Russia invades Ukraine

[cpleigh]

Absolutely fascinating thread retweeted by Eliot Higgins today.

To sum up:

1. Russia and Ukraine both have outdated weapons. The Russians have a numerical advantage, but the Ukrainians have small amounts of more modern weaponry from the west.

2. The Ukrainians floated for weeks a counteroffensive around Kherson. Why?

3. The Ukrainians know that where the Russians failed right from the start was logistics. Their supply chains are rubbish, and they are not fixable.

4. The public floating of a Kherson offensive by Ukraine was almost certainly a bid to suck in more Russian troops and weapons from the rest of Ukraine to defend Kherson.

5. This is because the Ukrainans have a small number of HIMARS and of HARM missiles for neutralising Russian air defences.

6. That tactic obviously worked, because we have seen that with Russian air defences disabled, the Ukrainians have destroyed every bridge into Kherson.

7. The only way that Ukraine could prevail by having a small amount of superior technology was by sucking the Russians into the area where they could deploy it.

8. Russia now has large numbers of troops and weapons stranded on the west side of the Dniepr River, with no bridges by which they can be resupplied.

9. Yet again, like outside Kyiv in March, the Russians are left with their logistic chain broken, and are reduced to ferrying in tiny amounts of supplies and men by boat across the river.

10. This is leaving the Russians exposed - on Saturday at Kherson they reportedly lost 450 men, 15 tanks and 27 APCs.

11. Those losses are not sustainable. At Kyiv and Kharkiv the Russians simply vanished, by a mixture of withdrawal and desertion, but there is no way out of Kherson's west bank.

12. The question now becomes whether this level of attrition continues, in which case the Russian forces in Kherson will collapse and surrender, or whether Putin responds to defeat by using tactical nuclear weapons, which would be an act of personal and national suicide.

No, He will turn off the gas to Europe and try and force it to end in a negotiation, where he keeps Crimea and the Donbas.

Ukraine have started taking terrority back in the Donbas now, so its full panic mode now. He's willing to forgoe money to try and enf it

 

[Firebat]

Ukraine war: Russia postpones 'referendum' in occupied region

The Russian occupation authorities in Ukraine's southern city of Kherson have postponed a so-called referendum on joining Russia, on security grounds.

"This is being paused because of the security situation," said Kirill Stremousov, deputy head of the Russian-appointed administration there.

He said heavy Ukrainian shelling had made a key Kherson bridge impassable.

Ukraine and its Western allies have denounced the referendum plans in Kherson and other areas as illegal.

Meanwhile, Ukraine says its forces have recaptured Vysokopillya, a small town some 167km (104 miles) north of central Kherson.

That gain - not verified independently - is part of a counter-offensive in the south launched by the Ukrainian army last week.

A photo shows soldiers apparently raising the Ukrainian flag over the town, which had nearly 4,000 residents before the war. It was posted on Facebook by Kyrylo Tymoshenko, deputy head of President Volodymyr Zelensky's office.

His photo caption says: "Vysokopillya, Kherson Region. Ukraine. Today."

President Zelensky said Ukrainian forces had recaptured two "population centres" in the south, but did not name them.

Russia has been planning referendums in Kherson and the southern Zaporizhzhia region, most of which it controls.

Speaking on Russian state TV, Mr Stremousov said Ukrainian shelling had damaged Kherson's Antonovskiy Bridge to such an extent that vehicles could no longer cross it.

He said barges transporting civilians across the Dnieper (Dnipro) river were also coming under Ukrainian fire, as was the city's infrastructure.

The Russians have relied on the bridge to bring troops and hardware in and out of Kherson.

Ukraine has deployed US-made Himars multiple rocket launchers in its drive to push the Russians out of the city - the first to fall to them after their 24 February invasion.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-62795976

 

[Junaids]

West should look at bigger picture and stop arming the Ukrainians.

This is prolonging the war and causing more deaths/miseries.

This war is also affecting the whole world (food shortages and energy crisis).

Yes, don’t try stopping or punishing the rapist. He’s not raping you, so leave the poor guy alone.

 

[bones]

[MENTION=145891]cpleigh[/MENTION] and [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION]

You make some very bold claims about recaptured territory and Russian deaths. What are these territories? Names of the settlements would be good. Also what about the Ukrainian deaths, why is it that if the Russians are losing so many troops that they are parked pretty deep in Ukraine?

 

[bones]

These guys never provide sources and when you provide pro-ukranian sources that paint a grim picture for Ukraine they ignore it.

 

[bones]

Such is the craziness that cpleigh just said Putin will weapons energy like his cult leaders but ignore the fact the west decided to and failed miserably with their sanctions.

Europe is suffering a lot more than Russia right now. The interesting part is that the Russians haven't truly retaliated do far but looks they will now that winter is looming.

Gas is 40 times cheaper in Russia than Europe right now...

 

[bones]

There is no coverage in the MSM still but protests have started in Europe. Czech Republic, France, Germany and Italy so far. It will soon get more serious.

By the way junaids and cpleigh how much will your energy bills be this winter? Unlike you many are not prepared to pay 3 or 4 times more for a corrupt regime in Ukraine.

 

[cpleigh]

There is no coverage in the MSM still but protests have started in Europe. Czech Republic, France, Germany and Italy so far. It will soon get more serious.

By the way junaids and cpleigh how much will your energy bills be this winter? Unlike you many are not prepared to pay 3 or 4 times more for a corrupt regime in Ukraine.

No idea. Probably about £230. Looks like they are going to freeze energy prices here now.

I've seen the protests on the MSM, so u are wrong there.

Ukraine isn't the reason many in the UK aren't willing to pay the increases.... It's the profits they make

 

[cpleigh]

Such is the craziness that cpleigh just said Putin will weapons energy like his cult leaders but ignore the fact the west decided to and failed miserably with their sanctions.

