The 2016 U.S. Elections Thread

[Cracket]

 

[Pakistanian]

I'm afraid Trump will win.

 

[Saeed]

Trump will probably talk about Benghazi and Lewinsky scandal today. It would be good for hillary if he kept making personal attacks during the debate.

 

[Saeed]

Trump has tan and it looks horrible. Moderator aska a question about Trump's comment on women and he deflects by talking about ISIS and taking our country back. He is literally saying this is how people talk in locker room, get over my comment already. Then his non sense about Obama's citizenship. He blames it on her for staarting lies about Obama's citizenship and that she should apologize to president. If she started then why did he went along with it? How does that make him any better. Guy is all over the place.

 

[Abdul]

Lol, this is quite hilarious. It's unbelievable that this is an actual presidential debate.

 

[Saeed]

He didn't even bother to apologize to Khan family. Lol guy just said Captain Khan would be alive if he was president. He is still pushing the lie about Iraq war. Guy supported Iraq war and there is solid evidence against Trump being against Iraq war. This guy is at war with facts.

 

[Saeed]

"I know nothing about Russia I mean I know about Russia" "We are cutting bigly" What does that even mean?

 

[Jin Chacha]

As ridiculous as it sounds for some reason I sometimes have a soft spot for Trump. It is like an irresistible desire to support the underdog. Or may it is that smug calculating look on Hillary's face. It makes me empathize with Trump supporters.

 

[s28]

So this is the Democracy they think it is worth killing millions of innocent civilians for to impose upon them.

 

[anuk]

"I know nothing about Russia I mean I know about Russia" "We are cutting bigly" What does that even mean?

Big league, not bigly. He likes saying big league.

 

[FreakCricket]

Very boring debate today!
Trump did better than the last time considering his sexist remarks leaked on the tape.
Trump knows more about taxcode than hillary

 

[Cracket]

*Drumroll*


Trump. Freakin' DOMINATED Hillary. Like a lion circling his prey.

This is mindblowing given the circumstances he went under.. Gotta admit last two days were rough for Trump supporters. He has turned it around.

 

[Cracket]

 

[sjahmed23]

This election is over... no neutral person is going to vote for trump after that video leak. We're going to have four more years of Obama.

 

[anuk]

This election is over... no neutral person is going to vote for trump after that video leak. We're going to have four more years of Obama.

Yes this is true but we can only hope. I fear to think what the terror situation around the world would be if Hillary continues the same path as she has for the last 8 years.

 

[sjahmed23]

Yes this is true but we can only hope. I fear to think what the terror situation around the world would be if Hillary continues the same path as she has for the last 8 years.

Yup... this was a bad election overall. Republicans should've backed a better candidate... but fox news and their extremist rhetoric made trump and now they are paying for it.

 

[James]

The Republican Party would have easily won this election had they blooded and then selected a better candidate. They are paying the price for years of lazy & mediocre groundwork. With Trump at the helm, November is looking like a toss-up for them at best.

 

[majiz]

Hillary has so much blood on her hands(mostly Muslim) trump is a bit slimey but comes across as mildly transparent at least unlike crookary. She is vile

 

[majiz]

Let's see how trump supporters defend this now. So do Americans want a president who likes to sexually assault women?

he wasn't talking about sexually assaulting women, he was talking about being forward with women who are interested in rich, successful men

and if anyone wants to talk about audio tapes there's a one of hillary clinton giggling about how crap lie detectors must be because it showed the child rapist she successfully defended to be telling the truth about his innocence. champion for women's rights right there, nevermind how cozy she is with saudi or her predator of a husband

though it would be such shame for an election of this importance to boil down to these kinds of soap operas about what people have said in the past and not about their past actions or what they intend to do(hillary is a disaster all round here btw). I see people just mindlessly dancing to the media's tune and it's so depressing

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Yes this is true but we can only hope. I fear to think what the terror situation around the world would be if Hillary continues the same path as she has for the last 8 years.

In some ways I hope that Trump wins. Like Brexit, sometimes you really do need to give the bigots their day in the sun, just so we can see what that day would actually look like.

 

[majiz]

reading back the thread can't believe how many people are favouring killary. let's not forget trump's potential policy and comments is nothing but a drastic reaction to the terrible global situation killary has helped to create. we have a really weird situation nowadays where the left have almost morphed into neo-cons, and trump supporters are like the anti-establishment punks.

 

[majiz]

In some ways I hope that Trump wins. Like Brexit, sometimes you really do need to give the bigots their day in the sun, just so we can see what that day would actually look like.

what an awful post. there was nothing to admire about the eu, that's why we left, i'll spare liking it by defualt because of some imaginary, braindead idea of what it means to take the opposite view

 

[Cracket]

reading back the thread can't believe how many people are favouring killary. let's not forget trump's potential policy and comments is nothing but a drastic reaction to the terrible global situation killary has helped to create. we have a really weird situation nowadays where the left have almost morphed into neo-cons, and trump supporters are like the anti-establishment punks.

I couldn't have put it in better words. The left is turning into supporters of the 'Project for the New American Century' mantle helmed by Rebublicans in the 90s. Now the democrats have picked up the policy for endless war and regime change. Trump re-iterated not taking part in government building efforts in Syria, and he got pounced by the moderator Radaatz herself for going against Beltway D.C. position on Syria.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

what an awful post. there was nothing to admire about the eu, that's why we left, i'll spare liking it by defualt because of some imaginary, braindead idea of what it means to take the opposite view

I don't want to derail this thread but we'll see what Brexit looks like a couple of years down the line when the conditions actually kick in. Britain's leading businesses don't seem as optimistic as you, that's all I'll say on it for now.

