The recipe for disaster, Pakistan's current T20 batting lineup is just too pedestrian for an explosive format

[Rana]

wheres mohamad haris gone, the only top order player to play aggressively all the time

haris and saim should open every game, if they get out early riz or babar come in and play like openers any way, but if they get a good start pak would be in a great position

alas pak have insecurity of losing wickets, and ull never win anything worrying about your weaknesses before trying to prioritise aggression

Says the guy who laughs when I said you need Fakhar and Sharjeel to open

Another one who says things when it’s conveniently right to say so!

 

[Rana]

What about all the other names I mentioned? They all bat in the top 3 mate. That's practically the definition of an anchor. And thank you for mentioning Nissanka. I had missed him in that list.

Can you tag me where you mentioned names?

I wanna see this list of yours and make sure you are not misguiding people

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Having am anchor is fine, just letting you know. But having 5 anchors?

1) Babar
2) Rizwan
3) Shadab
4) Chacha
5) Irfan Khan

^^ All these are anchors in the team. And that's too much.

Chacha: 29 avg + 129Sr
Shadab: 18avg + 137 sr( Low for where he bats)
Rizwan: 49 Avg( inflated) + 122-126 SR
Babar: 42 avg(inflated) + 129 SR

How many anchors do you want?

Heck in 2022 the team you praised we had shan lol.

In what world are Shadab, Irfan and Chacha anchors? Anchors don't bat at 5-7 bro. I think you maybe need to understand what an anchor actually is before having this debate.

Their numbers are not great for someone batting in that position, but they are not anchors.

 

[shaz619]

Why is Umar Akmal not playing, am sure he scored a FC hundred in the recent season; he still got it, Umar can be slotted anywhere in the line up.

 

[mominsaigol]

This was Misbah’s mission all along

I’m surprised Imam didn’t make it into this side

Just to show

Avg of 49 and sr of 122 means rizwan averages 49 of 40 deliveries in t20 as an opener.

How is that okay? That's nearly 7 overs and scoring just 9 more runs then the ball count?

With babars avg of 42 and 129 sr that's an avg of 42 per 32 balls in every game

Collectively that means 72 balls and 91 runs scored?

So in 12 overs we get 91 runs. With chacha added that's another 29 runs of 29 of 22.

So that's 94 balls and 120 runs scored.

Now to top it off with shadab 18 runs of 12 deliveries putting it 106 balls 138 runs scored.

So in every game, nearly 18 overs played and 138 runs scored max? Like bro .

BTW if we factor In their wc sr, then that means every 72 balls, Babar and rizwan score 80 runs,

So in world cups, every 18 overs were averaging a score of 127?

 

[mominsaigol]

In what world are Shadab, Irfan and Chacha anchors? Anchors don't bat at 5-7 bro. I think you maybe need to understand what an anchor actually is before having this debate.

Their numbers are not great for someone batting in that position, but they are not anchors.

Well ask Pakistan why you'd have people who average a sr of 129 bat at no 6.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Bro I asked you to list them, cause I wanted to know which players we were going to discuss.

And it's fine if you think I'm wrong, that's AlrightE, I'm just discussing.

2022 wc was beyond lucky that's the thing. SA had beaten Zimbabwe but due to rain they didn't get an extra point and we had to rely on Nedtherlands beating sa to qualify, it also doesn't help that babar and rizwan didn't do a damn thing in the whole tournament minus the nz game.

2021 was a good tournament yes, no question, but this isn't the 2021 team.

Smith, Shai hope, Ibrahim zardan are beyond awful players atm, Smith did nothing even in wc 2023 and was a passenger in the side, the Smith of 2015 is gone and he'll likely get dropped anyway. England is also down in the water and aren't going anywhere atm. Malan was always a crappy replacement for Roy, hales, Bairstow and butler lol.

You've literally listed the weakest links in teams who are either passengers or don't contribute, with the exception of malan once in a blue moon, but public UK sentiment is that he's a massive thorn in the side, Yet you're putting babar and rizwan on a high pedestal?