Europe is suffering a lot more than Russia right now. The interesting part is that the Russians haven't truly retaliated do far but looks they will now that winter is looming.

Gas is 40 times cheaper in Russia than Europe right now...

Russia hasn't reacted??? They have just played their nuclear option by turning the gas off. Early by the way... No doubt he planned on doing it in winter when the EU was in desperate need.

He's had to go early.... He's getting desperate

 

[cpleigh]

[MENTION=145891]cpleigh[/MENTION] and [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION]

You make some very bold claims about recaptured territory and Russian deaths. What are these territories? Names of the settlements would be good. Also what about the Ukrainian deaths, why is it that if the Russians are losing so many troops that they are parked pretty deep in Ukraine?

They've taken Vysokopillia and oleksandrivka. Pictures of the flag going up.

Rumours they are in tomyna balka.

Be honest bones....nrussia hasn't taken anything for weeks now

 

[Robert]

Macron has asked the French to reduce energy consumption by 10%, in the hope of avoiding power cuts and sending gas to Germany. European solidarity in action.

Germany is extending the operational life of two nuclear reactors past their planned decommissioning date this year.

 

[cpleigh]

Looks like all bridges across the Dnieper are destroyed

 

[Technics 1210]

Russia's economy is further booming despite Putin having shut of the gas taps towards Europe and unfriendly nations.

Europe is poor, beggars, who either steal or borrow to survive, it's all documented history. More money in the East and Putin knows this.

Well done NATO, you have united the world against the White JC aggression, bullying, and warmongering!

Superb.

 

[Junaids]

[MENTION=145891]cpleigh[/MENTION] and [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION]

You make some very bold claims about recaptured territory and Russian deaths. What are these territories? Names of the settlements would be good. Also what about the Ukrainian deaths, why is it that if the Russians are losing so many troops that they are parked pretty deep in Ukraine?

No I haven’t.

I’ve said that Ukraine tricked Russia into diverting their troops to Kherson, then knocked out all the bridges to allow them to pick off the trapped Russians, whose supply chain has failed again.

I’m not sure about territory- it strikes me that for months the Russians have sacrificed huge numbers of soldiers and arms to make tiny territorial gains.

But the fact that it is Russia which now wants a peace settlement to freeze the territory as it stands now suggests that they cannot sustain their current levels of losses.

Russia long ago gave up fighting by the Rules of War and instead wrecked the civilian infrastructure of the parts of Ukraine they claimed to be liberating. Ethnically Russian Ukrainians have lost everything, so they have nothing more to lose.

The Ukrainians have zero incentive to take a peace settlement now without reclaiming their stolen lands.

The only people who want a peace deal are Russia, who are bankrupt and whose conventional military is now inferior to Vietnam’s, and those Western Europeans who are addicted to Russian energy.

But Russia has done an amazing job uniting ethnically Ukrainian and Russian Ukrainians.

Now they all see that Russia hates them and wants to steal their land and property, and finally Ukrainians of all backgrounds just want to defeat Russia.

 

[bones]

Looks like all bridges across the Dnieper are destroyed

You said that 3 weeks ago and the Russians went out of their way to show that they were still using the bridges and that most of the bridges were repairable.

Do you honestly think in the year 2022 that any military not least one of the most advanced in the world would pin all their hopes on 1, 2 or 3 bridges?

 

[Technics 1210]

JP Morgan has drawn up plans to shift work from offices in Germany into the City of London as finance companies brace for potential blackouts in the EU's biggest economy.

The Wall Street bank is preparing a raft of emergency measures so that it can continue trading if there are power outages this winter following Vladimir Putin's decision to cut off gas supplies from Russia.

It came as the energy crisis gripping Europe deepened, with the Kremlin announcing that the crucial Nord Stream 1 gas pipeline will remain shut until Western sanctions are eased, and the Opec-plus cartel of oil exporting countries agreeing to cut crude output.

The euro fell below $0.99 for the first time since December 2002, dropping by as much as 0.7pc to $0.9878 as wholesale gas prices surged and stocks slumped.

Shares were also hit, with Germany’s benchmark Dax index falling 2.2pc, while France's Cac 40 stock index dropped 1.2pc. Benchmark European gas prices jumped as much as 35pc.

DT

)

 

[cpleigh]

You said that 3 weeks ago and the Russians went out of their way to show that they were still using the bridges and that most of the bridges were repairable.

Do you honestly think in the year 2022 that any military not least one of the most advanced in the world would pin all their hopes on 1, 2 or 3 bridges?

Ukraine advancing in Luhansk now.

 

[bones]

Ukraine advancing in Luhansk now.

I decided to have a look into this becaue unlike you I'm more than prepared to accept if I'm wrong. The only area in Luhansk where control has changed in favour of Ukraine is Ozerne. All other areas remain stable, in the grey zone or have seen Russian gains. But Ozerne hasn't actually changed control, if you dig deeper and you'll realise that it was a small group of soldiers who crossed the river for some photos and then retreated.

Ozerne is north of the river and therefore without a massive coordinated assault with supply lines established it's not going to be held by Ukraine.

 

[bones]

I’m not sure about territory- it strikes me that for months the Russians have sacrificed huge numbers of soldiers and arms to make tiny territorial gains.

Using a force of just 200k soldiers, which is a a small force compared to what Ukraine has, the Russians have captured more than 100,000 kmsq. With Crimea that jumps up to 135,000 sq km.

If it's such tiny gains, why can't the Ukrainians capture any of it back?

But the fact that it is Russia which now wants a peace settlement to freeze the territory as it stands now suggests that they cannot sustain their current levels of losses.

