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The Wrestling Discussion Thread

Who saw Paul Heyman’s red tint Rolex matching with his tie? That was beautiful. What a gorgeous watch he has! I want one now
 
Rana said:
Who saw Paul Heyman’s red tint Rolex matching with his tie? That was beautiful. What a gorgeous watch he has! I want one now
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Am going to look out for it, I bet it was paid for with RVD’s wages
 
Rana said:
Watched both nights on repeat.

The Reigns, Rollins and Punk match was brilliant.

That should have been a title match
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I think they should have reversed the two nights and had this match end the event, we got two heel segments in the top spot back to back technically which has never happened before (thanks Papa H, nice way to send the fans home). If the Heyman double cross could be executed differently, I’d have had Punk go over, what a match though for sure one of the best main-events ever at a Mania.
 
And Cena did get cheered but that finish was certainly very cold. I don’t know why Dave can’t rate this 5* now 🤡
 
50x more hyped for this feud than Cena and Cody.

🔥

And then Punk - Cena after. Still crazy how the forever bad guy and good guy are now switched.
 
“You said I can’t wrestle, I don’t have to do, I just have to do this”

Mic goat for a reason.
 
If Randy wins, Cody will probably turn heel. Enough foreshadowing for it. Being a good guy costing him WM, then John pointing out today that the crowd keeps flip flopping on Cody. So once he he sees Randy be champ he will turn and if rock or Fein Fein is still in the picture then ally with them.
 
2005: Cena's first world title
2025: Cena's last world title (possibly)

2005 still feels like yesterday. Time flies so quickly.

 
sweep_shot said:
2005: Cena's first world title
2025: Cena's last world title (possibly)

2005 still feels like yesterday. Time flies so quickly.

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I kind of became emotional thinking about it.

Cena is one of the last guys left from those golden days. Almost all guys from that era have retired. Randy Orton and John Cena are the last two left I believe.
 
shaz619 said:
His gear is actually pretty cool, he was the only one who was allowed to keep the gear which the Sheild wore when they broke up. Roman isn't a genius on the mic but when you have him cut out all the goofyness, limit his mic time, give him no more then a sentence and keep it serious he'd do a pretty decent job and it would only add to his character as a badd-asss similar to the sucess he achieved during a member of the sheild. Anyway, in recent times they have limited his mic time and he is generally serious instead of getting all cosy and that's the way forward with him, the in-ring stuff is bound to improve. I though he did a brilliant Job against Lesnar at wrestlemania, the selling was very good. If he works hard I see no reason why he can't be a good world champion in the future, just needs to get a bit more compatible on the mic and that can happen with time just look at Bryan he wasn't a natural when he first started out.
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Roman ended the question mark on his mic skills a while back. He cooked La Knight at the contract signing and buried Seth and his WHC belt with the “I work less than you, yes” promo which solidified that Roman had left Seth in the dust.

If you remember I was a massive Roman hater around 2021-22, but now I acknowledge the chief.
 
John Cena’s latest dark theme entrance 🤣🤣🤣

This guy just trolling and having fun now.

No coloure, no video package.

All dark screen and just John Cena written 🤣🤣

IMG_0262.png
IMG_0261.png
 
BunnyRabbit said:
I know you don't like Pat McAfee but that Gunther segment was pretty good. I am pretty sure Pat is a better wrestler in ring psychology wise than that bum Logan Paul.
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He is. I thought he did great in NXT when he was involved with Adam Cole and Undisputed Era. Someone like McAfee you can tolerate. Because its not like he is going to beat Gunther or win a belt. Even as a match it'll most likely be 90-10 or 95-5. When people like Logan start winning belts and beating legends though it really hurts the image and perception of the business.
 
Bhaijaan said:
God I don’t want to see Cena vs Orton for the 1056th time
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I want to see Cena vs Orton as Orton is Cena’s biggest rival and not having Cena face Orton in his retirement tour would be idiotic. And I am interested to see the dynamics of heel Cena vs face Orton.

