecting".

I know realistically speaking that my chances right now as it is pretty low and if i just flat out tell her everything is going to be a 99.99% failure. Even worse for me will be giving the impression to the girl that everything i had been doing for the last 6 months of speaking to her was just disguised to get close to her and that i end up appearing like just another guy.

But i just don't see any other alternative right now and its not looking good. It is now dawning on me that i have wasted the last 3-4 years of my life trying to pursue this and it was all for nothing where i was not able to concentrate properly on my studies or my career and i just don't see how i can agree to be with another girl (due to family pressure) whom i am not interested in because i will still be feeling for my present crush.

One thing is for certain. That my relationship with my parents and elders is just not going to be the same again and there is nothing worse than a child losing trust and faith in his parents and elders.

 

[Pakistanian]

Is there tl;dr?

To answer your question, of course you need the girls side to approve of you otherwise any guy could marry whichever girl he liked.

As an aside, don't you think 10 years is quite an age difference for this day and age? Like youe maturity level and life experiences will br very different.

 

[ahmedwaqas92]

When I asked my elders and other relatives for advice they basically told me that my perceptions that a guy's family goes to the girls family just like that was misplaced and they told me that i was being extremely selfish and that i had no care or regard for my parents name and respect

One thing is for certain. That my relationship with my parents and elders is just not going to be the same again and there is nothing worse than a child losing trust and faith in his parents and elders.

[MENTION=2501]Savak[/MENTION] seriously brother I get every single word of what you've written because we both are in the same boat. I mean......This really took home and I've currently having similar problems of my own. I will pray to Allah that your problems are resolved ASAP.

 

[Slog]

well atleast you have had interactions this time...

in any case my experience/observation of the-somewhat-modern-but-from-traditional-family desi girls (which this one seems to be) is this: You just need to have a guy with great job, financial security and respectable family show up and they, and their family especially, are game.

So just establish yourself I guess...

Not sure what your plan could be trying to play a girl via Facebook messages!!!

Good luck though! Have grown to look forward to these six month updates

 

[Savak]

Is there tl;dr?

To answer your question, of course you need the girls side to approve of you otherwise any guy could marry whichever girl he liked.

As an aside, don't you think 10 years is quite an age difference for this day and age? Like youe maturity level and life experiences will br very different.

Everyone's experiences are different. Some prefer to marry women close to their age or older under the assumption they will be a lot more mature than younger girls. But i have seen in some cases where the marriage failed because both the guy and girl when they both got married together in their mid to late 30's were so set in their ways, habits, circle of friends and working life that the marriage failing.

I in general feel more at ease with girls much younger to me in comparison to close to my age.

 

[Savak]

well atleast you have had interactions this time...

in any case my experience/observation of the-somewhat-modern-but-from-traditional-family desi girls (which this one seems to be) is this: You just need to have a guy with great job, financial security and respectable family show up and they, and their family especially, are game.

So just establish yourself I guess...

Not sure what your plan could be trying to play a girl via Facebook messages!!!

Good luck though! Have grown to look forward to these six month updates

Lol establishing myself properly might take another 4-5 plus years. How long can one go on settling and is it wise to still be single in your late 30's, early 40's? Not everyone can luck out like Imran Khan

 

[Savak]

well atleast you have had interactions this time...

in any case my experience/observation of the-somewhat-modern-but-from-traditional-family desi girls (which this one seems to be) is this: You just need to have a guy with great job, financial security and respectable family show up and they, and their family especially, are game.

So just establish yourself I guess...

Not sure what your plan could be trying to play a girl via Facebook messages!!!

Good luck though! Have grown to look forward to these six month updates

Thats my question. If the girl is in Pakistan and I am in Canada.

If my folks are scared of rejection and are demanding that i do everything myself. What choice do i really have?

 

[Slog]

Lol establishing myself properly might take another 4-5 plus years. How long can one go on settling and is it wise to still be single in your late 30's, early 40's? Not everyone can luck out like Imran Khan

by establishing I mean a decent paying stable job (where you earn enough to rent and support yourself and a significant other with some leftover cash) for a period of one year atleast.

obv ideally 28- 30 is the age for a guy to get married imo but 35 is not unheard of. But yea beyond that dunno

 

[Savak]

[MENTION=2501]Savak[/MENTION] seriously brother I get every single word of what you've written because we both are in the same boat. I mean......This really took home and I've currently having similar problems of my own. I will pray to Allah that your problems are resolved ASAP.

This has been going on in my life since 2015. I have lost 3 years where every single day i have had to wake up out of bed with the stress of keeping the issue alive with my folks, trying to think and understand what to do and in these 3 years i have not been able to focus on my studies efficiently, have lost 4 jobs and given the constant negativity in my family that you have aged out, its game over for you, it doesn't really matter how much you earn now your age will always be a disadvantage and you will now have to compromise and settle for someone who is desperate for a rishta herself.

I mean can you imagine what this does to one's self confidence and esteem. I mean i literally lost the drive and passion to pursue my field because i more or less developed the mindset "Whats the point of pursuing a highly respected professional career if it will count for nothing or not help me much?, i might have just as well just become a taxi driver, truck driver or done odd jobs instead"

 

[Slog]

Thats my question. If the girl is in Pakistan and I am in Canada.

If my folks are scared of rejection and are demanding that i do everything myself. What choice do i really have?

Its not a matter of choice. What are the odds that it will work out seriously? Both know the answer.

Why fixate on one girl lol who you don't even know that well. Its prolly just an infatuation and I am sure she is just a run of the mill decent looking girls of which there are plenty. Its not like you know her really well to claim that her personality is really amazing for her to be such an attractive lady.

In any case you already say you aren't good at this but then you also want to come out and play with logistically impossible scenarios?

Try some desi online dating service or sth if you just wanna tip your toe in the water. Personally I don't think Ill ever do it (and know many who wont) but you've tried dating coaches so this is nothing.

 

[Slog]

I mean i literally lost the drive and passion to pursue my field because i more or less developed the mindset "Whats the point of pursuing a highly respected professional career if it will count for nothing or not help me much?, i might have just as well just become a taxi driver, truck driver or done odd jobs instead"

So the only reason of having a respected professional career is that it will result in an attractive girl marrying you? I mean that's where you are wrong to begin with.

The money you make is for you first so that you can enjoy your life and have a good living standard. Not to attract someone you can spend that money on. Having a successful career is independent of that.

Also... If you are successful in your field the other things you crave will follow anyway if they have to

Besides theres plenty of good for nothing dudes who have really attractive significant others so your presumption is faulty to begin with.

