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Pakistan has the best ODI pace attack in the world

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Nikhil_cric said:
Has only played 9 months of ODI cricket which is why the rankings are what they are Their entire strategy was based on Naseem's control. And they were heavily dependent on him - more so than any other cricketer.
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If we can't get india 3 down for under 50, we have zero chance.
 
jnaveen1980 said:
He has to establish consistency in this format yet. Naseem shah is ranked 60 in ODIs. His highest so far is 58. He has to get near top 20 to be considered a top bowler. Shaheen within one year was inside top 20. Right now even Pandya occasional part time seamer is ranked 50th. Thakur 41.
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Funny, how rankings are used as a convenient tool for measure when it suits one’s own argument.

Have you checked how many ODIs Naseem has played?

He is our best pacer, this was the established thought process even while he was playing and not injured.

Shaheen and Rauf are too attacking and they need someone like Naseem to compliment them. Right now we have Hasan Ali, who can be destroyed at any given time.
 
Shaheen, Naseem and Rauf is a very good pace attack any team would love to have.

Unfortunately, one of them got injured and one is definitely not fit as his speeds are repeatedly showing since the Asia Cup.
 
Usman Chadda said:
Shaheen, Naseem and Rauf is a very good pace attack any team would love to have.

Unfortunately, one of them got injured and one is definitely not fit as his speeds are repeatedly showing since the Asia Cup.
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I strongly disagree. Apart from Naseem, no one is that good. As usual we overhype players and expect ott stuff. One thing is for sure as long as there is no merit in the system we will keep picking players based on nepotism and experience.
 
MRSN said:
I strongly disagree. Apart from Naseem, no one is that good. As usual we overhype players and expect ott stuff. One thing is for sure as long as there is no merit in the system we will keep picking players based on nepotism and experience.
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Shaheen is definitely quality, but is suffering from fitness issues for certain.

His speeds have drastically reduced to Hasan Ali levels.
 
MRSN said:
I strongly disagree. Apart from Naseem, no one is that good. As usual we overhype players and expect ott stuff. One thing is for sure as long as there is no merit in the system we will keep picking players based on nepotism and experience.
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To be honest Naseem has very little sample. Besides in order to make his outswing look bigger he bowls way too short. If a batsman decides to see him he can easily do. Shaheen is still their best wicket taker. But he is too greedy with his line and length. His thinking has to improve a lot. Sussing out conditions and bowling accordingly rather than remembering his old success and hoping it will keep working.
 
Shaheen and Naseem are good but losing Naseem is a big loss for Pakistan.

Rauf is there to add an extra dimension of genuine pace but most of SENA and Indian batters are terrific vs pace, like bowl to come on bat and Rauf often sprays a lot which doesn't help his case either. He would have done better with Shaheen and Naseem both.

Pakistan spinners are poor. When it comes to bowling, it is pace + spin and not just pace. At the moment, all Pakistan have in this World Cup is Shaheen + Rauf( to an extent).
 
With Naseem it was good, without him and SSA decline due to injury and a scrambled brain, its not any where close.
 
Marooned said:
Ihsanullah has a much higher ceiling than Zaman is what I'm saying. Give them both opportunities.

I won't mind Zaman in the squad right now.


Ihsanullah isn't just a new ball bowler. His strength isn't swing and seam. His strength his hard length/ back of the length balls which rise very awkwardly. That at 150k. The kind of bowler who hits helmets and intimidates.

He got 2 games vs Nz on very unforgiving tracks. You can't form a judgement based on that. Look at his ingredients.
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Zaman would make no difference. Any guy that bowls slingy has an inconsistent action and is not a ODi player against decent players. Ihsanullah and Arshad are the next cabs off the rank.
 
So far pace units in this world cup.


qweqweqwqw.jpg
 
I saw The Pavilion program and in that Wasim Akram said something very important. He rightly pointed out that some players are looking unfit and he got to know that there is no proper fitness tests. It would be a big miracle if both Shaheen & Haris Rauf remain completely fit till the end of the tournament
 
Watching that horrific ill-discipline with the new ball from all the pacers made me embarrassed to be a fan of Pakistan, we're supposed to be the land of fast bowling.

