Water availability down to alarming levels: WAPDA

Foozee

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It seems that India is choking Pakistan in every way possible. There is no shortage of well-meaning, pro-peace commentators in this country who somehow find hope in the face of brazen provocation. But even they must accept that New Delhi can be most intransigent when it comes to issues that Pakistan rightly sees as a matter of life and death.

True, Pakistan did itself no favours. It nurtured militants who operated on both the western and eastern borders and ultimately turned their guns on the country itself once Islamabad renounced links that only the most ill-informed could ignore. But now India is usurping water supplies that rightfully belong to us under the terms of the 1960 Indus Water Treaty, a move that could deal a body blow to an agrarian economy that is already under severe stress. What’s more, it could be said that India’s decision to go ahead with the Kishanganga hydropower project and four other dams in Indian-administered Kashmir are geared not so much towards meeting its own needs as impoverishing Pakistan.

Under the World Bank-sponsored Indus Waters Treaty, Pakistan enjoys exclusive rights to the volumes generated by the Chenab, Jhelum and Indus rivers. Clearly, India is not abiding by the rules — probably because it sees itself as a power that is somehow above regulations. This attitude has harmed its credentials not only in Pakistan but other Saarc countries as well. In fact, India is seen as a regional bully throughout Saarc. Under the terms of the Indus Waters Treaty, India is required by law to inform Pakistan six months in advance if work is to commence on diverting or stalling waters covered under the 1960 agreement. That did not happen and it is up to the comity of nations to ensure that India’s transgression is stopped dead in its tracks.

http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect...per/editorial/14-indias-water-theft-420-zj-08

so much for aman ki asha, when Pakistan is starting to suffer from Water shortage :po:
 
Hence why all these peace bullcrap initiative will NOTa work. Steal our water, send our people back in body bags, responsible for killing our Shaheeds.

The future wars will not be fought over land, they'll be fought over water. india knows it cant do thing militarily (and why would they with the risk of ruining their economy)...they're trying to make up into an Ethiopia!
 
exactly.. all this BS of peace... when worse sh*t is happening
 
I don't want to start a provincial debate on this but found it very strange that why Sindh is so quiet on this.

I mean some time ago Indus river day was celebrated in Sindh and people threw rose petals in almost dry river and pray for more water.

As usual, in local press (from sindh) a lot of Punjab bashing can be seen where several political figures as usual were accusing Punjab for drying up river indus and using all its water.

This same local press is surprisingly quiet when these dams are built by india. So far i get the impression that it is OK if india can built dams on river indus and use its water but had someone in Pakistan tried to suggest KalaBagh or any other dam, hell would break lose.

Sadly, Pak central govt. is also sleeping. They should take this issue to UN as soon as possible, but so far we have seen some half hearted bi-lateral talks on this issue without any solution.
 
Blame your politicians for resisting water saving projects like the Kalabagh damn.

There is no vision in our country. Simple as.
 
It's very easy to blame your neighbours for all your water issues but what exactly has India done which breaches the Indus Water Treaty? A treaty signed by your own President at that time.

Even your own Indus Waters Treaty Commissioner agrees:

Indus Waters Treaty Commissioner Jamaat Ali Shah, while leaving for New Delhi to talk about waters shared by India and Pakistan, said that Pakistan was getting its share of waters under the Indus Treaty and that building a dam was the right of India. He said less water in Pakistani rivers was because of lack of rain, not because India had blocked it.

http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2009/06/02/story_2-6-2009_pg3_1

And if as a country Pakistan didnt make suicidal decisions like this then maybe Pakistan's water issues wouldnt be so bad.

ISLAMABAD: The filling of Mangla Dam’s additional 2.33 MAF (million acre feet) storage capacity built at a cost of more than Rs90 billion and construction of cheap hydropower projects of about 4,500MW are in jeopardy because of non-implementation of the dam’s up-raising agreement and three provinces’ opposition to allocation of water for Azad Kashmir.


Background discussions with government officials and documents available with Dawn suggest that the controversy has resulted in cancellation of a scheduled visit of President Asif Ali Zardari for inauguration of the Mangla dam up-raising project at the eleventh hour when AJK Prime Minister Raja Farooq Haider and his government threatened to boycott the ceremony and declined to receive the president at Mangla.

http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect...la,-hydropower-projects-in-jeopardy-220-za-07
 
what do you mean, what has India done... they have violated the Indus Water treaty...