Only player who's good on this list is Williamson but

A) His left foot is 10x better then babar and rizwan, his stats aren't inflated like Bobby and rizzu, let me repeat this is not 2021 Bobby. And even Williamson is a weak link considering rachin and mitchell are batting. Secondly he's a specialist captain, and very very good captain 100x superior to Bobby as a captain, his role is more so that of a specialist captain which is why he plays.

The guys you've listed are weak links, all it established is that babar and rizwan are weaker links.

Oh and South Africa has an anchor too: Reeza Hendricks. Before him it was Bavuma.

 

[Rana]

Just to show

Avg of 49 and sr of 122 means rizwan averages 49 of 40 deliveries in t20 as an opener.

How is that okay? That's nearly 7 overs and scoring just 9 more runs then the ball count?

With babars avg of 42 and 129 sr that's an avg of 42 per 32 balls in every game

Collectively that means 72 balls and 91 runs scored?

So in 12 overs we get 91 runs. With chacha added that's another 29 runs of 29 of 22.

So that's 94 balls and 120 runs scored.

Now to top it off with shadab 18 runs of 12 deliveries putting it 106 balls 138 runs scored.

So in every game, nearly 18 overs played and 138 runs scored max? Like bro .

BTW if we factor In their wc sr, then that means every 72 balls, Babar and rizwan score 80 runs,

So in world cups, every 18 overs were averaging a score of 127?

Elite 4th gear batting bro!

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Well ask Pakistan why you'd have people who average a sr of 129 bat at no 6.

Because they have done well in the PSL where they have struck at much higher rates. Pakistan can't select players from the IPL bro. Shadab and Iftikhar had excellent seasons which is why they are in those positions. Just because a pleyer has played a certain way in the past doesn't mean they will play like that for the rest of their lives.

 

[mominsaigol]

Oh and South Africa has an anchor too: Reeza Hendricks. Before him it was Bavuma.

Bavuma is the weakest link in sa too.

Idkw you're listing weak links and calling them anchors, you've literally listed the worst players in each set up minus Williamson .

But you're using that to justify babar and rizwan as goats, I don't get your argument

 

[mominsaigol]

Because they have done well in the PSL where they have struck at much higher rates. Pakistan can't select players from the IPL bro. Shadab and Iftikhar had excellent seasons which is why they are in those positions. Just because a pleyer has played a certain way in the past doesn't mean they will play like that for the rest of their lives. Gosh, I don't get why that's so hard to understand.

Brother PSL is a poor standard because azam Khan strikes at 171 but in international he gets dismissed easily with a current avg of 4.

Shadab has consistently proven to be a psl basher but isn't all that hot in international.

 

[RyanRyan10]

ill show you all the international players who are at the same level as rizwan and babar you tell me are any of them world class?

these are all players with a very excellent average 40+ like rizwan and babar and the same strike rate as rizwan and babar View attachment 143308

MTMMJ Ave is the GOAT

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Can you tag me where you mentioned names?

I wanna see this list of yours and make sure you are not misguiding people

I'll list them again.

New Zealand has Kane Williamson. England have Malan. Australia have Steve Smith. South Africa have Reeza Hendricks. West Indies have Shai Hope. Afghanistan have Ibrahim Zadran. Bangladesh have Shanto. Go and look at all these players and their numbers and tell me that they are better than Babar and Rizwan.

 

[Hitman]

The thing I like about Rizwan is that the guy has a tendency of performing under pressure.

 

[ElRaja]

Says the guy who laughs when I said you need Fakhar and Sharjeel to open

Another one who says things when it’s conveniently right to say so!

just cos you have an unhealthy obsession with an overweight long past it out of form fixer doesn't mean pak cannot have another aggressive batsman up top, think for the team, not for individuals.

 

[Statpadder Inc]

The thing I like about Rizwan is that the guy has a tendency of performing under pressure.

You are surely trolling @Hitman ji

 

[Rana]

just cos you have an unhealthy obsession with an overweight long past it out of form fixer doesn't mean pak cannot have another aggressive batsman up top, think for the team, not for individuals.

There you go.

*Mask off, mask off*

Great tune

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Brother PSL is a poor standard because azam Khan strikes at 171 but in international he gets dismissed easily with a current avg of 4.

Shadab has consistently proven to be a psl basher but isn't all that hot in international.

