If Pakistan had faced India in Test cricket over the last decade

[street cricketer]

Fair enough, but I am leaning towards a 1-1 draw since in 2015 it was an early Kohli side, which hadn't yet established its dominance. Kohli's team's peak came later.

Pak got whitewashed in Sri Lanka the previous year while India won the series in Lanka in 2015 (should've been a whitewash really if not for a bottlejob and an incredible innings by Chandimal at Galle). Pak also drew with Lanka and NZ in the UAE, I might be wrong but I don't think Lanka has ever won a single test in India in their test cricket history, and the last time the Kiwis won a test in India, Sir Hadlee and Kapil Dev were locking horns.

Kohli's India has arguably the greatest home record in the history of test cricket. They are yet to lose to a single side, and it's not just that, but they've won every single series they've played in Kohli's tenure. It would be interesting to compare how India's home record under Kohli stacks up against the home record of the Great Australians or the West Indians. India drew with Australia in 2003 and Pak drew with WI in '88, no side gas ever even drawn a single series against India under Kohli. That's how ruthless they've been. I mean you can criticise India's record outside Asia and it would be warranted, but the home record is something that will stay in the records for years to come.

 

[Mesozoic]

Fair enough, but I am leaning towards a 1-1 draw since in 2015 it was an early Kohli side which hadn't yet established its dominance. Kohli's team's peak came later.

There was no "Kohli side" in 2015. It was pretty much Dhoni's settled amd a strong home side that he inherited. The entire composition of that team was solidified in 2013 in the games against Australia and later against West indies. Dhawan, Vijay, Rahane, Jadeja, Shami etc all became mainstays under Dhoni....

 

[BreadPakoda]

Wish India had played Pakistan in UAE even in ODIs during this period. UAE was a fortress for Pakistan in the last decade. Careers of the many Rohits and Dhawans would have been destroyed. One Hassan Ali would be enough.

 

[King_Kohli]

Wish India had played Pakistan in UAE even in ODIs during this period. UAE was a fortress for Pakistan in the last decade. Careers of the many Rohits and Dhawans would have been destroyed. One Hassan Ali would be enough.

How come?
Rohit and Dhawan are proven world class players , they scored everywhere under tough conditions.

 

[BreadPakoda]

How come?
Rohit and Dhawan are proven world class players , they scored everywhere under tough conditions.

Phony accomplishments. Can they do it in UAE vs Hassan Ali on a consistent basis?

 

[Mesozoic]

Wish India had played Pakistan in UAE even in ODIs during this period. UAE was a fortress for Pakistan in the last decade. Careers of the many Rohits and Dhawans would have been destroyed. One Hassan Ali would be enough.

Yeah. He could have picked that much awaited 10-for as well. Too bad we didnt play....

 

[The lone Ranger]

Don't think Pakistan would have won a single test match against india at home, away or anywhere in the last decade let alone series.

They were losing to Zimbabwe , srilanka and newzealand of all teams. No chance against india.

India were far superior and the gab will only get wider and widen.

 

[szrana007]

Pak got whitewashed in Sri Lanka the previous year while India won the series in Lanka in 2015

Pak also won the series in Sri Lanka in the same year. Both teams won 2-1 in Sri Lanka, that tells me that both teams were pretty evenly matched back in 2015. In UAE in the same year Pakistan demolished England, while India demolished South Africa.

So could have been a great series back in 2015/16 and I am voting for a 1-1 drawn series.

 

[Markhor]

Not even 4 hours and already 2 pages

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

It's also funny how OP chose just those specific years.

Like why 2012 and not 2013, the year in which we beat Australia 4-0 and Pakistan lost a Test to Mugabe's Zimbabwe in addition to losing by an innings margin to South Africa in the UAE....

Or 2014 where they got swept by Sri Lanka and lost a test by an innings margin to a certain Mark Craig,

Why 2015 and not 2016-17, the period which saw us win 16 while losing just 1 test and Pakistan lose multiple Tests to West Indies and a clean sweep in the UAE against SL....

Got to say , OP's time selection is mucb smarter than we give him credit for.

Haha true.

Smart boy.

I think barring a year or two, it would be a no contest.

But a series at that precise time would have been fun.

 

[Mamoon]

The level of delusion in this thread is so great that I don’t know where to start and where to end, so I guess I will see myself out with the following statement:

The lack of bilateral cricket between Pakistan and India over the last 6-7 years is the best thing that could have happened to Pakistan cricket.

A full series with India home and away every two years would have been sufficient for our fans to lose interest in the game and for cricket to go the hockey way.

 

[street cricketer]

Pak also won the series in Sri Lanka in the same year. Both teams won 2-1 in Sri Lanka, that tells me that both teams were pretty evenly matched back in 2015.

