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Joe Root has 10 centuries since the start of 2021. Six of them are 150+
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Joe Root has potential to surpass Sachin Tendulkar's Test record, says Geoffrey Boycott
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The plaudits continue to arrive for England batter Joe Root, who is breaking multiple records during the current Test series against New Zealand.
Root brought up his 27th Test century with a splendid knock in the first innings of the second Test against the Kiwis in Nottingham and in the process became the first player to score more than 3,000 runs in World Test Championship history.
The 31-year-old has 10 World Test Championship centuries to his name and nearly 1,000 more WTC runs than his closest challenger in Marnus Labuschagne of Australia with 2,180 runs.
PLAYER WTC RUNS (2019-2022)
Joe Root (England) 3,124
Marnus Labuschagne (Australia) 2,180
Ben Stokes (England) 1,865
Steve Smith (Australia) 1,811
Babar Azam (Pakistan) 1,614
Root's most recent knock saw him draw level on the same amount of centuries as Australia great Steve Smith and India veteran Virat Kohli, while the right-hander is one of only two England players to have scored more than 10,000 Test runs in total.
The reigning ICC Test Player of the Year has also jumped into second place on the Test batter rankings, with Labuschagne the only player ranked in front of him.
It has led to Root receiving plenty of praise from his fellow team-mates, with fellow centurion Ollie Pope describing the former skipper as the best English player of all time.
"We’re seeing England’s greatest ever," Pope told BBC Sport.
"Watching him do what he’s doing at the moment, it’s amazing. A joy to be a part of."
Former England captain Michael Vaughan agreed with Pope's statement.
"We're witnessing something special. I've known Joe for years and I really do believe he's England's greatest player," Vaughan said.
"He's such a joy to watch and he makes batting look so easy.
"It's just that drive and determination. You've got to have an incredible appetite to just keep on scoring centuries."
https://www.icc-cricket.com/news/2644665
Root brought up his 27th Test century with a splendid knock in the first innings of the second Test against the Kiwis in Nottingham and in the process became the first player to score more than 3,000 runs in World Test Championship history.
The 31-year-old has 10 World Test Championship centuries to his name and nearly 1,000 more WTC runs than his closest challenger in Marnus Labuschagne of Australia with 2,180 runs.
PLAYER WTC RUNS (2019-2022)
Joe Root (England) 3,124
Marnus Labuschagne (Australia) 2,180
Ben Stokes (England) 1,865
Steve Smith (Australia) 1,811
Babar Azam (Pakistan) 1,614
Root's most recent knock saw him draw level on the same amount of centuries as Australia great Steve Smith and India veteran Virat Kohli, while the right-hander is one of only two England players to have scored more than 10,000 Test runs in total.
The reigning ICC Test Player of the Year has also jumped into second place on the Test batter rankings, with Labuschagne the only player ranked in front of him.
It has led to Root receiving plenty of praise from his fellow team-mates, with fellow centurion Ollie Pope describing the former skipper as the best English player of all time.
"We’re seeing England’s greatest ever," Pope told BBC Sport.
"Watching him do what he’s doing at the moment, it’s amazing. A joy to be a part of."
Former England captain Michael Vaughan agreed with Pope's statement.
"We're witnessing something special. I've known Joe for years and I really do believe he's England's greatest player," Vaughan said.
"He's such a joy to watch and he makes batting look so easy.
"It's just that drive and determination. You've got to have an incredible appetite to just keep on scoring centuries."
https://www.icc-cricket.com/news/2644665
Justcrazy
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Root purple patch will end soon , Tendulkar was once a generation batsman , 16000 runs is not easy , he will fizzle out soon.
The record itself is quite an embarassing one for Tendulkar m. The guy who played the most matches made the most runs. It’s not as if his ratio of runs to matches or average was standout in his era either.
Lara and Sangakkara’s runs / matches ratio is a lot higher than the “record” holder.
Kallis and Ponting also have a better runs to match ratio albeit only slightly.
Kallis and Sangakkara have comfortably better averages.
So my point comes to: Root should be able surpass the “record”. England play enough tests, Root is at the top of his game, is fit enough and even more if he’s not at the top of his game, England don’t have batsman in sight who are good enough to replace him.
But even if he does. What does it even prove? It’s just an aggregate number of runs. And if he does break it he’ll probably play a similar number of tests to Tendulkar too.
All it’s proved is he’s a great player. You’re great whether you make 10,000, 12,000 or even 15,000 runs. Why bother with the last few thousand - retire and relax once you feel you’re done.
Lara and Sangakkara’s runs / matches ratio is a lot higher than the “record” holder.
Kallis and Ponting also have a better runs to match ratio albeit only slightly.
Kallis and Sangakkara have comfortably better averages.
So my point comes to: Root should be able surpass the “record”. England play enough tests, Root is at the top of his game, is fit enough and even more if he’s not at the top of his game, England don’t have batsman in sight who are good enough to replace him.
But even if he does. What does it even prove? It’s just an aggregate number of runs. And if he does break it he’ll probably play a similar number of tests to Tendulkar too.