Then what should be the standard? The National T20 Cup? You keep pointing out alot of problems but have nothing in the way of a solution. What will players be selected on if not PSL and T20 leagues?

Nobody said Shadab is the second coming of Gary Sobers. But remind me again, who was it that came out and smacked Nortje, Rabada and Ngidi all over the SCG in that do or die 2022 T20 World Cup against South Africa? Shadab could have been player of the tournament in the last T20 World Cup had Pakistan won. That's how great a tournament he had. And he was player of the tournament in this year's PSL. So I guess maybe you need to look at stats a little differently too.

 

[mominsaigol]

Elite 4th gear batting bro!

In 2022 t20 wc this was the stats of our main batting order as fakhar was discarded for shan.

Rizwan: 25 avg 109 sr
Babar: 17 avg 93 sr
Shan: 25 avg 118 sr
Chacha: 16 avg 122 sr
Shadab: 14 avg 168 St
Haris: 24 avg 144 sr
Nawaz: 9 avg 106 sr

So basically in a nutshell average is

Rizwan: 25 of 22
Babar: 17 of 18
Shan: 25 of 21
Chacha: 16 of 13
Shafab: 14 of 9
Haris: 24 of 16
Nawaz: 9 of 8.

So basically every game that's 107 balls bowled and only 130 runs scored courtesy of haris inflating this number, without haris, we are sitting at 91 balls bowled and only 106 runs scored, so 106 of 15.1 overs with 6 wickets down.

^^ This was the avg of 2022 wc batting line up and people call this a goat team because they reached a final.

I repeat avg of 15 overs, 106 runs of 6 wicket down, without haris inflating the number .

Even with haris included it's 107 balls bowled 130 for 7 lol.

 

[PakEngFan]

ill show you all the international players who are at the same level as rizwan and babar you tell me are any of them world class?

these are all players with a very excellent average 40+ like rizwan and babar and the same strike rate as rizwan and babar View attachment 143308

Hahah. Brainless stuff according to this Germany players are as good as Babar. The definition of blind hate.

 

[emranabbas]

I'm not exactly sure what you are trying to prove here. Especially when I listed the anchor in every international T20I team except India. Yeah, I guess these guys might be good players in their respective associate division. But their numbers have zero bearing here. Before being an anchor in international cricket is a different challenge altorgther.

the point is whats the point in having such a big average and pile up runs at snail pace rate

no world class players have such a big average and such a small strike rate its only babar an rizwan even the anchors you have mentioned

world class players don't like like that in t20

 

[emranabbas]

Oh and South Africa has an anchor too: Reeza Hendricks. Before him it was Bavuma.

bavuma and hendricks don't waste balls if they cant do it they dont block anyone else from doing it either

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Bavuma is the weakest link in sa too.

Idkw you're listing weak links and calling them anchors, you've literally listed the worst players in each set up minus Williamson .

But you're using that to justify babar and rizwan as goats, I don't get your argument

Then why do they keep playing T20Is bro? Why do they keep getting selected? Are you saying that every T20I team except India is just out of their mind? Why do they keep selecting an anchor? These guys were all playing the last completed T20I for their respective countries.

Since you can't answer, I'll go. Maybe its because they want someone who may not necessarily score quickly but be there to play a big innings that adds something to the team's score if the hitters go missing. Which is something that is highly likely when you play a high-risk brand of cricket.

 

[IndoorCricket]

Ozzies, England, WI and SA have explosive teams. Subcontinent teams lacking in this format. Good thing is Pakistan has one of the better bowling units for this format.

 

[mominsaigol]

In 2022 t20 wc this was the stats of our main batting order as fakhar was discarded for shan.

Rizwan: 25 avg 109 sr
Babar: 17 avg 93 sr
Shan: 25 avg 118 sr
Chacha: 16 avg 122 sr
Shadab: 14 avg 168 St
Haris: 24 avg 144 sr
Nawaz: 9 avg 106 sr

So basically in a nutshell average is

Rizwan: 25 of 22
Babar: 17 of 18
Shan: 25 of 21
Chacha: 16 of 13
Shafab: 14 of 9
Haris: 24 of 16
Nawaz: 9 of 8.