No, that tells you both teams had the same result for a single series. Nothing more than that.

In UAE in the same year Pakistan demolished England, while India demolished South Africa.

So could have been a great series back in 2015/16 and I am voting for a 1-1 drawn series.

India didn't lose a series to Sri Lanka or fail to win a series against the kiwis at home. Their W/L ratio in asia since 2014 are miles apart. Not that Pak has a worse record, 1 point something is still a good W/L ratio but India's W/L ratio in asia since 2014 is simply a joke.

 

[Mamoon]

If the 2018 Asia Cup didn’t happen and India pulled out, our fans would not stop talking about how India were scared to play Pakistan in UAE after the CT Final, and they would have never entertained the possibility of India demolishing Pakistan twice without Kohli.

In terms of Test cricket, apart from the 2012-13 period where England and Pakistan caught India at the right time in Tests and ODIs respectively, India would have rinsed Pakistan throughout this decade.

The Indian cricket team has been three levels above Pakistan in all formats in terms of talent, skill and mental application for many years now.

 

[docteurmanish]

India too is grateful . Excess cricket would have killed india esp with ipl now . Indians don’t play Sri Lanka as often as they used to now . Finally india is basically benifit ting from playing less but more quality cricket

 

[szrana007]

No, that tells you both teams had the same result for a single series. Nothing more than that.



India didn't lose a series to Sri Lanka or fail to win a series against the kiwis at home. Their W/L ratio in asia since 2014 are miles apart. Not that Pak has a worse record, 1 point something is still a good W/L ratio but India's W/L ratio in asia since 2014 is simply a joke.

Well, India didn't play in Sri Lanka between 2011-14, while Pakistan played twice and lost both times. From 2011-14, Sri Lanka were much stronger with with both Mahela and Sanga playing. In 2015 both Pak and India beat a much weaker Sri Lanka when Mahela had retired and Sanga was past his prime and only played 1 match of the both series, I think.

From 2016 onwards, India has been a much better team than Pak, but it was pretty even stevens in 2015.

 

[street cricketer]

Well, India didn't play in Sri Lanka between 2011-14, while Pakistan played twice and lost both times. From 2011-14, Sri Lanka were much stronger with with both Mahela and Sanga playing. In 2015 both Pak and India beat a much weaker Sri Lanka when Mahela had retired and Sanga was past his prime and only played 1 match of the both series, I think.

From 2016 onwards, India has been a much better team than Pak, but it was pretty even stevens in 2015.

Sanga hit 4 tons in the World cup in Australia just days prior to that series. Let's agree to disagree.

 

[NishanKonar]

Wish India had played Pakistan in UAE even in ODIs during this period. UAE was a fortress for Pakistan in the last decade. Careers of the many Rohits and Dhawans would have been destroyed. One Hassan Ali would be enough.

Lol. Hasan Ali was bullied so badly by Dhawan & Rohit in 2018 Asia Cup in UAE that it totally destroyed his confidence. Took him 3 years to recover his old form

 

[Nikhil_cric]

A lot of test careers would have been destroyed too.
The likes of Dhawan, Rohit, Kohli and Pujara would probably have been dropped from India's test side had they played consistently against Pakistan since 2010.

So really India should thank its lucky stars that their Government decided to politicise sport.

Absolutely. A team that struggled to avoid getting whitewashed by Zimbabwe despite playing a 45 degree chucked would have ended our players' careers and given them nightmares.

 

[szrana007]

Sanga hit 4 tons in the World cup in Australia just days prior to that series. Let's agree to disagree.

Just checked Sanga only played 1 match of the India series and 2 matches of the Pakistan series, so even if he wasn't past his prime he didn't play the whole series against both Pak and India. So that Sri Lankan team was certainly much weaker than the ones Pakistan faced in 2012 and 2014 in Sri Lanka.

 

[street cricketer]

Just checked Sanga only played 1 match of the India series and 2 matches of the Pakistan series, so even if he wasn't past his prime he didn't play the whole series against both Pak and India. So that Sri Lankan team was certainly much weaker than the ones Pakistan faced in 2012 and 2014 in Sri Lanka.

Well you're checking the wrong website.

 

[BreadPakoda]

Just checked Sanga only played 1 match of the India series and 2 matches of the Pakistan series, so even if he wasn't past his prime he didn't play the whole series against both Pak and India. So that Sri Lankan team was certainly much weaker than the ones Pakistan faced in 2012 and 2014 in Sri Lanka.

Sanga played 2 matches, not 1 out of the 3 against India. But your point is still correct. This was a very different Sri Lanka that India defeated. Pakistan lost to an in-form Sri Lanka. No comparison.

 

[Local.Dada]

Thread should be renamed “Coping Mechanism”

A team that has been top 2 over the last decade vs a no.7-no.8 team really?