All it’s proved is he’s a great player. You’re great whether you make 10,000, 12,000 or even 15,000 runs. Why bother with the last few thousand - retire and relax once you feel you’re done.
Local.Dada
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If root does it will be an incredible achievement. puts into perspective how good Sachin was for over such a long period of time. If Root maintains this purple patch he will break SRT’s record. If he maintains the purple patch long enough to pull it off or even come close then he will automatically be an ATG of the game.
Remember even Kohli and Smith look like they have a lean patch now and few years back they looked unstoppable.
Remember even Kohli and Smith look like they have a lean patch now and few years back they looked unstoppable.
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In terms of style, substance and quality of runs Root is a far better player then Tendulkar but yes Tendulkar is far ahead on the quantity metric and will be difficult to catch.
Lol at substance and quality of runs! Tendulkar played some of the game's best ever bowlers with aplomb for more than 2 decades in both forms of the game.
You don't need to put down one player to elevate your favorite, do you?
You don't need to put down one player to elevate your favorite, do you?
And now it seems home runs carry enough weight for someone to be touted greater than Tendulkar.
If it's Indians who score runs at home they're termed HTBs though that doesn't come in the path of English batsmen towards greatness.
If it's Indians who score runs at home they're termed HTBs though that doesn't come in the path of English batsmen towards greatness.
Protea Fan
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Root scored runs everywhere against all sort of bowlers,only a staggering away ashes is missing in his resume which he can still get
The criticism he was getting 2 year back was the lack of runs in his home soil which he is milking now
And anyways, I don't have any problem in Root being hailed, he deserves every bit of it. Love Root the batsman and the person. Wish we had someone remotely as likeable and gun at the same time!
However, what I don't like is to put down others to show him greater.
However, what I don't like is to put down others to show him greater.
Joseph Gomes
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Tendulkar fans are too sensitive. I know he's a good in India and all, but boy do his fans get upset easily
I think the sad thing for Tendulkar fans is:
Kapil Dev gets criticised because he kept playing and playing and got the highest number of wickets
Gavaskar also made a lot of runs, but he played the most matches at that time too.
They were hoping Tendulkar wouldnt have to do that. They were hoping he was so far ahead of the game in every facet (like bradman) that he wouldnt need to keep going and going just to have some sort of record. But he did, which really is aggregate number of runs but again, its no different really to kapil and Sunil. He still played the most number of matches.
They were hoping he has the best average by a mile. He doesnt. Forget by a mile, he still doesnt even have the best average.
He doesnt have the most runs in a series
He doesnt have the most runs in a calendar like Viv did
He doesnt have the legendary innings like Laras 153 to win a test in the 4th innings. Or even legendary innings like Dravid and Laxman did.
In the end, it was the same old story. Play the most number of tests, get a record
Kapil Dev gets criticised because he kept playing and playing and got the highest number of wickets
Gavaskar also made a lot of runs, but he played the most matches at that time too.
They were hoping Tendulkar wouldnt have to do that. They were hoping he was so far ahead of the game in every facet (like bradman) that he wouldnt need to keep going and going just to have some sort of record. But he did, which really is aggregate number of runs but again, its no different really to kapil and Sunil. He still played the most number of matches.
They were hoping he has the best average by a mile. He doesnt. Forget by a mile, he still doesnt even have the best average.
He doesnt have the most runs in a series
He doesnt have the most runs in a calendar like Viv did
He doesnt have the legendary innings like Laras 153 to win a test in the 4th innings. Or even legendary innings like Dravid and Laxman did.
In the end, it was the same old story. Play the most number of tests, get a record
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You;ve made several posts saying people are bitter to compare Tendulkar and Root and accuse others of insulting Tendulkar (nobody has done this).
Longevity is Tendulkar's legacy in the game. Even your bolded is saying the same.
Now in my eyes longevity is an good achievement and I don't see the need for you to take it as a criticism.
Does Tendulkar have higher average than his peers? No. Kallis and Sanga are higher in the modern era as are many other batsmen. Lara is close, Miandad is also close.
Does Tendulkar have higher scores than his peers - No. other players have got massive triple centuries. Lara has broken the world record twice.
Does he have a high ICC peak ranking - Nope.
Does he have iconic knocks ( subjective criteria) - Not compared to Lara etc.
So whats the harm mentioning his longevity? He fails in most other objective criteria and the rest is all subjective.
Kroll
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I’m just waiting for the Teenda’s not fit to lace Root’s boots comments or vice versa by our resident wizard experts. 
Mamoon
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I’m just waiting for the Teenda’s not fit to lace Root’s boots comments or vice versa by our resident wizard experts.
He might overtake Tendulkar’s tally but he won’t be able to tie Williamson’s shoelaces. [MENTION=147292]RedwoodOriginal[/MENTION]
sweep_shot
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The way Root is going, he can get close to or even surpass Tendulkar's runs.
He needs less than 6,000 runs.
He needs less than 6,000 runs.