However, I can’t remember Cena and Orton ever having a great or memorable match, unlike some of the other great rivalries in WWE history that produced classic matches, so I am not expecting Cena or Orton to have a great match with each other at this stage of their careers.
 
RedwoodOriginal said:
He is. I thought he did great in NXT when he was involved with Adam Cole and Undisputed Era. Someone like McAfee you can tolerate. Because its not like he is going to beat Gunther or win a belt. Even as a match it'll most likely be 90-10 or 95-5. When people like Logan start winning belts and beating legends though it really hurts the image and perception of the business.
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And Pat is actually a believable wrestler who doesn't weigh 90lbs and can actually work. Even Austin praised his work in NXT.
Logan it appears has something in his contract to be winning majority of his matches. Pat only won against Theory and it was such an awesome match. Logan is simply a spot monkey and has no idea how to work the crowd and his punch is just an unbelievable and weak finisher.
 
The_KING said:
I want to see Cena vs Orton as Orton is Cena’s biggest rival and not having Cena face Orton in his retirement tour would be idiotic. And I am interested to see the dynamics of heel Cena vs face Orton.

However, I can’t remember Cena and Orton ever having a great or memorable match, unlike some of the other great rivalries in WWE history that produced classic matches, so I am not expecting Cena or Orton to have a great match with each other at this stage of their careers.
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Randy is arguably an even better wrestler than he used to be.
 
The_KING said:
I want to see Cena vs Orton as Orton is Cena’s biggest rival and not having Cena face Orton in his retirement tour would be idiotic. And I am interested to see the dynamics of heel Cena vs face Orton.

However, I can’t remember Cena and Orton ever having a great or memorable match, unlike some of the other great rivalries in WWE history that produced classic matches, so I am not expecting Cena or Orton to have a great match with each other at this stage of their careers.
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I liked the first major match they had at SummerSlam 2007. But I totally understand where @Bhaijaan is coming from. This was the forever feud that was done to death between 2009-14. And I also don't recall them having a single good match during this period.

That said, heel Cena and a babyface Orton at the peak of his powers is an absolutely mouthwatering prospect.
 
BunnyRabbit said:
And Pat is actually a believable wrestler who doesn't weigh 90lbs and can actually work. Even Austin praised his work in NXT.
Logan it appears has something in his contract to be winning majority of his matches. Pat only won against Theory and it was such an awesome match. Logan is simply a spot monkey and has no idea how to work the crowd and his punch is just an unbelievable and weak finisher.
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His new finisher is pretty cool though
 
the actual Cena and Orton matches were a lot of em forgettable, yes. But the promos and hype leading up to the actual matches were Stone Cold / Rock levels of heat. They are the Capt America and Iron Man of wwe.

I hope it is an I quit match again and Cena’s streak of never having said I quit ends.
 
Suleiman said:
the actual Cena and Orton matches were a lot of em forgettable, yes. But the promos and hype leading up to the actual matches were Stone Cold / Rock levels of heat. They are the Capt America and Iron Man of wwe.

I hope it is an I quit match again and Cena’s streak of never having said I quit ends.
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But Cena is winning I am pretty sure.
I'd like a Cena Roman feud as well and Cena to finally get a win over Roman.
 
Suleiman said:
I can’t tell if he’s wrestling worse on purpose to feed into the meme that he’s a bad wrestler and trying to look sloppy on purpose.
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He hasn't been wrestled properly since 2019 I think. He does seems slow and even when he was doing his sprint to the ring entrance, he was slower than he used to be. He might regain it the more he wrestles.
 
Suleiman said:
the actual Cena and Orton matches were a lot of em forgettable, yes. But the promos and hype leading up to the actual matches were Stone Cold / Rock levels of heat. They are the Capt America and Iron Man of wwe.

I hope it is an I quit match again and Cena’s streak of never having said I quit ends.
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An 'I Quit' Match should be the blow-off match to a long feud. Not sure if it works here. Plus, absolutely no way Cena is losing right now.
 
