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Pakistan reach 259/5 at stumps on Day 1 of the second Test against England

mominsaigol said:
Name one aussie player who's selfish. Name one England player who's selfish name one sa player who's selfish.

All I think of is Sachin who at the back end of his career stubbornly played for 100th 100 but that was at the back end
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Steve Waugh

“Ian Chappelli named his 20 greatest Ashes cricketers, and left Steve Waugh (and Boycott) out, claiming that Steve Waugh is "selfish".

Shane Warne said …”For the record AGAIN & l've said this 1000 times - I do not hate S Waugh at all. FYI - I picked him in my all time best Australian team recently. However, Steve was easily the most selfish cricketer that I ever played with”

All great players are selfish — the beauty of cricket is that it is an individual sport played within the context of a team sport.
 
imshally81 said:
Saud Shakeel
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he is another who couldnt score runs these days... scores a hundred per series and thats it followed by a set of low scores..

such an unreliable batsman.. Seems Asad Shafiq and Fawad Alam was much more reliant with 30 and 50s with odd hundreds...

Last six innings thats been the story with this guy, not ready for vice-captaincy i believe just to calm Karachi fans..... This guy has enormous chances as a batsman , played in the CWC etc wasnt able to prove his worth or come out shining.. waste of time really... I would drop him and bring in someone who can consistently score or even give that spot to Salman Ali agha..
 
Pakistan is firmly favourite in this test if they score another 100 runs ..England are not going to get 300 in first innings..
 
Given Salman and Rizwan will open tomorrow. Jamal in the hut with Sajid and Noman to slouch either. Pakistan should get 350+
 
gibsyhesperis said:
Steve Waugh

“Ian Chappelli named his 20 greatest Ashes cricketers, and left Steve Waugh (and Boycott) out, claiming that Steve Waugh is "selfish".

Shane Warne said …”For the record AGAIN & l've said this 1000 times - I do not hate S Waugh at all. FYI - I picked him in my all time best Australian team recently. However, Steve was easily the most selfish cricketer that I ever played with”

All great players are selfish — the beauty of cricket is that it is an individual sport played within the context of a team sport.
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This is such a dubious post because Shane Warne was angry at being dropped for the 99 test against wi and every player including waugh testified to this statement with Ian Chappel simply gooning Warne into oblivion.

Waugh made the correct decison on dropping Warne at he time who was injured and filled with ego of wanting to play

And secondly he's referring to Waugh as a leader, and questioning his leadership skills on choosing certain players over others.

@gazza619 is talking about batting skills only aka what babar and rizwan do and what misbah always did.

Big difference. Please understand the context of a situation before mentioning the Shane Warne book which I have read and is nothing more then Warne talking non stop about his unfair 99 drop
 
mominsaigol said:
This is such a dubious post because Shane Warne was angry at being dropped for the 99 test against wi and every player including waugh testified to this statement with Ian Chappel simply gooning Warne into oblivion.

Waugh made the correct decison on dropping Warne at he time who was injured and filled with ego of wanting to play

And secondly he's referring to Waugh as a leader, and questioning his leadership skills on choosing certain players over others.

@gazza619 is talking about batting skills only aka what babar and rizwan do and what misbah always did.

Big difference. Please understand the context of a situation before mentioning the Shane Warne book which I have read and is nothing more then Warne talking non stop about his unfair 99 drop
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and Ian Chappell’s comment …. ?
 
Hope it's not downhill after the first day again, even if Pakistan manage to score 350, the bowling selected is very suspect with overkill of spinners and no pacer to support Jamal if England take a liking for spin if pitch not doing much for them.
 
gazza619 said:
But you clearly said Haseebullah farigh hai, and now you are proposing his name

Make up your mind Baba Saigol
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I gave you the names now answer. To make it more specific, which GREAT BATSMEN had an element to selfishness that doesn't include the backend of their career
 
Pakistan's day, there is something on offer for both seamers and spinners. This pitch will break apart and is expected to be hard to bat on 3rd and 4th innings.
 
gazza619 said:
Steve Waugh
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Oh so steve waugh was a selfish batsmen? Where did you get that from considering both chappel and Warne only talk about his captaincy and his dropping and favouring players based of his liking?
 
mominsaigol said:
Oh so steve waugh was a selfish batsmen? Where did you get that from considering both chappel and Warne only talk about his captaincy and his dropping and favouring players based of his liking?
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If you dont know that Steve Waugh was selfish, then you know nothing about cricket

I dont have time to write essays.
 