Sensitive? So putting forth one's viewpoint is being sensitive?
By that token, the haters should be called bitter.
James
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Not in of itself no, but one can see how certain posters flock to defend SRT in these threads and the defensive panicking tone they present with.
There are even some users who very rarely crawl out of the woodwork for any other topic, but the moment SRT’s legacy or anything about him comes into question (or is even being discussed) — suddenly, there they are.
Joseph Gomes
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Where do you see the haters? I haven't seen any hater, just hypersensitive Tendulkar fans getting upset anytime their god is mentioned. It's quite annoying to be honest
And no, I don't think Root is as good as Tendulkar. This thread is about Root crossing Tendulkar's run tally since Root plays a gazillion tests. Root may or may not get there, there's no need for Tendulkar fans to get triggered at the mention. Pitiful insecurity
So people should keep posting on every other thread to escape censure on this count, lol! Didn't know forum rules were this strict!
Or the usual suspects coming in to bash Tendulkar every time his records are mentioned!
Insecure people are the ones whose hate is satisfied only after putting down someone in order to elevate their own 'god'.
First understand the meaning of insecurity. And if you've not seen any hater then brush up your comprehension skills!
Colorblind Genius
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Tendulkar played Test cricket for about 24 YEARS!!
English players are not that “faarigh”.
They’ve got better things in life to do after playing for a few years.
Root will exit out before we know it.
Not trying to take anything away from Tendulkar but these English players are not so deeply obsessed with personal records.
Their approach to life in general is a lot different than us desi mindsets.
English players are not that “faarigh”.
They’ve got better things in life to do after playing for a few years.
Root will exit out before we know it.
Not trying to take anything away from Tendulkar but these English players are not so deeply obsessed with personal records.
Their approach to life in general is a lot different than us desi mindsets.
Ab Fan
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What is better than playing for your country and maintaining the standards as high as Tendulkar maintained in his career, averaging 53 in Test cricket over such large sample? I am really interested in knowing that. What is that better thing waiting?
James Anderson, for example, is playing cricket at age of 39 too because he doesn't have anything better coming for him. Should we also accuse Anderson that he only plays for stats as he just took 650 wickets and his career average is not even 25 which for batsman, the equivalence is considered as 50 and Tendulkar on other hand retired with a 53 average?
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By that token, all those who played 150 tests or more, didn't have anything better to do in their lives. They all played just for personal records. People like Border, Steve Waugh, Jimmy, Cook, Kallis, Ponting, Dravid etc, list is long.
Or is this barb especially reserved for someone like Tendulkar?
Or is this barb especially reserved for someone like Tendulkar?
James
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Nothing to do with the rules, people can post as much or as little as they wish. Just a trend that’s been noticeable recently.
SRT was a great player but should've retired atleast 2-3 years earlier....but he kept on playing just for the sake of numbers (200 tests, 100 centuries) which somewhat tarnished his reputation.
So you can read someone's mind now! Wow!
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Yeah agreed. The 100 centuries quest went on forever until he tuk tukd his way to a ton v Bangladesh
It doesn't detract from his legacy too much as he is still quite comfortably in the top 20-25 batsmen to have played the game.
I don't think the English batsmen have the same obsession with runs, they tend to go through a bit of a lean patch in their 30's before waking up one day and deciding enough is enough. Generally they do still have something in the tank but decide its time to go for personal reasons. The only exception is Graham Gooch who was a bit eccentric ( like Younis Khan) and played forever.
I assume Joe Root will be the same as most english batsmen. In a couple of years his mates will have retired from international cricket, his kids will be at an age where he can be be more involved in their lives and he will call it a day.
But and its a big but - if he can continue then there's an outside chance of him doing it.
Robert
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Seems to be an Indian thing. Kapil kept going for years taking two wickets a match to pass Hadlee.
Totally agree mate. People behave as if longevity is a bad thing...LOL.
Tendulkar faced some of the best fast bowlers & spinners this game has ever produced across all formats in every continent across the globe and yet remained on top of his game for over 3 decades. In-fact, I have followed his career closely and even after playing for so long he NEVER had an elongated decline/dearth of form like Kohli is having now or Ponting faced or most batsmen does. He was best batsman in the world since he started opening in 1994 and never let his form slip for long. Even after injuries like tennis elbow when everyone thought his career is over, he rediscovered himself.
People often talk about he overstayed at the end of his career. That is another myth. He was India's best batsman and one of the highest scorer in 2011 World Cup. His form was brilliant up until India's tour of Australia in 2011-12. Then it declined and he retired from ODIs in 2012 and from tests in 2013. Where was the overstay? Compare that to likes of Ponting, Dhoni or even Kohli...how long they have dragged or dragging their careers.
Tendulkar was the best batsman this generation has ever seen who was equally good in red ball + white ball cricket and apparently had no technical flaws. Root may surpass one of his records but cant even come close to him as an overall batsman.
There will NEVER be another Tendulkar.
Yeah.