Pakistan is not suffereing from lack of rain, its the 4 rivers that run from Jammu that are being blocked... the rivers are running thin

stop being soo Indian
 
Foozee said:
what do you mean, what has India done... they have violated the Indus Water treaty...

Pakistan is not suffereing from lack of rain, its the 4 rivers that run from Jammu that are being blocked... the rivers are running thin

stop being soo Indian


Says who?

The World Bank, who are a signatory to the IWT and to whom both nations go to if there is a dispute disagrees.

Sure one could argue India get a very good deal out of the IWT but it is not India's fault that President Ayub Khan signed a treaty which heavily favours India.
 
A little old but still. Those in Pakistan should make people aware of whats happening instead of sitting back waiting for someone else.

[UTUBE]jqT9HSa_IvU&feature[/UTUBE]
 
I heard on a TV show 1-2 weeks ago (Kal Tak show I think) that India is making a dam on Kabul River in Afghanistan too.

But I am concerned of ministries, governments of last 15+ years that they don't fix irrigation systems and worry about agriculture. Sure you have droughts and they will keep happening. But what about the wasted water and working on issues and doing something. What about desalanization plants? I read a report (I think Karachi University) that bunch of land in Sind has beceome infirtile because of water shortage or other water problems. Just by fixing water distribution they could save a lot of water instead of the mud based open lines of cannals etc. Water shortages have been going on for years and I am not talking about Karachi city. They have had it for 30+ years and in that time the population has probably doubled.

Well talking about the government, ministries and let me add the big farmers, heard on another show few days ago that Iran has said no to keenoos (orange type thing many called mangerines) and Japan has said no to mangoes. Does anyone care? The problem there was quality assurance and refrigiration while transporting. The host of the show said, well we can try to provide bad food to ourselves but we cannot conquer others with it (or something like that)
 
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Zechariah said:
Blame your politicians for resisting water saving projects like the Kalabagh damn.

There is no vision in our country. Simple as.

General Pervez Musharaf was in power for 8 years and he couldn't do anything about it. blaming politicians a lone for this is useless.
 
insaftak said:
General Pervez Musharaf was in power for 8 years and he couldn't do anything about it. blaming politicians a lone for this is useless.

He tried, NS tried too all failed because PPP and MQM are a bunch of idiots.

MQM and PPP are not politicians?

Was it not for the damns built by Ayub Khan we would be running hand wheels in Pakistan today.

No leader after Ayub took the power sector seriously, Bhutto, Zia, BB, NS, Musharraf.
 
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What exactly is the problem with Kalabagh Dam, from what i (basically) understand it could be HUGE, Pakistan's hoover dam?

Just the 4 Pronvinces cant agree on it?
 
insaftak said:
Neelum-Jehlum Project is one project to keep an eye on

Jhelum is going dry. Its receded about 50 metres in 2 years.
 
Mohsin said:
What exactly is the problem with Kalabagh Dam, from what i (basically) understand it could be HUGE, Pakistan's hoover dam?

Just the 4 Pronvinces cant agree on it?
Most of the objection comes from Sindh, which feels that when it comes to water Punjab treats Sindh like India treats Pakistan.
 
d0gers said:
Most of the objection comes from Sindh, which feels that when it comes to water Punjab treats Sindh like India treats Pakistan.

Also, in NWFP, the building of the dam will create an artificial lake that will flood 2-3 villages completely, so the population will have to move elsewhere.

I remember someone telling me a while back(but I cant find any online references, so someone who has access to the actual treaty can verify), that one of the key points was that if Pakistan fails to build a dam within the next 40 years, India can build a dam on their side. 50 years have passed and we still have only Mangla and Tarbela.

Kalabagh has been used as a political tool. Fine, it cant be built. But that doesnt mean that other dams can also not be built. There is a lot of negligence around water management( frankly speaking, there is a lot of negligence in every aspect of Pakistan, but whatever).

For those interested, this is a nice article http://pakobserver.net/200912/17/Articles02.asp . It highlights the issues, and has proposals to fix them, but the government chooses to turn a blind eye.
 
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namak said:
Also, in NWFP, the building of the dam will create an artificial lake that will flood 2-3 villages completely, so the population will have to move elsewhere.

I remember someone telling me a while back(but I cant find any online references, so someone who has access to the actual treaty can verify), that one of the key points was that if Pakistan fails to build a dam within the next 40 years, India can build a dam on their side. %0 ears have assed and we still have only Mangla and Tarbela.

