Is this the end for Shadab Khan?

[Sher Khan]

Well, we are seeing the emergence of Sufyan Muqeem and Abrar Ahmed. Both are vastly better spinners of the ball than Shadab. Both have good variety and get good turn.

Shadab only played 2 FC matches this season and from then has been playing in the T10. He seems to already be in post retirement mode and it doesn't seem like his interested in playing First class cricket.

So is this the end for him?

 

[gazza619]

Well, we are seeing the emergence of Sufyan Muqeem and Abrar Ahmed. Both are vastly better spinners of the ball than Shadab. Both have good variety and get good turn.

Shadab only played 2 FC matches this season and from then has been playing in the T10. He seems to already be in post retirement mode and it doesn't seem like his interested in playing First class cricket.

So is this the end for him?

As long as we find bowlers who are number 11 batters, there will always be opportunities for part timers like Shadab Khan.

Our youngsters need to focus on all facets of the game.

 

[sweep_shot]

Shadab is only 26 years old. I expect him to play more. But, he may not be a regular since other good spinners are emerging.

 

[shamaan]

Well, we are seeing the emergence of Sufyan Muqeem and Abrar Ahmed. Both are vastly better spinners of the ball than Shadab. Both have good variety and get good turn.

Shadab only played 2 FC matches this season and from then has been playing in the T10. He seems to already be in post retirement mode and it doesn't seem like his interested in playing First class cricket.

So is this the end for him?

I have seen both bowl and Sufyaan looks better and stronger.How is thier fielding ?

 

[Aqib_mustafa]

As long as we find bowlers who are number 11 batters, there will always be opportunities for part timers like Shadab Khan.

Our youngsters need to focus on all facets of the game.

No you need specialist pak fast bowlers dont bat that well either why only target only spinners thats where aqib is getting right you guys are getting wrong cricket is game of someone who is good in bowling or batting thats how kuldeep and chahal used to be with india and used to win games.

 

[Savak]

Shadab is only 26 years old. I expect him to play more. But, he may not be a regular since other good spinners are emerging.

The guy is an age fudger. On paper he is 26 years old but he has been moving in the field like a 30 year old.

 

[sweep_shot]

The guy is an age fudger. On paper he is 26 years old but he has been moving in the field like a 30 year old.

I see.

Even 30 isn't that old for a spinner. I expect him to play more.

 

[shah_1]

The guy is an age fudger. On paper he is 26 years old but he has been moving in the field like a 30 year old.

He is 28-29 year old


My uni friend used to study with him in Pindi

 

[Bewal Express]

He is 28-29 year old


My uni friend used to study with him in Pindi

He is 4 years older than stated. I know people that know him well, and they say he is actually very down to earth but his bowling is terrible and without his bowling he is finished

 

[cricketAXEpert]

Well, we are seeing the emergence of Sufyan Muqeem and Abrar Ahmed. Both are vastly better spinners of the ball than Shadab. Both have good variety and get good turn.

Shadab only played 2 FC matches this season and from then has been playing in the T10. He seems to already be in post retirement mode and it doesn't seem like his interested in playing First class cricket.

So is this the end for him?

There is big money to be made in league cricket but if you only want to play leagues your skill level will drop to the point that your international career will end. Look at Anderson he got the most wickets in test cricket and retired as a legendary pace bowler. But Jimmy Anderson stayed focused on the top format (mostly avoided playing T20 cricket). In Pakistan all players who don't play first class / test cricket fade away within a few years. That danger is present for all that play for Pakistan. Look at India, all Indian International players are only allowed play the IPL and nothing else.

 

[RidiculousMan]

This is only the beginning. With a decent FC performance and in domestic overall. He will be eyeing for the CT25 spot.

His career is far from over considering his age. In fact he might be become the captain of Pakistan after Rizwan era.

 

[Savak]

There is big money to be made in league cricket but if you only want to play leagues your skill level will drop to the point that your international career will end. Look at Anderson he got the most wickets in test cricket and retired as a legendary pace bowler. But Jimmy Anderson stayed focused on the top format (mostly avoided playing T20 cricket). In Pakistan all players who don't play first class / test cricket fade away within a few years. That danger is present for all that play for Pakistan. Look at India, all Indian International players are only allowed play the IPL and nothing else.