Pak can win vs India if they get lottery conditions like the 3rd test pitch vs England recently. That’s about it. That’s what happened in 2012 too. Outside of that, one must be really delusional to think the results would be any other way.

As I said this seems like coping mechanism to me rather than a rational thought.

 

[Local.Dada]

If the 2018 Asia Cup didn’t happen and India pulled out, our fans would not stop talking about how India were scared to play Pakistan in UAE after the CT Final, and they would have never entertained the possibility of India demolishing Pakistan twice without Kohli.

In terms of Test cricket, apart from the 2012-13 period where England and Pakistan caught India at the right time in Tests and ODIs respectively, India would have rinsed Pakistan throughout this decade.

The Indian cricket team has been three levels above Pakistan in all formats in terms of talent, skill and mental application for many years now.

The 2018 Asia cup did bust a lot of myths. Also while I still think Pakistan currently overall is the 2nd best SC team. In SC/UAE conditions they are 3rd behind India and Bangladesh. That was a rightful reflection of where things stand.

 

[szrana007]

Well you're checking the wrong website.

Yeah just checked from cricinfo now, Sanga played 2 matches of both series against Pak and India, but my point still stands.

 

[szrana007]

The 2018 Asia cup did bust a lot of myths. Also while I still think Pakistan currently overall is the 2nd best SC team. In SC/UAE conditions they are 3rd behind India and Bangladesh. That was a rightful reflection of where things stand.

Lol @ Bangladesh being ahead of Pakistan. What are Bangladesh's rankings ?

 

[BreadPakoda]

Lol @ Bangladesh being ahead of Pakistan. What are Bangladesh's rankings ?

If rankings is the basis then this thread has no point.

 

[IMMY69]

The only thing the 2018 Asia Cup proved was that Kohli is a ridiculously bad captain and that Rohit should have been captaining the side in the shorter formats.

 

[shamaan]

2021 won't have been an even contest at all. Pak are currently an awful side and Babar has found some weakness vs spin too.

Whilst india got fount out by root...

 

[szrana007]

If rankings is the basis then this thread has no point.

Pakistan had a much better W/L ratio than India in the 2011-2015 period and were consistently ranked higher than them too, so this thread has some merit.

https://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/e...2011;spanval1=span;template=results;type=team

But 2016 onwards India has been much better than Pak and today obviously India would be favorites against Pak.

 

[szrana007]

Laughably fraud logic....

India toured Australia, England and South Africa twice in that period.
Pak toured just south Africa once .
Ofcourse their win loss would be better ...

Pak also toured NZL in that period, but the Indian team of that period was in transition, while Pak had a much settled team, so Pak were clearly better.

 

[BreadPakoda]

Don’t understand why some posters are putting down Bangladesh. As we saw during the 2015 Banglawash, Asia Cup, and so many times, Pakistan vs Bangladesh is much closer than what the rankings suggest. It’s a mouth watering contest result of which can go any way.

 

[Heisenberg111]

Don’t understand why some posters are putting down Bangladesh. As we saw during the 2015 Banglawash, Asia Cup, and so many times, Pakistan vs Bangladesh is much closer than what the rankings suggest. It’s a mouth watering contest result of which can go any way.

What happened to BD last year against Pak ?

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

The only thing the 2018 Asia Cup proved was that Kohli is a ridiculously bad captain and that Rohit should have been captaining the side in the shorter formats.

Oh no...it proved a lot of things mate.

Lets not go there tho.

 

[BreadPakoda]

Pakistan had a much better W/L ratio than India in the 2011-2015 period and were consistently ranked higher than them too, so this thread has some merit.

https://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/e...2011;spanval1=span;template=results;type=team

But 2016 onwards India has been much better than Pak and today obviously India would be favorites against Pak.

What was the WL in Asia? That’s more relevant because India lost too many away games against England and Australia during this time. Pakistan doesn’t play as many away games against SENA. Imagine Pakistan playing 5 match series in Australia lol

 

[Heisenberg111]

Pak got whitewashed in Sri Lanka the previous year while India won the series in Lanka in 2015 (should've been a whitewash really if not for a bottlejob and an incredible innings by Chandimal at Galle). Pak also drew with Lanka and NZ in the UAE, I might be wrong but I don't think Lanka has ever won a single test in India in their test cricket history, and the last time the Kiwis won a test in India, Sir Hadlee and Kapil Dev were locking horns.

Kohli's India has arguably the greatest home record in the history of test cricket. They are yet to lose to a single side, and it's not just that, but they've won every single series they've played in Kohli's tenure. It would be interesting to compare how India's home record under Kohli stacks up against the home record of the Great Australians or the West Indians. India drew with Australia in 2003 and Pak drew with WI in '88, no side gas ever even drawn a single series against India under Kohli. That's how ruthless they've been. I mean you can criticise India's record outside Asia and it would be warranted, but the home record is something that will stay in the records for years to come.