I don't care about the target being low, there's 0 excuse for producing that volume of hit me balls on a stage like this against an opposition like this. Thoroughly depressing.
 
This is why I told all of you naseem is > our trio and is the only world class one. You all got way too hyped because shaheen was bullying minnows and indian batters. Truth is beyond that inswing early on which doesn't always work, Dude is clueless in the middle and death lol cause his line and length is usually awful.

Naseem is line and length class. Economy + wickets XD.
 
They need to proof their bowlig strength in the match against Australia.

If still top 3 pacers doesnt fire in this match so they are done.
 
Rauf and Shaheen Shah Afridi bowling with pace and venom today
 
Rana said:
Just realised, Pakistan had 3 seamers in their 2003 wc attack that averaged below 25 runs per wicket and had taken close to 1000 ODI wickets between them.

The current 3 (Shaheen, Harris and Naseem) have an average age of 25, all 3 average below 25 and have also taken 100+ wickets at this level.

Maybe I am wrong, or will be proven wrong but this might actually be our best trio of pacers in 20 years. All 3 of them are more than useful fielders and 2 of them at least can add some value with the bat.

Can the 2023 World Cup trio do what the 2003 trio failed to do?
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The wheels have fallen off completely after the Asia Cup match against India.
Currently the Indian attack is the numero uno.
 
There was alot of hoopla about our bowlers before the world cup. While everyone knew the spinners were exposed in the Asia Cup, but the fast bowlers bowling rubbish was not expected.

I was taken by surprise how bad Haris Rauf came out to be. Before the World Cup there was soo much hype about him that a small episode was made where his background and roots were visited and his story was shared. But he got smacked in this world cup and did not live up to the expectations.

Waseem Jr surprised many of us, and showed that we should had trusted him alot more. He was the only bowler who was able to give Pakistan some hope in the bowling area.

Shadab and Nawaz both continued the garbage bowling from the Asia Cup.

Too much expectations on Shaheen to pick a wicket in his first spell maybe?

P.S yes yes, indian bowlers outperformed Pakistani bowlers by a mile. Shami alone gave a great performance in less games that we played
 
cricket.mad said:
This idiot bhagveeru is not seen any where as india is doing well..such a looser in life ..pathetic personality
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Huh? Calling me an idiot for posting my opinion here? Why are you venting out your frustration on me here? Did your dad/wife beat you today? Do you know me personally lol? What a loser. :inti
 
Shaheen gets Stokes.
He’s still up there

It’s all about having each others back and this team is missing Naseem Shah who is the leader of the pace attack
 
Bhaijaan said:
Shaheen gets Stokes.
He’s still up there

It’s all about having each others back and this team is missing Naseem Shah who is the leader of the pace attack
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Some fans are just not with it are they. it was a shocking shot a hack from stokes. Was a trundling Yorker. If stokes was at his peak he would have easily played and negotiated that. Got absolutely mauled today for 72 runs against a washed up England side.

He’s done.
 
Saj said:
Smashed to all parts match after match.

All over the place, no control or discipline.
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Bowling was pakistans strongest point. I have watched cricket for 4 decades and know when a player is done.

Post injury we have burnt afridi to the ground and will continue to burn to the ground further I just don’t see him reaching the levels he once did. He’s sadly done due the incompetence of the selectors to force him to play.

They will carry on playing him until he becomes a total cannon fodder chaminda Vaas pace bowler 73 mph and with modern players nowadays will butcher him for 70+ on a regular.
 
Saj said:
Yes definitely the best:

337 by England in 50 overs
401 by New Zealand in 50 overs
286/2 by Afghanistan in 49 overs
367 by Australia in 50 overs
192/3 by India in 30.3 overs
344 by Sri Lanka in 50 overs
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Shaheen is no 1 👀
 
The last thing which was needed to prove this was to let a totally out of form and demoralized England batting line-up smash 340 runs.
 