 

[Savak]

by establishing I mean a decent paying stable job (where you earn enough to rent and support yourself and a significant other with some leftover cash) for a period of one year atleast.

obv ideally 28- 30 is the age for a guy to get married imo but 35 is not unheard of. But yea beyond that dunno

I remember at University my friends when they were dating their college girl friends were under so much stress because they didn't have jobs or didn't end up with good jobs early on and the girls parents were more in favor of the girls choosing to marry more older well established guys. These same guys used to comment and tell me "How lucky you are that you never dated anyone and don't have to deal with this stress, just go out there enjoy your life, study further, establish yourself career wise, make money and then finally settle down by 30-32 and watch how you will end up with great options and catches via the arranged marriage route through your parents"

These same guys now make fun of me "We got the person we dated and wanted, what have you done in your life, why are you still struggling right now? What stopped or prevented you from dating someone, you are old now, you can forget about getting a good young catch, just go and settle for whatever you can get now".

Another golden lesson learn't in life, there is no such thing as good life long friends, its all fantasy, everyone moves on

 

[Savak]

So the only reason of having a respected professional career is that it will result in an attractive girl marrying you? I mean that's where you are wrong to begin with.

The money you make is for you first so that you can enjoy your life and have a good living standard. Not to attract someone you can spend that money on. Having a successful career is independent of that.

Also... If you are successful in your field the other things you crave will follow anyway if they have to

Besides theres plenty of good for nothing dudes who have really attractive significant others so your presumption is faulty to begin with.

I agree with the part of good for nothing dudes having good catches. The skills to attract women have nothing to do with money, looks.

The point i was making was that as kids your parents and elders encourage you to aim for tough fields like Law, Medicine, Accounting and one of the reasons they give is that it will improve your chances of getting a very good catch because parents will strongly prefer a guy whom they feel can provide comfort and financial security.

 

[Slog]

I remember at University my friends when they were dating their college girl friends were under so much stress because they didn't have jobs or didn't end up with good jobs early on and the girls parents were more in favor of the girls choosing to marry more older well established guys. These same guys used to comment and tell me "How lucky you are that you never dated anyone and don't have to deal with this stress, just go out there enjoy your life, study further, establish yourself career wise, make money and then finally settle down by 30-32 and watch how you will end up with great options and catches via the arranged marriage route through your parents"

These same guys now make fun of me "We got the person we dated and wanted, what have you done in your life, why are you still struggling right now? What stopped or prevented you from dating someone, you are old now, you can forget about getting a good young catch, just go and settle for whatever you can get now".

Another golden lesson learn't in life, there is no such thing as good life long friends, its all fantasy, everyone moves on

Also a good lesson: Young girls aren't always 'catches.' Give me a 28-30 year old educated woman with a successful professional career over a bheegi billi22 year old chick out of art school any day.

With friends I have in the past used very crude terms regarding girls/women Ive been with or want to be with so I def am no angel and feel bad about it now but you seem to have a totally different level of disrespect even if language isn't as crude. Females aren't 'catches' or objects for your pleasure. They are also humans. Maybe if you see them as humans first you will fare better. Also try women in your age bracket as well?

 

[Savak]

Its not a matter of choice. What are the odds that it will work out seriously? Both know the answer.

Why fixate on one girl lol who you don't even know that well. Its prolly just an infatuation and I am sure she is just a run of the mill decent looking girls of which there are plenty. Its not like you know her really well to claim that her personality is really amazing for her to be such an attractive lady.

In any case you already say you aren't good at this but then you also want to come out and play with logistically impossible scenarios?

Try some desi online dating service or sth if you just wanna tip your toe in the water. Personally I don't think Ill ever do it (and know many who wont) but you've tried dating coaches so this is nothing.

What does knowing someone inside out have to do with anything? Does every highly successful marriage filled with love kickstart because the guy and the girl knew each other well inside out before marriage?

And even if the guy and the girl knew each other very well before marriage, what is the guarantee that the marriage will be successful or will last?

I get ****** off when people raise these points trying to justify giving up.

All my extended relatives and folks are willing to push me towards other girls whom i don't know at all, no one raises these problems or objections there.

Like i have said, i have followed this girl for 3-4 years and have been interacting with her 6 months, so i have some idea but to be honest you never know a person till you actually live with them. Even the wordly Imran Khan realized this the hard way via Reham.

 

[Savak]

Also a good lesson: Young girls aren't always 'catches.' Give me a 28-30 year old educated woman with a successful professional career over a bheegi billi22 year old chick out of art school any day.

With friends I have in the past used very crude terms regarding girls/women Ive been with or want to be with so I def am no angel and feel bad about it now but you seem to have a totally different level of disrespect even if language isn't as crude. Females aren't 'catches' or objects for your pleasure. They are also humans. Maybe if you see them as humans first you will fare better

Lol, i am perhaps the most well behaved and respectful towards girls in my family. As far as terminology like catches is concerned, this is what i hear all my aunts and daadi say all the time.

 

[Savak]

Anyways, lets not digress. If anyone can share their experience of how they broke the ice with their love interest or when they told them how they felt. That would be helpful to me in terms of guiding me on what to do.

 

[Slog]

What does knowing someone inside out have to do with anything? Does every highly successful marriage filled with love kickstart because the guy and the girl knew each other well inside out before marriage?

And even if the guy and the girl knew each other very well before marriage, what is the guarantee that the marriage will be successful or will last?

I get ****** off when people raise these points trying to justify giving up.

All my extended relatives and folks are willing to push me towards other girls whom i don't know at all, no one raises these problems or objections there.

Like i have said, i have followed this girl for 3-4 years and have been interacting with her 6 months, so i have some idea but to be honest you never know a person till you actually live with them. Even the wordly Imran Khan realized this the hard way via Reham.

My point is this:

Why fixate on A who lives in Pakistan when she is probably as pretty as B and C who are in your region - esp when you don't know any of them well enough to have any overriding reason to prefer A.

And if A is some drop dead gorgeous model (which I highly doubt) there isn't much of a chance anyway.

You are playing this as a game anyways so why not make moves which help your chances?

 

[Savak]

My point is this:

Why fixate on A who lives in Pakistan when she is probably as pretty as B and C who are in your region - esp when you don't know any of them well enough to have any overriding reason to prefer A.

And if A is some drop dead gorgeous model (which I highly doubt) there isn't much of a chance anyway.

You are playing this as a game anyways so why not make moves which help your chances?

Lol, i dont trust my family to find B's or C's, to be honest they will only go after what they can get or go to those families were they won't fear the rejection will be wide spread or loud. It's a common reaction typical to guys who 9 times out 10 give up the moment they see a girl out of their league.

 

[Slog]

Anyways, lets not digress. If anyone can share their experience of how they broke the ice with their love interest or when they told them how they felt. That would be helpful to me in terms of guiding me on what to do.