Great Aussie team went 28 continuous series undefeated at home albeit that includes 3 drawn series.

Great WI team went 16 continuous series undefeated at home, that includes 2 drawn series too.

Current Indian team is on 13 series undefeated run at home and ofcourse they have won all of them.

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

Assuming people are talking about bilaterals only. Let me sum this thread up.

If A beat B
And B beat C
Then obviously A is better than C.

However in reality this is not how things work. Some fans who have never seen Indo Pak test cricket in life can't understand outside pressure, history and expectations from these players when they play against each other. As I have said here multiple times, rankings don't matter in Ind vs Pak matches. Pakistan playing against India in India is different that Pakistan playing India in Aus or Eng. Their spinners will get help from the pitches here too and presently our batsman are not that good playing against spin.

 

[Rajdeep]

The only thing the 2018 Asia Cup proved was that Kohli is a ridiculously bad captain and that Rohit should have been captaining the side in the shorter formats.

But Kohli led India beat your team again in 2019 WC and as badly as in Asia cup.

 

[szrana007]

What was the WL in Asia? That’s more relevant because India lost too many away games against England and Australia during this time. Pakistan doesn’t play as many away games against SENA. Imagine Pakistan playing 5 match series in Australia lol

I don't know about W/L ratios in Asia, but Pakistan had a pretty good record in the UAE from 2011-2015. I am sure India had a great record at home too in that period.

But you talked about rankings, and I remember Pakistan being consistently ranked higher than India in that period.

 

[OMB]

Oh the irony of this. )

Shades of
>

 

[BreadPakoda]

I don't know about W/L ratios in Asia, but Pakistan had a pretty good record in the UAE from 2011-2015. I am sure India had a great record at home too in that period.

But you talked about rankings, and I remember Pakistan being consistently ranked higher than India in that period.

Rankings on every Jan 1

2011: India: 1, Pakistan: 6
2012: India: 4, Pakistan: 5
2013: India: 5, Pakistan: 4
2014: India: 3, Pakistan: 5
2015: India: 4, Pakistan: 3
2016: India: 3, Pakistan: 4

Only twice did Pakistan rank better out of 5 years - you can take 2011-2015 or 2012-2016. So no Pakistan wasn't ranked consistently higher.

 

[street cricketer]

Yeah just checked from cricinfo now, Sanga played 2 matches of both series against Pak and India, but my point still stands.

Your point is that because Pakistan lost against Sri Lanka and failed to win against New Zealand, India would have similar results too but that's the definition of conjecture. India has shown zero flaws in the subcontinent after the series defeat to England and so one has zero reason to expect India to struggle against SL and NZ.

The W/L ratio of both sides from 2014-2015 tells the whole story.

Pak - 1.8
Ind - 5

Like I said, it's not that Pak was poor in that period. They were clearly the best side after India. But India has been miles better than every other side ever since that loss in 2012 against England.

 

[szrana007]

Rankings on every Jan 1

2011: India: 1, Pakistan: 6
2012: India: 4, Pakistan: 5
2013: India: 5, Pakistan: 4
2014: India: 3, Pakistan: 5
2015: India: 4, Pakistan: 3
2016: India: 3, Pakistan: 4

Only twice did Pakistan rank better out of 5 years - you can take 2011-2015 or 2012-2016. So no Pakistan wasn't ranked consistently higher.

I remember India slipping to no.7 in the Test rankings in 2015. You have only posted rankings at the start of the each year while rankings tend to change every month.

Pakistan was higher ranked than India for more time between 2012-2016, I am sure.

 

[Rajdeep]

Assuming people are talking about bilaterals only. Let me sum this thread up.

If A beat B
And B beat C
Then obviously A is better than C.

However in reality this is not how things work. Some fans who have never seen Indo Pak test cricket in life can't understand outside pressure, history and expectations from these players when they play against each other. As I have said here multiple times, rankings don't matter in Ind vs Pak matches. Pakistan playing against India in India is different that Pakistan playing India in Aus or Eng. Their spinners will get help from the pitches here too and presently our batsman are not that good playing against spin.

Think you are stuck in 90s as modern Indian team and players dont take any extra pressure of playing against Pakistan. Players are much more tailor made and professional now to think along those lines. They treat every game equally irrespective of whether its against Pakistan, Australia or Honolulu. The fact that India send a team without its captain and best player in last Asia cup like they did in 2014 shows they dont necessarily treat Pakistan game as anything extra special.