Heel John Cena dream opponents list (atleast for me):
  • ̶R̶a̶n̶d̶y̶ ̶O̶r̶t̶o̶n̶
  • CM Punk
  • AJ Styles (they need to run this back)
  • Sami Zayn
  • Roman Reigns
  • Drew McIntyre
  • L.A Knight
  • Gunther
  • Ricky Saints
Would have liked to see KO v Cena again too, but sadly, that may be unlikely because of KO's injury.
 
I love the idea of Bron & Seth v Roman & Punk at Backlash. But I think they atleast need to add a third member to this faction. My guess is that the third member will interfere at Backlash and cost Punk & Roman the match.
 
AKA I thought filming a dance video with my daughters was more important. :kp

B*tch, w*f did you get involved in the first place, if you were "going to take a step back" later?

www.f4wonline.com

WWE News: The Rock says why he wasn’t at WrestleMania

Dwayne “The Rock” Johnson broke his silence as to why he wasn’t part of the build to John Cena and Cody Rhodes’ WWE WrestleMania 41 match and why he didn’t appear at the company’s biggest show of the…
www.f4wonline.com www.f4wonline.com
 
RedwoodOriginal said:
Heel John Cena dream opponents list (atleast for me):
  • ̶R̶a̶n̶d̶y̶ ̶O̶r̶t̶o̶n̶
  • CM Punk
  • AJ Styles (they need to run this back)
  • Sami Zayn
  • Roman Reigns
  • Drew McIntyre
  • L.A Knight
  • Gunther
  • Ricky Saints
Would have liked to see KO v Cena again too, but sadly, that may be unlikely because of KO's injury.
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A feud with LA Knight will be great for the promos but not the matches themselves.
I'd like to throw in Rey's name there too considering how Cena heelishly took the title off him over a decade back.
Face Edge vs Heel Cena would be pretty cool as well but we aren't going to see it sadly.
Same with Face Bryan vs Heel Cena.
Face Brock vs Heel Cena.
They can even make a star out Austin Theory now if done right. Theory is a very underrated worker and Cena purposely sabotaged that feud 2 years ago.
A promo segment with Miz would be gold as well.
But there are just going to be 6-7 matches at max I guess.
 
BunnyRabbit said:
A feud with LA Knight will be great for the promos but not the matches themselves.
I'd like to throw in Rey's name there too considering how Cena heelishly took the title off him over a decade back.
Face Edge vs Heel Cena would be pretty cool as well but we aren't going to see it sadly.
Same with Face Bryan vs Heel Cena.
Face Brock vs Heel Cena.
They can even make a star out Austin Theory now if done right. Theory is a very underrated worker and Cena purposely sabotaged that feud 2 years ago.
A promo segment with Miz would be gold as well.
But there are just going to be 6-7 matches at max I guess.
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Face R-Truth vs Heel Cena :inti
 
BunnyRabbit said:
A feud with LA Knight will be great for the promos but not the matches themselves.
I'd like to throw in Rey's name there too considering how Cena heelishly took the title off him over a decade back.
Face Edge vs Heel Cena would be pretty cool as well but we aren't going to see it sadly.
Same with Face Bryan vs Heel Cena.
Face Brock vs Heel Cena.
They can even make a star out Austin Theory now if done right. Theory is a very underrated worker and Cena purposely sabotaged that feud 2 years ago.
A promo segment with Miz would be gold as well.
But there are just going to be 6-7 matches at max I guess.
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I don't understand why ppl think LA can't cut it in the ring. I think he's pretty good without being anything special.
 
how’s this going to work out for Cody? Rematch v Cena and Orton triple threat?
 
Cena mentioned he wanted to retire by the end of this year. So, December 2025.

In that case, Survivor Series 2025 should be his last PPV. It is to be held in November. There is no PPV scheduled in December.

Who should be his final opponent? I think he should become a babyface in October and face The Rock in Survivor Series. He can finish his career with a win over The Rock. That would be a good ending.

:inti
 
sweep_shot said:
Cena mentioned he wanted to retire by the end of this year. So, December 2025.

In that case, Survivor Series 2025 should be his last PPV. It is to be held in November. There is no PPV scheduled in December.

Who should be his final opponent? I think he should become a babyface in October and face The Rock in Survivor Series. He can finish his career with a win over The Rock. That would be a good ending.