Source for this? Please provide sources that are not the Daily Mail or reddit.

Russia long ago gave up fighting by the Rules of War and instead wrecked the civilian infrastructure of the parts of Ukraine they claimed to be liberating. Ethnically Russian Ukrainians have lost everything, so they have nothing more to lose.

The Ukranians still have water, electricity, internet, a functioning railroad system etc. If the Russians wanted to destroy civilian infrastructure deliberately those things would have been taken out on day 1.

But Russia has done an amazing job uniting ethnically Ukrainian and Russian Ukrainians.

Now they all see that Russia hates them and wants to steal their land and property, and finally Ukrainians of all backgrounds just want to defeat Russia.

Have you been reading more Daily Mail articles? Perhaps you should listen to what the ethnic Russians have said to the journalists who have visited places like Melitopol, Luhanks, Mariupol, Severodonestk etc.

Perhaps you should see what the AFU have said about the ethnic Russians in Donbas - they reveal locations to the Russians and make the job easier for the Russian army.

 

[cpleigh]

Zelensky to make a statement tonight.. with great news about the offensive in Kharkiv

 

[KingKhanWC]

Zelensky to make a statement tonight.. with great news about the offensive in Kharkiv

Ukraine have captured Kharkiv or the usual ** about they will win the war , something you claimed 4 months ago? lol

I think this could be his great news, make sure you record it and watch it all night .

Escaped chimpanzee returns to Kharkiv zoo on keeper’s bicycle

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...escapes-from-zoo-in-under-fire-ukrainian-city

 

[Technics 1210]

Russia's Gazprom is planning to sell gas to China in both rubles and yuan to shift away from the euro!

Russia's increased trade with China has helped boost domestic demand for the yuan. Russia is now the third-largest market for yuan transactions outside the Chinese mainland as Western sanctions block payments using the dollar and euro.

Russia has already taken payment for its oil exports in yuan instead of the dollar, which is the primary currency for most commodities. Russia has also accepted the yuan for coal shipments. And in March, Russia's central bank said it would use the yuan in its currency reserves.

Meanwhile, Russia is considering buying up to $70 billion in Chinese yuan and other currencies from "friendly" countries to put the brakes on the soaring ruble, according to a Bloomberg report.

https://markets.businessinsider.com...tural-gas-sales-ruble-yuan-euro-dollar-2022-9

-------

Oh my, Putin is now attacking the Euro! And yes, the Euro is now trading below USD parity!

Genius!

)

 

[cpleigh]

Ukrainian troops in balakliya. Would that be the first actual city liberated?

 

[shaz619]

Absolutely fascinating thread retweeted by Eliot Higgins today.

To sum up:

1. Russia and Ukraine both have outdated weapons. The Russians have a numerical advantage, but the Ukrainians have small amounts of more modern weaponry from the west.

2. The Ukrainians floated for weeks a counteroffensive around Kherson. Why?

3. The Ukrainians know that where the Russians failed right from the start was logistics. Their supply chains are rubbish, and they are not fixable.

4. The public floating of a Kherson offensive by Ukraine was almost certainly a bid to suck in more Russian troops and weapons from the rest of Ukraine to defend Kherson.

5. This is because the Ukrainans have a small number of HIMARS and of HARM missiles for neutralising Russian air defences.

6. That tactic obviously worked, because we have seen that with Russian air defences disabled, the Ukrainians have destroyed every bridge into Kherson.

7. The only way that Ukraine could prevail by having a small amount of superior technology was by sucking the Russians into the area where they could deploy it.

8. Russia now has large numbers of troops and weapons stranded on the west side of the Dniepr River, with no bridges by which they can be resupplied.

9. Yet again, like outside Kyiv in March, the Russians are left with their logistic chain broken, and are reduced to ferrying in tiny amounts of supplies and men by boat across the river.

10. This is leaving the Russians exposed - on Saturday at Kherson they reportedly lost 450 men, 15 tanks and 27 APCs.

11. Those losses are not sustainable. At Kyiv and Kharkiv the Russians simply vanished, by a mixture of withdrawal and desertion, but there is no way out of Kherson's west bank.

12. The question now becomes whether this level of attrition continues, in which case the Russian forces in Kherson will collapse and surrender, or whether Putin responds to defeat by using tactical nuclear weapons, which would be an act of personal and national suicide.

The most hilarious thing is, Junaids doesn’t even live in Europe, it is concerning how you’re spewing nazi propaganda all the way from Australia!

 

[Robert]

The most hilarious thing is, Junaids doesn’t even live in Europe, it is concerning how you’re spewing nazi propaganda all the way from Australia!

Come on mate. Ukraine is a democracy, not totalitarian.

There are a very few Nazis in the Ukraine army, originally about 2000 in one single Regiment,
and undoubtedly fewer now. That’s less than 1% of the Ukraine armed forces.

 

[bones]

Come on mate. Ukraine is a democracy, not totalitarian.

There are a very few Nazis in the Ukraine army, originally about 2000 in one single Regiment,
and undoubtedly fewer now. That’s less than 1% of the Ukraine armed forces.

Have you seen the numerous clips of thousbands of civilians who hail Bandera as a hero and doing the Nazi salute? I agree the problem is exagerrated by the Russians, but a heck of a lot more than what you're suggesting.

 

[Technics 1210]

Standards of living in Europe are being sacrificed for American interests.

NATO/Liberals apologists are too blinded by ZMSM and White JC Imperialism, to realise this fact.

 

[Junaids]

Standards of living in Europe are being sacrificed for American interests.

NATO/Liberals apologists are too blinded by ZMSM and White JC Imperialism, to realise this fact.

It’s like 1939.