 

[Saeed]

Hillary has so much blood on her hands(mostly Muslim) trump is a bit slimey but comes across as mildly transparent at least unlike crookary. She is vile

She is a crook and vile because? Trump's whole campaign has been vile, just look at his recent leak. No normal person talks like him.

 

[majiz]

She is a crook and vile because? Trump's whole campaign has been vile, just look at his recent leak. No normal person talks like him.

she colludes with super pacs illegally. breaks federal law and gets away with it (the e-mail scandal). most likely swindles money via the clinton foundation. iraq and libya were disasters but yet she wants to continue arming rebels in syria. she is an interventionist tyrant. all in all she just comes across as so creepy and dishonest anyway not sure how anyone could find her even slightly amicable

 

[Markhor]

Hillary has so much blood on her hands(mostly Muslim) trump is a bit slimey but comes across as mildly transparent at least unlike crookary. She is vile

reading back the thread can't believe how many people are favouring killary. let's not forget trump's potential policy and comments is nothing but a drastic reaction to the terrible global situation killary has helped to create. we have a really weird situation nowadays where the left have almost morphed into neo-cons, and trump supporters are like the anti-establishment punks.

Give Trump a term and he'll have plenty of Muslim blood on his hands too. His supporters are baying for Muslim blood too.

A man seeking 30,000 ground troops in Syria, saying Obama's dropping over 20k bombs and missiles on Iraq/Syria ISN'T ENOUGH, calling for the killing of the family members of terrorists, proposing to reinstate the worst excesses of the Bush years such as torture and condemning the Iran deal doesn't sound like an anti-establishment peacenik.

Sometimes it helps if one actually follows the detail of this campaign.

 

[Markhor]

she colludes with super pacs illegally. breaks federal law and gets away with it (the e-mail scandal). most likely swindles money via the clinton foundation. iraq and libya were disasters but yet she wants to continue arming rebels in syria. she is an interventionist tyrant. all in all she just comes across as so creepy and dishonest anyway not sure how anyone could find her even slightly amicable

A Republican FBI director, a man who was the deputy to the deeply right-wing Bush era Attorney General John Ashcroft, cleared her on the emails.

Look, as a progressive I detest how Hillary Clinton seems to find comfort in the company of the likes of Henry Kissinger, Goldman Sachs and is the walking, talking symbol of the Establishment at a time when the entire world hates the Establishment. I'd say she's even further to the right than Tony Blair. I do not like her at all and if she continues with the neoliberal agenda - then I say primary her in 2020 like Lyndon Johnson was in 1968.

However I'll take a corrupt competent (Clinton) over a corrupt incompetent (Trump).

For every email and Foundation scandal Hillary has, Trump has his own corrupt Foundation which is anything BUT a charity, Trump University where students were swindled, his non-payment of taxes for 20 years, shady business deals, multiple bankruptcies and then all the racism, misogyny and Islamophobia on top of that.

Republicans made a huge mistake with Trump. If they went for Rand Paul to run on a populist libertarian ticket - he would have a great chance of winning and even gaining a decent chunk of young voters. John Kasich would've been another good pick.

 

[Nostalgic]

To the dedicated Trump supporter, the 2005 tape won't matter much. They're looking for an unscripted, spontaneous, non-PC, non-politician, and every outrageous outburst, every faux pas, actually reinforces that image of his. To people who are hell bent on spiting the establishment no matter what the cost, every revelation of this sort actually serves to strengthen him as the best possible way to stick their collective tongue out, snub their nose and point their middle finger at the establishment.

What is worrisome is the likelihood that there may be many who don't admit to voting for him in the polls, but will do so come Election Day. Call it the Brexit effect or the Jesse Ventura effect, but he may be running closer to Clinton than the polls show. Add to this the fact that such voters are likely to be motivated enough to not only vote but also make sure their friends and families do, something that can't be said for those voting for Clinton, many of whom are only reluctantly in favor of her. We may be in for interesting times ahead.

 

[majiz]

Give Trump a term and he'll have plenty of Muslim blood on his hands too. His supporters are baying for Muslim blood too.

A man seeking 30,000 ground troops in Syria, saying Obama's dropping over 20k bombs and missiles on Iraq/Syria ISN'T ENOUGH, calling for the killing of the family members of terrorists, proposing to reinstate the worst excesses of the Bush years such as torture and condemning the Iran deal doesn't sound like an anti-establishment peacenik.

Sometimes it helps if one actually follows the detail of this campaign.

come on now, hillary clearly wants to drag us down a messier route. she is the queen of world disruption. defy russia? overthrow yet another dictator in the middle east? she never learns.

 

[Saeed]

she colludes with super pacs illegally. breaks federal law and gets away with it (the e-mail scandal). most likely swindles money via the clinton foundation. iraq and libya were disasters but yet she wants to continue arming rebels in syria. she is an interventionist tyrant. all in all she just comes across as so creepy and dishonest anyway not sure how anyone could find her even slightly amicable

She was investigated for emails multiple times and nothing came out of them. U.S. can't just dump the Justice System to appease Hillary haters. She is innocent until proven guilty. Yes they were disaster but don't tell me she alone is responsible for all that, she is not a dictator like Assad, Saddam and Gaddafi. Syria is already a bigger disaster than Iraq and Libya. She will put an end to it by taking Assad to ICC.

No body can be more dishonest and creepy than Trump. He lied about Iraq, he lied about Libya, he lied about Obama's borth place and he lied about Clinton fighting ISIS her entire adult life.

 

[majiz]

A Republican FBI director, a man who was the deputy to the deeply right-wing Bush era Attorney General John Ashcroft, cleared her on the emails.