Eng will be more than happy, kept Pakistan in check with only tail left. 280ish they will wipe it in 2½sessions. Basically Eng will look to bat once hopefully the spin trio of Pakistan will not let them settle.
 
gazza619 said:
If you dont know that Steve Waugh was selfish, then you know nothing about cricket

I dont have time to write essays.
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Let's be honest, we both know you didn't watch their eras and started watching since the misbah era.
 
Taking 20 wickets is a crucial factor in Test cricket than piling up runs , as evident by our ill fated Eng tour in 2010 where with zilch batting and dubious activities still we won 2 out of 4 Tests.

As far as Steve Waugh whether selfish or not is concerned, he was a great player be it selfish or not evident by his many stellar innings playing 150+ Test for Australia is not joke.
 
mominsaigol said:
Oh so steve waugh was a selfish batsmen? Where did you get that from considering both chappel and Warne only talk about his captaincy and his dropping and favouring players based of his liking?
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Actually you are incorrect — Warne’s “criticism”was also related to Waugh as a batsman

— Warne cited the fact that Waugh was involved in 104 career international run outs (a record), in which his partner was run out over 70% of the time (he posted this on his Twitter account when he became aware of this statistic)

— the fact that Waugh did not believe in keeping the strike when batting with tailenders, which Warne claimed was due to his desire to have “not outs” thereby boosting his average.

These are both related to Waugh’s batting.
 
gibsyhesperis said:
Actually you are incorrect — Warne’s “criticism”was also related to Waugh as a batsman

— Warne cited the fact that Waugh was involved in 104 career international run outs (a record), in which his partner was run out over 70% of the time (he posted this on his Twitter account when he became aware of this statistic)

— the fact that Waugh did not believe in keeping the strike when batting with tailenders, which Warne claimed was due to his desire to have “not outs” thereby boosting his average.

These are both related to Waugh’s batting.
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That's a leadership critique. It's not the same as what @gazza619 was claiming aka to duck and avoid playing high risk strokes aka the Misbah batting approach .

Also waugh never did things that Warne claimed. Warne was forever angry at the 99 wi drop
 
Kianig89 said:
Eng will be more than happy, kept Pakistan in check with only tail left. 280ish they will wipe it in 2½sessions. Basically Eng will look to bat once hopefully the spin trio of Pakistan will not let them settle.
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They can try bowling defensively with in out field. Restricting the scoring rate is the best way to beat England in their own game.
 
Nikhil_cric said:
Take Ian Chappell's or really any Aussies opinions on other Aussies with a big bucket of salt. They are not always objective
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With respect, by definition no one’s opinion is “objective”….. as individuals all of our opinions (including all of ours on this forum) are subjective
 
gibsyhesperis said:
With respect, by definition no one’s opinion is “objective”….. as individuals all of our opinions (including all of ours on this forum) are subjective
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There are opinions that have some basis in objective facts and others that don't.
 
I saw only first hour of the match. From what i saw pitch is too slow atleast at this point. Pakistan spinners would want it to deteriorate further with more cracks. England is not afraid of taking chances. That is where Pakistan will have an opening.
 
jnaveen1980 said:
They can try bowling defensively with in out field. Restricting the scoring rate is the best way to beat England in their own game.
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Pakistan don't have bowlers to plan anything. They are just relying on pitch cracking up, doesn't seem it'll happen
 
No one apart from Kamran and Saim batted in partnerships or took responsibility. Pak team still playing in broken pieces.
 
Just look at the way Ghulam and Shakeel have composed their innings to date - there is daylight between them, two hardened domestic run scorers and the likes of Shan - no offence at all to the current skipper.

Even compared to the talented Babar, Ghulam and Shakeel look to have tighter techniques while not being as gifted and still having their issues. Saud will have to come up with something against the short ball.

Ghulam and Shakeel look good players, and we should be delighted they have emerged - two proper, correct batsmen.

