Is Dale Steyn better than Allan Donald?

[Sankalp]

When Dale Steyn made his international debut, Allan Donald retired. But Steyn somehow reminds me on Donald due to pretty similar bowling action. Donald is undoubtedly the best fast bowler produced from South Africa, but the way Steyn is going I think he is par with Alan if not ahead. Please note I am not bringing the stats, avgs etc as they are deceptive sometimes. So who you think is a better bowler at their peak in terms of impact, threat to opposition, speed, as an overall bowler and match winner?

 

[bin_pendi_ka_lota]

He is definitely better then Donald when it come to overall effectiveness. Infact he more of a Waqar like bowler when it comes to attitude and aggression..... Even records are similar

 

[jusarrived]

Steyn is better than any bolwer i have seen overall .

At their peaks only waqar is comparable to him imo . This is offcourse from the ones Ihave seen play.

 

[battler]

Yes he is

 

[Avenger]

I think Donalds fear factor was much greater in that he looked to hit the batsman. Also i dont think Donald would ever sacrifice pace for accuracy and swing. Steyn sacrifices speed for swing and accuracy and only cranks it up when there is no swing, seam.

 

[Jo_Don]

He's already surpassed Donald's record in 7 fewer tests.

 

[MR__KHAN__JI]

Steyn.

He gets his wickets needing fewer deliveries.

 

[Sankalp]

I have seen Donald in 92 world cup and he was absolutely lethal. To me, Donald was better than Steyn in ODI's

 

[Convict]

Steyn's better than Donald.

Steyn would be pushing for top 5 fast bowlers I have seen.

Donald would be pushing for top 10

 

[Fateh]

Not see Donald at his peak but Steyn is awesome .

 

[SL_Fan]

No doubt.

 

[Irshadbhat]

Steyn is an ATG and the best i have seen

 

[Itachi]

Donald at his peak. Overall, steyn.

 

[TM Riddle]

dont know much about Donald as I haven't seen him bowling but Steyn is the best fast bowler I have ever seen .

 

[saeedhk]

I would rate Steyn as the best fast bowler ever.

 

[soso_killer]

Steyn is reaching new heights every game he plays now, i have always been torn between these too, but numbers speak for themselves, i can deny it no more. It was a bowlers era in the 90's, now the are alot of roads. Like we have seen in Australia. Dale is pushing the top 3 of the greatest fast bowlers of all time.

 

[vic mackey]

i think donald was far better in odis but in test steyn might become greatest ever

 

[IndianWillow]

I genuinely feared for batsmen when Donald was at his peak. But Steyn is better overall.

Batsmen had more skill handing pace and seam during Donald's time (never saw so many sub 50 and sub 100 totals back then, even from minnows) so I think though Steyn has better records, he is only just above or equal to Donald.

 

[Buffet]

Sure. If he can continue same way till retirement, I might rate him as best bowler( seen by me, ahead of Marshall).

 

[Jo_Don]

I genuinely feared for batsmen when Donald was at his peak. But Steyn is better overall.

Batsmen had more skill handing pace and seam during Donald's time (never saw so many sub 50 and sub 100 totals back then, even from minnows) so I think though Steyn has better records, he is only just above or equal to Donald.

Steyn did well against a full strength Indian batting lineup in India though, most of the same batsmen who also faced Donald.

It's tough to make a call on ODIs because the countries who prioritise tests (specifically England, SA and Australia) no longer play the same team in ODIs as they do in tests. Steyn for example might play 1 or 2 ODIs in a 5 match series. In the past, the same team would have played in both formats.

 

[Bewal Express]

Watched both from the start of their careers and to the end(In Donalds case) and I Think Donald was the better bowler. Donald scared players, which when the conditions are not in your favour can be a great asset. Steyn is very skilful but if i wanted a bowler on a flat deck on a hot day, it would always be Donald. People also need to remember that Donald missed 6 yrs of cricket(the period in which he was one of the quickest in the world) due to isolation.
If its on Youtube watch the battle between AD and Robin Smith at Edgebaston in the Natwest Semi in 1990. It was like 2 gladiators at their peak going at each other.

 

[James]

ODIs Donald, Tests Steyn, overall Steyn.

With Donald not far behind, Steyn is the best bowler I've seen.

 

[Jo_Don]

If its on Youtube watch the battle between AD and Robin Smith at Edgebaston in the Natwest Semi in 1990. It was like 2 gladiators at their peak going at each other.