Look, as a progressive I detest how Hillary Clinton seems to find comfort in the company of the likes of Henry Kissinger, Goldman Sachs and is the walking, talking symbol of the Establishment at a time when the entire world hates the Establishment. I'd say she's even further to the right than Tony Blair. I do not like her at all and if she continues with the neoliberal agenda - then I say primary her in 2020 like Lyndon Johnson was in 1968.

However I'll take a corrupt competent (Clinton) over a corrupt incompetent (Trump).

For every email and Foundation scandal Hillary has, Trump has his own corrupt Foundation which is anything BUT a charity, Trump University where students were swindled, his non-payment of taxes for 20 years, shady business deals, multiple bankruptcies and then all the racism, misogyny and Islamophobia on top of that.

Republicans made a huge mistake with Trump. If they went for Rand Paul to run on a populist libertarian ticket - he would have a great chance of winning and even gaining a decent chunk of young voters. John Kasich would've been another good pick.

clinton's corruption has more political, more human/world affecting implications about it

politicians are always 'competent' and the world's in a mess. time to give the less rehearsed guy a spin imo

 

[majiz]

She was investigated for emails multiple times and nothing came out of them. U.S. can't just dump the Justice System to appease Hillary haters. She is innocent until proven guilty. Yes they were disaster but don't tell me she alone is responsible for all that, she is not a dictator like Assad, Saddam and Gaddafi. Syria is already a bigger disaster than Iraq and Libya. She will put an end to it by taking Assad to ICC.

No body can be more dishonest and creepy than Trump. He lied about Iraq, he lied about Libya, he lied about Obama's borth place and he lied about Clinton fighting ISIS her entire adult life.

they couldn't prove her guilt but it seems dodgy as hell. honestly the clinton's spin s*** into gold, how else are they worth 100 million without ever really producing anything. and overthrowing assad is not the answer

 

[Markhor]

come on now, hillary clearly wants to drag us down a messier route. she is the queen of world disruption. defy russia? overthrow yet another dictator in the middle east? she never learns.

Hillary is to the right of Obama on foreign policy no doubt.

But how does this validate Trump's foreign policy which would be Dubya on steroids. He would turn a blind eye to a nuclear arms race in East Asia, massively accelerate the bombing campaigns in Iraq and Syria, would allow the House of Saud to develop nukes, kill the Iran deal and in his AIPAC speech was sucking up to Bibi as much as humanly possible, killing any chance of a two state solution (what little there is) by recognising Jerusalem as the capital of Israel. Even Hillary isn't going that far.

Anyone who's tracked Trump's public utterances will see he plays both the chest-thumping militarist and the splendid isolationist depending on what room he's in. He's playing his base for fools. And his foreign policy team consists of various energy interests and a man who's tied to a Lebanese Christian militia (since we're on the subject of Muslim blood). My foot is Trump a dove.

Look, my 2 cents whatever its worth to my progressive friends across the Atlantic is this. If Hillary wants to be a neoliberal in economics and a hawk abroad - primary the hell out of her in 2020 and bring her down like LBJ in 1968. Then you can bring in Sherrod Brown or Elizabeth Warren or whoever.

 

[Saeed]

they couldn't prove her guilt but it seems dodgy as hell. honestly the clinton's spin s*** into gold, how else are they worth 100 million without ever really producing anything. and overthrowing assad is not the answer

People are not proved guilty based on feelings. They make money by giving speeches. Check her website, its all there. When is lier trump releasing his tax return?https://www.hillaryclinton.com/page/tax-returns/

 

[majiz]

Hillary is to the right of Obama on foreign policy no doubt.

But how does this validate Trump's foreign policy which would be Dubya on steroids. He would turn a blind eye to a nuclear arms race in East Asia, massively accelerate the bombing campaigns in Iraq and Syria, would allow the House of Saud to develop nukes, kill the Iran deal and in his AIPAC speech was sucking up to Bibi as much as humanly possible, killing any chance of a two state solution (what little there is) by recognising Jerusalem as the capital of Israel. Even Hillary isn't going that far.

Anyone who's tracked Trump's public utterances will see he plays both the chest-thumping militarist and the splendid isolationist depending on what room he's in. He's playing his base for fools. And his foreign policy team consists of various energy interests and a man who's tied to a Lebanese Christian militia (since we're on the subject of Muslim blood). My foot is Trump a dove.

Look, my 2 cents whatever its worth to my progressive friends across the Atlantic is this. If Hillary wants to be a neoliberal in economics and a hawk abroad - primary the hell out of her in 2020 and bring her down like LBJ in 1968. Then you can bring in Sherrod Brown or Elizabeth Warren or whoever.

trump's foreign policy is on the whole safer in my view. while some of his policies are throwback to more traditional conservative standpoints, he's certainly more of an isolationist than hillary is and he is going for an ISIS targeted approach in Syria. there's fears hillary could literally start WW3 because the Russians know very well that overthrowing assad is far from the answer to the middle east or worlds' problems .

 

[AlphaFighter]

Let us be clear. Muslims in the US, African Americans, Latinos, immigrants, Minorities are going to vote for the lesser of the 2 evils and the lesser of the 2 evils is Hillary Clinton.

If Trump does not have these voters on his side, he will lose just like Mitt Romney did. I am predicting a Clinton Victory by 4-5 % margin. History will be made with a female president in the US.

 

[majiz]

People are not proved guilty based on feelings. They make money by giving speeches. Check her website, its all there. When is lier trump releasing his tax return?https://www.hillaryclinton.com/page/tax-returns/

even if it is true the tax thing doesn't have the wide reach that the stuff hillary is accused of does. it's a personal thing maybe but i personally trust trump a heck lot more than i trust her. i don't believe she's at all honest or kind-hearted for one second, not in the slightest, and if she even once came across that way on the surface it would make all the stuff that's on her a little harder to believe, but she doesn't, she's just the hundreth drab political drone. trumps 'flaws' on the other hand make him reachable and fathomable

 

[majiz]

Let us be clear. Muslims in the US, African Americans, Latinos, immigrants, Minorities are going to vote for the lesser of the 2 evils and the lesser of the 2 evils is Hillary Clinton.