:inti
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It's rumored that his final appearance will be held at Boston where WWE plans to hold a PPV called Ruthless Aggression in December 2025 in honor of Cena.
 
sweep_shot said:
Cena mentioned he wanted to retire by the end of this year. So, December 2025.

In that case, Survivor Series 2025 should be his last PPV. It is to be held in November. There is no PPV scheduled in December.

Who should be his final opponent? I think he should become a babyface in October and face The Rock in Survivor Series. He can finish his career with a win over The Rock. That would be a good ending.

:inti
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Roided-up Rocky has no business being in such a high-profile position. No current wrestling fan wants to see that embarrassment unfold in the ring. He should stick to making those box-office bombs he has been making for the past few years. No need to step in the ring and risk ripping a tendon off the bone, which is a very expected outcome considering the amount of steroids he has pumped into his body.

It should be a young guy on the up. I don't care if it isn't Cody. It can be Gunther or anyone else.
 
sweep_shot said:
Cena mentioned he wanted to retire by the end of this year. So, December 2025.

In that case, Survivor Series 2025 should be his last PPV. It is to be held in November. There is no PPV scheduled in December.

Who should be his final opponent? I think he should become a babyface in October and face The Rock in Survivor Series. He can finish his career with a win over The Rock. That would be a good ending.

:inti
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I think Cena needs to pick his opponent himself rather than the booking team.
Batista did so.
Sting did so.
HBK did so.
 
sweep_shot said:
Cena mentioned he wanted to retire by the end of this year. So, December 2025.

In that case, Survivor Series 2025 should be his last PPV. It is to be held in November. There is no PPV scheduled in December.

Who should be his final opponent? I think he should become a babyface in October and face The Rock in Survivor Series. He can finish his career with a win over The Rock. That would be a good ending.

:inti
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Cena has 27 appearances remaining. :inti
 
Very happy to see my boy Miro AKA Rusev back in the WWE. If WWE book him half as well as AEW booked him in his run as TNT Champion, he will be a valuable addition to the roster. I'd start by putting the IC Championship on him.

He's a fantastic wrestler and I hope he is treated/booked better than he was in his previous WWE stint.
 
RedwoodOriginal said:
Roided-up Rocky has no business being in such a high-profile position. No current wrestling fan wants to see that embarrassment unfold in the ring. He should stick to making those box-office bombs he has been making for the past few years. No need to step in the ring and risk ripping a tendon off the bone, which is a very expected outcome considering the amount of steroids he has pumped into his body.

It should be a young guy on the up. I don't care if it isn't Cody. It can be Gunther or anyone else.
Click to expand...
Logan Paul v Cena. Icon vs Icon.
 
RedwoodOriginal said:
Roided-up Rocky has no business being in such a high-profile position. No current wrestling fan wants to see that embarrassment unfold in the ring. He should stick to making those box-office bombs he has been making for the past few years. No need to step in the ring and risk ripping a tendon off the bone, which is a very expected outcome considering the amount of steroids he has pumped into his body.

It should be a young guy on the up. I don't care if it isn't Cody. It can be Gunther or anyone else.
Click to expand...
BunnyRabbit said:
I think Cena needs to pick his opponent himself rather than the booking team.
Batista did so.
Sting did so.
HBK did so.
Click to expand...
Bhaag Viru Bhaag said:
Cena has 27 appearances remaining. :inti
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Suleiman said:
Logan Paul v Cena. Icon vs Icon.
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Whoever Cena ends up wrestling last, I hope he will not retire as a heel. I would prefer him to leave pro-wrestling as a babyface.

I personally find heel characters more interesting but a legendary wrestler should always retire as a face in my opinion. Happy ending.
 
sweep_shot said:
Whoever Cena ends up wrestling last, I hope he will not retire as a heel. I would prefer him to leave pro-wrestling as a babyface.

I personally find heel characters more interesting but a legendary wrestler should always retire as a face in my opinion. Happy ending.
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He'll turn face during the last month or so.
 
