PTI protest : Will Imran Khan succeed on 2nd November, 2016?

[PakLFC]

What do PP's feel will happen when Imran Khan puts everything on the line on 2 November in his attempts to get rid of Nawaz? Will he succeed or will it again lead to nothing? I think million's will be on the streets though don't expect Nawaz Sharif to resign so easily. It will be a long process possibly lasting months,

 

[Syed1]

The turnout will be amazing but Nawaz Sharif is very stubborn and will never come clean on his ill-gotten money or step down until he is kicked out by the people or the army.

Pretty sure if he manages to ride this wave he will rig the next elections as well and consolidate his power.

 

[WebGuru]

I have no faith in the justice system and the institutions of this country. I know i will be labeled as a supporter of anarchy just like Imran but i don't think there is any other choice left under the current circumstances in this system where democracy is all about giving you a 5 year license to rule the country as a King without any accountability.

As Hassan Nisar says democracy without accountability is anarchy

So i will support this move by Imran although i know Nawaz got everyone including the institutions in his pocket so chance of any change is very very little but that doesn't mean we should stop asking questions and stop protesting just because we know the people ruling us are so powerful.

I just hope there is no jamhoori shahadat for PMLN this time to use it as a card in future just like they did after Musharraf.

 

[MABA]

At this moment what Pakistan needs is political stability, even if it under Nawaz Sharrif. One of the biggest factors which has always hampered Pakistan is political instability. Pakistan has not allowed democracy to evolve in the country. Every few years there was an army take over, now those are over but now we witness dharnas. Democracy takes time to develop and constant disturbances will badly affect the country.

Also there is no denying that PML-N has done better than the previous regime, that is because the current government knew if that they do not deliver something than they will be kicked out like PPP. Imran I feel knows it will be very hard for him to beat Nawaz through election and I believe Imran blew the "dhandli" situation out of proportion. So his only option to gain power is through street politics which I am not a fan of.

Once again each time it seems Pakistan is going towards the right direction some form of obstacle presents it self. Imran fans will not like it what I am saying but this is what I see as an outsider as I have no real stake in Pakistan besides being born there.

 

[Syed1]

The awaam is dying because of thirst and hunger, exports are declining, growth rate is stuck in the 4-5 range, finance minister is awarding himself bogus awards, foreign direct investment isn't picking up and too top it all up the sitting Prime Minister is looting the nation with both hands and feet.

But the guy raising his voice against them is pushing the country towards political instability???


Give me a break.


I much rather have political instability than this corrupt nizaam.

 

[Syed1]

So much for political instability when the sitting PM and his ministers leak bogus info to the newspapers targetting the one institution that is not under their control.


Inki choori pakro tou jumhoriat ko khatra hojata hai..

 

[WebGuru]

The awaam is dying because of thirst and hunger, exports are declining, growth rate is stuck in the 4-5 range, finance minister is awarding himself bogus awards, foreign direct investment isn't picking up and too top it all up the sitting Prime Minister is looting the nation with both hands and feet.

But the guy raising his voice against them is pushing the country towards political instability???


Give me a break.


I much rather have political instability than this corrupt nizaam.

Democracy without accountability is anarchy

 

[dayvancowboy]

The awaam is dying because of thirst and hunger, exports are declining, growth rate is stuck in the 4-5 range, finance minister is awarding himself bogus awards, foreign direct investment isn't picking up and too top it all up the sitting Prime Minister is looting the nation with both hands and feet.

But the guy raising his voice against them is pushing the country towards political instability???


Give me a break.


I much rather have political instability than this corrupt nizaam.

Easy to say that when you're not affected by it bro.

 

[DW44]

So much for political instability when the sitting PM and his ministers leak bogus info to the newspapers targetting the one institution that is not under their control.


Inki choori pakro tou jumhoriat ko khatra hojata hai..

This, right here, is my biggest issue with PTI's supporters, the 'when in doubt, lie' strategy. For all that is wrong with PML-N, and there's a lot wrong with a Nawaz led government, they're in the right on this particular issue. Anyone who knows anything about how our army operates and what's been going on in our corridors of power in recent years would know that the news leak was anything but bogus. Nawaz may be the devil incarnate but where he's right, he's right and one should have the moral courage to stand by the truth rather than twisting it to their agenda. First, knowing the institution in question, there would have been turmoil right now and heads would have been rolling if the leak was even partly bogus. Secondly, familiarizing oneself with the facts of the case helps greatly. The facts, in this case, were thus: Earlier this year, Nawaz issued capture or kill orders to CTD, the civilian counter terrorism agency for Jaish e Mohammad, one of the largest terrorist organizations in the country and one deeply involved with our army. While CTD was carrying out these orders, Raheel Sharif cornered Nawaz at a meeting about national security and pressurized him into handing over control of the operation against JeM to the army and given the massive imbalance in power between the two institutions in question(Federal government, army), Nawaz had no choice but to acquiesce. Now as soon as the army took over, all action against JeM stopped, their captured operatives were released and they started fundraising activities in major cities(you're supposed to be a Karachi wala, you should know this considering their biggest fundraising drive was in Karachi) and several army officials were photographed at these marches/fundraising drives. PML may be corrupt but what they're not is suicidal. An allegation like the one Shehbaz Sharif made without solid facts to back it would have catastrophic consequences for the government considering who it was made against and the impunity that particular institution enjoys when it comes to trampling all over the law and diplomatic norms.

 

[WebGuru]

[MENTION=26195]DW44[/MENTION] i find it hard to believe Shehbaz Shareef and his brother going by their 30 years history and even in recent past during Zardari govt Shehbaz was asking TTP to please don't attack Punjab we are on same page with you while Nawaz was saying Extremists are our brother and sons. Even current law minister of Shehbaz Sharif cabinet is known for his links with banned Outfits. (And i am not going to defend Imran he also had soft corner and wanted to talk with these animals and he was wrong but it's funny when i hear these PMLN leaders calling him Taliban Khan).

Army isn't a group of angels but these politicians are also no better thn them when it comes to this topic.

Some newspapers headlines from past if you can read urdu:

 

[Pakpak]

For those who can't read Urdu:

''Taliban and our POV is the same'' Nawaz
''Taliban, please don't attack Punjab'' Shehbaz
''There should be Taliban like system in Pakistan'' Nawaz
''Taliban are running their government under a better system'' Nawaz

 

[DW44]

[MENTION=26195]DW44[/MENTION] i find it hard to believe Shehbaz Shareef and his brother going by their 30 years history and even in recent past during Zardari govt Shehbaz was asking TTP to please don't attack Punjab we are on same page with you while Nawaz was saying Extremists are our brother and sons. Even current law minister of Shehbaz Sharif cabinet is known for his links with banned Outfits. (And i am not going to defend Imran he also had soft corner and wanted to talk with these animals and he was wrong but it's funny when i hear these PMLN leaders calling him Taliban Khan).

Army isn't a group of angels but these politicians are also no better thn them when it comes to this topic.

Some newspapers headlines from past if you can read urdu:

True but we both know that not all terrorists are equal in Pakistan and depending on the interests of the stakeholders at any given time, several terrorist groups can be in the good books of one or more stakeholders while others are not. PML-N's own links with terrorist organizations are no secret, nor is the fact that they themselves are a product of the same fascist dictatorship that is responsible for the existence of these terrorist groups in the first place. Shehbaz and, to a lesser extent, Nawaz were in full appeasement mode towards the TTP for the better part of the late 2000s and This was evident by the lack of attacks in their home turf compared to the early 2000s when Islamabad, Pindi and Lahore used to bear the brunt of TTP's violence. Their links with ASWJ are also undeniable but then ASWJ is completely kosher in our army's books and has seat sharing agreements with both PPP(in Karachi) and PTI(Kashmir) too. PML-N were also the ones, along with PTI, who were against Zarb e Azb till the last moment and wanted more talks with the Taliban so I am under no illusion that they have somehow miraculously reformed and are committed to eradicating extremism. I understand that if they're doing so, there's something in it for them. This is simply a case of, like I said earlier, when they're right, they're right.