Great that we also have a good test level 7 and 8 now, they are level up on Faheem and Shadab in whites.

On another note, not sure what Mir Hamza has to do to get a game, another proven performer - would've dovetailed well with Jamal and we still would've had space for 2 'specialist' spinners and Agha, and also Saim.
 
Great day for Pakistan cricket! I am expecting this pitch to favour bowlers more and more as the match progresses on day 2 and 3 and on the 4th day, it will start to explode. Batting last won't be easy here at all.

Kamran Ghulam never looked nervous and smiled every single time when a bowler beat his bat with a good delivery. Gotta love that "wait on and the bat pointing exactly towards the bowlers as if they were his batting partners. What a character.
 
Ahmed216 said:
No score is good enough if we continue to collapse in second innings. Normally 400 would be a good score on such a surface.

It's sluggish and spinning a bit and likely to get worse
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No score is good enough when you have pathetic bowlers. England are scoring 500 at least as the turn on offer seems very manageable.

Pakistan could effectively be batting last
 
hur rizvi said:
No score is good enough when you have pathetic bowlers. England are scoring 500 at least as the turn on offer seems very manageable.

Pakistan could effectively be batting last
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I don't think England are getting 500 on this surface especially we're able to bat for 40-50 more overs in the first innings.
Spinners are going to nab them
 
Ahmed216 said:
I don't think England are getting 500 on this surface especially we're able to bat for 40-50 more overs in the first innings.
Spinners are going to nab them
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Spinners weren't doing a damn.

It was reversing qith seam
 
Ahmed216 said:
I don't think England are getting 500 on this surface especially we're able to bat for 40-50 more overs in the first innings.
Spinners are going to nab them
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Only noman Ali is half decent

I assure you these spinners won't cause England any harm at least in their first innings. They just need to bat 85-90 overs to score 500
 
Ahmed216 said:
Our spinners should bowl much better on this surface than England
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Why? Pakistan hasnalways misread it's pitches, it's nothing new. Their over reliance on spin will come back to bite them.

People need to accept the truth that the gap is too high.

The one good thing that did come out is that this series has proven that

A) PCB keeps making all format mistakes and equates multiple formats as one, the likes of Babar, Shaheen etc don't even play local fc cricket and it's clearly showing in their selection. Only format selection is needed.

B) select players who are performing and not based of reputation, for example shabzada farhan top scored in qea last time so he shpuld have been here, his performance related to odi or t20 cups or psl shouldn't be used as a criteria only qea should for test cricket selection only.

With that being said, I'm also willing to take back what I said anout rizwan champions cu0 avg but he also needs a boot. He just like babar and shaheen does not play local red ball cricket and hasn't featured in SMGPL test for a long long time.

And it clearly shows as he was totally clueless againat reverse. All his scoring came off over dealing with rubbish bashir
 
batandballbattle said:
This could get ugly if no turn is found today
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Its a day 9 pitch , used pitch and will go worse in the coming days.. If Pak can manage somehow to put a score of 350+ this will be a good match.. with three experienced FC spinners + Salman its Pak match to lose i reckon...
 
But to replace Riz you are giving names of Sarfaraz & Haseebullah whom you dont support yourself. something doesnt seem right.
 
If there's any chance of the pitch deteriorating significantly, then Pakistan should play for time as well as runs to ensure the pitch is tough to bat on for England.
 
ask_analyse_act said:
Its a day 9 pitch , used pitch and will go worse in the coming days.. If Pak can manage somehow to put a score of 350+ this will be a good match.. with three experienced FC spinners + Salman its Pak match to lose i reckon...
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England can make what is seemingly a good score look under par very quickly. The pitch will need to spit a lot more venom for our spinners to be effective.
If the turn stays moderate like today they will likely get smashed to all parts
 
very good day for Pakistan. New look has brought new resolve to do well. They need to push the score to 400+ which is possible with two very good batsman at the crease and few handy ones to follow. Wicket is doing more than the first test and that is all needed to tackle majority of flat track bullies in England line up. England may still end up winning they will have to work really hard in this test.. I predicted 2-1 or max 2-0 win for England, this match could be the one where Pak will either draw or win one finally..
 