Ideally Pakistan's policy should mirror the BCCI's but we don't have the economy to demand exclusitivity.

 

[Savak]

He is 4 years older than stated. I know people that know him well, and they say he is actually very down to earth but his bowling is terrible and without his bowling he is finished

He has some hamstring and back issues due to which he has had to change his bowling action. Its affected his mobility in the field. He hasn't helped himself by neglecting his fitness.

 

[gazza619]

No you need specialist pak fast bowlers dont bat that well either why only target only spinners thats where aqib is getting right you guys are getting wrong cricket is game of someone who is good in bowling or batting thats how kuldeep and chahal used to be with india and used to win games.

Kuldeep Yadav has a FC batting average of 20 odd, has a FC hundred and is not a number 11. Chahal is a number 11 and that explains why India has ignored him.

I have no issues in fast bowlers who are number 11 as they wouldnt have much gas left after practicing their key skill. But for a spinner to be a number 11 reflects nothing but sheer laziness.

 

[Bewal Express]

He has some hamstring and back issues due to which he has had to change his bowling action. Its affected his mobility in the field. He hasn't helped himself by neglecting his fitness.

From what he told an acquaintance, it was a knee injury

 

[khyberlion]

Kuldeep Yadav has a FC batting average of 20 odd, has a FC hundred and is not a number 11. Chahal is a number 11 and that explains why India has ignored him.

I have no issues in fast bowlers who are number 11 as they wouldnt have much gas left after practicing their key skill. But for a spinner to be a number 11 reflects nothing but sheer laziness.

The current one specially faisal Akram has been as usual in field and in batting since u16. This guy has been in the set up very young and is still awful. As you have rightly pointed out it's nothing other than laziness and lack of interest and with these sort of players they don't last much.

 

[Nasty Naz]

Well, we are seeing the emergence of Sufyan Muqeem and Abrar Ahmed. Both are vastly better spinners of the ball than Shadab. Both have good variety and get good turn.

Shadab only played 2 FC matches this season and from then has been playing in the T10. He seems to already be in post retirement mode and it doesn't seem like his interested in playing First class cricket.

So is this the end for him?

Not sure why you're making up Shadab only playing 2 FC but he played 5, which was the entire season and his team didn't move on to the triangular stage. He scored a healthy amount of runs and got plenty of wickets.

If anything, it's starting to look like Shadab will be back sooner than later with him bowling a lot better lately, including some good bowing in T10.

In ODI's, a full strength bowling attack consists of Shaheen/Naseem/Rauf, making it 3 specialist bowlers and 3 tail enders. No team is consistently going to go with 5 bowlers and 5 of whom bat at tailenders level. Pakistan need an all-rounder and Shadab has certainly been solid with his bat. 4 specialist bowlers + Shadab would give the team more balance assuming Shadab bowling is at least somewhat back in form.

Jamal batting level is unclear at the moment. If he can consistently show good batting skills, it may change the equation but until then, Pakistan desperately need allrounder in the lineup. Recently, Pakistan has been going 7 batters & 4 bowlers with Salman/Saim doing 5th bowler duty but that may not work against a strong team who can easily pick apart spin from Salman.

 

[Farabi]

As long as we find bowlers who are number 11 batters, there will always be opportunities for part timers like Shadab Khan.

Our youngsters need to focus on all facets of the game.

Says who? What batting ability do Kuldeep Yadav and Chahal have? They have both played for India at the same time and won them several tournaments.
A specialist spinner’s batting is/should be looked at as a pacer’s. What batting ability does Rauf offer?

 

[Farabi]

Kuldeep Yadav has a FC batting average of 20 odd, has a FC hundred and is not a number 11. Chahal is a number 11 and that explains why India has ignored him.

I have no issues in fast bowlers who are number 11 as they wouldnt have much gas left after practicing their key skill. But for a spinner to be a number 11 reflects nothing but sheer laziness.

Are you saying Kuldeep Yadav is preferred over Chahal because his FC batting average is better lol
You have no idea what you’re talking about if you actually think that.