I don’t get the Rock hate, whatever you’ve seen that you are not happy with, has unfolded under H’s watch. WM is an event you plan for with a bit of guile and make best use of resources within your control; the decision to have Travis Scott interfere is on H. It’s possible that you can say this is all some kind of subliminal worked shoot, but just remember this, when it comes to H, to understand his wiring, you need to revisit his past and I’ve recorded every chapter, this is the bloke right, who thought it was a good idea to beat Booker T at WM 19, he had fans throwing garbage at him to close a Wrestlemania, he main evented WM’s which he had no business main eventing to negative/cold receptions, he thought it was a genius move to have a trad singles match against Orton after a heated rivalry at WM 25, he brainlessly went like half an hour with Reigns at WM 32 after a long show thinking he was Harley @ Starcade in the late 80’s and this insecure dweeb went like over an hour at the HOF more recently.

There’s a trend here which we’ve commonly seen in his booking; H is incompetent when it comes to closing the show and he strikes when the iron is cold.

Rock took H for a ride and H allowed that to happen, if H didn’t have such a massive ego he would have the Rock’s respect and could better deal with him, Rock is influential but would Vince allow someone else to dictate his creative in this manner ? Vince would have taken charge of the situation and maybe the creative involves something we don’t like necessarily, but he has the knack for monetising big personalities and ultimately taking control of his stories through his leadership.

Rock is on the board I get it, though H should have remained firm on doing things without him if he really had strong feelings about it. H hasn’t shown any kind of leadership at the top of the card, based on what I’ve seen from him, the cold finish is his trademark and you’re getting your pay-off at a lesser event, nothing tops Wrestlemania and that’s not anywhere in his rear view mirror.
 
sweep_shot said:
Cena mentioned he wanted to retire by the end of this year. So, December 2025.

In that case, Survivor Series 2025 should be his last PPV. It is to be held in November. There is no PPV scheduled in December.

Who should be his final opponent? I think he should become a babyface in October and face The Rock in Survivor Series. He can finish his career with a win over The Rock. That would be a good ending.

:inti
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It should be Triple H, I miss him blessing my TV screen. In fact it was a grave misfortune that even his own heart did not want him to entertain us anymore.
 
What did you guys think of the closing segment of RAW, are we getting like a modern variant of the Dangerous Alliance ?

Am glad that Bron gets to work more closely with Heyman opposed to Triple Doofus though and this is a good move for him.
 
There use to be a time when WM weekend was a fun time to see what other promotions were doing besides WWE & even international promotions often held shows in the US, we don’t really have that now thanks to Tony Khan. I also sense from these events that WWE have created a new generation of fans and the influence of old school fans is limited to the IWC. That raw passion for the sport is missing, it will shine through at times when they’re perfect but it’s inconsistent and those fans have been isolated by the state of wrestling today.

The further monopolisation of wrestling wont help either and while I don’t believe for a second that Triple Doofus and Stephanie could not have run the company by themselves, I have some reservations about TKO; their presentation of WM appears to be similar to a landmark UFC PPV, they’ve cut cost substantially and hiked ticket prices like no tomorrow, they need to quickly accept the two business are fundamentally distinct and this is where a real leader would have the balls to make sure the event is a grand spectacle vastly superior to the Super-Bowl, if you spent more time doing your actual job opposed to being a mark / everything you hate, it’s possible to achieve something, but no, I need to focus on what am going to do when I open the show on Night 1 and the little twerk I have planned when I bring out all the HOF’ers because it will prove I am superior.

For comparison, it is easy to explain what went wrong with their PR when you look at the production values of the last WM which took place in Las Vegas. And now fans are not happy with the creative either and negative publicity has been created from the event with the backstage shenanigans, can we monetise that? Sure, in 6 months time you will find the answers to all your questions.
 
Watching as a ‘fan’:

The best matches/segments from the whole weekend for me,

Best opening match: Ricky Saints vs Ethan Page, both guys killed it, Saints is so good at fighting from underneath and Ethan is such a great worker, his subtle creativity as a heel is so good to watch.

Best match/segment in the middle of the card: Randy Orton vs Joe Hendry.