The issue here concerns JeM, an organization unlike the TTP or ASWJ in that it attacks outside our borders and has created problems for Pakistan with the international community. This particular organization is on good terms with the army but, for reasons that are obvious, they were becoming a bit of a liability for the government due to the India angle so after Pathankot, the government's hand was forced and they started an operation against them on their own because the army wouldn't. Such sudden change in position isn't unusual here e.g. the army took out Malik Ishaq and his sons despite their organization being on very good terms with the army because Malik and his men were about to pledge allegiance to IS. While the operation against JeM in South Punjab was underway, Army, who are on good terms with JeM, intervened and took over the operation after which it effectively stopped. All of this was reported well before the story in Dawn was published so at the very least, it wasn't a complete fabrication since the existence of tensions between the army and the government over JeM were already established facts. This leaves the question of whether or not there was a confrontation between Shehbaz and DG ISI. On that we can only speculate but it makes more sense that it did than the other way round. First, we both know what the consequences of getting into a game of one-upmanship with the army are and it's suicidal unless you're standing on very firm ground. Second, the same question was raised in subsequent days openly in parliament by both government and opposition lawmakers. Third, as soon as the news leaked, the army immediately started looking for the source of the leak instead of going for the journalist who wrote the story as they usually do. In the past, they have murdered journalists for less so this pinpoint focus on who leaked the news instead of shooting the messenger as is their modus operandi suggests that there is truth to the events described in the article and they were simply trying to go after the person responsible for humiliating them.

 

[WebGuru]

True but we both know that not all terrorists are equal in Pakistan and depending on the interests of the stakeholders at any given time, several terrorist groups can be in the good books of one or more stakeholders while others are not. PML-N's own links with terrorist organizations are no secret, nor is the fact that they themselves are a product of the same fascist dictatorship that is responsible for the existence of these terrorist groups in the first place. Shehbaz and, to a lesser extent, Nawaz were in full appeasement mode towards the TTP for the better part of the late 2000s and This was evident by the lack of attacks in their home turf compared to the early 2000s when Islamabad, Pindi and Lahore used to bear the brunt of TTP's violence. Their links with ASWJ are also undeniable but then ASWJ is completely kosher in our army's books and has seat sharing agreements with both PPP(in Karachi) and PTI(Kashmir) too. PML-N were also the ones, along with PTI, who were against Zarb e Azb till the last moment and wanted more talks with the Taliban so I am under no illusion that they have somehow miraculously reformed and are committed to eradicating extremism. I understand that if they're doing so, there's something in it for them. This is simply a case of, like I said earlier, when they're right, they're right.

The issue here concerns JeM, an organization unlike the TTP or ASWJ in that it attacks outside our borders and has created problems for Pakistan with the international community. This particular organization is on good terms with the army but, for reasons that are obvious, they were becoming a bit of a liability for the government due to the India angle so after Pathankot, the government's hand was forced and they started an operation against them on their own because the army wouldn't. Such sudden change in position isn't unusual here e.g. the army took out Malik Ishaq and his sons despite their organization being on very good terms with the army because Malik and his men were about to pledge allegiance to IS. While the operation against JeM in South Punjab was underway, Army, who are on good terms with JeM, intervened and took over the operation after which it effectively stopped. All of this was reported well before the story in Dawn was published so at the very least, it wasn't a complete fabrication since the existence of tensions between the army and the government over JeM were already established facts. This leaves the question of whether or not there was a confrontation between Shehbaz and DG ISI. On that we can only speculate but it makes more sense that it did than the other way round. First, we both know what the consequences of getting into a game of one-upmanship with the army are and it's suicidal unless you're standing on very firm ground. Second, the same question was raised in subsequent days openly in parliament by both government and opposition lawmakers. Third, as soon as the news leaked, the army immediately started looking for the source of the leak instead of going for the journalist who wrote the story as they usually do. In the past, they have murdered journalists for less so this pinpoint focus on who leaked the news instead of shooting the messenger as is their modus operandi suggests that there is truth to the events described in the article and they were simply trying to go after the person responsible for humiliating them.

You raised some strong points and i agree with most of what you said but don't you think govt/pmln is on the way to follow the same good taliban/bad taliban and your terrorist/my terrorist model by focusing on the orgs that hurt them while covering the one that suits them?

 

[DW44]

You raised some strong points and i agree with most of what you said but don't you think govt/pmln is on the way to follow the same good taliban/bad taliban and your terrorist/my terrorist model by focusing on the orgs that hurt them while covering the one that suits them?

They've been doing that since the 90s but do we oppose army and Zarb e Azb because they too play good taliban-bad taliban and support ASWJ/LeJ, Jaish, LeT/JuD etc?

 

[WebGuru]

They've been doing that since the 90s but do we oppose army and Zarb e Azb because they too play good taliban-bad taliban and support ASWJ/LeJ, Jaish, LeT/JuD etc?

I agree both are responsible here and this good/bad, internal/external policy is a failure but in Mil Est case mostly now they are working against the one creating problems within the country while in pmln case it's opposite don't you think?

 

[DW44]

I agree both are responsible here and this good/bad, internal/external policy is a failure but in Mil Est case mostly now they are working against the one creating problems within the country while in pmln case it's opposite don't you think?

Military aren't so much targetting those creating problems within the country as they are those who are not under their control. ASWJ/LeJ, for instance, is mostly involved in domestic terrorism and they have the second largest body count after TTP but they're in the army's good books. They did target certain factions within ASWJ-LeJ when it was inconvenient for them not to(Malik Ishaq) but they still retain cordial relations and LeJ's activities in Quetta and ASWJ's political and sectarian activities in Punjab and Sindh get the army's tacit support. Both army and federal government are targeting terrorists that are inconvenient for them while staying close to those they can control or cooperate with but if we're going to take the stance that any action against terrorists by the government is meaningless because they're in bed with other terrorists, we should take the same line against the army who're in a league of their own when it comes to going after some terrorists while supporting others since they were the ones who came up with this smoke and mirrors act in the first place. We can't have it both ways where we laud the army for targeting TTP in Zarb e Azb despite their support for various equally deadly terrorist organizations while dismissing the government's operation against JeM because of their links with other terrorist and sectarian groups.

 

[TalentSpotterPk]

Nawaz Sharif to be responsible if 'third power' steps in after protest: Imran Khan

 

[Hadi Rizvi]

At this moment what Pakistan needs is political stability, even if it under Nawaz Sharrif. One of the biggest factors which has always hampered Pakistan is political instability. Pakistan has not allowed democracy to evolve in the country. Every few years there was an army take over, now those are over but now we witness dharnas. Democracy takes time to develop and constant disturbances will badly affect the country.

Also there is no denying that PML-N has done better than the previous regime, that is because the current government knew if that they do not deliver something than they will be kicked out like PPP. Imran I feel knows it will be very hard for him to beat Nawaz through election and I believe Imran blew the "dhandli" situation out of proportion. So his only option to gain power is through street politics which I am not a fan of.

Once again each time it seems Pakistan is going towards the right direction some form of obstacle presents it self. Imran fans will not like it what I am saying but this is what I see as an outsider as I have no real stake in Pakistan besides being born there.

I don't understand why people support democracy. IMO democracy is of no use when approx 50% of the population is illiterate. If a party e.g PMLN gives food, clothes etc to those illiterates just before the election then they are always gonna to vote for PMLN no matter what. This is the kind of mentality that the "ghareeb awaam" has been reduced to. Apart from that, everyone knows that we need "danda" to stay disciplined so who better than the army to provide discipline and stability to the country.

As far as political stability is concerned, then as long as accountability is absent, there will be no stability because some people will always have to face injustice and it is these people who Imran wants to provoke.

TBH, I don't have any hope in democracy in Pakistan. If you look at the economical history of Pakistan then you'll see that when army generals were in power that was when Pakistan was most stable economically and there is no denying it. Pakistan was always in a better financial and economic position when people like Ayub Khan, Zia-ul-haq(although I thoroughly hate him), Musharraf etc were in power. I remember Hasan Nisar said in 2007 or 2008 that people will beg for Musharraf when PPP comes into power. I guess he was right. That's just my 2 cents on this issue. Would love to get feedback.

 

[DW44]

I don't understand why people support democracy. IMO democracy is of no use when approx 50% of the population is illiterate. If a party e.g PMLN gives food, clothes etc to those illiterates just before the election then they are always gonna to vote for PMLN no matter what. This is the kind of mentality that the "ghareeb awaam" has been reduced to. Apart from that, everyone knows that we need "danda" to stay disciplined so who better than the army to provide discipline and stability to the country.

As far as political stability is concerned, then as long as accountability is absent, there will be no stability because some people will always have to face injustice and it is these people who Imran wants to provoke.