Croma said:
Leach takes out SHafique :sanga
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Shafique's technique was exposed badly in this series by England.. his bat comes in an angle from the gully... he needs to go back to domestic and get his technique fixed.. bowled in the last inns on a fuller delivery first ball and today one more time...

Replace him with Hurraira and he will make a debut 100 as well...

I would even play Imam ul Haq at no.3 instead of this English speaking captain Shan...

Imam ul Haq would have definitely made more runs than this useless Shan if given the opportunity at no.3..

following should be the pool of players to select from for tests

  1. Hurraira
  2. Saim Ayub
  3. Imam ul Haq
  4. Kamran Ghulam
  5. Babar Azam ( after he scores loads of runs in FC and earns his spot back )
  6. Salman Ali Agha
  7. Rizwan
  8. Aameer Jamal
  9. Sajid Khan
  10. Noman Ali
  11. Mir Hamza
  12. Sameen Gul
  13. Naseem Shah
  14. Zahid Mehmood
  15. Abdullah Shafique
  16. Saud Shakeel..
  17. Usman Salahuddin
  18. Abraar Ahmed
  19. Hasnain
  20. Khurram Shehzad
 
: Kamran Ghulam, who earlier became the 257th player to don the Test cap for Pakistan, hit a brilliant century in his first outing in the Test career as Pakistan finished the first day of the second Test match with 259-5 in 90 overs at the Multan Cricket Stadium on Tuesday.

Kamran was dismissed for a well-made 118 off 224 balls hitting 11 fours and one six, in the 85th over of the day after having walked into bat in the 10th over with 19-2 on the board.

Along with Saim Ayub (77, 160b, 7x4s), Kamran shared a 149-run third-wicket partnership as the duo took Pakistan out of trouble before Saim departed in the 56th over with the scorecard reading 168-3.

Earlier, after Pakistan opted to bat first, Jack Leach drew the first blood as he castled Abdullah Shafique for a 28-ball seven in the eighth over. An over later, Leach got rid of Shan Masood for just three as Crawley pouched the ball at short midwicket.

Pakistan amassed 79 runs for the loss of just two wickets on the stroke of lunch with Saim and Kamran having brought up their fifty-run stand off 85 balls. Saim reached his third Test half-century off 97 balls before succumbing to Matthew Potts just an over before Tea break, caught by Ben Stokes at short mid-off.

After Pakistan scored 94 runs in the second session giving away only one wicket, England began the third session with the vital scalp of Saud Shakeel (4, 14b, 1x4) as he was caught behind off Brydon Carse in the 61st over.

With the scorecard reading 178-4, Mohammad Rizwan (37 not out, 89b, 4x4s) joined forces with Kamran to stabilise Pakistan’s innings as the duo put on a dogged 65-run fifth-wicket partnership. In the meanwhile, Kamran became the 13th Pakistan player to score a century on Test debut and only the sixth batter to score a hundred on men’s Test debut while batting at No.4, when he hit Joe Root to midwicket for a boundary in the 74th over.

Shoaib Bashir brought an end to Kamran’s 74.4-over stay on the crease when he got one to hit the stumps in the 85th over with Pakistan 243-5. Salman Ali Agha (5 not out, 19b) and Rizwan closed the day for Pakistan with 259-5 on the board.

Scores in brief:

Second Test - Day 1 of 5; Pakistan won the toss and elected to bat first at the Multan Cricket Stadium

Pakistan 259-5, 90 overs (Kamran Ghulam 118, Saim Ayub 77, Mohammad Rizwan 37 not out; Jack Leach 2-92)
 
batandballbattle said:
England can make what is seemingly a good score look under par very quickly. The pitch will need to spit a lot more venom for our spinners to be effective.
If the turn stays moderate like today they will likely get smashed to all parts
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Agree that if the pitch stays how it is today it will not make that tough for England..

But their bazball could also get a hit if the Pak spinners attack alongwith the captains support... Just like how Stokes created Shans wicket.. Saim and KG batted really beautifully in this wicket to dig out of the hole... Now its upto the remaining lot to make sure Pak cross 350 with ease.. 450 would be a match winning score in this wicket provided Pak bat well in the second inns..
England so far in the last tour and this tour havent been tested with spin friendly wickets and good amount of spin bowling...
first time they are put into this situation and it would be interesting to see how they respond..
 