Sometimes you have to make a sacrifice to stop evil despots in your continent.

 

[Technics 1210]

It’s like 1939.

Sometimes you have to make a sacrifice to stop evil despots in your continent.

Right, but supporting despots outside the continent is just fine?

Pinnochet
Mugabe (knighted)
Shah
Saddam Hussein

To name but a few, all supported by the West at some point in time.

You call it sacrifice, the rest world calls it daylight hypocrisy.

If you lovers of NATO really cared about Ukraine, NATO would've accepted Ukraine's application to join years ago.

Amreeka is playing Europe like a dog, no, lapdog.

 

[cpleigh]

Standards of living in Europe are being sacrificed for American interests.

NATO/Liberals apologists are too blinded by ZMSM and White JC Imperialism, to realise this fact.

Thought you'd be happy today?... Energy prices frozen so no winter armagaeddon like you feared.

 

[cpleigh]

Right, but supporting despots outside the continent is just fine?

Pinnochet
Mugabe (knighted)
Shah
Saddam Hussein

To name but a few, all supported by the West at some point in time.

You call it sacrifice, the rest world calls it daylight hypocrisy.

If you lovers of NATO really cared about Ukraine, NATO would've accepted Ukraine's application to join years ago.

Amreeka is playing Europe like a dog, no, lapdog.

How could it? Ukraine was at war. NATO doesn't accept members whilst at war

 

[Technics 1210]

Thought you'd be happy today?... Energy prices frozen so no winter armagaeddon like you feared.

Energy prizes frozen costing the tax payers £100s of Billions in the long run, and how will the government recoup this? Yup, higher taxes.

It's good to know that the UK has frozen energy prices, but not the EU! I couldn't give a flying fig what happens in the EU, but yes this winter in UK is not going to be armageddon, hopefully.

Though it should be duly noted that the energy price freeze doesn't apply to businesses, only households, so businesses will continue to suffer.

Alas! Liberals and NATO apologists couldn't pay the price worth paying for the Ukrainian war!

 

[sweep_shot]

Energy prizes frozen costing the tax payers £100s of Billions in the long run, and how will the government recoup this? Yup, higher taxes.

It's good to know that the UK has frozen energy prices, but not the EU! I couldn't give a flying fig what happens in the EU, but yes this winter in UK is not going to be armageddon, hopefully.

Though it should be duly noted that the energy price freeze doesn't apply to businesses, only households, so businesses will continue to suffer.

Alas! Liberals and NATO apologists couldn't pay the price worth paying for the Ukrainian war!

Putin has check-mated west with this energy crisis alone.

West thought they could bully Putin and Russia like they bullied smaller countries. Didn't work out as planned.

 

[bones]

Why are people jumping up and shouting about the price freeze and not asking how the gap will be covered? Once again short term gains, won't solve our problems. We need the global supply issue resolved so bring the prices back under control.

 

[Technics 1210]

Putin has check-mated west with this energy crisis alone.

West thought they could bully Putin and Russia like they bullied smaller countries. Didn't work out as planned.

Yup and while Russia has the lowest GDP to debt ration in the Western hemisphere, this war has piled on more debt on Western countries including UK, Europe, and USA.

The biggest win though is not forcing NATO members on their knees but SWIFT alternatives which are now in acrion - MIR and RuPay means Russia, China, and India can trade between eachother bypassing the USD and EU.

 

[bones]

Big news coming through. The big battle has commenced. The Ukrainians have deployed a massive army with mechanized and tank brigades to the Izyum front. This backs up for once cpleigh's statement. Even a broken clock is right twice a day isn't it? The Ukranians made some gains here and defeated the Russian units.

Slightly further north the Russians have made moves towards Chuhiv - they are still a way off but the plan is clear, they want to encircle as much of Kharkiv as they can. They don't have enough forces to go into the city.

The Russians it appears have also deployed some of the 3rd corps in the south and they've captured some settlements 100km to the east of Zaporozhia.

Everything we're seeing points to the following, the Kherson offensive failed miserably, despite huge noise no one was able to point out any territory actually held by the AFU. The Ukranians are aiming to hurt the Russians around Izyum.

 

[cpleigh]

Big news coming through. The big battle has commenced. The Ukrainians have deployed a massive army with mechanized and tank brigades to the Izyum front. This backs up for once cpleigh's statement. Even a broken clock is right twice a day isn't it? The Ukranians made some gains here and defeated the Russian units.

Slightly further north the Russians have made moves towards Chuhiv - they are still a way off but the plan is clear, they want to encircle as much of Kharkiv as they can. They don't have enough forces to go into the city.

The Russians it appears have also deployed some of the 3rd corps in the south and they've captured some settlements 100km to the east of Zaporozhia.

Everything we're seeing points to the following, the Kherson offensive failed miserably, despite huge noise no one was able to point out any territory actually held by the AFU. The Ukranians are aiming to hurt the Russians around Izyum.

The plan was to destroy all exits and trap the Russians in Kherson... it's worked. All bridges out gone.

Loads of places liberated near Kharkiv today, videos of Ukranian tanks rolling in and civilians cheering for joy. HIMARS out out in broad daylight today, looks like they are aiming to take out the Kupyansk (Russias main supply route from Russia) they have liberated Balakliya which means they are in range now with HIMARS.

Ukraine have just put a tweet out saying 'its about to get hot in Crimea'....

and to prepare to swim...

Sounds like they are going for the bridge

 

[bones]

The plan was to destroy all exits and trap the Russians in Kherson... it's worked. All bridges out gone.

Oh right, so the plan was never to retake Kherson, it was to trap the Russians? Is that why the Odessa and Mikolaiv hospitals are overflowing with Ukranians soldiers?