TBH, I don't have any hope in democracy in Pakistan. If you look at the economical history of Pakistan then you'll see that when army generals were in power that was when Pakistan was most stable economically and there is no denying it. Pakistan was always in a better financial and economic position when people like Ayub Khan, Zia-ul-haq(although I thoroughly hate him), Musharraf etc were in power. I remember Hasan Nisar said in 2007 or 2008 that people will beg for Musharraf when PPP comes into power. I guess he was right. That's just my 2 cents on this issue. Would love to get feedback.

The issue with that entire premise is that we have already had 35 odd years of military rule and they have been just as bad as when it comes to governance and economic management as the likes of PPP and PML-N, and, worse still, far more corrupt. The economic prosperity during the Ayub, Zia and Mush eras is a bit of an illusion because the economic expansion in all three eras was driven by external factors, not their management of the economy.

Ayub took over at the height of the cold war when both the US and USSR would literally pay third world countries, in cash and in kind, to ally with them. Ayub era growth was driven mostly by aid inflows from the US and any economy registers high growth rates when large amounts of cash are injected into it regardless of how poorly that cash is managed. To put it into perspective, South Korea a decade ago was in a similar situation and aid made up 90% of their budget but the Syngman Rhee government there invested most of the aid money in setting up a network of schools and providing free education to all citizens of schoolgoing age, followed by the Park government that built on Rhee's efforts(Rhee, incidentally, was so corrupt he makes Zardari look like a paragon of clean governance) and invested the aid inflow into developing an industrial base that would serve as a launchpad for future economic growth. Ayub, during roughly the same period, invested his aid receipts in the army and some minor industrial infrastructure but he was the one who laid the foundation for future military interference in governance by turning us into a national security state as opposed to the Korean and Taiwanese militaries who used aid to turn their countries into developmental states.

Zia, again, ruled Pakistan when aid inflows from the US and Saudi Arabia were at historical highs and the global economy was riding a wave of high growth after a tumultuous decade in the 70s. Same goes for Musharraf who benefited from a global economic boom starting in 2003. During the first four years of his rule, when the global economy was depressed and the dot com bubble had just burst, our economic performance was comparable to our performance under Zardari from 2008 onwards. It was only after 9/11 when the aid dollars started rolling in and the added impetus provided by a buoyant global economy from 2003 onward that our economy saw some growth, most of which had ended by the tail end of Musharraf's government anyway. Not a single dictatorship laid down a foundation on which future economic growth could be built nor did they bring about any reforms that would provide an impetus for the economy growing forward. What they did was make merry with aid dollars and ride on global economic booms which coincided with their rule.

 

[Syed1]

The issue with that entire premise is that we have already had 35 odd years of military rule and they have been just as bad as when it comes to governance and economic management as the likes of PPP and PML-N, and, worse still, far more corrupt. The economic prosperity during the Ayub, Zia and Mush eras is a bit of an illusion because the economic expansion in all three eras was driven by external factors, not their management of the economy.

Ayub took over at the height of the cold war when both the US and USSR would literally pay third world countries, in cash and in kind, to ally with them. Ayub era growth was driven mostly by aid inflows from the US and any economy registers high growth rates when large amounts of cash are injected into it regardless of how poorly that cash is managed. To put it into perspective, South Korea a decade ago was in a similar situation and aid made up 90% of their budget but the Syngman Rhee government there invested most of the aid money in setting up a network of schools and providing free education to all citizens of schoolgoing age, followed by the Park government that built on Rhee's efforts(Rhee, incidentally, was so corrupt he makes Zardari look like a paragon of clean governance) and invested the aid inflow into developing an industrial base that would serve as a launchpad for future economic growth. Ayub, during roughly the same period, invested his aid receipts in the army and some minor industrial infrastructure but he was the one who laid the foundation for future military interference in governance by turning us into a national security state as opposed to the Korean and Taiwanese militaries who used aid to turn their countries into developmental states.

Zia, again, ruled Pakistan when aid inflows from the US and Saudi Arabia were at historical highs and the global economy was riding a wave of high growth after a tumultuous decade in the 70s. Same goes for Musharraf who benefited from a global economic boom starting in 2003. During the first four years of his rule, when the global economy was depressed and the dot com bubble had just burst, our economic performance was comparable to our performance under Zardari from 2008 onwards. It was only after 9/11 when the aid dollars started rolling in and the added impetus provided by a buoyant global economy from 2003 onward that our economy saw some growth, most of which had ended by the tail end of Musharraf's government anyway. Not a single dictatorship laid down a foundation on which future economic growth could be built nor did they bring about any reforms that would provide an impetus for the economy growing forward. What they did was make merry with aid dollars and ride on global economic booms which coincided with their rule.

An ideal system for Pakistan would be a mixture of what we have at present combined with what China has going on.

Actually the common man on the street isn't too concerned about what form of government we have, US/European style democracy is a very foreign concept for us since vast swathes of our population isn't educated enough to take any interest in what kind of government exists and make the correct voting decision.

The common man is only interested in having food two/three times a day, a nice paying job, education for his kids, health facilities for his family, some disposable income for entertainment and good transit facilities to go to and from work.

Whichever government is able to deliver on these fronts will earn the nations respect. These jamhooriaat jamhooriat ke naray are useless. When Mush was making mockery of all institution we heard every single politician from PPP, PML-N and PTI saying that jamhooriat ajaigi tou maslay haal hojaingaye. Well guess what its been 8+ years since jamhooriat came and people are by and large economically worse off than they were before jamhooriat.

 

[Bewal Express]

Couldn't NS stop the PTI in its track by agreeing to the opposition TORs, after all he and his thugs go onto TV every night and tell us he and his family are innocent. So the logical next step is to provide the paperwork and IK and everyone can then then be humiliated for lying against the Sharifs.

 

[DW44]

An ideal system for Pakistan would be a mixture of what we have at present combined with what China has going on.

Actually the common man on the street isn't too concerned about what form of government we have, US/European style democracy is a very foreign concept for us since vast swathes of our population isn't educated enough to take any interest in what kind of government exists and make the correct voting decision.

The common man is only interested in having food two/three times a day, a nice paying job, education for his kids, health facilities for his family, some disposable income for entertainment and good transit facilities to go to and from work.

Whichever government is able to deliver on these fronts will earn the nations respect. These jamhooriaat jamhooriat ke naray are useless. When Mush was making mockery of all institution we heard every single politician from PPP, PML-N and PTI saying that jamhooriat ajaigi tou maslay haal hojaingaye. Well guess what its been 8+ years since jamhooriat came and people are by and large economically worse off than they were before jamhooriat.

If wishes were horses, beggars would ride. Realistically, none of those things are about to happen regardless of whether there's a civilian government or a military one. While the common man may not care about the system of governance, that's more down to the common man's lack of intelligence than to the kind of system in place being inconsequential because the common man does suffer from the failures of both forms of governments. Pakistani democracy is deeply flawed but still infinitely preferable to the dark comedies that are our military dictatorships.

 

[Mamoon]

So Kaptaan is about to launch an online fund raising campaign for the November 2nd circus in Islamabad. The target of 500 million rupees is a complete and utter waste of money and resources. Just goes to show how power hungry he is.

I have said it before and I will say it again. Pakistan needs to get out of this usurping mindset. Throughout our history, the Army (and no institution has harmed the country more) has never let democratically elected governments complete their tenure.

Apart from the 18th Amendment, the one good thing that came out of Zardari's tenure was that the government was able to complete its term.

Doesn't matter if it is PPP, PML-N or PTI - a democratically elected government completing its term is the only way forward. Revolutions, especially pseudo revolutions are never the way forward. Look at Iran and Egypt. Anyhow, Pakistan is not at that position anyway.

What will happen tomorrow if the extreme right-wing extremists get tired of Imran sucking up to them and funding their madrassas, and decide to march against his government and impose Shariah Law?

Will this cycle continue forever?

This will not end the same way as usual. Kaptaan will repeat the same rhetoric from the top of a container while PTI junoonis will be clowning around, taking selfies with red and green face paint.

Allah swt have mercy on the citizens of Islamabad. This is the second episode of the 2014 nightmare.

Imran Khan is the god of destruction.

 

[Mamoon]

At this moment what Pakistan needs is political stability, even if it under Nawaz Sharrif. One of the biggest factors which has always hampered Pakistan is political instability. Pakistan has not allowed democracy to evolve in the country. Every few years there was an army take over, now those are over but now we witness dharnas. Democracy takes time to develop and constant disturbances will badly affect the country.