People here present their personal biases as some sort of facts regarding Tendulkar's career. As I said, they know nothing about Tendulkar's career if that's the case.
As for English or Pakistani posters dissing Tendulkar in this thread for having a long career, that's because for them grapes are sour as they never had any batsman who was remotely close to Tendulkar as a batsman, let alone surpassing him.
First time they've got someone like Root and they've got temerity to diss Tendulkar for having a long and successful career?
First time they've got someone like Root and they've got temerity to diss Tendulkar for having a long and successful career?
Hitman
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Why did Viv Richards keep going for the last 3 years of his career (89', 90', 91') with below average returns?
lol, see him shifting goalposts now like he does to defend pedestrian bats like Atherton had to face McGrath with a new cherry or Gooch's stats being spoiled by Alderman or some pre war batsman having a poor series which affected his overall stats.
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I've went through ths thread and there hasn't been much mention of Tendulkars runs being meaningless, poor quality or that his longevity is a bad thing.
Seems like having an opinion is a crime when it comes to Sachins career.
Seems like having an opinion is a crime when it comes to Sachins career.
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3 decades, sounds like another longevity metric.
Sure he may not have declined like Ponting/Lara but nor did he have a crazy peak like him either, where he absolutely dominated bowling attacks.
The crux of your argument seems to be that he was a good batsman for a longer time that other players were good batsmen.
Yes its unlikely that there will be another player who players cricket for so long, especially in the modern era. In fact if Root doesn't break his longevity records then they will certainly remain forever.
But hypothetically, imagine he does. Then what will Sachin be left with? He won't have the highest average amongst his peers, nor the highest score, nor the most runs. He will have 6 more centuries than Jaques Kallis at a lower average.
Ab Fan
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I think it is also down to the fact that in ODI World cups, Tendulkar has won India three Man of match awards in winning cause vs Pakistan, the most by anyone vs Pakistan in World Cup and this has been a major contributor to the streak we have in World Cups. I think they find it hard to live with it so they try to demean him by calling his runs as useless as they resulted three times in Pakistan's loss in World cups, the biggest tournament in ODIs. No other batsman I can recall won MOM twice vs Pakistan in ODI World Cups.
That's also the reason they try hard to label him as a non match winner as he is the biggest match winner vs Pakistan in ODIs in World cups.
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Joseph Gomes
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The fact that Tendulkar fans calls the player reeks of insecurity. It's hilarious to see grown adults acting like man-children whenever Tendulkar anybody doesn't subscribe to their cult. I don't even dislike Tendulkar, just his insufferable followers who plague the cricket fandom.
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Sunil Gavaskar knows a thing or two about scoring runs in Test cricket. The Indian batting legend was the first batter to complete 10,000 runs in Test cricket and he has given his verdict on the latest entrant to the elite club - Joe Root. The former England captain has been in devastating form with the bat and has been scoring centuries at will in the ongoing Test series against New Zealand. There is a lot of discussion about whether the 31-year-old Root can pose a threat to the all-time run scoring record of Sachin Tendulkar. Gavaskar has said that anything is possible in sport but it is going to be a very tough task even for someone with Root's level of consistency.
"That is an insurmountable record because we are talking about another almost 6000 runs, which means you would have to score about 1000 runs or 800 runs over the next 8 years for you to get there," Gavaskar was quoted as saying to India Today.
"Joe Root has got age on his side (31 years old). He certainly can (break the record) if he can maintain that enthusiasm and go on.
"Alastair Cook retired but he is still playing first class cricket. Sometimes, if you are playing around the clock, your form can also drop because there is mental tiredness that comes in. Root is scoring 150+ scores but it can take a toll on him, mentally and physically," he added.
The veteran commentator gave the example of the most Test wickets record and said that records do get broken as well.
"Anything is possible in the game. We first thought Richard Hadlee's 431 wouldn't break, but that was overtaken. Then we thought of Courtney Walsh's 519... So, I mean look where we are going. (It is) not impossible, but very very difficult."
Tendulkar had a 24-year career, in which he scored 15921 runs in 200 Test matches at an average of over 53. He is the only batter to have score more than 50 centuries in Test cricket.
NDTV
"That is an insurmountable record because we are talking about another almost 6000 runs, which means you would have to score about 1000 runs or 800 runs over the next 8 years for you to get there," Gavaskar was quoted as saying to India Today.
"Joe Root has got age on his side (31 years old). He certainly can (break the record) if he can maintain that enthusiasm and go on.
"Alastair Cook retired but he is still playing first class cricket. Sometimes, if you are playing around the clock, your form can also drop because there is mental tiredness that comes in. Root is scoring 150+ scores but it can take a toll on him, mentally and physically," he added.
The veteran commentator gave the example of the most Test wickets record and said that records do get broken as well.
"Anything is possible in the game. We first thought Richard Hadlee's 431 wouldn't break, but that was overtaken. Then we thought of Courtney Walsh's 519... So, I mean look where we are going. (It is) not impossible, but very very difficult."