The Donald/Atherton confrontation was arguably more intense.

 

[kungfu90]

How much did Donald averaged in UAE and SL ? :eye_done

 

[Hitman]

Depends on where Dale Steyn finishes his career. Allan Donald has always been my favorite fast bowler ever, so for now I'd vote for him.

 

[Bewal Express]

The Donald/Atherton confrontation was arguably more intense.

I think that battle was brilliant and will live with me for a long time. Donald was just a brilliant fast bowler who would not behind conditions.BTW I think i may have got the yr wrong(age catching up with me), it may have been 1991.

 

[James]

Steyn's battle with Tendulkar at Cape Town was just as magnificent

 

[Jo_Don]

Steyn's battle with Tendulkar at Cape Town was just as magnificent

The difference between the two is that Steyn was trying to get Tendulkar out, whereas Donald was trying to kill Atherton

 

[cricketworm]

Donald's bowling action over Steyn! I absolutely love Donald's bowling action. Used to copy it all the time!

Ok Let me rethink.

Perfect combo: Steyn's run up, Donald's Jump followed by Akhtar's celebration (I am flying like a plane).

 

[cricketworm]

I have never seen any bowler who has bowled better off cutters and inswingers as Donald! (not Inswinging yorker that title goes to Waqar).

Steyn wins the battle for outswingers. Pitching on middlish-leg stump and ball goes to first slip!! Geez!

 

[Jo_Don]

Perfect combo: Steyn's run up, Donald's Jump followed by Akhtar's celebration (I am flying like a plane).

Akhtar stole that celebration from Donald Clive Barker, SA's football coach at the time, was the first to do it when SA won the AFCON cup in 1996.

 

[soso_killer]

How much did Donald averaged in UAE and SL ? :eye_done

he averaged 19.33 at a S.R of 51.0.
In Asia he average 20.33 at a strike rate of 48.5

 

[vandokkum]

In tests I rate them equal but Steyn will go past him very soon. Donald started his career at 26, could have easily gone past 500 wickets otherwise.

 

[Leeon1994]

Donald's bowling action over Steyn! I absolutely love Donald's bowling action. Used to copy it all the time!

Ok Let me rethink.

Perfect combo: Steyn's run up, Donald's Jump followed by Akhtar's celebration (I am flying like a plane).

Nah, Not a fan of Steyn's personality but Steyn's celebration over any bowler anyday, That passion and aggressiveness he takes out inside of himself after taking a wicket is marvellous

 

[Murakh]

skill wise i would say donald because he can swing the ball both ways but over all dale styne for his line and length and control over his outswing.

 

[soso_killer]

Akhtar stole that celebration from Donald Clive Barker, SA's football coach at the time, was the first to do it when SA won the AFCON cup in 1996.

LOL, you remember that? It seems like along time ago. How our football has fallen from grace.

 

[cricketworm]

Akhtar stole that celebration from Donald Clive Barker, SA's football coach at the time, was the first to do it when SA won the AFCON cup in 1996.

Interesting!

He may have but Akhtar looks better with beefy chest and broad shoulders.

Donald was like bowling Giant! Very scary! That typical angry face with white cream on his nose. That's why I think Sachin's 169 at Cape Town is my fav. inning.

 

[Watsupdoc]

No doubt about it. I have seen both of them play and while Donald was a very good bowler, Steyn is better.

 

[cricketworm]

Nah, Not a fan of Steyn's personality but Steyn's celebration over any bowler anyday, That passion and aggressiveness he takes out inside of himself after taking a wicket is marvellous

Honestly, if you like his celebration, you shouldn't be critical of his personality. Because he has that personality, he is able to able to have that kind of celebration.

I like Akhtar's celebration because when Steyn does his run-up he looks like a fighter plane about to take off, which is followed by Donald's jump, his wrist close to his right eye, like plane is aiming for the target, so finishing up with Akhtar's celebration is the most appropriate.

Like fighter plane came (Steyn), destroyed the target (Donald) and now it's landing (Akhtar).

 

[bin_pendi_ka_lota]

Watched both from the start of their careers and to the end(In Donalds case) and I Think Donald was the better bowler. Donald scared players, which when the conditions are not in your favour can be a great asset. Steyn is very skilful but if i wanted a bowler on a flat deck on a hot day, it would always be Donald. People also need to remember that Donald missed 6 yrs of cricket(the period in which he was one of the quickest in the world) due to isolation.
If its on Youtube watch the battle between AD and Robin Smith at Edgebaston in the Natwest Semi in 1990. It was like 2 gladiators at their peak going at each other.