Lets see what others have to say here esp married folk.

I am 26 and haven't been married but my involvements have almost always been though school or college.

So normally - its just get to know each other at a party or before/after class--> then hang out with a bunch of mutual friends --> and then grab dinner/lunch. However I have no idea about proposing to someone lol and even if I had it would have been someone Id already been with. Though I do get the whole drama of involving family and asking them to formally go is something Id rather not have to go through.

So your situation is entirely different and clearly not happening in a more normal way.

 

[DrSchultz]

For some people, it is prudent to give up on the thought of ever having a romantic partner. Must realize that not everyone deserves one.

There are millions of such people all over the world who struggle to hold a conversation, but watch in vain as there friends chat up the same girl and mesmerize her with their charisma and confidence.

The chances of such people ever getting anyone to show romantic interest in them is very very low.

 

[mmkextreme_1]

Must say reading through that was dense.

My first question is, 10 years difference, don't you think that is a lot? I mean, I see that you are more comfortable with younger females, but IMHO 5 years is ok too. 10 years is a bit much, in terms of compatibility you guys will be in different eras I would assume. Might not look like it when a person is in there late 40s and has a friendship with a person in their 50s, but with the age group you guys are in, I think that is a lot. Maybe that is why she doesn't talk to you that much? She might be uncomfortable with that. I mean, that is almost an uncle level (I have an uncle that is about 6-7 years older than me and an aunt) difference, my apologies if I offend you by saying that.

Going back to the relationship thing, I think rather than sitting there and waiting around, as you have said you have waisted 3-4 years of your life (which to me, is a lot, that's nearly 10% of your life up until now) for her. I think that is excessive, remember brother, if it is meant to be it will happen. Either tell her or forget her, no need to keep wasting your time and stressing yourself out.

There are millions of females in Pakistan (I assume that is where you want to get married?) get to know someone else, you might just be surprised who else is out there.

 

[JaDed]

Savak and his problems with womenfolk continue.

His threads are very interesting,best is they have updates on them like qtrly reports.

On the topic:

With your parents disappointing you now have independence of making your own decisions, which I see a huge plus.
You can always use this incident as an excuse for decisions that you make for your own life.

 

[TM Riddle]

His threads are very interesting,best is they have updates on them like qtrly reports.

On the topic:

With your parents disappointing you now have independence of making your own decisions, which I see a huge plus.
You can always use this incident as an excuse for decisions that you make for your own life.

Jaded Bhai I am at that stage in life where thought of romantic relationship just make me feel suffocated.
Dunno why Savak gets all sentimental over these issues. He should count himself lucky to be a free guy.

 

[LastManstanding]

Lol, i dont trust my family to find B's or C's, to be honest they will only go after what they can get or go to those families were they won't fear the rejection will be wide spread or loud. It's a common reaction typical to guys who 9 times out 10 give up the moment they see a girl out of their league.

How does arranged marriage work in Pakistan? Do you have matrimonial websites to find brides and grooms?

 

[JaDed]

Jaded Bhai I am at that stage in life where thought of romantic relationship just make me feel suffocated.
Dunno why Savak gets all sentimental over these issues. He should count himself lucky to be a free guy.

You dated too many man and wrong ones probably, you would know easily know the difference but I get it ,I went through the phase as well which after every 3 months you feel suffocated and "mental games" argh.

 

[Savak]

How does arranged marriage work in Pakistan? Do you have matrimonial websites to find brides and grooms?

It's the million dollar question for me right now. What I learning, if the girl is out of your league you have to pursue her yourself because everyone else will feel you have no chance.

If the girl is not out of your league then no one will have any problems and your folks will not be scared of rejection and will not give a damn about whether you know her or not, have interacted with her or not, and in this situation they will be willing to put in the work to make it happen.

But truth be told, no matter how hard you try the quranic ayat of "Allah is the best of planners" is a reality as well

 

[TM Riddle]

You dated too many man and wrong ones probably, you would know easily know the difference but I get it ,I went through the phase as well which after every 3 months you feel suffocated and "mental games" argh.

I'm done with women for now honestly.
No relationships for at least 4-5 years. Don't see myself getting married before turning 30 which fortunately is quite far as far as I'm concerned.

 

[LastManstanding]

Jaded Bhai I am at that stage in life where thought of romantic relationship just make me feel suffocated.
Dunno why Savak gets all sentimental over these issues. He should count himself lucky to be a free guy.

Love marriage is always better in India, too many gold diggers out there on these matrimonial sites who will judge you not for your potential and talent but the number of houses you or your parents own. My advice, find a nice girl right now, date her for few years and marry her. After few years you will find it harder to find a decent girl.

 

[JaDed]

I'm done with women for now honestly.
No relationships for at least 4-5 years. Don't see myself getting married before turning 30 which fortunately is quite far as far as I'm concerned.

That's not how emotions work,but you will realize as time goes.
Its like saadibaba's signature : I'm not young enough to know everything.

 

[TM Riddle]

Love marriage is always better in India, too many gold diggers out there on these matrimonial sites who will judge you not for your potential and talent but the number of houses you or your parents own. My advice, find a nice girl right now, date her for few years and marry her. After few years you will find it harder to find a decent girl.

I have had enough of dating liberal and feminist girls. The mere sight of them makes me wanna run away in the opposite direction as fast as I can.

As a matter of fact, I have told my mother in straight simple words that I would be happy to marry someone of her choice as long as the girl cooks well and do not babble about women empowerment issues every other day.

 

[Major]

wow, this thread is scaring me.

Its like OP and me are quite alike. Never dated anyone in my whole life, because i never had the communication skill to impress the opposite sex.
All my friends are dating and enjoying. Often get told by those friends how im lucky that im not in this mess.

had a crush on a girl for 5 years, who was really beautiful but was soo messed up that had her explicit pics leaked.i had never talked to this girl, but still loved her. Get mocked by my friends for it.

ALways trying to forget her, but my friends keep on reminding me about her.

Finally after getting into uni was able to let go of my infatuation which has having me held back and allowed me to social with my Uni class mates.

Im 23, and the good boy of the family. Never smoked, never did drugs, never had alcahol..

Moral of the story, good guys always suffer..

 

[Major]

But i would like to add, if it doesn't work out, try to socialize by going to different events or places where you would have to interact with the opposite sex. Might aswell take a job oppurtunity which makes you do it.

Will help you move on and might allow you to meet more amazing people.

i'm a person who never socialized, but recently tok some oppurutunies which made me socialize and that socializing helped me get over my crush who i couldn't even talk to.

I hope it does work out, but if you want to get noticed do something to get noticed.