PakPremi said:
Amongst good captaincy Stokes does strange decisions like bowling root to make it easier for Ghulam to get the last two runs, and earlier in the day bowling spinners for too long when they were being handled easily by Saim and Kamran, as soon as pacers came they made it harder for Pakistan.
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You can't expect to keep bowling the two pacers they've selected all day. They bowled as many overs as they could under the conditions. Pakistani fans need to understand this, and more importantly, so does the Pakistan think tank, which has a habit of running their bowlers into the ground.
 
gazza619 said:
Basically it is a hate driven agenda and I smell racism.
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There is definitely an element of racism directed towards him by some posters. I personally don't like rizwan for his antics and part of his game too, but unlike others I am not deluded in thinking that there are better options than him. If you seriously think there is a better option than rizwan for tests. This tells us 2 things you either don't know cricket or you hate him.
 
ask_analyse_act said:
Shafique's technique was exposed badly in this series by England.. his bat comes in an angle from the gully... he needs to go back to domestic and get his technique fixed.. bowled in the last inns on a fuller delivery first ball and today one more time...

Replace him with Hurraira and he will make a debut 100 as well...

I would even play Imam ul Haq at no.3 instead of this English speaking captain Shan...

Imam ul Haq would have definitely made more runs than this useless Shan if given the opportunity at no.3..

following should be the pool of players to select from for tests

  1. Hurraira
  2. Saim Ayub
  3. Imam ul Haq
  4. Kamran Ghulam
  5. Babar Azam ( after he scores loads of runs in FC and earns his spot back )
  6. Salman Ali Agha
  7. Rizwan
  8. Aameer Jamal
  9. Sajid Khan
  10. Noman Ali
  11. Mir Hamza
  12. Sameen Gul
  13. Naseem Shah
  14. Zahid Mehmood
  15. Abdullah Shafique
  16. Saud Shakeel..
  17. Usman Salahuddin
  18. Abraar Ahmed
  19. Hasnain
  20. Khurram Shehzad
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Hussnain has remodelled his action. Looks good.
But will he be playing tests though?
 
Pakhs said:
You can't expect to keep bowling the two pacers they've selected all day. They bowled as many overs as they could under the conditions. Pakistani fans need to understand this, and more importantly, so does the Pakistan think tank, which has a habit of running their bowlers into the ground.
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Did need to bowl all day just should had bowled a lot earlier as clearly Pakistan struggles with pacers more, and if couple more wickets fell Pakistan would had been under tremendous pressure early on. Stokes definitely provided the opportunity for Pakistan to stabilise, taking nothing away from KG and Saim sensible batting.
 
mominsaigol said:
I don't support them, but I hate riz more.
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So I was right it's due to hate, is it because he is religious? I see no possible reason for hating him in Tests, considering he is Pakistan's best performing wicket keeping batsman who is sound keeper too.
 
its harder to bat in the mornings should have made most of the runs this afternoon will be a hard task for Rizwan tomorrow
 
Good toss to win and Pakistan got lucky. PCB took a big gamble by offering a used pitch for this match. But I guess their decision was easier because the Pakistan team has no chance on a sporting pitch anyway.
 
The Bald Eagle said:
: Kamran Ghulam, who earlier became the 257th player to don the Test cap for Pakistan, hit a brilliant century in his first outing in the Test career as Pakistan finished the first day of the second Test match with 259-5 in 90 overs at the Multan Cricket Stadium on Tuesday.

Kamran was dismissed for a well-made 118 off 224 balls hitting 11 fours and one six, in the 85th over of the day after having walked into bat in the 10th over with 19-2 on the board.

Along with Saim Ayub (77, 160b, 7x4s), Kamran shared a 149-run third-wicket partnership as the duo took Pakistan out of trouble before Saim departed in the 56th over with the scorecard reading 168-3.

Earlier, after Pakistan opted to bat first, Jack Leach drew the first blood as he castled Abdullah Shafique for a 28-ball seven in the eighth over. An over later, Leach got rid of Shan Masood for just three as Crawley pouched the ball at short midwicket.