Infact I think he bowled really really well to Sachin. People remember Mcgrath vs Sachin battles but I think it was allways Donald who mostly came trumps between Sachin Donald battles.

I loved to watch Donald bowl. Bounce he used to get was completely effortless. He was so smooth. A textbook fast bowler.. If you want to become a fast bowler Alan Donald is perfect source for inspiration and style.

But saying that, despite all the smoothness , I think Steyn has a lot more variation when it comes to fast bowling. He is kind of complete fast bowler for all the tracks.. This ability of him to take wicket on any track is reflected in his records too.... One of the fastest to reach 100,200,300 wickets.

 

[Zaz]

From someone whos seen both, steyn is a more effective wicket taker than donald. Donald was great, a top notch bowler with a beautiful action, he was quicker and taller generating more bounce than steyn

However Steyn is more accurate and gets better movement than donald did. Steyn bowls to his limitations, he doesnt bowl too short often, he is always at the batsman keeping things simple pitching ball after ball up at pace in the right areas making the batsman play, whereas donald with all his extra attributes could be short and wayward

Donald was a more complete bowler but steyn is more effective

 

[Robert]

I'm starting to think that Steyn could even be as good as the great Marshall....

 

[MR__KHAN__JI]

Infact I think he bowled really really well to Sachin. People remember Mcgrath vs Sachin battles but I think it was allways Donald who mostly came trumps between Sachin Donald battles.

I loved to watch Donald bowl. Bounce he used to get was completely effortless. He was so smooth. A textbook fast bowler.. If you want to become a fast bowler Alan Donald is perfect source for inspiration and style.

But saying that, despite all the smoothness , I think Steyn has a lot more variation when it comes to fast bowling. He is kind of complete fast bowler for all the tracks.. This ability of him to take wicket on any track is reflected in his records too.... One of the fastest to reach 100,200,300 wickets.

McGrath and Donald came trumps against sachin.

 

[IndianWillow]

Steyn did well against a full strength Indian batting lineup in India though, most of the same batsmen who also faced Donald.

It's tough to make a call on ODIs because the countries who prioritise tests (specifically England, SA and Australia) no longer play the same team in ODIs as they do in tests. Steyn for example might play 1 or 2 ODIs in a 5 match series. In the past, the same team would have played in both formats.

Sachin was more comfortable against Steyn as compared to Donald. I will never forget this match where Donald ripped through the Indian lineup and had Tendulkar in all sorts of trouble.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/current/match/63736.html

 

[Anfield]

Donald is vastly underrated.

Steyn isn't a clear favorite as most of the posters here are saying.

Donald played in a different eras where most of the teams were much stronger than what they are today.

Australia in 90s were much much stronger in 90s than what they are now.
Pakistan was much stronger too.
New Zealand was much much better.
England was more or less the same in terms of Batting.
India is stronger in Steyn's era.
Sri Lanka was more or less the same or stronger then.

Donald has better average than Steyn against most teams in an era where those teams were stronger. To me Donald was a better bowler.

 

[vandokkum]

Steyn has similar average but at a better strike rate. Strike rate of 41 is unreal in any era never mind the era of flat pitches, bigger bats and ftb's.

 

[shakil]

Steyn is more physically fit than Donald ever was. Donald could swing it in big time, cut the bowl away and his bouncer was more vicious than Steyn. Steyn has a better out-swinger though but Donald was much much more better with his in-swinger.

In his prime and in conditions conducive to swing, Donald was probably just as effective as Steyn. Donald could also make the ball jump even on a flat surface because of his pace. However, Steyn has shown that he can be equally effective by persisting on a simple line and get the batsmen to make the mistake.

So reliability wise Steyn is better and will most likely get more wickets.

 

[ecstatic_freak]

I personally admire Donald for that fire, loved his action and aggression. Steyn is a better bowler though, more effective and skilled but if there was one bowler (other than WWs for obvious reasons), it was Donald who i'd love to watch.

 

[Anfield]

Steyn is more physically fit than Donald ever was. Donald could swing it in big time, cut the bowl away and his bouncer was more vicious than Steyn. Steyn has a better out-swinger though but Donald was much much more better with his in-swinger.