 

[Mohraheem]

He has been chilling .. look where his career now …

 

[Farabi]

The current one specially faisal Akram has been as usual in field and in batting since u16. This guy has been in the set up very young and is still awful. As you have rightly pointed out it's nothing other than laziness and lack of interest and with these sort of players they don't last much.

So cricketers cannot be specialists otherwise they are lazy? What kind of logic is this.
Also Shadab Khan’s batting specifically improved over time after he joined the team. Who’s to say it won’t happen for others. Players are developed. They don’t drop on parachutes.

 

[Farabi]

Not sure why you're making up Shadab only playing 2 FC but he played 5, which was the entire season and his team didn't move on to the triangular stage. He scored a healthy amount of runs and got plenty of wickets.

If anything, it's starting to look like Shadab will be back sooner than later with him bowling a lot better lately, including some good bowing in T10.

In ODI's, a full strength bowling attack consists of Shaheen/Naseem/Rauf, making it 3 specialist bowlers and 3 tail enders. No team is consistently going to go with 5 bowlers and 5 of whom bat at tailenders level. Pakistan need an all-rounder and Shadab has certainly been solid with his bat. 4 specialist bowlers + Shadab would give the team more balance assuming Shadab bowling is at least somewhat back in form.

Jamal batting level is unclear at the moment. If he can consistently show good batting skills, it may change the equation but until then, Pakistan desperately need allrounder in the lineup. Recently, Pakistan has been going 7 batters & 4 bowlers with Salman/Saim doing 5th bowler duty but that may not work against a strong team who can easily pick apart spin from Salman.

You are confused and unclear in what you are saying. You say “ 4 specialist bowlers” but don’t describe in detail.

Sufiyan/Abrar are competing with pacers for those “specialist bowler” roles. Like other teams who play 3 specialist pacers and 1 specialist spinner, Pakistan would also drop 1 pacer and go with 1 specialist spinner, 3 pacers and 1 all rounder.

Or, if the wicket has a lot on offer for spinners, which may be the case in India, then they should go with 2 specialist spinners, 2 pacers, and 1 all rounder.

In 2011, Pakistan had Ajmal as a specialist spinner but also 2 all rounders in Afridi and Hafeez, and then 3 pacers.

 

[moghul]

Well, we are seeing the emergence of Sufyan Muqeem and Abrar Ahmed. Both are vastly better spinners of the ball than Shadab. Both have good variety and get good turn.

Shadab only played 2 FC matches this season and from then has been playing in the T10. He seems to already be in post retirement mode and it doesn't seem like his interested in playing First class cricket.

So is this the end for him?

At least he has now realized you cannot become a good spinner without playing longer version of cricket and this year Shadab already has played 5 Fc games and likely will play more. He is still young and can make a comeback . These new spinners Sufyan and Arafat have not played a single FC game and I'm not too optimistic with their future by just playing tamasha cricket . Sufyan is almost Shadab's age and yet to make his FC debut.

 

[BouncerGuy]

Shadab is not finished, he still has time but he really needs to be serious about his cricket. Once in a blue moon type performances are not required in modern day cricket so he better be making himself more consistent. There are better bowlers than him in the circuit atm.

 

[Xoib]

I like his commitment this year played full QEA trophy and bowled quite a lot of overs will that relate to better results let’s see but atleast commitment was there

 

[Aqib_mustafa]

Says who? What batting ability do Kuldeep Yadav and Chahal have? They have both played for India at the same time and won them several tournaments.
A specialist spinner’s batting is/should be looked at as a pacer’s. What batting ability does Rauf offer?

what batting does rauf or hasnain has if they can play so can spinners its as simple as that so pak need to play specialist spinners i dont care if they are number 11 with bat one thing they will get you wickets in middle and win you games simple.

 

[Hellion]

Overaged and finished.

 

[gazza619]

Are you saying Kuldeep Yadav is preferred over Chahal because his FC batting average is better lol
You have no idea what you’re talking about if you actually think that.

India already has a certified number 11 in Bumrah.

Chahal would have made a better career if he knew how to hold a bat.

Education is so important.