Tendulkar had a 24-year career, in which he scored 15921 runs in 200 Test matches at an average of over 53. He is the only batter to have score more than 50 centuries in Test cricket.
NDTV
Kroll
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As a personality, I’ve always preferred Kohli and Dhoni who have always been respectful to Pak team.
Tendulkar always came across as dull and anti-Pak.
I still remember him congratulating the Indian hockey team or something when Pak beat India in CT17 totally blanking the result even though he was at the game.
Couldn’t even muster any appreciation for the Indian team to acknowledge they still had a great tournament. Shows what a bitter and ungracious individual he was.
People need to ask the question - would Tendulkar have longed out his career if he had an average of 65, had the highest rating record, had the highest aggregate in a series / calendar year, a few iconic knocks like Lara’s around 2008/9?
I don’t think so - he would have retired and been secure about his place in history.
Most players are satisfied with being great and move on with family, kids etc. With Tendulkar and his insecurity he had to keep going because he had to try and prove he was the greatest and have some kind of record that could not be broken. And he kept on going and going. The more you keep trying, the further it gets.
It seems the last few years of his career he was looking to retire on a certain astronomical high. That level of high never came, and the media clamour for his hundred 100s (a pointless stat in the grand scheme of things) kept him going.
Maybe he should have retired in 2008 after the England series, maybe after the SA series of 2010 where he had a very good series. Maybe after the World Cup victory. But it was probably hollow for him because he failed again in the final, and the iconic 100th 100 didn’t happen in the World Cup final.
Then there was the other fairytale. 100th hundred at lords. But he had a pitifully poor series vs England where he was schooled by Dravid how to play in England. So he kept going. It was poetic justice that he embarrassingly got the the pointless milestone in a pointless odi against a minnow (Bangladesh).
I actually feel sorry for him. I admire his desire for continuing, but it just became pretty sad to watch him limp to 200 tests and to that 100th hundred.
I don’t think so - he would have retired and been secure about his place in history.
Most players are satisfied with being great and move on with family, kids etc. With Tendulkar and his insecurity he had to keep going because he had to try and prove he was the greatest and have some kind of record that could not be broken. And he kept on going and going. The more you keep trying, the further it gets.
It seems the last few years of his career he was looking to retire on a certain astronomical high. That level of high never came, and the media clamour for his hundred 100s (a pointless stat in the grand scheme of things) kept him going.
Maybe he should have retired in 2008 after the England series, maybe after the SA series of 2010 where he had a very good series. Maybe after the World Cup victory. But it was probably hollow for him because he failed again in the final, and the iconic 100th 100 didn’t happen in the World Cup final.
Then there was the other fairytale. 100th hundred at lords. But he had a pitifully poor series vs England where he was schooled by Dravid how to play in England. So he kept going. It was poetic justice that he embarrassingly got the the pointless milestone in a pointless odi against a minnow (Bangladesh).
I actually feel sorry for him. I admire his desire for continuing, but it just became pretty sad to watch him limp to 200 tests and to that 100th hundred.
100% agree.
To add to that, they both had a massive impact on where India is today as a cricketing force. Both Dhoni and Kohli have accomplished a lot more and more importantly changed the mindset of India. Tendulkar was an inspiration, but it inspired the same mindset of aspiring to be the next in line of the endless production line of Batsmen in India and achieving personal records.
Dhoni and Kohli have introduced the winning mentality. They have shown you can have bowling matchwinners as well as batsmen. I respect them a lot from this point.
This was obviously missing from Tendulkar but I think this is also something missing from Root. Yes he captained the team for a long time but apart from his substantial runs I don’t think he has contributed to the mentality of English cricket.
WhenSultansBowled
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I distinctively remember an extremely disappointed SRT after losing the 100th 100 game.
I don't think he was very enthusiastic to receive the motm award.
Technics 1210
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Tendulkar’s highest Test score was vs. the mighty Bangladesh, (248).
His 100th 100 was also against the mighty Bangladesh, BUT, as ever, in a losing cause.
Test career in 2 sentences.
His 100th 100 was also against the mighty Bangladesh, BUT, as ever, in a losing cause.
Test career in 2 sentences.
jeeteshssaxena
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I am quite surprised that Root vs Tendulkar is even a debate.
Lol, one guy averages 49 while being at his peak, the other one avgd near 60 at his peak and played against better bowling lineups.
Joe Root is finding it difficult to raise his avg above 50 while Sachin was averaging 55 till like 180 tests.
If that doesn't settle the debate, Joe Root's away average is 46, SRT's away average is 52.
Sachin averages 40+ in all countries, how many batsman have done that.
If we start including the other formats, Joe Root will be left at least a couple of light years behind the GOAT.
Why is this even an argument, what sort of peak is this when you can't even take your average above 50?
Joe Root can retire as an ATG, but let
alone Sachin he isn't even in the same class as Dravid.
Also saw someone mentioning Gavaskar's name in this topic, Root isn't a patch on Gavaskar who is by far the greatest opener in Cricket.
Lol, one guy averages 49 while being at his peak, the other one avgd near 60 at his peak and played against better bowling lineups.