Also there is no denying that PML-N has done better than the previous regime, that is because the current government knew if that they do not deliver something than they will be kicked out like PPP. Imran I feel knows it will be very hard for him to beat Nawaz through election and I believe Imran blew the "dhandli" situation out of proportion. So his only option to gain power is through street politics which I am not a fan of.

Once again each time it seems Pakistan is going towards the right direction some form of obstacle presents it self. Imran fans will not like it what I am saying but this is what I see as an outsider as I have no real stake in Pakistan besides being born there.

Great post.

 

[abc_to_xyz]

He's only going to delay my sessions

 

[Syed1]

So Kaptaan is about to launch an online fund raising campaign for the November 2nd circus in Islamabad. The target of 500 million rupees is a complete and utter waste of money and resources. Just goes to show how power hungry he is.

I have said it before and I will say it again. Pakistan needs to get out of this usurping mindset. Throughout our history, the Army (and no institution has harmed the country more) has never let democratically elected governments complete their tenure.

Apart from the 18th Amendment, the one good thing that came out of Zardari's tenure was that the government was able to complete its term.

Doesn't matter if it is PPP, PML-N or PTI - a democratically elected government completing its term is the only way forward. Revolutions, especially pseudo revolutions are never the way forward. Look at Iran and Egypt. Anyhow, Pakistan is not at that position anyway.

What will happen tomorrow if the extreme right-wing extremists get tired of Imran sucking up to them and funding their madrassas, and decide to march against his government and impose Shariah Law?

Will this cycle continue forever?

This will not end the same way as usual. Kaptaan will repeat the same rhetoric from the top of a container while PTI junoonis will be clowning around, taking selfies with red and green face paint.

Allah swt have mercy on the citizens of Islamabad. This is the second episode of the 2014 nightmare.

Imran Khan is the god of destruction.

'Kaptaan' is not asking for the government to be dissolved. He is asking Nawaz to step down and present himself for accountability and give proof of how he amassed all that wealth. Nawaz can very well appoint another parliamentarian from his party as the PM to see off the rest of the tenure, but unfortunately the badshah salamat does not have a beta, beti or bhatija in the National Assembly and cannot appoint an outsider as PM since it would go against their "jamhooriat".

It would have helped if you had actually read up on what Imran is asking for instead of resorting to your usual "hate Immy" posts.

 

[WebGuru]

'Kaptaan' is not asking for the government to be dissolved. He is asking Nawaz to step down and present himself for accountability and give proof of how he amassed all that wealth. Nawaz can very well appoint another parliamentarian from his party as the PM to see off the rest of the tenure, but unfortunately the badshah salamat does not have a beta, beti or bhatija in the National Assembly and cannot appoint an outsider as PM since it would go against their "jamhooriat".

It would have helped if you had actually read up on what Imran is asking for instead of resorting to your usual "hate Immy" posts.

His bhatija is actually in NA but bhatija jitna be acha ho waaris to beta he hota hena

 

[Mamoon]

'Kaptaan' is not asking for the government to be dissolved. He is asking Nawaz to step down and present himself for accountability and give proof of how he amassed all that wealth. Nawaz can very well appoint another parliamentarian from his party as the PM to see off the rest of the tenure, but unfortunately the badshah salamat does not have a beta, beti or bhatija in the National Assembly and cannot appoint an outsider as PM since it would go against their "jamhooriat".

It would have helped if you had actually read up on what Imran is asking for instead of resorting to your usual "hate Immy" posts.

Do you think Kaptaan will be satisfied with that? Absolutely not. He has a documented history of changing his demands as soon as a demand is met. He will not stop unless and until he is appointed as PM and is prepared to use any means to get there. From bowing down to the Umpire or appeasing the Mullahs.

There is absolutely no need for Nawaz resigning. It will create chaos in the country and induce a power struggle. Let him complete his term; we need a new precedence of democratically elected governments completing their terms.

A precedence that will bear fruit in the long-term.

 

[TalentSpotterPk]

Raseedaan Kaddo Tey Jaan Chaddo

 

[last_knight]

Do you think Kaptaan will be satisfied with that? Absolutely not. He has a documented history of changing his demands as soon as a demand is met. He will not stop unless and until he is appointed as PM and is prepared to use any means to get there. From bowing down to the Umpire or appeasing the Mullahs.

There is absolutely no need for Nawaz resigning. It will create chaos in the country and induce a power struggle. Let him complete his term; we need a new precedence of democratically elected governments completing their terms.

A precedence that will bear fruit in the long-term.

Democratically Elected is a controversial claim and rightly so. It has been forever. It will be same if one day PTI gets majority in NA.

What IK had demanded, (accountability, this time wrt Taxpayers money) is a norm in civilised democratic societies. The response to his demand has been what is a norm in uncivilised undemocratic societies. Beyond this, it's an unknown and unpredictable territory, the merits and demerits of which can not be foreseen.

Btw one thing I have observed in last two weeks, PTI popularity has escalated SIGNIFICANTLY ( although most are from democracy@40kg-Rice mentality group but still its good for numbers).

 

[shaz619]

An ideal system for Pakistan would be a mixture of what we have at present combined with what China has going on.

Actually the common man on the street isn't too concerned about what form of government we have, US/European style democracy is a very foreign concept for us since vast swathes of our population isn't educated enough to take any interest in what kind of government exists and make the correct voting decision.

The common man is only interested in having food two/three times a day, a nice paying job, education for his kids, health facilities for his family, some disposable income for entertainment and good transit facilities to go to and from work.

Whichever government is able to deliver on these fronts will earn the nations respect. These jamhooriaat jamhooriat ke naray are useless. When Mush was making mockery of all institution we heard every single politician from PPP, PML-N and PTI saying that jamhooriat ajaigi tou maslay haal hojaingaye. Well guess what its been 8+ years since jamhooriat came and people are by and large economically worse off than they were before jamhooriat.

Now this is a beautiful and readable post, paragraphs anyone?!!!

 

[shaz619]

My view is that, these protests are absolutely useless. I get the intention behind them but history in recent times has shown that there is more bad then good to come out of them in Pakistan, hopefully the people stay at home for their own safety.

 

[Mamoon]

Democratically Elected is a controversial claim and rightly so. It has been forever. It will be same if one day PTI gets majority in NA.

What IK had demanded, (accountability, this time wrt Taxpayers money) is a norm in civilised democratic societies. The response to his demand has been what is a norm in uncivilised undemocratic societies. Beyond this, it's an unknown and unpredictable territory, the merits and demerits of which can not be foreseen.

Btw one thing I have observed in last two weeks, PTI popularity has escalated SIGNIFICANTLY ( although most are from democracy@40kg-Rice mentality group but still its good for numbers).

Yes there has been systematic rigging but the majority voted for PML-N in 2013 and PPP in 2008. Good or bad, the majority got what they wanted. That is democracy.

The problem is democracy is right only when our desired leaders are elected. You are absolutely right to point out that if PTI comes into majority, the same issues will be raised.

Henceforth, usurping and toppling the government is never the solution and it has done no good for Pakistan in the past.

 

[Mamoon]

Nawaz Sharif to be responsible if 'third power' steps in after protest: Imran Khan

Now this certainly takes the cake.

Does he expect that Nawaz will 'pesh' himself before him?

The case is in the Supreme Court and that is where everything is going to be decided. He is invading Islamabad and if the military comes in, Nawaz will be responsible?

Why?

Because Nawaz is not 'peshing' himself before him? or because he is not resigning which he must, since Kaptaan has given the verdict that Nawaz Sharif is guilty?

Amazing.

By the way, I didn't quite catch what SMQ was mumbling about. I was watching the video and it felt as if Kaptaan dismissed him, which probably means he said something sensible.

Anyhow, maybe it is time for him to gather the tenners he collects from his serfs when he sits squat legged with that obnoxious turban. He is for Naya Pakistan after all, he should lead by example and free his serfs first.

 

[KingKhanWC]

In the UK the prime minster would have resigned a long time ago.

But when you have posters living in Pakistan happily accepting their country to be looted, there is little hope for such a people and their country.

You have to respect the determination from a great man fighting for a country which has never lived up to it's potential.