 

[Savak]

How does arranged marriage work in Pakistan? Do you have matrimonial websites like shaadi.com to find brides and grooms?

But i would like to add, if it doesn't work out, try to socialize by going to different events or places where you would have to interact with the opposite sex. Might aswell take a job oppurtunity which makes you do it.

Will help you move on and might allow you to meet more amazing people.

i'm a person who never socialized, but recently tok some oppurutunies which made me socialize and that socializing helped me get over my crush who i couldn't even talk to.

I hope it does work out, but if you want to get noticed do something to get noticed.

Not that simple. My Academic commitments combined with work are such that I dont even have time to go to the gym to excercise frequently so socializing is out of the question

 

[LastManstanding]

It's the million dollar question for me right now. What I learning, if the girl is out of your league you have to pursue her yourself because everyone else will feel you have no chance.

If the girl is not out of your league then no one will have any problems and your folks will not be scared of rejection and will not give a damn about whether you know her or not, have interacted with her or not, and in this situation they will be willing to put in the work to make it happen.

But truth be told, no matter how hard you try the quranic ayat of "Allah is the best of planners" is a reality as well

In India, the financial situation of a guys family also plays a part. Does it not in Pakistan? Arent the girl's family more likely to say yes if the guy's family is financial stronger than them irrespective of the girl's looks?

 

[Savak]

How does arranged marriage work in Pakistan? Do you have matrimonial websites like shaadi.com to find brides and grooms?

But i would like to add, if it doesn't work out, try to socialize by going to different events or places where you would have to interact with the opposite sex. Might aswell take a job oppurtunity which makes you do it.

Will help you move on and might allow you to meet more amazing people.

i'm a person who never socialized, but recently tok some oppurutunies which made me socialize and that socializing helped me get over my crush who i couldn't even talk to.

I hope it does work out, but if you want to get noticed do something to get noticed.

In India, the financial situation of a guys family also plays a part. Does it not in Pakistan? Arent the girl's family more likely to say yes if the guy's family is financial stronger than them irrespective of the girl's looks?

My more than decent financial situation has not helped me. I lived in a $2 million dollar house which my dad owns and half an appartment in my name for rent. My dad owns a few properties in the US, UK, Dubai, Pakistan but he is still scared of being turned down by an equally upper middle class family in this case.

In most cases this would have been a plus point but unfortunately I am cursed

 

[Abdul]

wow, this thread is scaring me.

Its like OP and me are quite alike. Never dated anyone in my whole life, because i never had the communication skill to impress the opposite sex.
All my friends are dating and enjoying. Often get told by those friends how im lucky that im not in this mess.

had a crush on a girl for 5 years, who was really beautiful but was soo messed up that had her explicit pics leaked.i had never talked to this girl, but still loved her. Get mocked by my friends for it.

ALways trying to forget her, but my friends keep on reminding me about her.

Finally after getting into uni was able to let go of my infatuation which has having me held back and allowed me to social with my Uni class mates.

Im 23, and the good boy of the family. Never smoked, never did drugs, never had alcahol..

Moral of the story, good guys always suffer..

"Good guys always suffer."

What rubbish is this? Do you expect girls to talk to you just because you're a "nice" guy? )

 

[Abdul]

Arranged marriages are an outdated concept now but the only way for people who lack the courage and guts.

 

[Major]

Not that simple. My Academic commitments combined with work are such that I dont even have time to go to the gym to excercise frequently so socializing is out of the question

bro if this doesn't work out, socializing would be something that you would have to seriously consider to move on from it. Heart breaks could be tough.

Again, i hope it works out.

I understand what you are going through. I really do. But the thing is, you are just stalling your life.

For a guy who goes after logic, these things have no logic. Before you waste your life any furhter just confess to her( its easier said from a neutral perspective, i would never confess my love to that girl i loved)
Or get the message conveyed by someone mutual just so you know whats the feeling from the other end.

But trust me, if this doesn't work out, the only way you could move on from this is finding a way to socialize.
I ended up becoming the teacher assistant of my class, this forced me to be in contact with every student in class. It really helped me, as it allowed the opposite sex to have a reason to have a convo with me,, even if it was about the syllabus or the exam date

 

[JaDed]

Pakistanis and Indians have carved out different identities I feel esp after seeing this thread and problems of Savak w.r.t arranged marriages.

Our problems with arranged marriages are much more different I think.

 

[Major]

"Good guys always suffer."

What rubbish is this? Do you expect girls to talk to you just because you're a "nice" guy? )

lol na,

point is, most of us live in this disillusion that if we lead a life according to the book good things will happen to us. ok you may laugh at me

 

[kingusama92]

In my absolute state of madness and desperation i wasted $10,000 going to fortune tellers and an Indian Attraction expert with whom i wasted one whole year of trying to adopt his Alpha Male philosophy i.e.

You can't be serious.

 

[ethan hunt]

My sincere advice to you would be to get on dating apps.
You will learn so much about life and the opposite gender .
Small talk rarely works , as you've found out with this lady . This is something you will learn pretty quickly when you are in the dating business.
Start dating and your confidence levels will improve and trust me your conversation skills and fashion sense , everything will pick up , even having female friends helps in that regard .

Once you've gone out a few times and spent a few nights talking to the ladies over the phone or in person you will understand the psychology and the art of attracting womenfolk . The confidence you will gain will help you in life .You sound like you really do need a break
No two women are the same but you will get a basic idea of what to do and more importantly what not to .

I can see why you might come across a little creepy at times . If you want a positive change start with real life experiences and your personality will improve for the better .Once that happens you won't have to try as hard to impress .

 

[Savak]

People have digressed.

How can one play with words to tell a girl how he feels and his intentions without looking desperate and without options?

 

[akki]

People have digressed.

How can one play with words to tell a girl how he feels and his intentions without looking desperate and without options?

Impressing a girl is not much difficult. Is she a punjabi girl ? Either if ahe is not.
I hope you will do what i will tell you.
First and most important . Try to be humorous and cool at the same time. Dnt you ever like ever bor a gal in your starting phase. Try to make jokes ,sarcasm. Your chances of having a next stage converstion with girl is directly proportional to how you make her laugh and interested at same time. Try some sarcasm lines while conversation.

Second try to be cool. Like why dnt you tell her some self made stories while conversation like ,,how modern thinking guy and yet attached to your root culture guy you are. How balanced guy you are. How you helped some one doing that thing today. How you took stand against alot of people today. And why are you stressed today ,like you took stand and this seems logocal and nobody understood. These things gonna make her start talking with you.