So basically every game that's 107 balls bowled and only 130 runs scored courtesy of haris inflating this number, without haris, we are sitting at 91 balls bowled and only 106 runs scored, so 106 of 15.1 overs with 6 wickets down.

^^ This was the avg of 2022 wc batting line up and people call this a goat team because they reached a final.

I repeat avg of 15 overs, 106 runs of 6 wicket down, without haris inflating the number .

Even with haris included it's 107 balls bowled 130 for 7 lol.

@RedwoodOriginal ^^ This was the overall average for our t20 2022 wc batting line up

17.5 overs, 130 for 7.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

bavuma and hendricks don't waste balls if they cant do it they block anyone else from doing it either

Hendricks has an average of 29 and a SR of 130.

 

[mominsaigol]

Then why do they keep playing T20Is bro? Why do they keep getting selected? Are you saying that every T20I team except India is just out of their mind? Why do they keep selecting an anchor? These guys were all playing the last completed T20I for their respective countries.

Since you can't answer, I'll go. Maybe its because they want someone who may not necessarily score quickly but be there to play a big innings that adds something to the team's score if the hitters go missing. Which is something that is highly likely when you play a high-risk brand of cricket.

For different reasons.

Bavuma is a gun captain so is Williamson, their needed for other qualities.

Smith is their because their hoping he can replicate his aggressive 2015 era which sadly is misconceived.

Malan was added due to bairstow, Roy, hales etc fizzing out.

 

[Rana]

Hahah. Brainless stuff according to this Germany players are as good as Babar. The definition of blind hate.

He added a statistic from cricinfo

If Babar is going to be celebrated as a great captain after overtaking Brian Masaba…then this counts as well

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

For different reasons.

Bavuma is a gun captain so is Williamson, their needed for other qualities.

Smith is their because their hoping he can replicate his aggressive 2015 era which sadly is misconceived.

Malan was added due to bairstow, Roy, hales etc fizzing out.

LMAO. There you go with your mental gymnastics again. And you didn't even justify all the players on that list lol.

Replicate 2015? you think anyone in Australian cricket even remembers that far back lol

 

[RyanRyan10]

He added a statistic from cricinfo

If Babar is going to be celebrated as a great captain after overtaking Brian Masaba…then this counts as well

Manish Pandey has better average than Babar Azam and he doesn't even make it to the IPL XI

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

For different reasons.

Bavuma is a gun captain so is Williamson, their needed for other qualities.

Smith is their because their hoping he can replicate his aggressive 2015 era which sadly is misconceived.

Malan was added due to bairstow, Roy, hales etc fizzing out.

And no, you're wrong obviously. All these players are there because they are anchors who have a high probability of delivering an innings that the rest of the team can build around. Which is why their low strike rates are tolerated and why they play at the top of the order.

 

[mominsaigol]

LMAO. There you go with your mental gymnastics again. And you didn't even justify all the players on that list lol.

Replicate 2015? you think anyone in Australian cricket even remembers that far back lol

Yes they do because Smith on 2015 had better numbers then kohli and was the primary reason for a victory in wc especially when he scored a 70 ball 100 against india

 

[mominsaigol]

And no, you're wrong obviously. All these players are there because they are anchors who have a high probability of delivering an innings that the rest of the team can build around. Which is why their low strike rates are tolerated and why they play at the top of the order.

So you're saying Steven Smith a guy who was a passenger in 2023 Australian 11, failed in the recent t20 series against NZ as an opener, has a HIGH PROBABILITY of delivering an innings that the rest of the team can build around.

And don't say I'm ratting, you yourself said ALL THESE PLAYERS

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

So you're saying Steven Smith a guy who was a passenger in 2023 Australian 11, failed in the recent t20 series against NZ as an opener, has a HIGH PROBABILITY of delivering an innings that the rest of the team can build around.

And don't say I'm ratting, you yourself said ALL THESE PLAYERS

No. I'm saying that ALL THESE PLAYERS are there because they are playing an anchor role where they are told to go out there and play an innings the team can build around. Since Smith has done that numerous times in ODIs, the belief is probably that he can do so in T20s too.

If teams really believed what you think they believe then every team except Pakistan would be selecting hitters up and down the order. But taht isnt the case is it?

