How far will Pakistan progress in the ICC T20 World Cup 2024?

[Rana]

Riz & Babar are Pakistan’s greatest ever cricketers without a shadow of a doubt. If you cant back them then you cant back anyone. Their game was built on a model which suited Pakistan cricket in T20s and still does to be honest.

We have ruined their confidence as a pair due to the constant hate and team changes.

Never mind we have Saim and he must open no matter what. RizBar can rest from T20s as Pakistan look for the youngsters to take us forward.

But if Aaqib wants RizBar in T20s then we must support them.

On one hand you claim there is no doubt Riz and Babar are the greatest ever cricketers from Pakistan. On the other hand you have changed your tone to say Saim has to open no matter what.

Why must he now open no matter what if Riz and Babar are playing and are Pakistan’s greatest ever?

 

[Rana]

Check their numbers

Which ones? From the T20i world cups in powerplays where they opened?

 

[gazza619]

Which ones? From the T20i world cups in powerplays where they opened?

The only way we can prove that Riz is not one of Pakistan’s greatest ever w/k batter is if you find me 3 Pakistanis who are/were better than him.

The only way we can prove that Babar is not one of Pakistan’s greatest ever batters is if you find me 10 Pakistanis who are/were better than him.

 

[gazza619]

On one hand you claim there is no doubt Riz and Babar are the greatest ever cricketers from Pakistan. On the other hand you have changed your tone to say Saim has to open no matter what.

Why must he now open no matter what if Riz and Babar are playing and are Pakistan’s greatest ever?

I don’t blame you. I think it’s the optical illusions which you’re experiencing

 

[Rana]

The only way we can prove that Riz is not one of Pakistan’s greatest ever w/k batter is if you find me 3 Pakistanis who are/were better than him.

The only way we can prove that Babar is not one of Pakistan’s greatest ever batters is if you find me 10 Pakistanis who are/were better than him.

The only way I can prove anything to you is when you wake up from this delusion that they are the greatest ever. Otherwise, what use is it? You insist on keeping an insane view, I can’t help it.

 

[Rana]

I don’t blame you. I think it’s the optical illusions which you’re experiencing

But your argument is flimsy? Why must Saim open now if Babar and Rizwan are still there according to you?

 

[mominsaigol]

The only way we can prove that Riz is not one of Pakistan’s greatest ever w/k batter is if you find me 3 Pakistanis who are/were better than him.

The only way we can prove that Babar is not one of Pakistan’s greatest ever batters is if you find me 10 Pakistanis who are/were better than him.

You said these 2 were the greatest and that theirs no doubt

So why do I have to find you 3 and 10? Why not just 1?

Greatest means top 1?

 

[mominsaigol]

Riz & Babar are Pakistan’s greatest ever cricketers without a shadow of a doubt. If you cant back them then you cant back anyone. Their game was built on a model which suited Pakistan cricket in T20s and still does to be honest.

We have ruined their confidence as a pair due to the constant hate and team changes.

Never mind we have Saim and he must open no matter what. RizBar can rest from T20s as Pakistan look for the youngsters to take us forward.

But if Aaqib wants RizBar in T20s then we must support them.

Riz & Babar are Pakistan’s greatest ever cricketers without a shadow of a doubt.

^^ This was your claim?

firstly for rizwan hes a barely avg 40+ test and odi batter with only 3 centuries in each format? And for test just avg numbers overseas? Credit to him for avg 46 in aus though.

Compare that to Yousaf in tests and odi, Yousaf who averages both 50+ in test and in odi has 15 centuries?

How is rizzu > him? Then the less said about t20 the better.

As for Babar, Babar only surpasses them in avg and metric but he benefits from batting in Cricket's most batting friendly.

In this era bi laterals are meaningless, what matters is Icc events to measure odi success and babar hasnt been that good in comparison. He's missing impact points since he onoy has one vs NZ?

How is that > Inzi, Yousaf, Saeed who essentially clobber him in impact points?

No point comparing their avg and century tally. This would put thr likes of shai hope > Viv lol. And Babar > Pointing

 

[gazza619]

You said these 2 were the greatest and that theirs no doubt

So why do I have to find you 3 and 10? Why not just 1?

Greatest means top 1?

Excuse my typo. I think you are smart enough to know that I meant they are one of Pakistan’s greatest ever

 

[mominsaigol]

Excuse my typo. I think you are smart enough to know that I meant they are one of Pakistan’s greatest ever

Well do add in more filters such as batters + wicket keeper batters, because greatest ever would have them compete with bowlers and allrounders as well. In which case the likes of Imran, Wasim, Waqar and many others would kick them out of the top 10 list by default.