Having girls respect is very very must thing. Tell her how gal proposer you but you are not sure. And relationship is very imp.thing for you. You cant just say yes for the sake of yes.
Post as many pics with your female friends with you in some parties and tell hwr hkw she likes you or likes to flirt with you. But mind you dnt try to be oversmart. You have to balance all these things.
Man with this much 10000 dollars money ,you give it to me and i can get you even 10 more gals like her.lolz.

Although i am also a heartbroken guy ,who cudnt marry his love due to circumstances .
Hopefully you wud get to marry her. But i hope you wud not only take interest in her beauty instead help her to be more of herself and independent and to become a better human being.

 

[LastManstanding]

People have digressed.

How can one play with words to tell a girl how he feels and his intentions without looking desperate and without options?

Girls aren't stupid. They get hit on by many guys everyday. She probably knows about your intentions already. The fact that your friendship hasn't gone to next level despite talking for so many years should give you an indication that she might not be interested in you. No harm in confessing your feelings towards her and be done with it.

 

[WhenSultansBowled]

i am in my 30's i had aged out for really good attractive catches and that my options had now diminished very badly

Are you kidding me?

A 30 something guy, with stable job, intelligent and with a clear mind: how many of these guys do you know? They are rare lol, at least where I live. Beautiful girls, otoh, are everywhere...

 

[kaayal]

I don’t understand why Savak thinks that these 22yr old’s should “like him” like the way he does?? They also have a life, they might be attracted towards more younger handsome established males than him. He is thinking only from his point of view and is projecting her as some trophy wife/a catch than a life partner. Sorry to say but you deserve to be get dumped here. Respect the girl’s opinion too sometimes.

 

[King-Misbah]

Brother; no one is worth pursing up to an extent. I have dated very pretty girls and trust me there is no special (out of this world) formula. I realised that pretty girls also have confidence issues and tend not to be 100% content with their looks, life in general. I would advise you to go on dating apps as there are a lot more fishes in the sea. No one person is worth it if theyre not showing interest. There are so many pretty girls in this world so chillax. Try to act casual with any girl and then try to be that guy who they feel confortable with. This is the golden rule. Once they have your trust and feel comfortable then its easy. Then its just about being a little funny and dropping hints. Never ever act desperate because they can sense it and girls tend to not feel comfortable with such a guy. Hope this helps. And for starters; find some female friends as this help you to understand females more and they may have some friends etc.

 

[introvert]

By now you should have tell her how much you love her & what kind of lifestyle you can offer to her.

the Other thing you can do to know what exactly she thinks about you is by involving third person in this matter who is also near to him & someone who can present your proposal in front of her in a good way.

if she is not interested then move on. try to find new attraction who knows you might get lucky with next girl.

 

[Halaribo]

I must say, I find the OP... eerily disturbing

 

[akki]

I don’t understand why Savak thinks that these 22yr old’s should “like him” like the way he does?? They also have a life, they might be attracted towards more younger handsome established males than him. He is thinking only from his point of view and is projecting her as some trophy wife/a catch than a life partner. Sorry to say but you deserve to be get dumped here. Respect the girl’s opinion too sometimes.

Yeah but she has not given her opinion yet. Dnt be so judgemental.let him atleast try . Some guys dnt know how to go through all this approach process.

 

[Adijazz1706]

All my life my parents and elders raised me to believe that all a guy has to do whenever he fancies someone is to just tell his parents and that they will go the girls parents, elders and try to get the ball rolling.

But i am now learning the hard way that times have changed in certain cases.

I have always had a crush on my bhabi's cousin for the last 7 years who is ten years younger than me and i first saw her when my elder brother got married in 2011. Back then she was very young i.e. 17 years old while i was 27 years old and i just dismissed it as an innocent crush.

I then moved to a new country and had to reeducate myself in order to start a new life and to pursue a new career pathway. Professionally and Academically things have not been easy, i had been fired 4 times as i was unable to cope with the fast paced working environments of those organizations where they had a sink or swim culture and those experiences have badly scarred me and hit my confidence to the core where the last time i got fired in extremely humiliating circumstances i.e. where i turned up to work, the office receptionist stopped me, went to tell my boss i was here, he came out of his office, without saying hello, anything just instructed me to follow him to a board room where there was a female lawyer present and politely requested me to sit down and then basically went like "_______ (My name), your employment is now being terminated effective immediately, ________ (Lawyers name), will explain all the details to you, thank you for your service" and then proceeded to storm out of the board room and into his office slamming the door shut.

Alhamdullilah i have been working for a big Jewish firm now for the last 6 months where the working environment has been really nice and even though people and recruiter reach out to me on Linkedln with requests for interviews, i desperately just want stability right now and dont have the stomach or courage to take any more risks at this time.

Anyways so during this whole process of working, studying, being fired, struggling to find another job, my parents, elders kept teasing me about being single, about how now that i am in my 30's i had aged out for really good attractive catches and that my options had now diminished very badly and all my relatives and extended relatives were aggressively lobbying for girls in their families who had broken engagements or were in their late 20's, early to mid 30's and were looking for someone without giving a damn about whether i was interested in them or not.

The last straw for me was when my parents recommended a first cousin on mine to me whom i had always regarded as a young sister more than anything else. I realized that my naive beliefs and hopes that i held since childhood that "All you have to do is just focus on your studies, on getting set career wise and your parents, elders will find a nice match for you which you will be very happy with" was badly misplaced and that i could no longer rely on my parents, elders for getting me the kind of match i would be happy with.

It was during this time period i thought about my bhabi's cousin and i looked her up on facebook and saw that had now grown up and i still felt the same way about her all these years but this time i began to feel why not. To be very honest, she is very pretty and 90% of people after looking at her pic and my pic will straight away flat out say "You are not in her league, forget it, you are punching above your weight".

I told my folks about my interest in her but they were not supportive at all and were off the opinion that the girl's family and her was a complete misfit and categorically accursed me that you just see her as a doll and that you are just interested in her because of her looks and nothing else.

I tried talking to the girl a few times on facebook but i had to do most of the talking and eventually in a few days in 2016 she completely shut me out and ignored my messages. When i reached out to 30-40 of my closest friends and confidants worldwide on what to do about this, the most common feedback was that "You have to have the girl on your side and you need to be dating her or have her reciprocate your feelings before you get your folks involved", yes there were a few people who were like "It is possible for you to pursue this girl via the arranged marriage route even if she has not reciprocated or if you don't know her or if she doesn't like you". And yes lol i also got told by a few people "This is highly immature high school type behavior from you where you are just interested in someone for there looks".