Kalabagh has been used as a political tool. Fine, it cant be built. But that doesnt mean that other dams can also not be built. There is a lot of negligence around water management( frankly speaking, there is a lot of negligence in every aspect of Pakistan, but whatever).

For those interested, this is a nice article http://pakobserver.net/200912/17/Articles02.asp . It highlights the issues, and has proposals to fix them, but the government chooses to turn a blind eye.

Very well said. The amount of water resources we have the fact that Hydal power is so cheap, we should have built massive dams already!

The return in terms of engineering and water conservation is massive and the amount of water we could have for crops and such rather than it going down to the sea.
 
Another good article which raises decent points.

http://www.ocnus.net/artman2/publish/Dark_Side_4/Water_Disputes_Between_India_and_Pakistan.shtml

From the article:
In late June 2009, Pakistani Water and Power Minister Raja Parvez Ashraf observed that India does have a right to build dams, but that it cannot stop the flow of water into Pakistan in order to fill the dams. In fact, Jamaat Ali Shah, Pakistan’s Indus Water Commissioner, gave a rare candid interview in April 2008, stating that the Indian water projects currently undertaken do not contravene the provisions of the 1960 Indus Water Treaty. Noting that India can construct dams within the technical specifications outlined in the treaty, Shah acknowledged: "In compliance with the Indus Water Treaty, India has so far not constructed any storage dam on the Indus, the Chenab and the Jhelum rivers. The hydroelectric projects India is developing are on the run-of-the-river waters of these rivers, projects which India is permitted to pursue according to the treaty."

This point is the key. If our own ministers admit that the treaty is flawed, then either the treaty needs to be renegotiated, or, as stated in the earlier link that I posted, Pakistan needs to conserve water better and significantly reduce the 51% losses and decrease/eliminate contamination.

Like it or not, the reason India is building dams is because the Indian populace also has needs that are increasing day by day. The only way to solve this is to truly examine it at a regional level and implement a system that works for both nations. Given the current political climate, that is highly unlikely :(
 
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Foozee said:
what do you mean, what has India done... they have violated the Indus Water treaty...

Pakistan is not suffereing from lack of rain, its the 4 rivers that run from Jammu that are being blocked... the rivers are running thin

stop being soo Indian


read post 19........ :)
 
At this rate Pakistan will have to ultimately dissolve and accede to India...writing is on the wall...

Two nation theory is dead and Pakistanis are profoundly ambivalent about their identity, in which case reunification with their ethnic brethren across the eastern border is the most pragmatic thing to do...
 
By that argument, the whole planet should be one country so that the leadership takes care of everyone :)

I dont think India would wnat to merge with Pakistan if an impending ecological disaster is about to take place.

I did manage to find the Indus Waters treaty at http://web.worldbank.org/WBSITE/EXT...K:146736~piPK:583444~theSitePK:223547,00.html

There is no 40 year rule, so part of my earlier post was misinformed. However, it looks like as per Annexures C, D, and E, the construction of the Baghlihar dam meets the stipulations set, so the minister was right.
 
Cheguvera said:
At this rate Pakistan will have to ultimately dissolve and accede to India...writing is on the wall...

Two nation theory is dead and Pakistanis are profoundly ambivalent about their identity, in which case reunification with their ethnic brethren across the eastern border is the most pragmatic thing to do...


Two nation theory is the way to go ahead and develop. I think it will be a disaster if that fails and reunification of any sort happens.

The kind of power hungry politician we have in both sides will suck both countries dry.

The only union which will be good for both is trade, education, agriculture and healthcare. And if we can include other saarc countries successfully into it then it will be beneficial for the entire region.

From administrative point of view one country policy is not gonna work.
 
Garuda said:
Two nation theory is the way to go ahead and develop. I think it will be a disaster if that fails and reunification of any sort happens.

The kind of power hungry politician we have in both sides will suck both countries dry.

The only union which will be good for both is trade, education, agriculture and healthcare. And if we can include other saarc countries successfully into it then it will be beneficial for the entire region.

From administrative point of view one country policy is not gonna work.

I would like to extend the union on trade, education, agriculture and healthcare at a global level. We are all people living on the same planet and all of us need to effectively use its resources so that the future generations do not have to face the problems faced by the current generation.

Sadly, this utopia will always remain a dream. :(
 
namak said:
By that argument, the whole planet should be one country so that the leadership takes care of everyone :)

I dont think India would wnat to merge with Pakistan if an impending ecological disaster is about to take place.