 

[PakLFC]

I support IK here. Immense pressure has to be put on pro-India Nawaz otherwise the situation will online decline. It could be a very blood few months nonetheless a massive clean up is now needed. Could be that Nawaz tells Modi to open fire as the LOC or even worse so to safeguard his own position by diverting attention. The military just needs to deal with it, this excuse of complete anarchy or even civil conflict after 2 Nov is no longer sustainable.

 

[TalentSpotterPk]

Now this certainly takes the cake.

Does he expect that Nawaz will 'pesh' himself before him?

The case is in the Supreme Court and that is where everything is going to be decided. He is invading Islamabad and if the military comes in, Nawaz will be responsible?

Why?

Because Nawaz is not 'peshing' himself before him? or because he is not resigning which he must, since Kaptaan has given the verdict that Nawaz Sharif is guilty?

Amazing.

By the way, I didn't quite catch what SMQ was mumbling about. I was watching the video and it felt as if Kaptaan dismissed him, which probably means he said something sensible.

Anyhow, maybe it is time for him to gather the tenners he collects from his serfs when he sits squat legged with that obnoxious turban. He is for Naya Pakistan after all, he should lead by example and free his serfs first.

Mamoon you are educated enough to know all the Facts.


The TORS PM sent to Supreme Court needed 25 years.


Than FBR, FIA & NAB did nothing in 7 months to Investigate all Concerned.


Only after Raiwand March FBR sent notices to those whose name has come in Panama leaks.


Supreme Court has also woken up now.



You know the Truth very well. You have seen Clips of Mushahidullah, Chaudhary Nisar and Sadeeq ul Farooq about the time since those Flats are Property of Sharifs. Begum Kulsum is also on Record. Bbc Reports are also there. The U turn statements of Pm's Children's are also there.


Mamoon you know all.



I have no Issues with you criticising Imran Khan but you should now Open Up about Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif.



Democracy should continue but not at the expense of Accountability. Take out Accountability from developed countries and than see where they will stand than.



Nawaz Sharif thinks He is not Accountable. His Senior Minister tells him in Parliament that Mian sahib do not worry after sometime people will forget Panama Gate and it will be History.



8 years of Democracy without Accountability what has Pakistan Achieved at International Level ? Has the Economic Condition of People below the Powerty Line has improved ? Where are the Economic indicators even after Fudging with numbers ? Heart Patients in Punjab are given dates of 2017 of Echo Test which they require now. FBR, FIA, Civil Services, Police, Education none improved. Country is getting drowned in Internal & External Debts. Why ? Because a certain Elite Class is devoid of Accountability.

 

[WebGuru]

I support IK here. Immense pressure has to be put on pro-India Nawaz otherwise the situation will online decline. It could be a very blood few months nonetheless a massive clean up is now needed. Could be that Nawaz tells Modi to open fire as the LOC or even worse so to safeguard his own position by diverting attention. The military just needs to deal with it, this excuse of complete anarchy or even civil conflict after 2 Nov is no longer sustainable.

Firing at LoC already started 2 days ago. I am supporting this move by IK / PTI but i don't think anything is going to happen or anything is going to change because our corrupt leaders have learned all the tricks in these decades to remain safe while poor awaam suffer more and more while still voting for them blindly but i can't even blame awaam here they are too busy for their 2 waqt ki roti and survival so most of them don't care what's happening at the top level and for them it doesn't matter if a the leader is a dictator or champion of democracy. Majboor voters apne vote ka sahi istemaal kese keren when they have facee waderas, sardars, thaana/kachehri culture etc etc

I don't have any hope from this nation for a change anytime soon but i hope they prove me wrong.

And an update Nawaz Sharif is going to visit Kyrgyzstan to attend SCO meeting on Nov 2

 

[WebGuru]

I don't understand this theory of giving democracy a long time and things will improve automatically without any effort. How are things going to improve when there is no accountability and when institutions don't exist and you act like a King? In last 8 years i didn't see even a small effort by both ppp and pmln govts to build institutions and going for reforms in police, nab etc.

After 5 years of full corruption at evert lavel now PPP have their leader Khursheed Shah sitting as PAC Chairman (Public Accounts Committee) what a joke!

They say Imran Khan isn't a politicians i agree he isn't a politicians if the criteria to become a politician in Pakistan is to have corruption records like PMLN and PPP leadership.

Why the middle class of Pakistan can successfully produce authors, scientists, generals, judges, engineers, doctors but politics and leadership is limited to elite class only?

 

[PakLFC]

Firing at LoC already started 2 days ago. I am supporting this move by IK / PTI but i don't think anything is going to happen or anything is going to change because our corrupt leaders have learned all the tricks in these decades to remain safe while poor awaam suffer more and more while still voting for them blindly but i can't even blame awaam here they are too busy for their 2 waqt ki roti and survival so most of them don't care what's happening at the top level and for them it doesn't matter if a the leader is a dictator or champion of democracy. Majboor voters apne vote ka sahi istemaal kese keren when they have facee waderas, sardars, thaana/kachehri culture etc etc

I don't have any hope from this nation for a change anytime soon but i hope they prove me wrong.

And an update Nawaz Sharif is going to visit Kyrgyzstan to attend SCO meeting on Nov 2

Even if NS was home on Nov 2 nothing will be changing on that very day. It is getting to the stage that either the army will again intervene or the people need to physically force Nawaz out of office. Nawaz knows his resignation will lead to him being in even more trouble with the panama leaks scandal and everything else going on. I will hope that our people have also learnt a thing or two as to how they are always fooled by Zardari, Nawaz and everyone else, many of them voted for Nawaz so maybe are not as "majboor" but bewakoof to be repeatedly fooled by him. I just hope IK can last the course this time and means what he says that he will either become a ghazi or a shaheed. I think if he also knows that if he quits this time due to some outside factor then people will lose hope in him as well. India will do whatever it takes to keep Nawaz in power, we all know that. It is further complicated with the next COAS also to be announced soon.

 

[WebGuru]

Even if NS was home on Nov 2 nothing will be changing on that very day. It is getting to the stage that either the army will again intervene or the people need to physically force Nawaz out of office. Nawaz knows his resignation will lead to him being in even more trouble with the panama leaks scandal and everything else going on. I will hope that our people have also learnt a thing or two as to how they are always fooled by Zardari, Nawaz and everyone else, many of them voted for Nawaz so maybe are not as "majboor" but bewakoof to be repeatedly fooled by him. I just hope IK can last the course this time and means what he says that he will either become a ghazi or a shaheed. I think if he also knows that if he quits this time due to some outside factor then people will lose hope in him as well. India will do whatever it takes to keep Nawaz in power, we all know that. It is further complicated with the next COAS also to be announced soon.

There are reports next Army Chief is going to be announced this week by govt before dherna to play their first card (although army leadership asked govt to not announce it early). Many people believe if failed this dherna is going to end Imran's national politics or at least he is going to have a long break from national politics. Imrans knows it very well thats why he announced it that no more jalsas or dhernas after this so this is his last card for now and he himself selected this do or die situation for him instead of going for typical politics like ppp and zardari by always playing safe so that there is always a backdoor.

 

[Bewal Express]

I have made a contribution to the fund but ultimately the desire for change doesn't exist amongst my fellow Punjabis. They are as my late mum used to call them Matlab ke banday, with the main Matlab being money.

 

[Bewal Express]

Now this certainly takes the cake.

Does he expect that Nawaz will 'pesh' himself before him?

The case is in the Supreme Court and that is where everything is going to be decided. He is invading Islamabad and if the military comes in, Nawaz will be responsible?

Why?

Because Nawaz is not 'peshing' himself before him? or because he is not resigning which he must, since Kaptaan has given the verdict that Nawaz Sharif is guilty?

Amazing.

By the way, I didn't quite catch what SMQ was mumbling about. I was watching the video and it felt as if Kaptaan dismissed him, which probably means he said something sensible.

Anyhow, maybe it is time for him to gather the tenners he collects from his serfs when he sits squat legged with that obnoxious turban. He is for Naya Pakistan after all, he should lead by example and free his serfs first.

But NS is guilty, Panama is not an allegation it's fact. Btw, I have no faith in the SC, why have they taken six months?

 

[PakLFC]

I have made a contribution to the fund but ultimately the desire for change doesn't exist amongst my fellow Punjabis. They are as my late mum used to call them Matlab ke banday, with the main Matlab being money.

That's coz regretfully most Punjabi's only want to see their own province prosper. They don't really know much about the rest of Pakistan let alone what those people think. The government in Islamabad has always been Punjab centric.