 

[mominsaigol]

No. I'm saying that ALL THESE PLAYERS are there because they are playing an anchor role where they are told to go out there and play an innings the team can build around. Since Smith has done that numerous times in ODIs, the belief is probably that he can do so in T20s too.

No you said they all have a high probability of delivering. Read your og statement.

Belief and high probability are 2 separate things.

As for Smith, he's their because in 2015 he use to strike and bat better then kohli even, dude was smashing 40 ball 50's and 70 ball 100's in odi.

Australia want him to come back to that form but he's clearly unable to. He'll most likely be dropped soon. The nz t20 series was his final test to make a mark and he failed at it. They'll have Warner(his final wc) and head open, Smith is done in t20.

 

[Rana]

I'll list them again.

New Zealand has Kane Williamson. England have Malan. Australia have Steve Smith. South Africa have Reeza Hendricks. West Indies have Shai Hope. Afghanistan have Ibrahim Zadran. Bangladesh have Shanto. Go and look at all these players and their numbers and tell me that they are better than Babar and Rizwan.

Ok, will take this one by one.

1. Let’s not stoop so low to justify 2 anchors (Babar and Rizwan) to OPEN the innings in T20 because Afghanistan use Zadran and Bangladesh use Shanto. Please, with all due respect….please no.

2. Kane Williamson at number 3, NO PROBLEM AT All.

3. Malan does not OPEN for England. They will open with Jos Butler and Phil Salt. Malan will probably bat at three. No issues with that either.

4. Steven Smith will not OPEN for Australia. If he still makes their side/XI, he will bat at 3 or 4. That’s Australia’s headache but personally I recon he won’t make their starting XI.

5. West Indies will slot Shai Hope at number 4. Their current crop of openers is Brandon King, Johnson Charles, Kyle Mayers and maybe even Nicholas Pooran. Shai Hope at 4 is perfect to give them balance and calm amidst the madness. He won’t OPEN

6. South Africa have a serious problem when it comes to balancing their side to meet the quota system, which significantly hinders them. As such, they play either Temba Bavuma or Reza Hendricks in the side to open or bat top 3. QDQ is their gaurenteed opener on merit. Besides this, they still have an ELITE middle to lower middle order of Klaasen, Miller, Markram, Jansen…let’s not forget Tristan Stubbs and Dewald Brevis who are also coming through the ranks and will slot in very soon. That makes it 1 player who strikes it at 130 (either Temba or Reza), and then 6 dynamic players to cause serious damage.

So, I hope that kind of makes it clear to you that the argument we who HATE Babar or Rizwan opening or both of them in the top 3 are making is that NO, NO ONE who is serious about competing are setting up with these kind of players, 2 of them in their top 3!

 

[PakEngFan]

Manish Pandey has better average than Babar Azam and he doesn't even make it to the IPL XI

Narine is opening in IPL and is having success. Enough said about IPL. I can play the same game too.

 

[RyanRyan10]

Narine is opening in IPL and is having success. Enough said about IPL. I can play the same game too.

Alright, Manish Pandey is a gun T20 batter. I apologize for undermining him.

 

[emranabbas]

Narine is opening in IPL and is having success. Enough said about IPL. I can play the same game too.

manish pandey average quoted are from t20i not IPL, he's saying players like babar dont make the indian team or ipl thats how rubbish he is

 

[mominsaigol]

nothing brainless, only thing brainless is you who is unable to understand simple stats

babar and rizwan are nowhere near the likes of rohit sharma, virat kohli, maxwell, warner, etc...
they are in the same league as j van heerden of germany and j coatzee of thailand from their playing style

He claimed babar makes it in the Indian team ahead of sheryas iyer and I'm the brainless one .

But then again I might be wrong, after all babar was clearly playing a goat innings yesterday against A string NZ, ofcourse I had to plug in my ps5 and control him in ashes.

OH wait we're talking about the real game, we'll can't plug my controller in now can I?

 

[Rana]

Narine is opening in IPL and is having success. Enough said about IPL. I can play the same game too.

Share your stats here, I’ll get you into the IPL auction next year

 

[PakEngFan]

Alright, Manish Pandey is a gun T20 batter. I apologize for undermining him.

And narine is better than all the greats. As I said I can play the same game.