I did manage to find the Indus Waters treaty at http://web.worldbank.org/WBSITE/EXT...K:146736~piPK:583444~theSitePK:223547,00.html

There is no 40 year rule, so part of my earlier post was misinformed. However, it looks like as per Annexures C, D, and E, the construction of the Baghlihar dam meets the stipulations set, so the minister was right.

I don't understand what you mean by the whole planet turning into one country...

At any rate, in Pakistani context there is a conspicuous and very relevant precedent in the recent history...if two Germanys can merge and become one...then it is certainly possible for eastern areas of Pakistan to merge with mother India...

And quite contrary to your assertion that India may not want Pakistan or parts of it to be re-integrated back into it for "ecological" reasons...I find this hard to fathom given that India can very easily remedy this by turning the taps back on...Furthermore, Indians have still have plenty of indignation with regards to partition itself...the notion of "Akhund Bharat" unofficially India's manifest destiny and a major political party BJP was elected to power on this ideas as their election manifesto...

Lastly, Pakistanis would certainly not mind reconnecting with their ethnic and cultural homeland...
 
Great so now we are talking about re-integrating with India.

To think how low we have become as a nation, we cant even say the right things.
 
Zechariah said:
Great so now we are talking about re-integrating with India.

To think how low we have become as a nation, we cant even say the right things.

Well we failed as a nation...why we failed is a very different and frankly a rather futile debate...so let's not bother...no harm is in admitting failure/defeat and moving on...

The best thing to do now is to cut the loses and restore the position of midnight August 13th, 1947, at least Altaf Bhai's live long mission would be fulfilled...
 
y'all dont get it..these kinda things will lead to war or something...
 
Maybe Aman Ki Asha is working after all.

They say imitation is the sincerest form of flattery and for years India would blame Pakistan for all it's troubles. Even if a cow farted in Delhi, Pakistan would be blamed.

Well it's good to see the Pakistani establishment have taken this up - blame your neighbour, hide your own incompetencies and help to unite the nation by creating a common enemy.

Of course the fact that you havent invested in water management and desalination plants over the years has nothing to do with the current problem. That you had petty domestic arguments about building dams whilst India were moving forward full pace with their dams also had nothing to do with the problem. No, it's all India's fault.

As for war? Well even the idiotic leadership of both countries arent stupid enpough to start a war both sides know they could not win.
 
Cheguvera said:
I don't understand what you mean by the whole planet turning into one country...

What I mean is, 'Based on your argument, if there is a dispute because of a border, remove that border'

So as you say, India and Pakistan should become one country. Lets say for the sake of argument, Afghanistan builds a dam on the Kabul river. Now it will negatively impact Pakistan. However, if Afghanistan and Pakistan were one nation, then a collective decision could be made to benefit both areas. The 'remove border if there is a dispute' analogy can be extended on global level.

However, if you read into the history of nationalism, it is extremely hard to argue against th setting up of nation states.
 
Foozee said:
y'all dont get it..these kinda things will lead to war or something...

War? Based on what? Ayub Khan signed the Indus Water Treaty. I will repost: http://web.worldbank.org/WBSITE/EXT...K:146736~piPK:583444~theSitePK:223547,00.html

If this is not favourable to Pakistan, why is it not renegotiated? And what parts are not favourable to Pakistan? Can you highlight?

People are missing the real problem. Lets say there is a man called Khadim Hussain. He has access to a bucket of water. Now this bucket of water is leaky, so he ends up with half a bucket of water for his use. But thats okay, because he can manage with half a bucket. Now he goes up and gets married. Both he and his wife share that half a bucket, and they can manage. In 10 years, they have 5 kids. All of them share that half a bucket of water. Now, he has a neighbour, Ram Persad. He signs an agreement with him allowing Ram Persad to take a small cup of water from that bucket, because Ram persad has a family of 100 and he needs water from whichever source available. Khadim Hussain still has access to water amounting to slightly less than half the bucket for his wife and 5 kids. 25 years pass. The 5 kids get married. Another 10 years pass. Those 5 couples now have 5 kids of their own per couple. So now, 37 people are sharing that slightly less than half a bucket of water.

As the years pass, Ram Persad also tries to maximise his cup as per the treaty because now he has a family of more than 300 people. Ram Persad is accused of being the root cause of the water shortage, as opposed to Khadim Hussain fixing the leak that allows the bucket to lose half its water, and work on alternative sources of water(desalination plants at sea). So, as per some people, Khadim Hussain should go to war with Ram Persad to reclaim that cup of water that is being 'stolen' despite the fact that Khadim Hussain signed a legal agreement allowing Ram Persad to get that cup of water.