Pakistan amassed 79 runs for the loss of just two wickets on the stroke of lunch with Saim and Kamran having brought up their fifty-run stand off 85 balls. Saim reached his third Test half-century off 97 balls before succumbing to Matthew Potts just an over before Tea break, caught by Ben Stokes at short mid-off.

After Pakistan scored 94 runs in the second session giving away only one wicket, England began the third session with the vital scalp of Saud Shakeel (4, 14b, 1x4) as he was caught behind off Brydon Carse in the 61st over.

With the scorecard reading 178-4, Mohammad Rizwan (37 not out, 89b, 4x4s) joined forces with Kamran to stabilise Pakistan’s innings as the duo put on a dogged 65-run fifth-wicket partnership. In the meanwhile, Kamran became the 13th Pakistan player to score a century on Test debut and only the sixth batter to score a hundred on men’s Test debut while batting at No.4, when he hit Joe Root to midwicket for a boundary in the 74th over.

Shoaib Bashir brought an end to Kamran’s 74.4-over stay on the crease when he got one to hit the stumps in the 85th over with Pakistan 243-5. Salman Ali Agha (5 not out, 19b) and Rizwan closed the day for Pakistan with 259-5 on the board.

Scores in brief:

Second Test - Day 1 of 5; Pakistan won the toss and elected to bat first at the Multan Cricket Stadium

Pakistan 259-5, 90 overs (Kamran Ghulam 118, Saim Ayub 77, Mohammad Rizwan 37 not out; Jack Leach 2-92)
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This
PakPremi said:
Did need to bowl all day just should had bowled a lot earlier as clearly Pakistan struggles with pacers more, and if couple more wickets fell Pakistan would had been under tremendous pressure early on. Stokes definitely provided the opportunity for Pakistan to stabilise, taking nothing away from KG and Saim sensible batting.
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Stokes bowled them as much as he realistically could. Pakistan's well-known weakness against pace has existed long before Stokes, and he would have been fully aware of that. However, he was equally mindful of not overworking his only two selected pacers so early in the game. That’s precisely why teams select five bowlers who can share the workload effectively.

It's actually quite rare now for any bowler, in any conditions, to bowl more than a 5-over spell, especially with the amount of cricket the top teams, like the Big 3, play. About 10 years ago, it was more common for a bowler to continue for 7 or 8 overs if they were in a good rhythm, but the demands of the modern game have changed that.
 
ask_analyse_act said:
Agree that if the pitch stays how it is today it will not make that tough for England..

But their bazball could also get a hit if the Pak spinners attack alongwith the captains support... Just like how Stokes created Shans wicket.. Saim and KG batted really beautifully in this wicket to dig out of the hole... Now its upto the remaining lot to make sure Pak cross 350 with ease.. 450 would be a match winning score in this wicket provided Pak bat well in the second inns..
England so far in the last tour and this tour havent been tested with spin friendly wickets and good amount of spin bowling...
first time they are put into this situation and it would be interesting to see how they respond..
Click to expand...
Bazball failed when faced with spin freindly wickets in India but the spinners were Jadeja/Ashwin and Kuldeep.
We don't have anyone of that caliber which is why I am worried that we will get smashed.
Even with the slowness of the wicket I feel like we need 450+ to be truly safe
 
Pakistan has lost matches after scoring 446 and 556. So they will be very wary of that regardless of how the pitch behaves. So i predict them to bat as long as possible and bat until they get bowled out. I say 2.5 sessions tops? That will give them another 200 runs. Pakistan will get to 450. If the pitch doesn't break up England will rakc up 450 in no time and turn it into a one innings contest.
 
Congratulations to Kamran Ghulam on his debut with century. Kamran Ghulam should been in the side years ago, especially the last 2 years. But couldn't get in due to a certain Nepo kid, this is the real reason why Pakistan can't find new talent.
 
Didn't see the match fully. How was the pitch? Was it tacky? It was not tacky from little i saw. It was just very slow off the pitch. DIdn't see anything unusual
 
jnaveen1980 said:
Didn't see the match fully. How was the pitch? Was it tacky? It was not tacky from little i saw. It was just very slow off the pitch. DIdn't see anything unusual
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Slow turner with some variable bounce. All in all pretty manageable
 
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