Also, rankings do matter in Indo-Pak game like it does for any other clash. There is a reason why barring few odd occassions, India has beaten Pakistan in all recent encounters in one sided defeats. If a test series happens now, India would beat Pakistan unless we underperform severely.

 

[szrana007]

Rankings on every Jan 1

2011: India: 1, Pakistan: 6
2012: India: 4, Pakistan: 5
2013: India: 5, Pakistan: 4
2014: India: 3, Pakistan: 5
2015: India: 4, Pakistan: 3
2016: India: 3, Pakistan: 4

Only twice did Pakistan rank better out of 5 years - you can take 2011-2015 or 2012-2016. So no Pakistan wasn't ranked consistently higher.

You posted that India at start of 2012 was higher ranked than Pak, well guess what? Pak were ranked higher than India later in the same year from August onwards.

https://web.archive.org/web/2013032...ket.com/match_zone/test_ranking.php?year=2012

Just proves my point that rankings tend to change after a few months and posting the rankings from just the start of the year doesn't reflect that.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Pakistan had a much better W/L ratio than India in the 2011-2015 period and were consistently ranked higher than them too, so this thread has some merit.

https://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/e...2011;spanval1=span;template=results;type=team

But 2016 onwards India has been much better than Pak and today obviously India would be favorites against Pak.

Spreading half facts.

India was comfortably ahead of Pakistan when home venues were considered in this period.

https://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/e...2011;spanval1=span;template=results;type=team


They were also comfortably ahead of Pakistan in Asia.

https://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/e...2011;spanval1=span;template=results;type=team


Unless Pakistan was England South Africa Australia New Zealand playing in SENA, they had no chance in beating India.

 

[cricketjoshila]

What was the WL in Asia? That’s more relevant because India lost too many away games against England and Australia during this time. Pakistan doesn’t play as many away games against SENA. Imagine Pakistan playing 5 match series in Australia lol

Australia wont invite them for a 5 match series.

 

[BreadPakoda]

You posted that India at start of 2012 was higher ranked than Pak, well guess what? Pak were ranked higher than India later in the same year from August onwards.

https://web.archive.org/web/2013032...ket.com/match_zone/test_ranking.php?year=2012

Just proves my point that rankings tend to change after a few months and posting the rankings from just the start of the year doesn't reflect that.

Bro you stated that Pakistan ranked consistently higher than India without sharing any supporting data. I agree that I shared one data point per year but I took Jan 1 without any bias. If you have data to support that Pakistan ranked higher than India in terms of number of days pls share. You may very well be correct but I can’t take your word without supporting data. “I remember it very well” doesn’t help especially after your Sangakarra goof up on the same page.

 

[szrana007]

Your point is that because Pakistan lost against Sri Lanka and failed to win against New Zealand, India would have similar results too but that's the definition of conjecture. India has shown zero flaws in the subcontinent after the series defeat to England and so one has zero reason to expect India to struggle against SL and NZ.

The W/L ratio of both sides from 2014-2015 tells the whole story.

Pak - 1.8
Ind - 5

Like I said, it's not that Pak was poor in that period. They were clearly the best side after India. But India has been miles better than every other side ever since that loss in 2012 against England.

India only played 3 series in Asia from 2014-15, while Pak played 6 series, so W/L ratios are skewed due to that.

But if you look at the number of matches played in Asia for both teams from 2014-15

Pakistan in Asia (from 2014-15)

Matches Played 18
Matches Won 9
Matches Lost 5
Matches Drawn 4

W/L ratio = 1.8

India in Asia (from 2014-15)

Matches Played 8
Matches Won 5
Matches Lost 1
Matches Drawn 2

W/L ratio of 5.0

So Pakistan played almost 3 times the number of matches in Asia compared to India, their W/L ratio is bound to be lower.

Anyway, Pakistan's W/L ratio is much lower because they lost 0-2 to a stronger Sri Lanka in 2014. And thats my point as well that India didn't face a stronger SL side in SL.

 

[BreadPakoda]

So Pakistan played almost 3 times the number of matches in Asia compared to India, their W/L ratio is bound to be lower.

What?

 

[IMMY69]

Oh no...it proved a lot of things mate.

Lets not go there tho.

Yes but all of which were inconsequential other then Kohli not being there and hence proving that he's a pathetic captain.

Why was it all inconsequential? Because we're talking test cricket and not ODI's

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

Yes but all of which were inconsequential other then Kohli not being there and hence proving that he's a pathetic captain.

Why was it all inconsequential? Because we're talking test cricket and not ODI's

You dont need Asia cup to know Kohli is a pathetic loi captain.