If Trump does not have these voters on his side, he will lose just like Mitt Romney did. I am predicting a Clinton Victory by 4-5 % margin. History will be made with a female president in the US.

i think trump's going to win. trump supporters have more conviction and on the day the hillary turn-out will be low. i mean nobody seriously wants hillary to be president let's be honest here lol.

 

[Cracket]

People are not proved guilty based on feelings. They make money by giving speeches. Check her website, its all there. When is lier trump releasing his tax return?https://www.hillaryclinton.com/page/tax-returns/

So Clintons were "dead broke" when leaving the White House, but made a net worth of $100 million just by giving paid speeches?

 

[AlphaFighter]

So Clintons were "dead broke" when leaving the White House, but made a net worth of $100 million just by giving paid speeches?

You have no idea how much Bill Clinton gets paid to speak? How much Pervez Musharraf gets paid to speak. Bill Clinton probably has a few book deals as well, has pension and other benefits offered to an ex US president.

 

[dayvancowboy]

Ex-Muslims supporting Trump only because they still have a serious axe to grind lol

 

[dayvancowboy]

Give Trump a term and he'll have plenty of Muslim blood on his hands too. His supporters are baying for Muslim blood too.

A man seeking 30,000 ground troops in Syria, saying Obama's dropping over 20k bombs and missiles on Iraq/Syria ISN'T ENOUGH, calling for the killing of the family members of terrorists, proposing to reinstate the worst excesses of the Bush years such as torture and condemning the Iran deal doesn't sound like an anti-establishment peacenik.

Sometimes it helps if one actually follows the detail of this campaign.

You know there are ex-Muslims that have sick fantasies of a Crusade spanning from Morocco to Indonesia.

Even if they aren't willing to raise tax rates to World War 2 era levels to fund said 'Crusade'.

 

[Cracket]

You have no idea how much Bill Clinton gets paid to speak? How much Pervez Musharraf gets paid to speak. Bill Clinton probably has a few book deals as well, has pension and other benefits offered to an ex US president.

Someone hasn't read Clinton Cash. Bill was paid huge sums to speak while Hillary provided favors in State Depts. Ask Ericsson's ex-Ceo, lol.

 

[Junaids]

*Drumroll*


Trump. Freakin' DOMINATED Hillary. Like a lion circling his prey.

This is mindblowing given the circumstances he went under.. Gotta admit last two days were rough for Trump supporters. He has turned it around.

With respect - and I say this as someone who has no affection for Hillary Clinton - I think you have completely misinterpreted the Second Debate.

Clinton is miles ahead now in the polls against Trump, and her biggest fear now is that, as a deeply unpopular candidate herself, the Republicans remove Trump from the ticket and run with Mike Pence instead. Pence is in many ways quite extreme in a Ted Cruz-like way, but there wouldn't be enough time for the Democrats to inform the undecided voters of his extremism. Pence would probably beat Hillary.

So the Second Debate was fascinating. Trump went the only way he knows - electrifying his base with his ludicrous "Lock Her Up" demagoguery. That makes people like you who are in his Locked In 40% feel better, but it doesn't win over anyone in the undecided centre.

Hillary Clinton went in a different direction. She wanted to persuade those undecided centrists that she was responsible and grown-up enough to not start World War 3. But above all, she couldn't afford to strike a knockout blow against Trump in case the Republican hierarchy removed him from the ticket.

So I think it was Mission Accomplished for Hillary. Continue to goad Trump into alienating undecided voters with his angry, bullying behaviour, but don't damage him so much that he explodes and incites the Republican hierarchy to throw him off the ticket.

There will be more of the same in Las Vegas. Hillary can beat Trump but she would lose to any grown-up non-extreme Republican. If she had faced Mitt Romney or John McCain or Paul Ryan she'd have been annihilated.

So she needs to keep Trump at the top of the Republican ticket. She can afford for him to inspire his base with his Looney Tunes medley of the Wall / Mexicans / Muslims / Bill the Rapist, but she can't let him make headway with the undecided voters.

And by definition, undecided voters don't think that Bill Clinton is a rapist or that Hillary is an email traitor or that they need a wall or extreme vetting or tax cuts for billionaires. Those issues don't move the undecided voters.

 

[AlphaFighter]

With respect - and I say this as someone who has no affection for Hillary Clinton - I think you have completely misinterpreted the Second Debate.

Clinton is miles ahead now in the polls against Trump, and her biggest fear now is that, as a deeply unpopular candidate herself, the Republicans remove Trump from the ticket and run with Mike Pence instead. Pence is in many ways quite extreme in a Ted Cruz-like way, but there wouldn't be enough time for the Democrats to inform the undecided voters of his extremism. Pence would probably beat Hillary.

So the Second Debate was fascinating. Trump went the only way he knows - electrifying his base with his ludicrous "Lock Her Up" demagoguery. That makes people like you who are in his Locked In 40% feel better, but it doesn't win over anyone in the undecided centre.

Hillary Clinton went in a different direction. She wanted to persuade those undecided centrists that she was responsible and grown-up enough to not start World War 3. But above all, she couldn't afford to strike a knockout blow against Trump in case the Republican hierarchy removed him from the ticket.

So I think it was Mission Accomplished for Hillary. Continue to goad Trump into alienating undecided voters with his angry, bullying behaviour, but don't damage him so much that he explodes and incites the Republican hierarchy to throw him off the ticket.