Joe Root is finding it difficult to raise his avg above 50 while Sachin was averaging 55 till like 180 tests.
If that doesn't settle the debate, Joe Root's away average is 46, SRT's away average is 52.
Sachin averages 40+ in all countries, how many batsman have done that.
If we start including the other formats, Joe Root will be left at least a couple of light years behind the GOAT.
Why is this even an argument, what sort of peak is this when you can't even take your average above 50?
Joe Root can retire as an ATG, but let
alone Sachin he isn't even in the same class as Dravid.
Also saw someone mentioning Gavaskar's name in this topic, Root isn't a patch on Gavaskar who is by far the greatest opener in Cricket.
Great sermon. But ultimately pointless
This is not a comparison thread. It is a “can root break the record for the most amount of runs” thread. A record which Tendulkar happens to have.
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I think the worrying thing for Sachin fans is IF ( and its a big if) Root breaks the records then where does it leave Sachin?
As the second highest run scorer of all time, with an inferior average to sanga and kallis, inferior peak to ponting, and less high score dominance than Lara.
Still not too shabby a place to be but these guys elevate him to a God. Unfortunately 'gods' cant come in second place so they will be required to re-evaluate their hero and thats a scary thought.
For those of us that are true cricket lovers its an interesting debate but for fans of only sachin its blasphemy.
As the second highest run scorer of all time, with an inferior average to sanga and kallis, inferior peak to ponting, and less high score dominance than Lara.
Still not too shabby a place to be but these guys elevate him to a God. Unfortunately 'gods' cant come in second place so they will be required to re-evaluate their hero and thats a scary thought.
For those of us that are true cricket lovers its an interesting debate but for fans of only sachin its blasphemy.
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James
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Seems to be mainly Sachin Tendulkar fans who are conscious of “the record”. England fans are really happy that they have a potential ATG in their team (Joe Root) but there is no attachment to the record, we just want him to do well and to help the England team win matches.
shariqnoor
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Root can easily play for 8 more years. That means 100 more Tests for England. Getting 6000 runs in 100 Tests is a piece of cake for a batsman of Root's calibre.
jeeteshssaxena
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I understand that Whatever I have written is way above your ability to comprehend.
Breaking down in simple terms:
Root can not break Tendulkar's record because he neither has the quality of Tendulkar and nor his hunger for runs.
jeeteshssaxena
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Is 5000 runs the only thing separating Root from Tendulkar.
Is there not a difference in their quality as a batsman.?
jeeteshssaxena
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So all your theory is based on Root surpassing Tendulkar.
That's not happening bro.
jeeteshssaxena
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I am not even a Tendulkar megafan, it's just that it felt ridiculous when someone compared a guy who can't take his avg above 50 even after his peak to someone who is amongst the greatest batsman of all time.
Just 2 years ago, this was the scenario :
S Smith - 62.84
Kohli - 53.62
Kane - 50.99
Warner - 48.94
Pujara - 48.66
Root - 48.40
I mean Root was behind Pujara
You are comparing this guy to a GOAT.
Ridiculous.
Let Root play more and then we'll see where it goes.
As of now Root is behind Javed Miandad let alone Sachin.
Just 2 years ago, this was the scenario :
S Smith - 62.84
Kohli - 53.62
Kane - 50.99
Warner - 48.94
Pujara - 48.66
Root - 48.40
I mean Root was behind Pujara
You are comparing this guy to a GOAT.
Ridiculous.
Let Root play more and then we'll see where it goes.
As of now Root is behind Javed Miandad let alone Sachin.
James
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Honestly I don’t really pay attention to much of this stuff, Root is a great batsman for England and that’s the main thing that I am interested in.
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I am not even a Tendulkar megafan, it's just that it felt ridiculous when someone compared a guy who can't take his avg above 50 even after his peak to someone who is amongst the greatest batsman of all time.
Just 2 years ago, this was the scenario :
S Smith - 62.84
Kohli - 53.62
Kane - 50.99
Warner - 48.94
Pujara - 48.66
Root - 48.40
I mean Root was behind Pujara
You are comparing this guy to a GOAT.
Ridiculous.
Let Root play more and then we'll see where it goes.
As of now Root is behind Javed Miandad let alone Sachin.
The thread and comparison is about total career runs not averages 2 years ago.
If we were using averages we would compare Root to better players than Tendulkar ( from the perspective of averages) Kallis, Sangakara , Sobers etc
Ok well if that’s what you believe then say that in simple terms. There’s no need to insult root’s inability to take his average beyond 50 etc etc. quite uncalled for imo.
Personally I don’t think quality has anything to do with it. Has Cook got more quality than Sangakkara and Lara? Yet he made more runs. Is Chanderpaul better than Gavaskar? Resounding no.
Hunger for runs (excessive runs) yes that might make a difference - but that’s what everyone has been saying anyway.
So again - lovely impassioned sermon, but ultimately pointless.
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Its unlikely. English players tend to wake up one morning, look at their kids and decide they can't be bothered travelling anymore.