 

[szrana007]

Bro you stated that Pakistan ranked consistently higher than India without sharing any supporting data. I agree that I shared one data point per year but I took Jan 1 without any bias. If you have data to support that Pakistan ranked higher than India in terms of number of days pls share. You may very well be correct but I can’t take your word without supporting data. “I remember it very well” doesn’t help especially after your Sangakarra goof up on the same page.

I can't find any source here to share the number of days, Pakistan was ranked ahead of India but I am going by my memory.

Btw, you posted that India were 4th at the start of 2015, but in January 2015, they were at 7th.

https://www.indiatvnews.com/sports/cricket/team-india-slips-to-7th-in-icc-test-rankings-14962.html

So I am 100 % sure that Pakistan were ranked above India for atleast 10 months in 2015, except maybe at the end of 2015, when India beat South Africa 3-0 and overtook Pakistan.

 

[szrana007]

What?

Point is India's data size is smaller, so W/L ratios can be skewed coz of that.

 

[IMMY69]

You dont need Asia cup to know Kohli is a pathetic loi captain.

Reckon he's useless in test matches too.

 

[street cricketer]

India only played 3 series in Asia from 2014-15, while Pak played 6 series, so W/L ratios are skewed due to that.

But if you look at the number of matches played in Asia for both teams from 2014-15

Pakistan in Asia (from 2014-15)

Matches Played 18
Matches Won 9
Matches Lost 5
Matches Drawn 4

W/L ratio = 1.8

India in Asia (from 2014-15)

Matches Played 8
Matches Won 5
Matches Lost 1
Matches Drawn 2

W/L ratio of 5.0

So Pakistan played almost 3 times the number of matches in Asia compared to India, their W/L ratio is bound to be lower.

Anyway, Pakistan's W/L ratio is much lower because they lost 0-2 to a stronger Sri Lanka in 2014. And thats my point as well that India didn't face a stronger SL side in SL.

Mate, 18/8 is not "almost 3 times", it's just over 2 times. Anyway you keep ignoring Pak failing to win against NZ and losing a test by an innings while giving a 10fer to Mark Craig of all people. What next, are you gonna say India dodged a stronger NZ side with Mark Craig in it? What you're indulging in is the definition of conjecture.

I have absolutely no doubt in my mind that India would have started overwhelming favourites post 2012 against Pakistan, now I can't force you to agree with my statement. So feel free to disagree.

 

[Suleiman]

All these posts and threads about wanting a Pakistan vs India in tests in present times, all these posts seem to come from Pakistanis only. Little to no reciprocation from Indians. Shows who is obsessed with who. One wants to prove something languishing at the bottom of the table, the other really has nothing to prove.

 

[szrana007]

Mate, 18/8 is not "almost 3 times", it's just over 2 times. Anyway you keep ignoring Pak failing to win against NZ and losing a test by an innings while giving a 10fer to Mark Craig of all people. What next, are you gonna say India dodged a stronger NZ side with Mark Craig in it? What you're indulging in is the definition of conjecture.

I have absolutely no doubt in my mind that India would have started overwhelming favourites post 2012 against Pakistan, now I can't force you to agree with my statement. So feel free to disagree.

Mate, India were ranked below Pakistan for most of 2015 in the ICC test rankings, so how can you say that India would have been overwhelming favorites against Pakistan in a series in 2015? when Pakistan was the higher ranked team for the most part in the same year?

 

[BreadPakoda]

I can't find any source here to share the number of days, Pakistan was ranked ahead of India but I am going by my memory.

Btw, you posted that India were 4th at the start of 2015, but in January 2015, they were at 7th.

https://www.indiatvnews.com/sports/cricket/team-india-slips-to-7th-in-icc-test-rankings-14962.html

I posted ranks as on Jan 1. India was ranked 4th. Here's the source:

http://idlesummers.com/ratings.php

India's rank may have gone down later in Jan. So I am correct with regards to India's rank as on Jan 1.

So I am 100 % sure that Pakistan were ranked above India for atleast 10 months in 2015, except maybe at the end of 2015, when India beat South Africa 3-0 and overtook Pakistan.

First you say you are 100% sure that India was consistently ranked lower than Pakistan from 2011 to 2015.
Now you say you are 100% sure about something else.

You need to share supporting data for Pakistan being ranked consistently above India between 2011-2015. I am sorry but your being "100% sure" doesn't matter. That's not how things work in real world.

 

[BreadPakoda]

Point is India's data size is smaller, so W/L ratios can be skewed coz of that.

That's not what you said.

So Pakistan played almost 3 times the number of matches in Asia compared to India, their W/L ratio is bound to be lower.

This is not how things work in real world. Playing more matches (and arbitrability more in this case) does not always reduce your W/L ratio. Sorry mate, this argument is not progressing anywhere. Can't be part of it any more.

 

[Amjid Javed]

Great Aussie team went 28 continuous series undefeated at home albeit that includes 3 drawn series.