 

[PakEngFan]

nothing brainless, only thing brainless is you who is unable to understand simple stats

babar and rizwan are nowhere near the likes of rohit sharma, virat kohli, maxwell, warner, etc...
they are in the same league as j van heerden of germany and j coatzee of thailand from their playing style

You proved my point again.

 

[PakEngFan]

manish pandey average quoted are from t20i not IPL, he's saying players like babar dont make the indian team or ipl thats how rubbish he is

But narine can open in IPL and score a century. Pakistanis and bending over for Indians. Something never changes.

 

[PakEngFan]

Share your stats here, I’ll get you into the IPL auction next year

When did I say I can IPL?

 

[emranabbas]

He claimed babar makes it in the Indian team ahead of sheryas iyer and I'm the brainless one .

But then again I might be wrong, after all babar was clearly playing a goat innings yesterday against A string NZ, ofcourse I had to plug in my ps5 and control him in ashes.

OH wait we're talking about the real game, we'll can't plug my controller in now can I?

i wouldn't be surprised if he had said rizwan and babar should open for india ahead of rohit sharma and virat kohli
he's a great example of delusional fan

 

[TeymurBlake]

Lol

Goes on to claim the most popular opinion on this forum and says ‘this won’t be the popular opinion’

Apparently, the guys who criticise your so called popular opinion are the ‘cult’ here.

You wanted Asif Ali to open & captain Pakistan

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

No you said they all have a high probability of delivering. Read your og statement.

Belief and high probability are 2 separate things.

As for Smith, he's their because in 2015 he use to strike and bat better then kohli even, dude was smashing 40 ball 50's and 70 ball 100's in odi.

Australia want him to come back to that form but he's clearly unable to. He'll most likely be dropped soon. The nz t20 series was his final test to make a mark and he failed at it. They'll have Warner(his final wc) and head open, Smith is done in t20.

Well yeah genius. That's what I said. And I say that because practically all of them because probability is based on averages and all of them have the higher averages in their respective teams, as compared to other players. And if they don't have high averages in T20Is, they have high averages in ODIs where they play that anchor role.

Australia and India are the outliers. India has possibly the greatest anchor and most complete batter this format has ever seen in Virat Kohli. And Australia have enough great T20 players where they might not need one. But even they were willing to experiment with an anchor. Why? Because the last time they stacked their team with hitters they got knocked out of the T20 World Cup in the first round in their own backyard.

 

[Rana]

You wanted Asif Ali to open & captain Pakistan

This Pakistan side yes

Anyone but Selfish Babar and his chum Rizwan

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

This Pakistan side yes

Anyone but Selfish Babar and his chum Rizwan

Wow. Now you've lost all credibility in my eyes and I cannot take anything you say seriously. This is just an absolutely laughable thing to say. I don't think that any serious poster here would even contemplate something like this let alone say it.

 

[emranabbas]

But narine can open in IPL and score a century. Pakistanis and bending over for Indians. Something never changes.

we are just stating facts not all of us like to bring in politics into sports, not going to downplay a player just because he's an indian

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Ok, will take this one by one.

1. Let’s not stoop so low to justify 2 anchors (Babar and Rizwan) to OPEN the innings in T20 because Afghanistan use Zadran and Bangladesh use Shanto. Please, with all due respect….please no.

2. Kane Williamson at number 3, NO PROBLEM AT All.

3. Malan does not OPEN for England. They will open with Jos Butler and Phil Salt. Malan will probably bat at three. No issues with that either.

4. Steven Smith will not OPEN for Australia. If he still makes their side/XI, he will bat at 3 or 4. That’s Australia’s headache but personally I recon he won’t make their starting XI.

5. West Indies will slot Shai Hope at number 4. Their current crop of openers is Brandon King, Johnson Charles, Kyle Mayers and maybe even Nicholas Pooran. Shai Hope at 4 is perfect to give them balance and calm amidst the madness. He won’t OPEN

6. South Africa have a serious problem when it comes to balancing their side to meet the quota system, which significantly hinders them. As such, they play either Temba Bavuma or Reza Hendricks in the side to open or bat top 3. QDQ is their gaurenteed opener on merit. Besides this, they still have an ELITE middle to lower middle order of Klaasen, Miller, Markram, Jansen…let’s not forget Tristan Stubbs and Dewald Brevis who are also coming through the ranks and will slot in very soon. That makes it 1 player who strikes it at 130 (either Temba or Reza), and then 6 dynamic players to cause serious damage.