You've been saying for weeks the bridges are out of commission but every day the Russians release footage showing the bridges being used. Even if the Ukranians do eventually make these bridges completely unusable, then modern armies have the ability to build pontoon bridges.

 

[cpleigh]

Oh right, so the plan was never to retake Kherson, it was to trap the Russians? Is that why the Odessa and Mikolaiv hospitals are overflowing with Ukranians soldiers?

You've been saying for weeks the bridges are out of commission but every day the Russians release footage showing the bridges being used. Even if the Ukranians do eventually make these bridges completely unusable, then modern armies have the ability to build pontoon bridges.

Show the bridges today? They'll take Kherson don't worry about that

 

[Junaids]

Pretty accurate Darth Putin tweet just uploaded:

Day 196 of my 3 day war.

Once I run out of North Korean ammo my soldiers will work in pairs.

One will throw rocks & other will shout "BANG".

 

[Junaids]

Looks like the Russians have been defeated at Balakliya.

That is major news, because it is well south of Kharkiv, and nowhere near either Donbas or Kherson.

We seem to be seeing the Russians overstretched now, with their logistics unable to keep up.

It’s sort of like a Reverse Stalingrad.

Right from the start of this 3 Day War their logistics have been unfit for purpose. But they can basically only sustain a single front adjacent to Russia. Kherson plus Donbas is more than their supply chains can sustain.

 

[Junaids]

The thing that is different about Balakliya is that the Russians haven’t just run away, like they did when they were defeated outside Kyiv and sold their withdrawal as a a “decoy move”.

This time the Russians have been encircled and they are surrendering in large numbers.

There is no word for this except defeat. Ukraine has defeated Russia at Balakliya.

 

[Junaids]

Russia really has lost that aura of military power now. This one is doing the rounds currently:

Was just talking with a NATO officer about the Russian Army and asked him how long it would take the Finnish Army to seize St Petersburg.

He said, ‘not long, only problem they’d face is that the Poles would get there first.’

……..

Remember, this is what Russia historically is - they lost to Japan in 1905 and Poland between the wars.

 

[sweep_shot]

Russia really has lost that aura of military power now. This one is doing the rounds currently:

Was just talking with a NATO officer about the Russian Army and asked him how long it would take the Finnish Army to seize St Petersburg.

He said, ‘not long, only problem they’d face is that the Poles would get there first.’

……..

Remember, this is what Russia historically is - they lost to Japan in 1905 and Poland between the wars.

As long as they have nuclear weapons, their aura is not lost.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Looks like the Russians have been defeated at Balakliya.

That is major news, because it is well south of Kharkiv, and nowhere near either Donbas or Kherson.

We seem to be seeing the Russians overstretched now, with their logistics unable to keep up.

It’s sort of like a Reverse Stalingrad.

Right from the start of this 3 Day War their logistics have been unfit for purpose. But they can basically only sustain a single front adjacent to Russia. Kherson plus Donbas is more than their supply chains can sustain.

Ukrainians control Verbivka if true, not Balakliya. Even if they did its a very small town of around 20k people.

In their own so called land with so many weapons from Nato, Ukraine hasnt taken back anything of significance since March. The Taliban did better than this in Afghanistan.

Ukraine is not getting the east back, its idiotic think they will. Reason is simple, the people in the East of Ukraine are with the Russians, they are Russians.

But please lets have a prediction when will Kharkiv be taken and when will Russia be defeated to run out of Ukraine?

 

[Junaids]

As long as they have nuclear weapons, their aura is not lost.

Far from it.

The best way to understand this is to compare it to a situation in which a killer has taken hostages.

Until the point where he sets to kill the hostages, the aim is to avoid that situation.

But as soon as he starts to murder the hostages, that game is over. The new task is to use overwhelming force to kill him before he kills anyone else.

If Putin uses any nuclear weapons - even short-range battlefield ones - then within ten minutes nuclear weapons are fired at every town, city and military location in Russia.

That’s his dilemma. He’s overstretched his conventional forces, and he’s using nuclear blackmail, but if he fires a single nuke he commits instant personal and national suicide.

 

[sweep_shot]

Far from it.

The best way to understand this is to compare it to a situation in which a killer has taken hostages.

Until the point where he sets to kill the hostages, the aim is to avoid that situation.

But as soon as he starts to murder the hostages, that game is over. The new task is to use overwhelming force to kill him before he kills anyone else.

If Putin uses any nuclear weapons - even short-range battlefield ones - then within ten minutes nuclear weapons are fired at every town, city and military location in Russia.

That’s his dilemma. He’s overstretched his conventional forces, and he’s using nuclear blackmail, but if he fires a single nuke he commits instant personal and national suicide.

Russia has 5,977 nukes (more than USA). They can fire too.

Mutually assured destruction.

 

[Junaids]

Ukrainians control Verbivka if true, not Balakliya.

Ukraine is not getting the east back, its idiotic think they will. Reason is simple, the people in the East of Ukraine are with the Russians, they are Russians.
?

You have clearly fallen for Russian propaganda.

The last Ukrainian election saw a Russian-speaking ethnic Russian defeat a Ukrainian nationalist.

Ethnic Russians in Ukraine don’t want to be a part of a corrupt, impoverished Russia. They want to be ethnic Russians in Ukraine, with all the benefits of a western lifestyle.

The war in Donbas and Kharkiv has completely alienated the Ukrainian Russians from Russia. Most of them hate Russia now.

There is probably a hard core of about 10% of Ukrainian Russians who support Russia. The rest prefer Ukraine.

 

[KingKhanWC]

You have clearly fallen for Russian propaganda.

The last Ukrainian election saw a Russian-speaking ethnic Russian defeat a Ukrainian nationalist.