When i asked my elders and other relatives for advice they basically told me that my perceptions that a guy's family goes to the girls family just like that was misplaced and they told me that i was being extremely selfish and that i had no care or regard for my parents name and respect

Anyways i kept battling with my parents to ask for her hand for me but one obstacle after the other kept coming up

- The girls father drinks

- The girls mother is a social butterfly

- The girls parents were once separated at one point in time and that is apparently a red flag

- The girls khala and mamu have been divorced

I still didn't give up and battled with my parents that i don't believe in these things, i don't believe in the crap that marriages are between 2 families and that i believe that it is ultimately between 2 people at the end of the day. Then my parents made me feel bad and were like "She is a Human Being, you are treating her as a doll, you are being very self centered in this whole thing"

I didn't let these comments phase me, i was off the opinion that i was following my heart, that these moments come once in a lifetime and that you can't miss the boat. So i didn't give up and kept trying to press my parents to go and then other obstacles came up

- The girl was in a steady relationship with a guy in her University but the guy's father was opposed to the union

- The girl had been in relationships before and therefore according to my folks this was a red flag and was a sign that she is not marriage material

I still didn't give up and finally my folks were like, look if you really like her this much, we don't have any problems it is your life, but you have to do this yourself and get her on your side, we aren't doing anything otherwise.

The problem is that all this sounds very good to hear and simple to execute but it was easier said than done for someone like me who had never been good at this. In my absolute state of madness and desperation i wasted $10,000 going to fortune tellers and an Indian Attraction expert with whom i wasted one whole year of trying to adopt his Alpha Male philosophy i.e.

- Go out there and try to date, romance, hit on 100 plus chicks every where you find

- To do rock climbing

- To take photographs of yourself doing Alpha Male Activities

I ultimately had to give up following his instructions when one of his drafted messages did not work for me.

In 2017 when i went for Hajj, i prayed every single moment to get this girl and i was super charged up by the perception that whatever you pray for during Hajj normally comes true.

In April 2018, my bhabi gave birth to 2 fraternal twins and it happened just one day before the girls birthday. I used the opportunity to wish her well on her Birthday and then used it as an excuse to speak to her about the birth of her baby cousins.

From April 2018 to July 2018, i have probably interacted with this girl the most beyond my own expectations, imaginations compared to any other time period in my life. Don't get me wrong, it wasn't extraordinary or anything earth shattering because i was the one who had to initiate the chats, had to do the bulk of the talking to get conversations going and if i didn't send her a message then she would never talk to me but thats the case with all my facebook contacts where if i don't talk or reach out to people myself, no one will chat with me so i didn't make to much of it. But i exchanged many photographs of her twin baby cousins, articles and videos i felt she would be interested in. 70-75% of the times if i would send her a message, i would get a response after like 10-12 hours, 5-10% of the times she would respond instantly but the maximum that would last for was 10 minutes max and then yes there were moments when she would not respond to me and after waiting for one whole day, day and a half if i didn't get a response or if i she read my message but didn't respond then i would send a follow up message where she either responded after 12-14 hours, instantly or not at all and i would repeat.

The difficult i had with those thing was that i was just unable to put or implement any concrete strategy. Everything i had planned in my head in terms of what to talk to her about today and how i will take the conversation forward would go kaput if she didn't respond. My thinking was that i would during this time period build some comfort, confidence before i would tell my parents about this or if possible tell her about my feelings.

Unfortunately everything has gone kaput in the last one month where she has stopped responding to my messages or she reads my messages but does not respond. My parents are maintaining the same position i.e. if she likes you and reciprocates then we are going otherwise we aren't as this is not how arranged marriages work.

The vast majority of people i have spoken to agree with my folks. A few select people are like your folks know you are punching above your weight and also because they are not in favor of the girl and the family, that is why they are adopting this position because if they had been in favor of some other girl then even if that particular girl was not interested or involved with you yet, they wouldn't give a damn about whether she was not interested in you as long as they were in favor of it they would go all out to help hook you up with her and lobby with her parents to influence her to say yes.

The way i see it right now, i just don't have a powerful case or leg to stand on as the girl is just not responding or communicating the way i need her too.

The vast majority of the people and girls i have spoken to have told me "Just tell her the truth and get it over with". But this is easier said than done for people who are not dealing with the situation. It's easier to go gung ho and just tell a girl fearlessly about how you feel when you actually strongly believe that you have other good options out there. The last time i told someone i fancied them was ten years ago when i had no real friendship, connection with them and the girl was a complete stranger and it was very humiliating to deal with rejection. It took me a good 4 plus years to get over that experience and the memory of the whole thing. It wasn't just dealing with the pain and humiliation of rejection but the after math of the entire brigade which kept telling me "Just tell her", where they started making fun of me for the embarrassment and the criticism that followed "You freaked her out", "You are so dumb, what were you thinking? You think you can just go up to a stranger and just tell her you like her just like that?", "Don't you have a brain, what were you thinking and expecting".

I know realistically speaking that my chances right now as it is pretty low and if i just flat out tell her everything is going to be a 99.99% failure. Even worse for me will be giving the impression to the girl that everything i had been doing for the last 6 months of speaking to her was just disguised to get close to her and that i end up appearing like just another guy.

But i just don't see any other alternative right now and its not looking good. It is now dawning on me that i have wasted the last 3-4 years of my life trying to pursue this and it was all for nothing where i was not able to concentrate properly on my studies or my career and i just don't see how i can agree to be with another girl (due to family pressure) whom i am not interested in because i will still be feeling for my present crush.

One thing is for certain. That my relationship with my parents and elders is just not going to be the same again and there is nothing worse than a child losing trust and faith in his parents and elders.

Crushes are cool in the teens, not sure it's cool in your 30's. Also, if the girl isn't ready and is forced against her will, it's not a nikah in the first place. There seem to be too many red flags around this girl anyway

 

[kaayal]

Yeah but she has not given her opinion yet. Dnt be so judgemental.let him atleast try . Some guys dnt know how to go through all this approach process.

I am just expressing a female opinion here. He is trying to pull a high tension line from Canada to Pakistan all by himself. On his own admission, the girl doesn't look interested in this "chatting" anymore then why force this relationship on her? He need to build his self confidence and move on instead of hanging on this.

 

[Abdul]

You can't be serious.

I felt pretty sad reading this.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

I had assumed this was a troll thread and someone was having a good laugh while writing all this out ripping it out of FOBs, but apparently not, seems it is serious. Can I ask, are you talking about Pakistan or living in England?

 

[Savak]

I don’t understand why Savak thinks that these 22yr old’s should “like him” like the way he does?? They also have a life, they might be attracted towards more younger handsome established males than him. He is thinking only from his point of view and is projecting her as some trophy wife/a catch than a life partner. Sorry to say but you deserve to be get dumped here. Respect the girl’s opinion too sometimes.

There is no hard and fast rule about age gaps. Yes people do talk that it is much more difficult now compared to the 60's and 90's where women and the girls parents don't like a mature guy but then again I have seen couples with age gaps of 7-10 plus years so nothing is impossible.