In the mean time, the bucket will still be less than half full, Khadim Hussain's family will continue to grow and grow, and the water will not magically increase. The war will put a strain on Khadim Hussain's finances, and he will become poorer and will not be able to support his ever growing family for anything(food, clothing, shelter, etc).

War is not the solution. Renegotiating the treaty so that no cup of water can be taken, fixing the leak in the bucket so that a full bucket is available instead of half a bucket, looking for alternative sources of water, and controlling the population growth is the answer.


References:
http://pakobserver.net/200912/17/Articles02.asp
http://www.ocnus.net/artman2/publish/Dark_Side_4/Water_Disputes_Between_India_and_Pakistan.shtml
 
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Cheguvera said:
At this rate Pakistan will have to ultimately dissolve and accede to India...writing is on the wall...

Two nation theory is dead and Pakistanis are profoundly ambivalent about their identity, in which case reunification with their ethnic brethren across the eastern border is the most pragmatic thing to do...

Oh dear God! Allah aap ko hidayat de mere bhai

Btw you do remember Pakistan was created 1947 with the sole purpose that it'll fail and re-join india within a couple of months right? :))
 
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Cheguvera said:
Well we failed as a nation...why we failed is a very different and frankly a rather futile debate...so let's not bother...no harm is in admitting failure/defeat and moving on...

The best thing to do now is to cut the loses and restore the position of midnight August 13th, 1947, at least Altaf Bhai's live long mission would be fulfilled...

We have failed yes but re-integrating is a mere joke and anyone in Pakistan working towards it (Altaf Bhai) will never be successful. The idea of Pakistan runs deep in the blood and no one can take it away.
 
To add to post #31, you can merge with India, you can fight wars with India, you can elect Zardari, Bilawal, Altaf Bhai, Nawaz Sharif, Imran Khan, or whoever else you fancy,

but you cant really stop the growth of Khadim Hussain's family with any of these actions, and you cannot magically increase the bucket of water(the Indus and its tributaries) with these actions.

So after all is done and dusted, there will still be a water shortage crisis.
 
Mmmm so those evil Indians arent stealing Pakistan's water afterall.


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Gabbar Singh said:
Mmmm so those evil Indians arent stealing Pakistan's water afterall.
Yeah, read posts #17 and #19 by namak. Raises some good points. Blaming India appears to be a political tool when it is in fact our own provinces that can't reach a consensus. In the mean while a lot of water gets wasted i.e. used neither for irrigation nor generating electricity.
 
Well the recent round of talks between the countries have yielded nothing new:

LAHORE: The three-day talks between Indus Water Treaty Commissions of India and Pakistan have concluded in Lahore. India said it is not stealing Pakistan’s water while Pakistan said that a fresh understanding between the two sides is required to end this dispute.

http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect...12-india+says+it+is+not+stealing+water--bi-04

Indian side says they are doing nothing which breaks the Indus Water Treaty and Pakistani shortages are due to their own mismanagement:

Wednesday, March 10, 2010 E-Mail this article to a friend Printer Friendly Version

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India links Pakistan’s concerns on water to ‘mismanagement’

* Indian officials deny plans to build storage projects
* Claim India provided £62m to Pakistan to construct ‘replacement’ canals

By Iftikhar Gilani

NEW DELHI: India on Tuesday dismissed Pakistan’s concerns regarding the flow of water and attributed its woes to mismanagement of water resources and an attempt to divert attention from the growing discontent in Sindh and Balochistan over denial of their share of Indus waters.

Pledging commitment to the Indus Water Treaty (IWT), senior Indian officials blamed Pakistan for making water a “populist issue” and expressed concerns over the issue being handed over to the Lashkar-e-Tayyaba (LT) for raising anti-Indian sentiments.

http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2010\03\10\story_10-3-2010_pg7_37


So round and round we go.....
 
Pak mismanaging Indus water: Foreign Minister Qureshi


Islamabad: Pakistani authorities have a tendency to "pass the buck" and exaggerate differences with India over the sharing of river waters though mismanagement within the country is resulting in the loss of 34 million acre feet of water, the Foreign Minister said on Friday.

Shah Mahmood Qureshi made the remarks when he was asked at a news conference whether Pakistan had taken up the issue of India trying to block the flow of rivers by building dams during a meeting yesterday between Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani and his Indian counterpart Manmohan Singh.

Pakistan had taken up the issue during the meeting on the sidelines of a SAARC summit in Bhutan but Pakistani authorities have a "tendency to exaggerate" and "pass the buck" in this regard, Qureshi said.