So, I hope that kind of makes it clear to you that the argument we who HATE Babar or Rizwan opening or both of them in the top 3 are making is that NO, NO ONE who is serious about competing are setting up with these kind of players, 2 of them in their top 3!

So you admit that every team except India and Australia has atelast one anchor, which is the point I started out with anyway.

 

[TeymurBlake]

This Pakistan side yes

Anyone but Selfish Babar and his chum Rizwan

Listen, I agree its time for the Babar-Rizwan partnership to break (too much pressure gets put on top/middle order), however going with Asif "200 sixes in nets" Ali is never going to be the answer, but nor is Shan "speaks engurish" Masood the answer.

 

[Rana]

Wow. Now you've lost all credibility in my eyes and I cannot take anything you say seriously. This is just an absolutely laughable thing to say. I don't think that any serious poster here would even contemplate something like this let alone say it.

I’ve lost credibility in your eyes?

Oh no


How will I sleep at night?

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

This Pakistan side yes

Anyone but Selfish Babar and his chum Rizwan

And you say that you don;t have an agenda?

 

[PakEngFan]

we are just stating facts not all of us like to bring in politics into sports, not going to downplay a player just because he's an indian

Facts that narine can play IPL as an opening batsmen but Babar can't get into to IPL. Yeah make sense based on your criteria.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

I’ve lost credibility in your eyes?

Oh no


How will I sleep at night?

I mean ignorance is bliss. So I would guess you will sleep well? The same way you slept when you said Asif Ali should open for Pakistan and captain...sorry I just can't stop laughing about that one

 

[Rana]

So you admit that every team except India and Australia has atelast one anchor, which is the point I started out with anyway.

They have anchors

But no one has two anchors (or Bankers in Australian slang as Wasim understood it) that open the innings or two in the top 3.

Only Pakistan has bankers like that.

 

[Rana]

I mean ignorance is bliss. So I would guess you will sleep well? The same way you slept when you said Asif Ali should open for Pakistan and captain...sorry I just can't stop laughing about that one

Of course you are going to laugh. You being serious means you believing Babar and Rizwan have a 4th gear.

 

[emranabbas]

Facts that narine can play IPL as an opening batsmen but Babar can't get into to IPL. Yeah make sense based on your criteria.

bro put your hand on your heart...
do you think babar can score 100 off 50 balls? hitting 6 sixes and and 14 fours? vs trent boult, ashwin and chahal?

 

[Rana]

bro put your hand on your heart...
do you think babar can score 100 off 50 balls? hitting 6 sixes and and 14 fours? vs trent boult, ashwin and chahal?

He can in InMyDreams Premier League

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

They have anchors

But no one has two anchors (or Bankers in Australian slang as Wasim understood it) that open the innings or two in the top 3.

Only Pakistan has bankers like that.

You dad humor is as lame as it is unfunny.

The last time Australia stacked their batting with hitters they lost by 89 runs to New Zealand in the opening game of the 2022 World Cup.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Of course you are going to laugh. You being serious means you believing Babar and Rizwan have a 4th gear.

What does your level of seriousness look like? Asif Ali as captain?

 

[Rana]

You dad humor is as lame as it is unfunny.

The last time Australia stacked their batting with hitters they lost by 89 runs to New Zealand in the opening game of the 2022 World Cup.

Well that’s a strong argument isn’t it?

A team stacked with Batsman were D’d by Fin Allen…who absolutely SLAUGHTERED Pakistan’s bowling attack earlier this year

 

[PakEngFan]

bro put your hand on your heart...
do you think babar can score 100 off 50 balls? hitting 6 sixes and and 14 fours? vs trent boult, ashwin and chahal?

If a tailender like narine can than anyone can. Narine doesn't even have an international 50 lol.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Well that’s a strong argument isn’t it?

A team stacked with Batsman were D’d by Fin Allen…who absolutely SLAUGHTERED Pakistan’s bowling attack earlier this year

No actually they were knocked out of the first round too. Of a World Cup where they were defending champions and where teh tournament was held in their backyard.