In his prime and in conditions conducive to swing, Donald was probably just as effective as Steyn. Donald could also make the ball jump even on a flat surface because of his pace. However, Steyn has shown that he can be equally effective by persisting on a simple line and get the batsmen to make the mistake.

So reliability wise Steyn is better and will most likely get more wickets.

How can you say Steyn is more physically. Donald played 316 first class matches for crying out loud.

 

[endymion248]

From the full matches I've seen (not live for Waqar), my top3 is Steyn, Asif and Waqar.

 

[jusarrived]

Donald is vastly underrated.

Steyn isn't a clear favorite as most of the posters here are saying.

Donald played in a different eras where most of the teams were much stronger than what they are today.

Australia in 90s were much much stronger in 90s than what they are now.
Pakistan was much stronger too.
New Zealand was much much better.
England was more or less the same in terms of Batting.
India is stronger in Steyn's era.
Sri Lanka was more or less the same or stronger then.

Donald has better average than Steyn against most teams in an era where those teams were stronger. To me Donald was a better bowler.

You are completely forgetting the pitches .

 

[endymion248]

You are completely forgetting the pitches .

Off topic, but I'd rather play on 2000s pitches with more than half matches played in SA, going up to 60-70% with England an Aus, than playing on 1990s pitches with more than half played in Pak, going up to 70%-80% in Asia/WI.

If anything, it just gives more power to Akhtar's 24-25 average.

So, I agree that pitches should be taken into account when people compare Steyn with Donald and Waqar (can't find that thread).

 

[Jo_Don]

Off topic, but I'd rather play on 2000s pitches with more than half matches played in SA, going up to 60-70% with England an Aus, than playing on 1990s pitches with more than half played in Pak, going up to 70%-80% in Asia/WI.

If anything, it just gives more power to Akhtar's 24-25 average.

So, I agree that pitches should be taken into account when people compare Steyn with Donald and Waqar (can't find that thread).

Funny how we rarely see that argument used for batsmen, where guys like Kallis and Ponting ought to get more credit but somehow don't.

 

[vandokkum]

Funny how we rarely see that argument used for batsmen, where guys like Kallis and Ponting ought to get more credit but somehow don't.

It's easier to bat in SA/ AUS but also easier to bowl there

 

[chacha kashmiri]

donald has a better average in asia then overall, 20 compared to 22

He was a legend

 

[akheR]

Funny how we rarely see that argument used for batsmen, where guys like Kallis and Ponting ought to get more credit but somehow don't.

You're actually right, that's why I say that Pak fast bowlers are underrated as much as your batsmen, because in both cases the 'home' conditions aren't the most favourable.

I'd like to see how Steyn ends his career (isn't as he'd go for 1/200 in his last innings, still), but Donald's average in Asia and SR overall is quite something.

 

[Robert]

Funny how we rarely see that argument used for batsmen, where guys like Kallis and Ponting ought to get more credit but somehow don't.

These days we have Cook and KP averaging 50 when Gooch and Gower averaged 44.

Are the new generation really 14% better?

No, they are not.

 

[vandokkum]

These days we have Cook and KP averaging 50 when Gooch and Gower averaged 44.

Are the new generation really 14% better?

No, they are not.

KP is probably as good as Gooch and Gower if not slightly better, Cook isn't as good as either one of them. Cook would be lucky to average near 40 if he faced the fast bowlers that Gooch and Gower faced for most of their careers (Ambrose, Imran, Marshall, etc)

 

[justarslan]

He's already surpassed Donald's record in 7 fewer tests.

Donaldo missed some of best years of his career because South Africa were banned from cricket. Otherwise his record would have been even better. Steyn did not have that problem of missing early 20s of his career. Donald is the best fast bowler from South Africa.

 

[Inziquicksingle]

Yes.

 

[James]

KP averages over 50 against Warne, McGrath and Steyn, I don't know why Robert tends to diss him (and other modern players)

 

[vandokkum]

KP averages over 50 against Warne, McGrath and Steyn, I don't know why Robert tends to diss him (and other modern players)

He is right about the pitches and quality of bowling in general though. Extra protection doesn't hurt either

 

[Worldcuppa]

What a great question !

There is no obvious answer to this.

Both were/are truly great fast bowlers. Donald was probably consistently faster but Steyn also gets up to 150 clicks from time to time.

Both Have classical bowling actions

Both get sharp bounce.

Both had/have tremendous ability to move the ball away.