337 by England in 50 overs
401 by New Zealand in 50 overs
286/2 by Afghanistan in 49 overs
367 by Australia in 50 overs
192/3 by India in 30.3 overs
344 by Sri Lanka in 50 overs

If Naseem was fit and firing....all these would be 25% less
 
Rana said:
Just realised, Pakistan had 3 seamers in their 2003 wc attack that averaged below 25 runs per wicket and had taken close to 1000 ODI wickets between them.

The current 3 (Shaheen, Harris and Naseem) have an average age of 25, all 3 average below 25 and have also taken 100+ wickets at this level.

Maybe I am wrong, or will be proven wrong but this might actually be our best trio of pacers in 20 years. All 3 of them are more than useful fielders and 2 of them at least can add some value with the bat.

Can the 2023 World Cup trio do what the 2003 trio failed to do?
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That aged well.
 
For a bowling attack to be considered the best, it should have shown consistent performance and not just few good balls at death where batsmen have no option but to hit hard
 
Bewal Express said:
On their day PK, Ind, Aus or Saffer can claim to be the best. Aus with the big 3 and Green will keep the pressure on, Ind with Bumrah( if he is fit), Shami and Siraj will be a danger to most batting lineups, Saffers with Nortje, Rabada( although he looks to be on his last legs and shows no passion) and Jansen will be a handful. And then there is us with SSA getting closer to full fitness, Naseem bowling with good pace and movement and Rauf bowling with pure pace, will be a handful to all batsman.
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Badly wrong on Rauf. Absolutely awful this tournament. Went back to brainless bowling and couldn't cope with pressure. Our attack has been amongst the weakest in the tournament
 
Bewal Express said:
A final and SF. Is that failure? Let's have more of these failures
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Last year’s WT20 was a failure. Pakistan didn’t deserve to be in the final and actually played very mediocre cricket throughout the competition.

The team deserved a group stage exit. Had that happened, Babar would’ve been sacked as captain.

You IK fans will blindly cheerlead anything he does even if it leads to an outcome of failure.
 
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Saj said:
Yes definitely the best:

337 by England in 50 overs
401 by New Zealand in 50 overs
286/2 by Afghanistan in 49 overs
367 by Australia in 50 overs
192/3 by India in 30.3 overs
344 by Sri Lanka in 50 overs
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Pak batsmen did their bowlers a favor by only scoring 190 runs vs India. Spared some embarrassment.
 
topspin said:
Last year’s WT20 was a failure. Pakistan didn’t deserve to be in the final and actually played very mediocre cricket throughout the competition.

The team deserved a group stage exit. Had that happened, Babar would’ve been sacked as captain.

You IK fans will blindly cheerlead anything he does even if it leads to an outcome of failure. BC
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No such thing as deserve. You get there because the rules allowed. Its not dressage in show jumping.
 
Well on a sports they were talking about shaheen, and fakhar-e-alam mentioned the stats where shaheen has 3 wickets in 9 games in his initial opening spell. I expected so much more from him, and the rest of the bowlers this tournament. Both fast bowlers and spinners taken around the park, never have I seen such a consistent eyesore performance from our bowlers.
 
Rana said:
Just realised, Pakistan had 3 seamers in their 2003 wc attack that averaged below 25 runs per wicket and had taken close to 1000 ODI wickets between them.

The current 3 (Shaheen, Harris and Naseem) have an average age of 25, all 3 average below 25 and have also taken 100+ wickets at this level.

Maybe I am wrong, or will be proven wrong but this might actually be our best trio of pacers in 20 years. All 3 of them are more than useful fielders and 2 of them at least can add some value with the bat.

Can the 2023 World Cup trio do what the 2003 trio failed to do?
Click to expand...
Is this thread similar to my rizwan greatest batsmen thread?

Or were you fooled by the bullying of c or d string sides?