Ethnic Russians in Ukraine don’t want to be a part of a corrupt, impoverished Russia. They want to be ethnic Russians in Ukraine, with all the benefits of a western lifestyle.

The war in Donbas and Kharkiv has completely alienated the Ukrainian Russians from Russia. Most of them hate Russia now.

There is probably a hard core of about 10% of Ukrainian Russians who support Russia. The rest prefer Ukraine.

You have no credibility to judge anyone since you couldn't answer a simple question regarding your beloved Israel.

Last election, you mean Zelensky the Zioinst/Nato puppet who was installed after a violent bloody coup?

Almost all of the East wants to be independent of Ukraine and are against Nato because Nato HAVE BEEN arming the Nazis and others to attack and kill those in the East. Nato has been training in Ukraine since 2014.

No prediction? If you're so confident as you have been for 6 months, try another prediction. Your earlier ones have turned out to as comedy like the Ukrainian PM.

 

[sweep_shot]

I noticed that Ukraine supporters generally ignore the topic of Nazism within Ukrainian military.

There is Azov brigade within Ukrainian military. They are straight up Nazis.

I wonder what [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] thinks about them.

 

[Junaids]

I noticed that Ukraine supporters generally ignore the topic of Nazism within Ukrainian military.

There is Azov brigade within Ukrainian military. They are straight up Nazis.

I wonder what [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] thinks about them.

There was an interesting Twitter thread three days ago about the Russian Nazis who are supposedly DeNazifying Ukraine.

Both countries have a small racist, anti-Semitic neo-Nazi lunatic fringe - but Russia’s is bigger and worse.

Ukraine’s President Is a Russian Jew. Calling Ukraine Nazis or anti-Russian is insane.

 

[sweep_shot]

There was an interesting Twitter thread three days ago about the Russian Nazis who are supposedly DeNazifying Ukraine.

Both countries have a small racist, anti-Semitic neo-Nazi lunatic fringe - but Russia’s is bigger and worse.

Ukraine’s President Is a Russian Jew. Calling Ukraine Nazis or anti-Russian is insane.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_Regiment

Question is why did Ukraine add them to their military (knowing they are Nazis)? They are with Ukrainian military officially.

 

[Junaids]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_Regiment

Question is why did Ukraine add them to their military (knowing they are Nazis)? They are with Ukrainian military officially.

I don’t like it either.

It’s a battle for national survival - they are the ones who have been invaded, going back to 2014. They have to use whatever they can.

Mind you, Russia is recruiting convicts for the war.

 

[cpleigh]

Ukrainians control Verbivka if true, not Balakliya. Even if they did its a very small town of around 20k people.

In their own so called land with so many weapons from Nato, Ukraine hasnt taken back anything of significance since March. The Taliban did better than this in Afghanistan.

Ukraine is not getting the east back, its idiotic think they will. Reason is simple, the people in the East of Ukraine are with the Russians, they are Russians.

But please lets have a prediction when will Kharkiv be taken and when will Russia be defeated to run out of Ukraine?

Balakliya puts them in range of kupyansk. HIMARS will destroy the only supply hub to the entire east in minutes.

Ukraine will get it back, Igor girkin on telegram... remember him?? Says the Russian army is days away from its biggest defeat since 1943

 

[bones]

Show the bridges today? They'll take Kherson don't worry about that

With what army? Here is your western MSM covering Ukrainian losses.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/09/07/ukraine-kherson-offensive-casualties-ammunition/

 

[cpleigh]

Russia has requested a UN security council meeting today to discuss people supplying weapons to ukraine..

Diddums

 

[cpleigh]

You know what army. They said they aimed to have 1m armed by late summer into autumn.

 

[bones]

Balakliya puts them in range of kupyansk. HIMARS will destroy the only supply hub to the entire east in minutes.

Ukraine will get it back, Igor girkin on telegram... remember him?? Says the Russian army is days away from its biggest defeat since 1943

You are totally clueless and you don't bother to do any research yourself. The Ukrainians won't bother taking Balakliya because it's a trap and the Russians could use a few fab500s to decimate the area.

Before you type nonsense please open up some maps, look at the terrain and then think for just a couple of minutes about supply, air control and fire control. Once you do this you will realise why the Russians do what they do and why the Ukrainians do what they do. The Ukrainians have numbers on their side the Russians have artillery on their side and this is why both sit behind fortifications and wait for gaps that take weeks. Ukraine will never take Kherson, the terrain won't allow it. They can take other regions possibly but not kherson because of the river and the open flat terrain.

Here is an article which highlights the losses they suffered.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/09/07/ukraine-kherson-offensive-casualties-ammunition/

Personally I think you're worse than the amateurs on the daily mail.

 

[bones]

You know what army. They said they aimed to have 1m armed by late summer into autumn.

Territorial defence units with 3 weeks training is fodder, it's not an army. The Ukrainians have gone through 8 waves of mobilisation, it means they are scraping the bottom.

 

[bones]

The Ukrainians used 9-10k soldiers for t he counter offensive in kherson, that's why they were never going to make gains.

On the other hand they have between 30-40k which includes rank and mechanised brigades in the Izyum direction. Quite clear the Ukrainians had no real interest in taking kherson. The tactic appears to be to cut the Russians in half by taking the m03 motorway.

It appears that the Russians have given up on some of these towns because of the huge number of Ukrainians and they have fortifications further back. The next stage of the battle will be interesting because no one really knows where the Russians have sent their 3rd corps.

 

[cpleigh]

You are totally clueless and you don't bother to do any research yourself. The Ukrainians won't bother taking Balakliya because it's a trap and the Russians could use a few fab500s to decimate the area.