Best main-event: CM Punk vs Roman Reigns vs Seth Rollins

Best event overall: HBK’s NXT Stand & Deliver

Honourable mention: Oba Femi vs Trick Williams vs Je'Von Evans; one of the best triple threats in NXT history and arguably the MOTY, something is seriously wrong if neither of these men end up as big stars at the top of the card, with H’s current attitudes towards POC, I don’t have high hopes though.
 
I demand a criminal investigation into why these men were not considered for Jey Uso’s spot:

Sami Zayn
LA Knight
Kevin Owens
Chad Gable
AJ Styles
Drew McIntyre
Austin Theory
 
Also, what is Melo’s crime? Are we still living in the 18th century?

What does Triple KKK have to say about this.

Can ya”ll comprehend what this would do to the likes of Oba Femi & Trick Williams?

He bought Omos back who was enjoying himself in Japan, just to warm the bench.
 
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Just remember one thing, this guy seriously made AJ Styles job. In my eyes that’s not far from what Benoit achieved because AJ Styles is my Imran Khan in the wrestling world. H should be the most hated man after that.
 
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shaz619 said:
I don’t get the Rock hate, whatever you’ve seen that you are not happy with, has unfolded under H’s watch. WM is an event you plan for with a bit of guile and make best use of resources within your control; the decision to have Travis Scott interfere is on H. It’s possible that you can say this is all some kind of subliminal worked shoot, but just remember this, when it comes to H, to understand his wiring, you need to revisit his past and I’ve recorded every chapter, this is the bloke right, who thought it was a good idea to beat Booker T at WM 19, he had fans throwing garbage at him to close a Wrestlemania, he main evented WM’s which he had no business main eventing to negative/cold receptions, he thought it was a genius move to have a trad singles match against Orton after a heated rivalry at WM 25, he brainlessly went like half an hour with Reigns at WM 32 after a long show thinking he was Harley @ Starcade in the late 80’s and this insecure dweeb went like over an hour at the HOF more recently.

There’s a trend here which we’ve commonly seen in his booking; H is incompetent when it comes to closing the show and he strikes when the iron is cold.

Rock took H for a ride and H allowed that to happen, if H didn’t have such a massive ego he would have the Rock’s respect and could better deal with him, Rock is influential but would Vince allow someone else to dictate his creative in this manner ? Vince would have taken charge of the situation and maybe the creative involves something we don’t like necessarily, but he has the knack for monetising big personalities and ultimately taking control of his stories through his leadership.

Rock is on the board I get it, though H should have remained firm on doing things without him if he really had strong feelings about it. H hasn’t shown any kind of leadership at the top of the card, based on what I’ve seen from him, the cold finish is his trademark and you’re getting your pay-off at a lesser event, nothing tops Wrestlemania and that’s not anywhere in his rear view mirror.
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As much as I have grown to dislike H's booking style I disagree with you for the simple fact that H being in this position is not the same as when Vince was in this position.

There are atleast 3-4 people that have far more power than H and can overrule him at any given time. Whereas when Vince was in-charge nobody had the power to overrule him. In a corporate structure like this where you are not the boss, you can't just do what you want. So if anything, I sympathize with H for these guys hijacking his plans because they were too stupid to see the bigger picture.

I don't know if it was Ari Emmanuel whose idea it was to have Rock show up for Elimination Chamber, or if The Rock is just lying to protect his reputation like he did in that cringeworthy WrestleMania 40 documentary, but fact is it ended up being an absolutely horrible idea in hindsight. Because while initially people reacted really strongly to the heel turn, over time it lost steam and failed to captivate fans going into WrestleMania.

If the original story is true, that the turn was supposed to happen at Mania—and I believe that it is—then not only would it have worked better as a surprise, but it also would have likely given fans at WrestleMania an ATG moment that would have also overshadowed the match and how bad it was. Because people would have said that hey, atleast we got to witness this memorable moment regardless of how bad the match was.