Now to add to your point.

Yes rizwan is Pakistan’s best ever keeper batsmen and babar would probably be somewhere in top 10 pakistani batters. But so?

The goal isn't to compete against one each other across eras, it's too compete with teams across eras?

1992-1999 pakistan was a solid team, for the era at hand, excluding classic Australia which demolished everyone from 1996 onwards.

They were settled 11's with top tier bowling and decent batting that got to 250 to 260 scores which was standard for that era and that's mainly cause the 11's were settled.

I can confidently say that the likes of inzi, Miandad, Yousaf, Younis, Saeed Anwar, Wasim akram, Waqar younis, Imran Khan and many others are easily comparable to their competitors in that era.

Even our wicket keepers like moin Khan are comparable to the likes of boucher as batters etc, infact it's only gilly and sanga in tests who are head and shoulders > the rest.

Flashforward to this modern era, Which one of our batters competes with other teams?

Fakhar onsong and saim onsong + Saud in test are the only ones I can think of? Otherwise Rizwan is probably the worst no 4 and t20 opener in this era? Excluding minnows? And Babar is just bang avg and doesn't compare to other openers/top order in this era especially in test + t20

 

[gazza619]

Well do add in more filters such as batters + wicket keeper batters, because greatest ever would have them compete with bowlers and allrounders as well. In which case the likes of Imran, Wasim, Waqar and many others would kick them out of the top 10 list by default.

Now to add to your point.

Yes rizwan is Pakistan’s best ever keeper batsmen and babar would probably be somewhere in top 10 pakistani batters. But so?

The goal isn't to compete against one each other across eras, it's too compete with teams across eras?

1992-1999 pakistan was a solid team, for the era at hand, excluding classic Australia which demolished everyone from 1996 onwards.

They were settled 11's with top tier bowling and decent batting that got to 250 to 260 scores which was standard for that era and that's mainly cause the 11's were settled.

I can confidently say that the likes of inzi, Miandad, Yousaf, Younis, Saeed Anwar, Wasim akram, Waqar younis, Imran Khan and many others are easily comparable to their competitors in that era.

Even our wicket keepers like moin Khan are comparable to the likes of boucher as batters etc, infact it's only gilly and sanga in tests who are head and shoulders > the rest.

Flashforward to this modern era, Which one of our batters competes with other teams?

Fakhar onsong and saim onsong + Saud in test are the only ones I can think of? Otherwise Rizwan is probably the worst no 4 and t20 opener in this era? Excluding minnows? And Babar is just bang avg and doesn't compare to other openers/top order in this era especially in test + t20

I made a thread very recently that Riz needs to let go of the number 4 spot in ODIs. I am now also supporting the notion that both Riz & Babar must rest from T20s. I like Saud, Saim & Fakhar. I think both of us are mostly on the same page. Babar has been below par for a while now. You don’t like Babar but I am of the view that he will make great contributions in Tests & ODIs again. This is our main point of argument really.

 

[Devadwal]

Semi Final minimum!

It's in the bag.

I think they will be the finalists once again.

We are gonna win the thing.

Kings of the Caribbean.

Happy New year .Khamma Ghani

Only my friend @The Bald Eagle predicted the right .

 

[mominsaigol]

I made a thread very recently that Riz needs to let go of the number 4 spot in ODIs. I am now also supporting the notion that both Riz & Babar must rest from T20s. I like Saud, Saim & Fakhar. I think both of us are mostly on the same page. Babar has been below par for a while now. You don’t like Babar but I am of the view that he will make great contributions in Tests & ODIs again. This is our main point of argument really.

I never complained about babar in odi. I actually think the criticism is unfair in odi. Reason why I have disagreed with some posters, is because their overdoing it calling him the best pakistani odi batter of all time.

However the criticism for odi is a bit unfair.

As for test, he's a crap test player. Infact excluding the openers, I dont think he replaces any test cricketer from our no 1 ranked uae team.

Azhar for all his faults has a double century in aus, a triple century + 19 test cemtutries which I doubt babar will reach. Younis is irreplaceable and babar can't bat any lower then 4 to begin with. Misbah was captain so its between babar, Asad and Sarfaraz. Asad and sarfi understood uae conditons more whereas babar is a bunny vs spin.

 

[The Bald Eagle]

Happy New year .Khamma Ghani

Only my friend @The Bald Eagle predicted the right .

Likewise @Devadwal , wish you a great year