There will be more of the same in Las Vegas. Hillary can beat Trump but she would lose to any grown-up non-extreme Republican. If she had faced Mitt Romney or John McCain or Paul Ryan she'd have been annihilated.

So she needs to keep Trump at the top of the Republican ticket. She can afford for him to inspire his base with his Looney Tunes medley of the Wall / Mexicans / Muslims / Bill the Rapist, but she can't let him make headway with the undecided voters.

And by definition, undecided voters don't think that Bill Clinton is a rapist or that Hillary is an email traitor or that they need a wall or extreme vetting or tax cuts for billionaires. Those issues don't move the undecided voters.

This i think is the most accurate way of the looking at the present situation.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Those who think Hillary is better than Trump are definitely not seeing the bigger picture. Trump may be a bit of a loose cannon and certainly most of what he says is absolutely despicable. But Hillary is a massive hypocrite and a complete crook to boot. She has a "softer" image than Trump but she is merely a puppet of all these financial institutions. And she won't be any less than Bush either in terms of foreign policy.

 

[AlphaFighter]

Those who think Hillary is better than Trump are definitely not seeing the bigger picture. Trump may be a bit of a loose cannon and certainly most of what he says is absolutely despicable. But Hillary is a massive hypocrite and a complete crook to boot. She has a "softer" image than Trump but she is merely a puppet of all these financial institutions. And she won't be any less than Bush either in terms of foreign policy.

Its about choosing the lesser of 2 evils. Sorry but that is how Democracy works. 2 candidates, choose the lesser of 2 evils and that unfortunately happens to be History. Let America also bask in glory of having the first female US president in its history.

 

[majiz]

Its about choosing the lesser of 2 evils. Sorry but that is how Democracy works. 2 candidates, choose the lesser of 2 evils and that unfortunately happens to be History. Let America also bask in glory of having the first female US president in its history.

trump is definitely the lesser of two evils. trump isn't at all evil

 

[AlphaFighter]

trump is definitely the lesser of two evils. trump isn't at all evil

Yeah right. All US Muslims, African Americans, Minorities are going to unite in droves on election day to vote against this guy.

 

[sshakir411]

Trump with his rhetoric has divided the country...he hates Mexicans, Muslims, Blacks, and Women. Hilary on the other hand has united the country against Trump. Come election day, Americans are going to trash Trump. His support has really dwindled among the educated yet loyal republicans.

 

[majiz]

Trump with his rhetoric has divided the country...he hates Mexicans, Muslims, Blacks, and Women. Hilary on the other hand has united the country against Trump. Come election day, Americans are going to trash Trump. His support has really dwindled among the educated yet loyal republicans.

it's nothing but people dancing to the media's tune

he doesn't hate any of those things

are you really that incapable of free thought?

 

[AlphaFighter]

it's nothing but people dancing to the media's tune

he doesn't hate any of those things

are you really that incapable of free thought?

Even personally deep down, i thought all the stuff he was saying was just to win popularity votes and brownie points. His agenda was and is too crazy for a US President to actually carry out. This isn't Nazi Germany.

 

[sshakir411]

it's nothing but people dancing to the media's tune

he doesn't hate any of those things

are you really that incapable of free thought?

I live in the US and see the effects of this election daily. You're delusional if you think the country isn't more divided now than it was 3 years ago.

 

[Cracket]

I live in the US and see the effects of this election daily. You're delusional if you think the country isn't more divided now than it was 3 years ago.

And you're just repeating CNN/DNC's talking points. Race and partisan politics division increased under Obama. Trump only came in the picture last year with a rhetoric about immigrant laws being enforced.

Wikileaks email dumps revealed today his DoJ colluded with Clinton camp on email releases. The stench of corruption in the current administration is damning.

 

[AlphaFighter]

In historic event, rebellion erupts against Trump one month before election

[The Canadian Press]

The Canadian Press

October 8, 2016

In historic event, rebellion erupts against Trump one month before election

WASHINGTON — An internal rebellion has erupted against Donald Trump, knocking out support from longstanding pillars of the Republican party and threatening to turn his presidential campaign into ruins.

Election historians say it's unprecedented.

Just one month before election day, the party is turning on Trump. At least one-third of the party's senators have now declined to support him, rescinded their support, asked him to resign, or declared they'll vote for someone else.

As if that weren't enough, his own running mate publicly scolded him this weekend. His wife issued an angry, if forgiving statement. Even the Terminator terminated his support; Arnold Schwarzenegger bailed. So did Condoleezza Rice. The list of anti-Trump Republicans now includes about 17 senators, 24 representatives, several governors — and counting.

Add a former Republican nominee to the list. John McCain has withdrawn his already-tepid backing. The final straw for him, and apparently for many others, was the release of an old video where the billionaire bragged about grabbing women's genitals without permission.

"I have wanted to support the candidate our party nominated. He was not my choice, but as a past nominee, I thought it important I respect the fact that Donald Trump won a majority of the delegates by the rules our party set," the 2008 nominee said in a statement Saturday.

"But Donald Trump's behaviour this week, concluding with the disclosure of his demeaning comments about women and his boasts about sexual assaults, make it impossible to continue to offer even conditional support for his candidacy... (My wife) Cindy and I will not vote for Donald Trump."

Several elected members went a step further: They asked Trump to resign, and let running mate Mike Pence replace him. Pence, for his part, cancelled a campaign appearance Saturday; declared himself offended by Trump's remarks; and suggested he would be looking for contrition Sunday night in what is now destined to be a memorable debate against Hillary Clinton.

Trump vowed to stay in.

"The media and establishment want me out of the race so badly," he tweeted.