 

[WebGuru]

That's coz regretfully most Punjabi's only want to see their own province prosper. They don't really know much about the rest of Pakistan let alone what those people think. The government in Islamabad has always been Punjab centric.

That's wrong even in Punjab most of the developments is limited to Lahore and some being spent on center of Punjab in PMLN govt ignoring south. According to a report 51% of Punjab budget is being spent on Lahore. I am a Punjabi but i have to say Khadam-e-Aala is more like Khadam-e-Lahore

 

[PakLFC]

That's wrong even in Punjab most of the developments is limited to Lahore and some being spent on center of Punjab in PMLN govt ignoring south. According to a report 51% of Punjab budget is being spent on Lahore. I am a Punjabi but i have to say Khadam-e-Aala is more like Khadam-e-Lahore

But Lahore is in Punjab as well. I am Punjabi as well, don't support Nawaz or his cronies at all. Pak needs a government that thinks of the entire country not just Lahore or Punjab.

 

[Syed1]

I have made a contribution to the fund but ultimately the desire for change doesn't exist amongst my fellow Punjabis. They are as my late mum used to call them Matlab ke banday, with the main Matlab being money.

Why blame the Punjabis when the Sindhis have been voting for PPP for the last 40 years despite them treating the local population as dirt. Or the Urdu-speaking population of Karachi consistently voting for MQM when it is well known that MQM is a terrorist organization. Or the Baluchis who continue to vote for corrupt sardars that keep all the development money in their own pockets and purposefully keep the local population poor and illiterate. The best have been the people of KPK who vote out anybody who doesn't perform.


Our pop is too jahil to make the correct voting decisions and a western style democracy can never work there. (Not calling for dictatorship either)

 

[Waseem]

At this moment what Pakistan needs is political stability, even if it under Nawaz Sharrif. One of the biggest factors which has always hampered Pakistan is political instability. Pakistan has not allowed democracy to evolve in the country. Every few years there was an army take over, now those are over but now we witness dharnas. Democracy takes time to develop and constant disturbances will badly affect the country.

Also there is no denying that PML-N has done better than the previous regime, that is because the current government knew if that they do not deliver something than they will be kicked out like PPP. Imran I feel knows it will be very hard for him to beat Nawaz through election and I believe Imran blew the "dhandli" situation out of proportion. So his only option to gain power is through street politics which I am not a fan of.

Once again each time it seems Pakistan is going towards the right direction some form of obstacle presents it self. Imran fans will not like it what I am saying but this is what I see as an outsider as I have no real stake in Pakistan besides being born there.

Let's say PTI supporters like me are just crazy for supporting Imran's call on Panama leaks.
- Do you suggest opposition to keep quiet even though the whole world reacted to Panama papers and actions have been taken in quite a few countries?
- Can democratic system evolve without accountability?
- Is Imran wrong in asking for institutions to act?
- Given Nawaz's track record of abusing each and every instiution (except for armed forces and this is when he acts like champion of democracy), should we let him do whatever he feels like including rigging, corruption, incompetence?


- Is Nawaz strengthening the democracy by appointing corrupt individuals as head of key institutions, family politics, powerless local bodies, rigged electoral system, bribing media houses & journalists, extreme nepotism within party and institutional appointment etc?

I can give Nawaz a benefit of doubt on economy despite soaring loans and pathetic exports figures but no way on earth he is a symbol of democracy, he is not someone fighting for democracy or strengthening democracy. On top of all that, he is a power hungry and greedy and with his track record of taking money from ISI to conspire against PPP governments. I absolutely do not support PPP and hate their leadership to core but reality is PPP stands for democracy (with all their incompetence, corruption etc).

 

[PakLFC]

Reports coming in that Imran Khan and Shah Mehmood Qureshi to be arrested before the 2nd of November.

 

[Syed1]

Reports coming in that Imran Khan and Shah Mehmood Qureshi to be arrested before the 2nd of November.

That would be a suicidal move by Nawaz and incredibly dumb even by his standards.

 

[Hadi Rizvi]

Why blame the Punjabis when the Sindhis have been voting for PPP for the last 40 years despite them treating the local population as dirt.Or the Urdu-speaking population of Karachi consistently voting for MQM when it is well known that MQM is a terrorist organization. Or the Baluchis who continue to vote for corrupt sardars that keep all the development money in their own pockets and purposefully keep the local population poor and illiterate. The best have been the people of KPK who vote out anybody who doesn't perform.


Our pop is too jahil to make the correct voting decisions and a western style democracy can never work there. (Not calling for dictatorship either)

That's harsh. Ever heard of Mustafa Kamal when he was Mayor of Karachi. Also voted 2nd best mayor IN THE WORLD. Used to be in MQM.

Problem with MQM is that they chose to abuse their power in Karachi by using "badmaashi policy" largely to please "Altaf Bhai"(worst person on the face of Earth). This is the exact same reason Mustafa Kamal left the party but since he knew very well what Karachi was facing he thankfully came back after 3 years and formed PSP.

Karachiites weren't wrong in voting for MQM either because MQM was the only way they could ask for equal rights in everything from Job quotas to salaries etc etc. As I said before MQM is not what it used to be. Whatever work had been done to improve Karachi was either done by Mustafa Kamal (during his Mayoral tenure) or the MQM. But that was a long time ago and that is why MQM is now being recognized as having filled extremists and goons in the place of well-educated people just for the sake of maintaining their hold on Karachi.

For me MQM is almost in a do or die situation. If Waseem Akhtar doesn't do something to improve Karachi then I think that MQM is gonna struggle big time. But IMO voting for MQM was the only way Urdu speakers could get equal recognition and improvement in Karachi but that is the past. TBH Urdu speakers should now think about PSP and forget MQM. MQM is too messed up now.

Just my 2 cents. I'm a Karachiite btw.

 

[PakLFC]

I don't know why Tahir Qadri is not joining IK on 2nd of November. All this time he has been wanting justice for the Lal Masjid massacre, now when crunch time is approaching he is sitting in Canada. He talks about his next world tour of preaching real Islam in Jordan when his own country is on fire. Instead of cleaning up the world first he should sort out his own country. I have lost total respect for him now, he just comes and departs Pakistan as he pleases.

 

[moghul]

Until recently I hated Imran Khan's politics of street protests and wanted him to chill out and wait for his next chance in 2018 but the way Sharif is getting away with one corruption to another and has been unaccountable to whatever he does, don't think IK , or Pakistanis are left with any other choice.

 

[Waseem]

I don't know why Tahir Qadri is not joining IK on 2nd of November. All this time he has been wanting justice for the Lal Masjid massacre, now when crunch time is approaching he is sitting in Canada. He talks about his next world tour of preaching real Islam in Jordan when his own country is on fire. Instead of cleaning up the world first he should sort out his own country. I have lost total respect for him now, he just comes and departs Pakistan as he pleases.

You mean Model town?? He was never a reliable person and it's the best thing from PTI perspective if he stays far away from PTI protests. His SEASONAL love and care for Pakistan is a joke.

 

[Waseem]

Until recently I hated Imran Khan's politics of street protests and wanted him to chill out and wait for his next chance in 2018 but the way Sharif is getting away with one corruption to another and has been unaccountable to whatever he does, don't think IK , or Pakistanis are left with any other choice.

That's the thing right, as much as people hate these protests and agitation, what exactly are options for opposition parties or Pakistanis in general? An international leak (nothing to do with Imran/PTI) comes up, government/institutions react all over the world but in Pakistan PM refuses to even answer questions raised and none of the institutions act, what eactly are the options? Take it to streets or accept that PM/ruling elite has immunity and can't be questioned and if that is the case, at least make it official rule?

 

[moghul]

Why blame the Punjabis when the Sindhis have been voting for PPP for the last 40 years despite them treating the local population as dirt. Or the Urdu-speaking population of Karachi consistently voting for MQM when it is well known that MQM is a terrorist organization. Or the Baluchis who continue to vote for corrupt sardars that keep all the development money in their own pockets and purposefully keep the local population poor and illiterate. The best have been the people of KPK who vote out anybody who doesn't perform.


Our pop is too jahil to make the correct voting decisions and a western style democracy can never work there. (Not calling for dictatorship either)

I am a Punjabi but blame Punjabis similar to Sindhis, Mohajirs and Baluchs for the reason you mentioned. Punjabis are electing the Sharif Mafia for ages. Only KPK people have been showing true political maturity. They elect a party, if doesn;t perform, give chance to the next one. Mullahs, Wali Khan party, elected and discarded by them and I heard PTI is performing well and has a chance to stay.