My closest female friends are ones who are considerably younger than me i.e. 6-10 years. I don't know how to explain it, its just the way I am wired, I feel more at ease with girls younger than me as opposed to close to my age, my age or older than me.

 

[Savak]

Brother; no one is worth pursing up to an extent. I have dated very pretty girls and trust me there is no special (out of this world) formula. I realised that pretty girls also have confidence issues and tend not to be 100% content with their looks, life in general. I would advise you to go on dating apps as there are a lot more fishes in the sea. No one person is worth it if theyre not showing interest. There are so many pretty girls in this world so chillax. Try to act casual with any girl and then try to be that guy who they feel confortable with. This is the golden rule. Once they have your trust and feel comfortable then its easy. Then its just about being a little funny and dropping hints. Never ever act desperate because they can sense it and girls tend to not feel comfortable with such a guy. Hope this helps. And for starters; find some female friends as this help you to understand females more and they may have some friends etc.

I don't believe anyone is perfect. Do you believe it is possible to like someone even for their imperfections too?

 

[Savak]

By now you should have tell her how much you love her & what kind of lifestyle you can offer to her.

the Other thing you can do to know what exactly she thinks about you is by involving third person in this matter who is also near to him & someone who can present your proposal in front of her in a good way.

if she is not interested then move on. try to find new attraction who knows you might get lucky with next girl.

Involving my Bhabi is a dead end. I heard my Bhabi's family gave negative feedback about the girls family and the girl. Besides based on my experiences in life, I have come to realize everytime that involving others for things like this is always going to lead to disappointment and the accusations that you demanded/expected something excessive. Better to just do these things on your own and not ruin your relationship, develop grudges against the middle men.

The only option left now is to tell her the truth and take the hit.

 

[Savak]

I will definitely tell her someway or the other. But before I do that, I need to ask guys based on their experiences, what have been the outcomes?

- A straight away Yes (which would be unrealistic and a miracle in this case)

- A straight No (a possibility where she will politely tell you about her not being interested in you)

- If she says No, will she still allow you to be in touch with her or will she block you

- Will she be like "Let me think over it" or lets get to know each other better

- Will she be like "Sure send your folks over, join the line and then they will decide what is the best option for me"

The last time I told someone my true feelings 10 years ago, she just walked away from me and did not speak to me again or acknowledge my existence.

 

[InziRules]

Dude, what you did is creepy, and most girls would block you. You're far older than her and she probably sees you as an uncle.

 

[InziRules]

wow, this thread is scaring me.

Its like OP and me are quite alike. Never dated anyone in my whole life, because i never had the communication skill to impress the opposite sex.
All my friends are dating and enjoying. Often get told by those friends how im lucky that im not in this mess.

had a crush on a girl for 5 years, who was really beautiful but was soo messed up that had her explicit pics leaked.i had never talked to this girl, but still loved her. Get mocked by my friends for it.

ALways trying to forget her, but my friends keep on reminding me about her.

Finally after getting into uni was able to let go of my infatuation which has having me held back and allowed me to social with my Uni class mates.

Im 23, and the good boy of the family. Never smoked, never did drugs, never had alcahol..

Moral of the story, good guys always suffer..

You're not entitled to a girl just because you never smoked and never did drugs. There are far richer, better looking and all round better people than you.

This is not to attack you or [MENTION=2501]Savak[/MENTION], but I see this thinking so much in Pakistanis. I'm successful, ergo she should marry me. It doesn't work like that.
[MENTION=2501]Savak[/MENTION], she ignored you, she doesn't like you. It's time to move on. You're successful and can still get married to someone. Just not her.

Honestly, you'll be creating issues for your own Bhabhi by pursuing this

 

[barah_admi]

Dont worry about age difference, that is a load of nonsense. Reach out to her family ify ou can and see what happens.

 

[Savak]

You're not entitled to a girl just because you never smoked and never did drugs. There are far richer, better looking and all round better people than you.

This is not to attack you or [MENTION=2501]Savak[/MENTION], but I see this thinking so much in Pakistanis. I'm successful, ergo she should marry me. It doesn't work like that.

[MENTION=2501]Savak[/MENTION], she ignored you, she doesn't like you. It's time to move on. You're successful and can still get married to someone. Just not her.

Honestly, you'll be creating issues for your own Bhabhi by pursuing this

Being rich is not enough. You guys have no idea about my family background. But after a point in time just trying to sell your own salary, career prospects or family wealth to a girl who genuinely just wants to be with someone she herself feels more comfortable with and likes regardless of his family wealth becomes lame.

If she ignores me, rejects me, politely says no to me after I tell her about my interest, I will have no choice

But I want to do this properly and correctly.

 

[Savak]

Dont worry about age difference, that is a load of nonsense. Reach out to her family ify ou can and see what happens.

Lol, did you read the OP. I have exhausted the family option.

 

[Syed1]

Maybe it is time to accept that the door has now shut on that girl for you.







Also, the girl would be now 27 year old and as you describe she is very pretty, which makes me think she is one of those narcissistic girls who think they are some hoor pari and no boy is upto their standard. Trust me you would never be happy with such a person.


Keep in mind her looks would fade, but her personality will stay the same.

 

[InziRules]

Maybe it is time to accept that the door has now shut on that girl for you.







Also, the girl would be now 27 year old and as you describe she is very pretty, which makes me think she is one of those narcissistic girls who think they are some hoor pari and no boy is upto their standard. Trust me you would never be happy with such a person.


Keep in mind her looks would fade, but her personality will stay the same.

Look at what [MENTION=2501]Savak[/MENTION] is saying above though. It's obvious that he thinks he's superior because of his family background, wealth, etc. You think the girl can't see that?

So many people won't say this, but in Pakistan, no one wants to marry well above their social standing, or well below it. Precisely because she knows that ke us ko dab ke rhna pare ga because she is not from as rich a family. No girl or boy wants that.

 

[InziRules]

Being rich is not enough. You guys have no idea about my family background. But after a point in time just trying to sell your own salary, career prospects or family wealth to a girl who genuinely just wants to be with someone she herself feels more comfortable with and likes regardless of his family wealth becomes lame.

If she ignores me, rejects me, politely says no to me after I tell her about my interest, I will have no choice

But I want to do this properly and correctly.

That's the point, she may be dead set on marrying someone else. Also, as I said above, most people stay within their own family circle. Your Bhabhi may also have said something about your family that means she doesn't want to marry in it.

Most families also don't like to make more than one relationship within a family, in fear that the other family will have control

 

[Syed1]

Look at what [MENTION=2501]Savak[/MENTION] is saying above though. It's obvious that he thinks he's superior because of his family background, wealth, etc. You think the girl can't see that?