Ari Emmanuel and The Rock need to stay in their lane and avoid meddling in the creative side. For better or worse, Triple H is the booker. Either fire him and send him packing, or let him do his job. Constantly meddling in the creative side like this hurts the show and leads to stuff like this that feels illogical and hurts the product. For me, the greatest blame for the failure of this main-event lies on Ari Emmanuel and The Rock.
 
shaz619 said:
Watching as a ‘fan’:

The best matches/segments from the whole weekend for me,

Best opening match: Ricky Saints vs Ethan Page, both guys killed it, Saints is so good at fighting from underneath and Ethan is such a great worker, his subtle creativity as a heel is so good to watch.

Best match/segment in the middle of the card: Randy Orton vs Joe Hendry.

Best main-event: CM Punk vs Roman Reigns vs Seth Rollins

Best event overall: HBK’s NXT Stand & Deliver

Honourable mention: Oba Femi vs Trick Williams vs Je'Von Evans; one of the best triple threats in NXT history and arguably the MOTY, something is seriously wrong if neither of these men end up as big stars at the top of the card, with H’s current attitudes towards POC, I don’t have high hopes though.
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I know that people loved the Joe Hendry segment/match but I'm in the minority who didn't like this. I mean don't get me wrong, as a moment it was pretty fun and clearly got a great reaction from the crowd too. But man, as someone who doesn't watch TNA, this match made TNA look like such a third-rate promotion. That their World Champion came in only to be jobbed out and beaten within 3 minutes.

The alternative side of this is that TNA has a very small audience and getting on WrestleMania should be considered as some sort of privilege that TNA should be grateful for but I don't agree with this at all. There were a number of people who could have been in this position and it would have worked much better; beginning with Nick Aldis.

The worst part for me was the second RKO after Orton raised Hendry's hand. That made Hendry come across as a such a jobber and a geek. Which is not something I would do to the World Champion of a partner company that I am working with.
 
RedwoodOriginal said:
As much as I have grown to dislike H's booking style I disagree with you for the simple fact that H being in this position is not the same as when Vince was in this position.

There are atleast 3-4 people that have far more power than H and can overrule him at any given time. Whereas when Vince was in-charge nobody had the power to overrule him. In a corporate structure like this where you are not the boss, you can't just do what you want. So if anything, I sympathize with H for these guys hijacking his plans because they were too stupid to see the bigger picture.

I don't know if it was Ari Emmanuel whose idea it was to have Rock show up for Elimination Chamber, or if The Rock is just lying to protect his reputation like he did in that cringeworthy WrestleMania 40 documentary, but fact is it ended up being an absolutely horrible idea in hindsight. Because while initially people reacted really strongly to the heel turn, over time it lost steam and failed to captivate fans going into WrestleMania.

If the original story is true, that the turn was supposed to happen at Mania—and I believe that it is—then not only would it have worked better as a surprise, but it also would have likely given fans at WrestleMania an ATG moment that would have also overshadowed the match and how bad it was. Because people would have said that hey, atleast we got to witness this memorable moment regardless of how bad the match was.

Ari Emmanuel and The Rock need to stay in their lane and avoid meddling in the creative side. For better or worse, Triple H is the booker. Either fire him and send him packing, or let him do his job. Constantly meddling in the creative side like this hurts the show and leads to stuff like this that feels illogical and hurts the product. For me, the greatest blame for the failure of this main-event lies on Ari Emmanuel and The Rock.
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H has considerable influence though and it’s about showing a pair of bollocks, but a) he’s incompetent and b) too selfish to ever take full advantage of his role. If Rock & Ari are sabotaging him so much, why was Cody not allowed to turn heel, H allegedly rejected that proposal and other suggestions. He is ultimately responsible for the creative direction and had months to get this right, I don’t necessarily think the main-event was a failure, but we need to consider there is no grand pay-off until it’s too late when it comes to H and what has he done in the past 365 days which tell me it’s not the case? Forget Cena/Cody for a second, you look at the event as a whole and he has made some truly diabolical decisions on this card. The only person who is screwing H is H himself, he should thank the lord the heel turn was done well in advance of the planned date because otherwise there would be very little interest in Mania, and he signed off on this to, he was boasting about it in the presser after the PPV; ‘does it feel like the road to WM now?’ he mentioned that when he was butt hurt by fans criticising why the build had been so poor for Mania, if the business is losing some steam on the way to a huge event then it’s normal for the stakeholders to intervene, there is nothing I’ve seen from H which points to him doing a great job with the event with or without his superiors bouncing him around; night 1 was a snooze fest event besides the main-event, it was like watching a special Smackdown episode until the main-event.