But yeah, go ahead and tell me how Asif Ali is going to solve everything as opener and captain

 

[Rana]

No actually they were knocked out of the first round too. Of a World Cup where they were defending champions and where teh tournament was held in their backyard.

But yeah, go ahead and tell me how Asif Ali is going to solve everything as opener and captain

So what are you essentially arguing? Pakistan shouldn’t stack their sides with hitters all the way like Australia because they lost the 2022 World Cup?

 

[RyanRyan10]

And narine is better than all the greats. As I said I can play the same game.

My point was that averages don't have much importance in T20s in the current era. Strike Rate matters more. I wasn't playing any game.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

So what are you essentially arguing? Pakistan shouldn’t stack their sides with hitters all the way like Australia because they lost the 2022 World Cup?

I'm saying that only a bonehead would think that stacking their side with hitters is the way to make a T20 winning World Cup team. Not every pitch in the World Cup is a flat road. Pitches can be far more challenging where batters temperament is tested. Especially in high-pressure matches.

 

[Kroll]

How many finals have these other guys won?

At the end of the day only 2 teams make it there and even getting there is some feat.

This is the problem with todays fanbase, we have accepted and embraced mediocrity, satisfied with reaching milestones and being nearly men. Our aim should always be to win.

 

[MenInG]

Usman Khan is that man....

 

[mominsaigol]

Wow. Now you've lost all credibility in my eyes and I cannot take anything you say seriously. This is just an absolutely laughable thing to say. I don't think that any serious poster here would even contemplate something like this let alone say it.

Are you contemplating it now?

 

[emranabbas]

Usman Khan is that man....

if he plays in the top 3

 

[Rana]

I'm saying that only a bonehead would think that stacking their side with hitters is the way to make a T20 winning World Cup team.

You recon the Aussies, English, West Indians are going to be boneheads stacking their sides with hitters all the way?

 

[Slim]

Another thought has crossed my mind, and I sincerely hope this isn't the situation. Over the past few years, we've seen several openers come and go. My concern is whether Babar and Rizwan are instructing them to go all out while they themselves focus on safeguarding the wicket. It's vital that players are allowed to play their natural game and evolve, rather than being pressured into a specific approach.

This is not only a valid concern but an actual truth. Its always the responsibility of the new player after someone gets out to hit whereas Babar or Rizwan happily take singles because they are self anointed “anchors”. One has to ask why Babar and Rizwan dont want to open in ODI or test but are very defensive about their t20 opening, its because they need maximum time to pad their average. There is no position they both fit in. Garbage t20 players.

 

[MenInG]

if he plays in the top 3

Ah yes

If I play in number 3 position, I magically become someone big.

Yes that old chestnut.

 

[emranabbas]

Ah yes

If I play in number 3 position, I magically become someone big.

Yes that old chestnut.

usman khan does top3 49 outside top3 21 see the difference in the picture you posted

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

You recon the Aussies, English, West Indians are going to be boneheads stacking their sides with hitters all the way?

Any team that doesn't have atleast one anchor in T20I just isn't very smart. Because they are deluding themselves into thinking that they will smash 200+ everytime. Teams with hitters up and down the order can go from 220-6 in one match to 90 all out in the next.

Oh and England have an anchor in Malan. West Indies have an anchor in Shai Hope. Even in Windies most successful World Cup campaigns where they had hitters up and down, they also had guys like Marlon Samuels and Lendl Simmons at the top.

 

[mominsaigol]

Ah yes

If I play in number 3 position, I magically become someone big.

Yes that old chestnut.

Confidence and motivation is a thing. Theirs a reason SA can bazzball to 400 against wc winners but look like minnows and associate while chasing, even losing to nedtherlands 2x and getting bowled out against India for less then a 100 in an odi whike chasing.

Similarly as to why rachin magically clicked as an opener or why Rahul looked a million dollars butchering Pakistan in the middle order but couldn't click as an opener and besides that quick fire 50 and a few one offs was a tail at opening for India for a while.

 

[Slim]

Usman Khan is that man....

Rizwan needs to be dropped for the remaining 2 matches, we need usman at number 3. I doubt it will happen though.