The average supply of water that reaches Pakistan is 104 million acre feet while the water that is consumed is 70 million acre feet, he pointed out.

"Where is the 34 million acre feet of water going? Is India stealing that water from you? No, it is not. Please do not fool yourselves and do not misguide the nation. We are mismanaging that water," the foreign minister said.

Pakistan "must understand" actions made by India, including the construction of dams and water projects, if they comply with the 1960 Indus Waters Treaty, he said.

Pakistan has to see if new structures being built in the Indian side of Kashmir are "in accordance with the Indus Waters Treaty or in violation of it", he added.

"We should examine the Indus Waters Treaty and its annexures which are binding. If there are any violations, we must take them up and will do it without any compromise as water is a matter of life and death for us.

"Pakistan's progress and economy (is) dependent on water and there will be no compromise on it," he said.

Qureshi also hinted that the Foreign Office had not received any information from the concerned ministry about violations of the treaty by India for almost 20 years but did not give details.

Differences over the sharing of river waters have emerged as a major irritant in bilateral ties in recent years.

Pakistani politicians have accused India of trying to turn the country into a desert by building a large number of dams and power projects on rivers in Jammu and Kashmir.

India has denied the charges and said the flow in the rivers has been affected by climate change and low rainfall.

http://www.zeenews.com/news623251.html
 
What will happen if India stops all the water?
Pakistan will nuke india.end of story.
 
Foozee said:
Its funny how ur the only bumping this thread.. lol

great source btw.. zeenews.. hahaha


What is wrong with bumping an old thread if it saves us starting a new one?

Anyway, you never did get back to us on this post of yours:

Foozee said:
what do you mean, what has India done... they have violated the Indus Water treaty...

Pakistan is not suffereing from lack of rain, its the 4 rivers that run from Jammu that are being blocked... the rivers are running thin

stop being soo Indian


Which part of the treaty has India violated exactly?
 
Xohaib said:
What will happen if India stops all the water?
Pakistan will nuke india.end of story.

Yes what a great idea- must have taken you a while to think it up.

South Asia is facing a population crisis so I guess if we do it your way we could get rid of half a billion Indians and Pakistanis.
 
Xohaib said:
What will happen if India stops all the water?
Pakistan will nuke india.end of story.

You forget India also have nukes and it can also use it.







Get some sense buddy.......you seriously think nuking each other is an option?
 
Why India will always be ahead of her neighbour when it comes to the scramble for water resources in the region:



Kishanganga dam controversy: Top officials’ tussle may damage case for water rights
By Zafar Bhutta
Published: August 23, 2011


ISLAMABAD:

While India has already started work on the controversial Kishanganga Hydroelectric Power Project (KHEP) in Indian Kashmir, a dispute between top government officials may seriously damage Pakistan’s case for securing priority rights over Neelum River.

The badly-timed tussle appears to have intensified right before the hearing of the case against the construction of the dam, due to take place at the International Court of Arbitration (ICA) in The Hague on August 25

The tensions between Indus Water Commissioner Sheraz Memon and the Prime Minister’s Special Assistant on Water Resources Kamal Majeedullah had reached such high levels of intensity that steps needed to be taken to alleviate the situation, sources told The Express Tribune.

This involved sending Memon on an ‘official course’, resulting in his exclusion from the delegation due to attend the ICA hearing from August 25-27. Earlier, at a meeting of the Senate Standing Committee on Water and Power, the commissioner had alleged that Majeedullah had caused a delay in the ICA case when he had hired a lawyer based on personal choice.

According to sources, the controversy also included Memon’s objections to the delegation’s inclusion of law ministry official Shumaila Tariq and Ambassador-at-Large Khalil Ahmad. When contacted, the commissioner confirmed that he was not going to attend the hearing at The Hague.

At the same time, he denied his absence from the hearing as being a result of any kind of pressure, adding that joining the course was routine official practice.

The first hearing was held at The Hague on January 14, 2011 when it was decided that Pakistan would submit its case to the ICA in May. At the upcoming hearing, Pakistan aims to obtain a stay order to put a halt to the KHEP, which it says will seriously hinder its own Neelum-Jhelum Hydroelectric Project (NHJEP). Memon had earlier said, “I had insisted during the first proceedings in the international court to obtain a stay order against the construction of the Kishanganga dam, but Kamal Majeedullah did not agree with this course of action.”