At the end of the day he has achieved little in the business and is like the Rock’s left ball sack when you want to compare their accomplishments, Rock never had the problem doing jobs either unlike that unprofessional parasite, I do agree they deserve criticism for hiring that 4/10 low IQ clown, you can’t put someone in that role who has a vastly overrated resume and no real world experience beyond the WWE.
 
Saw a Facebook post saying rock said in an interview very recently that it was Cody who was supposed to turn heel at EC, but they changed it John last second because Rock said Cody should turn heel, but not at that point.

And he had no intention to show up at EC but was asked to show up so he did.

I saw an interview pop up of his with espn in the last few days, probably the one, but haven’t check it yet.
 
RedwoodOriginal said:
I know that people loved the Joe Hendry segment/match but I'm in the minority who didn't like this. I mean don't get me wrong, as a moment it was pretty fun and clearly got a great reaction from the crowd too. But man, as someone who doesn't watch TNA, this match made TNA look like such a third-rate promotion. That their World Champion came in only to be jobbed out and beaten within 3 minutes.

The alternative side of this is that TNA has a very small audience and getting on WrestleMania should be considered as some sort of privilege that TNA should be grateful for but I don't agree with this at all. There were a number of people who could have been in this position and it would have worked much better; beginning with Nick Aldis.

The worst part for me was the second RKO after Orton raised Hendry's hand. That made Hendry come across as a such a jobber and a geek. Which is not something I would do to the World Champion of a partner company that I am working with.
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TNA currently is more of a WWE developmental than anything else. They legit have nothing to go up against WWE. Not big enough ratings, no competition. If anything, AEW presents itself as a bigger competition to WWE than TNA atm.
So if anything, getting their top champion featured at Wrestlemania is only a bonus for TNA as it puts more eyes on their product. And losing to Randy isn't honestly a shameful thing. Even Cena lost to Taker at Mania 34 in 3 mins.
It would have been shameful if Henry had lost to Santos Escobar or Nia Jax in 3 minutes.
 
BunnyRabbit said:
TNA currently is more of a WWE developmental than anything else. They legit have nothing to go up against WWE. Not big enough ratings, no competition. If anything, AEW presents itself as a bigger competition to WWE than TNA atm.
So if anything, getting their top champion featured at Wrestlemania is only a bonus for TNA as it puts more eyes on their product. And losing to Randy isn't honestly a shameful thing. Even Cena lost to Taker at Mania 34 in 3 mins.
It would have been shameful if Henry had lost to Santos Escobar or Nia Jax in 3 minutes.
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You're missing the point. Everyone knows TNA is not a major promotion. But to have your World Champion squashed like a bug in 3 minutes is still a bad look and creates a very negative perception around the promotion. It could have been anyone but him.

Also, the second RKO was pretty needless. Made him look like a total geek and a fool.
 
RedwoodOriginal said:
You're missing the point. Everyone knows TNA is not a major promotion. But to have your World Champion squashed like a bug in 3 minutes is still a bad look and creates a very negative perception around the promotion. It could have been anyone but him.

Also, the second RKO was pretty needless. Made him look like a total geek and a fool.
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Yeah 3 mins is crazy. They been making Randy job to everyone last 2-3 years and now they make him squash someone who defo has a future in WWE (look at the massive pop he got when he first appeared in NXT)… h is a clown.

Kross was a great choice to face Randy… that too in his home of Vegas, even if he lost, it’s his freaking home town. Better for him to not show up at all than feature handing effin brass knuckles to AJ while he wrestles a brainless YouTuber who doesn’t deserve a WM spot

But his shoot promo is gold. Reminded me of that Miz moment with Daniel Bryan.
 
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