Great WI team went 16 continuous series undefeated at home, that includes 2 drawn series too.

Current Indian team is on 13 series undefeated run at home and ofcourse they have won all of them.

Great Aussie and WI teams were good away from home aswell. Something india still need to prove in NZ / SA and Eng

 

[szrana007]

Mate, 18/8 is not "almost 3 times", it's just over 2 times. Anyway you keep ignoring Pak failing to win against NZ and losing a test by an innings while giving a 10fer to Mark Craig of all people. What next, are you gonna say India dodged a stronger NZ side with Mark Craig in it? What you're indulging in is the definition of conjecture.

I have absolutely no doubt in my mind that India would have started overwhelming favourites post 2012 against Pakistan, now I can't force you to agree with my statement. So feel free to disagree.

https://www.indiatvnews.com/sports/cricket/team-india-slips-to-7th-in-icc-test-rankings-14962.html

This is from the same year, India were ranked 7th in ICC test rankings in January 2015, and were below Pakistan in the rankings for most of the year, so I don't think you can claim that they would have been overwhelming favorites against Pak in 2015.

 

[Kashmirilion]

I'm not a pessimist like mamoon but fact is India would win every series..

 

[NishanKonar]

The only thing the 2018 Asia Cup proved was that Kohli is a ridiculously bad captain and that Rohit should have been captaining the side in the shorter formats.

50% of India agrees with you !

 

[szrana007]

I posted ranks as on Jan 1. India was ranked 4th. Here's the source:

http://idlesummers.com/ratings.php

India's rank may have gone down later in Jan. So I am correct with regards to India's rank as on Jan 1.



First you say you are 100% sure that India was consistently ranked lower than Pakistan from 2011 to 2015.
Now you say you are 100% sure about something else.

You need to share supporting data for Pakistan being ranked consistently above India between 2011-2015. I am sorry but your being "100% sure" doesn't matter. That's not how things work in real world.

If a series between the two teams happened in 2015, Pakistan would have been favorites based on their higher ranking. India were 7th ranked team in 2015, their ranking only improved after beating South Africa later in the year.

 

[street cricketer]

https://www.indiatvnews.com/sports/cricket/team-india-slips-to-7th-in-icc-test-rankings-14962.html

This is from the same year, India were ranked 7th in ICC test rankings in January 2015, and were below Pakistan in the rankings for most of the year, so I don't think you can claim that they would have been overwhelming favorites against Pak in 2015.

I thought we were talking about a series in the subcontinent. Why would the overall rankings matter?

Do you know why India played so few tests in asia during 2014-15 in comparison to Pakistan? It's because India was taking part in the overseas cycle of their fixtures which all came almost back to back (SA tour, NZ tour, Eng tour, Aus tour), where they fared badly and hence the drop in rankings. Why would you use India's performances outside Asia against their ability to compete in asia where even during that period where they were ranked low, they were near to invincible in the subcontinent. It makes no sense.

 

[street cricketer]

Great Aussie and WI teams were good away from home aswell. Something india still need to prove in NZ / SA and Eng

We were clearly talking about just home domination.

 

[street cricketer]

Great Aussie team went 28 continuous series undefeated at home albeit that includes 3 drawn series.

Great WI team went 16 continuous series undefeated at home, that includes 2 drawn series too.

Current Indian team is on 13 series undefeated run at home and ofcourse they have won all of them.

Thanks buddy, West Indian record is breachable but the Australian record seems very difficult.

 

[szrana007]

I thought we were talking about a series in the subcontinent. Why would the overall rankings matter?

Do you know why India played so few tests in asia during 2014-15 in comparison to Pakistan? It's because India was taking part in the overseas cycle of their fixtures which all came almost back to back (SA tour, NZ tour, Eng tour, Aus tour), where they fared badly and hence the drop in rankings. Why would you use India's performances outside Asia against their ability to compete in asia where even during that period where they were ranked low, they were near to invincible in the subcontinent. It makes no sense.

You are right about India faring badly outside Asia and being ranked no.7 in 2015, while Pak were ranked no.3 for most of the year. But even if you ignore the rankings, I just don't think that India were overwhelming favorites against Pak in 2015, maybe slight but definitely not overwhelming.

 

[Ab Fan]

Whilst india got fount out by root...

He has scored 80 runs in last 5 innings, so NO!

India are beating England 3-1 without Sir Jadeja who would have played in place of Sundar and Shami/Yadav are also missing.

 

[Ab Fan]

2012 (played in India)

A 1-1 draw or 2-1 win for Pakistan. Whitewashing India in India in tests is unlikely.


2015 (played in UAE)

India wins 2-1. Jadeja and Ashwin were at best and Vijay, Pujara and Kohli were doing great as well. Younis would have won Pakistan one match for sure.