 

[PakLFC]

You mean Model town?? He was never a reliable person and it's the best thing from PTI perspective if he stays far away from PTI protests. His SEASONAL love and care for Pakistan is a joke.

Yeah Model town. I used to TUQ but now can see through his fake patriotism. When the going gets tough he does a runner sitting in Canada pretending to be ill. One may not always agree with IK's political views but there is no doubt the man has a heart of a lion and is a true Pakistani.

 

[moghul]

I know lots of people in Pakistan, in Punjab in particular, almost all of them who are politically active with PML, have been doing remarkably well financially and their die hard supporters. The ones not politically active or not with PML, going through really hard time.

 

[www787]

In healthy democracy accountability is the key factor.
Anyone arguing that we need to let democracy let it take it course is an argument with no weight.
Accountability issue should be fixed now, not 20 years from now.

 

[Waseem]

In healthy democracy accountability is the key factor.
Anyone arguing that we need to let democracy let it take it course is an argument with no weight.
Accountability issue should be fixed now, not 20 years from now.

Agreed, it's not that Imran Khan just woke up and took an issue out of nowhere for political gains. His party started with the slogan against corruption and he is reacting to an international leak that was taken very seriously by governments all around the world. I think Denmark is paying huge amount of money to purchase further information to help them with investigations. It is in fact Nawaz Sharif who is trying to destabilize the democratic process, he can easily resign and get any other party member to take the country/democracy forward.

 

[Waseem]

Now this certainly takes the cake.

Does he expect that Nawaz will 'pesh' himself before him?

The case is in the Supreme Court and that is where everything is going to be decided. He is invading Islamabad and if the military comes in, Nawaz will be responsible?

Why?

Because Nawaz is not 'peshing' himself before him? or because he is not resigning which he must, since Kaptaan has given the verdict that Nawaz Sharif is guilty?

Amazing.

By the way, I didn't quite catch what SMQ was mumbling about. I was watching the video and it felt as if Kaptaan dismissed him, which probably means he said something sensible.

Anyhow, maybe it is time for him to gather the tenners he collects from his serfs when he sits squat legged with that obnoxious turban. He is for Naya Pakistan after all, he should lead by example and free his serfs first.

It is so simple, don't try to confuse yourself. What Imran Khan wants is exactly what ALL parties want, TORS prepared by ALL opposition parties in which Aitzaz Ahsan played a key role can be used to investigate allegations made against Nawaz Sharif? Why on earth is it so hard to understand? Imran Khan and dharna is all irrelevant if Nawaz as a head of state presents himself for accountability.

 

[WebGuru]

In healthy democracy accountability is the key factor.
Anyone arguing that we need to let democracy let it take it course is an argument with no weight.
Accountability issue should be fixed now, not 20 years from now.

This

Without accountability this badshaahat form of democracy will remain same even if you give it 2 more decades. You can't stop a killer from killing people without arresting and punishing him. If there is now law and no punishment thn people will keep doing what they want and nothing is going to change automatically no matter how much time you give it.

 

[Bewal Express]

I see the LOC in Kashmir has started to rumble again, it seems that Modi is desperate to protect NS.

 

[JaDed]

Pakistan out of economic crisis, says IMF's Lagarde

International Monetary Fund (IMF) Managing Director (MD) Christine Lagarde in a meeting with Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif in Islamabad on Monday maintained Pakistan is now "certainly out of economic crisis", a PM Office statement said.

http://www.dawn.com/news/1291982/pakistan-out-of-economic-crisis-says-imfs-lagarde

 

[Bewal Express]

Pakistan out of economic crisis, says IMF's Lagarde



http://www.dawn.com/news/1291982/pakistan-out-of-economic-crisis-says-imfs-lagarde

http://tribune.com.pk/story/1207075/revenue-shortfall-accountancy-firms-refuse-oblige-government/

 

[TalentSpotterPk]

http://e.dunya.com.pk/detail.php?date=2016-10-24&edition=LHR&id=2687618_16745061

 

[TalentSpotterPk]

http://e.dunya.com.pk/detail.php?date=2016-10-24&edition=LHR&id=2687611_45955439

 

[Zeeraq]

Now this certainly takes the cake.

Does he expect that Nawaz will 'pesh' himself before him?

The case is in the Supreme Court and that is where everything is going to be decided. He is invading Islamabad and if the military comes in, Nawaz will be responsible?

Why?

Because Nawaz is not 'peshing' himself before him? or because he is not resigning which he must, since Kaptaan has given the verdict that Nawaz Sharif is guilty?

Amazing.

By the way, I didn't quite catch what SMQ was mumbling about. I was watching the video and it felt as if Kaptaan dismissed him, which probably means he said something sensible.

Anyhow, maybe it is time for him to gather the tenners he collects from his serfs when he sits squat legged with that obnoxious turban. He is for Naya Pakistan after all, he should lead by example and free his serfs first.

Shouldn't a 'democratically' elected Prime Minister 'Pesh' himself for accountability? If not then please tell me what is democracy?

And if Rigging wouldn't have changed the results why was the Election Rigged? Maybe PML-N would've still won but they (Sharifs) wouldn't have been so powerful that they can get away with literally anything.

 

[www787]

Tahirul Qadri decides to join PTI's protest in Islamabad on Nov 2

In a significant development on Monday, Pakistan Awami Tehreek (PAT) chief Dr Tahirul Qadri accepted Pakistan Tahreek-i-Insaf’s (PTI) request to take part in their November 2 'lockdown' of Islamabad.

Imran Khan, who spoke with Qadri via telephone, welcomed the PAT chief’s decision to join the anti-government march planned for November 2, DawnNews reported.

Awami Mulsim League chief Sheikh Raseed, who was tasked to convince Qadri over the matter, also confirmed the development, it added.

“I have categorically accepted Imran Khan’s invite to take part in the sit-in,” Qadri was quoted as saying by DawnNews. The workers of both the parties are fighting for the same cause, he added.

"I have informed Khurram Nawaz Gandapur about my decision, now the party representatives will meet and discuss the future plan of action," said Qadri.

PTI has already asked all democratic forces to join the movement for strengthening democracy and getting rid of the current government.

Earlier in September, Qadri's PAT had distanced itself from the PTI's Raiwind march.

The PAT had announced to part ways from "the PTI’s Raiwind march as it might lead to siege of the private residence of Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif".

At that time Qadri had supported the stance of the Pakistan Peoples Party and Pakistan Muslim League-Quaid which had opposed staging a sit-in outside the Jati Umra residence of the premier.

PTI's plan B
The PTI has also prepared a strategy to tackle the sit-in and any possible crackdown against the party.

PTI workers will gather at Faizabad and march towards Zero Point under Mr Khan’s leadership. “Blocking Zero Point will render Kashmir Highway, I.J. Principal Road, Murree Road and Islamabad Expressway closed and the federal capital will be in lockdown,” a senior official told Dawn.

“Party leaders are of the view that the government will close the roads themselves, helping the party’s plan to besiege Islamabad,” he said.

If PTI workers are arrested ahead of the lockdown of the capital city, the party plans to lay siege to the police station where they will be held.

PTI leadership has also directed party workers to avoid arrest and "if anyone arrested, then more than 200 workers will immediately reach that police station."

http://www.dawn.com/news/1291992/tahirul-qadri-decides-to-join-ptis-protest-in-islamabad-on-nov-2

 

[Syed1]

Not sure why IK continues to align himself with Qadri

 

[Mamoon]

[MENTION=138980]TalentSpotterPk[/MENTION] [MENTION=135]Waseem[/MENTION] [MENTION=103382]Zeeraq[/MENTION]

He wants Nawaz Sharif to stand trial before him, because he holds him guilty. What Imran needs to realize is that he is not leading a revolution; he is working within a system and the system has laws and courts.

If he is claiming that he is leading a revolution then he should come out open and say that he rubbishes the constitution, resigns from the Parliament (which includes the provincial parliaments) and announce his revolution.

What I find strange is that what he has been been doing is effectively trash the entire constitutional system and aim to build a new one. If he's a Khomeini a Lenin or a Mao, he should declare that so we know exactly what he wants.