"I WILL NEVER DROP OUT OF THE RACE, WILL NEVER LET MY SUPPORTERS DOWN!"

Growing fissures in the party are now splitting wide.

The divisions predate Trump; the rift between the party's leadership and its membership is among the dominant themes in American politics. The big-business-friendly, immigration-supporting, trade-promoting leadership has clashed repeatedly with a grassroots that tilts against immigration and trade. That split has already affected American governance, stalling legislative efforts like long-delayed immigration reform.

Now Trump appears to be cracking it apart.

Trump is as reviled in institutional Washington as he is popular with a vast swath of primary voters. In the watering holes of the nation's capital, it's common to hear Republicans denigrate their own nominee.

This rift is now evident everywhere.

At rallies this weekend, party figures like Paul Ryan were heckled for not sufficiently supporting Trump; the congressional leader has expressed dismay over the remarks, but not officially withdrawn his backing. On Facebook, former secretary of state Rice was deluged with criticism for declaring: "Enough! Donald Trump should not be President. He should withdraw."

An example of the negative comments directed at Rice included: "Unfollowed. You care more about political correctness than the American people."

The biggest danger for Trump was hinted at in different reports quoting sources that suggest the party might pull organizational or financial support away from him — and redirect resources to legislative races in an effort to save the Senate.

In a clear sign of trouble, senior party officials were not speaking on Trump's behalf this weekend.

Is there a historical precedent for a rebellion like this, at this stage in an election? When asked that question by The Canadian Press, three political historians answered unequivocally.

"Not in the last 150 years," replied Allan Lichtman of American University. He said the closest comparisons he could think of were the smaller group of lawmakers who didn't endorse 1964 Republican nominee Barry Goldwater or 1972 Democratic nominee George McGovern. "But nothing like this," he said.

Michael Kazin of Georgetown University agreed this differs from the 1964 and 1972 cases. He said the holdouts then announced their decision long before October. He noted that both candidates lost in historic landslides.

Trump is not expected to suffer anything like those routs. He's behind in the polls, but he continues to have support from Republican base voters and more than 40 per cent of the general electorate.

Another political historian said what's unique in this election year is the late-campaign rebellion.

Margaret O'Mara of the University of Washington said the closest similarities occurred before the Civil War. She said parties were more fluid back then, with new ones popping up during campaigns. Also, Abraham Lincoln's successor Andrew Johnson was abandoned by the Republican party while he was in office, although he wasn't a Republican himself.

But this is different, she said.

"I cannot think of an October Surprise of this variety in modern memory, perhaps ever."

Alexander Panetta, The Canadian Press

https://ca.news.yahoo.com/stampede-republicans-abandon-trump-historic-233837450.html

 

[Cracket]

And by definition, undecided voters don't think that Bill Clinton is a rapist or that Hillary is an email traitor or that they need a wall or extreme vetting or tax cuts for billionaires. Those issues don't move the undecided voters.

As someone who is registered independent, I don't think you are really speaking for undecideds. No matter how you cut it, Trump managed to hit her hard on deleting emails, the softball "Abraham Lincoln" comparison she tossed Trump on the public vs private question and Trump calling her out on not personally funding her campaign despite being rich herself.

 

[sshakir411]

And you're just repeating CNN/DNC's talking points. Race and partisan politics division increased under Obama. Trump only came in the picture last year with a rhetoric about immigrant laws being enforced.

Wikileaks email dumps revealed today his DoJ colluded with Clinton camp on email releases. The stench of corruption in the current administration is damning.

You really need to be joking if you say Trump hasn't divided this country further, please take a look at his rallies.

 

[sshakir411]

heck even Republicans have never been so divided, let alone rest of America

 

[AlphaFighter]

As someone who is registered independent, I don't think you are really speaking for undecideds. No matter how you cut it, Trump managed to hit her hard on deleting emails, the softball "Abraham Lincoln" comparison she tossed Trump on the public vs private question and Trump calling her out on not personally funding her campaign despite being rich herself.

Not sure how he managed to hit her hard, most online polls have her winning the second debate as well by a comfortable margin. However the verdict also is that she should have done much more and should have really gone after him and finished him given the circumstances he came in. But then again maybe they want Trump to be the presidential candidate for the Republican party till the very end.

 

[Cracket]

heck even Republicans have never been so divided, let alone rest of America

GoPe trying to resist the populist? You don't say. DNC crushed the populist on their side. RNC is trying the same, GoPe, Bush Type republicans are fine with Hillary (which says a lot about who she will benefit). Trump fights back.

 

[Junaids]

As someone who is registered independent, I don't think you are really speaking for undecideds. No matter how you cut it, Trump managed to hit her hard on deleting emails, the softball "Abraham Lincoln" comparison she tossed Trump on the public vs private question and Trump calling her out on not personally funding her campaign despite being rich herself.

With respect, I think you are getting confused between the terms "undecided" (which you are not) and "independent" (which you are). Please bear in mind when reading this that I am no fan of either Clinton.

This is how I see the US Political landscape:

Republican supporters: 35% (25 supporting Trump, 10 opposing him)
Democrat supporters: 35% (35 supporting Clinton, many of them reluctantly).
Rabid isolationist / anti-free trade independents, mainly without a College degree: 10% (all supporting Trump)
Genuine undecided voters: 15%
Racist sexist rednecks: 5% (all Trump voters)

This means that Trump has a hardcore locked in vote of 40%, while Clinton has a locked-in vote of 45%.

But the problem for Trump is that the remaining 15% of voters are not energized by "Lock Her Up", "Build A Wall", "Benghazi" or "emails". They have heard those mantras coming out of Trump's mouth for the last year, and it doesn't move them. If they cared about Benghazi or emails they'd already be Trump voters. And half of those 15% are women.