So many people won't say this, but in Pakistan, no one wants to marry well above their social standing, or well below it. Precisely because she knows that ke us ko dab ke rhna pare ga because she is not from as rich a family. No girl or boy wants that.

It's true... in our family we specifically avoid families that are too rich or higher in social status.

 

[Savak]

Look at what [MENTION=2501]Savak[/MENTION] is saying above though. It's obvious that he thinks he's superior because of his family background, wealth, etc. You think the girl can't see that?

So many people won't say this, but in Pakistan, no one wants to marry well above their social standing, or well below it. Precisely because she knows that ke us ko dab ke rhna pare ga because she is not from as rich a family. No girl or boy wants that.

When did I say I consider myself superior. You yourself bought in "far more richer people than you".

And in arranged marriages, the girls parents and elders do ask "What does the boy do?", "How much does he earn every month?", "What are his career plans, prospects?", "Does he have a decent place to live?", "Does he have cars?", "What is his lifestyle?", "What are his hobbies like?"

 

[Savak]

That's the point, she may be dead set on marrying someone else. Also, as I said above, most people stay within their own family circle. Your Bhabhi may also have said something about your family that means she doesn't want to marry in it.

Most families also don't like to make more than one relationship within a family, in fear that the other family will have control

Lol I created this thread in order to get tips, advice on how to go about telling this girl about how I feel and whether people can share their knowledge, experiences to help me.

Not to be judged and commented upon for my choices.

 

[InziRules]

Lol I created this thread in order to get tips, advice on how to go about telling this girl about how I feel and whether people can share their knowledge, experiences to help me.

Not to be judged and commented upon for my choices.

When did I say I consider myself superior. You yourself bought in "far more richer people than you".

And in arranged marriages, the girls parents and elders do ask "What does the boy do?", "How much does he earn every month?", "What are his career plans, prospects?", "Does he have a decent place to live?", "Does he have cars?", "What is his lifestyle?", "What are his hobbies like?"

I'm not judging you. I'm tell you a fact. You are not like that, I'll admit I shouldn't have said that.

But people do think this way. People don't like marrying well above their social status because hamesha dab ke rhna parta hai. It's a fact, and while you may not think this way, someone in your family will, and will remind her of it.

Add to that the age difference too.

Also, in the end, it has always been the girl's choice. My own mother married my dad after rejecting 7-8 people, some much richer than my dad was at the time.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

My more than decent financial situation has not helped me. I lived in a $2 million dollar house which my dad owns and half an appartment in my name for rent. My dad owns a few properties in the US, UK, Dubai, Pakistan but he is still scared of being turned down by an equally upper middle class family in this case.

In most cases this would have been a plus point but unfortunately I am cursed

Financial status only counts if the girl you desire is below that status and she thinks it would be a step up. You mentioned you don't have Imran Khan's luck, but luck has nothing to do with it. He is a world famous sportsman who was considered one of the most handsome men around at that time. If you can also become a super handsome world class sportsman then I think your curse can be lifted.

 

[Savak]

I'm not judging you. I'm tell you a fact. You are not like that, I'll admit I shouldn't have said that.

But people do think this way. People don't like marrying well above their social status because hamesha dab ke rhna parta hai. It's a fact, and while you may not think this way, someone in your family will, and will remind her of it.

Add to that the age difference too.

Also, in the end, it has always been the girl's choice. My own mother married my dad after rejecting 7-8 people, some much richer than my dad was at the time.

I believe to just blindly generalize rich or well of people to be snobbish, arrogant is not entirely true. Some of the most genuinely nice people who have a genuine regard for people and are extremely phillantrophic are very well off rich people.

Just look at Asad Umar and his personality, the guy retired from Engro at the peak of his career when he was making Rs 6,000,000 a month and with Stock Options worth Rs 300,000,000 at the age of 50.

 

[Savak]

Financial status only counts if the girl you desire is below that status and she thinks it would be a step up. You mentioned you don't have Imran Khan's luck, but luck has nothing to do with it. He is a world famous sportsman who was considered one of the most handsome men around at that time. If you can also become a super handsome world class sportsman then I think your curse can be lifted.

One can't generalize. A sensible guy will not marry into a family where they are more excited about getting married into a upper class rich family.

A friend of mine got engaged to a girl where there was a wealth gap between the two and the funny part is he was even involved with that girl for a year. The moment they got engaged, then the girls family started making financial demands, gifts and he eventually got put off and ended things with the girl because he realized the girl and the family were extremely materialistic and were just only excited about the guys and the family bank balance.

I remember also meeting a 40 year old Pakistani guy who was a pretty well established Accountant in a Big 4 firm and had just recently got married. He told me he was once nikofied and married to a Pakistani girl and she was even expecting his child but he divorced her and had filed an application with the embassy requesting to cancel her immigrant visa application which he sponsored and when I quizzed what went wrong, he was like she was just interested in my bank balance, the fact I was giving her an opportunity to come to Canada and he realized that her intentions were not correct. I didn't probe further

 

[InziRules]

I believe to just blindly generalize rich or well of people to be snobbish, arrogant is not entirely true. Some of the most genuinely nice people who have a genuine regard for people and are extremely phillantrophic are very well off rich people.

Just look at Asad Umar and his personality, the guy retired from Engro at the peak of his career when he was making Rs 6,000,000 a month and with Stock Options worth Rs 300,000,000 at the age of 50.

Our family is easily upper middle class, and I can name 2-3 people who would be snobbish to some new bride who isn't rich. Every family has people like this. It makes life hell, one of my Aunts and uncles live in Saudi because of how toxic it could get with some members of the family, all because she was from a family that once lived on Zakat..... about 200-300 years ago and some of our family couldn't stand that and reminded her of it.

 

[Jin Chacha]

You are overthinking this too much. Just sincerely tell her about your feelings and that you want to send your family over if the feeling is mutual. Given that this is going on for a few years, exactly how you say it would not really make or break your chances. She already knows enough about you to make a decision one way or another.

PS: You come across as a sincere person in your posts and have revealed details that others probably wouldn’t have but I would seriously recommend that you don’t post such sensitive personal details on the internet. Your posts reveal too much about your personal life and for someone who knows you in real life it would be very easy to make a guess about your identity.

 

[Adil_94]

[MENTION=137142]JaDed[/MENTION] in what way would u say rishta process is diff between India and Pak.

 

[ManFan]

No girl is worth the trouble.

Enjoy yourself.

 

[InziRules]

Btw, on the title itself, "Does one always need the girl on his side for arranged marriages today?"

Would you want to be married to someone who did not want to marry you?