This will happen for Root in a couple of years and will probably coincide with when his mates retire from the game.
Unlike Tendulkar he has a bit of charm and charisma so will be well set for a post cricket career that will give him a sense of fulfilment that evaded the one dimensional Tendulkar.
So yeah, in summary "that's not happening bro" is probably correct.
I think Mr Saxena needs to open up a new thread and post to his sermons there!
Ab Fan
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Who says England fans don't care about records? Look at James Anderson, what is his legacy apart from taking 600 and 700 wickets. The bowling average is sitting simply around 26-27 all his career with away average of 30. But they do call him an ATG. A medium pace ATG he is thanks to longevity with relatively more home dominant performances.
James
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The difference is that if Anderson retires on a high tomorrow morning then England fans will simply be happy for him and wish him well, he is under no pressure whatsoever to break the “next record” and take 700/800 wickets (at the detriment of the team’s development), or the most 5 wicket or 10 wicket hauls, etc, or go past Warne or Murali. When he is done, he is done.
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When sporting activities including cricket came to a halt during the Covid-19 pandemic, English maestro Joe Root started practicing batting on one leg to achieve better balance, his father Matt has revealed.
One of the greatest modern-day batters, Root has been in phenomenal form in the ongoing Test series against New Zealand in which he not only scaled the 'Mount 10K' peak, but also surpassed Indian legend Sunil Gavaskar in the list of top run-getters in the traditional format. Giving an account of Root's dedication towards become one of the best in the world, his father spoke about his preparation, especially during the pandemic.
"During Covid he (Joe) got one of the Root Academy ball feeders that we have and he'd be there for an hour batting on one leg for balance. There's a video somewhere of him doing it," Matt said on the Test Match Special.
"Joe just loves batting," added Matt. "As a kid, wherever someone would bowl at him he'd be there with a bat. He just loves doing it, he just loves batting."
The former England skipper recently became the second English batter after Alastair Cook to score 10,000 runs in Tests during his 115 not out in the second innings against New Zealand as the hosts romped home by five wickets to take a 1-0 lead in the three-match series.
In the ongoing second Test, Root went past Gavaskar and reached 10191 runs with his knock of 176 in the first innings. Root has jumped to 12th spot in the elite list led by Indian icon Sachin Tendulkar (15921).
https://www.hindustantimes.com/cric...e-leg-to-achieve-balance-101655209893782.html
One of the greatest modern-day batters, Root has been in phenomenal form in the ongoing Test series against New Zealand in which he not only scaled the 'Mount 10K' peak, but also surpassed Indian legend Sunil Gavaskar in the list of top run-getters in the traditional format. Giving an account of Root's dedication towards become one of the best in the world, his father spoke about his preparation, especially during the pandemic.
"During Covid he (Joe) got one of the Root Academy ball feeders that we have and he'd be there for an hour batting on one leg for balance. There's a video somewhere of him doing it," Matt said on the Test Match Special.
"Joe just loves batting," added Matt. "As a kid, wherever someone would bowl at him he'd be there with a bat. He just loves doing it, he just loves batting."
The former England skipper recently became the second English batter after Alastair Cook to score 10,000 runs in Tests during his 115 not out in the second innings against New Zealand as the hosts romped home by five wickets to take a 1-0 lead in the three-match series.
In the ongoing second Test, Root went past Gavaskar and reached 10191 runs with his knock of 176 in the first innings. Root has jumped to 12th spot in the elite list led by Indian icon Sachin Tendulkar (15921).
https://www.hindustantimes.com/cric...e-leg-to-achieve-balance-101655209893782.html
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Tbf Anderson was not considered an ATG for a very, very long time, even here. It's only in last 2 years people have changed the tune, and justifiably so. I still think his bowling average is a tad too high to be considered ATG, but I won't argue with anybody anymore if they call him an ATG.
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Anderson is 100% a longevity ATG but in terms of being a bona fide global ATG I think that debate will continue. I’m still not sure.
He is a fantastic bowler, a national great, and comfortably slots into an all time England XI — I don’t think there can be much argument there.
Ab Fan
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Same is the case with SRT and Indian fans too. SRT was anyways ahead in terms of runs scoring and hundreds tally by 2008 only when he beat Lara's record. But it was Indian media who hyped the 100th century thing to another level from 2011 World Cup onwards as it helps them cater to the Indian audience ( even those who hardly know about stats) and generate higher revenue so they did it.
Now, the records are meant to be broken someday but once a player's legacy is built, it needs to be duly respected by fans from all round the world. Hence the comments such as Tendulkar scored more runs only because he played more games(as others have better things to do in life than playing more matches for their country) and the 100th century coming in losing cause tells us the story of his career are surely not gonna go well with other Indian fans over here.
Ab Fan
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Longevity plays an important factor in any sports. That goes without saying, I would myself consider Anderson an ATG too, just highlighting the differences that people have while comparing two different players from different country.