The issues on which you think that Trump "hit her hard" will certainly have energized his base of guaranteed voters. But I don't think that the undecided 15% were remotely impressed or influenced. They see an election between two candidates whom they despise and do not respect.

That 15% who are still undecided now are a fascinating group. If they all stay at home, the election is too close to call.

But they won't all stay at home. And the ones who do vote are likely to vote on the basis of what they dislike and want to avoid, rather than what they like.

That's why I thought that Clinton's worst answers were about the Supreme Court and renewable energy - she managed to alienate some "soft Republicans" there, who might otherwise have voted for her like George H Bush will. It was the perfect time to implement her "two messages for two audiences" mantra and keep her mouth shut about the Supreme Court. Yet instead she scared off a significant number of anti-Trump Republicans.

And I think that all of Trump's aggression and name calling and insults - including on emails and Abraham Lincoln - actually did him more harm than good with those undecided voters. Yes, he electrified his base. But he alienated moderate, educated voters who dislike both candidates, and who have decided that now they will only cast a vote to keep out a bullying, ignorant, overgrown schoolboy from the Presidency.

Both candidates leave me cold. But the stunts which impress Trump rallies do the opposite with Middle America.

 

[Pakistanian]

And you're just repeating CNN/DNC's talking points. Race and partisan politics division increased under Obama. Trump only came in the picture last year with a rhetoric about immigrant laws being enforced.

Wikileaks email dumps revealed today his DoJ colluded with Clinton camp on email releases. The stench of corruption in the current administration is damning.

Trump is not the solution, he's mentally deranged. I'd much rather prefer Paul Ryan or Mitt Romney over Trump & Clinton, but in a contest between the two, Hillary is the lesser of two evils and Pakistanians know well about the treachery of Hillary and her Drone Wars.

 

[Pakistanian]

Someone hasn't read Clinton Cash. Bill was paid huge sums to speak while Hillary provided favors in State Depts. Ask Ericsson's ex-Ceo, lol.

Clintons are trash but way better than Trump. A Brown person supporting Trump is just deluded and acting like an Uncle Tom. Trump is no fan of Indians, he'll stop all the H1Bs and student visas to make America great again.

 

[Junaids]

Trump is not the solution, he's mentally deranged. I'd much rather prefer Paul Ryan or Mitt Romney over Trump & Clinton, but in a contest between the two, Hillary is the lesser of two evils and Pakistanians know well about the treachery of Hillary and her Drone Wars.

I'm not Pakistani, so I don't understand what you find so egregious about the drone warfare.

It strikes me that conventional Democrat and Republican foreign policy is fairly similar.

Much of the mess that has to be cleaned up comes from having invented and supported the Mujahideen in Afghanistan in the 1980s and 1990s on the basis of their anti-Soviet actions - which I can understand even though it seems stupid now - with little attention to their inherent nutjob extremism, now combined with their patronage by elements of the Pakistani military establishment. And that is combined with the effect of a major ally spreading Wahabi exteremism.

I'm not sure what else you think an American government now could do? We in the west hold much of the original responsibility for our leaders letting these cancers take root two decades ago, but are we supposed to just let ourselves get consumed by them now?

I'm not really on Obama's side of politics, but I think that he has managed this issue fairly sensitively and cautiously. In terms of nutjob extremism he inherited a mess, and hasn't made it worse.

 

[Saeed]

Trump is not the solution, he's mentally deranged. I'd much rather prefer Paul Ryan or Mitt Romney over Trump & Clinton, but in a contest between the two, Hillary is the lesser of two evils and Pakistanians know well about the treachery of Hillary and her Drone Wars.

It is Pakistanis or Pakistani, not Pakistanian. Your username is wrong too.

 

[Cracket]

[MENTION=291]junaid[/MENTION] - Interesting analysis. Yeah these are two candidates with high unlikeables. Yet I think Trump will lead among undecideds simply due to Trump being the underdog and change candidate in the end.

Wikileaks Potesta emails confirm HRC/Media pushed Trump in the primaries precisely because they thought he would be easy to beat in the General. The plan from the start was to oust him as the bigot candidate and win a close race.

https://wikileaks.org/podesta-emails/emailid/4664

I think maybe the people are just waking up and want out of this game.

 

[Cracket]

FOX also did a scoop with Marc Turi. Obama/Clinton's gun runner in Libya. Damning interview.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...at-on-libya-operation-to-protect-clinton.html

 

[anuk]

[MENTION=291]junaid[/MENTION] - Interesting analysis. Yeah these are two candidates with high unlikeables. Yet I think Trump will lead among undecideds simply due to Trump being the underdog and change candidate in the end.

Wikileaks Potesta emails confirm HRC/Media pushed Trump in the primaries precisely because they thought he would be easy to beat in the General. The plan from the start was to oust him as the bigot candidate and win a close race.

https://wikileaks.org/podesta-emails/emailid/4664

I think maybe the people are just waking up and want out of this game.

do u really think trump can pull it off?

the lastest round of wikileaks is getting absolutely no coverage at all. i'm amazed at how corrupt hillary is and how little it's being covered.

 

[Saeed]

New Jersey Congressional Candidate’s Home Vandalized With Swastikas
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/peter-jacob-vandalism_us_57fd1b2ee4b0e655eab7cc3f?section=&

Trump's boys vandalizing property now. Whatever happened to the constitution that they hide behind.

 

[majiz]

Clintons are trash but way better than Trump.

anyone who thinks this has been effectively played by the media's bias, simple as that. trump hasn't done anything wrong, his tounge is a bit loose big deal, hillary takes money off saudi arabia and supplies them with arms whilst knowing full well they fund ISIS (admits to this in latest wikileaks)

 

[Cracket]

do u really think trump can pull it off?

the lastest round of wikileaks is getting absolutely no coverage at all. i'm amazed at how corrupt hillary is and how little it's being covered.