Before you type nonsense please open up some maps, look at the terrain and then think for just a couple of minutes about supply, air control and fire control. Once you do this you will realise why the Russians do what they do and why the Ukrainians do what they do. The Ukrainians have numbers on their side the Russians have artillery on their side and this is why both sit behind fortifications and wait for gaps that take weeks. Ukraine will never take Kherson, the terrain won't allow it. They can take other regions possibly but not kherson because of the river and the open flat terrain.

Here is an article which highlights the losses they suffered.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/09/07/ukraine-kherson-offensive-casualties-ammunition/

Personally I think you're worse than the amateurs on the daily mail.

Literallys videos showing Ukrainian troops entering the City and some sitting at bus stops laughing about catching the bus to Belograd

 

[bones]

Literallys videos showing Ukrainian troops entering the City and some sitting at bus stops laughing about catching the bus to Belograd

Yesterday you said the same about Ozerne in Luhansk, which you incidentally didn't respond back with. The Ukranians go in, do their photoshoots and then claim victory on social media.

It's on the frontline, like many places on the frontline, there will be swapping back and forth and both sides can only claim an area when they have total fire free control and have swept the area. Take for example Pisky, the Russians claimed to have took it 3 weeks ago, but to perform the sweep and remove Ukraine's chance at fire control it took them at least another 10-14 days.

Even if Ukraine take Balakliya, even if they take the other surrounding towns, in order for them to actually have control, then need to push the Russians back 10km and destroy their fortifications which includes the mines. If the Ukranians take an area without performing a sweep, it means the Russians want the Ukranians to take it.

Remember if a place is worth it, both sides will fight. The fact teh Russians are not fighting means either their fortifications are further back, or they know it's of little value at this stage.

 

[cpleigh]

I never mentioned ozerne? I said Ukraine were making gains in Luhansk. I didn't mention a single place.

Or the Russians have emptied their reserves by sending them South into Kherson

 

[bones]

I never mentioned ozerne? I said Ukraine were making gains in Luhansk. I didn't mention a single place.

Or the Russians have emptied their reserves by sending them South into Kherson

You said Luhansk and therefore I had to do some research to find these "gains" and the only one that was mentioned was Ozerne.

Better still if the Ukranians have made gains in Luhansk, why not tell us where they are and give us your sources.

 

[Technics 1210]

Christine Lagarde has said she’s happy to eat humble pie when it comes to admitting the ECB got its inflation forecasts wrong.

She told reporters: “I take the blame as the head of the institution.”

Ms Lagarde said the reasons for the ECB’s failures were mainly due to events outside the bank’s control, such as Covid, the war in Ukraine and what she described as “energy blackmail” by Vladimir Putin.

“Yes we made forecasting errors, and we came forward with the causes for those errors. That's why we revised our forecasts,” she said.

DT

Come EU, hurry up and collapse!

 

[cpleigh]

Ukraine taken sen'kove. Thats the direct supply route to Izyum and Kupyansk cut off.

Russian telegram confirm Ukraine is 10km west of Kupyansk now

 

[Technics 1210]

The Russian president has sent a telegram to Britain’s new King Charles III

Russian President Vladimir Putin has sent his condolences over Queen Elizabeth’s death to the new British monarch, the Kremlin press service said in a brief statement on Thursday.

“The most important events in the modern history of the United Kingdom are inseparably linked to the name of Her Majesty. For many decades, Elizabeth II rightfully enjoyed the love and respect of her subjects, as well as authority on the world stage,” Putin said, wishing Charles III “courage and perseverance” in the face of this “heavy and irreparable loss.”

“I ask you to convey the words of sincere sympathy and support to the members of the royal family and all the people of Great Britain,” the Russian president added.

 

[sweep_shot]

The Russian president has sent a telegram to Britain’s new King Charles III

Russian President Vladimir Putin has sent his condolences over Queen Elizabeth’s death to the new British monarch, the Kremlin press service said in a brief statement on Thursday.

“The most important events in the modern history of the United Kingdom are inseparably linked to the name of Her Majesty. For many decades, Elizabeth II rightfully enjoyed the love and respect of her subjects, as well as authority on the world stage,” Putin said, wishing Charles III “courage and perseverance” in the face of this “heavy and irreparable loss.”

“I ask you to convey the words of sincere sympathy and support to the members of the royal family and all the people of Great Britain,” the Russian president added.

That's nice of Russia.

Putin is a gentleman.

 

[Junaids]

For the first time I am starting to feel sorry for the Russian troops.

It's only in the last 36 hours that it has become apparent that Russia is now suffering total annihilation on the battlefield. Until yesterday I feared that if the Europeans went wobbly Russia might win, or at least freeze the map as it currently stands.

But soldiers are humans, and it's unsettling to see them being routed like Russia now are. I've been particularly struck by the audio recordings of Russian troops at both Bakaliya and Kherson making frantic calls to say that they can't evade Ukrainian drones and that pinpoint strikes are following within minutes of them appearing.

I know Russia started it, and I know that Russia has committed awful war crimes. And I know they have to give back the territory that they have unlawfully stolen. But it's hard watching Russia get massacred because its leaders won't surrender.

 

[bones]

For the first time I am starting to feel sorry for the Russian troops.

It's only in the last 36 hours that it has become apparent that Russia is now suffering total annihilation on the battlefield. Until yesterday I feared that if the Europeans went wobbly Russia might win, or at least freeze the map as it currently stands.

But soldiers are humans, and it's unsettling to see them being routed like Russia now are. I've been particularly struck by the audio recordings of Russian troops at both Bakaliya and Kherson making frantic calls to say that they can't evade Ukrainian drones and that pinpoint strikes are following within minutes of them appearing.

I know Russia started it, and I know that Russia has committed awful war crimes. And I know they have to give back the territory that they have unlawfully stolen. But it's hard watching Russia get massacred because its leaders won't surrender.