For example, one of the major reason why Anwar in tests is not rated at same level to Smith, Hayden and Sehwag is because he doesn't have the longevity like other three. 4000 test runs are enough to judge a player but been able to consistently do it for a longer period takes a lot more. An example would be that 8000 runs at 50 average is always better than 5000 runs at 52 assuming other factors are constant.
Joseph Gomes
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Well the primary argument against Anderson was his away stats, which tbh is still not very good. Credit where its due though, Anderson post 2012 is worthy of ATG tag.
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I don't think the fans or media care too much about Jimmys record. Certainly not to the same extent that Indians hyped up Tendulkars
But yes I agree he is similar to Tendulkar in that respect as the majority of his legacy is based on longevity, although one could argue that is a far more difficult achievement for a quick bowler than a batsman.
Technics 1210
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I am not even a Tendulkar megafan, it's just that it felt ridiculous when someone compared a guy who can't take his avg above 50 even after his peak to someone who is amongst the greatest batsman of all time.
Just 2 years ago, this was the scenario :
S Smith - 62.84
Kohli - 53.62
Kane - 50.99
Warner - 48.94
Pujara - 48.66
Root - 48.40
I mean Root was behind Pujara
You are comparing this guy to a GOAT.
Ridiculous.
Let Root play more and then we'll see where it goes.
As of now Root is behind Javed Miandad let alone Sachin.
Time slicing is of no use. Rewind back to the time when Lara was leading the Test run table, and Tendulkar was playing catch up.
SRT was compared to the GOAT, Lara, back then.
Plus you are talking averages above when the point is of Test runs scored. However, if you really want to talk Test averages, SRT doesn't make it to the top Test 20, but Vinnod Kambli does!
)https://stats.espncricinfo.com/CI/content/records/282910.html
Technics 1210
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As for Jimmy, he is the first pace bowler to break the 600 Test wicket mark, this alone is worthy of note, and yes, his longevity is far more important for a pace bowler given the stress applied to a pace bowler's physique.
You can argue that Jimmy needed the longevity because the other factors of greatness were not quite there.
Maybe it’s the same case with Tendulkar.
What a lot of tendulkar’s fans don’t admit is that Tendulkar carried on playing for so long because he felt something was missing in the other aspects. Had he ticked all of the boxes 4-5 years before he would have retired then.
So you can argue that Tendulkar took a lot longer than his peers to achieve that level of greatness.
Longevity is important to a degree but does 200 tests prove anything more than 130 tests? 160 tests? Does it matter when you get to those numbers? Anyone who’s played over a hundred tests has ticked the longevity box. If they’ve ticked all the boxes by 100 tests, there’s no need to go further.
Maybe it’s the same case with Tendulkar.
What a lot of tendulkar’s fans don’t admit is that Tendulkar carried on playing for so long because he felt something was missing in the other aspects. Had he ticked all of the boxes 4-5 years before he would have retired then.
So you can argue that Tendulkar took a lot longer than his peers to achieve that level of greatness.
Longevity is important to a degree but does 200 tests prove anything more than 130 tests? 160 tests? Does it matter when you get to those numbers? Anyone who’s played over a hundred tests has ticked the longevity box. If they’ve ticked all the boxes by 100 tests, there’s no need to go further.
Ab Fan
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How is it similar? Anderson's away average is good but not great. His overall average is great but not like true all time greats.
Sachin's away average was great and his overall average was like true all time great of the game too. There are two boxes which needs to be ticked:-
1. Longevity
2. Maintaining Top level performance throughout overall career( bowlers averaging less than 25 and batsman averaging more than 50)
Sachin is right up there on both. Anderson is up there on one but not really as high as Sachin in the second one. That's the difference.
Ab Fan
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Actually when you consider these two parameters, then pretty much everyone lose to Sachin in the discussion of greatest cricketer of all-time barring Bradman and Sobers.
For example, Imran Khan had maintained top level performance in his career like Sachin Tendulkar made but he loses to Sachin because he was not able to maintain it for a longer period of time like Tendulkar did for India. This is where SRT not only outperforms Anderson but also outperforms Imran Khan and takes the greatest Asian cricketer of all-time recognition. Actually Imran loses to Anderson in the second category as well (both are bowlers also) because Imran in his own era had lesser wickets to all three of his contemporaries - Kapil, Hadlee and Botham.
For example, Imran Khan had maintained top level performance in his career like Sachin Tendulkar made but he loses to Sachin because he was not able to maintain it for a longer period of time like Tendulkar did for India. This is where SRT not only outperforms Anderson but also outperforms Imran Khan and takes the greatest Asian cricketer of all-time recognition. Actually Imran loses to Anderson in the second category as well (both are bowlers also) because Imran in his own era had lesser wickets to all three of his contemporaries - Kapil, Hadlee and Botham.
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Yes agreed, in the longevity metric Sachin trumps everyone. Imran included.
He is the only cricketer to have played so many matches while maintaining output on par with his peers.
And that too in both forms of the game that were being played during his times.
Not only that, he has played (and excelled) against so many ATGs which is unheard of.
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