 

[gazza619]

Says who? What batting ability do Kuldeep Yadav and Chahal have? They have both played for India at the same time and won them several tournaments.
A specialist spinner’s batting is/should be looked at as a pacer’s. What batting ability does Rauf offer?

unless you can chuck as well as Murali or Ajmal and get away with it, there is no room for number 11 spinners in this day and age.

 

[Farabi]

India already has a certified number 11 in Bumrah.

Chahal would have made a better career if he knew how to hold a bat.

Education is so important.

Chahal’s career ended because Kuldeep was a better quality spinner not batter.
The thing is that you and @khyberlion aren’t totally wrong.
It’s a legitimate strategy that many teams deploy to stack all rounders, even if they really are bits and pieces like Shadab. It kinda works.
However, some of us (@Aqib_mustafa ) favor a more aggressive strategy to take wickets in the middle overs. India doesn’t play Kuldeep because of his 20 FC average. They want wickets from Kuldeep and he gets main batters out like Babar, Fakhar, Saud and others in recent ODI games, which finished the game there and then.
It’s true that all rounder can add 20-30 runs here and there, but we believe it’s more valuable if you can get main opposition batter out. That is more valuable.

 

[Farabi]

unless you can chuck as well as Murali or Ajmal and get away with it, there is no room for number 11 spinners in this day and age.

I am not sure what your point is. Is your point that we need specialist spinners who should be able to hold a bat? I could think of Adil Rashid, Rashid Khan, and Zampa who are tailenders who can hold a bat. Or is your point that we should have all rounders like R Jadeja, Axar, Shadab, Imad, Arafat M

 

[Farabi]

@gazza619 @khyberlion
This is what we need spinners to do:
Kuldeep Yadav vs Pakistan. 13 wickets in 6 games at an average of 14 and ER of 3.8
Has had Fakhar’s number 4 times, Babar’s number thrice, Saud once, and Agha once.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Sheddy played a full first class season.

The bowling performance was decent, not amazing, not bad either just decent. He also hit a few 50's

Most importantly he got a lot of overs under his belt.

If after a full season of FC he goes to play this dumb Abu Dhabi tournament then what's the issue?

 

[gazza619]

I am not sure what your point is. Is your point that we need specialist spinners who should be able to hold a bat? I could think of Adil Rashid, Rashid Khan, and Zampa who are tailenders who can hold a bat. Or is your point that we should have all rounders like R Jadeja, Axar, Shadab, Imad, Arafat M

All the spinners you have mentioned in your post can hold a bat.

My point is that a spinner should be able to hold a bat.

 

[Farabi]

All the spinners you have mentioned in your post can hold a bat.

My point is that a spinner should be able to hold a bat.

I don’t have a problem with that.
However, there should be no compromise on ability to get wickets as a spinner.
Shadab is competing with Amir Jamal, Arafat Minhas for all rounder role.
Sufiyan Muqeem and Abrar are competing with Rauf, Naseem and Shaheen.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

All the spinners you have mentioned in your post can hold a bat.

My point is that a spinner should be able to hold a bat.

All spinners should be able to bowl spin. I personally don't care if they can bat or not ( but it would be welcome).

For a long time bowlers like Nawaz, Shadab and Imad meant we were bowling up and down darters.

We need at least one proper turner in the team for each format.

 

[gazza619]

All spinners should be able to bowl spin. I personally don't care if they can bat or not ( but it would be welcome).

For a long time bowlers like Nawaz, Shadab and Imad meant we were bowling up and down darters.

We need at least one proper turner in the team for each format.

Spinners should be able to bowl well is the obvious.

One of the key reasons Pakistan won against England in the recent test series was because both Sajid & Nauman contributed vital runs in the lower order.

 

[khyberlion]

So cricketers cannot be specialists otherwise they are lazy? What kind of logic is this.
Also Shadab Khan’s batting specifically improved over time after he joined the team. Who’s to say it won’t happen for others. Players are developed. They don’t drop on parachutes.

Shadab could bat a bit from the start. These guys can't. All these guys have been in the set up for a while and haven't improved much.

I am not saying that there isn't a place for specialists. What I am saying is that these specialists are barely better than the non specialists. Stop making things up.