The waters of the Kishanganga River are to be diverted through a 24-kilometre-long tunnel for power production. The remaining water flow will join the Wullar Lake and ultimately run through Jhelum to Muzaffarabad. If successfully implemented by India, the KHEP, initiated in 2007, will result in a shortfall of about 21% of Neelum’s inflow for the NHJEP. This would reduce the project’s much needed energy generation by 10%. The KHEP’s completion would also significantly harm agriculture, fisheries, and the economy as a whole.

Bilateral negotiations on the KHEP were halted in April 2010, when India argued that the project had been initiated before the NHJEP. While the project was kept on a top priority list in Pakistan’s 2002 Power Policy and was scheduled to be completed within six years, the government awarded the NJHEP to the Chinese Gezhouba Group of Companies in 2008. By that point, India had already been working on the KHEP for a year.

http://tribune.com.pk/story/237401/...ials-tussle-may-damage-case-for-water-rights/
 
IMO unless population growth is tackled in both countries, water shortages will happen, it is a matter of WHEN, not IF.

Fine, even if there is enough water for 2 billion Indians+Pakistanis, will there be enough water for 3 billion?

Not a chance.
 
Well we failed as a nation...why we failed is a very different and frankly a rather futile debate...so let's not bother...no harm is in admitting failure/defeat and moving on...

The best thing to do now is to cut the loses and restore the position of midnight August 13th, 1947, at least Altaf Bhai's live long mission would be fulfilled...
Best thing is for us to ship you back to your love India.

Where the nation has failed is in having failed citizens like you!
 
Yes what a great idea- must have taken you a while to think it up.

South Asia is facing a population crisis so I guess if we do it your way we could get rid of half a billion Indians and Pakistanis.
Ignore the idiot. Sounds like a village retard. Normal Indians & Pakistanis don't think like that.
 
War? Based on what? Ayub Khan signed the Indus Water Treaty. I will repost: http://web.worldbank.org/WBSITE/EXT...K:146736~piPK:583444~theSitePK:223547,00.html

If this is not favourable to Pakistan, why is it not renegotiated? And what parts are not favourable to Pakistan? Can you highlight?

People are missing the real problem. Lets say there is a man called Khadim Hussain. He has access to a bucket of water. Now this bucket of water is leaky, so he ends up with half a bucket of water for his use. But thats okay, because he can manage with half a bucket. Now he goes up and gets married. Both he and his wife share that half a bucket, and they can manage. In 10 years, they have 5 kids. All of them share that half a bucket of water. Now, he has a neighbour, Ram Persad. He signs an agreement with him allowing Ram Persad to take a small cup of water from that bucket, because Ram persad has a family of 100 and he needs water from whichever source available. Khadim Hussain still has access to water amounting to slightly less than half the bucket for his wife and 5 kids. 25 years pass. The 5 kids get married. Another 10 years pass. Those 5 couples now have 5 kids of their own per couple. So now, 37 people are sharing that slightly less than half a bucket of water.

As the years pass, Ram Persad also tries to maximise his cup as per the treaty because now he has a family of more than 300 people. Ram Persad is accused of being the root cause of the water shortage, as opposed to Khadim Hussain fixing the leak that allows the bucket to lose half its water, and work on alternative sources of water(desalination plants at sea). So, as per some people, Khadim Hussain should go to war with Ram Persad to reclaim that cup of water that is being 'stolen' despite the fact that Khadim Hussain signed a legal agreement allowing Ram Persad to get that cup of water.

In the mean time, the bucket will still be less than half full, Khadim Hussain's family will continue to grow and grow, and the water will not magically increase. The war will put a strain on Khadim Hussain's finances, and he will become poorer and will not be able to support his ever growing family for anything(food, clothing, shelter, etc).

War is not the solution. Renegotiating the treaty so that no cup of water can be taken, fixing the leak in the bucket so that a full bucket is available instead of half a bucket, looking for alternative sources of water, and controlling the population growth is the answer.


References:
http://pakobserver.net/200912/17/Articles02.asp
http://www.ocnus.net/artman2/publish/Dark_Side_4/Water_Disputes_Between_India_and_Pakistan.shtml

Top Post. This poster doesn't seem to be around anymore.
 
Very worrying signs for Pakistan.

Pakistan already faces problems with extreme heatwave. Only in 3 years ago, around 1200 people died due to extreme heatwave and recently 65 or so. The fact there are no construction limitations means people can build huge buildings which is not ideal as already the direction of the wind is being blocked due to big constructions. Cross wind in Pakistan is a myth.