Both really hard to score off.

Both had sub-50 strike rates for the bulk of their careers (a rarity for 300+ wicket taking bowlers over the history of the game)

The only distinct difference I can recall between the two is that Donald beat the bat time and time again whilst Steyn is always more like to get the edge !

Follow @world_cuppa on twitter

 

[Random Aussie]

Steyn. I don't really rate Donald.

 

[truefan]

Donald got better pitches suited to bowlers,lesser aggressive and capable batsmen and still he hardly was a match winner in Asian conditions like Steyn is....no comparison...

 

[Anfield]

Steyn. I don't really rate Donald.

Why not?

 

[Anfield]

Donald got better pitches suited to bowlers,lesser aggressive and capable batsmen and still he hardly was a match winner in Asian conditions like Steyn is....no comparison...

How wasn't he a match winner in Asian Conditions? Averagee 16 in India 19 in Srilanka and comparatively a bit high in Pakistan and you say he wasn't a match winner in Asian Conditions?

 

[Convict]

Why not?

Seen in Australia as a bit mentally weak.

 

[pacesensation]

i think given the quality of batters of present time compared to donald's era, i will rate allan donald better than dale steyn. Keep in mind that allan donald made his international debut at 26.
And he didnt play much test matches at the start of his career. Further i think allan donald was faster than him and had a more lethal bouncer.

Check his video of bouncers to waugh brothers, even though he was about 32 at that time but it tells alot about a man's talent

 

[Anfield]

Seen in Australia as a bit mentally weak.

based on what?

 

[Convict]

based on what?

1999 world cup and his average of over 30 against Australia.

 

[Hitman]

1999 world cup and his average of over 30 against Australia.

Not fair. Warne and Lara are very highly regarded by us Indians despite their mediocre record against us.

 

[Convict]

Not fair. Warne and Lara are very highly regarded by us Indians despite their mediocre record against us.

Australians and Indians have very significant cultural differences.

Donald is seen as a choker and thus mentally weak.

 

[Robert]

KP averages over 50 against Warne, McGrath and Steyn, I don't know why Robert tends to diss him (and other modern players)

I'm not dissing him. He's in my ATG-England-XI-of-the-last-30-years.

Read what I posted: I don't believe he is 14% better than Gooch and Gower.

I believe I have also said that McGrath was even better than Lillee, Warne arguably the best spinner ever, and Steyn maybe even as good as Marshall.

So there.

 

[Hitman]

Australians and Indians have very significant cultural differences.

Donald is seen as a choker and thus mentally weak.

Just on the basis of that 99 WC match?

 

[Convict]

Just on the basis of that 99 WC match?

Running without a bat is a remarkable choke to be fair.

That supported by is average performances against the best team of the time.

To an Australian sports man, mental weakness is the cardinal sin. It's why flashy players like Martyn and Mark Waugh aren't as rated as tough blokes like Boony or Langer.

It's why Clarke was considered soft and overated for years and even now isn't particularly popular.

Nobody thinks Donald is a bad player. They just don't think he's particularly great.

 

[Random Aussie]

Not just on 1999 WC, but that sealed his reputation for us.

The average of 30 plus against our team over a long period of time is the main thing. Hard to rate a guy as great when he isnt great against you.

 

[Hitman]

Running without a bat is a remarkable choke to be fair.

That supported by is average performances against the best team of the time.

To an Australian sports man, mental weakness is the cardinal sin. It's why flashy players like Martyn and Mark Waugh aren't as rated as tough blokes like Boony or Langer.

It's why Clarke was considered soft and overated for years and even now isn't particularly popular.

Nobody thinks Donald is a bad player. They just don't think he's particularly great.

Not just on 1999 WC, but that sealed his reputation for us.

The average of 30 plus against our team over a long period of time is the main thing. Hard to rate a guy as great when he isnt great against you.

Alright, what you say makes sense on your part. I'm pretty sure if that's your argument, you don't rate Dravid (another good player of his time) highly either? The bloke averages 38 odd against Australia over a period of 16 years.

 

[Convict]

Alright, what you say makes sense on your part. I'm pretty sure if that's your argument, you don't rate Dravid highly either? The bloke averages 38 odd against Australia over a period of 16 years.

Dravid played some very good innings against Australia. Same with Laxman.

 

[Hitman]

Dravid played some very good innings against Australia. Same with Laxman.

But in the end he has a very mediocre record against Australia.