I can see why you would get so excited about the news coming from Ukraine, it's similar to the pace the Russians were moving in March through several fronts.

However for armchair experts like you who have no idea what is actually happening, you are advised to wait a few days. The kherson counter offensive was a fail, the Ukrainians suffered horrific losses because of the terrain primarily. They didn't have enough men or equipment.

The Izyum direction, well Ukraine have deployed a huge force multiple BTGs including mechanised and tank groups. The front line is over 1000km so with a force of 200k the Russians can't protect it all. It has become clear that the Russians had national police in many of these areas. So as usual now that the Ukrainians have made their move we will need to see how the Russians adapts do respond. Rumours are that Russia is already moving reserves into the area, so let's see.

 

[the Great Khan]

I can see why you would get so excited about the news coming from Ukraine, it's similar to the pace the Russians were moving in March through several fronts.

However for armchair experts like you who have no idea what is actually happening, you are advised to wait a few days. The kherson counter offensive was a fail, the Ukrainians suffered horrific losses because of the terrain primarily. They didn't have enough men or equipment.

The Izyum direction, well Ukraine have deployed a huge force multiple BTGs including mechanised and tank groups. The front line is over 1000km so with a force of 200k the Russians can't protect it all. It has become clear that the Russians had national police in many of these areas. So as usual now that the Ukrainians have made their move we will need to see how the Russians adapts do respond. Rumours are that Russia is already moving reserves into the area, so let's see.

As usual our resident cheer leaders forget that in wars like this you have to wait a while to fully understand the results. There is a big risk for the ukrops. They have to succeed. The Russians can pull back hold their defensive positions and wait till they bring up more strike forces. Also they are finally striking supply lines..who knows why they haven't done this till now.

We also know there are NATO troops amongst the formations..unofficial of course hence a better performance by ukrops here..this is now a real fight for Russia and they will have to rethink and readapt..but we know from this war that they will do this..

 

[Robert]

For the first time I am starting to feel sorry for the Russian troops.

It's only in the last 36 hours that it has become apparent that Russia is now suffering total annihilation on the battlefield. Until yesterday I feared that if the Europeans went wobbly Russia might win, or at least freeze the map as it currently stands.

But soldiers are humans, and it's unsettling to see them being routed like Russia now are. I've been particularly struck by the audio recordings of Russian troops at both Bakaliya and Kherson making frantic calls to say that they can't evade Ukrainian drones and that pinpoint strikes are following within minutes of them appearing.

I know Russia started it, and I know that Russia has committed awful war crimes. And I know they have to give back the territory that they have unlawfully stolen. But it's hard watching Russia get massacred because its leaders won't surrender.

I concur with your last point but no Russian President with withdraw. Russia is not a democracy. Withdrawal will be seen as weakness and political suicide, probably life-ending too.

 

[Robert]

That's nice of Russia.

Putin is a gentleman.

Maybe he will stop probing our air and sea defences, and trying to assassinate dissidents on our soil with polonium umbrellas and Novichok.

 

[cpleigh]

Ukraine are in Kupyansk.

Also see St Petersburg councillors have demanded the State Duma press charges against Putin for Treason against Russia.

The start?....

 

[Realromeo]

My grandfather and uncles were in the military. My grandfather was even trained in Soviet Union. They are fully behind Russia lmaoo. I can't understand how they think what Russia doing is correct.

 

[cpleigh]

some lovely videos about of libertaing areas with old woman crying etc and hugging Ukranian troops.

Lol @ people thinking they wanted to be under Russian rule

 

[cpleigh]

https://twitter.com/mbk_center/status/1568174194243915776?s=46&t=lxz-GCiRx4fkEdoei8Skfw

a letter from the russian finance ministry regarding payments to deceased families. Just under 50k, and that doesn't take into account the DPR and LPR troops.

Unbelievable

 

[Pakpak]

I can see why you would get so excited about the news coming from Ukraine, it's similar to the pace the Russians were moving in March through several fronts.

However for armchair experts like you who have no idea what is actually happening, you are advised to wait a few days. The kherson counter offensive was a fail, the Ukrainians suffered horrific losses because of the terrain primarily. They didn't have enough men or equipment.

The Izyum direction, well Ukraine have deployed a huge force multiple BTGs including mechanised and tank groups. The front line is over 1000km so with a force of 200k the Russians can't protect it all. It has become clear that the Russians had national police in many of these areas. So as usual now that the Ukrainians have made their move we will need to see how the Russians adapts do respond. Rumours are that Russia is already moving reserves into the area, so let's see.

Kherson was a feint in my opinion. Ukraine is never going to be able to retake it. Their quality troops and their aim has always been farther East,

Even if we disagree on that there is no way Russia will hold on till they mobilise their entire army. Ukraine is too big, too weaponised now. Mobilise and get it over with. Whatever think tank anyone had I highly doubt involved Russians with the war dragging on 8 months later.

 

[bones]

Even if we disagree on that there is no way Russia will hold on till they mobilise their entire army. Ukraine is too big, too weaponised now. Mobilise and get it over with. Whatever think tank anyone had I highly doubt involved Russians with the war dragging on 8 months later.

I agree the frontline and the territory they're fighting is huge against a pretty modern and very large army. The problem is Putin and the Russian leadership don't want to mobilise, but the behaviour of the west is almost pushing them into it.

 

[bones]

https://twitter.com/mbk_center/status/1568174194243915776?s=46&t=lxz-GCiRx4fkEdoei8Skfw

a letter from the russian finance ministry regarding payments to deceased families. Just under 50k, and that doesn't take into account the DPR and LPR troops.

Unbelievable

Now do the same for the Ukranians...

I'll be waiting.