You also have lack of trees - no trees mean further heat; environment and global warming in Pakistan is taken lightly; Imran Khan's project of 1bn trees in KP needs to implemented everywhere.

Recently, my family back home told me there is no tap water at times - like electricity, Pak will only receive water at certain times. Already by 2040, it is predicted Pakistan will be the most water stressed country in the World. Worrying signs. Pakistan must prioritise the environment/global warming issues asap.

Iran is next to us - for them issues like electricity etc is a myth. My Iranian friend was shocked to hear that load shedding is still a thing in Pakistan..
 
Very worrying signs for Pakistan.

Pakistan already faces problems with extreme heatwave. Only in 3 years ago, around 1200 people died due to extreme heatwave and recently 65 or so. The fact there are no construction limitations means people can build huge buildings which is not ideal as already the direction of the wind is being blocked due to big constructions. Cross wind in Pakistan is a myth.

You also have lack of trees - no trees mean further heat; environment and global warming in Pakistan is taken lightly; Imran Khan's project of 1bn trees in KP needs to implemented everywhere.

Recently, my family back home told me there is no tap water at times - like electricity, Pak will only receive water at certain times. Already by 2040, it is predicted Pakistan will be the most water stressed country in the World. Worrying signs. Pakistan must prioritise the environment/global warming issues asap.

Iran is next to us - for them issues like electricity etc is a myth. My Iranian friend was shocked to hear that load shedding is still a thing in Pakistan..

Not going to happen soon. India and Pakistan both are busy buying expensive weapons and not focusing much on the basic needs of more than half its population.
 
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Water availability down to alarming levels: WAPDA
Stresses on new dams, water conservation to improve situation

LAHORE:
Pakistan’s per capita water availability has come down from 5650 cubic metre in 1951 to an alarming level of 908 cubic metre per annum, pushing Pakistan to the verge of water-scarcity. The country can store only 10% of its annual river flows against the world average of 40%, said Lt Gen Sajjad Ghani (Retd), Chairman of the Pakistan Water and Power Development Authority (Wapda).

Speaking to a PAF Air War College delegation at the Wapda House, Ghani said, ““We have merely 30 days carry over capacity of water in comparison to India with 170 days, Egypt with 700 days and USA with 900 days. The carry over water storage capacity will have to be increased from 30 days to 120 days.”

“Likewise, the low-cost hydel electricity, which stands at 9406 MW at present, also needs to be improved from the existing 28% to at least 50% in the national grid,” he added.

The delegation, which was led by Air Vice Marshal Hussain Ahmed Siddiqui, and comprised of Pakistani and allied officers from Bahrain, Bangladesh, Egypt, Indonesia, Iran, Iraq, Jordan, Malaysia, Nigeria, Sri Lanka, South Africa, Saudi Arabia and Zimbabwe, was also given a detailed debriefing on Pakistan’s overall water situation, the country’s hydro power projects and challenges being faced with regards to water and energy security.

“The water situation in Pakistan can only be improved by constructing more dams, conserving water, adopting modern irrigation techniques and minimising water evaporation losses,” he said.

Express Tribune
 
Alarming news for our beloved nation
=====
The Indus River System Authority (Irsa) on Wednesday said that the country is facing a 30 per cent water shortage at the start of the sowing season for cash crops such as rice and cotton.

Irsa said the gap is based on lower than normal winter snowfall in the northern areas, affecting catchment areas of the Indus and Jhelum Rivers that are used for irrigation.

Kharif crops, or monsoon crops, including rice, maize, sugarcane and cotton are sown in April and require a wet and warm climate with high levels of rainfall.

“There was less snow than normal as a result of climate change affecting the country’s glaciers,” Muhammad Azam Khan, assistant researcher with Irsa, told AFP on Wednesday.

“This will have a direct impact on the availability of water for kharif crops in the summer.”

The water shortage gap is expected to narrow as the monsoon rains arrive later in the season.

However, the meteorological department has also forecast higher than normal temperatures during the monsoon season, increasing uncertainty.

Agriculture is the largest sector of the economy, contributing about 24pc of its GDP.

But it has been criticised for being water inefficient.

“What this current water shortfall means for the crops is that authorities will have to better plan on how to utilise the water that is allotted to them,” Khan said.

The country has recently been grappling with the profound impacts of climate change which includes shifting and unpredictable weather patterns.

Devastating floods in 2022 — which scientists linked to climate change — that affected more than 30 million people also severely impacted the cotton crop that year.

Source: Dawn News
 
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