He'll win, lol. The media/DNC/GoPe are this desperate to bury Trump just shows their internal polling is not looking as good as they would like.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

anyone who thinks this has been effectively played by the media's bias, simple as that. trump hasn't done anything wrong, his tounge is a bit loose big deal, hillary takes money off saudi arabia and supplies them with arms whilst knowing full well they fund ISIS (admits to this in latest wikileaks)

What makes you think any of that would change if Trump was elected?

 

[anuk]

What makes you think any of that would change if Trump was elected?

we don't. he could very well turn out to be as corrupt as hillary.

but knowing what we know it's almost impossible to vote for hillary.

 

[Pakistanian]

we don't. he could very well turn out to be as corrupt as hillary.

but knowing what we know it's almost impossible to vote for hillary.

They're all part of the establishment, they all will do what their masters tell them.

 

[siddharth]

Every Indian and Pakistani immigrants who got the ''citizenship'' hates immigrants on job visa.and supports Trump.. How very nice of you..

 

[James]

Polls can be useless. Look at the 2015 UK election, and then the Brexit vote. It depends on who is being polled doesn't it?

I watched the Channel 4 documentary about Trump's chances of winning (quite an anti-Trump documentary in its tone and presentation) - and the top Trump impersonator who makes his living travelling the US wearing a Donald mask said that if you engage the masses on the ground in an open and honest dialogue - regardless of the "opinion polls", and away from the hand-picked people who BBC / CNBC choose to interview - it quickly becomes clear that Trump is gonna get heaps upon heaps of votes.

There is also the chance of the 'Closet Tory' effect from 2015 repeating itself, wherein the majority of people always planned to vote for the "nasty" Conservative Party but were too morally ashamed to admit it to the pollsters.

It will be a very close election IMO.

 

[siddharth]

Polls can be useless. Look at the 2015 UK election, and then the Brexit vote. It depends on who is being polled doesn't it?

I watched the Channel 4 documentary about Trump's chances of winning (quite an anti-Trump documentary in its tone and presentation) - and the top Trump impersonator who makes his living travelling the US wearing a Donald mask said that if you engage the masses on the ground in an open and honest dialogue - regardless of the "opinion polls", and away from the hand-picked people who BBC / CNBC choose to interview - it quickly becomes clear that Trump is gonna get heaps upon heaps of votes.

There is also the chance of the 'Closet Tory' effect from 2015 repeating itself, wherein the majority of people always planned to vote for the "nasty" Conservative Party but were too morally ashamed to admit it to the pollsters.

It will be a very close election IMO.

Exactly my thoughts...

 

[Junaids]

Polls can be useless. Look at the 2015 UK election, and then the Brexit vote. It depends on who is being polled doesn't it?

I watched the Channel 4 documentary about Trump's chances of winning (quite an anti-Trump documentary in its tone and presentation) - and the top Trump impersonator who makes his living travelling the US wearing a Donald mask said that if you engage the masses on the ground in an open and honest dialogue - regardless of the "opinion polls", and away from the hand-picked people who BBC / CNBC choose to interview - it quickly becomes clear that Trump is gonna get heaps upon heaps of votes.

There is also the chance of the 'Closet Tory' effect from 2015 repeating itself, wherein the majority of people always planned to vote for the "nasty" Conservative Party but were too morally ashamed to admit it to the pollsters.

It will be a very close election IMO.

I just can't agree with this.

Especially as in the last 24 hours Trump has gone to war against his own supposed party.

I am pretty sure that I'm watching a remake of The Manchurian Candidate, in which a person has been programmed to unconsciously act for another side. Trump's combination of a mediocre IQ combined with incredible narcissism and a very thin skin and bullying personality actually make him remarkably easy to control in such a way.

I know that the prevailing wisdom is that if he is a Manchurian Candidate he is being controlled by the Russian mafia/Putin. But I disagree.

I think he is being manipulated and manoeuvred into doing what the Democratic Party wants him to do, and he isn't smart enough to restrain his instincts.

 

[Cracket]

I just can't agree with this.

Especially as in the last 24 hours Trump has gone to war against his own supposed party.

I am pretty sure that I'm watching a remake of The Manchurian Candidate, in which a person has been programmed to unconsciously act for another side. Trump's combination of a mediocre IQ combined with incredible narcissism and a very thin skin and bullying personality actually make him remarkably easy to control in such a way.

I know that the prevailing wisdom is that if he is a Manchurian Candidate he is being controlled by the Russian mafia/Putin. But I disagree.

I think he is being manipulated and manoeuvred into doing what the Democratic Party wants him to do, and he isn't smart enough to restrain his instincts.

I disagree entirely. Trump knows exactly what he is doing. Most of it boils down to Syria. He has taken a position of not continuing the fight against Assad and Russia, going against 99.99% of D.C. Beltway. He is not saying this outright, and kind of danced around it in the debate, but in case you had not notice, the U.S. is desperate to initiate some kind of conflict against Russia as a pretext to escalate the fight against Assad in Syria.

CNN has basically become into RT.com for the White House now but even they are admitting this:
http://www.cnn.com/2016/10/12/politics/us-russia-tensions-cold-war/index.html

The amount of dirt that is being revealed from Clinton's emails is astounding. Trashing Evangelical Christians, blatant collusion with NYTimes...FOX is already talking about it and sooner or later the rest of MSM will be forced to bring this to the front. I feel if this Christian trashing gains traction, Clinton campaign is all but dead.

I also don't see how Trump is a narcissist. He comes across as genuine and real. Clinton is the one who is always rehearsed and fake.