Don't get me wrong, I was also fooled until asia cup where I started to warn people as to what would happen, so I'm asking, we're you fooled like I was or is the thread similar to my rizwan thread that I did for giggles?
 
jnaveen1980 said:
Performances of pacers in 2023 world cup

pace2.jpg



Performance of pacers in the last 3 world cups 2015/2019/2023 combined

worldcup.jpg
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Unfair to blame our pace attack. Apart from India, all other pacers have found things hard in this WC. Even the likes of Starc, Hazelwood, Cummins have struggled and Bolt only did well against Sri Lanka.

Our pacers suffered badly because the spinners failed to pick up 2-3 wickets in the middle.
 
mominsaigol said:
Is this thread similar to my rizwan greatest batsmen thread?

Or were you fooled by the bullying of c or d string sides?

Don't get me wrong, I was also fooled until asia cup where I started to warn people as to what would happen, so I'm asking, we're you fooled like I was or is the thread similar to my rizwan thread that I did for giggles?
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Tbf the three looked good running up until the World Cup or that dreadful game against India.

They completely lost their zip after that beating
 
Savak said:
Unfair to blame our pace attack. Apart from India, all other pacers have found things hard in this WC. Even the likes of Starc, Hazelwood, Cummins have struggled and Bolt only did well against Sri Lanka.

Our pacers suffered badly because the spinners failed to pick up 2-3 wickets in the middle.
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Our pacers are out of form and quite frankly, overrated.
 
When will we see this level of desire and committment again? Where is the world class pedigree? Where is the arrogance?

1706045464666.png
 
Lets leave RizBar aside & Sharjeel, Asif Ali debate should take a rest. @Rana @mominsaigol @Bewal Express

Pakistan cricket famous for its fast bowling, it was bowlers who stepped up and absolutely demolished the opposition.

Pakistan attack took 26 wickets @18.5 with a SR of 22.4, insane!

Another important factor all 4 quicks contributing and none of them had a bad day.

No comparison with any other fast bowling arsenal from past , but definitely a glimpse of how great attacks of the 70s 80s operated.
 
Pakistan attacks was destroy by Afghanistan and others teams in 2023 world cup .

Again they were betean by USA in 2024 World.

So Stop hyping them just after one good series
 
Devadwal said:
Pakistan attacks was destroy by Afghanistan and others teams in 2023 world cup .

Again they were betean by USA in 2024 World.

So Stop hyping them just after one good series
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Everyday is a new day, Indian bowlers were ridiculed and labelled as pop gun until a decade ago. There are ups and downs, more than bowling its Pakistan batting which lets them down
 
Kianig89 said:
Lets leave RizBar aside & Sharjeel, Asif Ali debate should take a rest. @Rana @mominsaigol @Bewal Express

Pakistan cricket famous for its fast bowling, it was bowlers who stepped up and absolutely demolished the opposition.

Pakistan attack took 26 wickets @18.5 with a SR of 22.4, insane!

Another important factor all 4 quicks contributing and none of them had a bad day.

No comparison with any other fast bowling arsenal from past , but definitely a glimpse of how great attacks of the 70s 80s operated.
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If their inform then their top tier bowlers.

If their not in form then their run machines. Theirs no in between.

In the past the pace trio use to complement each other.

Shaheen was a killer new ball bowler but a poor middle and death overs bowlers.

Naseem was an economical Support bowler when it came to new ball bowling and death overs bowling but was a poor middle overs bowler.

Rauf was an expensive but wicket taking .middle overs bowlers.

They would compliment one another as their weaknesses wouldn't get exposed due to the fact that these 3 complimented each other.

For example, Shaheen deapite being a poor death overs bowler would pick up wickets as naseem was difficult to hit. So batsmen took unnecessary risk.

Similarly naseem's lack of quality new ball bowling wasn't an issue as he was economical and shaheen just got rid of the opening pair with the new ball.

In terms of 2024. Rauf's career seems to be on an upwards trajectory. Shaheen and naseem are improving line and length but shaheen's pace is down which is a worrying concern.
 
Kianig89 said:
Lets leave RizBar aside & Sharjeel, Asif Ali debate should take a rest. @Rana @mominsaigol @Bewal Express

Pakistan cricket famous for its fast bowling, it was bowlers who stepped up and absolutely demolished the opposition.