 

[khyberlion]

@gazza619 @khyberlion
This is what we need spinners to do:
Kuldeep Yadav vs Pakistan. 13 wickets in 6 games at an average of 14 and ER of 3.8
Has had Fakhar’s number 4 times, Babar’s number thrice, Saud once, and Agha once.

The problem is you are comparing kuldeep to our spinners he's light years ahead of ours.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

All spinners should be able to bowl spin. I personally don't care if they can bat or not ( but it would be welcome).

For a long time bowlers like Nawaz, Shadab and Imad meant we were bowling up and down darters.

We need at least one proper turner in the team for each format.

This is the crux of the matter for me. Shadab is a poor spinner, and his batting is in no way good enough to compensate for that. He would have to be picked as a specialist batsman to justify being picked in any format, because his bowling is likely to cost you the game against any decent side.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Spinners should be able to bowl well is the obvious.

One of the key reasons Pakistan won against England in the recent test series was because both Sajid & Nauman contributed vital runs in the lower order.

It wasnt obvious to Pakistani selectors for a long time that's why we had weird strategies across formats.

I agree with your point on Sajid and Nauman but more importantly they were legit turners and canny bowlers, batting was just a bonus.

But for a long time it seemed we wanted spinners who could bat first and the bowling was secondary

 

[aukhan]

Hopefully, this is the end for this full tosser.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

This is the crux of the matter for me. Shadab is a poor spinner, and his batting is in no way good enough to compensate for that. He would have to be picked as a specialist batsman to justify being picked in any format, because his bowling is likely to cost you the game against any decent side.

He wasn't a poor spinner for a very long time in limited overs. He has regressed badly in recent years but if he can get back to the way he was a few years ago he would be a shoe in for T20 alongside a proper spinner too.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

He wasn't a poor spinner for a very long time in limited overs. He has regressed badly in recent years but if he can get back to the way he was a few years ago he would be a shoe in for T20 alongside a proper spinner too.

He has a very good googly which got him a lot of his early success. Since international teams have worked out that he doesn't really turn the leggie, they can slog him with some confidence. He doesn't really have any other tools like a top spinner either.

 

[Markhor]

Full toss
Long hop
Groin tear
Recalled to team
Full toss
Hamstring tear

The Shadab Khan cycle for the last 7 years. His performance at the last two white ball World Cups is enough to disqualify him from selection until a radical transformation in his bowling.

 

[Farabi]

The problem is you are comparing kuldeep to our spinners he's light years ahead of ours.

Sufiyan looks a pretty good prospect. I am not sure what your guys expectations are but this is as good as it gets for a newcomer.
Yadav was also dropped in 2019 and he had to work on his speeds and accuracy to regain his spot. Players are developed. You need to identify talent and then be patient and invest in them.

 

[Aqib_mustafa]

Sufiyan looks a pretty good prospect. I am not sure what your guys expectations are but this is as good as it gets for a newcomer.
Yadav was also dropped in 2019 and he had to work on his speeds and accuracy to regain his spot. Players are developed. You need to identify talent and then be patient and invest in them.

Ya these pakistani fans will never appreciate good talent sufiyan right now looks as good as kuldeep can be even better than him same kuldeep was taken to cleaners by england batsmen then he worked on his bowling to comeback stronger.

 

[khyberlion]

Sufiyan looks a pretty good prospect. I am not sure what your guys expectations are but this is as good as it gets for a newcomer.
Yadav was also dropped in 2019 and he had to work on his speeds and accuracy to regain his spot. Players are developed. You need to identify talent and then be patient and invest in them.

Let him play better teams. If he's holds his own it will be good for Pakistan.

 

[Farabi]

Let him play better teams. If he's holds his own it will be good for Pakistan.

I agree with that.
1) if you will stick with Shadab, you will never find out what your other options are. We were told we don’t have spinners in tests and then suddenly Sajid and Nauman emerged.
2) give players 10+ games before you judge them. How Saim has been indicted is exactly how every single player should be indicted. This is how mature teams bring new talent and give them consistent chances and back them. Same needs to happen with Sufiyan.
3) if he doesn’t do well after that, drop him.

 

[BouncerGuy]

Shadab not considered for South africa series. Good decision I think

He has been bowling well in QEA trophy but IMO he needs to keep doing that for at least 2 seasons to be considered again.