2018 (played in India)

India wins 3-0.... Proper thumping..

Ravichandran Ashwin or Ravindra Jadeja as Man of series.



2021 (played in Pakistan)

India wins 3-0.. A bowling attack of Jadeja, Axar and Ashwin would have run riots while Yasir's leg spin won't have hurt India much, particularly with Rishabh Pant taking on his harmless leg spins for plenty quick runs.

Man of match- Rohit Sharma/Rishabh Pant

 

[shamaan]

He has scored 80 runs in last 5 innings, so NO!

India are beating England 3-1 without Sir Jadeja who would have played in place of Sundar and Shami/Yadav are also missing.

England played with half a team in every test.root got wickets against ur great line up.you should be beating england 4-0 in India . Pakistan is a much better team in asia than england.

 

[Amjid Javed]

Great Aussie team went 28 continuous series undefeated at home albeit that includes 3 drawn series.

Great WI team went 16 continuous series undefeated at home, that includes 2 drawn series too.

Current Indian team is on 13 series undefeated run at home and ofcourse they have won all of them.

Pakistan went on a run of 16 series undefeated at home between 1981 and 1995. Won 12 and drew 4 series (2 vs WI and 2 vs India). Pakistan lost just 2 home tests out of 51 in that time period.

So why no mention of it?

 

[cricketjoshila]

Spreading half facts.

India was comfortably ahead of Pakistan when home venues were considered in this period.

https://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/e...2011;spanval1=span;template=results;type=team


They were also comfortably ahead of Pakistan in Asia.

https://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/e...2011;spanval1=span;template=results;type=team


Unless Pakistan was England South Africa Australia New Zealand playing in SENA, they had no chance in beating India.

[MENTION=146594]BreadPakoda[/MENTION]
[MENTION=139664]street cricketer[/MENTION]

 

[szrana007]

Pakistan went on a run of 16 series undefeated at home between 1981 and 1995. Won 12 and drew 4 series (2 vs WI and 2 vs India). Pakistan lost just 2 home tests out of 51 in that time period.

So why no mention of it?

India between 2004-2012 went on a 14 series unbeaten run too, India won 10 series and drew 4.

 

[Amjid Javed]

Between 1970 and 1994. Pakistan lost just 1 home test series. Losing 3 tests out of 72. So in a 24 year period only WI won a tests in pakistan. Yet people show lack of respect to how difficult a place pakistan use to be to win tests.

 

[Amjid Javed]

India between 2004-2012 went on a 14 series unbeaten run too, India won 10 series and drew 4.

That should be mentioned to as india have always been strong at home.

 

[szrana007]

Between 1970 and 1994. Pakistan lost just 1 home test series. Losing 3 tests out of 72. So in a 24 year period only WI won a tests in pakistan. Yet people show lack of respect to how difficult a place pakistan use to be to win tests.

Pakistan's Overall home W/L ratio of 2.73 is the best out of all teams, so that isn't surprising at all.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Between 1970 and 1994. Pakistan lost just 1 home test series. Losing 3 tests out of 72. So in a 24 year period only WI won a tests in pakistan. Yet people show lack of respect to how difficult a place pakistan use to be to win tests.

I dont think that's true. Pakistan was a notoriously difficult place to tour between 1980 and 1995. Everybody acknowledges that. But since then, Pakistan lost around 8 series at home drew a few more, so that aura of invincibility was lost. Which is probably why despite Whitewashing the Saffers, I would say that tip 4 sides would have a chance of not only doing well but can beat Pakistan in Pakistan as well.

 

[Ab Fan]

England played with half a team in every test.root got wickets against ur great line up.you should be beating england 4-0 in India . Pakistan is a much better team in asia than england.

Half a team? They played with their best team in most matches.A great bowler like Broad was nullified completely and other England players always found it hard against India even though we just came from a tiring series win in Australia.

India were missing Jadeja and Shami/Yadav and also missed Axar in first test otherwise this would have been 4-0 for India. I am not too sure about Pakistan better than England in Asia as you guys lost to Kiwis in Asia a year and half ago and England are comfortably better than NZ in subcontinent.

 

[szrana007]

I dont think that's true. Pakistan was a notoriously difficult place to tour between 1980 and 1995. Everybody acknowledges that. But since then, Pakistan lost around 8 series at home drew a few more, so that aura of invincibility was lost. Which is probably why despite Whitewashing the Saffers, I would say that tip 4 sides would have a chance of not only doing well but can beat Pakistan in Pakistan as well.

From 1995-2000, Pakistan lost 6 series at home. But in the last 2 decades, lost only 2 series at home, have a W/L ratio of 3.4 in Pakistan in the last 20 years, which is pretty good.