Pakistan attack took 26 wickets @18.5 with a SR of 22.4, insane!

Another important factor all 4 quicks contributing and none of them had a bad day.

No comparison with any other fast bowling arsenal from past , but definitely a glimpse of how great attacks of the 70s 80s operated.
Click to expand...
These group of pacers have now adjusted well on various tracks around the world. Even Australia. They all started young for Pakistan barring Harris and by now they are experienced enough. If they remain fit. One can only imagine what they will do by the age of 30.

With flat tracks and highways of course it's a different ball game.
 
They are good on helpful wickets but less so on flatter batting friendly wickets.

In limited overs they are also constrained by the fact that the batting is often far behind a par score so it appears like the bowling has let the team down by allowing the opposition to score lots of runs.
 
DeadlyVenom said:
They are good on helpful wickets but less so on flatter batting friendly wickets.

In limited overs they are also constrained by the fact that the batting is often far behind a par score so it appears like the bowling has let the team down by allowing the opposition to score lots of runs.
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I think old experienced pacers tend to do well on flat tracks than young ones. Could be a number of reasons some may be obvious too. But yea it is like that.
 
Kianig89 said:
Lets leave RizBar aside & Sharjeel, Asif Ali debate should take a rest. @Rana @mominsaigol @Bewal Express

Pakistan cricket famous for its fast bowling, it was bowlers who stepped up and absolutely demolished the opposition.

Pakistan attack took 26 wickets @18.5 with a SR of 22.4, insane!

Another important factor all 4 quicks contributing and none of them had a bad day.

No comparison with any other fast bowling arsenal from past , but definitely a glimpse of how great attacks of the 70s 80s operated.
Click to expand...
The failure of Pakistan's batsmen to adjust to Australian conditions is usually cited as the reason behind our awful record there.

An equally important factor is our inability to bowl the right lengths - something @Nikhil_cric has previously mentioned. It doesn't help we've often had long gaps between touring making acclimatisation harder.

However we've now toured Australia in three consecutive years - 2022 T20 World Cup, 2023 Test series and 2024 ODI series - and on all three occasions they've performed well.

Last year our bowling average was 36.78 - our lowest across a Test series since 1995. While that doesn't sound particularly impressive, opposition teams (exc. Pakistan) touring Australia in the last 15 years averaged 43.5.

It's true Australian surfaces have become spicier in the last few years, but you must still land the ball in the right areas, and not get too carried away by the extra bounce. Hopefully our bowling carries this performance forward into the T20s.
 
Markhor said:
The failure of Pakistan's batsmen to adjust to Australian conditions is usually cited as the reason behind our awful record there.

An equally important factor is our inability to bowl the right lengths - something @Nikhil_cric has previously mentioned. It doesn't help we've often had long gaps between touring making acclimatisation harder.

However we've now toured Australia in three consecutive years - 2022 T20 World Cup, 2023 Test series and 2024 ODI series - and on all three occasions they've performed well.

Last year our bowling average was 36.78 - our lowest across a Test series since 1995. While that doesn't sound particularly impressive, opposition teams (exc. Pakistan) touring Australia in the last 15 years averaged 43.5.

It's true Australian surfaces have become spicier in the last few years, but you must still land the ball in the right areas, and not get too carried away by the extra bounce. Hopefully our bowling carries this performance forward into the T20s.
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Haris Rauf certainly has a great deal of experience bowling in Australia, so do we give him most of the credit for holding the attack together in the recent ODI series or do you feel Shaheen & Naseem made the necessary adjustments as well?
 
Devadwal said:
Pakistan attacks was destroy by Afghanistan and others teams in 2023 world cup .

Again they were betean by USA in 2024 World.

So Stop hyping them just after one good series
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I don’t think the bump was designed to hype them up as the best etc and what not, I would argue that they had a strong argument between 2022-2023. But it’s good to recognise good performance and Pakistan & good fast bowling is part of their heritage so it’s natural they will be proud to see performances that bring back some of the old days….
 
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