He should come out in the open and claim that he does not accept this constitution and from today onwards, it is dissolved and since the constitution is gone and no longer exists, the legislatures and judicial edifice no longer exist either.

You cannot challenge the system as long as you consider yourself part of the system, because as I mentioned before, the system has laws and Courts of Justice. You cannot take matters into your own hands and be the judge and the jury, which is exactly what he is doing.

Apparently he doesn't have 'faith' in the legal system anymore and neither do his supporters, so why don't we declare a revolution?

 

[Mamoon]

It seems like something very sinister is about to happen.

Difa-e-Pakistan, the jihadi alliance, is meeting on the 28th in Islamabad to chalk out a strategy to help Imran Khan in his Tariq ibn Ziyad style attack on Islamabad (the burnt boats fame).

This lethal outfit is lead by Maulana Sami-ul-Haq, once known as The Sandwich Maulana. He wants to pay back Imran Khan on the PKR 300 million he received from PTI to 'reform' his madrassa, but it doesn't end here.

The outfit includes Jamaat-ud-Dawa and Ahle Sunnat Wal Jamaat among others.

They will be discussing their strategy with the Shuhada Foundation of Maulana Aziz, the invincible jihadi. Their spokesman Hafiz Ehtisham said and I quote: "the Government has crossed its limits in its enmity with Islam and the country". Furthermore, thousands of Lal Masjid activists are thinking of joining in.

Can these outfits make a move without a nod from the tail which wags the dog as it has been so nicely put? If there is no nod then they should be stopped and we all know who alone can stop them but then Imran Khan says this time the Umpire WILL raise his finger. Well in that case, Imran Khan has decided who the next Chief of Staff will be.

The latest is that Saint Qadri has decided to grace us with his holy presence again and has agreed to chip in his hordes as well. Apparently he took a bit long because he was raising his price.

Along with Jaish-e-Mohammed, Jamaat-ud-Dawa, Darul Uloom Haqqania and now Lal Masjid, Imran should invite Taliban and ASWJ/ISIS for the Islamabad Invasion as well, and treat all his allies equally.

 

[Tera Gawaandi]

Pakistan is seen as progressing economically, terrorist attacks have halted, Lahore is seeing massive infrastructure development, country's image has improved tremendously in current tenure of PM Nawaz Sharif. He has taken some good steps like departure of Afghan refugees, *** for tat India policy, raising K at UNGA, CPEC, Qadri hanging.

What else do you expect from PM Nawaz Sharif ? First learn to respect PM of your country, only then trust will develop.

Imran Khan is an anarchist, very anti national. India should lend it's support to PM Nawaz Sharif.

 

[Syed1]

India should lend it's support to PM Nawaz Sharif.

Please do so ASAP, it will only accelerate this corrupt looter's exit from the top office in the country.

 

[Mamoon]

Pakistan is seen as progressing economically, terrorist attacks have halted, Lahore is seeing massive infrastructure development, country's image has improved tremendously in current tenure of PM Nawaz Sharif. He has taken some good steps like departure of Afghan refugees, *** for tat India policy, raising K at UNGA, CPEC, Qadri hanging.

What else do you expect from PM Nawaz Sharif ? First learn to respect PM of your country, only then trust will develop.

Imran Khan is an anarchist, very anti national. India should lend it's support to PM Nawaz Sharif.

Plenty of good things have happened in this tenure. Other than Imran arranging a circus every now and then, their is a revived sense of prosperity and renewed faith among the public of Pakistan, which has been missing since 9/11.

Now obviously the expat patriots will dispute this claim even though they haven't stepped foot in the country for years or have spent hardly a couple of months at best.

Pakistan's problems are not over and there is a long way to go but we have taken some steps in the right direction. There is no doubt that a lot of things, especially the ones you mentioned, are getting better.

Imran is anti-democratic individual and a potential fascist. He should be dealt with sternly because we have had enough of his shenanigans.

 

[Syed1]

FDI worse than Zardari's time.

Exports falling for 3 consistent years.

Growth rate at 4-5%

More foreign loans in 3 years of Nawaz government than in 5 years of Zardari government.


And they say renewed sense of prosperity )

 

[WebGuru]

It seems like something very sinister is about to happen.

Difa-e-Pakistan, the jihadi alliance, is meeting on the 28th in Islamabad to chalk out a strategy to help Imran Khan in his Tariq ibn Ziyad style attack on Islamabad (the burnt boats fame).

This lethal outfit is lead by Maulana Sami-ul-Haq, once known as The Sandwich Maulana. He wants to pay back Imran Khan on the PKR 300 million he received from PTI to 'reform' his madrassa, but it doesn't end here.

The outfit includes Jamaat-ud-Dawa and Ahle Sunnat Wal Jamaat among others.

They will be discussing their strategy with the Shuhada Foundation of Maulana Aziz, the invincible jihadi. Their spokesman Hafiz Ehtisham said and I quote: "the Government has crossed its limits in its enmity with Islam and the country". Furthermore, thousands of Lal Masjid activists are thinking of joining in.

Can these outfits make a move without a nod from the tail which wags the dog as it has been so nicely put? If there is no nod then they should be stopped and we all know who alone can stop them but then Imran Khan says this time the Umpire WILL raise his finger. Well in that case, Imran Khan has decided who the next Chief of Staff will be.

The latest is that Saint Qadri has decided to grace us with his holy presence again and has agreed to chip in his hordes as well. Apparently he took a bit long because he was raising his price.

Along with Jaish-e-Mohammed, Jamaat-ud-Dawa, Darul Uloom Haqqania and now Lal Masjid, Imran should invite Taliban and ASWJ/ISIS for the Islamabad Invasion as well, and treat all his allies equally.

View attachment 70327

Is it ok when Government of Pakistan invite all those parties and Difa-e-Pakistan alliance to help them and stay away from this march and get something in return? But it's not ok if they go to help Imran movement for their own agendas even if he don't invite them.

Brother i guess you missed the news our interior minister had talk with them just 2 days ago they want govt to review the fourth schedule list. So they are not coming out on roads in love with a yahoodi agent but they are coming for their own agendas and i guess govt will give them what they want even before them announce the support. They are just cashing the opportunity.

 

[WebGuru]

What else do you expect from PM Nawaz Sharif ? First learn to respect PM of your country, only then trust will develop.

Imran Khan is an anarchist, very anti national. India should lend it's support to PM Nawaz Sharif.

Learn to respect PM of your country? I guess you missed many golden chapters from Pakistan politics history where Nawaz insulted PM Benazir and President Laghari and Ishaq and even attacked supreme court and derailed elected goverments.

Anarchist? It was proved in supreme court that Nawaz was given money to form an alliance by ISI to derail elected goverment of Benazir.

As they say "as you sow you shall reap"

 

[shah_1]

[MENTION=138980]TalentSpotterPk[/MENTION] [MENTION=135]Waseem[/MENTION] [MENTION=103382]Zeeraq[/MENTION]

He wants Nawaz Sharif to stand trial before him, because he holds him guilty. What Imran needs to realize is that he is not leading a revolution; he is working within a system and the system has laws and courts.

If he is claiming that he is leading a revolution then he should come out open and say that he rubbishes the constitution, resigns from the Parliament (which includes the provincial parliaments) and announce his revolution.

What I find strange is that what he has been been doing is effectively trash the entire constitutional system and aim to build a new one. If he's a Khomeini a Lenin or a Mao, he should declare that so we know exactly what he wants.

He should come out in the open and claim that he does not accept this constitution and from today onwards, it is dissolved and since the constitution is gone and no longer exists, the legislatures and judicial edifice no longer exist either.

You cannot challenge the system as long as you consider yourself part of the system, because as I mentioned before, the system has laws and Courts of Justice. You cannot take matters into your own hands and be the judge and the jury, which is exactly what he is doing.

Apparently he doesn't have 'faith' in the legal system anymore and neither do his supporters, so why don't we declare a revolution?

I'm not even a PTI supporter

bhai ask relatives of deads in Model Town killing. What kind of justice they are getting from supreme court?

There is a video of Rana Sanuallah video of bribery and he is still the law minster. Our system is rotten

 

[WebGuru]

I'm not even a PTI supporter

bhai ask relatives of deads in Model Town killing. What kind of justice they are getting from supreme court?

There is a video of Rana Sanuallah video of bribery and he is still the law minster. Our system is rotten

Adding to your points a supreme court judge resigned today he was accused of making illegal appointments in the Islamabad High Court.